ChanServ changed the topic of #ruby-lang to: Ruby 1.9.3-p125: http://ruby-lang.org | Paste >3 lines of text on http://pastie.org or use a gist
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<ReinH> No, there's nothing like that
<ReinH> I would consider it an antifeature
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<ReinH> if you want _ for variable names and static types, don't use ruby
<ReinH> huh, that was like 5 hours ago...
<ReinH> never mind
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<rubarlion> ReinH: what about hashes?
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<rubarlion> is there a way to not use underscores in a long hash name?
<rubarlion> and still access the hash
<swarley> what
<swarley> what are you talking about?
<rubarlion> i want people to be able to type puts bighash['properties of x']
<rubarlion> and display the hash, but I dont know how to do it without putting underscores in
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<whitequark> rubarlion: do you mean using symbols with spaces for a hash key?
<whitequark> i.e. hash[:"symbol with spaces"]
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<whitequark> 09:06 < whitequark> rubarlion: do you mean using symbols with spaces for a hash key?
<whitequark> 09:06 < whitequark> i.e. hash[:"symbol with spaces"]
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<swarley> rubarlion, you can use any object as a hash key
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<swarley> rubarlion, you can use any object as a hash key
<swarley> puts hash[["I","Could","Do","This","If","I","Felt","Like","It"]]
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<swarley> i wish he could stay connected long enough for me to tell him he doesnt even need to use underscores
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<whitequark> swarley: don't bother
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<swarley> i wonder if he is registered
<swarley> yes
* swarley sends a memo
<whitequark> er. what?
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<swarley> -MemoServ- The memo has been successfully sent to rubarlion.
<swarley> /ms send
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<rubarlion> memo?
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<swarley> /ms read new
<swarley> it was too hard to send a chan message i knew you would see
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<matti> ;]
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<solondz> hiya - I'm trying to write a little program, and I'm doing it test first. The first test I want to write is that the program can find some files in a directory. What's teh recommended way to set this test up? Have a fixtures directory? Create some files in the test and remove them? Or stub the method?
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<rue> solondz: You could use FakeFS
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<solondz> rue: thanks - will look that up.
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<solondz> What's a less ugly way of doing this:
<solondz> name = key.split('/').last.split('.').first
<solondz> where key is a path like "/path/to/somewhere/file.txt
<rue> File.basename if I guess correctly
<solondz> and I want just 'file'
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<solondz> oh nice
<solondz> File.basename(string, ".*")
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<solondz> how do I get verbose minittest output? I'm just running: ruby mytest.rb - but I'd like it to print out each spec
<solondz> rather than just say: shit passed, yo
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<steveklabnik> solondz: or http://rubygems.org/gems/turn
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<rue> I actually did not remember that .* worked for basename
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<solondz> steveklabnik: hey thanks, turn is really awesome.
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<steveklabnik> any time
<solondz> first time i've used minitest/spec - it's nice; and I like not having to require rspec
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<steveklabnik> yeah, i went through a minitest fad, but i'm basically back to rspec these days.
<steveklabnik> but projects i contribute to use minitests
<blowmage> fad:: :(
<rue> OMG it’s a blowmage
<blowmage> ZOMG where?
<rue> That way!
<steveklabnik> :)
<steveklabnik> i should have said phase
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* blowmage gives steveklabnik a big old bear hug
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<steveklabnik> <3 :D
<steveklabnik> hows life?
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<solondz> blowmage: ponies at end of page on blowmage.com are epic. =)
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<andrewvos> Shit, that is cool.
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<andrewvos> Nice site. Responsive Design++
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<heftig> meh, but it uses javascript instead of css transitions :p
<rue> OMAG
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<andrewvos> Burn the witch!
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<Erlkoenig> wah... why doesn't ruby have a "Boolean" class which would allow for "whatsthat.is_a?(Boolean)" oO
<whitequark> Erlkoenig: because trueness is to be checked with "if whatever"
<swarley> Erlkoenig, is_a? TrueClass
<whitequark> swarley: fails on `false'
<swarley> also, you could technically make it work with
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<swarley> class Boolean; end; class True; end; class False < True; end
<swarley> True < Boolean
<swarley> its not worth the effort though
<Erlkoenig> so the only way to check for a boolean is "whatsthat.is_a?(TrueClass) || whatsthat.is_a?(FalseClass)" ?
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<swarley> nooo
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<swarley> if this == true or this == false
<Erlkoenig> oh hm :D
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<whitequark> swarley: and how those True/False would help?
<swarley> whitequark, it would help in is_a? but you would have to do a lot of monkey patches to make it worth anything
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<whitequark> swarley: it won't
<whitequark> you have {True,False}Class < Object and you can't do anything with it [with pure Ruby]
<swarley> i know
<swarley> it was mostly psudeo code
<whitequark> you could define .boolean?, but it isn't there already by design
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<swarley> Erlkoenig, well, i just made a technical cheat
<swarley> that is very bad practice lol
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<ttilley> Erlkoenig: you may also see a lot of bang bang. !foo returns the opposite of its truthiness value, so !!foo returns foo converted to a boolean value. very hard to read and very non-obvious.
<Erlkoenig> wah
<ttilley> Erlkoenig: there's nothing that `if !!foo` offers that `if foo` does not do.
<ttilley> > !!1 => true
<ttilley> > if 1; true; end => true
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<whitequark> ttilley: there is nothing non-obvious with !!.
<whitequark> if you don't know how it works already, you can trivially figure that out, because you do know how ! works
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<ttilley> Erlkoenig: the message here being that you never really need to convert something to a boolean or check if it's a boolean. it will act as one when necessary. you only need to worry about implicit boolean-ness if you're serializing a value that is expected to be literal `true` or `false` when read back in
<whitequark> ^ that
<rue> If you’re testing whether something is *either* true or wrong, you’re doing it the latter.
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<Erlkoenig> ttilley: hmm.... i have some magic code that should do things depending on the type of some object
<ttilley> Erlkoenig: oh yeah. unlike some other languages, 0 is true. so is an empty string. nil is false.
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<ttilley> Erlkoenig: then you're doing duck typing wrong
<ttilley> Erlkoenig: or have a special case, i guess, of which there are a number
<ttilley> Erlkoenig: what kind of magic?
<swarley> Erlkoenig, i just came up with a repulsive way to do true.is_a? Boolean
<Erlkoenig> ttilley: uhm, it's a bit complicated
<swarley> so if you want it, you can have it
<Erlkoenig> swarley: tell me :D
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<ttilley> > foo = false => false
<ttilley> > foo.is_a?(TrueClass) || foo.is_a?(FalseClass) => true
<ttilley> why is this complicated?
<swarley> Erlkoenig, http://pastebin.com/FC1ck32X
<swarley> the monkey patch of all monkey patches that should never be used in general code
<ttilley> what's with the funky Boolean not-really-a-class?
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<ttilley> class Object; def is_bool?; !!self; end; end;
<ttilley> why is this complicated again?
<Erlkoenig> wah
<Erlkoenig> not really complicated, but a bit strange
<swarley> [8] pry(main)> true.is_a? Boolean
<swarley> => true
<swarley> cheating, but it works i guess
<swarley> still, i wouldnt recommend it
<swarley> i feel dirty having coded it
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<whitequark> there's an easier way if you really that want to do it
<whitequark> module Boolean; class TrueClass; include Boolean; end; class FalseClass; # ditto
<whitequark> erm, you got the idea
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<swarley> whitequark, oh yeah lol, i forgot include adds to the is_a
<rue> It’s not complicated, it’s wroooooong
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<whitequark> rue: yeah
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<swarley> k
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<rindolf> Hi all.
<rindolf> Ggmar Hatimah Tovah.
<whitequark> what
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<valeri_ufo> rindolf: g'mar tov
<rindolf> valeri_ufo: thanks.
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<rindolf> valeri_ufo: what's up?
<valeri_ufo> not much, reading about tail recursion :)
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<rindolf> valeri_ufo: ah, does Ruby have proper tail recursion?
<whitequark> rindolf: short answer: no
<whitequark> long answer: in MRI, you can enable it.
<rindolf> whitequark: ah, OK.
<whitequark> the conditions which lead to a tail call are a bit obscure through
<whitequark> (compared to e.g. Scheme)
<workmad3> ruby implementations are allowed to do tail recursion, but aren't required to do so
<whitequark> exactly
<workmad3> as opposed to python, iirc
<whitequark> nope, python doesn't have such a requirement afaik
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<workmad3> python has a requirement that implementations *don't* support tail call optimisation iirc
<workmad3> (I meant 'as opposed' as in 'ruby doesn't care while python does'... but realise I wasn't clear on that)
<whitequark> ahh, maybe
<whitequark> ostensibly it impairs debugging
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<erikh> the world according to guido.
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<cirwin> there should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it
<erikh> other languages just add a keyword to indicate that TRO can be attempted in that call.
<cirwin> tail call elimination would make there be two ways to do iteration :p
<cirwin> erikh: that sounds disasterous
<erikh> you know, because options are the debbil
<cirwin> surely the compiler can tell much more easily than a human?
<erikh> that's not the point of it.
<erikh> TRO eliminates the stack, and can be harder to debug. guido is right about that.
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<cirwin> I guess it's nice to be explicit
<erikh> "let rec" in ocaml and "recur" in clojure explicitly say, "try to optimize this" but it's optional... recursion can be used anywhere of course
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<cirwin> I always assumed let rec was a parser hack so that you could refer to partially defined names
<cirwin> but I guess that makes sense
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<rindolf> erikh: there's also (letrec) in Scheme.
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<swarley> i'm going to rage
<swarley> /home/swarley/Documents/Programming/Ruby/YAIL/lib/yail/plugin.rb:10 <- does not qualify as a full backtrace
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<rue> Sad
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<TylerGillies> is this faster than iterating over the array without threads? https://gist.github.com/3773202
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<andrewvos> TylerGillies: My guess is no.
<TylerGillies> experiment in making datastructures thread safe if all the threads mutate separate addresses
<swarley> TylerGillies, use benchmark to see for yourself
<TylerGillies> swarley: thats what im doing now, the obvious is not always quite so obvious heh
<swarley> lol
<andrewvos> Or just `time my_insane_thread_stuff.rb`
<TylerGillies> i would prolly save some speed by instantiating the threads first and then doing a proper pool rather than just limiting the amount
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<andrewvos> NOPE
<swarley> sometimes simplicity is worth the 0.01 seconds you'll lose without the threads
<swarley> 0.001
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<TylerGillies> lawl teh thread portion took 3 seconds
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<TylerGillies> must be because of the thread spinup/teardown
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<workmad3> TylerGillies: it won't be faster using threads in 1.8 or 1.9 MRI
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<workmad3> TylerGillies: because you still have the GIL to contend with
<andrewvos> Maybe you could switch to jruby?
<andrewvos> Sorry, obvious troll.
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<TylerGillies> if im gonna use JVM i'll use clojure ;)
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<TylerGillies> whats the max thread pool size i should have before performance starts to drop?
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