<rjeffries>
UBB arrived from Germany. damn, it is tiny
<kristianpaul>
wpwrak: remner i  sent the new captured/blotef file for analisys, i got reply today, no findings..
<kristianpaul>
s/remner/remenber/
<kristianpaul>
s/blotef/bloated
<kristianpaul>
with bloated i mean a 16bit signed format fot the I/Q data
<tuxbrain>
wpwrak: (viral distribution) mmm a thing to think about
<tuxbrain>
wpwrak: (solder mask) ok I will make sure wen we send the final archives to start production
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: (nothing found) hmm yes, that was to be expected. things rarely work on the first try ...
<kyak>
xiangfu: hi
<zedstar>
tuxbrain: hi.....re: the wpan stuff.....i think it would be useful for sensor network or robotics type research projects so i guess you could sell to uni's
<tuxbrain>
zedstar: yeah but we need the software backend ready for this, :)
<zedstar>
tuxbrain: yeh this assuming some IP stack :)
<B_Lizzard_>
Ugh, power failure
<kristianpaul>
wpwrak: ;)
<kristianpaul>
back to the dma thing
<C-Keen>
hm, I get errors form usbboot when reading back the written uboot image :/
<C-Keen>
now I am scared to turn it off
<C-Keen>
...Fail off at 0, wrote 0x14, read 0x34...
<C-Keen>
ah seems I got an old version of the xburst tools
<C-Keen>
sorry for the noise
<C-Keen>
I will retry with a recent version
<C-Keen>
hm, no the problem persists
<wolfspraul>
can you try from another host USB port, or host computer?
<wolfspraul>
also (just in case) try to enter usb boot mode with the hardware pin under the battery, as opposed to the 'u' key
<C-Keen>
will I be able to boot in usbboot mode once I turn off the power?
<wolfspraul>
with the hardware pin you will always be able to
<wolfspraul>
and if you somehow overwrote or garbled the u-boot in the first NAND pages, then that's your only way back, yes
<wolfspraul>
NanoNote should be unbrickable though, I think so far it always was :-)
<wolfspraul>
from that 'wrote 0x14, read 0x34', I'd say rigth now there definitely is no bootable u-boot at the beginning of your nand
<wolfspraul>
for whatever reason
<wolfspraul>
I would try reflashing from another host computer, if you have one available. is this from inside a virtual machine, or Linux is running natively on the host?
<C-Keen>
natively
<wolfspraul>
I read something about a usbboot bug introduced recently, maybe kyak mentioned it
<wolfspraul>
so maybe the very latest usbboot is actually bad? don't know right now
<C-Keen>
well I took the one from the latest
<C-Keen>
I will try again with the one before that
<C-Keen>
hm, now usbboot cannot find the XBurst interface. Do I need to reset somehting else in linux if I change ports?
<wolfspraul>
that looks like the latest usbboot binary is buggy and should be removed right away, or more people will fall into the trap
<wolfspraul>
hmm. that's interesting. you try new things! You left the NanoNote running, unplugged it from one usb port and into another?
<C-Keen>
yes
<C-Keen>
seems like it
<C-Keen>
now it does not answer anymore
<wolfspraul>
cannot follow
<wolfspraul>
did you power cycle the NanoNote now?
<wolfspraul>
if you do, you need to use the usbboot pins under the battery to get back into usb boot mode
<wolfspraul>
for that you should use the carbonized rubber button that came with your Ben
<C-Keen>
here's what I do: w/o battery plug in the usb cable, short pins, press power button for 2 secs, short pins for 2 secs, check lsusb
<C-Keen>
when I plug in the cable the LED blinks once then remains dark
<wpwrak>
no. ignore the power button. short pins, keeping them sorted. plug usb. unshort pins. check lsusb.
<C-Keen>
ah
<wpwrak>
the led doesn't provide useful information. (it's part of the charging logic, not controlled by the cpu)
<wpwrak>
there are a lot of little things that don't quite work the way ones it used to :)
<wpwrak>
s/it/is/
<C-Keen>
ok I got it again
<C-Keen>
booted the two stages
<C-Keen>
erased the nand
<wpwrak>
ah, and when you power cycle usb, disconnect for at least 15 seconds. if you disconnect only briefly, the machine may shut down but not come up again
<C-Keen>
ah
<wpwrak>
but if you get a response from usbboot, it's fine
<C-Keen>
does erase put the cells into 0x00 of 0xff?
<wpwrak>
i was asking myself that same question when you mentioned the 0x14 vs. 0x34 :)
<C-Keen>
heh
<C-Keen>
now I do nprog 0 openwrt-xburst-qi_lb60-u-boot.img 0 0 -n
<wolfspraul>
I wouldn't trust usbboot output 0x14 vs 0x34
<wolfspraul>
I only see that it has failed, that is reliable.
<C-Keen>
with the uboot image from 2010-12-14
<wolfspraul>
usbboot error handling is horrible, very buggy
<C-Keen>
now I get a different error though
<wpwrak>
normally, the erased value should be 0xff
<wolfspraul>
which usbboot are you using?
<C-Keen>
Error - can't read bulk data from ingenic device:64
<wolfspraul>
I'm wondering whether the latest usbboot is buggy.
<C-Keen>
After Finish!
<C-Keen>
so it seems it cannot read back data
<wolfspraul>
try this:
<wolfspraul>
disconnect the Ben, remove battery, wait 15 seconds
<wolfspraul>
press 'u', reconnect usb cable
<wolfspraul>
see whether it comes up in lsusb
<wolfspraul>
if it does, that means the u-boot in nand is now working
<wolfspraul>
because when you press 'u', that is actually handled by u-boot
<C-Keen>
ot does
<C-Keen>
hah
<wolfspraul>
well good
<C-Keen>
good idea
<wolfspraul>
try flashing the Linux kernel now
<wolfspraul>
usbboot is buggy, I don't like it. so when I have to reflash many devices, I always only flash u-boot via usbboot, the rest I do by booting Linux from SD card, then I format/flash everything else in NAND from there
<wolfspraul>
if it's just my own Ben, ok I run reflash_ben.sh and hope for the best :-)
<C-Keen>
wolfspraul: ah, yeah I am still waiting for the microSD to arrive :/
<wpwrak>
wishlist/dream item for ya: a ROM boot loader that can boot from FAT-formatted SD :)
<wolfspraul>
C-Keen: try flashing just the Linux kernel now, with another nprog
<C-Keen>
wolfspraul: did so
<wolfspraul>
let's go step by step
<wolfspraul>
and?
<wolfspraul>
any errors in usbboot?
<C-Keen>
yeah the same when reading back data
<C-Keen>
not the same content of course but the message is the same
<wolfspraul>
but flashing the pages itself resulted in SUCCESS messages?
<wolfspraul>
just try rebooting again
<wpwrak>
what content does it show ?
<wpwrak>
maybe put the whole dialog in a pastebin
<C-Keen>
yes the errors are shown after the Finish! message
<wolfspraul>
with Linux kernel in NAND, you should see it coming up, and eventually run into an error that it cannot find the rootfs
<wolfspraul>
it's a long shot, but try to wget that file, then xbboot -u 0x80600000 /PATH/TO/zImage.bin
<wolfspraul>
I'm just curious whether that boots, even if it does I don't know how you can then reflash your nand :-)
<C-Keen>
plays the lab rat
<wolfspraul>
xbboot reuses the same stage1 as usbboot though, so if there is a low-level usb problem, it will show here as well
<C-Keen>
hm, I think the usb host is broken
<C-Keen>
[Â Â 662.766052] usb 1-2: usbfs: USBDEVFS_CONTROL failed cmd xbboot rqt 64 rq 1 len 0 ret -110
<C-Keen>
form dmesg
<C-Keen>
I will try booting a live cd on another machine
<C-Keen>
bbl
<wolfspraul>
you can try rebooting the host too, of course
<wolfspraul>
I read the backlog, good luck! we'll get the Ben back up, I'm sure...
<wolfspraul>
(this -110 thing from xbboot looks like the usbboot bugs btw, and since it reuses the same stage1 that may just mean that the xbboot idea won't help now)
<wolfspraul>
that leaves: different host computer, boot from sd, jzboot
<wolfspraul>
n8
<wpwrak>
-110 is a timeout. really sounds like usb physical layer
<larsc>
well
<larsc>
if the device doesn't reponse you'll get a 110
<wpwrak>
yup. and combined with the communication working (most/all of the time) for a bit of control but never/rarely for bulk, this looks like a high BER
<wpwrak>
if BER is high enough, bits of nastiness will also slip past the USB CRC, which would explain the verification errors
<wpwrak>
that's for BER ranges that still don't cause a total breakdown. just an error that gets to user space every so many thousand packets
<wpwrak>
i had this happen in ben-wpan/cntr when my TVS has too large a capacitance. it's easy to detect if you add some more redundancy and test that as well
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: yeah, parameters of the lower end of the standard range. that via hole really shouldn't have happened, though. i do that kind of stuff by hand on a particularly clumsy day :)
<wpwrak>
there's a surprisingly large number of pcb shops that have good prices but can only do 1.6 mm. i wonder why. you need 0.8 mm for more and more things these days.
<lekernel>
wpwrak: not for arduino hacks
<wpwrak>
lekernel: true. there, a plank of wood, a bit of wire, and a hammer should do
<rjeffries>
speaking of arduino ;) wpwrak would it be feasible to interface Ben via SPI to this Arduino that has Ethernet?
<C-Keen>
wpwrak: success in flashing kernel on another host. Seems the usb chip has some physical problems on the other machine
<wpwrak>
C-Keen: congratulations on the success ! yeah, usb can sometimes be odd. hard to tell which side is to blame
<C-Keen>
wpwrak: I think I will blame this old machine
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: dunno. if they didn't use both SPI ports (i've seen two in atmegas, one shared with icsp and the other shared with the uart), then yes. otherwise maybe. i don't see the schematics.
<C-Keen>
smiles at the SUCCESS messages scrolling by
<rjeffries>
wpwrak I have sent message to @JonOxner asking for EtherTen schematics
<rjeffries>
david K check your PayPay ypou should have my payment. I sent 2x what you requested. hope that is OK. ;)
<kristianpaul>
:o :-)
<kristianpaul>
thats sharims my friend !!
<kristianpaul>
sharism**
<tuxbrain>
rjeffries: (spi com) It can take me some time but I'm on it, I think is totally posible, I see various examples on avr spi slave code
<rejon>
man, i need one of those UBB
<rejon>
those are cool
<rejon>
does wolfgang have one?
<rejon>
spending next 3 weeks in beijing
<kristianpaul>
rejon: i bet you can get manufactured some UBB at beijing in the meantime there :-)
<rejon>
ha
<kristianpaul>
streetjob <- words from wolfgang
<tuxbrain>
rejon: you will come to EU some time soon?
<rejon>
sometime
<rejon>
june
<rejon>
kristianpaul wolfgang said making UBB Is a streetjob?
<kristianpaul>
he said that when he manufacture a UBB early version i remenber
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: you have a nice camera !!
<kristianpaul>
I cant get that zoom with mine :/
<tuxbrain>
nah! a really cheap one is not zoom is that it is really really close :)
<kristianpaul>
jaja
<kristianpaul>
nice trick
<rejon>
tuxbrain totally
<C-Keen>
wow
<C-Keen>
the latest release for qi openwrt has improved a lot since the one my ben nanonote came with
<C-Keen>
thanks for all the patient support again! I will stick around in case I can help someday as well
<tuxbrain>
C_Keen yeah!
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: yuo are beating all those ISCP programmers out there, you know that !
<tuxbrain>
kristianpaul: or at least making coolest videos than they :)
<kristianpaul>
hahah ;)
<kristianpaul>
larsc: how long take to run linux on that color dictionary before havint the ben as is know today?
<larsc>
kristianpaul: hm, i think i got my hands on it for the first time in late 2009
<larsc>
actually i think it was mid 2009
<larsc>
the kernel patches were merged upstream roughly a year after we started development
<kristianpaul>
okay, i was thiking same  (1 year)
<kristianpaul>
for a official upstream support of course :-)
<larsc>
found a blog post by mirco, apperently we started working on it in august
<kristianpaul>
oh, thats a half
<kristianpaul>
+ year
<kristianpaul>
ok
<larsc>
but you have to keep in mind that this was done in my free time
<kristianpaul>
hmm true
<kristianpaul>
okay i'll expecify that 1 and half year is not measured in work hours per men ;)
<kristianpaul>
man*
<larsc>
fulltime it would probably be 2 months
<larsc>
btw. anyone needs linux support for some device? me needs a job...
<viric>
I wish to be in a position to give jobs like that!
<kristianpaul>
I may need a php developer next month afaik :/
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: nice video ! ;-)
<wpwrak>
larsc: hmm, you may find out that 1 part-time-student-year translates to at least the same amount of time of regular 9-5 cubicle work ;-)
<larsc>
well it was more like irregular weekends and late night rather then part-time
<wpwrak>
i.e., all the really productive time :)
<larsc>
wont say anything against that
<larsc>
just saying if i had to start from scratch now i would be were we are now less than 2 months. buts thats partly due to that i know the hw and its pitfalls
<wpwrak>
ah yes, knowing where the traps are helps, too ;-)
<tuxbrain>
wpwrak: summarizing 40 mins in just 5 was not easy, well not until I found the right music :)
<tuxbrain>
Is curious how the creative part of mind works...
<tuxbrain>
btw the ardunote video has reach the thousand barrier :)
<wpwrak>
when will you get the next batch of UBB made ? ;-)
<wpwrak>
btw, the message that people want to own more than just 1-2 UBBs seems harder to convey than i thought. maybe you need some simple circuit, make a few variations of it (e.g., change LED colors), and show a bundle of them. so that people see several UBBs in use (soldered, not powered) simultaneously.
<wpwrak>
of course, the price-splitting "competition" will eventually disappear. e.g., dvdk is probably already sorry to have offered the mailing. he must have spent hours on the logistics.
<wpwrak>
alas, once the "splitters" vanish, people will come to pester you with requests for 1-2 units
<kristianpaul>
tought about making a UBB a play/stop/forward control for GMU
<tuxbrain>
rjeffries there is also SPI ethernet modules out there, smaller than a full arduino that can be used for have ethernet conenctivitiy in NN is matter to make the software to make it work
<kristianpaul>
have ethernet in his plans, but need get sone some ther tasks before start that
<tuxbrain>
There is any software dude that can helpme on an nanonote Arduino IDE?
<rjeffries>
tuxbrain VERY nice job on the UBB with instructons and ribbon cable
<kristianpaul>
so rjeffries feel free !
<tuxbrain>
thaks rjeffries :)
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: why not just run jlime and ran a python ide for arduino?
<kristianpaul>
i think there are some already
<rjeffries>
thank kristian[pau;. I can always rely on you and lekernel
<kristianpaul>
i hope lighter than java i hope
<tuxbrain>
yeah there is phyton and qt IDE but they are thinked for bigger screens
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: mainlly you need an editor
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: find it, and hack the other buttons is the easy part i guess
<kristianpaul>
at leas pinguino projected started like that
<kristianpaul>
editor/text editor/s
<kristianpaul>
hey why not nano?
<kristianpaul>
:-)
<tuxbrain>
Arduino guys will prefer graphical IDE, they are scared by shell.... (sigh)
<kristianpaul>
oh welll
<kristianpaul>
you need a nano SDL port ;-)
<kristianpaul>
xedit, but that for X
<tuxbrain>
yes I need to find a text editor able to do code coloring, and add the creation of the make file and run make and avrdude in the backend
<kristianpaul>
and wait in jlime there is a gtkeditor
<tuxbrain>
SDL is a pain on text
<kristianpaul>
X way to go then
<kristianpaul>
gtkeditor is in jlime already
<kristianpaul>
but color hmm
<kristianpaul>
you ask for so much.. ;-)
<tuxbrain>
they have fixed the gtk problem with open/save file dialogs?
<wpwrak>
echo "!! your project here" >foo; while vi foo; do sed /!!/d foo >foo.c; make 2>&1 | sed s/^!!/ | cat - foo.c >foo; [ do-the-pipestatus-thing ] && avrdude ...; done
<kristianpaul>
:D
<tuxbrain>
hahahaahaahaahaah
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: nano have colors support, is just matter of add some files
<tuxbrain>
wpwrak: you wanna make the arduino guy piss in his pants isn't it?
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: you mean because my UI is superior ? ;-)
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: i insist add some color even short cuts and nanote can slightly pass as an IDE for then
<kristianpaul>
s/nanonote/nano
<kristianpaul>
cheers wpwrak UI
<tuxbrain>
kristianpaul: yeah also joe, but again... if we wanna hit the "arduino" average user, we must go to the hard part and make a grapical IDE...
<kristianpaul>
grapical = lots of buttons?
<kristianpaul>
:-)
<tuxbrain>
to hit the avr crowd (hail!) the nano aproach is more than efficient
<tuxbrain>
but as you have see , say avr and few will look say Arduino and even your grandma will head up
<tuxbrain>
I'm thinking even to mimic the Arduino IDE colour schem and icons whatever posible but having in mind the 320x200 limits
<tuxbrain>
but yes at the end is just an editor with some extra funtions
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: you probably want an editor with very smooth handling of lines wider than the screen.
<tuxbrain>
wpwrak: yeah!
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: what if you stick editor to screen and "IDE" buttons to keyboard, i guess you dont mind labeling functions keys with some arduino-ide-like pics?
<kristianpaul>
even better
<kristianpaul>
use the space up the function keys
<kristianpaul>
thre is plenty of space thre for labeling
<kristianpaul>
just discover a horrible dust in the center of his nanonote screen :-/
<tuxbrain>
kristianpaul: not a bad idea dude!!!!
<kristianpaul>
he, finally ! :-)
<tuxbrain>
wich starting point you recomend, leapfrog, or at least with widget set (gtk, qt, tlc, sdl(no way due no text input clean solution))
<tuxbrain>
that works on frambuffer of course
<kristianpaul>
you need compare how text visualices there
<tuxbrain>
realize he is totally dumb in C
<tuxbrain>
but to make something efficient an quik is the way to go
<tuxbrain>
If I not remember bad qt renders it pretty good in his demo editor
<kristianpaul>
there are many way to go, even in C i think
<tuxbrain>
how is the state on the qt libs in actual distros?
<whitequark>
tuxbrain: if you mean desktop ones, then very good. it's the framework kde is based on
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: nanomap runs, and some other Qt demos, thats much to say i think
<kristianpaul>
tuxbrain: i think also at UNAL where using Qt IDE for making some stuff for SIE i remenber
<tuxbrain>
whitequark: sorry I'm refering to the Nanonote distros :)
<kristianpaul>
Qt creator i think..
<kristianpaul>
also there are instructiosn for cross compile if you look at SIE archives at wiki
<tuxbrain>
kristianpaul: good, then I can start playing with qt-designer