00:05 <wpwrak> nicksydney: well, about one hour by train. by australian standards, that's next-door neighbours (or closer), right ? :)

00:06 <nicksydney> wpwrak: as long as in one continent everybody is our next-door neighbours :)

00:06 <nicksydney> 1hr train ride is very close :)

00:07 <nicksydney> i hope too that they can work it out and neo900 will keep on going as it is a big project that people can learn from

00:10 <nicksydney> wpwrak: have you come across supplier selling nordic chip like the one used in this http://www.ebay.com/itm/170838373171

00:19 <wpwrak> http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en/rf-if-and-rfid/rf-transceivers/3539948?k=NRF24L01 ?

00:25 <CYB3R> Is it possible to enter usbboot mode without nand?

00:31 <wpwrak> CYB3R: since it's used to bring up the NAND from scratch, i'd think so :)

00:32 <whitequark> I think you enter usbboot mode via BOOT[01] pins

00:33 <CYB3R> whitequark: I mean stage2 boot

01:09 <nicksydney> wpwrak: wonder why i didn't find it yesterday when looking for it :(

04:15 <wpwrak> if neo900 is still alive, then this should be fun news: https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2014/02/picasso_nsa_exp.html

04:16 <whitequark> nice

05:14 <nicksydney> wpwrak: man feel so naked after reading that link :)

05:15 <whitequark> that one seems to be not for spying, but for undercover agents though

05:15 <whitequark> the "S" instead of "TS" designation kinda confirms

05:25 <wpwrak> in the comments someone offered a good explanation: it's for both agents and their marks

05:26 <whitequark> *nod*

05:27 <whitequark> either way this is something that probably should exist and doesn't worry me too much.

05:30 <wpwrak> consider that this probably requires the cooperation of the phone makers

05:30 <wpwrak> now, who says this isn't a standard feature by now, ready to be activated by a suitable code ?

05:32 <whitequark> if you use gsm, you're pwned by default. almost all that info can be extracted without any cooperation with phone

05:32 <wpwrak> voice recording ?

05:33 <whitequark> really, I bet SIM itself can do everything except voice recording, it's powerful enough and it can send SMS whenever it wants

05:33 <whitequark> and voice... well, you'd have to collect voice from the network

05:34 <whitequark> how exactly are they sending voice via SMS?

05:35 <wpwrak> yeah, i kinda wonder

05:36 <wpwrak> maybe MMS. they can be pretty large.

05:36 <whitequark> that requires GPRS already

05:36 <whitequark> hm... C140 has GPRS but not MMS

05:37 <whitequark> anyway. I bet you don't even need vendor cooperation today

05:37 <whitequark> if all RILs are written like the one in SGS2, they can be remotely exploited by a toddler

05:37 <whitequark> code like char number[18]; strcpy(number, sms.number);

05:38 <whitequark> and of course RIL runs effectively under root

05:39 <whitequark> apart from the fact that outdated linux usually has a dozen of easy local vulnerabilities

06:58 <DocScrutinizer05> they don't send voice via SMS. they instruct the ME to initiate a stealth phonecall (or, for calls, redirect the call to a "proxy" that recors stuff and forwards the call to original destination). And none of all that needs any special hw support, it's a "standard" feature of "standard" spyware you can buy for almost every phone, for a few 1000 bucks, form non-government providers of such security software

07:00 <DocScrutinizer05> agencies probably can remote-install such stuff meanwhile to any phone they like (except a very few ones that don't allow such exploits by design)

07:01 <DocScrutinizer05> as mentioned in another comment, meanwhile improved spyware may record hours of audio and then send it in burst via GPRS/UMTS data link

07:01 <DocScrutinizer05> or even via HSCSD

07:02 <DocScrutinizer05> at least for HSCSD a minimum cooperation from network carrier is needed

07:03 <DocScrutinizer05> no so for the whole rest of this type of attack

07:03 <DocScrutinizer05> except for installing OTA

07:03 <DocScrutinizer05> this also would need support from carrier

07:04 <DocScrutinizer05> well, unless they found a nice service SMS that makes the phone download the malware from some URL

07:08 <nicksydney> wpwrak: http://www.cnx-software.com/2014/02/18/stmicro-unveils-10-mbed-enabled-and-arduino-compatible-nucleo-development-boards/

07:09 <nicksydney> anybody going to Embedded World 2014 in Germany ...they can get the board for FREE :) register here http://www.st.com/web/en/support/nucleo_ew14_registration.html?icmp=reg-form-nucleo_pron_pr-nucleo_feb2014 :)

07:10 <nicksydney> hmm.......they rush in releasing the website ..can you spot the problem

07:10 <nicksydney> Registration procedure: in order to get your free STM32 Nucleo board from ST’s booth at embedded world 2013, fill in the form below and submit it. You will receive a personalized voucher to the email address specified in the form. Please show up with the voucher on ST’s booth to claim your discovery kit.

07:11 <nicksydney> wpwrak: wish Germany was like 1hr by train : )

07:11 <nicksydney> i can call as neighbour :)

07:21 <DocScrutinizer05> >>in order to get your free STM32 Nucleo board from ST’s booth at embedded world 2013<< MHM

07:57 <larsc> 2013?

08:01 <larsc> hm, the terms and conditions are an empty page

09:28 <DocScrutinizer05> great! :-P No terms and conditions, no obligations. No wasted times to read them

09:31 <DocScrutinizer05> WTF?! the difference between http://www.st.com/web/catalog/tools/FM116/SC959/SS1532/LN1847/PF259997 and http://www.st.com/web/catalog/tools/FM116/SC959/SS1532/LN1847/PF260000 is exactly only the color of that "Nucleo" cricle (pink vs yellow)??

09:33 <DocScrutinizer05> ooh, http://www.st.com/web/catalog/tools/FM116/SC959/SS1532/LN1847/PF259997 comes with "STSW-STM32143HAL library for STM32 Nucleo with application examples" (last link on page)

09:36 <DocScrutinizer05> aaah, now! one has 32k, one 64k, one 512k flash

09:56 <nicksydney> DocScrutinizer05: yes :)

09:56 <nicksydney> larsc: yeah they printed as 2013 instead of 2014

09:57 <nicksydney> found out that the shipping cost for a $10 board is using FedEx that can cost close to $30...FAIL !

12:18 <wpwrak> nicksydney: mbed ... cloud-based development. what could possibly go wrong ? ;-)

12:27 <nicksydney> wpwrak: its in the cloud so everything is safe :)

12:27 <nicksydney> wpwrak: unless you like to be 'looked' at ;)

12:28 <nicksydney> price of sophisticated silicons are dropping like a fly but shipping cost never goes down !

12:31 <larsc> time for DIY fabs

12:36 <wpwrak> time for Courier It Yourself :)

12:39 <larsc> lets see if my drone can do germany <-> australia without any stops ;)

12:40 <nicksydney> larsc: if that's possible you will be the next Google's of Drone :)

12:40 <nicksydney> wpwrak: CIY ? :) not CNY :)

12:46 <larsc> the problem is I guess that it is still more cost effective to transport a lot of packages in one big vehicle rather than in a lot of small verhicles

12:54 <nicksydney> the best thing to do for large corporation is to send packages from China as shipping cost is darn good there

13:05 <wpwrak> don't they have some old icbms in russia ? much more efficient than a drone

13:08 <larsc> if you have 20 mio, no problem

13:54 <wpwrak> ah, you already inquired :)

13:56 <larsc> well at least that's what it was a couple of years ago

13:56 <larsc> you can probably get one for a couple of bit coins today

15:18 <wpwrak> a anonymous coin could also work for the CIY network: let each "node" advertize the nodes it connects to, with cost, typical delay, and any other restrictions (e.g., maximum declared value and such). then you can find the optimum path through the network.

15:18 <wpwrak> attach a QR code to each shipment so each node can do "tracking"