imperator2 changed the topic of #ruby-lang to: Nick registration required to talk || Ruby 2.0.0-p247: http://ruby-lang.org (Ruby 1.9.3-p448) || Paste >3 lines of text on http://gist.github.com || RubyConf 2013 at http://www.justin.tv/confreaks
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<nXqd> W 9
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<nXqd> morning guys
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<freedrull> were modules in ruby borrowed from another language, or is that totally a ruby thing
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<ryanf> I think mixins came from lisp
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<aerook> hey, I'm new to ruby, I have a question: I'm trying to use array.split in conjunction with the " ! " convention for setting the variable from which the method is called to the result of the variable
<aerook> i cannot seem to make it work
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<epitron> is there a faster way to find out if a class has an instance method than Class.instance_methods.include? :methodname
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<epitron> (seems like there's gotta be something faster than searching through an array)
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<epitron> (ruby itself has to be using a hash internally)
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<epitron> oic, Class.instance_method(:methodname)
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<epitron> hah.. "include? :methodname" is 5x faster than "instance_method(:methodname) rescue nil"
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<epitron> "method_defined? :methodname" is the winner! 17x faster than include?
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<freedrull> wilmax cali must be p reliable...
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<epitron> hurr.. method_defined? doesn't work on class methods...
<epitron> gotta use "metaclass.method_defined?"
<epitron> does ruby have a real way to get the metaclass yet?
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<ryanf> yeah, .singleton_class
<ryanf> I think since 1.9?
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<epitron> woot!
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<yorickpeterse> morning
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<ljarvis> D:
<apeiros> holy batman - why didn't I see that before?
<ljarvis> lul
<yorickpeterse> +1 for /part filtering
<apeiros> category "joke" :D
<DouweM> nice
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<mikecmpbll> lmfao
<mikecmpbll> train emoji..
<gnufied> morning
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<gnufied> lol, the last reply from martin
<gnufied> he is exploiting matz's poor english
<yorickpeterse> heh
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<Jadenn> good morning, i'm have a question about ruby. I come from PHP and am moving to ruby, and many code snippets ive seen seem to be able to require files without using their extension (like .rb) and just call "require 'myfile'". I can't seem to get this to work, all I get is a load error
<yorickpeterse> if you're loading local files use require_relative
<yorickpeterse> or `require './some_file'`
<yorickpeterse> `require` looks for potential paths to search in $LOAD_PATH
<workmad3> yorickpeterse: don't use "require './some_file' "
<yorickpeterse> the "." directory is not in there
<workmad3> unless you like your requires to be dependent on your CWD :(
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<r0bglees0n> i hate to use require "./…" as well, but sometimes "basepath cannot be infered"
<r0bglees0n> i'll always try to use require_relative first
<workmad3> r0bglees0n: yeah... it's called IRB :)
<Jadenn> im confused as to how all these other scripts can call it like that without any apparent configuration
<r0bglees0n> yeah, but even other stuff does it too iirc
<r0bglees0n> like gem build
<workmad3> Jadenn: generally because they're using something like rubygems and that manipulates the $LOAD_PATH variable for you
<r0bglees0n> Jadenn: there is a variable called $LOAD_PATH which ruby scans for the file you're trying to require.
<r0bglees0n> it is inferred from build time configuration, and even rubygems, but that's not important for you right now
<Jadenn> so what is the best way for me to require files, then?
<r0bglees0n> with require, or require_relative.
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<Jadenn> so i shouldn't be doing require './file'?
<r0bglees0n> $LOAD_PATH does not contain ".", as yorickpeterse said, so you cannot use require with paths relative to "." (at least on ruby 1.9)
<workmad3> Jadenn: depends on what exactly you're setting up... if you're creating an application completely from scratch, you'll likely want to have a startup script that adds a 'lib/' path to your $LOAD_PATH
<workmad3> Jadenn: if you're using something like rails, you shouldn't need to do that, as rails adds lib/ to your load path
<r0bglees0n> workmad3: meh dont do that
<r0bglees0n> just use require_relative instead of a push to $LOAD_PATH
<workmad3> r0bglees0n: eww, no
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<Jadenn> i just started with ruby yesterday, im hardly going to be using frameworks
<workmad3> r0bglees0n: that ties two files together nastily in your file system
<r0bglees0n> workmad3: how?
<Jadenn> the trouble im having is with http://ruby.learncodethehardway.org/book/ex40.html
<workmad3> r0bglees0n: they need to stay in *exactly* the same positions to each other, relatively, otherwise breakage
<Jadenn> it simple requies the file name and it works
<Jadenn> i cant get it to though.
<yorickpeterse> Yeah great fucking idea right there, lets bastardize $LOAD_PATH because heaven forbid file A requiring an explicit path
<yorickpeterse> How many times do you actually move all those files around?
<r0bglees0n> workmad3: that's not very pratical at a glance, since they're relative to "lib" in your example, and the relative paths (mylib/foo) will be the same in require, or require_relative
<yorickpeterse> Jadenn: just use require_relative and ignore the pedantics, it will save you time
<workmad3> r0bglees0n: yes, but with require you only fix one file, not two
<Jadenn> thanks
<Jadenn> must be because im using ruby 2.0.0 and this article is 1.9
<r0bglees0n> workmad3: not really? the paths are the same either way, if i move any file i need to update the paths
<yorickpeterse> Jadenn: the "." change was made from 1.8 -> 1.9
<workmad3> r0bglees0n: with 'require', you only need to update the path if you change the path of the file you're requiring
<r0bglees0n> workmad3: i'm sorry, but even without understanding this further, i'm never going to agree
<workmad3> r0bglees0n: with 'require_relative' you need to update the path if you change the path of the file you're requiring *or* the path of the file it's in
<yorickpeterse> ddfreyne: HEY, YOU WORK AT SOUNDCLOUD RIGHT?
<r0bglees0n> note to self: run yorickpeterse through downcase!
<yorickpeterse> ddfreyne: submit patch that changes the sound button at the top right, every time I wreck my ears when I click it thinking that it just shows up the volume bar
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<Jadenn> bahaha
<yorickpeterse> instead of turning it to 100%
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<yorickpeterse> r0bglees0n: I am immutable
<yorickpeterse> so good luck with modifying self
<workmad3> yorickpeterse = yorickpeterse.downcase
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<yorickpeterse> hey I'm not that locally scoped
<r0bglees0n> lol
<workmad3> yorickpeterse: you look like a local variable to me ;)
<yorickpeterse> pretty sure I'm a global one
<workmad3> yorickpeterse: no $
<yorickpeterse> or at least equally annoying
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<Jadenn> yeah, the $ thing threw me for a loop, coming from php
<r0bglees0n> $ denotes a global variable
<r0bglees0n> in ruby
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<Jadenn> yeah
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<workmad3> yorickpeterse: also, to resist being reassigned, you'd need to be Yorickpeterse anyway... then you'd at least throw a warning with -W1 :)
<yorickpeterse> more like YORICK_PETERSE
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<r0bglees0n> shouldnt have done that
<workmad3> yeah, that would be more idiomatic... but the Y is the only bet that was needed :)
<r0bglees0n> in ruby you can be reassigned
<yorickpeterse> <injekt> m8 ill reassign yur face
<r0bglees0n> ive lost all my english charm slang
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<yorickpeterse> replaced it with Dutch slang?
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<r0bglees0n> hehe nah, probably american slang
<r0bglees0n> that's who i talk to almost everyday
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<ljarvis> m8
<r0bglees0n> awright m8
<ljarvis> u betta watch ur mouf
<ljarvis> ill smash u bruv
<r0bglees0n> lol
<Jadenn> ill bash ye fookin 'ed in m8
<ljarvis> lol fookin', ok tyneside
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<Jadenn> :D
<r0bglees0n> dont know what tyneside is but i know it made that perfect
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<ljarvis> r0bglees0n: up north
<r0bglees0n> ah
<ljarvis> aka geordies
<r0bglees0n> i know geordies ya :)
<ljarvis> i keep breaking the internet
<r0bglees0n> i wondered why my net was going out all the time
<ljarvis> my bad
<r0bglees0n> np
<ljarvis> i wrote an api in go and mother of god does it take up 0 memory
<r0bglees0n> :)
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<r0bglees0n> ljarvis: not to say Go isn't superb to do that, but I think Rails dirties the glasses when looking at stuff like this
<r0bglees0n> im pretty sure webmachine-ruby could be as sustainably light too
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<[spoiler]> r0bglees0n: Oh I've never seen webmachine-ruby before. It looks pretty cool
<r0bglees0n> it is awesomesauuuuce
<r0bglees0n> it fits very well for me at least
<ljarvis> r0bglees0n: I have a sinatra ruby api too which is also very good with memory, i'm in no way comparing it to rails, go still shoots it out of the park in general, though
<ljarvis> especially when you have multiple workers
<r0bglees0n> yeah, sure, but ruby on the web is often judged by rails, which encourages monolithic applications that arent easily distributed or decomposed
<ljarvis> but, that's not really much of a surprise
<r0bglees0n> plus the stack is hella big
<ljarvis> agreed
<ljarvis> the api im building is relatively small (~80-100) routes so it's fairly succint, no need for something like rails anyway
<ljarvis> succinct*
<r0bglees0n> my model is going towards (ruby) services with HTML/JS frontends that don't live with the services at all
<r0bglees0n> i say (ruby) because ruby isnt neccesary
<r0bglees0n> it could be Go
<ljarvis> yeah, i cannae stand js
<r0bglees0n> its pretty cool for what you can do with it
<ljarvis> oh totally, i just dont want to do anything with it, i leave that to people who dont want to strangle their family when they write it
<r0bglees0n> :)
<Jadenn> that.
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<[spoiler]> The onlt benefit I see in Rails is ActiveRecord, which can be used outside of Rails anyway
<ljarvis> heh
<r0bglees0n> yeah, AR is pretty good generally
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<r0bglees0n> im not sure id use it outside rails though
<ljarvis> I have done, sometimes use sequel though
<[spoiler]> I mean I like Rails too, but it's usually too heavy for what I need
<[spoiler]> or requires me to dig too much through documentation/source to accomplish something
<r0bglees0n> its probably way too heavy for most people, it doesn't encourage you to build a stack of what you need
<ljarvis> the rails rumble perfectly describes what rails is good for
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<r0bglees0n> its heavy by default, you can strip it down but in practice it doesnt often happen outside /api
<ljarvis> building a decent webapp in very little time
<r0bglees0n> yep
<r0bglees0n> its very good at that
<r0bglees0n> but you cant be a startup forever
<ljarvis> yeah, i think rails is perfectly fine for beyond that though, but it takes a hell of a lot of custom configuration and work
<[spoiler]> I find it faster to build a webapp in sinatra than Rails
<ljarvis> just like.. well, anything else
<ljarvis> [spoiler]: sure when it's basic
<r0bglees0n> ljarvis: thats true too, but my problem is it doesn't leave room for the model id like (distributed, decoupled services)
<ljarvis> heh
<r0bglees0n> no rails application is built like that, it's not encouraged, and it's not thought of
<yorickpeterse> this channel just became double brit (yeah bit late had lunch w/e)
<[spoiler]> ljarvis: even when it's not simple, actually. I just always sepend a lot of time looking for "the rails way" of doing shit in rails, and with sinatra I just do it however the jolly fuck I want (not sure why I'm so concerned with doing stuff the Rails way when using rails)
<ljarvis> [spoiler]: right, because presumably you're a beginner (for lack of a better word). I can build a pretty good webapp prototype in no time in rails, it'll take me a little longer with sinatra because I'll have more work to do (that's a fact)
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<ljarvis> (beginner with rails)*
<mikecmpbll> i built a pretty cool api in sinatra once, for the persistence layer of a backbone app
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<r0bglees0n> ljarvis: you don't need a bloated stack to prototype fast, you need tools to support a mode of development(SoA,monolithic)
<ljarvis> sinatra is awesome for apis, grape is even better
<mikecmpbll> like three route methods
<mikecmpbll> for update, create and delete
<ljarvis> r0bglees0n: right, which rails provides
<yorickpeterse> man I have such a perfect video related to grapes
<r0bglees0n> yep
<r0bglees0n> but its not neccesary
<yorickpeterse> but I'm pretty sure it will get me banned from this channel
<yorickpeterse> (it's SFW)
<ljarvis> quick whilst apeiros isn't looking
* yorickpeterse runs
<[spoiler]> ljarvis: Yeah, I didn't have a lot of opportunities to work with Rails. So, I am beginnerish with it
<yorickpeterse> put on headphones though
<yorickpeterse> workplace might not enjoy the text
<ljarvis> i live at home
<ljarvis> ^ wat
<ljarvis> work*
<mikecmpbll> haha
<[spoiler]> LMAO. "I live at home"
<ljarvis> what the fuck is this
<[spoiler]> Also, yorickpeterse I'vve seen that before
<ljarvis> apeiros: please ban him
<yorickpeterse> :<
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<r0bglees0n> well that was fucked
<r0bglees0n> i sat through the whole thing
<ljarvis> i watched about 11 seconds
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<r0bglees0n> it goes to a board room meeting and it starts to be somewhat funny
<yorickpeterse> I thought it was a pretty funny video
<r0bglees0n> before that its uhhhh
<ljarvis> which was 10 seconds longer than i needed to conclude it was messed up
<mikecmpbll> anyone got any experience writing tests for AR?
<yorickpeterse> I have some pretty offensive Dutch ones too, but only r0bglees0n will probably get those
<ljarvis> mikecmpbll: sure
<mikecmpbll> i've not worked with the rails test suite before
<mikecmpbll> no idea how to write or where to put a test for this PR: https://github.com/rails/rails/pull/12538
<yorickpeterse> heh, what's this thing with people wearing sunglasses while coding
<r0bglees0n> yorickpeterse: catching gamma rays
<yorickpeterse> you need tinfoil for that
<Jadenn> yorickpeterse: like this? http://puu.sh/5babx
<yorickpeterse> Plastic doesn't work very well to block gamma/mind control rays
<yorickpeterse> Jadenn: yes, exactly
<ljarvis> mikecmpbll: i would wait for feedback tbh, you can add new tests to the query_methods test file, though
<Jadenn> :P
<r0bglees0n> yorickpeterse: the tinfoil trick has been working well for me
<ljarvis> mikecmpbll: fwiw, i would remove the blank line you added, and line up the scope.joins! args with the indentation above it
<r0bglees0n> Jadenn: just curious, why do you choose to wear shades?
<Jadenn> i don't :P those are clip ons to my regular glasses
<r0bglees0n> hehe ok ;)
<Jadenn> surprisingly useful.
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<r0bglees0n> ljarvis: one byte too many for my terminal
<ljarvis> dont hate, bieberate
<Jadenn> BAHAHAHAHA
<yorickpeterse> in your defence, you are at least outside
<yorickpeterse> * defense
<ljarvis> yeah it's totally not a greenscreen
<r0bglees0n> hahaha
* drbrain waves
<r0bglees0n> ljarvis: you never told me you also got justin bieber's hair in addition to a jetpack
<yorickpeterse> ljarvis: that reminds me of those pics where some kid MS painted some lady next to him
<ljarvis> good morrow drbrain
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<ljarvis> yorickpeterse: those are pure gold
<drbrain> had to get up early for my flight home from RubyConf
<drbrain> + Eastern Time
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<ljarvis> drbrain: calling 7:30 early depresses me
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<drbrain> that's 4:30 AM for me home time zone
<r0bglees0n> killer plane journey
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<drbrain> r0bglees0n: not to mention that the corporate booking tool is full of lies
<yorickpeterse> ljarvis: my favourite one is where some guy is sitting on a motor bike with a lady shopped on the back
<drbrain> it said "look, a direct flight from MIA to SEA‼"
<drbrain> but there is no such flight, only a flight that stops in IAH
<mikecmpbll> ljarvis: good point RE alignment, will fix that. i didn't add any blank line though :)
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<r0bglees0n> drbrain: yeah, any plane trip i've had on a US airline has been an unholy mess (delays of 12 hours, mostly on a runway)
<r0bglees0n> extremely painful
<mikecmpbll> oh, that line.
<r0bglees0n> puts me off
<mikecmpbll> i was copying the formatting for the includes! method
<mikecmpbll> which has a blank line too :)
<ljarvis> mikecmpbll: ah right, well fair enough, i guess that one makes more logical sense :)
<ljarvis> cool
<r0bglees0n> if you put the +8 hours flight time, i was "in transit" for 20 hours
<ljarvis> mikecmpbll: maybe you can hijack the specs for that method
<drbrain> r0bglees0n: suck
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<mikecmpbll> ljarvis: hadn't thought of that, been a month or so since i made the PR so i'll probably work it out with a fresh mind
<ljarvis> mikecmpbll: :)
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<ruby-lang355> hey guys
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<ruby-lang355> Any idea why Ruby does this? https://gist.github.com/DanielVartanov/6988864
<ljarvis> ruby-lang355: that's the way it's designed, it's not a bug
<yorickpeterse> you never include M1 in A
<yorickpeterse> at least not until after you show the ancestors
<yorickpeterse> (the first time)
<yorickpeterse> also, in this case M1 is not an ancestor of A
<yorickpeterse> it's an ancestor of M
<r0bglees0n> ruby-lang355: i don't think its a bug either, at the time of the first include M1 isn't in the tree of M.
<yorickpeterse> Object.ancestors isn't recursive, it only shows direct ancestors
<r0bglees0n> if you re-include (when M < M1), it works
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<yorickpeterse> oh wait, hm
<yorickpeterse> it should be recursive apparently
<yorickpeterse> https://eval.in/65874
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<Jadenn> i love how that took 8 megs of ram
<ljarvis> yorickpeterse: it's not to do with recursion, that's just how they're stacked
<yorickpeterse> Jadenn: Ruby is webscale
<r0bglees0n> it behaves that way
<r0bglees0n> ancestors relfection is correct
<r0bglees0n> reflection*
<r0bglees0n> you need to re-include M into A, for 'foo' to be seen
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<[spoiler]> Jadenn: That's the minimum for MRI. mruby is like 3MB and rubinius (last time I checked) around 30MB iirc
<tbuehlmann> go check jruby :D
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<andredurao> hi there!
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<imperator> howdy
<andredurao> Am I doing something wrong on ruby 2 when I try to create a hash with string keys like this: "h={"a":"a"}"
<ljarvis> andredurao: yes
<ljarvis> that isn't valid
<andredurao> mmm i thought that new hash syntax was 'more like json' but its not just like that right:
<ljarvis> andredurao: that's only for symbols
<ljarvis> andredurao: {a: "a"}
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<andredurao> well... ok. I've seen new %i method also but the "for symbols only!" was news for me
<ljarvis> yeah %i is for arrays though
<andredurao> ljarvis: ty!
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<andredurao> to create an array of symbols right?
<ljarvis> correct
<ljarvis> i stands for 'intern'
<yorickpeterse> co-worker is learning Vim
<yorickpeterse> I'm amazed by his productivity
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<yorickpeterse> maybe he's the chosen one
<andredurao> *hope that wasnt made by an intern,,,,
<yorickpeterse> the one to liberate us from the shackles of Emacs
<vpretzel> Haha
<vpretzel> Is your team on emacs? I've never come across a team that is
<yorickpeterse> All the saint has to do is :gg=G>>:q and we'll be set free
<yorickpeterse> vpretzel: no
<vpretzel> rofl
<yorickpeterse> 2,5 Vim users, one Sublime user
<vpretzel> gotcha :)
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<[spoiler]> yorickpeterse: I use sublime. o: What's wrong with sublime? I love sublime. Sublime's amazeballs. Sublime's sublime
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<yorickpeterse> Nothing?
<yorickpeterse> I mean, it's an editor for heretics yes, but I don't really mind
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<ljarvis> heh
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<mikecmpbll> what's the best site for ruby logs?
<mikecmpbll> uh, irc logs
<mikecmpbll> is there like a generic one for free node?
<ljarvis> mikecmpbll: no, but some channels are covered here: http://irclog.whitequark.org/
<mikecmpbll> ah perfect, cheers!
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<yorickpeterse> mikecmpbll: ask the NSA
<yorickpeterse> or GHCQ :>
<ljarvis> or ur mom
<yorickpeterse> hurr hurr
<ljarvis> heuheuheuheu
<yorickpeterse> ljarvis: when you're in this shitty country we need to hack some code
<yorickpeterse> errr I mean rage at the gym
<ljarvis> agreed
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<banisterfiend> vpretzel 50% of my team is on emacs (the cool ones)
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<vpretzel> Haha cool - I just haven't ever even dabbled in emacs
<ljarvis> 0% of my team is on emacs
<vpretzel> I'm not even sure if anyone in my old company even was on it, ~150 developers
<vpretzel> it being emacs of course
<yorickpeterse> banisterfiend: how many of those have active RSI issues?
<vpretzel> vi guys for ruby
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<banisterfiend> yorickpeterse i don't know why people say that about emacs, seems vim would have more of an issue with that being that the 'escape' key is so often pressed (seems really stupid one of the most common key bindings is so far away from the rest of the keys..)
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<banisterfiend> yorickpeterse anyway i'm on an MBA 11", nothing is really a stretch :)
<vpretzel> banisterfiend: many vi experts bind their caps lock key for that very reason
<yorickpeterse> banisterfiend: that's true, but you can also use ctrl+{
<darix> the pros edit their code with microsoft word.
<yorickpeterse> which is less retarded
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<vpretzel> then again i've got mega-hands so esc isn't THAT far away
<oddmunds> i use jj to exit INSERT mode
<oddmunds> C-c can also be used
<oddmunds> (out of the box)
<oddmunds> I've been coding in Eclipse for the last few days and i'm starting to get claustrophobic
<darix> oddmunds: no emacs or vim mode plugin for eclipse?
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<oddmunds> yeah, there are
<oddmunds> i just havent gotten so far yet
<oddmunds> i try not to tweak my editor all day
<oddmunds> stuff i did today: get a "color theme" (pathetically only works in the editor window) and install mousefeed (a plugin that tells you the key bindings for anything you attempt to do from a menu)
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<yorickpeterse> y u use eclipse
<yorickpeterse> it's the wurst
<banisterfiend> yorickpeterse he's a java programmer ;)
<oddmunds> i'm using eclipse because i haven't coded in java for 100 years and that's what the senior dude is using
<yorickpeterse> banisterfiend: oooooh dear
<Jadenn> god help you :P
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<oddmunds> so in the beginning i'd rather mirror his setup
<oddmunds> hah
<oddmunds> it's not so bad
<oddmunds> this project is mainly just deleting stuff
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<yorickpeterse> you don't need Eclipse for that
<yorickpeterse> just rm -rf ./*
<oddmunds> thanks
<yorickpeterse> :>
<yorickpeterse> maybe there's even a maven task for it!
<yorickpeterse> mvn lol
<oddmunds> > /dev/lol
<Jadenn> why.... http://puu.sh/5fd4O.png
<Jadenn> why does this exist
<yorickpeterse> which one?
<joonty> for the lolz
<yorickpeterse> oh, ha
* yorickpeterse does not have /dev/lol
<yorickpeterse> if you cat it you see an ascii image of Mark Shuttleworth laughing at you
<Jadenn> (sfw)
<Jadenn> one of my friends mirrors :>
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<oddmunds> Jadenn: blocked by my organization :D
<yorickpeterse> don.gs?
<yorickpeterse> oh
<yorickpeterse> I get it
<yorickpeterse> very funny
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<ljarvis> :/
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<Jadenn> yer :P
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<yorickpeterse> I remember those jokes being lame in primary school already
<yorickpeterse> "hurr hurr he said penis"
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<nXqd> hi guys is Class a singleton object in ruby ?
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<apeiros> nXqd: how many classes are there which have class Class?
<nXqd> apeiros: there are many. But do they just inherit from Class ?
<apeiros> nXqd: inheritance does not concern the singleton pattern. the class does.
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<apeiros> >> [Array.class, Hash.class, String.class, Class.class]
<nXqd> I meant, when Ruby starts, there will be a Class object to be created. Many can inherit from them, but itself is the only one. Do I understand it correctly ?
<apeiros> uh, eval-in_ broken?
<nXqd> from it*
<ljarvis> apeiros: ya
<ljarvis> since forever
* ljarvis shakes fist at charlie
<x0f> apeiros, lemme help out ;) # [Class, Class, Class, Class]
<apeiros> nXqd: gotta go - for short: singleton pattern means a class has only a *single* instance
<apeiros> and the singleton object of it is that instance
<apeiros> and Class is an instance of Class - and as you can see, there are *plenty* of instances of Class around - so NO, it's not a singleton object.
<nXqd> got it.
<apeiros> (every class in ruby is an instance of Class)
* apeiros off
<nXqd> apeiros: [ are you off ... ] I have another question ...
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<ljarvis> nXqd: ask away there's other people here
<nXqd> btw, when a new Class is created in ruby. It will allocate the whole memory included all the Class object methods or it just creates a class, whenever we call a method belonging to Class object, it just send a message to Class object ?b
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<ruby-lang355> Guys, this code gives a error: https://gist.github.com/robgleeson/40cc2d9cdf5c2873f34b How is it not a bug? Look at the simplest consequence of such Ruby behaviour: https://gist.github.com/anonymous/7415109
<ljarvis> ruby-lang355: this has been explained to you 3 times
<ruby-lang355> ljarvis: yes, I read it. Please look at the second gist. Are you sure it is a supposed behaviour?
<ljarvis> nXqd: the methods are not redefined, they'll send up the call chain
<ljarvis> ruby-lang355: yes, that is intended behaviour
<ljarvis> they're*
<nXqd> ljarvis: great! so they just communicate with each other by sending message ?
<ruby-lang355> ljarvis: ok, thanks, now I can die in piece
<ljarvis> ruby-lang355: just 1 piece i hope
<nXqd> ljarvis: haha
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<nXqd> ruby-lang355: but wait, does module has a function called class_eval ?
<ruby-lang355> ljarvis: lol, sorry for a typo
<yorickpeterse> dying in multiple pieces wouldn't make much of a difference compared to only a single piece
<yorickpeterse> you'd still die
<yorickpeterse> though in the former case you'd at least be distributed
<ljarvis> yorickpeterse: it will matter to my mom
<yorickpeterse> instead of being a single point of failure
<nXqd> ljarvis: very good point :
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<yorickpeterse> also yay for ElasticSearch fuckups
<yorickpeterse> corrupt DB
<nXqd> yorickpeterse: yeah, it's like you die, you want to die in a technical way ...
<ruby-lang355> nXqd: yes it has: Module.new.class_eval {}
<apeiros> nXqd: class_eval and module_eval exist, and both are identical
<nXqd> wow ... is it just confused ?
<apeiros> Class is a subclass of Module. the whole "I can have instance methods" thingy is from Module.
<apeiros> no, it's a child :)
<apeiros> oh, a parent actually
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<nXqd> yeah but still, .. I just feel it wrong. Can we just design a multiple module and include specific ones to class ? My humble opinion
<nXqd> mixins* I meant in this case.
<apeiros> o0
<ljarvis> I believe the word you're looking for is
<ljarvis> wat
<nXqd> ...
<apeiros> I thought of `eh?`
<ljarvis> that works too
<apeiros> maybe we spoke about different things - at least I don't see the connection between the name `class_eval` and what he said :-|
<nXqd> because I see Module.class_eval ... The class_eval is there because it's included in Class object.
<ljarvis> no
<ljarvis> it's not in the Class class
<ljarvis> well, it is.. but not directly
<ljarvis> it's an instance method of Module
<ljarvis> jsut to confuse things
* yorickpeterse popcorn
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<ljarvis> the Class class of Module class classes Class module Module Class class
<x0f> ...class
<yorickpeterse> basecamp
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<apeiros> fu?
<apeiros> nXqd: Module is a class. Class is a Class. The class `Class` inherits from the class `Module`.
<apeiros> i.e., it's class `Class < Module; …`
<nXqd> yeah how about BaseModule ( which has module_eval ) and ClassModule ( which has class_eval ) and then in class you can include these two. And in new Module, it just include that BaseModule which doesn't have class_eval to confuse people [ yeah maybe just me ... ]
<apeiros> and for that reason, they simply didn't bother to only "rename" the method in Class. It simply exists in both places.
<apeiros> nXqd: it's not "one has X the other has Y", both have both.
<apeiros> Class has both module_eval and class_eval
<apeiros> Module has both module_eval and class_eval
<apeiros> those methods are *identical*
<apeiros> `BaseModule which doesn't have class_eval` <- wrong
<nXqd> can you tell me what's wrong ?
<apeiros> the statement is false. BaseModule has class_eval.
* ljarvis pulls up a chair next to yorickpeterse
<apeiros> as stated for like 5 times now.
<apeiros> and ruby-lang355's issue wasn't about the name of that method anyway.
<apeiros> his issue was that including modules in modules will not affect classes which had that module included.
<x0f> ..which is understandable.
<apeiros> (or at least that's what I gathered from glancing over his gist)
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<nXqd> apeiros: yeah, I know. I talked about my opinion about the class_eval method in Module, not about his problem ...
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<apeiros> nXqd: good. then your assertion makes no sense. all modules have class_eval. all modules have module_eval. there is no "BaseModule which doesn't have class_eval" (unless you explicitly remove it…)
<nXqd> the BaseModule in my case, in the case that I had a chance and power to redesign the language :v
<apeiros> o0
<apeiros> ok
<nXqd> because it makes no sense that I create BaseModule and then it already a Module and of course it has class_eval
<apeiros> …
<nXqd> ...
<apeiros> what is your problem exactly?
<nXqd> being too curious
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<nXqd> and opnionated
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* nXqd off for a bow of rice and chicken
<apeiros> ok, that's nothing which can be solved with an explanation.
<apeiros> good appetite
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<apeiros> hm, no, what was the english formulation for that again?
<apeiros> enjoy your meal?
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<x0f> guten appetit ;)
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<nXqd> yes, cooking :D
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<nXqd> if you come from another language and you try to learn ruby. What are the top 5 important things you should learn about ruby ?
<yorickpeterse> welp, finally shipped a fucking new version after a month or so of one of our $BIG_PROJECTS
<yorickpeterse> we're so bad at planning
<yorickpeterse> "Lets release it this Thursday!" - 2 weeks later: "Lets release it next Thursday!"
<whitequark> mental note: don't go work with yorickpeterse ;)
<nXqd> yorickpeterse: haha it happens all the time :D
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<yorickpeterse> whitequark: hey I'm not in charge of planning
<ljarvis> thank god AMIRITE
<yorickpeterse> well I more or less am but w/e
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<yorickpeterse> I've been moving these two things to every next Friday for a month or so
<yorickpeterse> granted they're small things, but still
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<imperator> looks like RF mailing lists are working again, yay
<ljarvis> you know RF is going to be EOL right?
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<imperator> says who?
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<ljarvis> maybe i dreamed it
<ljarvis> could have sworn someone did but can't find it
<apeiros> RF?
<imperator> RubyForge
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<yorickpeterse> PUSH TO PRODUCTION
<yorickpeterse> GET ERRORS
<yorickpeterse> YAY
<imperator> it's probably your fault
<ljarvis> seconded
<yorickpeterse> it actually is
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<yorickpeterse> pretty sure I'm the #1 with the most broken builds here
<apeiros> good thing nobody counts…
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<yorickpeterse> Good thing Jenkins does
<apeiros> ah, I thought in *here*
<apeiros> but you meant "here"
<ljarvis> apeiros: jokes on you, i count
<ljarvis> 426 so far
<apeiros> you certainly don't count :-p
<ljarvis> since this morning
<apeiros> ;-) j/k
<ljarvis> zinnggg
<ljarvis> oh you
<yorickpeterse> I also fix builds
<ljarvis> "I fix everything I break"
<yorickpeterse> " JENKINS_RUBY_VERSION=2.0 #62 "Use the "name" field for survey listings. - Yorick Peterse": SUCCESS " see?
<yorickpeterse> granted it failed the previous time because RubyGems crapped out
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<yorickpeterse> http://downloads.yorickpeterse.com/images/screenshot_111113_17%3a48%3a07.png first world dev problems: this isn't going faster
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<yorickpeterse> Partially because we run our tests against 1.9, 2.0 and rbx-2.1
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<cirwin> Where do people store sensitive configuration variables?
<yorickpeterse> public git repositories
<cirwin> :)
<yorickpeterse> In all seriousness, either in Git, directly on the server (if you only have one) or some key manager service
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<cirwin> I'm at the point where I want to take them out of git
<yorickpeterse> how many servers are you looking at?
<cirwin> 4
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<yorickpeterse> A poor man's key server would be a Git repo that would get cloned somewhere, the details would then be set in for example ENV vars
<yorickpeterse> I think tarcieri talked about Square open saucing their key server some time in the future
<cirwin> oh, interesting
<cirwin> I should have talked to him about it
<cirwin> having a separate git repo seems reasonable
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<jds> I've got a ruby server process that occasionally balloons to take massive amounts of ram. I can't reproduce it at will
<yorickpeterse> e.g. we still slap stuff in the repositories themselves, which is meh
<jds> Is there anything I can do to sample a currently running process and get any idea where all that memory is going?
<yorickpeterse> jds: eh, memory is a tricky one in Ruby
<cirwin> jds: you can use ObjectSpace.each_object
<cirwin> counts = {}; ObjectSpace.each_object{ |x| counts[x.class] += 1 }; puts counts
<yorickpeterse> there's no "it just works" tool that I know of, most of the profiling tools are focused on CPU usage and such
<cirwin> ruby 2.1 has an allocation tracer
<cirwin> if your app can boot on 2.1 you could try running it with that
<yorickpeterse> it does? Nice
<jds> ugh. I'll see if I can get in with hijack & try ObjectSpace
<yorickpeterse> previously I had to patch 1.9 so that ruby-prof could do that
<cirwin> yeah, there was a cool talk about it at rubyconf
<cirwin> jds: good luck :/
<yorickpeterse> jds: your first bet would be to get rid of anything that's stored globally (e.g. arrays on class level)
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<jds> Yeah, I'm not doing anything that dumb that I know of
<jds> But no doubt it'll turn out to be something along those lines
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<yorickpeterse> often it can also be tiny details
<yorickpeterse> e.g. creating an array only to get the biggest value for example, and that in a loop
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<jds> Hm. What's a RubyVM::Env ?
<jds> allocation_stats looks useful
<jds> sadly I'm on 1.9.3 for now
<cirwin> well you can try running on 2.1 just once :)
<cirwin> RubyVM::Env is I think something to do with a stack frame
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<jds> doh. I managed to break my hijacked process. Guess I kill it and wait until next time it occurs
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<nXqd> what do you prefer : def initialize(opts ={}); @a1 = opts[:a1]; @a2=opts[:a2]; @ end and def initialize(a1,a2,a3); @a1 = a1; @a2 = a2; @a3 = a3; end
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<ljarvis> they're not really comparable imo
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<ljarvis> so I'll say the latter
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<epitron> i was thinking that it would be handy if there was a mixin that turns the named parameters on initialize into ivars automatically :)
<epitron> (it would be handy for my specific use case, at least)
<epitron> it would be a little awkward to use, i suppose
<epitron> def initialize(thing1: nil, thing2: default, thing3: ..); super; end
<epitron> not very intuitive
<gnufied> inherit structs..
<gnufied> not exactly same though
<gnufied> ;-)
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<epitron> def initialize(...); ivarize_locals; end
<epitron> :D
<epitron> ugh
<epitron> maybe it should just be an editor macro that turns all your parms into ivars
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<manveru> just use Struct :P
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<yorickpeterse> fucking Ruby:
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<yorickpeterse> >> Set.instance_methods.include?(:initialize)
<yorickpeterse> .... where the fuck is that bot
<yorickpeterse> either way, it returns false
<yorickpeterse> even though the method is explicitly defined
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<yorickpeterse> gah, it's a private method apparently
<whitequark> private_instance_method
<whitequark> yes
<yorickpeterse> yap
<yorickpeterse> fucking herp derp implicit private method
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<epitron> manveru: does struct let you set defaults now?
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<gnufied> they don't.
<epitron> doesn't look like it... but that would be a good feauture
<epitron> Struct.new(param1: default_value, param2: nil)
<manveru> well, they didn't do that because when Struct was implemented there was no hash order
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<epitron> i know :)
<epitron> when you said "just use struct", it sounded like you were implying that they had
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<yorickpeterse> lel
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<jaimef> is there a cleaner way to write this? url = !extra.nil? ? monitor : monitor + extra
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<manveru> that looks kinda wrong
<apeiros> jaimef: url = extra ? monitor+extra : monitor
<apeiros> alternatively: url = monitor; url += extra if extra
<apeiros> note: `;` is equivalent to a newline. write that code as 2 lines.
<manveru> url = [monitor, extra].compact.join :D
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<apeiros> can drop the compact I think
<manveru> url = [monitor, *extra].join
<apeiros> >> [nil, "foo"].join
<manveru> ok
<apeiros> fökk
<apeiros> over in #ruby it still works?
<apeiros> oh… eval-in is probably not registered :D
<manveru> haven't been in #ruby for a decade :P
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<apeiros> jaimef is probably too busy fiddling around with all those fancy solutions to say "thank you" :-p
* apeiros off - n8 ppl
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<igalic> Is there a more ruby-like way of expressing this: http://dpaste.com/1456409/
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<ljarvis> igalic: split the line once, not 5 times
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<ljarvis> to start with
<ljarvis> right 3, didn't even notice it was a diff
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<dominikh> the colors didn't give it away?
<igalic> ljarvis....
<ljarvis> dominikh: :(
<igalic> or the + / -, or the diff on top?
<dominikh> hey, I don't want his help, I am allowed to be sarcastic.
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<ljarvis> heh
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<igalic> I changed it to http://apaste.info/adOG which is slightly less offensive to the eye.
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<ljarvis> you should write it again and use another different paste engine
<CaptainJet> What happened to using gists?
<igalic> CaptainJet: how do I use that from the commandline, without pain?
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<ljarvis> gem install gist
<ljarvis> anyway, it's fine
<ljarvis> i wouldn't split the string more than once, but i dont think it really matters much here
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<big_> hi everyone, I'm trying to write a config file parser https://gist.github.com/anishkothari/d6c460000d235f7bd5ad
<big_> I need help with lines 33 and 34
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<ljarvis> big_: what do you think match is doing?
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<ljarvis> big_: also, there are lots of weird lines in this that make no sense
<ljarvis> line 27 is another
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<big_> yeah... I haven't written Ruby in a while
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<ljarvis> you also dont want to escape the \n otherwise it'll try and match "\n" and not a newline
<big_> just trying to put something together :-)
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<big_> ljarvis: thanks
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<ljarvis> also "section_pattern||key_value_pattern" is moot because "section_pattern" is always a truthly value
<ljarvis> i would read the contents by each line
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<big_> hmm ok
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<big_> lljarvis: check out the PM when you can
<ljarvis> big_: im super busy and dont check PM, i recommend keeping your questions in here so everyone can help you out
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<big_> ljarvis: all right, thanks
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<big_> I'm applying for a junior role and this is part of the interview process. It's a little beyond me - would it be wrong to use a gem like rubygems.org/gems/parseconfig
<jaimef> so looping over hundreds of hosts and getting a numeric value for each and want to easily find the unique ones. the outliers. as they should all be the same. within a loop what is the best way to accumulate these to find that? foo = {}; hosts.each {|h,value| foo << { h.to_sym => value} } foo.uniq ?
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<ljarvis> big_: sounds like they want you to build it
<ljarvis> jaimef: use a set
<ljarvis> oh you still want to store dups but want to count unique ones?
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<big_> ljarvis: I thought so too, but I asked them a question about it and they replied "The best guidance is to tackle it in the way you believe to be the most efficient. More interested in how you tackle it than anything else."
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<jaimef> ljarvis: thanks
<ljarvis> big_: right, then do that, if that means use a library then go for it, with that explanation, you can't really go wrong
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<ljarvis> jaimef: if you want to efficiently track unique values you should use a counter
<jaimef> k
<big_> ljarvis: thanks for your help!
<jaimef> was thinking sort uniq, just derereferencing it
<ljarvis> jaimef: that's fine, but it wont be effecient over 'hundreds of hosts'
<jaimef> true
<jaimef> ljarvis: thanks
<ljarvis> but if you dont need that, no point in complicating it, go for .uniq
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<jaimef> yeah. </bash>
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<lianj> him i have never seen //.match(string) before
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<ljarvis> jaimef: wouldn't an offender be something that was a duplicate?
<ljarvis> in which case, you want to check if the sizes are the same
<jaimef> I want them all toe be the same
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<jaimef> offender would be the outlier. e.g. a system that deviates from the rest
<ljarvis> right, so the offenders are the final list?
<jaimef> right, any that make the uniqness go up other from 0->1
<ljarvis> right
<whitequark> right
<whitequark> left
<ljarvis> but it doesn't look like you track the bad ones
<ljarvis> so what's the point in the 2 separate objects? why not just a set
<ljarvis> you're basically implementing set functionality on top of an array, using a set to track it
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<jaimef> ljarvis: the second object, offenders, is just to track the names. not the values.
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<ljarvis> ah
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