#ruby-lang on 2013-11-01 — irc logs at freenode.irclog.whitequark.org

2013-09-29 20:40 apeiros changed the topic of #ruby-lang to: Nick registration required to talk || Ruby 2.0.0-p247: http://ruby-lang.org (Ruby 1.9.3-p448) || Paste >3 lines of text on http://gist.github.com

00:00 <Technodrome> Microsoft Windows incorporates support for Ogham Unicode from Windows 7 onwards.

00:00 <Technodrome> OSX i think has always had it

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00:01 <Technodrome> although it is true, its mostly been replaced by latin characters, but still , many novelist and schools use it

00:02 <[spoiler]> I, and this is so controversial, feel hipster using a Windows

00:02 <[spoiler]> right now

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00:03 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: so what do you use ruby for?

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00:04 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: All sorts of things: fun, projects... mostly fun, though

00:05 <[spoiler]> also use it as a tool to do stuff

00:06 <crankharder> how come after I rsync -av /path/foo/* /otherpath/ and then I "du -s /path/foo" and "du -s /otherpath/foo" the filesizes aren't the same?

00:06 <crankharder> isn't that the point of the rsync?

00:07 <[spoiler]> I'm laughing at "and then I du"

00:07 <[spoiler]> because, it's a bit like "I do"

00:07 <crankharder> I'm gonna du u next

00:07 <[spoiler]> LOL

00:07 <crankharder> dammit, wrong channel grr

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00:08 <crankharder> but WHY

00:08 <mistym> crankharder: du reports on actual usage, no? So fragmentation, filesystem metadata, etc. affects the result

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00:08 <mistym> I bet if you pass --apparent-size (on GNU du, not sure if BSD du groks that) you'd get the same result

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00:12 <Technodrome> so self always refers to the object receiver right? and if its called say from within a class definition it just refers to the global Class pretty

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00:13 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: no, it refers to the class it's within

00:13 <Technodrome> where its defined?

00:13 <crankharder> mistym: correctish answer btw... --apparent-size results in a smaller diff, but not a perfect match

00:13 <[spoiler]> >> class A; puts self; end

00:13 <eval-in> [spoiler] => A ... (https://eval.in/59314)

00:13 <Technodrome> ok for some reason i keep wanting to think its like this in javascript

00:13 <Technodrome> call time

00:13 <mistym> Technodrome: Classes themselves are objects and classes exist at the time the class definition opens

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00:14 <Technodrome> what if you redefine though, like newClass.something = Math.sqrt

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00:14 <[spoiler]> then it's redefined

00:14 <Technodrome> and say sqrt referred to self, what would be self?

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00:14 <Technodrome> Math or newClass if it was called from newClass.something?

00:14 <[spoiler]> newClass is not a valid class in Ruby

00:14 <Technodrome> would self still refer to where it was *defined* in?

00:14 <Technodrome> yeah iknow

00:14 <Technodrome> sorry

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00:15 <[spoiler]> Hmm, I'm confused now

00:15 <[spoiler]> can you write the code

00:15 <[spoiler]> of what you're trying to explain?

00:15 <Technodrome> like the this in JS and Java are very different :)

00:16 <Technodrome> this in JS is like call time , if you refine a method to another object the this will then be that new object caller

00:16 <Technodrome> point to it

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00:21 <[spoiler]> I'm not sure you can change methods that way

00:21 <[spoiler]> because Something.method_name= other_method

00:21 <[spoiler]> will attempt to call "method_name=" on Something

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00:21 <[spoiler]> and pass "other_method" as a parameter

00:22 <drbrain> I would say "the value of 'other_method'"

00:22 <[spoiler]> whereas in javascript, method_name is just a property on Something that can be re-assigned

00:22 <[spoiler]> drbrain: thanks :)

00:22 <drbrain> just to be clear that "other_method" gets evaluated first

00:22 <[spoiler]> I should've said method(:other_method)

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00:23 <drbrain> ah, yes, because in JS there's a difference between "some_method" and "some_method()"

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01:00 <rickhull> a coworker is having a problem with mechanize and net:http::persistent

01:00 <rickhull> it looks like the remote end (apache) is not respecting the keep alive header

01:01 <rickhull> so we tried agent.keep_alive false

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01:01 <rickhull> we're still getting a net::http::persistent error on remote close

01:01 <rickhull> https://gist.github.com/achanda/7259620

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01:02 <drbrain> rickhull: that means the server is hanging up on you before all the bytes are returned

01:02 <drbrain> keep alive won't change that behavior

01:02 <drbrain> … bus time

01:02 <rickhull> ok, i suspected some sort of remote bug

01:02 <rickhull> thanks!

01:02 <drbrain> mechanize is supposed to rescue that exception and give you a Mechanize error you can see the returned bytes from

01:03 <drbrain> (some servers are just broken)

01:03 <drbrain> there may be an issue you can find for it on github.com/sparklemotion/mechanize

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01:06 <rickhull> this one looks like it https://github.com/sparklemotion/mechanize/issues/123

01:06 <rickhull> so, if i understand correctly, the remote server is fucked up. cool

01:06 <rickhull> but there is a potential client bug in the way it exposes the server bug

01:06 <rickhull> ?

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01:09 <rickhull> heh, that issue got jacked into SSL certs and CAs xD

01:12 <zzak> yorickpeterse: for travel

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01:32 <rony358> drbrain: thanks

01:32 <rony358> I tried agent.retry_change_requests = true

01:32 <rony358> but that did not work either

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02:11 <Technodrome> yeah drbrain i keep thinking in terms of JS right now

02:11 <Technodrome> been doing a lot of node.js

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02:23 <[spoiker]> fuck

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02:23 <[spoiler]> there

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02:28 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: i keep thinking like Math.something is some property , like its not being executed etc

02:28 <[spoiler]> it can be a constant

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02:29 <[spoiler]> Math::Pi

02:29 <[spoiler]> for example

02:29 <[spoiler]> but that's not what you mean, though

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02:29 <[spoiler]> idk, if Math::Pi is a constant, tho

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02:49 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: yeah but do you know how in JS, people re assign objects to different function objects all the time

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02:49 <Technodrome> then execute and it messes up the context of "this"

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02:51 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: that's considered bad from :P I've never had a problem

02:51 <[spoiler]> in JS with it, though

02:51 <Technodrome> yeah people don't do it much

02:52 <[spoiler]> Also, if you want a class to mimic JS objects, you can do something like

02:52 * [spoiler] types

02:53 <Technodrome> i'm not a huge fan of prototypes , so no mimic'ing here really

02:53 <[spoiler]> https://eval.in/private/24899b2bc6aa47

02:53 <Technodrome> the whole "call time" this , has been an issue in JS for years because some people change some of the bigger libraries and it causes huge conflicts

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02:54 <[spoiler]> Ruby uses a call-time self, too

02:55 <Technodrome> but you can't re assign like that though right? so its a non issue

02:55 <Technodrome> its call time but its also where its defined right?

02:55 <Technodrome> it works more like the java this ?

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02:59 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: https://eval.in/private/3aea16a797dc5f

02:59 <[spoiler]> self is context-aware

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03:11 <coca_rails> Any newbies feel like pairing up on a project with a fellow newbie on a rails project I just started?

03:12 <[spoiler]> what's the project? :-)

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03:27 <coca_rails> [spoiler]: Basically making a search utility using Blacklight for a bunch of PDF files online

03:28 <coca_rails> The Blacklight search utility will allow users to filter through a repository of pdfs

03:28 <coca_rails> that are relevant to what theyre searching for

03:29 <coca_rails> Are you interested? Crosses fingers:

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04:12 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: so it is like the JS version of this a bit

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04:16 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: so in ruby, the self will always be the object receiver , but in ruby that will likely always be the place its defined in unless you include a module like you did or something?

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08:41 <gnufied> banisterfiend: you there?

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08:44 <gnufied> weird bug I am seeing here

08:44 <gnufied> if a Process spawns another ruby process and a. spawned process has 'require "pry"' somewhere b. spawned process is created in its own process group. then second process simply hangs

08:44 <gnufied> I suspect this is because of readline somewhre

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08:49 <gnufied> alright

08:49 <gnufied> looks like, child of stdin is still connected to terminals stdin

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08:50 <gnufied> gah, I meant $stdin of child is still connected to terminal's stdin

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09:19 <yorickpeterse> morning

09:20 <gnufied> yorning yorick

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11:26 <[spoiler]> o.o

11:26 <[spoiler]> is the memoserv

11:26 <[spoiler]> supposed to give feedba--nvm

11:26 <[spoiler]> it was lagging a little

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11:28 <psih> is it me or ruby under 64 bit is buggy as hell? o.O

11:28 <[spoiler]> psih: what's buggin' ya?

11:28 <psih> well, I have a Gentoo box, compiled the ruby and stuff

11:28 <joonty> psih: we always run it on 64 bit systems without problems

11:28 <psih> and I never saw so much weird things going on with an app EVER

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11:29 <[spoiler]> I've never had problems with running it on a 64bit system either

11:29 <psih> right now I'm trying to get Redmine working and it says that I don't have the security token generated

11:29 <yorickpeterse> ... that's not related to 64bit at all

11:29 <psih> the damn thing is - it is there where it looks for it

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11:30 <psih> well, yesterday it was not working at all, I don't know how it kind'a works today...

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11:30 <psih> I get now this: ArgumentError (A secret is required to generate an integrity hash for cookie session data. Use config.secret_token = "some secret phrase of at least 30 characters"in config/initializers/secret_token.rb):

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11:31 <psih> despite the fact that

11:31 <psih> cat config/initializers/secret_token.rb

11:31 <psih> RedmineApp::Application.config.secret_token = 'the long token here at around 64 symbols''

11:32 <psih> I just don't understand how these things are happening :(

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11:33 <psih> I'm a PHP guy myself, but even I know ruby/python are not as straight forward, setting up a RoR app by the looks of it is a hell, trying for the 3rd day now :(

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11:40 <workmad3> psih: redmine is a PITA to get set up

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11:41 <workmad3> psih: their guides never seem to be complete enough for their primary target (peeps like you) and they have a lot of extra stuff that is above and beyond a normal rails app

11:41 <psih> workmad3, I noticed :( Although I've got up and running it on Ubuntu box, just an ancient version

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11:43 <psih> I can't get it why it does not read the secure_token although it is there, maybe it's sonthing in the way it is defined, i'm just not familiar with ruby syntax to see if something is wrong :()

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12:14 <[spoiler]> psih: if it was syntac error, ruby's led you know loud and clear

12:14 <[spoiler]> s/'s/'d

12:15 <psih> hope so :) Right now I have no idea why does it fail like that

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12:15 <psih> not like i'm runing ruby 2.0 or wrong rails version

12:15 <[spoiler]> Where are you getting tha argument error?

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12:16 <[spoiler]> maybe you made a typo and are passing a nil

12:16 <[spoiler]> or, nvm

12:16 <[spoiler]> it looks like

12:16 <[spoiler]> it's not even passing

12:16 <[spoiler]> in the argument

12:17 <psih> the content of the file is RedmineApp::Application.config.secret_token = 'token'

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12:17 <psih> file is located where it tries it to read

12:17 <psih> permissions are ok

12:17 <[spoiler]> You're getting the error from within `config/initializers/secret_token.rb`?

12:18 <[spoiler]> That's so odd

12:18 <psih> ArgumentError (A secret is required to generate an integrity hash for cookie session data. Use config.secret_token = "some secret phrase of at least 30 characters"in config/initializers/secret_token.rb):

12:18 <psih> /usr/lib64/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/actionpack-3.2.13/lib/action_dispatch/middleware/cookies.rb:319:in `ensure_secret_secure'

12:18 <psih> I get it like this

12:18 <psih> I can pastebin the whole trace if you need

12:20 <psih> here is the full trace I get http://pastebin.com/JfY7xXud

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12:21 <[spoiler]> is that rails 3.2?

12:21 <[spoiler]> looks like it

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12:21 <psih> yep, rails -v

12:21 <psih> Rails 3.2.13

12:22 <[spoiler]> Hmm, ok I'm on Rails 4, and this is what I have

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12:22 <[spoiler]> App::Application.config.secret_key_base = '...'

12:22 <[spoiler]> :|

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12:23 <[spoiler]> what's in your session_store.rb?

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12:24 <psih> where I should look for it? in gems folder?

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12:26 <psih> I don't have a session_store.rb in the app itself

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12:32 <[spoiler]> psih: should be in config

12:32 <[spoiler]> i mean config/initializers

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12:34 <psih> don't have it there

12:34 <psih> only 3 files

12:34 <psih> backtrace_silencers.rb inflections.rb and secret_token.rb

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12:35 <[spoiler]> oh

12:36 <[spoiler]> `App::Application.config.session_store :cookie_store, key: '_appname_session'`

12:36 <[spoiler]> create it and write that

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12:36 <[spoiler]> change `App` and `'_appname_session'` to Redmine, and to whatever you want the cookie to be called

12:37 <[spoiler]> that's Rails4, I'm not sure hopw much different it is in Rails 3.2

12:37 <[spoiler]> check the documentation

12:38 <[spoiler]> s/hopw/how

12:38 <psih> ok, gime a few minutes

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12:41 <psih> hm, according to the redmine docs

12:41 <psih> it does not have to have the session_store

12:41 <psih> after the 2.0.0 version of redmine (which applies to me

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12:46 <[spoiler]> Ah, balls. I've never really used Redmine. I think there's a rails channel

12:46 <[spoiler]> you might have more luck there

12:49 <psih> ok thanks :)

12:50 <[spoiler]> Yup, try #rails :-)

12:50 <workmad3> no, don't try #rails

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12:50 <workmad3> try #rubyonrails

12:50 <workmad3> #rails is a barren wasteland :)

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12:51 <[spoiler]> haha

12:51 <[spoiler]> I tried #ruby-on-rails, created a channel accidentally :s

12:52 <workmad3> I sat in #rails for about a month before realising :) then I sat in there for about 6 months more in order to redirect newcomers to #rubyonrails :)

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12:53 <[spoiler]> workmad3: I'm one of those lucky people that never had problems with rails. I know my friend _loathes_ rails. I'd not be surprised if he was in #rubyonrails

12:53 * [spoiler] asks him on Skype

12:54 <[spoiler]> Oh, he doesn't even use IRC. :-/

12:54 <psih> :)

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13:11 <workmad3> [spoiler]: I quite like rails :)

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13:50 <athaeryn> why doesn't this work? http://vpaste.net/KeyMB

13:51 <athaeryn> it just renders '<a href=""></a>'

13:51 <athaeryn> the .net version of mustache, nustache, handles that template just fine, and i need to be able to use those same templates.

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13:53 <toretore> try using string keys?

13:54 <cout> good call toretore

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13:55 <athaeryn> i've tried that. i think it's the "{{#.}}" (the dot)

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13:56 <athaeryn> if i do something like `view = Mustache.new; view[:collection] = [...]; view.render('{{#collection}}{{name}}{{/.}}')` it works

13:56 <banisterfiend> cout ni hao ma

13:57 <cout> I don't speak any asian languages :(

13:57 michd is now known as MichD

13:57 <cout> I would like to though

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13:59 <athaeryn> sorry, that last `{{/.}}` should be `{{/collection}}`

14:02 <toretore> sounds like using #collection is the better way anyway

14:02 <toretore> always be namespacing

14:02 <yorickpeterse> MOSHI MOSHI YORICK DESU

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14:02 <yorickpeterse> re asian languages

14:03 <gnufied> wat

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14:03 <gnufied> banisterfiend: did you see my morning message?

14:04 <athaeryn> toretore: that's what i would prefer, but i have to reuse existing templates from a .net project :/

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14:20 <Okasu> wondering why does it overflows http://ideone.com/3ByWoF ...

14:21 <Okasu> That one works fine http://ideone.com/l4BMLL .

14:22 <yorickpeterse> grrrrr, LESS

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14:22 <[spoiler]> I prefer sass

14:23 <[spoiler]> It's got more attitude, innit

14:23 <rue> I bet you do, mm-hm

14:23 <[spoiler]> LOL

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14:25 <Mon_Ouie> Okasu: Because my_nil is out of scope in the class << my_nil; …; end block

14:26 <Okasu> Mon_Ouie: Why? There is my_nil = nil onel ine above.

14:27 <Mon_Ouie> But class … end creates an entirely new scope

14:27 <Mon_Ouie> As does def … end

14:28 <Mon_Ouie> You can use class_eval and define_method, which accept blocks, to capture local variables

14:28 <Okasu> Mon_Ouie: Well, for out of scope ruby has NameError, no?

14:28 <Mon_Ouie> Except you have define method_missing, so that gets called instead

14:28 <Okasu> Ah, indeed.

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14:29 <Mon_Ouie> Also notice there's only one nil object

14:30 <Mon_Ouie> So that method will globally silence NoMethodError on nil

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14:33 <banisterfiend> Mon_Ouie 'alut, define_method is no longer private on 2.1 right?

14:33 <Okasu> Mon_Ouie: Yep.

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14:36 <Mon_Ouie> banisterfiend: Looks to me like it still is (trying to call it on Object.new)

14:37 <banisterfiend> Mon_Ouie Object.new isn't a class, so you're calling it on the singleton class or sth?

14:37 <Mon_Ouie> Oh, define_method, thought you said method_missing

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14:37 <Mon_Ouie> Oh, and actually I don't have 2.1 installed, so I can't check here

14:38 <Mon_Ouie> Does eval-in have it?

14:38 <banisterfiend> >> RUBY_VERSION

14:38 <eval-in> banisterfiend => "2.0.0" (https://eval.in/59550)

14:38 <Mon_Ouie> 21>> Class.method_defined? :define_method

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14:39 <Mon_Ouie> https://eval.in/59551 # => false

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14:48 <cout> aww, where did rubygarden.org go?

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14:52 <yorickpeterse> it grew out of control

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14:53 <yorickpeterse> <queue CSI tune>

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14:55 MichD is now known as michd

14:56 <r0bgl33s0n> cout: i can compensate with tulips. you down?

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14:57 <banisterfiend> r0bgl33s0n did u hear about the 'tulip bubble' in holland?

14:57 <r0bgl33s0n> nope

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14:57 <banisterfiend> around 1700s tulips were worth more than equivalent weight in gold or sth

14:58 <banisterfiend> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania

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15:01 <r0bgl33s0n> very interesting

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15:02 <rue> That’s just because gold is worthless

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15:07 <cout> r0bgl33s0n: hah

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15:09 r0bgl33s0n is now known as r0bgleeson

15:10 <r0bgleeson> the more leet speak in my name is a direct consequence of unreliable internet

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15:10 <yorickpeterse> that's because you live in a third-world city

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15:12 <banisterfiend> r0bgleeson he's just jelly he lives in a dorp

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15:13 <yorickpeterse> at least we have decent internet

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15:15 <banisterfiend> yorickpeterse that's just to keep everyone inside so they don't complain they live in a dorp

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15:16 <Technodrome> Good day

15:16 <yorickpeterse> I don't think anybody complains about that, if anything they complain about those 5 foreigners living across the train station

15:16 <yorickpeterse> or the homeless people being drunk on the street

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15:18 <Technodrome> so self, if it's defined in say a Person class, and used by a module method or used by a subclass, the instance of that Person class will always be the receiver class right? The value of self is mostly it seems like the class it was defined in, or if its a subclass or something or module the class in which self was in the context tree

15:19 <Technodrome> I think I have it, just looking for reassurance

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16:05 <[spoiler]> Self is is not evaluated until it needs to be.

16:07 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: this might help: http://ruby-doc.org/docs/keywords/1.9/files/keywords_rb.html#M000033

16:08 <Technodrome> yes i think I got it pretty good now [spoiler]

16:08 <Technodrome> wherever it's evaluated from, the object receiver will be self

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16:08 <Technodrome> the object in which is calling a method in which self is present that is

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16:08 <[spoiler]> mhm

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16:09 <Technodrome> i guess me explaining it causes more confusion sometimes than its worth [spoiler] :)

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16:10 <[spoiler]> Haha, it's alright. We've all have trouble with some concepts in programming languages at first

16:11 <[spoiler]> For me it was the `&:bleh` syntax

16:11 <Technodrome> i mean the only thing i was making sure is that "this" is not like self in ruby, but you can't really redefine methods all like that, if you do, like you mentioned yesterday, it will be just the value

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16:12 <Technodrome> this is really the only thing that ever hangs me up in Ruby

16:13 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: that you can't redefine methods?

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16:13 <Technodrome> no , the self in ruby

16:13 <Technodrome> i mean, i'm making it more complicated than it has to be for sure

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16:15 <[spoiler]> There's 3 things about self: 1 inside a class/module block it references the class/module; 2 in a method it references the receiver; 3 "out-in-the-wild" it references an special instance of `Object` "called" main

16:16 <Technodrome> why would you ever want it in a class/module block?

16:16 <Technodrome> to create a "class" method?

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16:21 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Well, what if your method needs to pass the object it's called on to an API

16:21 <[spoiler]> so, inside a method you would have something like

16:21 <[spoiler]> def method; API::process(this); end

16:21 <[spoiler]> i mean self, sorry

16:21 <[spoiler]> not this haha

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16:22 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: this might help as to what `self` does when it's not inside a class/module/method: https://eval.in/private/ee1ecb8d8f20d9

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16:23 <[spoiler]> defining a method inside `class Object` is the same as defining it out in the wild

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16:24 <Technodrome> anything you add to the main Object class is available throughout the entire program from top level [spoiler] ?

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16:24 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: the "top level" *is* Object :)

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16:25 <Technodrome> yeah, I knew that, but i didn't know you could just monkey patch that

16:25 <Technodrome> interesting

16:25 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: it's just implicit, rather than explicit

16:25 <Technodrome> implicit is probably better

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16:27 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: shouldn't the to_s method on Object change it from main to this? why when you print self do you still get main?

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16:28 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: because I'm printing self and this. I defined `this` and attached .inspect and .to_s singletons to it

16:28 <[spoiler]> I didn't touch self

16:29 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: p is shorthand for inspect right?

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16:31 <[spoiler]> p calls inspect on the object and sends the result to stdio output

16:31 <[spoiler]> i think it tries .to_s and then it tries .inspect if .to_s is not defined (needs confirmation)

16:32 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: I am not sure if you can modify `self` the example I provided with `this` is what happens inside the C part of Ruby

16:32 <Technodrome> looks like it returns the value as well

16:32 <[spoiler]> oh, yes, x = p a

16:32 <[spoiler]> is completely valid

16:32 <Technodrome> p name

16:32 <Technodrome> [1, 2, 3]

16:32 <Technodrome> => [1, 2, 3]

16:32 <[spoiler]> >> p "hello"

16:32 <Technodrome> where inspect you just get the return value and not it printed out

16:32 <eval-in> [spoiler] => "hello" ... (https://eval.in/59565)

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16:32 <Technodrome> yeah

16:33 <[spoiler]> mhm

16:33 <Technodrome> kinda cool, not sure how it would come into handy though

16:33 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: some people use it for logging/dirty debugging

16:34 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: when you added def this.inspect its just a regular instance method right? Nothing special about it, just as if it was defined in the class itself?

16:34 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: no, it's actually more complicated

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16:35 <[spoiler]> but, knowing that it's a singleton method of `this` is enough

16:36 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: its still an instance method right?

16:36 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Well, it will only work on that one specific object

16:37 <[spoiler]> but yeah, it works like an instance method

16:37 <Technodrome> ah

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16:37 <Technodrome> how common are an instance method add on like that?

16:37 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Not very common, afaik. I'm sure there's practical applianes, but I've never really needed it myself

16:37 <[spoiler]> applications*

16:38 <[spoiler]> However, it's very common to define singleton methods on classes or modules

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16:40 <[spoiler]> https://eval.in/private/d530ff11aa3580

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16:44 <[spoiler]> What happens in beckground, when you create a singleton method, is that a new class is created (a subclass of the original class), and then the method gets added to that class, and your object's class changes to that singleton class (I think that's what they're called)

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16:45 <[spoiler]> Oh, no sorry, I was wrong. All objects have singleton classes

16:46 <[spoiler]> but, when you add a method to an object directly

16:46 <[spoiler]> you add it to its singleton class

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16:49 <[spoiler]> Oh

16:49 <[spoiler]> I've been talking to someone who's not here

16:49 <[spoiler]> I miss those part/join messages now :|

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16:51 <[spoiler]> wb, Technodrome :)

16:51 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: in other words it's just available to that one object instance?

16:52 <[spoiler]> https://eval.in/private/533cb37c1f7eed

16:52 <Technodrome> this would be a singleton class correct?

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16:52 <[spoiler]> All objects have their own singleton class (a subclas of their class, basically) and when you define a singleton method

16:52 <Technodrome> i see

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16:52 <[spoiler]> you define it on their singleton class

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16:54 <Technodrome> yeah

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16:56 <Technodrome> class << self , what singleton class is this [spoiler] ?

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17:02 <[spoiler]> that's self's singleton class

17:02 <[spoiler]> Oh, it's

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17:03 <[spoiler]> Object singleton

17:03 <[spoiler]> basically

17:04 <[spoiler]> https://eval.in/private/67e3b962c77ec7

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17:10 <soahccc> Do negative lookaheads act like a character group so (?!foo)+ matches everything except foo. I don't understand all the example I've found

17:10 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: self being a subclass of the Object class?

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17:11 <Technodrome> i'm still not sure if self *is* the Object or just a subclass of it when not used in a method etc

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17:14 <[spoiler]> self (when outside of module/class/method) is an instance of Object

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17:15 <[spoiler]> defining a wild method (lol) is like defining it on self

17:15 <[spoiler]> because self's the receiver

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17:16 <[spoiler]> https://eval.in/private/58e29a076d23ac

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17:19 <[spoiler]> https://eval.in/private/c53a4a5e180352

17:19 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: that might help

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17:20 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: what about when its inside of a module and included right into main? self is then still the instance of Object right?

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17:21 <[spoiler]> Yep

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17:22 <[spoiler]> https://eval.in/private/d458af1e421cf5

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17:23 <[spoiler]> self, on top-level, is a bit special. I can't fathom why you'd ever need toplevel self

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17:25 <heftig> soahccc: makes about as much sense as \b+

17:25 <heftig> lookaheads have zero match size

17:26 <soahccc> what does that mean? It's impossible

17:27 <[spoiler]> soahccc: nothing is impossible. :P

17:27 <[spoiler]> soahccc: What do you need specifically?

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17:27 <soahccc> I have one group (.*?) and it should not match if it contains a special word

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17:28 <soahccc> I found a lot of these like http://stackoverflow.com/questions/16930563/regex-match-anything-except-specific-string

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17:30 <soahccc> I know you will blame me now because of what I attempt but this is the problem: http://rubular.com/r/cWkZ6u5jC1

17:31 <[spoiler]> Hmm. Do you *have* to use regexp? there's nokogiri

17:32 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: pretty sure i get it now :)

17:32 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: I'm glad! :D

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17:33 <soahccc> I know there is but it's a big dependency for just one or 2 tags I want to replace... I know that even if I could get this lookwhatever working it would still break if one of my attributes include a > but it would be good enough

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17:34 <soahccc> I put the first match into shellwords.shellsplit so \" and "''" works

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17:36 <[spoiler]> soahccc: you can take a look at http://ruby-doc.org/stdlib-2.0.0/libdoc/rexml/rdoc/REXML.html

17:37 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: its just the small things that trip me up sometimes

17:38 <[spoiler]> soahccc: I just very strongly advise you don't use regexp for parsing stuff :(

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17:38 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Oh, you'll get the hang of it, I'm sure

17:38 <Technodrome> I'm just doing a rails project here atm

17:39 <Technodrome> and yeah the whole self thing was tripping me up a bit, but most people when doing rails don't even use it

17:40 <[spoiler]> yeah, it's rarely used within rails projects

17:40 <soahccc> [spoiler]: I know it's bad in general but it's just for out blog (markdown). I can live with "no < in attributes" but it would be cool to support < in the innerHTML without forcing to close the tag when you have no content

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17:43 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: also, this is an example where self is useful: https://eval.in/private/289e67b22285a8

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17:44 <[spoiler]> but, API can be an external service, or soem FFI binding, or a C extension, etc

17:44 <[spoiler]> soahccc: Okay, I'll look at that regexp now

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17:45 <Technodrome> whats that one site i can try out ruby code in the browser and it has a nice editor and stuff? forget its name

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17:46 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: eval.in?

17:46 <Technodrome> no :)

17:46 <[spoiler]> I usually use IRB, though

17:46 <Technodrome> yeah

17:47 <Technodrome> you every try pry [spoiler] ?

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17:48 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: I did, but it's a habbit to type "irb"

17:48 <[spoiler]> habit*

17:49 <soahccc> [spoiler]: Thanks

17:49 <Technodrome> there is that Wirble thing too

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17:50 <[spoiler]> soahccc: does it have to be a single expression? because you can do this differently

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17:52 <soahccc> [spoiler]: Hmm I don't think so. Here's my current implementation: https://gist.github.com/2called-chaos/a5a0e764835bb831f88c

17:53 <soahccc> starts line 80

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17:53 <micalexander> does ruby count escaped characters as a character in length? Im trying to write a php serialization fixer

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17:54 <heftig> micalexander: your question is invalid

17:54 <micalexander> heftig: explain

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17:55 <heftig> strings don't store any information about "escapings"

17:55 <heftig> escaping is purely an external property

17:56 <micalexander> heftig: so \" would count as two characters if it was in a string

17:56 <heftig> sure, that's a backslash and a quote

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17:56 <heftig> but that has no intrinsic meaning

17:56 <micalexander> is there a way to force a meaning

17:56 <heftig> what?

17:57 <MrZYX> what's the "meaning" of \"?

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17:57 <micalexander> heftig: well away that ruby would see that as a quote

17:57 <heftig> no, it doesn't

17:57 <micalexander> MrZYX: to escape the quote

17:58 <heftig> the literal parser does, not the string

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17:58 <MrZYX> how is a "escaped quote character" different from a quote character?

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17:59 <[spoiler]> soahccc: bleh. I am not in the mood for this. So sorry!! :(

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17:59 <soahccc> [spoiler]: No problem, I'm desperate too

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18:00 <micalexander> MrZYX: ruby sees it as two character not one

18:00 <MrZYX> that doesn't answer my question

18:00 <[spoiler]> do you need the attributes?

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18:00 <micalexander> MrZYX: well I don't understand your question

18:00 <[spoiler]> MrZYX: If you have """ it's a syntax error

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18:00 <[spoiler]> MrZYX: If you have "\"" then it's a string with a single character, which is "

18:01 <[spoiler]> using \" oputside of a string does... fuck know what

18:01 <[spoiler]> syntax error, probably

18:01 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: class Foo

18:01 <Technodrome> class << self

18:01 <[spoiler]> soahccc: do you just need the attributes?

18:02 <MrZYX> [spoiler]: I know, just trying to get where micalexander's confusion is ;)

18:02 <Technodrome> self here is the class Foo though , where if it wasn't a class statement it would be the main right?

18:02 <Technodrome> so self changes when you're doing a class inside a class?

18:02 <MrZYX> micalexander: you seem to suggest that there's a difference between a " character and a \" character, where is that difference?

18:02 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Self is context-aware. A class is born as soon as class Foo s encountered

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18:03 <micalexander> MrZYX: give me a sec to give a better example of what I mean

18:03 <Technodrome> maybe i'm loosing it but it thought puts self.class , it would be "main" but i'm just loosing it

18:03 <Technodrome> confusing myself

18:03 <[spoiler]> MrZYX: there is a difference? " marks the beginning or the end of a string literal, and \" is an escaped quotation marked so it can be used inside interpolatable strings

18:04 <MrZYX> [spoiler]: of course not, from what I've read micalexander things there is ;)

18:04 <MrZYX> *thinks

18:04 <[spoiler]> s/?/.

18:04 <[spoiler]> I'm confused as hell now.

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18:05 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: wait. When Ruby encounters self inside a class, it ir a reference to that class

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18:06 <[spoiler]> so doing `class << self ...` means you're accessing the singleton class of that class, which is Class:Foo, basically

18:06 <Technodrome> yeah [spoiler] i just had a mental moment

18:06 <[spoiler]> haha

18:06 <Technodrome> and in a module its a reference to whatever class includes it etc

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18:07 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: no, it's a reference to that module

18:07 <Technodrome> when i did a puts self.class on a module i included , it showed Foo

18:08 <csaunders> Because modules get mixed into the class

18:08 <csaunders> I believe Pat Shaugnessy's book explains it kinda well

18:08 <micalexander> MrZYX: how about this, is there force ruby to see escape sequences as part of a raw string

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18:08 <Technodrome> yes, that is how I understood it

18:08 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: https://eval.in/private/5554bd188346ad

18:08 <csaunders> here's my poor attempt at explaining it.

18:09 <MrZYX> what's a raw string?

18:09 <csaunders> When you include a module it's like you are reopening the class and defining those methods on the class

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18:09 <csaunders> but you can do some neat things, like when a module is included, run this code

18:09 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: oh, you meant the `self` in a method?

18:10 <csaunders> [spoiler] - the self is the the instance right, and modules cannot be instantiated, correct?

18:10 <Technodrome> yes so anything included in a class, when called on that object which is an instance of that class, they all share the same receiver class?

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18:11 <[spoiler]> csaunders: nope, they can't.

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18:11 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: so self is the module right there right?

18:12 <[spoiler]> in my example yes

18:12 <Technodrome> yeah

18:12 <[spoiler]> but, if self is inside a method inside a module, then it references whichever an instance

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18:12 <Technodrome> and the fact you bonded it to the module itself (singleton) it can't be included in another class?

18:12 <Technodrome> yeah i get that [spoiler]

18:12 <[spoiler]> Exactly

18:14 <[spoiler]> What module does, is extend the "method pool" of a class. So when a class looks through all of its methods, then it starts looking thourh the module's methods

18:14 <[spoiler]> modules'*

18:14 <Technodrome> basically a module is just a non instantiable class?

18:15 <[spoiler]> if it finds a method, it executes that method within the context of its (the class's) instance

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18:15 <micalexander> MrZYX: in ruby this "\&quo t".length #=> 6 and in python len("\&quo t") #=> 7. Im trying to get to the source of the issue

18:15 <Technodrome> yeah i get it [spoiler]

18:15 <Technodrome> hopefully thats the end of it :)

18:15 <Technodrome> csaunders: you talking about the "ruby under a microscope" book?

18:15 <csaunders> yes

18:15 <lianj_> micalexander: try bytesize

18:15 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: well, a module is a collection of methods. Modules don't have instance variables and all the stuff classes have

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18:16 <[spoiler]> Modules are like interfaces in C++

18:16 <[spoiler]> if you ever worked with those

18:16 <micalexander> lianj_: .bitesize

18:16 <[spoiler]> well, similar

18:16 <micalexander> lianj_: .bytesize

18:16 <csaunders> [spoiler] are C++ interfaces similar to Java ones? Or am I thinking of pure virtual classes?

18:16 <MrZYX> micalexander: try '\&quo t'

18:17 <Technodrome> how are java interfaces like ruby modules?

18:17 <Technodrome> ruby modules have code?

18:17 <Technodrome> java interfaces are just well an interface, method definition

18:17 <[spoiler]> csaunders: I've never worked with Java :(

18:17 <csaunders> Technodrome: Not saying they are.

18:17 <Technodrome> like an abstract class sorta

18:17 <Technodrome> ah

18:17 <Technodrome> sorry

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18:17 <csaunders> [spoiler] "I haven't worked with Java :)" ftfy :P

18:17 <MrZYX> micalexander: ruby's literal parser interprets "\&" as &, pythons as \&

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18:18 <[spoiler]> what does ftfy mean?

18:18 <csaunders> fixed that for you

18:18 <[spoiler]> hahaha

18:18 <[spoiler]> Why the smiley face

18:18 <[spoiler]> happy smiley face

18:18 <csaunders> Not working with java is sometimes a good thing :P

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18:19 <MrZYX> micalexander: ruby's literal parser interprets '\&' as \&, so using single quotes makes the behavior consistent with pythons

18:19 <micalexander> MrZYX: are you familiar by chance what php sees it as?

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18:19 <Technodrome> csaunders: java is where i made all my money for a while :)

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18:19 <MrZYX> no, but should be easy to try out

18:20 <MrZYX> micalexander: looks like same as python, \& (and ruby using single quotes)

18:22 <micalexander> MrZYX: the issue Im having is that Im pulling a regex match from a sql file of a the double quotes are escaped as well as ampersands and the likes so it throughs my serialization fix off by count. Not sure if I can force single quotes. So Im looking or another option

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18:22 <micalexander> MrZYX: is there a way to force it

18:23 <MrZYX> reading the string from a file is whole different story than writing "\&" into your ruby script

18:23 <[spoiler]> csaunders, Technodrome: take a look at this example (https://eval.in/private/d1ea340952926e) this is what modules are for basically

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18:24 <csaunders> [spoiler] yeah

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18:24 <Technodrome> so a module can have an initialize?

18:24 <micalexander> MrZYX: Im trying to do this count = match[pattern, 4].length, and its giving me the wrong coutn in the case of having those characters

18:24 <csaunders> Technodrome: No

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18:24 <csaunders> well I guess so

18:24 <csaunders> but it's overriding the initialize function of the class

18:24 <[spoiler]> You can even put `attr_accessor :power` into the module

18:24 <csaunders> It's awkward

18:24 <Technodrome> i see

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18:25 <Technodrome> yes very awkward since the class can't be instantiated

18:25 <csaunders> attr_accessor is really just an alias for :whatever

18:25 <Technodrome> module*

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18:25 <MrZYX> micalexander: I could only guess what you are actually doing from that information

18:25 <csaunders> so attr_accessor becomes def whatever; @whatever; end and def whatever=(whatever); @whatever = whatever; end

18:25 <[spoiler]> The class uses Switch's initializer

18:25 <[spoiler]> as if it were its own

18:26 <Technodrome> csaunders: yeah i get it how an attr_accessor is really just creating get and setter methods

18:26 <micalexander> MrZYX: the forth match is the sting I am trying to get the length of

18:26 <csaunders> Technodrome: So the Switch gets an initialize method by default

18:26 <MrZYX> micalexander: still

18:26 <[spoiler]> classes use module's methods as if they're their own

18:26 <[spoiler]> csaunders: yup.

18:26 <csaunders> and including the mixin replaces the method declarations

18:26 <[spoiler]> mhm, all methods are "transfered agressively" (meaning they override existing methods within the class)

18:26 <csaunders> if you wanted you could include the module then implement initialize

18:26 <MrZYX> micalexander: do a gist, provide your input date, your script, your output and your desired output

18:26 <MrZYX> *data

18:26 <csaunders> and you'd clobber the initalize method added by the switch

18:26 <micalexander> MrZYX: I can eval.in it but it needs a file to test

18:27 <[spoiler]> csaunders: true

18:27 <Technodrome> yeah , so the modules initialize becomes the one that the class uses when its becoming instanced, right?

18:27 <MrZYX> micalexander: so do a gist

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18:27 <csaunders> Technodrome: Modules are *kinda* like monkey patches in that they re-open the class declaration and define a bunch of methods

18:27 <Technodrome> yeah

18:28 <Technodrome> so its just giving the class an initialize method then

18:28 <csaunders> Technodrome: Yes

18:28 <csaunders> well it's replacing it

18:28 <Technodrome> what about if you have multiple includes and they all have initialize?

18:28 <Technodrome> the last one is the one that is used?

18:28 <Technodrome> last include*

18:28 <csaunders> yes

18:28 <Technodrome> very interesting

18:28 <csaunders> read Ruby Under a Microscope

18:28 <Technodrome> never really thought how this stuff works internally

18:28 <csaunders> he covers all that

18:28 <csaunders> :)

18:29 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: wait until you have to make a C extension. that's where the fucketry begins

18:29 <csaunders> I tried that once

18:29 <csaunders> tried working on some patches for oily_png

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18:29 <csaunders> segfaults and couldn't get gdb working to figure out what was going on

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18:29 <[spoiler]> haha

18:31 <micalexander> MrZYX: https://gist.github.com/micalexander/85714bc59be74a262959

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18:31 <Technodrome> i understand C pretty well actually [spoiler] :)

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18:31 <Technodrome> but i'm just doing rails project

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18:32 <[spoiler]> Technodrome, oh understanding C is not the problem, understanding the "inner ruby" is the problem :P

18:32 <MrZYX> micalexander: so what's your desired output? strip the backslashes?

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18:32 <[spoiler]> Ruby is not so... elegant on the inside

18:32 <Technodrome> but it's ruby [spoiler] :)

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18:33 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: so why don't you work in ruby?

18:33 <Technodrome> you mentioned it's just a hobby for you

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18:34 <micalexander> MrZYX: no to give me the proper "s:#" where # is the number, as you can see in the provided code this ";s:1:\"\";" portion of it is incorrect

18:34 <micalexander> MrZYX: is should be ;s01:\"\";

18:34 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Oh, I never had the opportunity. There's virtually no Ruby jobs in Croatia

18:34 <micalexander> MrZYX: is should be ;s0:\"\";

18:35 Forgetful_Lion has joined #ruby-lang

18:35 <[spoiler]> There was a tiny Ruby (on Rails) convention where they tried to spark some interest and they asked me to hold a talk

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18:36 <[spoiler]> but it was pretty awkward, because everyone was like "what's this kid doing here"

18:36 <[spoiler]> Well, it was 7 months ago, actually

18:36 <[spoiler]> I'm 20, and the convention attempt was last year

18:36 <[spoiler]> but I was 19 then anyway

18:37 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Yeah, there's very little interest in Ruby in Croatia

18:38 <MrZYX> micalexander: I can't help you without sample input

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18:38 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: i wasted years of my life doing java , and J2EE dev at that

18:39 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: most Universities here teach bad C++ and even worse Java

18:39 <Technodrome> i mean you can make good money

18:39 <Technodrome> by the end i was at 150k a year but still

18:40 <[spoiler]> and there's a few monopolyish tech companies, that use like Java 4 and C89

18:40 <[spoiler]> and most of them are enslaved to Oracle. It's all about using Oracle {X} and not about coding

18:41 <Technodrome> i understand

18:41 <Technodrome> oracle db is very common here

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18:42 <[spoiler]> I mean, I don't mind oracle, but I am just not the type of person who can (not that I won't, but I just can't) read a 10k page PDF manual about "using this icon with this icon"

18:42 <micalexander> MrZYX: https://gist.github.com/micalexander/85714bc59be74a262959

18:42 <banisterfiend> anyone here speak dutch?

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18:43 <[spoiler]> banisterfiend: http://translate.google.com/

18:43 <[spoiler]> :P

18:43 <banisterfiend> [spoiler] tried and failed with that already :)

18:43 <[spoiler]> banisterfiend: haha

18:43 <[spoiler]> banisterfiend: what do you need translated, I have a friend

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18:50 <MrZYX> micalexander: okay, that format is weird as hell, so I'm not even going to try grasp it. I think what your issue is that you want to match \" in your regex and for forgot to escape the backslash, try (:\\?\\") as the third group in your regex

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20:09 <micalexander> is there a way to force the contents of a variable to literal?

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20:12 <drbrain> micalexander: what are you trying to do?

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20:12 <micalexander> drbrain: https://gist.github.com/micalexander/85714bc59be74a262959

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20:12 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: you really need to get a good ruby job

20:12 <Technodrome> 140k+

20:13 <Technodrome> there are many startups that are willing to pay that

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20:13 <micalexander> drbrain: line 19 is counting the escaped characters and I need it not to

20:14 <MrZYX> as said, just consume the \ in your regex, \" -> \\"

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20:15 <micalexander> MrZYX: doesn't work

20:15 <drbrain> micalexander: do you have a simpler example than this one?

20:15 <drbrain> like: pattern =~ "…" # I want $4 to be "…"

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20:21 <micalexander> drbrain: when I assign s:11:\"robots\\.txt$\" ; to a string in irb and get the length it gives me 12, however sense in my code it is matching it, it gives me 13

20:21 <micalexander> drbrain: Im sorry I really cant explain it better than that

20:22 <micalexander> drbrain: ask MrZYX: Ive tryied

20:22 <drbrain> >> 's:11:\"robots\\.txt$\" ;'.length

20:22 <eval-in> drbrain => 23 (https://eval.in/59632)

20:22 Mellett68_ has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.]

20:22 <drbrain> ⁇

20:22 Forgetful_Lion has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]

20:22 <drbrain> sorry, I don't understand

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20:24 sepp2k has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]

20:24 <drbrain> I guess you mean:

20:24 <drbrain> >> 'robots\\.txt$'.length

20:24 <eval-in> drbrain => 12 (https://eval.in/59633)

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20:26 <drbrain> micalexander: what is [\s|\S] supposed to be?

20:26 <drbrain> match?

20:26 <drbrain> it is the same as /./m

20:26 <micalexander> drbrain: the code I wrote goes through a sql file and fixes php serialized strings after doing a find and replace. The problem is if it encounters \" it counts it as two characters instead of one which is a problem. I believe it is because it is not interpeting it as a string literal. If it was a regular string in single quotes it would be fine. I think that is the problem

20:27 <drbrain> in a .sql file, \" is two characters, not one

20:27 <drbrain> in a ruby file, it would be the same as:

20:27 <drbrain> >> "\\\"".inspect

20:27 <eval-in> drbrain => "\"\\\\\\\"\"" (https://eval.in/59636)

20:27 <micalexander> drbrain: [\s|\S] = match space or anything but white space character

20:27 <drbrain> hrm, too many slashes

20:28 <drbrain> micalexander: inside a character class ([]) a pipe (|) is literal

20:28 <drbrain> >> "|" =~ /\S/

20:28 <eval-in> drbrain => 0 (https://eval.in/59640)

20:29 <drbrain> since | is matched by \S you don't need it, so [\s\S] is equivalent

20:29 <micalexander> drbrain: what do you mean

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20:30 <drbrain> compare http://www.rubular.com/r/njVf8KwTss and http://www.rubular.com/r/MMJwec876G

20:30 <micalexander> updated gist https://gist.github.com/micalexander/85714bc59be74a262959

20:31 <drbrain> in ruby regexp, "." in a regular expression does not match newline ("\n") without the m flag

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20:34 <micalexander> drbrain: updated gist https://gist.github.com/micalexander/85714bc59be74a262959

20:34 <micalexander> still that is not my issue

20:35 <micalexander> the match is correct

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20:35 <micalexander> the length is not

20:35 <drbrain> line 16 and 26 are not needed

20:37 <drbrain> line 24 does extra work, probably should be "#{match[1]}#{count}#{match[3..5]}"

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20:38 <drbrain> micalexander: by length do you mean match[4].length?

20:38 <micalexander> drbrain: I think I understand why 16 is unecessary but not why 24 does extra work

20:38 <drbrain> on line 17 you're already replacing the matched pattern

20:39 <drbrain> so line 24 is "find this thing we just found again, and replace it"

20:40 <drbrain> pattern = /abc/; line.gsub! pattern do |match_for_abc| match_for_abc.gsub! pattern, 'other content' end

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20:41 <drbrain> the result of the block for gsub replaces what you've matched, so you don't need to re-match

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20:42 <drbrain> >> pattern = /abc/; '123abc456'.gsub! pattern do |match_for_abc| match_for_abc.gsub! pattern, 'other content' end

20:42 <eval-in> drbrain => "123other content456" (https://eval.in/59643)

20:43 <drbrain> pattern = /abc/; '123abc456'.gsub! pattern do |match_for_abc| 'other content' end

20:43 <drbrain> oops

20:43 <drbrain> >> pattern = /abc/; '123abc456'.gsub! pattern do |match_for_abc| 'other content' end

20:43 <eval-in> drbrain => "123other content456" (https://eval.in/59644)

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20:44 <micalexander> drbrain: updated gist doesnt work at all now

20:44 <micalexander> https://gist.github.com/micalexander/85714bc59be74a262959

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20:50 <drbrain> hrm

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20:52 <Technodrome> csaunders: what are your top 3 ruby books?

20:52 <[spoiler]> Technodrome: Why? I mean I'd love to, but it's hard to find one in Croatia, and not many employers don't like long-distance workers

20:52 <Technodrome> i meant here in the US [spoiler]

20:52 <csaunders> Technodrome: Dunno

20:52 <[spoiler]> I'd need to get to the US first :(

20:52 <csaunders> I'm more getting into SE/Agile/Craftsmanship in general

20:53 <csaunders> Poodr is pretty good, I liked objects on rails, and design patterns in ruby was pretty good

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20:53 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: you could convince some startup that you're worth somewhere between 120-150 with great ruby knowledge and be remote, we had some guys in ukraine we payed very well

20:53 <csaunders> [spoiler] what about canada?

20:53 <drbrain> micalexander: I think I see the problem

20:53 <drbrain> hold on

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20:53 <Technodrome> csaunders: where are you?

20:53 <micalexander> drbrain: yep

20:53 <csaunders> I'm in Toronto

20:53 <Technodrome> i used to live in the valley

20:53 <csaunders> But the main office (Shopify) is in Ottawa

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20:54 <csaunders> Keep in mind the valley is paying a lot because Cost of living is a lot higher there

20:54 <csaunders> cost*

20:54 <Technodrome> if you get a US h1b visa, that would be even better, you could likely get that as well

20:54 <[spoiler]> Technodrome, csaunders I have no idea how to find those jobs anyway, haha. Is there like a listing for Ruby jobs?

20:55 <csaunders> Top ruby jobs?

20:55 <Technodrome> csaunders: at the end of my working, i was doing java at 150k a year and i was working remote, this is becoming more fairly common as people demand higher rates

20:55 <csaunders> HN has postings every once in a while

20:55 <csaunders> Technodrome: dev work is pretty hot right now

20:55 <[spoiler]> https://toprubyjobs.com/ <?

20:55 <csaunders> yeah

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20:55 <Technodrome> but there is still so many brain dead people who take on a java job at 60k

20:56 <Technodrome> and most h1b visas say from india or south asia in general they will start them at around 75

20:56 <csaunders> [spoiler] you can check out https://shopify.com/careers if you want

20:56 <csaunders> Though, Visas can sometimes take a while :(

20:57 <Technodrome> i think the US will have more options but nothing against canada :)

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20:57 <Technodrome> but the amount of work in the US that is in demand is nuts

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20:57 <csaunders> Technodrome: There's other places in the US beside the valley

20:57 <Technodrome> yeah for sure

20:58 <csaunders> There seems to be some cool stuff going on in the east coast as well

20:58 <Technodrome> i don't live there no more remember :)

20:58 <[spoiler]> I'm a student, though (20yo). So, I am not sure if anyone would take me + quitting uni is not an option since I have a scolarship

20:58 <csaunders> [spoiler] yeah, that's your call

20:58 <Technodrome> i left the uni after 1.5 years for a java job

20:58 <Technodrome> stupid me :(

20:58 <Technodrome> or smart me , not sure

20:58 <csaunders> You could apply and see if you could get an internship

20:59 <csaunders> Don't think we've ever done one for an out of country applicant

20:59 <drbrain> micalexander: what is the second field (the one with count) supposed to be for title

20:59 <csaunders> And it would be the summer, and Canada is pretty nice in the summer :P

20:59 <drbrain> micalexander: for "title"

20:59 <csaunders> also, maple syrup

20:59 <csaunders> take that america!

20:59 <csaunders> :P

20:59 <drbrain> micalexander: and for "title\r\nsubtitle"

20:59 <micalexander> drbrain: what line

20:59 <Technodrome> csaunders: you're treading water now :)

20:59 <drbrain> micalexander: in the abstract

21:00 <[spoiler]> csaunders: Aah! I'll think about it, because it does sound great

21:00 <soahccc> I got the lookahead now but has anyone an idea why it doesn't match #4 though it matches #1 and

21:00 <soahccc> #5? http://rubular.com/r/pu16XTjj8R

21:00 <csaunders> Technodrome: :P

21:00 <drbrain> it looks like what you're doing is rewriting "s:<number>:<content>;" to "s:<fixed number>:<content>;"

21:00 <Technodrome> csaunders: the last thing we need is *another* canada basher :)

21:00 <Technodrome> i live in miami florida, we have an awesome tech scene as well

21:01 <drbrain> canada is so great it gets its own pack in Cards Against Humanity

21:01 <csaunders> You going to ruby conf?

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21:01 <csaunders> drbrain: They are really just rebranded american ones

21:01 <csaunders> instead of A&E it's like… The Fifth Estate

21:02 <Technodrome> i lived in toronto for a while and montreal

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21:02 <drbrain> micalexander: so I'm guessing that "s:5:\\\"title\\\";" should be "s:5:\\\"title\\\";"

21:02 <csaunders> yeah, WE had that name before that wikileaks movie :P

21:02 <Technodrome> my fathers mother side is all from montreal / vermont area

21:02 <micalexander> drbrain: nothing in general just trying to match for anything https://www.dropbox.com/s/zvm175jvmoohajt/Screenshot%202013-11-01%2014.01.41.png

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21:03 <Technodrome> which is funny because when they move to vermont, the french is literally gone in 3-4 months and then they prefer english

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21:04 <[spoiler]> Hmm, the only thing that looks like it could work is https://toprubyjobs.com/jobs/622-bloc%2C-inc-ruby-on-rails-mentor, but I'm not sure if I make a good mentor... Bah!

21:04 <micalexander> drbrain: the only problem with the after_test.sql is s:1:\"\";s:6:\"number\"; which should be s:0:\"\";s:6:\"number\";

21:04 <drbrain> micalexander: s:5:\"21367\"; << what is the correct count for this entry?

21:04 <drbrain> ok, great

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21:05 <micalexander> drbrain: do you see the s:1 vs s:0

21:05 <micalexander> ?

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21:05 <drbrain> micalexander: I told you wrong with the match thing

21:05 <micalexander> it should be s:0

21:05 <micalexander> drbrain: what do you mean

21:06 <drbrain> micalexander: I forgot that gsub passed the matched string, not the MatchData to the block

21:06 <drbrain> but there is a simpler way to count the characters like you want

21:06 <micalexander> drbrain: its counting the \ when it shouldnt

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21:16 <drbrain> micalexander: https://gist.github.com/drbrain/37a5ea4c4bf276d5aae0

21:16 <drbrain> how is ↑

21:16 <drbrain> I made lots of revisions

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21:18 <Technodrome> [spoiler]: we have lots of off site people

21:18 <Technodrome> but i'm the guy trying to throw ruby into the mix

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21:21 <micalexander> drbrain: https://www.dropbox.com/s/w9b3g02caa9ibep/Screenshot%202013-11-01%2014.20.32.png

21:21 <drbrain> micalexander: I can't write tests from a screenshot

21:21 <micalexander> the left is what it should be, seems to be hanging up at the same place I had it hanging up at. there are more than just this one

21:22 <drbrain> micalexander: you can use my gist to add tests

21:22 <micalexander> drbrain: true but you can see the diff and

21:22 <micalexander> its just a diff using difftool

21:22 <micalexander> of what it should be

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21:23 <micalexander> drbrain: first diff line at the end

21:23 <drbrain> sure, but I'm not going to hand-copy text from a screenshot to write a test

21:23 <micalexander> s:13 vs s:12

21:24 <drbrain> what should it be?

21:24 <micalexander> drbrain: s:12

21:24 <micalexander> like the one on the left

21:24 <micalexander> i wil just give you a cunck of the sql ffile im working with

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21:24 <drbrain> I count 17 characters there before the \";

21:24 <drbrain> I may be off by one or two

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21:26 <Technodrome> csaunders: so you work for shopify?

21:26 <vbatts|work> drbrain: hey there, is there value in documentation for OpenSSL? or are there other plans for it?

21:26 <vbatts|work> zzak: ^

21:27 <drbrain> micalexander: I'm guessing you want to add \\ to php_escapes and change \\*["&] to \\("|") in your pattern regexp

21:27 <drbrain> vbatts|work: I see lots of value in OpenSSL documentation

21:28 <drbrain> at worst, Martin doesn't copy it into krypt because the method disappears

21:28 <vbatts|work> drbrain: k. i know there is high hopes for krypt

21:28 <drbrain> but that won't be until after ruby 2.1

21:28 <vbatts|work> k

21:28 <drbrain> so the lifetime on the documentation should be at least 1 year

21:29 <vbatts|work> hrm

21:29 <vbatts|work> emboss doesn't hand around on irc does he?

21:29 <drbrain> occasionally

21:29 <vbatts|work> k

21:30 <drbrain> maybe as _emboss_

21:31 <vbatts|work> i'll keep a look out

21:31 <vbatts|work> drbrain: cheers. i'm headed home now.

21:31 <drbrain> vbatts|work: later!

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21:37 <micalexander> drbrain: https://gist.github.com/micalexander/85714bc59be74a262959 this is a chunk straight out of the sql file. I tried it again and it seems to be working, why did you suggest that I change the regex?

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21:38 <drbrain> micalexander: switch to https://gist.github.com/drbrain/37a5ea4c4bf276d5aae0

21:39 <drbrain> micalexander: the latest revision for your 85714bc has bugs, so you'll need to roll back

21:39 <micalexander> drbrain: what do you mean switch to

21:39 <drbrain> or use the code in my gist

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21:40 <drbrain> I would clone my gist (https://gist.github.com/37a5ea4c4bf276d5aae0.git) and add this test:

21:41 <drbrain> test_3 = 's:1:\"\";'; raise test_3 unless 'fill_me_in' == test_3

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21:53 <ruby-lang687> Newbie asking for help: Getting a cannot open library 'libcurl' on windows trying to use ruby wrapper for firebase API

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21:57 <[spoiler]> ruby-lang687: You need to download the DevKit

21:57 <[spoiler]> and then libcurl

21:57 <[spoiler]> and then compile it

21:57 <ruby-lang687> spoiler, thanks for your help, I believe DevKit came with the Railsinstaller package I ran (3 weeks ago??).... I'm not positive, how do I check?

21:59 <micalexander> drbrain: if you can test with the file in the gist link I added, it doesnt seem to edit the file at all

22:00 <micalexander> however the test at the bottom of your gist seem to work ok

22:00 <drbrain> micalexander: it writes to after_test.sql because I don't like overwriting the input

22:00 <drbrain> (since I committed changes, I didn't want churn on a data file)

22:00 <[spoiler]> ruby-lang687: Uh. I'd recommend getting rubyinstaller and following their guide. However, you can check by downloading a gem that needs a native dependancy (like nokogiri or eventmachine)

22:02 <micalexander> if I wanted to change that I would just change "after_#{file}" to "file"

22:02 <[spoiler]> ruby-lang687: but your *best* option is downloading a VM emulator (VirtualBox is a free one) and while running a linux VM getting rvm and installing ruby

22:02 <[spoiler]> RVM*

22:02 Forgetful_Lion has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]

22:02 <[spoiler]> or, chruby

22:03 <[spoiler]> chruby is nice, too

22:03 <drbrain> micalexander: yep!

22:03 <[spoiler]> I've used it only one time, and I didn't have a problem with it

22:03 <drbrain> well, without quotes

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22:05 <micalexander> drbrain: yep

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22:05 <ruby-lang687> spoiler: This is all getting over my head. I got the error because I'm trying to use a ruby wrapper for Firebase API which requires a 'gem install firebase' which worked fine for me (as far as I can tell). Do you think I should go the vm direction for this??

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22:06 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: if `gem install` worked you should be good to go

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22:07 <ruby-lang687> drbrain: thats what I thought, but at runtime I get error message about libcurl not found when it his a line accessing the firebase api wrapper

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22:08 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: looks like firebase uses typhoeus which uses curl :/

22:09 <MrZYX> typhoeus uses ethon which is a (ffi?) binding for curl ;P

22:09 <drbrain> which means it doesn't check for libcurl at install time

22:09 <MrZYX> yup

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22:09 <zzak> pong

22:10 <zzak> vbatts|work:

22:10 <zzak> vbatts:

22:10 <MrZYX> since 0.6 at least, it used a c ext binding before that

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22:10 <ruby-lang687> drbrain, MrZYX ; so sorry, I'm a newbie, what should I do?? gem install curl also didnt work for me

22:10 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: so your options are "figure out how to install libcurl in a place typhoeus/ethon can find it"

22:10 <drbrain> or "set up a VM"

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22:11 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: since curl has windows packages, I'd try installing lib curl first: http://curl.haxx.se/download.html

22:11 <drbrain> but windows is not something I am very familiar with

22:11 <zzak> drbrain!!

22:11 <drbrain> zzak: sup?

22:11 <zzak> hah

22:12 <zzak> im gonna see you in like a week! :D

22:12 <drbrain> awesome!

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22:12 <zzak> we should get sake and tempura

22:12 Forgetful_Lion has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]

22:12 <zzak> or whatever the miami equivalent of that is

22:13 <drbrain> corn dogs?

22:13 <zzak> corn dogs and rum

22:13 <drbrain> probably something cuban

22:13 <zenspider> cubanos

22:13 <ruby-lang687> drbrain: thanks, will try. Is that download link essentially different than trying to gem install curl?

22:13 <zenspider> and beer

22:13 <drbrain> paella

22:13 <zzak> the only cuban food i know is a "cuban sandwich"

22:13 <zenspider> they have more than one, you know :P

22:14 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: scroll to the bottom of http://curl.haxx.se/download.html

22:14 <zzak> there can be only one cuba

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22:14 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: you want one of the "libcurl" downloads that matches your OS

22:14 <ruby-lang687> and how do I decide/what is the difference between generic and cygwin versions??

22:14 <zzak> zenspider: are you going too?

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22:15 <zenspider> nope

22:15 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: I missed this link, it's a download wizard! http://curl.haxx.se/dlwiz/

22:15 <zzak> zenspider: why not :((

22:16 <ruby-lang687> download wizard still wants to know if you want generic or cygwin

22:16 <drbrain> try generic first

22:16 <drbrain> at least you're only down to two choices

22:16 <ruby-lang687> k

22:16 <zenspider> zzak: because I don't care for florida

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22:16 <zzak> zenspider: but friends :(

22:17 <zenspider> I could ask why you didn't got to the last 5 conferences I went to... but that wouldn't be fair, would it?

22:17 <zzak> i guess we will remain #ruby-lang-friends

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22:17 <zzak> zenspider: i didnt get accepted to cascadia but wanted to go!

22:17 <zzak> and openstack on ales too!

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22:18 <zzak> i dont think im submitting to on ales next year, i want to do more international confs

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22:19 <zzak> zenspider: scotrubyconf cfp is open

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22:21 <zzak> zenspider: btw will you be able to release zentest again soon?

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22:21 <zzak> i need gems 2.2 support :(

22:21 <zenspider> oh. right. yeah. I can totally do that

22:22 <zzak> sec lemme find you the patch

22:22 <zzak> zenspider: https://github.com/seattlerb/zentest/pull/52

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22:25 <zenspider> grr... I'm turning off the env vars that tune ruby's GC. tired of seeing it spew on every run

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22:30 <ruby-lang687> drbrain, et.al: thanks, seems to be working.

22:30 <drbrain> ruby-lang687: \o/

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