<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: (kernel driver) in the end, there will be an AT86RF231 kernel driver, probably with an internal high/low level division, the high level implementing device operations and the low level talking to the interface. e.g. one to SDIO, the other to USB.
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: linux-zigbee already has a kernel driver for AT86RF230. it's very simple, though, leaving a lot to software to implement (which per se isn't wrong, but ...). including timing-critical functions (which may be a problem)
<roh>
wpwrak: less stuff than zigbee, still quite some stack foobar
<wpwrak>
roh: it seems that people are using much of the stack from contiki. but i haven't investigated how exactly things are done.
<roh>
havent looked at any code (yet)
<roh>
but it seems that there are not several modules and usb based modules avail
<xiangfu>
it's start at "21-Jan", until today, it still build, never happen before.
<wolfspraul>
ok, the wiki page works like a charm
<wolfspraul>
slowness on build host, hmm...
<xiangfu>
s/build/building
<wolfspraul>
checking...
<wolfspraul>
in 'top' I see a process that looks stuck
<wolfspraul>
mconf
<wolfspraul>
3440 minutes running
<xiangfu>
wolfspraul: yes. something wrong, it start at Jan18.
<xiangfu>
wolfspraul: let me kill that.
<wolfspraul>
why don't you kill it?
<xiangfu>
wolfspraul: don't notice it start at Jan18 until you mention it.
<wolfspraul>
xiangfu: do you have a command line music player you recommend on the nanonote?
<wolfspraul>
something like "play_this *.ogg"
<xiangfu>
wolfspraul: no.
<wolfspraul>
ok :-)
<wolfspraul>
then I use gmu
<kyak>
wolfspraul: mplayer *.ogg :)
<Jay7>
or mpg123/mpg321 :)
<Jay7>
may be with *curses frontend
<roh>
wolfspraul: i got bad news (for now)
<roh>
i didnt get my delivery of acryllic yet. gls fucked up big time
<roh>
it went underway on the 19th and got delivered somewhere on the 20th and i didnt get any notification from them.
<wolfspraul>
roh: no problem, relax.
<wolfspraul>
so first you need to find where it is now :-)
<roh>
doing that for 2 hours straight now
<roh>
even started calling people in oldenburg since there is a street with the same name and the surname they supposedly delivered it to
<roh>
problem just is: nobody with that name lives in this house
<zrafa>
wolfspraul: IIRC kyak did a mplayer version (in qi-openwrt) using a PATENTED stuff flag so it is useful for us. Maybe you could use it for mplayer *.ogg :)
<zrafa>
ah.. he already said that :P
<wpwrak>
hmm, fedex are also a bit slow this time. the bad weather kicked back my parcel from digi-key by one day. should reach BUE tonight, then one day customs, delivery wednesday. that much about cleverly using the weekend. well, nothing too urgent in there..
<kristianpaul>
What's the right temperature to remove a NAND chip from a.. let said nanonote board :-)
<kristianpaul>
planning to get a solder station for iron and air
<wpwrak>
more heat = better :-)
<kristianpaul>
k
<wpwrak>
the problem is not the temperature per se but to maintain a high enough temperature uniformly in the area of interest
<wpwrak>
factors that enter then are heat capacity of the elements you're heating, thermal transfer away from the area (e.g., ground planes), and of course also how continuous you can keep on heating
<kristianpaul>
yeah, i was told about when using hot air iron, to "fly" around the interested area in circles
<wpwrak>
i've never lifted something as big as a nand with hot air. but maybe that's just my station that's not good enough.
<wpwrak>
i use hot air for smaller areas, though. e.g., to solder the crystal
<kristianpaul>
how do you usually remove a nand chip then?
<kristianpaul>
hmm may be not the same method because ben board size.. but
<wpwrak>
(how do i remove) well, so far, i haven't ;-)
<kristianpaul>
ah
<kristianpaul>
well, for the 16GB nand upgrade ;-)
<wpwrak>
if i did try, they i would probably use the iron and if that didn't work, the chipquick thing. the latter it very dirty, but works well.
<wpwrak>
it uses a special type of solder that has a very high thermal capacity and stays molten for several seconds. so you spread it around all the contacts, melt it, and then you can lift off the component. then clean the mess off the board ...
<kristianpaul>
how you call solderwick in spanish there in argentina?
<wpwrak>
cinta para desoldar, malla desoldante
<wpwrak>
in english, desoldering braid / wick
<kristianpaul>
hmm
<kristianpaul>
i'll source, i had problem to ge tunderstood last time i asked
<wpwrak>
;-))
<wpwrak>
soon, i'll try 473-1060-ND and 473-1061-ND from digi-key
<wpwrak>
they're very narrow, narrower than the braid i can easily find there
<kristianpaul>
wow is cheap
<wpwrak>
with small component a regular-size braid (2 mm) is inconvenient, because it sticks to areas you're not working on. so you have to heat up a lot of things just to get the braid unstuck.
<kristianpaul>
ah, is called mecha
<mth>
a 10 meters high humanoid robot?
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: i have one that simply says "Solder-Wick" and "INDUSTRIA ARGENTINA" ;-)
<kristianpaul>
:(
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: (that one is medium quality. the best i have so far is imported from japan, "goot" brand. i'm vary curious about the quality of the ones from digi-key)
<kristianpaul>
wpwrak: tiny ones are important, i think i'll assist some people on hard disk repair, i need learn how all this stuff work togethe
<kristianpaul>
tiny <- solder-wick
<kristianpaul>
s/tiny/narrow
<kristianpaul>
:)
<wpwrak>
hard disks should be fun :)
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: i looked at the desoldering video. oh dear. that's quite brutish. the approach isn't too bad - the chipquick approach is the same. but the amount of time he's spending with the soldering iron is just scary.
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: possible reasons: 1) he's not adding flux. there's some in the solder, but with smt, you're in a world of pain without extra flux. 2) the iron is probably too cold. better to do things hot and quick than cool but spending minutes fighting - you're likely to do more damage in the 2nd case.
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: with the chipquick solder, you'd also have less trouble heating the entire row. i wouldn't make a habit of using it, but it can be helpful from time to time.
<wpwrak>
zrafa: i found the paper you recommended. the print looks promising. there are a few small flaws, but i'm not sure if they're the paper's fault. let's see how the transfer goes. (need to fix my machine first. the relay is finally dying.)
<zrafa>
wpwrak: ha , great :).. We used the iron for the toner transfer using the amount of minutes suggested for the ledtoy
<wpwrak>
don't seem to have it it on "our ebay" :-(
<steve|m>
oh well.. there are just so many awesome toys out there..
<wpwrak>
wolfspraul, adamw_, roh: the samples will take a little longer. with the footprint issues that still needed resolving, i couldn't start before yesterday afternoon, and i've been busy with other stuff most of today. so hopefully, i'll finish during wednesday.
<wolfspraul>
what is a day?
<wolfspraul>
:-)
<wpwrak>
roh: also, the mechanical sample won't be perfect. my boards shift a little when milling, which particularly affects atusb in an uneven way. so one side gets a little too wide and the other too short. i think the pcb maker will add their own flaws, so there's probably no use in optimizing my process down to the last micron.
<wpwrak>
roh: atben works better, so there, i think i'll have tolerances < 100 um.
<adamw_>
wpwrak, i haven't asked maker for how they cut edge.
<wpwrak>
roh: (the worst tolerance in atusb is a bit more than 200 um for now. may change a bit after etching.)
<wpwrak>
adamw_: just tell them it has to be very precise ;-) microsd tolerances
<wpwrak>
adamw_: about 0.1 mm tolerance are probably okay. but more would be trouble. i also made atusb with relatively narrow margins. after all, if we have a process that can produce atben, they'll be able to handle atusb too :)
<wpwrak>
wolfspraul: hah, three days ! of course, still better than the usual "add one, multiply with two, then convert to the next higher unit" rule. that would be 2 days -> 6 weeks :)
<wpwrak>
thinner path .. you mean the trace width ?
<kristianpaul>
yes that one
<kristianpaul>
s/thinner path/trace width
<wpwrak>
8 mil
<kristianpaul>
no no, argg i dont get well express
<kristianpaul>
thickness !
<kristianpaul>
is that right word for this topic?
<kristianpaul>
path thickness
<kristianpaul>
trace *
<wpwrak>
width, thickness, it's all the same
<wpwrak>
or do you mean in the Z direction ?
<kristianpaul>
:S
<kristianpaul>
X and Y
<wpwrak>
8 mil then :)
<kristianpaul>
My tought was, i wonder if i can plot it using a specialized pen and my current "cnc"
<kristianpaul>
but thats the bigger?
<wpwrak>
bigger traces are 10 mil, 20 mil, and 58 mil for the feed line
<wpwrak>
you don't see much of the 20 mil trace, though. i use it to tweak the shape of the feed line
<wpwrak>
(plotter) i would just use a laser printer. they're cheap and very accurate :)
<kristianpaul>
sure
<kristianpaul>
:-)
<kristianpaul>
I just wanted to avoid adional steps on transfer
<kristianpaul>
I have a laser printer (Samsung),
<zrafa>
wpwrak: ah nice
<zrafa>
wpwrak: so it is useful right? (alternative paper)
<wpwrak>
yeah, looks good. it's not as precise as the hp paper, but i think it's good enough for my 8 mil process. i could probably even do 7 mil, maybe 6 mil.
<wpwrak>
it has some issue with covering area, though. not sure yet, there they come from.