<gq>
like 6 people on Rizon have recently decided they're in love with me
<gq>
SO NOW THIS IS FUCKING HAPPENING
<gq>
D:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wat
* gq
climbs into ELLIOTTCABLE's hair & makes a nest
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: HELP MICAH IS AN ADULT AND HE'S ATTRACTIVE
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: MAKE IT STOP
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: D:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
what
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: wat
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that, yes
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
incomprehensibly: idk help bitcoin
* ELLIOTTCABLE
is poking around bfgminer
<gq>
o lol
<purr>
lol
<incomprehensibly>
ELLIOTTCABLE: lol idk bitcoin
<gq>
incomprehensibly: paypal recently decided to accept bitcoin as legit currency
<gq>
incomprehensibly: so now all the wolves are gathering :P
<incomprehensibly>
haha
<incomprehensibly>
fuck paypal
<incomprehensibly>
fuck bitcoin
<gq>
incomprehensibly: same lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fuck paypal, but i like bitcoin >:
<gq>
incomprehensibly: one of my (many) business ideas is to make a paypal alternative specifically for sex workers, cam girls, and other folks who work on the wrong side of the tracks
<incomprehensibly>
gq: that is a good idea
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
base it on bitcoin! )
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the only worthwhile thing to come out of ello is the ello smiley. )
<gq>
incomprehensibly: i also want to do a nonprofit alternative to the post office/USPS etc
<gq>
incomprehensibly: and i'm applying to local law school this winter quarter
<incomprehensibly>
ELLIOTTCABLE: wait ) is an ello smiley?
<gq>
incomprehensibly: if i can get a decent finaid package i'll do an undergrade in biology or something
<gq>
undergrad*
<incomprehensibly>
gq: whoo good luck!!
<gq>
incomprehensibly: thank you :) you've probably even heard of the school - Gonzaga Bulldogs, anyone?
<incomprehensibly>
oh i haven't but i haven't heard of any schools
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: ) is used as a smiley in ex-USSR countries for a decade and a half already
<whitequark>
together with )))) and such. it's a pretty good detector, in fact.
<gq>
whitequark: don't disillusion him now! he's in a good mood :)
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<joelteon>
ouch
<joelteon>
my buspirone is making me dizzy
<gq>
wat
<gq>
oh
<gq>
yeah :/
<gq>
try standing up slowly
<gq>
and drink lots of water.
<gq>
if it' sreally bad
<gq>
you might need a cane
<gq>
i have a walking stick these days lol
<purr>
lol
<joelteon>
a walking stick??
<gq>
joelteon: i just pretend i'm dr house :P
<joelteon>
da fuk
<gq>
joelteon: like, the buspirone makes me dizzy enough i don't feel safe walking without one, just in case :/
<gq>
i like having the extra support
* gq
shrugs
<purr>
¯\(º_o)/¯
<joelteon>
oh
<joelteon>
so it always makes you dizzy?
<gq>
um well
<gq>
not like
<gq>
once you get used to it
<gq>
it calms down
<gq>
but yeah definitely sometimes i'll stand up too fast
<gq>
and like
<gq>
fall over
<gq>
heh
<joelteon>
heh
<joelteon>
okay
<gq>
:P
<gq>
luckily i have very good balance from years in musical theatre
<gq>
so i know how to fall well
<gq>
no concussions yet!
<gq>
^_^;
<joelteon>
okay good to hear
<joelteon>
i do not like dizziness
<gq>
yeah
<gq>
stay safe yo
<joelteon>
it's a panic trigger for me
<gq>
:)
<gq>
yeah same :/
<gq>
if it gets too bad talk to your doctor becuase i'm pretty sure there are like
<gq>
vitamins you can take to counteract it
* gq
nods
<joelteon>
okay
<joelteon>
heh
<gq>
:)
<joelteon>
i'm on meds; now i'm on meds to counteract the negative effects of the meds
<joelteon>
what i should do now is get on meds to counteract the negative effects of the meds
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<gq>
joelteon: welcome to the club m8 lol
<purr>
lol
<gq>
joelteon: my favorite is the effexor was giviing me hormone prolllums, think like, growing another cup size, problems
<joelteon>
oh noooo
<gq>
joelteon: if i ever get on that again i'm pretty sure i'll need to take testosterone lol
<joelteon>
i'll never take effexor
<gq>
good
<gq>
that shit can make you lactate
<gq>
AND
<gq>
it's addictive
<joelteon>
i'm happy with my current cup size
<gq>
one time i missed the time i took it by two hours
<gq>
i started shaking so hard i couldn't walk
<gq>
it was terrifying tbqh
<gq>
x_x
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I ****hate**** arguing with women.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
because it makes me feel like attacking them for being women, when I simply disagree with them.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I just, don't know how to disagree with female feminists on *any issue* right now.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and it makes me regret getting involved in the feminist circles, regret trying to educate myself on feminist issues.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(not that i'm going to let that pain make me *stop* trying to, but I have to at least acknowledge that it sucks. |= )
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<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: it does suck, and i understand why :/
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: if you feel you need to emotionally withdraw from feminist circles for your own emotional health, you certainly have that right.
<gq>
:)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
gq: nah, not at all
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
lol
<purr>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I'll be fine.
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: Okay :)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it's only a small occasional quantity of suck. *shrug*
<purr>
¯\(º_o)/¯
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: Okay.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
makes it hard to engage with skilled females, though, which denies me 50% of the population as intellectual trading partners.
<gq>
I see.
<whitequark>
>skilled females
<whitequark>
you sound kinda like an asshole
<gq>
whitequark: i don't know what to say other than "well, he IS elliott cable"
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
what
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
why o_O
<gq>
lel
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
there's other people skilled in my field, and people unskilled in my field.
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: most people referring to women as "females" did that as a part of an insult
<whitequark>
which is not to say that you necessarily mean it
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
engaging with others who are skilled is how I self-improve, learn, and propagate ideas. half of the available people for that purpose are female; and it's difficult for me to interact with that half due to my own fear.
<whitequark>
just that it does sound like that
<joelteon>
is female the right way to refer to trans women too
<gq>
joelteon: yes
<joelteon>
ok
<joelteon>
"female"/"male" are sometimes degrading words anyway, so i'm not planning on doing that a whole lot
<dskuza>
back i didn't like being a elliott i wish to be removed
<gq>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hi dskuza
<dskuza>
hi ELLIOTTCABLE
<dskuza>
and now i must ride into the suburbs on my 74 horses between my crotch!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
dskuza: you can never leave; you can only deactivate your account
<dskuza>
or just /nick, that works, too.
<dskuza>
life needs a /nick.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
immediately pictured dskuza with two actual horses simultaneously between his legs
<dskuza>
two? no, 74.
<gq>
dskuza: your crotch has 72 horses?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
dskuza: “life needs a /nick.” wat.
<purr>
beep.
* gq
slides next to dskuza
<gq>
go on...
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
omfg gq
<gq>
lol
<purr>
lol
<dskuza>
my crotch has 74 horses and goes 0-60 in 4 seconds
<gq>
dskuza: hey. hey. hey can i go for a ride
<gq>
dskuza: just to try it?
<gq>
dskuza: :D
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
ugh ugh ugh stop making me picture this
<dskuza>
lmfao
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you two:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
DO NOT MAKE SEX.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
DO NOT.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
MAKE SEX.
* ELLIOTTCABLE
runs around in actual circles
* ELLIOTTCABLE
as opposed to elongated ellipsis, or rounded polyhedrals
* ELLIOTTCABLE
actual.
* ELLIOTTCABLE
circles.
<whitequark>
dskuza: "my crotch has 74 horses and goes 0-60 in 4 seconds" wat.
<purr>
beep.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-what
<purr>
<alexgordon> a python script, to generate a grammar, to pass to a compiler compiler, to generate the C++ source for a compiler, to be compiled by a C++ compiler
<dskuza>
whitequark: i have a super-crotch
<dskuza>
genetically modified.
<gq>
ELLIOTTCABLE: bitch don't tell me what to do
* gq
buys dskuza a drink
<gq>
^_^
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: there is no circle.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: didn't y〇u kn〇w? my superp〇wer is the f〇rmati〇n 〇f perfect circles.
<katlogic>
ELLIOTTCABLE: They're ovals. My terminal emulator is clearly subhuman.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
katlogic: :D
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
katlogic: hi, 'sup
<whitequark>
terminal emulator as a profession
<whitequark>
"my dad is a 4th generation terminal emulator"
<katlogic>
And can't draw perfect circles; because imperfect genes!
<whitequark>
"we're interviewing you for a position of a terminal emulator. please tell us about your experience with vt52 escape codes."
<katlogic>
ELLIOTTCABLE: Snarky and racist; as always.
<whitequark>
hey ec, want a fun interview story
<dskuza>
Guys I didn't die!
<whitequark>
it happened recently when I was over at [REDACTED]
<gq>
dskuza: yay!
<whitequark>
me: "well, there's [REDACTED], but it's not really usable" interviewer: "oh ... well, I wrote it" me: "oops"
<gq>
LOL
<purr>
LOL
<gq>
er
<gq>
lol
<gq>
but yes
<gq>
o dear
<joelteon>
that's an easy way to figure out you don't want to work there
<gq>
for sure
<whitequark>
actually, no, I do
<gq>
oh
<gq>
well
<gq>
that's unfortunate
<gq>
lol
<whitequark>
(surprise surprise, very good people can sometimes write bad code, it happens)
<gq>
whitequark: *points wordlessly at ELLIOTTCABLE*
<katlogic>
whitequark: Maybe it was a test of how much of "team player" you are :)
<gq>
katlogic: dear god i hate that tactic
<gq>
katlogic: i'm always like *smiles politely (thoughts: i want to rip your still beating heart out and eat it in front of your child)
<whitequark>
katlogic: "we thought about it and you're the best candidate"
<katlogic>
whitequark: So its a good place after all.
<katlogic>
or maybe
<whitequark>
katlogic: indeed
<katlogic>
or maybe just market, "despite not being a team player, we dont have anyone more sunny go happy with relevant skills"
<whitequark>
it's one of the best places I currently know of, and I do have good ones to compare with
<katlogic>
gq: I presume you're triggering me into saying something sexist, like "well duh; women are programmed to be team players, despite the burning sensation of thousands suns inside when you have to fake friendliness"
<katlogic>
Stop opressing me you feminist scum!
<gq>
katlogic: er. no? lol
<purr>
lol
<whitequark>
.... that was unprovoked
<whitequark>
gq: i don't think ec is a good developer. i can totally see him as idk a good UI designer (I know shit in UI design), or a good team leader (#ec persists after all, if its usefulness is marginal), or a whole bunch of other specializations
<whitequark>
[silence]
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
ow
<katlogic>
he's totes "technology evangelist"
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
katlogic: ಠ_ಠ
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fuck no
<gq>
lol
<katlogic>
large twitter following; good outlook of technology despite having no hard skill overall
<katlogic>
yup; fits the mark.
<gq>
whitequark: i think of him as an ELLIOTTCABLE - he's great at whatever he puts his mind to; even if it's bending reality
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: “terminal emulator as a profession” wat.
<purr>
beep.
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: was katlogic's qualification more offensive than mine or what
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: is that interview place the french place?
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: no comment
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
katlogic: wat
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
A) good outlook? wat?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
B) no hard skill overall? again, wat?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: well, yes. You put in the effort to couch your insult in “… but you *could* be better at these other things!”
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: whereas his was just “haha you're a <made-up job that people ascribe to themselves when they have no real skill”
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so many buckets of ಠ_ಠ
<whitequark>
hey, it wasn't an insult, or at least, was never intended to be
<katlogic>
ELLIOTTCABLE: outlook, as in, when someone says technobabble you usually know whats going on. hard skill, as in "hard scifi", or detailed low level understanding of computers. I have my doubts about your knownledge of 8051 ISA, but I might be completely wrong on this as I dont know you that long.
<whitequark>
(yes, I know there is a whole bucket of other problems with that statement, but, still)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
katlogic: So, anybody who doesn't have at least one instruction-set memorized is a ‘technology evangelist,’ not a programmer. I see. :P
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: I know that, you're far too honest for that.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: obviously, I'd *take* it as an insult, because I aspire very much to be a ‘good developer,’ not a UI designer.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
or, at least, I aspire to be somewhere between the two; and much closer to ‘good developer’ than you think I currently am.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
honestly, I'm more interested in being a good API designer than anything else.
<katlogic>
ELLIOTTCABLE: "Real programmers don't use Pascal" is subject to Poe's law indeed.
<whitequark>
I do include "API designer" in "UI designer" here
<whitequark>
in fact, that was the point
* ELLIOTTCABLE
nods
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
well, then you're completely accurate. Which is still disappointing to me. :P
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: thanks for being cool, nonetheless.
<whitequark>
katlogic: so, can I ask: do you consider yourself a good developer?
* katlogic
has the strange sense of dejavu: real text editor is not sublime text *g*
<katlogic>
whitequark: Hell no.
<whitequark>
aww.
<whitequark>
if you said "yes", we'd eventually end up at "but do you know how *exactly* are 12-nm MOS transistors manufactured"
<katlogic>
whitequark: That quality is to be judged by peers, which depends entirely on social circle.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
oooo katlogic wisdom
<whitequark>
lol
<purr>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
when you don't expect him to conform to current Western societal norms, he's quite the intelligent fellow ;)
<whitequark>
personally, my end goal is to become a Full-Stack Developer, by which I literally mean "start by purifying silicon using Czhochralski process"
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wait, what about forming the silicon in the first place
<katlogic>
whitequark: Arguing ad-absurdum again, I see what you did there :) Nah, there is certain line, I'd call it difference between software engineering and fab process engineering.
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: step 1: go to a beach, take a bucket of sand. step 2: mix with coal. step 3: heat up
<whitequark>
katlogic: no, not really
<whitequark>
in fact, there *are* domains of software engineering when you need to go down to gate level.
<whitequark>
my well-hidden point was about the usefulness of abstraction and the qualities that make a good engineer
<katlogic>
whitequark: Yes. But you dont need to know how FPGAs are manufactured.
<whitequark>
of course you do, synthesis software is only so good enough
<katlogic>
whitequark: Like chemist has some vague sense about physics, but does not understand it deep enough. Hence the separation of fields.
<katlogic>
In general sciences - physics -> chemists -> biology and so on.
<whitequark>
pffffrrt I would be a biologist and still I would have like four terms of quantum physics
<whitequark>
tell me more about separation of fields, please
<katlogic>
whitequark: That would be degree of knowitall then :)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it's okay, whitequark is a summary generalist
<whitequark>
anyway, what makes a good engineer is the ability to work on a given level of abstraction and knowing when and where to go deeper from there into things you ~don't know yet~
<whitequark>
it's absolutely fucking irrelevant whether a given developer knows x86 assembly, it is completely relevant whether they'll run away with their tail between their legs when their code is slow, or go to town with `perf record`
<whitequark>
saying that you need to know [specific technology] in order to be a good [general specialization] is just being an asshole to people you don't like for some reason
<katlogic>
or just asshole
<katlogic>
whitequark: As for perf record, is that contradiction on purpose?
<whitequark>
not arguing with that
<whitequark>
what do you mean?
<katlogic>
Because thats exactly the reason of abstraction bloat in general.
<whitequark>
elaborate?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
<whitequark>
katlogic: (btw, not a degree of knowitall. it would be bioengineering and bioinformatics... modern biology revolves around molecular methods.)
<katlogic>
whitequark: You're arguing that overspecialization inside a field (such as being good c++ developer, but not caring enough to delve into perf traces) is a good thing.
<whitequark>
nope
<whitequark>
I'm saying that initially, you don't know any technologies, and the more time passes, the more technologies you don't know
<katlogic>
By contradiction I mean, yes, you need to know a bit of low level stuff to correctly interpret perf traces.
<whitequark>
so in the long run, what matters is not particular knowledge, but knowing when and being able to acquire more of relevant one
<katlogic>
whitequark: No arguing with that.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: audy
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: oh.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: he's gone. >:
<whitequark>
so *when* your code is slow, you take out perf and figure out what the fuck does your code run on and how it works
<katlogic>
whitequark: My problem is people tend to move only in upwards directions. They all focus on more and more abstractions; having complete disregard for the low level stuff. Hence abstraction bloat.
<whitequark>
there's a separate issue with how slow exactly code must be for users (and developers) to care, but it's a completely separate systemic failure
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: audy?
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: do you know there is a #homecmos at freenode