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<kristianpaul>
wpwrak: had you ever ordered from rs-online?
<wpwrak>
let's see what that is ..
<wpwrak>
rs-online.com.ar ?
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<wpwrak>
and no, i never bought from them
<kristianpaul>
.ar no
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<kyak>
xiangfu: what could be the reson for "Error - can't retrieve XBurst CPU information: -110" when trying to flash? lsusb shows ID 601a:4740 Ingenic Semiconductor Ltd. XBurst Jz4740 boot mode
<xiangfu>
kyak, I will apply your patch. and continue build the image.
<kyak>
also it's not bricked, i can boot fine :) perhaps some intermittent problem that might go away after i reboot?..
<xiangfu>
kyak, are you using software-usbboot or hardware-usbboot?
<kyak>
the software i guess (U+Power)
<kyak>
xiangfu: you might want to apply the patch for package-ipkg.mk i sent you as well..
<xiangfu>
kyak, already done that on buildhost. thanks.
<kyak>
there is no reply in according bug report (12317)
<xiangfu>
kyak, I will test the u-boot software usbboot mode later today.
<kyak>
you see, there is no "SUCCESS" when flashing bootloader
<kyak>
so the progress bar get's confused, because it relies on "SUCCESS" string
<viric>
the bootloader may lack ECC
<viric>
or use some weird one
<viric>
but as it's writing, something could be checked I guess
<wpwrak>
the best practice is generally to first write everything, then verify everything. that way, also writes that went to the wrong place are detected.
<xiangfu>
kyak, because. the jz4740 cpu can only read 2KB nand at boot time. even the nand is 4KB. it still load 2KB.
<xiangfu>
kyak, so when we reflash the bootloader. we reflash like [2KB(skip 2kb)] [2KB(skip 2kb)]
<wpwrak>
xiangfu: btw, thanks for including the latest avrdude !
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<kyak>
xiangfu: yeah, that's clear, but why we don't check (SUCCESS) the first chunk in this case?
<xiangfu>
kyak, no reason. there is just no such message. feel free to add one. :)
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, you are welcome.
<kyak>
xiangfu: ok, i'll have a look
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<xiangfu>
kyak, at that time. I do copy a lot of windows ingenic code.
<kyak>
does it mean we would be able to flash from windows?
<xiangfu>
kyak, basically the linux relate code is better then others like ingenic_usb.c :)
<xiangfu>
kyak, yes. we can
<kyak>
sounds great.. though a working RNDIS would be so much better
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<wpwrak>
freight is typically for large things and tends to be slower
<wpwrak>
so you can't really compare prices
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<wpwrak>
you basically have 1) documents (fast, cheapest), 2) parcels (may be a little slower than documents due to customs, but not much, often a bit more expensive than documents), 3) cargo (generally with more complicated customs procedures)
<wpwrak>
in other words: what you pick depends mainly on what you're sending
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<kristianpaul>
larger..
<kristianpaul>
damn
<kristianpaul>
40usd from uk
<kristianpaul>
wow and 100usd from digikey/usa
<kristianpaul>
let me check currency again :)
<kristianpaul>
it seems
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<whitequark>
what
<whitequark>
I'm used to FedEx and EMS deliveries
<whitequark>
but it is the first time some drunk guy is delivered to my door
<kristianpaul>
?
<whitequark>
exactly
<kristianpaul>
FedEx how much?
<kristianpaul>
that 100usd is fedex
<whitequark>
kristianpaul: yeah, it's the same for russia
<whitequark>
use farnell
<whitequark>
it's way better
<kristianpaul>
i was qouting from rs
<kristianpaul>
i'll check farnell
<whitequark>
rs?
<kristianpaul>
rs-online
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<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:28:52] <TimRiker> DocScrutinizer05, there have been a few channels where I created files with the name of the log directory. This effectively stops the cron job from exporting html logs for those channels.
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:30:26] <TimRiker> I prefer not to have the bot in channels if they don't want them logged. if people are posting on public irc networks and expecting their data to be private in any way, they are in for sore disappointment. _anyone_ could be logging and reposting anything, anywhere.
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:31:28] <TimRiker> if you don't want your IP shown, then get a cloak. that's what they are for. but remember that sometimes services are down, so even a cloak does not insure that your ip is private.
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:32:19] <TimRiker> if you don't want your ip shown, don't use irc, or send email, or hit web sites, or use instant messaging, in short, get off the Internet.
<DocScrutinizer05>
so, on ""public demand""
<DocScrutinizer05>
~leave #qi-hardware
<DocScrutinizer05>
~quit #qi-hardware
<DocScrutinizer05>
grrr
<DocScrutinizer05>
~part #qi-hardware
<infobot>
Leaving. (courtesy of docscrutinizer05).
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<roh>
are you bored?
<DocScrutinizer05>
here you are
<DocScrutinizer05>
kyak been bored
<DocScrutinizer05>
but to be honest, this concern about IPs exposed actually bores me
<roh>
simple solution: use static ips ;)
<DocScrutinizer05>
???
<roh>
well.. no additional information exposure. same shellhost all the time
<DocScrutinizer05>
you mean then it's pretty clear everybody can link your IP to you?
<roh>
and that one has my name on anyhow...
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah
<DocScrutinizer05>
it's indeed an embarrasingly silly concern
<DocScrutinizer05>
but hey, I'm not very active in this chan anyway, and so when I miss infobot around, who except me will care and take consequences
<DocScrutinizer05>
or this silly bot only counts kicks it did itself?
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<whitequark>
DocScrutinizer05: well, I thought it was nice to have it.
<DocScrutinizer05>
well, talk to whomever is th eowner of this chan
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:30:26] <TimRiker> I prefer not to have the bot in channels if they don't want them logged. if people are posting on public irc networks and expecting their data to be private in any way, they are in for sore disappointment. _anyone_ could be logging and reposting anything, anywhere.
<whitequark>
yup. I totally agree
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<larsc>
well anyone could come up to you and shoot you, still I dont do it
<DocScrutinizer05>
a pretty odd analogy
<whitequark>
larsc: well, I actually think about it each other way I go out
<whitequark>
*other day
<DocScrutinizer05>
I answer: you're kernel hacker, give us a TCP stack that automatically hides IP
<larsc>
technical solutions for social problems are often suboptimal
<DocScrutinizer05>
so how's filttering IP in chanlog _not_ a technical solution
<DocScrutinizer05>
for the social problem of fools thinking they could live anonymous in internet
<larsc>
you are confusing cause and action
<whitequark>
DocScrutinizer05: there _is_ a technical solution
<whitequark>
namely an ircd which does not expose IPs
<DocScrutinizer05>
ooh, yep, you're right - filtering chanlogs is the problem, not the solution
<whitequark>
if you trust the server, it is a solution.
<DocScrutinizer05>
I think the root problem is people "trusting" 51 (or N - 2) chanusers, but get scared as soon as chanlog shows up on a webpage
<DocScrutinizer05>
make that 53 or N, since they probably trust themselves and chanserv as well
<DocScrutinizer05>
MEH
<DocScrutinizer05>
cya
<DocScrutinizer05>
ping me if you change your (or chanowner's) mind about this silly issue
<DocScrutinizer05>
I'm willing to join infobot any time
<DocScrutinizer05>
I'm _not_ willing to pester Tim about nonsense
<DocScrutinizer05>
like filtering chanlogs, to hide "private" info
<larsc>
let me try a different analogy, he is basically saying it's ok to steal your stuff because you did not lock your door.
<DocScrutinizer05>
you're completely derailed
<larsc>
while it is 'stupid' not to lock the door, you still can't justify stealing stuff from somebody with the argument that anybody could have done this
<DocScrutinizer05>
OMFG
<DocScrutinizer05>
pretty please reread Tim's statement, esp in context I posted earlier, before you continue that fuzz
<whitequark>
larsc: oh, but if you get all your valuable stuff and just place it on the street
<whitequark>
it's pretty much justified.
<larsc>
no
<DocScrutinizer05>
and then claim it's illegal to take a photo since it's *your* stuff
<DocScrutinizer05>
MEH!!!!!
<whitequark>
if you do not take _any sensible countermeasures_ to prevent anyone stealing your stuff, you deserve it
<larsc>
no
<DocScrutinizer05>
THIs IS NOT ABOUT ANYBODY TAKING AWAY ANYTHING!
<larsc>
stupidity is to a justification to exploit people
<larsc>
is not
<whitequark>
or, let me phrase it other way: if you don't give a f about your privacy, why should I?
<DocScrutinizer05>
this is about chan logging
<larsc>
this is about private information
<whitequark>
it is public.
<larsc>
'private'
<whitequark>
everyone already can access it.
<DocScrutinizer05>
stupidity is a justification to mute or kick people, but since i'm not in a mood to do so, I better leave you peeps alone
<whitequark>
well I won't call a man with a different point of view stupid, to say at least
<whitequark>
even if I consider his POV stupid.
<whitequark>
that's just unproductive
<DocScrutinizer05>
"hey, I'm writing my password on that house wall so I don't forget it - but you're rogue to take a photo of it!" BWAHAHAHA
<larsc>
exactly
<whitequark>
the security is not in the machine
<whitequark>
it's in minds
<whitequark>
and if you do not care about it, you don't have any security or privacy. trivial.
<whitequark>
don't like facebook collecting info? don't join facebook. simple. no regulation whatsoever could change its behavior.
<whitequark>
same here.
<whitequark>
you might _want_ it to be some other way, but your wishes won't change the world or whatever
<DocScrutinizer05>
whitequark: larsc called Tim a criminal, since Tim dared to prefer not having his bot in channels, rather than to implement silly chanlog filtering for those silly stupid channels
<larsc>
DocScrutinizer05: I did not
<whitequark>
DocScrutinizer05: he did not
<whitequark>
indeed
<larsc>
I said that I don't agree with his reasoning that something should be done because anybody else could also do it
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah, exactly
<DocScrutinizer05>
just that he not even said that
<whitequark>
larsc: besides that, by joining freenode you agree for your IP to be shown to strangers. there is no countermeasure at all which could prevent showing your IP to strangers after you've agreed & effectively published it.
<whitequark>
both technical and social
<DocScrutinizer05>
that's so incredibly silly my head starts to hurt
<larsc>
whitequark: that's correct, still there is a moral imperative for the induvidual not do so
<DocScrutinizer05>
not to do WHAT??
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<larsc>
save your private data
<DocScrutinizer05>
to publish announced chanlogs, with agreement of chanowner?
<DocScrutinizer05>
bullshit!
<DocScrutinizer05>
you suggest I should delete my chanlog because you post your password here?
<DocScrutinizer05>
dude!
<whitequark>
larsc: moral views are subjective. that's why they are not laws.
<whitequark>
in fact, I do not consider your IP to be private data because it's not, well, private.
<DocScrutinizer05>
and when you walk down the street naked, you will sue me for sexual harrassment when I look?
<whitequark>
exactly because I have received it from a public source in the first place
<whitequark>
DocScrutinizer05: lol exactly
<larsc>
DocScrutinizer05: since you don't know in advance that I will share my password with you, you should not have to delete you backlog
<urandom__>
if you tell something private to a group of people (irc channel) then it wouldt be nice if they don't tell it to strangers (not into the discussion just saying)
<whitequark>
urandom__: yeah, and if this channel was private that would be true
<larsc>
DocScrutinizer05: no I'll take a photo and post in on twitter ;)
<whitequark>
urandom__: but you're sharing something with an _unbounded_ group of people
<whitequark>
because anyone can join at any time
<DocScrutinizer05>
this is a PUBLIC channel though
<whitequark>
urandom__: it's silly to expect the propagation of information through an unbounded group of people to be bounded.
<DocScrutinizer05>
and I'd even call it rogue to filter logs, form a very basic POV
<urandom__>
nah it is semi-public, the people here are not that random, though i agree that you cant expect but it would be nice of them
<whitequark>
urandom__: you are random
<DocScrutinizer05>
and I'm absolutely shure you don't know me
<whitequark>
I'm pretty sure about that :) and jokes aside, I hear from you here first time ever. therefore you are indeed random for me for all intents and purposes
<DocScrutinizer05>
but you had all chances to know infobot and his chanlog
<DocScrutinizer05>
and it's even in /topic that this chan is logged, it DOES NOT mention the logs are filtered to keep the log "private"
<viric>
reading the last 20 posts, I can't tell who favors what
<whitequark>
viric: me and DocScrutinizer05 think that IPs are not private, kyak and larsc think they are. not sure about urandom__ .
<DocScrutinizer05>
I favour to leave this "discussion" alone, until some of you have thoroughly rethought their POV and expectations
<larsc>
I favor the categorical imperative
<whitequark>
larsc: what?
<DocScrutinizer05>
THOUGH SHALT NOT FAKE LOGS <- categoric imperative
<larsc>
whitequark: kant
<DocScrutinizer05>
-GH
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<urandom__>
well i don't get why someone would need to log IPs for any good reason
<DocScrutinizer05>
I don't get why anybody would want them FILTERED for any good reason
<whitequark>
larsc: I don't understand _why_ did you say that, not _what_ have you said
<DocScrutinizer05>
look on your screen and you see them logged
<whitequark>
urandom__: I don't collect them in first place because they just look ugly. Otherwise, I don't see a reason to not collect them. I first had them included for the sake of completeness.
<larsc>
whitequark: I thought that's what the whole discussion was about
<whitequark>
larsc: correct me if I'm wrong, but it was about logs and IPs and not philosophy.
<urandom__>
they have no use, some people are offended that they are locked, so solution just don't log them, really not a big thing, i think there are more intresting topics
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<whitequark>
urandom__: I would not go and fix my codebase because of a bogus concern which should not have arisen in first place
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah, like some are offended by your posts, so better not show them. Problem solved
<whitequark>
in fact, as I've already said, I am considering building a bot specifically for collecting and publishing IPs.
<viric>
hm I'm more with whitequark, in the sense that if someone logged them and published them... well, it's a public channel. I don't think the published did anything wrong. If some people are upset about that, then it can be negotiated with two happy outputs: filter, or not publish anything at all, for the sake of keeping good relationships.
<urandom__>
well not loging IPs should be a 10 minute fix if you are slow
<viric>
(for next publications)
<larsc>
whitequark: for me it was
<viric>
urandom__: laziness plays a big role too
<whitequark>
urandom__: DocScrutinizer05 does not control the infobot codebase, for example
<viric>
I understand that someone could prefer not to publish anything instead of filtering :)
<DocScrutinizer05>
urandom__: i'm not going to pester devels that for SURE have better things to do
<whitequark>
larsc: ah ok, I see your point.
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:28:52] <TimRiker> DocScrutinizer05, there have been a few channels where I created files with the name of the log directory. This effectively stops the cron job from exporting html logs for those channels.
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:30:26] <TimRiker> I prefer not to have the bot in channels if they don't want them logged. if people are posting on public irc networks and expecting their data to be private in any way, they are in for sore disappointment. _anyone_ could be logging and reposting anything, anywhere.
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:31:28] <TimRiker> if you don't want your IP shown, then get a cloak. that's what they are for. but remember that sometimes services are down, so even a cloak does not insure that your ip is private.
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2012-10-15 19:32:19] <TimRiker> if you don't want your ip shown, don't use irc, or send email, or hit web sites, or use instant messaging, in short, get off the Internet.
<urandom__>
ah i see, well ok, so just make a note "warning your IPs are logged if you have concerns fuck off" or something
<whitequark>
urandom__: EVERYONE on the internet logs IPs
<whitequark>
from google analytics to $websitename
<DocScrutinizer05>
even pastebin does ;-P
<DocScrutinizer05>
and nicely exposes them
<DocScrutinizer05>
now cya for good
<whitequark>
in fact you can get millions of IPs together with sensitive data with a clever inurl: query
<whitequark>
due to known public analytics scripts
<whitequark>
(you might not have this ability right now because IIRC google has blocked this attack vector. you still can crawl the entire web manually for the same result. it's trivial.)
<DocScrutinizer05>
ps: in fact since I have "hide join/nick/quit msgs" on set my IRC client, I'm fscked as chanop when fighting spambots and no chanlog gives me IP of the bot
<DocScrutinizer05>
so WHY THE F**K filter/fake chanlogs, just because somebody thinks it's evil to show all that's already been shown?
<DocScrutinizer05>
(except for aesthetic resons)
<DocScrutinizer05>
I mean, there's probably a *reason* when freenode themselves decide to display IP in join-msgs
<DocScrutinizer05>
And I'm still not seeing a sound scenario for exploiting last week's IPs whatsoever
<DocScrutinizer05>
probably last week's newspaper is more 'private' and 'dangerous' than your last week's IP
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