purr changed the topic of #elliottcable to: a kind of sludge
yorick has joined #elliottcable
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: the "async s <= fs.stat(p)" line means that fs.stat(p) receives a callback and the result is `s` (and `s` is NOT a future -- instead the code is rewritten at compile-time)
<alexthegreat>
the problem is how to ensure that each callback is called in the right order
<alexthegreat>
and that mutable state is available to each callback
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hold on
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you realize JavaScript has forEach() right?
* ELLIOTTCABLE
grins
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I see.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
why does the *compiler* need to ensure this?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
That's, IMO, the wrong battle to pick. That's much easier to ensure program-side than language-side. I really like the approaches used in the Node community for ordering callbacks.
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: well... the idea is to make it seamless
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I understand, of course. I'm all for excellent U/X.
<alexthegreat>
I agree maybe it would be better to make it async and not impose any ordering constraint
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
But a *stdlib function with a delicious API* that orders asynchronous operations, would take much less of your time, and be 99.99% as pleasurable to the end-user. (Also, more transparent.) And that time means more improvement on other aspects of the language.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
just a thought.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
as for how to do it: well, mutable state … (you poor thing, furrow shoulda been Paws ;) … do you not already have some sort of locking mechanism?
<alexthegreat>
yeah but the problem is more memory management
<alexthegreat>
you have to allocate the mutable state
<alexthegreat>
then release it when all the callbacks are done
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and the ordering should be *relatively* easy to handle. The compiler is obviously aware of loops and such, and at least in situations where the async keyword is used inside *compiler* constructs, you can ensure they're all held until the outer loop has completed.
<alexthegreat>
with some kind of reference counting
<alexthegreat>
I was trying to figure it out but it was doing my head in
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
okay, now you're over my head. I think.
<alexthegreat>
haha
<alexthegreat>
I dunno, I can't explain it because I don't understand it myself
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(you know you're *really* confused, when you don't even know if you're confused.)
<alexthegreat>
I'm sure there's a simple solution that I'm missing
<alexthegreat>
I was hoping whitequark would be here because he'd just say "you're a fucking idiot" and give me the solution ;)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
trudat
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark is clearly a minor savant.
<alexthegreat>
he's younger than me, I think
<alexthegreat>
the younger you get the smarter, in this channel -_-
<alexthegreat>
I mean devyn is like 13 and he does haskell
<prophile>
the average age of this channel is surprisingly low
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
That's really not surprising.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
A) I like collecting intelligent people,
<prophile>
oh look, alexthegreat is implementing monads in javascript
<alexthegreat>
prophile: C++ actually
<alexthegreat>
prophile: any ideas?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
B) the older an intelligent person, the more likely they are to be really busy
<alexthegreat>
prophile: it's a loop right? so if you call an async function in a loop, the callbacks from the async function won't necessariy be in the same order as the loop
<alexthegreat>
glowcoil: LOL
<purr>
LOL
<prophile>
alexthegreat: right, that sounds like correct behaviour
<prophile>
if you strictly order it, they're not asynchronous
<alexthegreat>
prophile: not talking about the operations, I'm taking about the callbacks
<glowcoil>
nuck: i don't like parser generaotrs
<glowcoil>
nuck: i always handroll
<alexthegreat>
prophile: the operations occur concurrently
<prophile>
so there's no reason the callbacks should happen sequentially
<prophile>
it doesn't work that way in any other async system
<alexthegreat>
prophile: but I _want_ them to
<prophile>
so shove in some locks
<alexthegreat>
prophile: yeah and all other async systems suck ;)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
nuck: try it!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
alexthegreat: oh no u din't
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: oh yes I did
<prophile>
for a loop which runs n times, you need n locks
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
don't make me tattoo a page of cPaws on your back in your sleep
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: that interview might make you think radiohead is cool
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: he's the guitarist
<prophile>
in the nth callback, lock the nth lock, do the callback, then unlock the (n+1)th lock
<alexthegreat>
prophile: I have tried shoving locks in numerous orifices but none have come up good
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
alexthegreat: wat.
<purr>
beep.
<alexthegreat>
prophile: that seems pretty crazy
<prophile>
then after putting in all the asyncs, at the end of the loop
<prophile>
unlock the 0th lock
<prophile>
that'll do the job you want
<alexthegreat>
prophile: also I don't like locks, in general
<glowcoil>
oh shit max is not even that expensive
<glowcoil>
vastly more useful than something like ableton i would say yet
<glowcoil>
it's like, $250
<alexthegreat>
prophile: since tend to, well, block
<prophile>
well, yes
<prophile>
if you don't want blocking, let the ordering be arbitrary
<Rusky>
d a t a f l o w
<alexthegreat>
better to use callbacks instead of locks
<prophile>
or implement FRP :D
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
R u s k y
<Rusky>
important question here
<Rusky>
why must the callbacks be in order
<alexthegreat>
instead of "if busy, then wait" have "if busy then call this function when you've got time"
<alexthegreat>
which is the premise of GCD
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
i am bad at code
<prophile>
alexthegreat: look up Haxl
<prophile>
it might be relevant to your interests
<glowcoil>
pls kill people who feel superior based on not liking any music
* prophile
kills people who feel superior based on not liking any music
yorick has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<glowcoil>
prophile: thank you
<Rusky>
you killed yorick
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: what?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
also, died.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I miss the tumblr.
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: like if you spend any time on the internet webster music blogoforumosphere
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
somebody say something worthy of the tumblr.
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: you will see that
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
or remind me to use the tumblr next time somebody says that.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the … what?
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: there is a significant amount of people who really don't enjoy any music ever
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: and feel superior to those who do
<Rusky>
kind of like the people who run around the gmc saying they don't use gm
<glowcoil>
ya
<glowcoil>
only like
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the GMC?
<Rusky>
general motors company
<glowcoil>
they would run around the whole game dev community saying all game amking tools are bad
<Rusky>
hahahahaha yeah
<glowcoil>
but those people don't get like
<glowcoil>
social capital for doing that
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
confused.
<glowcoil>
because the game dev community isn't gross in that way
<Rusky>
game dev is one of the chiller communities
<Rusky>
probably because it's so pragmatic
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: so, Rusky and i spent a lot of time on the Game Maker forums a long time ago
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: it's an easy to learn programming tool so obviously those who can program in more things feel superior
<alexthegreat>
glowcoil: it's like deaf people who feel superior to hearing people
<glowcoil>
alexthegreat: haha yeah
<Rusky>
hey guyz i'm good cuz i don't use drills to put in screws
<Rusky>
i just push really hard with my thumb
<alexthegreat>
glowcoil: I remember on reddit reading a story where a deaf person was lip-reading the lecturer in class, and he said something like "when think thoughts you *hear* them as a voice in your head?!"
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wat?
<alexthegreat>
because deaf people don't have an internal monologue, obviously
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
crzy
<alexthegreat>
at least, people deaf from birth, obviously if you become deaf later in life you don't lose it
<alexthegreat>
glowcoil: actually I think it wasn't thought but reading
<alexthegreat>
"when you read, you hear the words in your head?"
ELLIOTTCABLE changed the topic of #elliottcable to:
<glowcoil>
alexthegreat: haha yeah
<alexthegreat>
"In some medical or mental conditions there is uncertainty about the source of internal sentences. Attribution for an internal monologue may lead to concerns over schizophrenia, hallucinations, or hearing voices" <-- so basically schizophrenia is deja vu
<alexthegreat>
glowcoil: it's supremely weird how we can hear words in our head without speaking though
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
lol!
<purr>
lol
<Rusky>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and now I hear myself saying ‘lol!’
<alexthegreat>
I can even sing in my head
<alexthegreat>
I'm a great singer when I don't sing
<glowcoil>
alexthegreat: there's evidence about like
<glowcoil>
alexthegreat: particular parts of your brain in fmris being activated both when expeirencing, and imagining stimuli
<glowcoil>
like, the same particular part of your brain for each particular stimulus
<glowcoil>
so like
<glowcoil>
your brain can play back shit
<alexthegreat>
yeah
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fucking fuck
<Rusky>
mind reading
<Rusky>
vulcans
<purr>
<Nuck> American English is a better-maintained fork of the English language.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Ruskyans.
<alexthegreat>
nuck: FUCK THAT
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Rusky: Hey. Hey. Hey.
<alexthegreat>
british english ftw
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Rusky: write a Paws.
<Rusky>
busy making a tk
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wat
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
really? why on earth
<Rusky>
for making a graphical programming system
<Rusky>
and a better os
<Rusky>
glowcoil knows about this huh huh
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
are you really? :D
<Rusky>
it will be cooler than lispos and amiga and beos combined
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
… okay. How so? :P
<Rusky>
immediacy and simplicity
<Rusky>
the interface is designed in such a way as to make several classes of applications obsolete
<Rusky>
imagine shell script flexibility expanded to everything
<glowcoil>
whitequark: in dismissing dragging-boxes-around visual programming, one should take into account the massive amount of usefuness in Max/MSP
<nuck>
alexthegreat: haha but it's true
<alexthegreat>
nuck: american english is stupid
<alexthegreat>
british english is far better
<alexthegreat>
right prophile ?
<nuck>
Yes with your completely obsolete U
<nuck>
colour
<nuck>
Yeah like French
<nuck>
:p
<alexthegreat>
nah it's more than that
<alexthegreat>
american english misses words out
<prophile>
there are a lot of differences in spelling and syntax
<alexthegreat>
which usually I'm all for, but it doesn't go far enough
<prophile>
but that isn't what makes british english british english
<prophile>
what makes british english what it is is the disdain with which you say things in it
<alexthegreat>
:D
<nuck>
hahaha
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
everybody wants shell-script flexibility expanded to everything.
<prophile>
american english spells colour as "color", whatever
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
old idea. tell me how you're *doing* it, in a way that is useful to users; and then convince me that you're going to stick with the project and that I should care.
<alexthegreat>
prophile: it's interesting, I can tell that those two lines you said are british english, but I can't say why
<prophile>
but american english is what people behind counters speak when they smile at you and tell you to have a nice day, sir
<prophile>
bugger that for a game of soldiers
<prophile>
so false
<prophile>
I want people behind counters speaking the queen's english and telling me they don't care whether I live or day while fulfilling my order
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
prophile: “but that isn't what makes british english british english. what makes british english what it is is the disdain with which you say things in it.” wat.
<purr>
beep.
<prophile>
s/day/die/
<prophile>
although if you get upper-class enough it is actually pronounced "day"
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
upper-class? that sounds much more … uh …
<glowcoil>
alexthegreat: funny thing, movies set in like the american revolution or w/e all have british accents but i've read that british english has changed more than american english since then
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I don't know the areas of Britain. But, one of the areas that isn't upper-class.
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: the equivalent of "upper class" in america is a 16 year old socal girl
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wat
<alexthegreat>
seriously, only 16 year old socal girls can accurately simulate the quantity of distain that the upper classes posses
<nuck>
are you trying to insult yourself?
<alexthegreat>
nuck: I'm british, of _course_ I am
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
nuck: did I mention, write a Paws? 'cuz write a Paws, and stuff.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
>3
* nuck
wrties a paws-to-c++ transpiler to piss off ELLIOTTCABLE
<nuck>
:>
<glowcoil>
all you c people, is **argv or *argv[] Better™™™
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
latter
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but don't listen to me, I don't qualify as C people.
<glowcoil>
ok :p
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
my stupid friend is at a stupid party and I'm stupid jealous
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I was invited, but she also invited all her other friends, 'cuz it's a fundraiser thing and she was told to bring lots of people
<alexthegreat>
glowcoil: all I know is that *argv[] is what textmate does
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and apparently her bff said yes.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and that bff and I aren't on speaking terms.
<nuck>
yeah but text mate sucks alexthegreat
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I'm all, GODDAMNIT I SAID YES *FIRST*. WHY IS SHE ALLOWED TO GO!?
<alexthegreat>
-nuck @ nuck
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so now, I didn't get to go, and I'm grumpy as fuck over it.
<purr>
nuck: shut up nuck you are a nuck
<Rusky>
glowcoil: *argv[]
<glowcoil>
ok
<nuck>
ELLIOTTCABLE: You're rich, perfect for a fundraiser purpose
<glowcoil>
consensus reached
<glowcoil>
i can continue writing my program
<alexthegreat>
glowcoil: no idea what the difference is though
<nuck>
glowcoil: There's no consensus until we have at least 10 signings
<alexthegreat>
afaik they're the same?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-sign
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: not being on speaking terms is so dumb
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it's a longish story.
<glowcoil>
been a lot of that in my social circle until fairly recently
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but it's something *totally* inappropriate.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
which is half of why I'm mad.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the bff saw a post of mine on Facebook, on a night when I was really, really, really hurting.
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: why are you not on speaking terms what?
<Rusky>
alexthegreat: they're the same because [] "pointer decays" to *
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
posted something about having no close friends available to me (because both of my closest friends were fucking me over, that night.)
<Rusky>
but it's clearer intent that it's an array rather than just a single element
<alexthegreat>
Rusky: right, so why does it exist LOL
<purr>
LOL
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and this other person, who's a “distant friend” at best (as well as a couple other acquaintances) took huuuuuuuuge offense to that.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
as if it's their business whether I publicly say whether I have friends or not.
<glowcoil>
Rusky: so it *can* be more safe or w/e but in this case there's no diff?
<Rusky>
alexthegreat: because c doesn't have first class arrays (or functions, but that's kind of okayer)
<alexthegreat>
Rusky: if that's the case then why do we write char* all the time
<Rusky>
it's not really safer or not
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
this girl in particular is so angry she won't speak to me.
<alexthegreat>
I mean a string is an array of characters...
<Rusky>
I would say mostly convention
<Rusky>
you generally don't want to declare a char[] either though
<Rusky>
int main() { char foo[] = "foo"; }
<Rusky>
means something completely different
<glowcoil>
i just mean, some things that Are Arrays can have more compile time safety? at least the statically sized ones?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and *I'm* angry at her, for *being angry at me over something where I was hurting*. Like, I was badly hurting, and she's so goddamn selfish to be *too busy worrying about whether I consider her a close friend friend or not*, to goddamn be there when I needed somebody?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that's just Shitty™.
<glowcoil>
Rusky: oh why
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: I can see why someone would be angry at that
<Rusky>
char foo[] is an array on the stack, char *foo is a pointer to a static string
Willox_ is now known as Willox
<glowcoil>
oh ok
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: if she is more friends with you than you are with her, if you know what I mean
<Rusky>
you might get compiler warnings for doing naughty stuff with known-sized []
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
arrays decay to pointers
<Rusky>
so do function names
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
as soon as you move out of the region where the compiler “remembers” that it's an array.
<Rusky>
did you know you can say int foo(); **************foo
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
no, there's plenty of locations where the compiler still has the metadata that it ‘is an array’ and can generate errors based on that
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but, if I recall correctly, as soon as you pass them outside of functions(?)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it's all so long ago, I'm all fuzzed up, will have to google
<nuck>
I don't recall the compiler being able to be smart based on that stuff
<nuck>
sadly
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but yeah, there's a boundary at which the compiler forgets they're arrays and treats them permanently as an un-annotated pointer
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: arrays as parameters are basically pointers
<Rusky>
[russell@prometheus ~]$ clang -x c -
<Rusky>
int main() { int foo[3] = { 1, 2, 3 }; return foo[5]; }
<Rusky>
<stdin>:1:47: warning: array index 5 is past the end of the array (which
<Rusky>
int main() { int foo[3] = { 1, 2, 3 }; return foo[5]; }
<Rusky>
contains 3 elements) [-Warray-bounds]
<Rusky>
^ ~
<Rusky>
<stdin>:1:14: note: array 'foo' declared here
<Rusky>
int main() { int foo[3] = { 1, 2, 3 }; return foo[5]; }
<Rusky>
^
<Rusky>
1 warning generated.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
> Bestial Satan of Grotesque Beauty
<Rusky>
only a warning
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
> Bestial Satan of Grotesque Beauty
<alexthegreat>
ELLIOTTCABLE: foo(T x[]) is not different to foo(T* x) in any way that I can think of
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
> > > Bestial Satan of Grotesque Beauty
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
alexthegreat: yep
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
ugh
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I wrote a spec, somebody care ;_;
<alexthegreat>
I was caring yesterday
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
:P
<Rusky>
someone else's turn
<nuck>
I cared earlier
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
on the bright side: every time I Paws, it inspires somebody else to go work on their own language some more.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
at this rate, I'll never finish Paws, but I'll be the *cause* of ten other programming languages.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
net win :D
<glowcoil>
3[food]
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: I just realized your definition of discrimination is self-contradictory. "it is applying statistics for people", yet the usual way to determine that discrimination exists is looking for systematic bias, i.e. applying statistics to people.
<glowcoil>
3[foo]
<Rusky>
I like 3[food] better
<glowcoil>
haha what if you could say
<glowcoil>
int 3[food]
<Rusky>
hahaha
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
… you can
<glowcoil>
and it was the same
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
… it is
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: no, decl
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
well, not specifically that
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
ah. thought you didn't know about that, and was gonna pop a stack :D
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: haha yeah i know about the indexing
<glowcoil>
;p
<Rusky>
too bad you can't do that with c++ containers
<alexthegreat>
whitequark: are we STILL talking about that?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: err, I never said discrimination. I'm talking about bigotry.
<glowcoil>
i'm glad make install worked with portaudio
<glowcoil>
and i didn't have to do any bullshit
<Rusky>
std::vector<int> foo; 3[foo]
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: hm, right
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Discrimination is systematic, and is defined by statistics, yes. A bigot is a bigot in and of himself, no discrimination necessary to call someone that.
<whitequark>
misremembered it then
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
alexthegreat: s/still/back to/
<alexthegreat>
Rusky: 3[&foo[0]]
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
'sokay <3
<Rusky>
true true
* ELLIOTTCABLE
sighs
<alexthegreat>
or maybe
<alexthegreat>
nah
<glowcoil>
whitequark: lol, not applying statistics to one person's beliefs
<purr>
lol
<Rusky>
but barney shoestrap's goal was for user defined types to be exactly the same as builtin ones
<Rusky>
:P
<glowcoil>
whitequark: but applying it to *people* as data points
<alexthegreat>
LOL
<alexthegreat>
barney shoestrap
<Rusky>
dangit youcompleteme why do you have to build your own clang when it's already installed
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
barney shoestrap :D
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
died died died
<alexthegreat>
Rusky: can't you just define the operator the other way around?
<Rusky>
oh nevermind it's boost
<Rusky>
you can't define operators on int
<Rusky>
or I would be doing that stuff all over the place to pointers
<Rusky>
at least I would have until I shot myself in the foot
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: but some of my friend group is poisoned in that way etc.
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: thought you didn't like whiny raconteurs guitar music
<alexthegreat>
stacey dooley's accent is soooo common
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: college. Don't worry about it. There's a bigger world out there, and you choose your own friend-groups.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
When you leave schooling, your life gets *way* more echo-chambered, IME.
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: right yeah college is already a lot better in terms of echo chambering
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it bothers me, honestly.
<nuck>
glowcoil: Your friends are all hipsters is what you're saying?
<glowcoil>
nuck: no
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I go out of my way (excluding this *extremely* echo-chambery room) to expose myself to people who disagree with me, or hold world views I don't understand.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(As long as they don't run.)
<glowcoil>
nuck: like the main friend i'm talking about who poisons things is the opposite of a hipster
<nuck>
ELLIOTTCABLE: It's okay, I disagree with you
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the religious, the hardcore feminists
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
nuck: you *think* you do, but only because I made you think so.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(':
* ELLIOTTCABLE
pats nuck
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: right yeah i respect that
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
nuck: write a paws.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fucking runners.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
no runners.
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: you said you exclude the extremely echo-chambery stuff
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
anybody who doesn't run, or snowboard.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: hm?
<whitequark>
and then mentioned religious and hardcore feminists
* whitequark
shrugs
<purr>
¯\(º_o)/¯
<glowcoil>
aw rusky left
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: you mis-read.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: I said I avoid echo-chambering *myself*.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: not that I avoid echo-chambers.
Rusky has joined #elliottcable
<glowcoil>
any idea why this is in a C example
<glowcoil>
int main(void);
<glowcoil>
int main(void)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
ughgiuawrga9wuitauwt
<glowcoil>
{
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fucking foursquare
<whitequark>
glowcoil: what about that
<glowcoil>
whitequark: like, the decl right before thd ef
<glowcoil>
the def
<glowcoil>
seems pointles
<glowcoil>
is it?
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: lol you said i haven't been typoing as much lately
<purr>
lol
<glowcoil>
i'm typing so poorly
<Rusky>
it's pointless
<whitequark>
glowcoil: well it's not required by standard
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I suck at git, sometimes
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
need to write my own set of helpers.
<whitequark>
prophile: oh god look at footnote 139
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that is WRONG, github-bot
<whitequark>
this is so horrible
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
WRONG
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that is NOT WHAT I DID
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you BUTTFACE
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: it's like, boards of canada-influenced post-dubstep-style bass music
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: really really nostalgic
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: heavily heavily melodic and synth-filled
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
boards of canada is vaguely familiar
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: they're one of my favorite artists of all time
<prophile>
"Thus, preprocessing directives are commonly called ‘‘lines’’. These ‘‘lines’’ have no other syntactic significance, as all white space is equivalent except in certain situations during preprocessing (see the # character string literal creation operator in 6.10.3.2, for example)."
<glowcoil>
they're ambient stuff signed to Warp
<prophile>
yes, everyone hates the preprocessor :|
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
warp?
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: famous experiental electronic label w autechre and such
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: it checks for new work every N ms, in µpaws
<Willox>
is there aniseed?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but that actually doesn't account for most of them
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Willox: huh?
<Willox>
like bonjela
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
aniseed beer!?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
are you for real?
<Willox>
JELLY BEANS
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: wel yeah, why do you do that?
<whitequark>
just post them into a queue and wait on that queue
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that was JavaScript, brah
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
what do you mean “wait on.”
<Willox>
Up to 99.99%!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: hm?
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: oh, right, forgot you're using the brain-damaged runtime
<whitequark>
then, hm
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wat?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
don't need performance advice right now, dude.
<whitequark>
it's not performance, it's design
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that was an old implementation that had NO PURPOSE IN THE UNIVERSE except to get us running some Paws code, so we could talk about it better.
<whitequark>
ok makes sense
<whitequark>
nevermind then
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that said: I'd be *ecstatic* to have someone to intelligently talk Paws performance with.
<whitequark>
*shrug* teach me paws sometimes
<purr>
¯\(º_o)/¯
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so if you want to go write a ‘performant’ Paws … hint hint … then I'd shit bricks over the chance to hear which aspects of my design are performance-preventing.
* ELLIOTTCABLE
points at the spec
<whitequark>
oh
<whitequark>
OH FUCK
<whitequark>
IT IS 6 AM
<whitequark>
AGAIN
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
don't need to know Paws to build one. In fact, if you you need to, then my spec is a failure.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
bahahahahaha
<Willox>
6 am too late for you buddy
<whitequark>
fuck fuck fuck I was going to sleep at 24:00 today
<whitequark>
argh
<Willox>
_today_
<whitequark>
yes. 24:00 today. current time is 30:00.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
‘today’
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
slightly drunk already
<whitequark>
are you not familiar with this scheme?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fuck this
<Willox>
'today' meaning stay up!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
god damnit
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I need more session beers in my fridge.
<whitequark>
no, that would be "00:00 today".
<Willox>
00:00 today = 24:00 yesterday?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
valid enough.
<whitequark>
yep
<Willox>
that's crazy
<Willox>
I disagree
<whitequark>
actually used in TV programming in Japan
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you watch anime. Your opinion doesn't matter.
<Willox>
perhaps the 0.04% remaining is just the credits
<Willox>
of my open-source movie
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: I think you're mistaken
<whitequark>
it means my opinion is the only thing ever that matters
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
going to leave the office and go hang out in the living room to drink beer and watch more Leverage.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
'cuz no progress on Paws.js is happening tonight.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: but seriously. You should try making a paws. Out of all the people here, only alex's output would be more productive. It wouldn't take long, and it'd help me tons.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
superforeverloveetc.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
bbl television and drunks
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: idk maybe
<whitequark>
paws in ocaml?
<Willox>
100% everywhere but it isn't done
<Willox>
i don't know what to do
<whitequark>
that seems to be on the right intersection of (stuff I can quickly write) × (stuff I'm interested in)
<whitequark>
Willox: check local data
<Willox>
It's gotta be done by now
<Willox>
seems to be working fine anyway
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: perfect.
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<purr>
<elliottcable> micahjohnston: … I don't think you understand how tampons work.
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<devyn>
> I dunno, we'd be talking about the movie version of the book version of a Twilight fanfic. I'd specify a pornographic Twilight fanfic, but I'm not sure there's any other kind.
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<devyn>
also y'all are not that far off; I was like 15 I think when Micah got me interested in Haskell
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: you less busy with school, now?
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<Biscuitrat>
hey
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
ranj!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
oh my GOD I forgot your Internet handle
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
jesusgodfuck that brings back a lot of memories. a lot. of memories.
<Biscuitrat>
D: how could youuuuu!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
RANJ RAN RAJRNATKKJ RANJANI
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so, some extremely gay furry on Twitter has invited me to GW2 with them. I'm gonna give it a stab tomorrow.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Care to join?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I've been craving some MMO distraction in my life for, like, a year. WoW is just so unfulfilling /=
<Biscuitrat>
sec, league match
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wat
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
devyn: wasn't Twilight already a fanfic?
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
oh, wait, that was 50 shades of gray.
<SwooshyCueb>
Heyo!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
o7 SwooshyCueb
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
how the everliving FUCK do you pronounce your name?
<SwooshyCueb>
Just call me Swooshy lol
<purr>
lol
<SwooshyCueb>
The pronunciation of the second bit doesn't really matter
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so, my goddamn Nest has decided that it can't connect to the Internet, because it has a low battery.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(SwooshyCueb: personally partial to “coo-ebb.”)
<SwooshyCueb>
That works~
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(said quickly. one syllable.)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and now I can't control my temperature without getting off the couch / out of bed
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
THE FUTURE IS FAILURE.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: so, I haven't touched GW2 in ages, but iirc, higher-level people get dragged down if they go to lower-level areas, right?
<SwooshyCueb>
Somewhat yes. Their armor and such stays the same.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
bahhah
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the only thing I remember doing much of, is exploring.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I was obsessive about map-completion, but I really didn't find myself interested in the character-advancement /=
<SwooshyCueb>
I actually quite enjoy the personal story missions. If you don't enjoy them so much we can carry you through them quite quickly to get them out of the way.
* ELLIOTTCABLE
laughs
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whatevs, all in good fun
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
what do you do? I can't remember why I followed you.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
a dev?
<SwooshyCueb>
I'm a college student studying software engineering, yes
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
check your privmsgs.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
HEY Biscuitrat
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
BISCUITRAT that's fun to type by hand
<SwooshyCueb>
Well after experiencing it I've decided that I don't want to be in that state in public or alone. I'd rather be with a few friends I really really trust.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
omfg glowcoil
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: oh, agreed. I very, very rarely get drunk.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
helps that my drink-of-choice tends towards scotch, which is so extremely flavorful that it's hard to get drunk off of
<SwooshyCueb>
I feel pretty goddamn vulnerable. And I'm pretty sure I'm one of those drunks that if you get talking will spill the beans on anything. I have no secrets of my own, so I'm more worried about my friends in this regard.
<Biscuitrat>
league of legends
<Biscuitrat>
i got drunk once
<Biscuitrat>
i've been tipsy several times
<Biscuitrat>
NO
<Biscuitrat>
TWICE
<Biscuitrat>
SORRY
<Biscuitrat>
FORGOT THE OTHER ONE
<Biscuitrat>
once because of my guy roommates
<Biscuitrat>
who were like
<SwooshyCueb>
But during that one time I was drunk I found out I really really really really really like biting
<Biscuitrat>
HEY SHE'S PROBABLY A LIGHTWEIGHT, LET'S MAKE HER PLAY QUARTERS
<Biscuitrat>
AND THEN THROW ALL OUR QUARTERS IN HER CUP
<SwooshyCueb>
Oh wow
<Biscuitrat>
i prayed the porcelain god that night
<Biscuitrat>
*to
<Biscuitrat>
second time, my brother took me to a bar
<Biscuitrat>
bought me a drink and five minutes later was like
<Biscuitrat>
WAIT
<Biscuitrat>
MY FRIENDS ARE IN TEH OTHER BAR
<Biscuitrat>
DRINK YOUR DRIN
<Biscuitrat>
K
<Biscuitrat>
AND THEN DRINK MINE
<Biscuitrat>
what
<Biscuitrat>
fuckign
<Biscuitrat>
okay
<Biscuitrat>
we get to the other bar
<Biscuitrat>
HEY, HERE'S ANOTHER DRINK
<Biscuitrat>
MY TREAT
<Biscuitrat>
but i don't JUST TRY IT
<Biscuitrat>
OKAY FINISH IT, BECAUSE I PAID FOR IT
<Biscuitrat>
bear in mind
<Biscuitrat>
i am all of 95 pounds
<SwooshyCueb>
Goddamn
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
woah backlog
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-clouds
<purr>
ELLIOTTCABLE: is stuck up in the clouds; hilight 'em if you want 'em.
<Biscuitrat>
anyway, the moral of the story is all men are liars
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
sex while drunk?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
meh.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
can't handle that shit
<Biscuitrat>
there is no sex while drunk
<Biscuitrat>
there's groping and then sleeping
<SwooshyCueb>
Oh also I still haven't really found anything I like. Beer is disgusting. Tastes like plain carbonated water to me. Everything else I've tried has a cough syrup taste to it.
<Biscuitrat>
your brain literally can't handle it
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it's stupid.
<Biscuitrat>
BAILEY'S
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
like,
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
sex is *amazing*
<Biscuitrat>
BAILEY'S WAS MY GATEWAY DRUG
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and *spectacular*
<Biscuitrat>
i make white russians
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and requires lots of time, lots of mental acuity, lots of focus, and lots of energy.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and alcohol drains all four of those away.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so what you're left with is the dregs-of-the-dregs as sex goes.
<Biscuitrat>
vodka + kahlua (trader joe's kona coffee liqueur if you can get it) + bailey's + milk/cream
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: I make a sick fucking drink. Spent about a year of my life, since we last really talked much, learning to mix.
<Biscuitrat>
what kind of sex are you having that requires mental acuity :P
<SwooshyCueb>
Still haven't had sex yet, but I've been on both ends of a blowjob.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: the best kind ever.
<Biscuitrat>
IF I CALIBRATE YOUR BODY
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: how old are you?
<Biscuitrat>
TO LIE TANGENT TO MY DICK
<SwooshyCueb>
21
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: mmmm, mildly accurate.
<Biscuitrat>
BEEN THERE, SWOOSHY
<Biscuitrat>
it's not that big of a deal
<Biscuitrat>
the first time i had sex, i was like IT'S ALL GONNA BE DIFFERENT NOW
<Biscuitrat>
nope
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
exploring the way different pressures, different angles, different speeds, affect the way my touch feels.
<Biscuitrat>
nothing
<SwooshyCueb>
Also pink lemonade vodka tastes like perfume.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: oh my god that lol
<purr>
lol
<Biscuitrat>
never had it
<Biscuitrat>
THE LEMONADE I MEAN
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so, I tried to kill myself with fruit-loops flavoured vodka once
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
cannot SMELL the shit now, without retching.
<Biscuitrat>
:(
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but seriously, wait,
<Biscuitrat>
that's probably not a great way to go, honestly
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
do real people, who aren't bros or bimbos, *not* take their sex slowly and put effort into it?
<Biscuitrat>
unless you were trying to go via alcohol poisoning, in which case
<Biscuitrat>
well yes :P
<Biscuitrat>
ideally
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I mean, where's the fun in slap-dash bang-it-out blah
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
this conversation ಠ_ಠ
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
now I want sex ಠ_ಠ
<Biscuitrat>
because my boyfriend waits until the literal last minute before i have to get up for work
<SwooshyCueb>
lol
<Biscuitrat>
BECAUSE HE CANNOT TAKE HINTS
<Biscuitrat>
HE IS AS DENSE AS A STALE GERMAN CHOCOLATE CAKE
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
THAT IS DENSE
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
solution:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
finger up the butt.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
'll wake anybody up.
<Biscuitrat>
his or mine?
<Biscuitrat>
or both
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and either get them in the mood, or convey your annoyance, or both.
<Biscuitrat>
or a third party?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fittyfitty.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
…
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I like you more now
<SwooshyCueb>
I can't take hints either. You need to be pretty goddamn blunt with me. Like a couple of weeks after having a conversation with someone I'll be like "wait, they were hitting on me, weren't they?"
<Biscuitrat>
happens to everybody
<Biscuitrat>
just don't be like me
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
yes, I'm suggesting you quietly vacate the bed, go find a random stranger, bring them back, sneak them into bed, then take your sleeping boyfriend's finger, and STUFF IT UP THE STRANGER'S BUTT
<Biscuitrat>
it took me three months to figure out my crush was very very very very not heterosexual
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
have to admit, that'd be a pretty memorable way to wake p
<Biscuitrat>
"WHO IS THIS PERSON" "his name is juan and i think we ought to tip him when this is all over"
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: that's because all the best ones are gay.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
#trufact
<Biscuitrat>
THEY ARE
<Biscuitrat>
HE WAS SO CUTE
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the best ones that *aren't* gay,
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
actually are.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and are just going to break your heart when they realize it.
<Biscuitrat>
haven't been there yet
<Biscuitrat>
oh
<Biscuitrat>
yeah
<Biscuitrat>
and then i pursued a guy who may have ahd a girlfriend the whole time
<Biscuitrat>
and totally did not get my hints about coming over
<Biscuitrat>
"FOR COOKIES"
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
may have?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
"FOR COOKIES"
<Biscuitrat>
and i felt like a dick after
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Oh my god
<Biscuitrat>
okay
<Biscuitrat>
so
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
oh my god
<Biscuitrat>
relying
<Biscuitrat>
on facebook relationship statuses
<Biscuitrat>
is generally not a good way to go
<Biscuitrat>
i'm finding out
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so, I can get laid and shit, but,
<Biscuitrat>
because HE HAD NONE
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
nobody's ever asked *me* over "for cookies"
<SwooshyCueb>
I had so many girls interested in me in high school. I wasn't out back then. I did not know how to handle that situation because holyfuck they were persistent.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
or, you know for cookies
<Biscuitrat>
THERE MIGHT HAVE BEEN BOTH
<Biscuitrat>
actually, at that time, i probably wouldn't have been ready for all of that
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
see, I want the best of both worlds, where I get somebody who wants to give me both cookies *and* "cookies" at once
<Biscuitrat>
i just wanted cuddle time and cookies
<Biscuitrat>
but now
<Biscuitrat>
i want both
<Biscuitrat>
D:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fuckmefuckmefuckme
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you're hitting all my pain-points right now
<Biscuitrat>
i had all the wrong people interested in me in high school/middle school
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
have: beer and star trek and a yearning for an MMO
<Biscuitrat>
people i did not find attractive
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
want: cookies, cuddles, and "cookies"
<Biscuitrat>
people i did not respect
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I had nobody interested in me in \w+-school.
<Biscuitrat>
finally grew some balls and asked someone out senior year of college, and we're still together, but meh :/
<Biscuitrat>
iono
<Biscuitrat>
MIGHT HAVE TO GROW SOME BALLS AND CHANGE MY MIND
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
had some shitty childhood, over here. Turned me into a hopeless romantic needy little fuck.
<Biscuitrat>
i'm fairly romantic
<Biscuitrat>
you know
<Biscuitrat>
i've always wanted flowers
<Biscuitrat>
i gave HIM flowers twice
<Biscuitrat>
as a hint
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
then I apparently quietly turned *really hot* when I wasn't looking, got laid in my early twenties, and discovered that sex is amazing and yes please
<Biscuitrat>
but no D:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and also that relationships suck, people suck, and romance is dead.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
|=
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<SwooshyCueb>
I'm pretty goddamn happy in my current relationship.
<Biscuitrat>
:D
<Biscuitrat>
yaaaay swooshy
<Biscuitrat>
iono, i just feel like i'm missing out
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wait.
<SwooshyCueb>
Got to visit him over spring break
<Biscuitrat>
I'M IN THE PRIME OF MY LIFE
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: current boy is from high-school? did I miss something?
<Biscuitrat>
I'M PROBABLY IN THE 2ND BEST SHAPE OF MY LIFE
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: and you're saying current boy is somebody you explicitly don't respect? o_O
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(was the first one a dodecahedron?)
<Biscuitrat>
no, current boy is from tail end of college
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(because, I must say, I have a thing for a trim dodec.)
<SwooshyCueb>
lol
<purr>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
yeah, I thought so.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I was like, no WAY you were with him since I've known you. totes thought he was fairly recent.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I don't have many friends in Chicago, yet. One of the few ones I do, whom I don't otherwise like much (pothead, very … empty-headed seeming, no techie tastes at all, and worst of all, uses Android),
<SwooshyCueb>
Hey I use Android!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you're lucky that Freenode wouldn't let me kick you while I'm not opped
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
:P
<SwooshyCueb>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
… so, this girl, let slip that her and her friend-group, whom she's been trying to get me to come over and hang out with, are starting a D&D campaign
<Biscuitrat>
:D
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
LEAAAAAAAST expected thing. I did the verbal equivalent of a spit take, and was like, gushing desire all over this person I usually ignore
<Biscuitrat>
i haven't had a fun group to play DND with in yeaaarss
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
“OMG OMG OMG ASK THEM IF YOU CAN TAKE ONE MORE OMG”
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
because I've never properly played.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Started campaigns twice, both went very badly and fell apart like three sessions in,
<SwooshyCueb>
Aw :c
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but I've been an obsessee since I was like twelve. :P
<Biscuitrat>
i DMed a pretty epic campaign in middle school/early high school
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
she assents, I continue to be excited for, like, a week,
<Biscuitrat>
lasted weeks
<Biscuitrat>
we did it on IM
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
then DERP NOPE I FORGOT TO TELL YOU BUT I TALKED TO THEM AND THEY'RE NOT INTERESTED IN ANY MORE PLAYERS
<SwooshyCueb>
Aw
<Biscuitrat>
:(
<Biscuitrat>
but there's always room for more players
<Biscuitrat>
seriously
<Biscuitrat>
what harm would it do that dm
<SwooshyCueb>
Well, fluff_dragon, Korozjin, and I are looking for players. We will be playing online, of course. Probably using a combination of some sort of VOIP and roll20
<Biscuitrat>
to account for ONE more person
<Biscuitrat>
i would, but i'm super busy :(
<Biscuitrat>
have enough trouble making time for the boy, let alone other stuff
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I learned programming *for D&D*, actually.
<SwooshyCueb>
Another friend, DodgingCats has shown interest. She's also in Chicago
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Way back in the day. *Way* back. I wanted to create a way to turn synchronous, but human-controlled, games, into asynchronous games.
<SwooshyCueb>
o:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Even when I was young, I could see that a human-DM'd game was *clearly* superior to silly console/computer games, where the ‘story’ (laughable) is restricted to what can be programmed into the machine ahead-of-time, instead of being unlimited by the imagination of the DM,
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and the ‘graphics’ are limited to the computational restrictions of expensive, high-end hardware, instead of the unlimited confines of a player's imagination
<SwooshyCueb>
Also if you're going to be playing with me, I must warn you. I have a tendency to split parties.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
but it was always clear to me that *real people* (not basement-dwelling geeks) don't have the *time* to devote a single, continuous, eight-hour session to something every couple weeks.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the synchronicity of D&D is what keeps D&D a niche, nerd's game.
<SwooshyCueb>
Yeahhh :c
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
real people want to sit down with COD, play one match after work.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I wanted to reconcile those, bring tabletop gaming into the digital age. >:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
anyway. </nostalgia>
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: what do you do, now?
<Biscuitrat>
teach high school
<SwooshyCueb>
My most viewed video on YouTube is a four hour long one-off d20 game done over Skype lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hm. microwave pizza? or a pizza hot-pocket? hmmmmm.
<SwooshyCueb>
omg
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: So! What do you write, and what do you write it in / with?
<SwooshyCueb>
WELLL
<SwooshyCueb>
I've recently fallen in love with PyGTK
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: HEY
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Biscuitrat: SO
<SwooshyCueb>
So a lot of what I do is in Python
<SwooshyCueb>
My current big project is a windows registry hive editor for Linux
<SwooshyCueb>
Using hivex
<SwooshyCueb>
I've also got an archive manager for a very obscure format in the works
<SwooshyCueb>
And I've got my own fork of a VST I'm working on, but I really have no idea what I'm doing there. Obviously that one's not in Python :p
<SwooshyCueb>
At some point I'm gonna write an IRC bot for the network I OP to do traceroutes from the nodes and such.
<SwooshyCueb>
And at some point I also want to port over the lua stuff from snes9x-rr to the GTK fork
<SwooshyCueb>
(I really, REALLY like GTK2, if you can't tell)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hive?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I use Macs.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
;)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hook up with glowcoil, by the way.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
he's into audio stuff right now, too.
<SwooshyCueb>
I've been using Linux exclusively for the past three months AND LET ME TELL YOU IT FEELS GREAT
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
been there.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I think my longest straight stretch with headed Linux was, uhhh, maybe two-ish years.
<SwooshyCueb>
A registry hive is a big file that contains a section of the Windows registry
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
year and three quarters. wharves.
<SwooshyCueb>
I'm using Linux Mint with MATE and it's just <333333
<SwooshyCueb>
The straw that broke the camel's back was when I got infected with ZeroAccess from a drive-by exploit back when php.net was compromised. I got rid of the malware but a lot of Windoze was still broken. After limping around with that for a while I decided fuck it and went full Linux.
<SwooshyCueb>
I am MUCH less stressed now
<SwooshyCueb>
I had no idea how much stress Windoze was causing me lol
<purr>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Mint, eh?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I was an Arch and awesomewm guy
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
can't believe real people, in the real world, use Windows. Christ.
<SwooshyCueb>
I've actually found that a lot of games run much better in wine than in Windoze
<SwooshyCueb>
The Wolf Among Us, Civ5 (if you stick it on an NTFS partition), GW2 (to an extent)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Civ5! <'3
<SwooshyCueb>
Yesssssssssss
<SwooshyCueb>
Just played some tonight with my bf, actually~
<SwooshyCueb>
I'm letting him name all my cities so I've got cities named shit like Swooshlandia and Assbuttica
<SwooshyCueb>
But yeah, the best hardware I've got is my laptop. It's got a discrete 525M I have to use bumblebee with. And holyfuck my framerate in Civ is orgasmic compared to how it is in Windows.
<SwooshyCueb>
There's a reason my display name in Steam is #LinuxGamingMasterRace
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
bumblebee?
<SwooshyCueb>
It'
<SwooshyCueb>
It's this thing that lets you use discrete graphics cards on NVidia Optimus setups
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
makin' people happy
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: you inspire me to make people happy.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: so, no, not about a tweet. You just inspire me in several ways.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
okay, touchy-feely over,
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
now: do I get another beer, or go try and crash?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
mmmmm.
<SwooshyCueb>
http://vgy.me/azbR0x.png I wish I could figure out what's doing that number - table shit. Probably the game itself but eh
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: attach a debugger?
<SwooshyCueb>
I probably will if it bothers me enough to
<SwooshyCueb>
Right now it's just a minor annoyance
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
betcha ten m฿ there's a way to get gdb to break on write to the pty, or sommat
<SwooshyCueb>
lol
<purr>
lol
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: awwwwwwwww thx
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: what scale from high to low is this haha
<SwooshyCueb>
Wait...
<SwooshyCueb>
lol
<SwooshyCueb>
lol
<glowcoil>
SwooshyCueb: you seem cool let's be friends
<SwooshyCueb>
PURR YOU CONFUSE ME
<glowcoil>
SwooshyCueb: what's your twet
<SwooshyCueb>
SwooshyCueb
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: wat? you want me to define a unit for wisdom?
<glowcoil>
SwooshyCueb: ooooh automate pitch bend range :p
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: no not units just
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: not sure which ways i'm enlightened and which ways i'm not enlightened ;p
<glowcoil>
like details/habitswise am i not? or what
<SwooshyCueb>
Music only account is DampHit
<glowcoil>
:p
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you are twelve Icelandic króna wise on the inside,
<glowcoil>
SwooshyCueb: man i'm constantly having an inner debate whether i should have separate twitter accounts
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and only three Tibetan srang wise on the outside.
<SwooshyCueb>
Well you won't miss anything if you just follow my main
<glowcoil>
SwooshyCueb: it's moot at this point since i haven't released a single game or track, so
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
that shit is waaaaaaaay too subtle to characterize.
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: hahaha
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Just an impression formed from long, long association with you.
<SwooshyCueb>
Gotta move someone over to my overflow list in order to follow you on my main, hang on lol
<glowcoil>
FORGET ABOUT YOUR HOUSE OF CARDS
<glowcoil>
AND I'LL DO MINE
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: <3<#
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
There's surface stuff, that's definitely been tempered over the years, but is still occasionally visible: being in too much of a hurry, somehow, hard to put down … or getting irrationally annoyed or angry;
<SwooshyCueb>
I keep bumping that follow cap lol
<purr>
lol
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
as for the deeper stuff, you're absoliterally the only person I've ever met in my entire life who actually seems to try to consider all viewpoints, approach things logically, treat people well, etc.
<glowcoil>
haha i'm at ~250 but it's constantly rising
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you're basically goddamn Vulcan, except better at it, because you've also mastered emotion, so you're an *approachable* Vulcan. :P
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(YES I DON'T KNOW STAR TREK THAT WAS PROBABLY EXTREMELY UN-CANON, DIE IN AN ACID-FACTORY FIRE.)
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: means a lot <3333
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: big lists user?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: the other day somebody saw my lists-page irl, and lost their shit a little
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
ooo ooo speaking of lists
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
storytime storytime
<SwooshyCueb>
Yes I use lists quite alot
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: fwiw you seem to do a very good job of earnest self improvement and considering all viewpoints etc.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
shit, ranjani left
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: <3
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
<'3
<glowcoil>
oh i need to star using lists
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
well, if I have one virtue, it's knowing my failures. >,>
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
there's a lot I can't seem to do much about.
<SwooshyCueb>
As a matter of fact you're both on three lists now
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
delusions of grandeur, and a lot of bigotry I can't seem to root out despite desires to the contrary.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
LISTS STORY:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
chellio's agency has a couple interns right now.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and one of them is managing their internet presence.
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: yeah but i feel like in the time i've known you you have earnestly and genuinely worked to improve those things and it's nice :)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
yesterday, the intern created a twitter list called “competitors.”
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and, no shit, added ALL OF THE LOCAL DESIGN AGENCIES
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
while it was public.
<SwooshyCueb>
LOL
<purr>
LOL
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: also tweting semifamous people compliments is the best feel on earth
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
they all got push notifications.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it was a minor shitstorm.
<glowcoil>
hahahahahahaha
<glowcoil>
that's great
<SwooshyCueb>
omfg
<SwooshyCueb>
I used to have a lot more public lists, but someone pointed out that they made it easy to find a few folks' private accounts so I made the lists private.
<SwooshyCueb>
The only public list I have now is my overflow list
<SwooshyCueb>
Normal users can only follow 2000 accounts
<SwooshyCueb>
I bump that limit a LOT
<SwooshyCueb>
So I have a list to offload folks to when I reach 2000 again
<SwooshyCueb>
I have to be 100% sure that someone is NEVER going to protect their account before moving them over though
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
… normal users …
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
er, are we talking about Twitter?
<SwooshyCueb>
Yes
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
… are you … fucking kidding me …
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you can only follow 2,000 people on Twitter?
<SwooshyCueb>
Normal users as in folks with less than 1800 some odd followers
<SwooshyCueb>
There's a funky algorithm to it
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
when did this happen!?
<SwooshyCueb>
Forever
<SwooshyCueb>
I think
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
LOL
<purr>
LOL
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
believe me, no.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I've followed way more than that several times. But that was back when Twitter didn't give much of a shit.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so I guess I'm not that surprised, in general.
<SwooshyCueb>
"Twitter lets you follow the number of followers that you have plus 10%. When you hit the figure of 1819 you are allowed to follow that number plus a further 182. Your follower limit is now 2001 and you have broken through the barrier, just."
<SwooshyCueb>
Twitter lets you follow the number of followers that you have plus 10%. When you hit the figure of 1819 you are allowed to follow that number plus a further 182. Your follower limit is now 2001 and you have broken through the barrier, just.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
My surprise just had a … very sharp third-derivative.
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: "To be momentarily pendantic, unlike the traditional AST, it's neither abstract (since it references actual objects in the run-time of the program), nor syntax-related"
<whitequark>
you misunderstand what A and S mean in AST.
<whitequark>
"abstract" means that it is opposed to "concrete", ie, parse tree--which would include all the actual characters, delimiters, whitespace and so on.
<whitequark>
modern languages don't really generate parse trees, unless you use some PEG shite like treetop
<whitequark>
as per syntax... it *does* reflect the abstract syntax of cPaws
<whitequark>
whether that directly maps to some semantics or not is irrelevant.
<whitequark>
by the way, that something directly operates on an AST is irrelevant too. E.g. Lisp code *is* an AST.
<whitequark>
>interface NoObject : Object
<whitequark>
wtf does Object mean here?
<whitequark>
>readonly
<whitequark>
how about making "readonly" the default and instead marking fields as "mutable" :]
<purr>
<sephr> he was clearly moaning "SEPHR"
<whitequark>
>At no point will Relations be modified; they're intended to be static members of an object. They'd as easily be implemented as a part of the object's data-structure.
<whitequark>
then why isChild is not readonly?
<whitequark>
also why do you even talk about Relation instances? just make all Objects implement Relation
<whitequark>
wtf is a "static attribute"? you never actually explained the syntax you use for defining your "interfaces"
<whitequark>
or whatever the word "interface" even means here
<whitequark>
>Our generic Object type is implemented as a simple ordered-list (à la LISP), we treat our Objects as if they're dictionaries.
<whitequark>
that's some weird violation of abstraction
<whitequark>
I mean, there's no reason Nucleus must mandate an incredibly inefficient and somewhat awkward to work with implementation for every single Object;
<whitequark>
apart from the fact that *interpretation* is not even a job of Nucleus.
<whitequark>
by the way, your Objects have a rather distant relation to Lisp's lists
<whitequark>
because they can be freely mutated
<whitequark>
and if Scheme has learned one thing, it's that immutable-by-default pairs are A Really Fucking Good Idea
<whitequark>
in general, while CL has some good ideas, for elegance I'd look at Scheme impls.
<whitequark>
btw: list<Relation>
<whitequark>
whatever that even means? that Paws has parametric types?
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<whitequark>
>That value has a identical object-identity to message
<whitequark>
does this means that strings (symbols? you never elaborated on the datatypes Paws has) are interned? they better do
<whitequark>
>This algorithm obeys the ‘noughty’ rule, particularly with respect to the pseudo-pairs it encourages.
<whitequark>
What.
<whitequark>
>Symbols are a static type
<whitequark>
what the *fuck* is a static type.
<whitequark>
Elliott, if you don't define something, don't ever use it, or I will come and [REDACTED] you.
<whitequark>
>All symbols with equivalent name
<whitequark>
what the fuck is an "equivalent" name, you never introduced the notion of equivalence for strings
<whitequark>
>There will be no user-facing method for creating Symbols electively, by design. The majority of Symbols in a runtime are expected to come into the program via the Script.
<whitequark>
this means Core won't be able to have Lisp-ish macros, which is... shortsighted. I mean, on one hand it's hygienic, on other it's really inconvenient to use. Rust has such a design, and it pisses me off.
<whitequark>
also, wtf is that part about exploding symbols. that's basically meaning "you can't create arbitrary symbols, except for this one particular case no one cares about". useless.
<whitequark>
your "executions" are not continuations, but they are delimited continuations though.
<whitequark>
why do you even expose stack as an attribute? make it abstract and only provide methods.
<whitequark>
why do you say that pc is non-existent? does this mean that a freshly created Execution doesn't provide an Execution interface, because that interface includes an existing pc attribute?
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<whitequark>
>Paws requires the programmer to describe the boundaries of their data-structures, giving the runtime the hints it needs to decide which sections of code it can safely paralellize.
<whitequark>
"hints"? "hint" is a weak word. this means ownership relationships can be easily ignored. this also means you don't define semantics of parallelization with ownership, you merely suggest it, which is weird and probably useless.
<whitequark>
your ownership structure in general is markedly similar to Rust's, except that Rust statically prevents ownership loops
<whitequark>
and Paws doesn't; that is, likely, very important and not in favor of Paws.
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<whitequark>
why do you even describe a reactor in a Nucleus spec?
<whitequark>
you have deliberately left parallelism open-ended; describe only how execution must appear to the programmer, not how it is designed internally in Paws.
<whitequark>
that's how it is done.
<whitequark>
"However, for objects with a built-in receiver that is known to immediately re-queue the caller with a result, there's an expectation that performant implementations will process multiple combinations in series, without ever removing the caller from the reactor."
<whitequark>
that's, again, absolutely irrelevant
<whitequark>
you in general don't know what will be the bottleneck in an implementation. don't put such crap in the spec.
<whitequark>
wtf is "coproducing"? again, using terminology without or before defining it
<whitequark>
>This isn't just a tool for managing memory-safety in a concurrent environment
<whitequark>
you keep using that word, it doesn't mean what you think it does.
<whitequark>
Paws is inherently memory-safe.
<whitequark>
what you intended to use here is "race condition"
<whitequark>
>(relevantly, some implementations may not actually be concurrent, and won't have to worry about that at all.)
<whitequark>
all Paws implementation, as said, are concurrent.
<whitequark>
hell, fucking Twitter has race conditions--try quickly changing between Interactions and Timeline.
<whitequark>
that's on single-threaded client JS code...
<whitequark>
"A block of code that acquires responsibility for a data-structure is stating “I am going to preform several sequential operations on this data, which must not be interleaved with other modifications;”"
<whitequark>
just call "responsibilities" "locks".
<whitequark>
that's the classic definition of a mutual-exclusion lock.
<whitequark>
I don't think you need to describe algorithms for locking in the spec; rather, again, specify the desired *result*.
<whitequark>
this will give implementations freedom to use a more efficient scheme, say, with lock elision (which you absolutely want to do.)
<whitequark>
as a variation, you can use the "as-if" trick, i.e. say that the Paws runtime behaves as-if it was using the following algorithm.
<whitequark>
but really, better describe the result (mutual exclusion) than some table mutation bullshit.
<whitequark>
>a proprietary format
<whitequark>
why proprietary?
<whitequark>
>recurse this entire process;
<whitequark>
again, no definition of "recurse" as far as I can tell.
<whitequark>
that's in fact the only time that word is even used.
<whitequark>
resolution: Paws spec is incoherent, does not unambiguously specify a language, is unsuitable for writing an implementation, and must be mostly rewritten.
<whitequark>
that's fine though, my first dozen specs were shite
<whitequark>
(and I know there's a bunch of TODOs... they were written but in russian. so. yeah.)
<whitequark>
hey elliott
<whitequark>
haul your ass here already
<whitequark>
or I will just go and watch anime for the next four 24-hour intervals
<whitequark>
someone here knows his phone number?
<whitequark>
ah it's public
<whitequark>
btw EnvironmentedProc is pretty cool
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hi, okay, so, reading in a sec
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and thanks, whitequark
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I really *did* used to be a master of Ruby. Not exaggerating or tooting my own horn.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Don't think I've mastered another language as much as well as I used to grok Ruby, as a whole.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
shower, first.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and a bunch of brand-new faggots are demanding my attention for GW2 <3
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
I'm excerterededed
<whitequark>
hi elliott
<whitequark>
GW2?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
“or I will just go and watch anime for the next four 24-hour intervals”
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Guild Wars 2
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb etc
<whitequark>
oh ok
<whitequark>
what about anime
<whitequark>
?
<SwooshyCueb>
<3
<SwooshyCueb>
Guild Wars 2
<SwooshyCueb>
I'm eating burg and wearing my favorite pair of shorts
<SwooshyCueb>
Life is good
<whitequark>
okay
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: just QFT'ing, it was funny.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
so, yeah. shower, 'cuz sticky, and then dogs have to come first, 'cuz Friends Matter™, and then I'll read your mountain of feedback
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
you are my new favorite person, and I haven't even read it. There's like four pages of scroll back! to help me make My Things, Better™™™!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hold on while I puke blood out of excitement.
<whitequark>
lol, I just do the usual thing I do in life
<purr>
lol
<whitequark>
i.e. rant about literally everything
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
okay awesome.
<SwooshyCueb>
lol they're playing Sting in here
<purr>
lol
<SwooshyCueb>
Oh god this waitress is hitting on me
<whitequark>
that sounds extremely doubtfu;
<SwooshyCueb>
This burger is fantastic
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
hello!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: bring. me one
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
my period moved D:
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: wat.
<purr>
beep.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
k!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: I just spent half an hour talking to my neighbor about GW2 and WoW. It was 'dorbs.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: I'm gonna go work with whitequark here for a while, but I still want to play tonight. Poke me, if y'all get to a stopping-place or a time when you'd like to see me join, I guess? *shrug*
<purr>
¯\(º_o)/¯
<SwooshyCueb>
Will do!
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
IMPOSSIBLE TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY WHEN MY HANDLE IS A BUTT
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
sudden urge to read The Rolling Stones.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
(Heinlein, not rock-n-roll.)
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
okay, whitequark, reading.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: not Yellowstone. I grew up in Alaska, remember? There was a big eruption up there, blanketed half the goddamn state in several inches of ash.
<whitequark>
ah, right
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: errr
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: I never new the difference between concurrent and parallel. That makes complete sense, though. That said: How is Paws, as described, not parallel? Two-plus reactors, operating in threads, implemented with atomic, memory-safe mutation operations on the shared Unit data (queue, table, and graph),
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
err
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
okay, real talk, how do you want to have this discussion? You brought up *so many points*, that discussing any one down here in real time, is going to prevent me from continuing to read (and reply to) the ones above.
<whitequark>
no idea
<whitequark>
:D
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
lol okay
<purr>
lol
<whitequark>
use irc log to follow points?
<whitequark>
and quote them?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
going to take this to Google Wave.
<whitequark>
er, isn't that dead?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and put up with whatever ridicule I get for that. :P
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
the Google product is dead, but they open-sourced the (absolutely terrible) Java app as a whole.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
So other people run clones. *shrug*
<purr>
¯\(º_o)/¯
<whitequark>
also one of my very past employers attempted to do it and the UI is unusable
<whitequark>
but you can try
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
agreed.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
not unusable.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
just close-to.
<whitequark>
right
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
It's a *terrible* implementation of one of the *greatest* ideas I've ever seen in the web sphere.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
It's still, IMO, truly the best way to communicate on any topic of any depth *or* breadth. Only shallow-in-both-dimensions conversations work well on purely-asynchronous or purely-synchronosu mediums.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
anyway, brb.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: what e-mail do you want to use for Rizzoma?
<glowcoil>
Encountering computers in recording studios was always a bit disappointing when we were starting out. I found that early music software really off-putting: cubase, logic, all those programs seemed desperate for you to write in 4/4 at 120 bpm and loop the first 4 bars. You were always being led down a certain route – despite the supposed limitless directions you could go in.
<glowcoil>
So when I started on Max I felt like I’d got past all that, and didn’t have to use someone else’s idea of what a delay, or a reverb, or a sequencer should do, or should sound like – I could start from the ground, and think in terms of sound and maths. It was like coming off the rails. Before there was all this padding between the computer and me. Now there was a blank screen as a starting point…..
<glowcoil>
ELLIOTTCABLE: you might think that's cool
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: hey
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: excellent discussions going on, get your ASS in here.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
alexgordon: whitequark's given me a ton of feedback on the spec, and we're Waving. Like the good 'ol days.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Lots of discussions going on. <3
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
If you've got time, take a gander.
<alexgordon>
:O
<alexgordon>
ELLIOTTCABLE: it wants me to sign up
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
yeah
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
it's a Wave clone
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
like, direct
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
just hit the log-ins ith google button
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and it'll import all your old waves.
<SwooshyCueb>
lol didn't Wave get put in the Apache Incubator?
<purr>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: Google didn't put it there, Apache took it; and all they've produced is a Wave-in-a-Box that you can install, if you're a Java guru and sysadmin type, on your own machine.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
and even then it has no account-management, and none of the other features that made Wave cool.
<SwooshyCueb>
:c
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
gadgets, robots, etc; their attempts to make Waves, as a whole, a little more ‘open.’
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Rizzoma is … run by some crazy russians (/ht whitequark), who can barely speak english, and are dragging their feet about releasing their source, but who *have* managed to make a fairly compelling Wave clone.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
unfortunately, they've solved none of the *problems* with Wave, and their UI is basically a direct knock-off (i.e. just as disgustingly terrible.)
<alexgordon>
who is SwooshyCueb
<SwooshyCueb>
You know I never know quite what to say when someone asks me who I am.
<SwooshyCueb>
I'm just here for the food.
<SwooshyCueb>
Well this Rizzoma thing is really nice, letting me see the wave from the Portal ARG three years ago
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<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: Flamboyantly gay Twat whom I'm going to play GW2 with :3
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
er, alexgordon -^
<alexgordon>
lol ok
<purr>
lol
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: Your real name is visible on that, by the way. Just FYI.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Not sure if you're compfortable with that being visible.
<SwooshyCueb>
Visible on what? o:
<SwooshyCueb>
If you're talking about Rizzoma, yeah that's fine lol
<purr>
lol
<SwooshyCueb>
I don't really care if people connect SwooshyCueb to realname. The reverse, not so much.
<whitequark>
SwooshyCueb: 9th link on Google by your realname is twitter.com/swooshycueb.
<whitequark>
so that kinda failed
<SwooshyCueb>
Well shit
<SwooshyCueb>
I'll have to see if I can't do something about that
<whitequark>
protect your tweets
<whitequark>
nothing else would work afaik.
<whitequark>
ask @psnively, seems he has a similar problem
<SwooshyCueb>
Google really needs to update their cache of the Celldweller link a few links down
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: Yeah, at this rate, GW2 isn't happening. Poops.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
Very involved with whitequark, and have somewhere to be in two hours, on top of that.
<whitequark>
"a few links down" is irrelevant for me though, because google bubble.
<SwooshyCueb>
Aw
<SwooshyCueb>
Okedok
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
whitequark: hm?
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
google bubble?
<whitequark>
yeah, google rating of results differs *Wildly* based on your profile somewhere inside google
<SwooshyCueb>
They try to order things based on what they think you'd be interested in.
<whitequark>
it's really a silent, continuously adjusted echo chamber
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
yep.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
icky.
<whitequark>
but... duckduckgo simply gives me results which are shite, so can't use that too.
<SwooshyCueb>
They're data miners. They know you're pregnant before you do. They know your dick size, how many hairs are in your eyebrows, the cell count of your ear drums, and so on.
<whitequark>
for nontrivial searches.
<glowcoil>
anyway goin someplace
<glowcoil>
shruge
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
glowcoil: me, too >:
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
wish you were here for this. It's been neat.
<purr>
<alexgordon> Euler's artistic penis?
<SwooshyCueb>
what
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-what @ SwooshyCueb
<purr>
<micahjohnston> wtf
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-what @ SwooshyCueb
<purr>
<elliottcable> dude, birdy nam nam
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-what @ SwooshyCueb
<purr>
<elliottcable> I'm a unicorn
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-what @ SwooshyCueb
<purr>
<purr> Factoid ‘sephr’: Popularity 0.
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
-what @ SwooshyCueb
<purr>
<alexgordon> ELLIOTTCABLE: shit in russia that's practically a proposal of marriage
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
SwooshyCueb: Exactly.
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<SwooshyCueb>
LOL
<purr>
LOL
<SwooshyCueb>
So apparently my bouncer decided to add me to a new channel during my time away from Freenode
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
#butts
* whitequark
pokes ELLIOTTCABLE
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
reading set-car! set-cdr!
<whitequark>
right
<whitequark>
ELLIOTTCABLE: maybe that's irrelevant to paws
<whitequark>
actually I think it is, because ownership