apeiros changed the topic of #ruby-lang to: Ruby 2.0.0-p247: http://ruby-lang.org (Ruby 1.9.3-p448) || Paste >3 lines of text on http://gist.github.com
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<imperator> hola
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<imperator> hm, seems some methods of the uri library get persnickety if you don't include the scheme
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<imperator> u = URI.parse("ruby-lang.org"); u.find_proxy => NoMethodError: undefined method `downcase' for nil:NilClass
<imperator> is that by design or a bug?
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<gnufied> drbrain: ping
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<freedrull> i think i have a fundamental misunderstanding about UTC
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<mdedetrich> what is the idiomatic way to call a method on an object (if it the method exists) else return nil
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<freedrull> consider just implementing the method on that class and make it return nil, then you don't have to check if it exists
<freedrull> otherwise you could check if the method exists with respond_to?
<mdedetrich> freedrull: well I dont feed like monkey patching ActiveRecord::Base ;)
<mdedetrich> freedrull: but yeah, I know you can use respond to, its just wordy
<mdedetrich> hence why I am asking for an idiomatic way
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<mdedetrich> assuming that either tmp2 or tmp MAY have a method called b, I want the bleh to either contain "" or the result of either tmp2.b or tmp.b (should the methods exist)
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<freedrull> do hmm
<freedrull> mdedetrich: do A and B both inherit from ActiveRecord::Base, by chance? :)
<mdedetrich> freedrull: yes, they are both activerecord models
<mdedetrich> freedrull: this is what I am doing currently, its just really wordy/boilerplatery
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<freedrull> those look like they would be activerecord attributes to me, which would return nil anyway?
<slash_nick> instution || bank || ""
<mdedetrich> slash_nick that doesn't work
<freedrull> why is insitution and bank implemented on some products but not others
<mdedetrich> slash_nick: thats what I had before, and it cuts off saying "undefined method institution"
<mdedetrich> freedrull: because that is how the models are designed? Some models have a bank, some have an institution, and some have neither
<slash_nick> mdedetrich: gotcha... think I came in in the middle of something
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<freedrull> if there is only one product model and institution and bank are activerecord attributes, then they should both return nil, not say they are undefined
<mdedetrich> well thats what they are doing
<slash_nick> mdedetrich: show us the db/schema.rb bits and classes for what you're messing with?
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<mdedetrich> slash_nick: can't really do that due to nda
<mdedetrich> note that the models are defined with self.abstract_class = true
<mdedetrich> because its a secondary, not main, activerecord database
<mdedetrich> anyways thanks for the help, its not such a huge issue
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<Nilium> Hm, not sure how to handle strings with the c struct stuff, so I won't.
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<yorickpeterse> I'M ON A TRAIN
<yorickpeterse> Headed to destinity: next stop, Ruby station
<yorickpeterse> TOOT TOOT
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<retro|cz> yorickpeterse, :)
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<yorickpeterse> Magazines are so multifunctional
<yorickpeterse> you can read them as well as using them to raise monitors!
<Nilium> Well, I have now seen the most horrifying project on github
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<Nilium> https://github.com/mame/quine-relay ← Seriously. Why does this exist?
<Nilium> Is it because the other universes were all destroyed by its existence?
<Mon_Ouie> Yeah, I wonder how much time it took that guy
<Nilium> If enough people run this, it'll probably create a singularity.
<Mon_Ouie> Even installing the 50ish interpreters-compilers you need for that is too much for me
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<judofyr> note that is was generated though: https://github.com/mame/quine-relay/blob/master/src/code-gen.rb
<Mon_Ouie> Oh, that makes more sense :p I only saw the main file
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<judofyr> that's Haskell code that generates Logo code that generates INTERCAL code
<Nilium> The disturbing part is that intercal is in there..
<yorickpeterse> Nilium: because some people like to have fun
<yorickpeterse> there was this HN comment that claimed it was sad. God that pissed me off
<Nilium> Well this person's idea of fun is putting the fabric of reality at risk
<yorickpeterse> "WOW THIS GUY IS HAVING FUN. SO SAD"
<judofyr> mame++
<judofyr> haters gonna hate
* Nilium likes to avoid hacker news because it's full of strange people who hate programming.
<yorickpeterse> Pretty much
<yorickpeterse> Sadly the content is quite interesting from time to time
<Nilium> I bet if I posted my c-struct gem on there they'd get mad that I didn't use the existing c-struct gem because IT ALREADY EXISTS
<yorickpeterse> Nilium: here's what you need to do
<yorickpeterse> 1. Write it in Go
<Nilium> Then again, they'd also get mad that I wasn't spewing stupidity like "what if we used maybe instead of null"
<yorickpeterse> 4. Make fucktons of money on HN
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<Nilium> I'd like to use Go if it didn't hog the main thread that I so desperate cannot have it hogging
<Nilium> Well, thread 0, anyway. The main thread is sort of arbitrary.
<yorickpeterse> I don't like the PascalCase for methods
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: does that really matter?
<yorickpeterse> either use camelCase or snake_case, not the method casing of the heretics
<Nilium> My cat just bit his own tail. He is the ouroboros
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: if you're a pedantic asshole like me, yes
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<judofyr> yorickpeterse: have you written a lot of Go?
<yorickpeterse> probably syntax OCD
<Nilium> I don't really care as long as the style's consistent.
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<yorickpeterse> judofyr: No, because the syntax keeps me from doing it
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<Nilium> Also as long as opening braces don't have to go on a newline.
<yorickpeterse> No doubt it's ac ool language, I just don't like the syntax
<yorickpeterse> and the way of passing errors as return values strikes me as odd
<Nilium> People who put opening braces on newlines are heatens
<Nilium> heathens, even
<yorickpeterse> Nilium: :<
<Nilium> You know what sins you have committed
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: you haven't actually tried to write anything in it, you just don't like it from a distance?
<judofyr> :)
<Nilium> I tried to write something in it, but it ate thread 0 :|
<Nilium> And that was the end of that.
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: yeah
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: hey welcome to generalization 101
<judofyr> I understand your position, but that's a seriously weak excuse :P
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<yorickpeterse> Actually, think about it. Given you'll use it often the syntax does matter a lot
<judofyr> Go is fine enough. I love the stdlib.
<yorickpeterse> hence I'm not a fan of ML like languages either
<yorickpeterse> Though I have to say Go is sane for the most part
<yorickpeterse> (syntax wise)
<Nilium> I'm not a huge fan of Haskell, so HN already hates me by default.
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<judofyr> yorickpeterse: well, if you haven't *tried it* you don't know if the syntax is crappy or just unknown
<Nilium> Also don't like Clojure.
<Nilium> Scheme's the bomb, though.
<Nilium> Well, gambit scheme.
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: that's bs
<Nilium> There are plenty of crappy things about Go's syntax, though I don't take issue with the casing.
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: syntax plays a big role, if it strikes me as odd it means I'm less inclined to use it
<yorickpeterse> However, I do share interest in Go so I most likely will try it soon
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: well, you can assert that certain things are crappy (e.g. PHP), but you don't know if the crappiness is going to annoy you when you actually write code.
<yorickpeterse> I just really want a viable alternative to C that's not C++
<judofyr> I'm hoping for Rust
<judofyr> I see Go more as a cleaner Java
<yorickpeterse> I can't get over the pointer syntax of Rust
<Nilium> For example, no parentheses around if or for. Also the fact that `for` is this weird, ambiguous control structure makes it unlikable.
<yorickpeterse> &, @ and 2 others I believe for different pointer types or w/e it was
<judofyr> memory matters
<Nilium> That said, it has a very sane switch/case
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: ~ for unique, @ for GC allocated
<Nilium> I should sleep before I get the 2am hunger.
<judofyr> & for borrowed (which is used when you e.g. need a function that can take both types of pointers without restricting it to either of the two types)
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: they're also moving away from using @ in stdlib
<judofyr> because it requires GC
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<judofyr> I've only used ~ really
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<judofyr> well, for the small programs I've written
<ddfreyne> Nilium: What is it that you don't like about Clojure?
<ddfreyne> I've been doing a whole bunch of Clojure lately, which is why I'm asking
<ddfreyne> I hope I get to play with Rust soon :)
<Nilium> Extremely long startup time, not really great for performance, and it just comes across as being too big for a lisp
<Nilium> It's mostly down to my preference for Schemes, too.
<ddfreyne> It is a tad slow, but not problematically so in my experience
<ddfreyne> As for the startup time, well... that's the JVM for you :)
<Nilium> Indeed.
<Nilium> That said, performance was notable worse than gambit scheme for me, so I went back to that for lisp stuff.
<Nilium> *notably
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<Nilium> You do lose the JVM and ergo all of Java in the process, but that's not really a problem for me since I don't use it
<ddfreyne> Yeah, JVM interop is important for us (lots of libraries out there that we need)
<Nilium> I do game dev stuff, so it's not really an option for me.
<ddfreyne> Ah yeah, makes sense
<Nilium> The JVM not being the issue, though -- it's good at what it does.
<Nilium> Just nowhere near the amount of libraries for use
<injekt> wat
<ddfreyne> Nilium: Hmm, what makes Clojure bad for games specifically? I imagine that the main point would be GC causing unpredictable lagging, but is there something else?
<Nilium> I don't think GC is an issue there if you just don't allocate anything.
<Nilium> And I don't know that Clojure is bad for games, I just don't like the language from the time I spent with it.
<Nilium> I have no objective thoughts on it for that purpose
<Nilium> Or really any objective thoughts on it, probably.
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<Nilium> Huh, apparently C extensions don't work in jruby. Well, that's a shame.
<yorickpeterse> https://gist.github.com/YorickPeterse/6007160 well, there we go
<yorickpeterse> lets do this Pomodoro thing
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<Nilium> Hm, I should probably do that just for my back's sake.
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<apeiros> Nilium: that's not quite correct
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<apeiros> C extensions which use FFI do work with jruby
<apeiros> and afaik there was/is a project which provides rubys standard C API for jruby. don't remember the name, though.
<Nilium> Yeah, I need the C API, I don't think jumping through hoops for it is really worth the time just to see if I can make my snow-data gem work.
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<Nilium> Plus the jruby folks would probably hate it anyway due to how hideously unsafe it is.
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<tbuehlmann> yorickpeterse, nice. I will totally pirate this one
<yorickpeterse> OH NOES! QUICK, LICENSE IT UNDER THE GPLv3!
<yorickpeterse> but yeah, feel free to pirate it
<yorickpeterse> tbuehlmann: I have it as an applet in my Xfce toolbar, complete with a tomato icon
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<tbuehlmann> yeah, trying the icon thingy right now
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<gnufied> oh dear, language bike shedding and I was eating lunch
<tbuehlmann> thanks
<gnufied> I found go syntax to be okay. But I just was going through gotour examples
<gnufied> have not written substantial code in it
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<gnufied> they are setting themselves to some incosistencies though
<gnufied> esp. in areas when you can omit types and when you can't.
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<yorickpeterse> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hipster_PDA so I got here from Pomodoro -> Lifehacking -> Hipster PDA
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<injekt> yes that is a rails project
<yorickpeterse> DAMN YOU INKJET
<yorickpeterse> WHATS THE SECRET SAOUCE
<injekt> the secret is fuck rails
<yorickpeterse> don't say "inkjet sauce"
<yorickpeterse> that's gross
<injekt> hey it's been known to cure cancers
<yorickpeterse> wat
<injekt> srsly
<yorickpeterse> in which yorick discovers that his test for this certain aggregation class was totally useless
<yorickpeterse> because it wasn't actually testing if there was data
<Nilium> Ok, 1.0.0pre1 out time to sleep
<yorickpeterse> as in, if there was no data it would still pass
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<retro|cz> Is there any way to avoid rb_iv_get warning instance variable @abc not initialized?
<retro|cz> some check if iv exists?
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<apeiros> retro|cz: write proper #initialize methods
<apeiros> that's what they're there for.
<injekt> I'm still torn between defining ivars and implicit nil values
<apeiros> I find implicit nil values one of the worst decisions in ruby
<apeiros> initializers for ivars, that's something I'd welcome
<judofyr> I like the `@foo ||= bar` pattern though
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<apeiros> i.e. something like: class X; auto_vivify :@foo, nil; auto_vivify :@bar do |_self| Time.now…
<retro|cz> apeiros, thanks, you opened my mind :-*
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<apeiros> not the same :-/
<apeiros> I'd like it on ivar level, not on accessor level
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<ledestin> if Ruby uses green threads, why ulimit matters? i.e. ulimit limits number of threads I can have.
<ledestin> meaning number of user processes
<apeiros> ledestin: ruby uses OS threads
<apeiros> it just has a GIL
<apeiros> also native extensions
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<judofyr> ledestin: 1.8 used green threads. 1.9 uses native threads.
<judofyr> well, and 2.0
<ledestin> judofyr: cool, thanks
<ledestin> apeiros: ty
<judofyr> ledestin: and as apieros mentioned: there's a GIL which ensures that only one Ruby thread is running at the same time
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<jcarlos> I'm newbie to ruby, and trying to install a ruby gem. I'm not sure if this is the right channel to ask. I try to install a ruby gem (I'm using debian) with "gem install fast_trie --user-install", but I get the following error: http://paste.debian.net/16333/ Am I missing anything?
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<injekt> jcarlos: yes, that gem is broken
<injekt> (it is, after all, 3+ years old)
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<yorickpeterse> haha, that's not how you fix errors
<injekt> that wont fix it
<injekt> that isn't the issue
<jcarlos> injekt: But if the gem was working before, what has changed since then?
<yorickpeterse> different compiler version, different config, etc
<injekt> jcarlos: your computer
<yorickpeterse> could be any number of things
<jcarlos> injekt: Hehe
<jcarlos> It seems an error caused by a security warning being enabled
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<jcarlos> yorickpeterse: injekt: If I'd know how to disable that security warning in the gem I could at least build it. I'm not interested in security issues.
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<jcarlos> How could I change the contents in the generated Makefile? I change the file but it is a generated file, so it is overwriten.
<injekt> jcarlos: extconf.rb builds the makefile
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<jcarlos> injekt: I can see the flag -Werror=format-security in the CXXFLAGS variable in the Makefile file. But I don't know how to tell "gem" not to generate that flag. Could you give some pointer?
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<yorickpeterse> eh, I believe you can pass CFLAGS to `gem install`
<yorickpeterse> but I'm not sure what the syntas was for it
<yorickpeterse> * syntax
<injekt> --with-cflags
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<yorickpeterse> man this pomodoro thing so far works pretty great
<yorickpeterse> gives me a reason to move and stretch my ass more oftne
<yorickpeterse> * often
<yorickpeterse> heh, and that reads weird
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<Aoa_> Hi there. I'm having problem with Hashes in Ruby. I'm quite new to this language, so here is the pastie corresponding to my problem (excepted result, and what I do get now) : http://pastie.org/8145585
<Aoa_> Thanks ! :)
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<realDAB> Aoa_: the "each" grabs a key/hash pair in an array
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<jcarlos> yorickpeterse: injekt: Thanks. "gem install fast_trie --user-install -- --with-cflags=" did the trick. The gem is now installed properly. No compilation error.
<yorickpeterse> :)
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<jcarlos> yorickpeterse: I suppose that using an empty --with-cflags option removes all the configured cflags options in the generated Makefile
<yorickpeterse> Yeah I believe it does
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<yorickpeterse> Ok I seriously need to wrote a camper_van alternative
<yorickpeterse> I can't have a Campfire bridge taking down an entire server once in a while
<yorickpeterse> (it takes it down before monit can get its hands on it
<imperator2> u = URI.parse("ruby-lang.org"); u.find_proxy => undefined method `downcase' for nil:NilClass
<imperator2> bug or not?
<erikh> imperator2: I'd say it's a bug
<eval-in> yorickpeterse => undefined method `downcase' for nil:NilClass (NoMethodError) ... (https://eval.in/37697)
<yorickpeterse> >> require 'uri'; URI.parse('ruby-lang.org').find_proxy
<yorickpeterse> hm
<yorickpeterse> yes, I'd say so
<erikh> I also imagine you know why
<erikh> imperator2: what does URI::Generic/HTTP/HTTPS do?
<erikh> actually, I guess I can just use the bot
<erikh> >> require 'uri'; URI::HTTP.parse('ruby-lang.org').find_proxy
<eval-in> erikh => undefined method `parse' for URI::HTTP:Class (NoMethodError) ... (https://eval.in/37698)
<erikh> die
<erikh> die URI
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<yorickpeterse> hey hey watch the potty mouth Mr
<erikh> yeah, so there's a parsing hook that they all provide that URI.parse uses
<erikh> added since 1.9
<erikh> I had to deal with this a few years back but I don't remember it now -- either way, you can override that parser probably trivially to work around this
<erikh> it's like URI.parsers[:http] or something
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<injekt> >> require 'uri'; URI.schemes
<eval-in> injekt => undefined method `schemes' for URI:Module (NoMethodError) ... (https://eval.in/37699)
<injekt> >> require 'uri'; URI.class_variable_get(:@@schemes)
<eval-in> injekt => {"FTP"=>URI::FTP, "HTTP"=>URI::HTTP, "HTTPS"=>URI::HTTPS, "LDAP"=>URI::LDAP, "LDAPS"=>URI::LDAPS, "MAILTO"=>URI::MailTo} (https://eval.in/37700)
<yorickpeterse> dat class variable
<injekt> >> require 'uri'; URI::DEFAULT_PARSER
<eval-in> injekt => #<URI::Parser:0x40723f04> (https://eval.in/37701)
<injekt> >> require 'uri'; URI.parse("ruby-lang.org").parser
<eval-in> injekt => #<URI::Parser:0x40c3fee8> (https://eval.in/37702)
<injekt> meh
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<yorickpeterse> oh nice, it appears I'm debugging a 2,5 year old bug
<yorickpeterse> in other words, something that never worked
<yorickpeterse> (at least that's what it looks like right now)
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<imperator2> so, already reported?
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<imperator2> erikh, i think i'll just manually add "http://" if not already present
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<injekt> I dont think it's been reported
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<yorickpeterse> man this DO box is being weird as butts
<yorickpeterse> 5USD AMS1 droplet running some IRC stuff and more often than not the entire network craps out
<yorickpeterse> 10USD AMS1 droplet runs fine and it runs much "heavier" things
<yorickpeterse> it also seems to come in waves
<yorickpeterse> e.g. it works fine for a while, then gets super slow, and then works again
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<imperator2> question is, what -should- find_proxy return if the scheme is nil?
<imperator2> nil?
* imperator2 waves to headius
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<yorickpeterse> hey folks, you heard of MVC right?
<yorickpeterse> check this out
<ericwood> wats mvc
<ericwood> is it liek rubay
<lupine> ur controllers so fat, etc
<yorickpeterse> ^ prepare thyself
<ericwood> that is not rubay
<ericwood> wat is it
<yorickpeterse> heh, 2011
<yorickpeterse> ericwood: somebody who thought "FUCK MVC, WE'LL HAML IT"
<lupine> haml is nice. that code is less nice
<yorickpeterse> well more like "FUCK OO ..."
<ericwood> fuk da polic haml all da way
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<apeiros> yorickpeterse: assignments in haml alone are a smell already IMO
<apeiros> and… that… code… - horror :D
<apeiros> I mean `:style => "width: #{[(((amounts[type][compared_key].to_i / max_number.to_f) * 180).to_i rescue 0), 1].max}px"`
<apeiros> WHY?!??!? :D
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<ericwood> that is disgusting
<ericwood> I need to shower now
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<chris2> cmon :P
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<imperator2> ow
<yorickpeterse> bahaha, appears I found the particular bug
<ericwood> yorickpeterse: you have your code pasting privileges revoked
<yorickpeterse> and it indeed has been there since 2011
<ericwood> after that atrocity
<yorickpeterse> ericwood: I have more
<ericwood> no thx
<ericwood> plz stahp
<yorickpeterse> haha
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<yorickpeterse> "yorick plz"
<chris2> show me :P
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<ericwood> stahp
<yorickpeterse> fak, I can only fix this poop mountain by throwing more poop at it
<injekt> mother of god
<injekt> I thought our haml was bad, it looks incredible compared to that
<injekt> assignments in views just reminds me of php, too
<yorickpeterse> Mind you that this *was* written with a super tight deadline, but still
<injekt> also :/ calling capitalize on a translation string
<yorickpeterse> surely every language does that the same, right?
<yorickpeterse> RIGHT?
<yorickpeterse> Hm, I wonder
<injekt> kill it with fire
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<yorickpeterse> >> "ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ".upcase
<eval-in> yorickpeterse => "ㅋㅋㅋㅋㅋ" (https://eval.in/37712)
<yorickpeterse> heh
<yorickpeterse> figures
<yorickpeterse> ah well, time to retractor
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<injekt> re-tractor
<yorickpeterse> bro that's just like your opinion
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<Sammidysam> I have this question http://stackoverflow.com/questions/17561195/replace-string-in-yield over on StackOverflow of what I need help with. Can anyone help me with something? What I am trying to do is make the calls of a method inside the block of the call of that same method call a different method. The question has a ton more information on what i mean.
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<yorickpeterse> injekt: so far the re-tractoring is going quite well
<yorickpeterse> oh welp, I broke it
<yorickpeterse> Ah, forgot a #to_f
<injekt> Sammidysam: use capture()
<injekt> ah you're not using rails
<Sammidysam> injekt: I am
<injekt> but you haven't tagged your question with it? shame on you!
<yorickpeterse> capture() was also suggested somwhere last night
<Sammidysam> injekt: Yesterday I did some work with then but when I replaced a string in it all of the less than and quotes with "&lt;" "&quot;" etc. and I wasn't sure what to do.
<Sammidysam> I think I mentioned that.
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<Sammidysam> My "genius idea" was to capture the output then manipulate it.
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<injekt> mother of god the indentation in that project just killed my face
<Sammidysam> Yeah I know :/
<Sammidysam> I think I'll open an issue for that.
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<yorickpeterse> injekt: your face is easy to kill
<injekt> nours
<yorickpeterse> want me to get something out of the "wtf Olery" bucket?
<Sammidysam> Oh I just figured out the indentation. It's just a tab after a module then two spaces for a method in the module, which is confusing...
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<injekt> oO
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<Sammidysam> So yesterday with capture(&block) I called gsub and then all of the <, >, ", etc. got changed into &lt;, &gt;, &quot;, etc (I hope I remembered that right).
<yorickpeterse> damn it, there's cotton-something-stuff all over the places
<yorickpeterse> Fucking trees + open windows
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<darix> yorickpeterse: you need your own forum for your rants. imho
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<injekt> yorickrants.com
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<yorickpeterse> I already have one
<yorickpeterse> #ruby-lang on Freenode
<Sammidysam> lol
<yorickpeterse> I'll tell you guys a secret, I also rant in work chat channels
<yorickpeterse> e.g.
<yorickpeterse> "yorick_peterse | sometimes I wonder how much cocaine was used back in 2011"
<apeiros> ranting = zen
* yorickpeterse back to work
<darix> yorickpeterse: well then you can stop here and just use your work channels. ;)
<yorickpeterse> NO
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<yorickpeterse> There's no fun in that
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<yorickpeterse> DAMN YOU POMODORO
<yorickpeterse> STOP MAKING ME PRODUCTIVE
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<injekt> what the fuck, rails new permit crap doesn't support arrays
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<Sammidysam> injekt: Rails doesn't have arrays anymore?
<injekt> Sammidysam: no just the new parameter permitting stuff
<injekt> ie params.require(:post).permit(:comment_ids) wont work
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<injekt> you have to write params.require(:post).permit(comment_ids: [])
<apeiros> injekt: hu? afaik it does
<injekt> apeiros: no sir
<apeiros> well, yes
<apeiros> that
<injekt> that's silly
<apeiros> no
<injekt> yes
<apeiros> otherwise you're back at the original problem
<injekt> I dont see how, if you're going to make it that way for negligent programmers why not go the whole hog
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<apeiros> because an array is not the same as a scalar
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<apeiros> and if you do .find(params.permit(:id)) you want a scalar
<apeiros> but you could (and I would) argue that data validation is a separate concern and should be handled by its own framework.
<injekt> heh
<apeiros> (i.e. instead of piggy-backing different validations on models and controllers and soon other places because they realize that those aren't the only data sources)
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<injekt> yeah, I hate writing this crap
<apeiros> s/sources/sources & processors/
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<apeiros> injekt: well, you can simply ignore the whole strong-parameters stuff if you don't like it
<injekt> true
<apeiros> what you want you can get with Hash#slice
<injekt> I'm not that bothered about it, but passing an empty array there just feels weird
<apeiros> params[:post].slice(:comment_ids, :foo)
<injekt> right
<apeiros> hm, though, that wouldn't work straight away
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<yorickpeterse> http://hastebin.com/nugahareco.haml retractoring
<yorickpeterse> Still some work to do though
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<bjrohan> Very new to Ruby here. I could use some clarification. a string is a class. Puts is a method of the kernel class? When you enter puts "this string" or Kernel.puts "this string" are you sending a class to a method of another class?
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<apeiros> "a string is a class" - no, a string is an object. String is a class. a string is an instance of the class String.
<apeiros> "puts is a method of the kernel class" - Kernel is a module. Modules work differently than classes.
<apeiros> the Kernel module specifically is included into Object, which has the effect of all Kernel instance methods being available everywhere as instance methods.
<bjrohan> That is where i was going awry. Thanks apeiros . "this is a sting" is an object of the String class. Therefore I am sending the object "this string" to the method puts of the Kernel class?
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<apeiros> receiver.method_name(argument1, …) # you send the receiver a method and pass arguments to it
<apeiros> without an explicit receiver, e.g. just `puts("hello")`, the receiver is `self`
<apeiros> so with `puts "foo"` you send the method 'puts' to whatever object you are currently in
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<apeiros> and because Kernel is included into Object, `puts` works in almost every object.
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<bjrohan> apeiros, That just went above my head :-) I am very new to all of this
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<cout> I always found the distinction between Kernel instance methods, Object instance methods, and methods defined in 'main' to be confusing.
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<apeiros> bjrohan: if it helps - this is a bit complex, but ruby only has few complex things, and once understood, they make perfect sense and explain about everything
<apeiros> cout: Kernel instance methods are "functions", i.e. they don't rely on self
<apeiros> contrary to Object instance methods, those are about self, they rely on it
<bjrohan> Gotcha. Thank you for the input and clarification of the string object vs class
<cout> apeiros: by convention, yeah, that's a good point
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<apeiros> cout: not just by convention :-p
<apeiros> cout: this is exhibited by the fact that all Kernel methods are module_function's, which means you can call all of them as Kernel.method_name
<apeiros> you couldn't do that with Object's instance methods
<cout> apeiros: there's nothing to stop me from accessing instance variables inside a Kernel instance method
<apeiros> cout: no. but you're not going to patch ruby, submit it and get it merged ;-)
<apeiros> new methods: sure
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<apeiros> there it's convention and you should stick to it.
<cout> apeiros: also typically methods defined at the toplevel (which end up being private methods of Object) do not access instance variables
<apeiros> usually. can do to. just wrote a tiny script today which does.
<apeiros> *too
<apeiros> (proper thing would have been to make it a class with a run(argv) method, though)
<apeiros> toplevel methods should only be used in single-file scripts IMO
<cout> yeah I almost always end up refactoring to do that in the end
<cout> agreed
<apeiros> Kernel#gem not being a module_function was actually one bug report from me which got fixed :-)
<apeiros> (module_function makes the method also private, and Kernel#gem not being private broke a method_missing for me)
<cout> mm
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<eleanor> baz = 1 if 1==2; defined?(baz) => "local-variable"
<eleanor> why is 'baz' bound in that case? i would expect it to be undefined
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<eleanor> same deal with: if 1 == 2 then baz = 1 end
<cHarNe2> hi guys, im trying do download files over https with basic_auth, but the site uses a 302 redirect, but i think i fugured that out. tho it still does not work.
<cHarNe2> anyone care to take a look? http://pastie.org/8145614 im getting 401 "Unauthorized", the same un/pw and url works fine in a browser.
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<whitequark> eleanor: because local variables are declared when an assignment is present, not when it is executed
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<whitequark> (and they contain `nil' by default)
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<freedrull> whats a good default value for datetimes instead of nil
<freedrull> the beginning of unix time? :)
<yorickpeterse> The current date?
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<kartarn> +1
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<freedrull> that would break some comparisons i currently have in place...
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<yorickpeterse> Well then you're going to have to provide some more info on what you need
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<yorickpeterse> TIL you can alias global variables
<eval-in> yorickpeterse => undefined method `echo' for main:Object (NoMethodError) ... (https://eval.in/37808)
<yorickpeterse> >> alias $HAHA $LOAD_PATH; echo $HAHA
<yorickpeterse> ha fail
<yorickpeterse> fucking PHP syndrome
<eval-in> yorickpeterse => /execpad/interpreters/ruby-2.0.0-p0/lib/ruby/site_ruby/2.0.0 ... (https://eval.in/37809)
<yorickpeterse> >> alias $HAHA $LOAD_PATH; puts $HAHA
<yorickpeterse> wat
<yorickpeterse> oh wait, that's actually correct
<yorickpeterse> charlie y u 32bit
<erikh> getenv
<yorickpeterse> que?
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<erikh> i misunderstood 'alias' in that context
<erikh> carry on
<yorickpeterse> ah
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