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<ldb>
it seems that i want a log file system in CL
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<Josh_2>
should be easy enough LdBeth
<Josh_2>
oops
<Josh_2>
sorry wrong ping :P
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<ldb>
Josh_2: it's ok since we're the same person
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<Josh_2>
*thumbs up*
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<beach>
Good morning everyone!
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<Josh_2>
Mornin beach
<edgar-rft>
beach: At the risk of disappointing you I must say that not everyone is on irc and not everyone on itc has joined #lisp, so the chances to reach everyone with your message are rather low.
<beach>
edgar-rft: Noted. Thanks.
<buffergn0me>
beach's good mornings are the best part of lurking in #lisp
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<Josh_2>
if they haven't joined #lisp what is the point of being on IRC
<holycow>
what are we talking about? what is itc
<holycow>
?
<edgar-rft>
itc is a typo :-)
<holycow>
ah
<edgar-rft>
a holy typo for holycow
<no-defun-allowed>
minion: what does ITC stand for?
<minion>
Interassure Tirl Creasing
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<isBEKaml>
what's IRC?
<no-defun-allowed>
minion: what does IRC stand for?
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<eivindst>
In Common Lisp by the way.
<phoe>
that last m-v-b has no body
<phoe>
so obviously it returns NIL
<eivindst>
Could you explain? I'm new to Lisp in general.
<phoe>
multiple-value-bind binds new variables for you
<phoe>
but then you need to do something with these variables
<eivindst>
Ah of course. Forgot about that.
<no-defun-allowed>
What are you trying to do with MATRIX-CHAIN-ORDER in the bottom line?
<phoe>
replace that last form with (matrix-chain-order '(30 35 15 5 10 20 25))
<phoe>
and you'll get whatever the function returns
<no-defun-allowed>
If you just want to return those two values, you don't need to wrap anything around the function call, as phoe says.
<eivindst>
Right. I'm supposed to process it further, just forgot to add that part. I thought the actual function returned nil.
<phoe>
it doesn't
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<phoe>
it returns (values m s)
<eivindst>
Also, it seems that the 'm' and 's' values are never updated in the last progn in the function. Likely because of my if statement being wrong?
<phoe>
updated? what do you mean?
<phoe>
I see some SETF AREF M and SETF AREF S in the code
<eivindst>
Hmm, when I print the result, it's all either "inf" or 0.
<phoe>
this means that the places inside that array are modified someplace in that code
<phoe>
if that happens, then that's a question whether your algorithm is doing the correct thing
<eivindst>
Yea... Trying to implement some algorithms from my algorithms course, but some of them are a pain in the back.
<eivindst>
But as far as Lisp is concerned it looks OK?
<eivindst>
In the final if-statement, I'm updating 'q' and when it evaluates it should return the new value, whichis compared to m[i,j].
<phoe>
the return value of that last statement is ignored
<phoe>
ooh, you mean that
<eivindst>
aeth: Thanks for the reference btw. For small projects like this I prefer to not have external dependencies, and also, its only integers in this case.
<eivindst>
aeth: Thanks for the reference btw. For small projects like this I prefer to not have external dependencies, and also, its only integers in this case.q
<phoe>
yes, (setf q ...) updates q and returns the new value
<eivindst>
Oops
<eivindst>
Thanks for the help. There might be some off-by-1 errors as the reference algorithm has indexing from 1 to n... Will keep looking at it.
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<beach>
eivindst: Would you like remarks on that code?
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<eivindst>
beach: Sorry for the late response. I would appreciate remarks. I'm a bit busy for the next ~45 min. but if you would leave some remarks or discuss at that time I would be grateful.
<beach>
OK.
<beach>
The DO LOOP keyword has an implicit PROGN, so you don't need that PROGN.
<beach>
You should put LOOP keywords first on a line. And you then need the slime-indentation contribution to get the indentation right.
<beach>
If you have an IF without an `else' branch, it is better to use WHEN. That way you don't need the PROGN either.
<beach>
Instead of doing (loop for l from 1 to (1- n)...) it is better to do (loop for l from 1 below n...). Same for (loop for k from i to (1- j)...).
<beach>
For global constants, it is conventional to surround the name with +, so +inf+ instead of just inf.
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<eivindst>
Thanks for the feedback! Will do as you say. Is there a "style guide" somewhere I should follow for conventions?
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<beach>
The google style guide is fairly complete.
<beach>
You also have the LUV slides by Norvig and Pitman. (You can google that. I don't remember the link by heart)
<eivindst>
Thanks. I will check it out.
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<jackdaniel>
what's left is to have connection the other way around via websocket and we'll have super-slow and buggy McCLIM backend, yay! :-)
<jmercouris>
phoe: I'll try, thank you
<beach>
jackdaniel: Wow, nice!
<jackdaniel>
thanks
<phoe>
jackdaniel: woah, that's amazing stuff!
<jackdaniel>
work from yesterday evening and today afternoon continuation
<jackdaniel>
I know that McCLIM has many other (and more important) things to work on, but this seems to be fun. html5 canvas api maps to mcclim drawing almost seamlessly
<Xach>
jackdaniel: very cool, i have been trying to do something slightly similar - decoupled backends/frontends for vecto. i want to do websocket<->browser interaction locally too.
<Xach>
one lisp program that outputs html canvas, svg, pdf, png, etc. without changes
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<jackdaniel>
right, that's what I'd like to have mcclim doing for output-only backends (and interaction for others)
<jackdaniel>
I have semi-working console backend for vt100 terminal (without ncourses, only via sgt extensions)
<jmercouris>
phoe: you are a life saver
<jmercouris>
weeks, and weeks of wondering why this is crashing
<jmercouris>
phoe: I owe you a million pomelos
<jackdaniel>
Xach: is there a repository or it is still in too early phase?
<jackdaniel>
the little one attacks me and the workstation :)
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<Xach>
jackdaniel: nothing published yet, just some proofs of concept
<Bike>
maybe we should get whoever's in charge of the cffi manual to mention float traps, if they haven't already
<Xach>
jackdaniel: i had a thing where it sends arrays of floats that encode the operations, and a js shim that interprets the ops
<Xach>
like [1.0, 50.0, 50.0] is (move-to 50 50)
<Xach>
i don't know if that's worth the trouble
<phoe>
minion: bank: jmercouris owes me 1000000 pomelos
<minion>
watch out, you'll make krystof angry
<phoe>
Xach: curious question, why not strings that denote ops?
<jackdaniel>
binary encoding makes sense if there is a lot of data going through the network
<Xach>
phoe: i thought it might be smaller.
<Xach>
and faster indexing into the function array
<Xach>
i don't know if that's true or not
<jackdaniel>
wouldn't integers be better suited for opcodes?
<phoe>
Xach: if you're very worried about bandwidth, I think you shouldn't use JSON through the web, but rather a binary format over WebSockets of some sort
<scymtym>
jackdaniel: the broadway backend has all that. the only difference is that it currently rasterizes on the server side
<Xach>
jackdaniel: js doesn't have integers...
<jmercouris>
I believe there is an object for integers
<Xach>
jmercouris: what position do you feel that supports?
<jackdaniel>
scymtym: I know, this hack is more a self-amusement whim tahn a competition
<jackdaniel>
than*
<scymtym>
Xach: the gtk people made a websocket-based bi-directional mechanism for this. the server side is implemented in the experimental McCLIM broadway backend
<Xach>
what is broadway?
<jmercouris>
broadway is a place in new york
<scymtym>
broadway = displaying gtk applications in the browser
<Xach>
You did, but I'm glad you don't care and won't try to argue otherwise.
<jmercouris>
Except that I didn't, there is an object for integers
<fe[nl]ix>
we can all agree that Javascript is awful, and move on
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<Xach>
beach: what do you think about making Trucler available via quicklisp? someone asked me to add it for the next release, but I realized somewhat late they are not one of the authors.
<Xach>
I know that the license allows it, so I am asking about your preferences, not my freedom to do it.
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<beach>
Xach: It might be a bit premature. Let me check with heisig to see what he thinks.
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<scymtym>
jackdaniel: i think both implementations (i.e. rasterized and vector-based) are worth exploring. i just wanted to point out that some shareable infrastructure is already there
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<MichaelRaskin>
jackdaniel: impressive work!
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<eschulte>
I have a CFFI problem in which dynamically allocated memory returned by a wrapped C function can't later be accessed from lisp without throwing a memory violation. (The equivalent C implementation works fine.) Any suggestions, or is this an "on my own as its probably related to specifics of the C code" type of situation? The code is up here
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<phoe>
eschulte: dynamically allocated memory? you mean allocated by Lisp?
<phoe>
by malloc?
<Bike>
foreign-alloc, it says
<phoe>
ooh
<phoe>
then sounds like something frees that memory
<eschulte>
By malloc inside of one of the hooked C functions (I believe `cs-open` in the example)
<phoe>
figure out what frees it, and you'll be done
<eschulte>
Okay. I'm guessing something on the lisp side, any suggestions for things to trace?
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<_death>
eschulte: your code assumes that size_t is the same as unsigned int, but that needs not be the case (and is not, on x64)
<_death>
eschulte: you can use the groveller to define a proper size-t type (annoying, I know)
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<eschulte>
_death: Ah, okay, thanks. I'll do that
<_death>
also, capstone assumes that size_t can store a pointer (what uintptr_t is for).. it is the case on the platforms they care about, I guess, but needs not be the case
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<_death>
it reminds me that a while ago I modified one of your libraries (the elf one, I think) to use capstone for something
<eschulte>
Oh, cool. If you have a pointer I'd be very interested to see it.
<eschulte>
Also, changing the type of the `capstone-handle` ctype from size_t to pointer seems to have solved my memory error, so thanks for that too!
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<_death>
;)
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<eschulte>
Oh, I should just be using sb-capstone. That's what I get for giving up my package search after (ql:system-apropos "capstone") returned nothing
<_death>
eschulte: personally I think cffi bindings is a worthy project.. when they made that contrib the reason for it puzzled me, and I think I asked on #sbcl but they gave no reason
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<fouric>
Shinmera: do you have a few minutes to sell me on why i should use alloy instead of clim
<Shinmera>
You should use Alloy if you need something that works in an OpenGL context and is Lisp native.
<Shinmera>
OR: you should use Alloy if you want to hack and contribute on a new UI toolkit that is open to reconsidering existing paradigms.
<Shinmera>
If those do not apply I cannot in good conscience recommend it because it is still much too young.
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<Shinmera>
I would absolutely love to have some collaborators for it though.
<fouric>
interesting. why "and is lisp native"? my projects definitely are, but i thought that clim was a prime example of something that was lisp-native
<fouric>
(that is, i read your "and lise native" as implying that clim is less so)
<Shinmera>
Yes but CLIM does not do OpenGL (currently)
<fouric>
aha, gotcha
<fouric>
hmmm
<Shinmera>
There are other non-lisp native things that do OpenGL
<Shinmera>
So Alloy is currently the only thing that does both of those :)
<fouric>
if i want something that has both opengl and software rendering backends, is either clim or alloy definitely best for that?
<fouric>
oh, i think you implied that allow requires opengl
<Shinmera>
No, Alloy is backend-independent
<fouric>
aha, alright
<Shinmera>
There's currently just only an OpenGL one because I have only so much time.
<fouric>
makes sense
<fouric>
and, is there potential for alloy to offer run-time introspection of widgets? that is, i'm specifically looking for a framework that will allow me to implement "jump to definition" but for widgets instead of code
<fouric>
and hotpatching, so that i can modify said widgets
<fouric>
(i don't think that this is possible in gtk, for example)
<Shinmera>
Alloy is deeply based on CLOS, so I don't see why not.
<fouric>
alright, that's enough for me to start trying to consume the documentation
<Shinmera>
Don't hesitate to stop by #shirakumo and ask me questions directly
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<fouric>
alright! no guarantees that i'll actually do anything, though, because i'm the stereotypical lisper who pokes at shiny things for a few months but can't finish a project
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<Shinmera>
Yeah, I've unfortunately not been successful in finding anyone to help out so far, but I'll keep on trying!