apeiros changed the topic of #ruby-lang to: Nick registration required to talk || Ruby 2.0.0-p247: http://ruby-lang.org (Ruby 1.9.3-p448) || Paste >3 lines of text on http://gist.github.com
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<flgr> apeiros: thanks, I'll find out how to do it and go for it (super slow reply)
<flgr> rue: thanks. :)
<flgr> rue: feels like it's been a long while, I think I remember you from back in the olden times :)
<rue> flgr: Internet-ancient almost? Early 2000’s?
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<rue> I actually haven’t been doing much Ruby recently at all…
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* drbrain waves to flgr
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<flgr> rue: same here, but I'm planning to back and move forward soon :)
<flgr> drbrain: oh hai
<flgr> been adding some javascript to the mix lately (http://webclonk.flgr.name/ — need more hours of time per day)
<flgr> chris2 is still here, but it looks like we lost batsman :(.
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<flgr> rue: must have been 2003 or something, I think. otherwise I would have been too young. :)
<flgr> I think I was still doing Perl in 2000
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<rue> Yeah, batsman hasn’t been around in a long time…
<coca_rails> i cant watch youtube vids
<coca_rails> it keeps asking me to install flash although i did that several times
<coca_rails> i just bought this mac so its never worked before.
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<Barrin6> hello
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<Barrin6> going to blow through the codeacademy html course while watching treehouse videos on html
<Barrin6> multitasking ftw!
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<captain_chen> (’・ω・`)
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<captain_chen> Anyone familiar with using tf-idf and cosine similarity?
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<micalexander> need a way to trash a document that will work on windows linux or osx
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<micalexander> is there a ruby built in way to do this?
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<whitequark> no
<micalexander> whitequark: any suggestions
<micalexander> anyone encounter a solution to this issue?
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<drbrain> micalexander: you can delete it outright
<micalexander> drbrain: true, kinda wanted a backup in the trash just incase
<micalexander> so the user could roll back if needed
<drbrain> you could detect the platform and move it to the right spot
<drbrain> or use the OS-specific API to do the same
<micalexander> thats pretty much what Im thinking Im gonna have to do, thx
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<chris2> flgr: he is on this server as mfp ;)
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<yorickpeterse> HELLO
<yorickpeterse> I AM UP TOO EARLY
<yorickpeterse> DATABASE UPDATES, YAY
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<gnufied> we lost mfp to ocaml
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<chris2> ocaml is nice :P
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<yorickpeterse> mfp?
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<yorickpeterse> grrrr, carrierwave
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<lewis1711> I have two arrays [:a1, :c1, :a2, :c2] and [:b1, :d1, :b2, :d2]. Wanting to get [[:a1, :b1, :c1, :d1], [:a1, :b2, :c2. :d2]]. I'm sure this is easy but drawing a blank. it's like zip, but not
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<lewis1711> spoiler alert:
<lewis1711> left = [:a1, :c1, :a2, :c2]; right = [:b1, :d1, :b2, :d2]; left.zip(right).flatten.each_slice(4).to_a
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<canton7> do you mean [:h2, :b2, :c2, :d2] in the second desired array?
<canton7> s/h2/a2
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<yorickpeterse> sweet jesus, I got my happy hacking and it fucking rocks
<yorickpeterse> and it's so tiny compared to my Das
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<whitequark> and these guys tell us we have weird gem names:
<whitequark> twisted.spread.banana.BananaError: Security precaution: more than 64 bytes of prefix
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<cout> the gem name doesn't make me look askew as the exception message
<cout> as much as
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<cout> I wonder what daniel berger is thinking right now.
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: still better than "cocaine", "crack", "tranny", etc
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<yorickpeterse> "BUTTTT IS'S FROM A MOVIE!!!11" suuure
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<whitequark> honestly I don't care very much about the library name as long as its error messages and APIs are sensible
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<yorickpeterse> I'd rather not tell people that "We use cocaine at work"
<yorickpeterse> or "we use crack in production"
<yorickpeterse> or "we have tranny installed"
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<yorickpeterse> oh dear, co-worker raging on JS
<yorickpeterse> better intervene before a computer goes out of the window
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<zzak> imperator: wow, congrats!
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<imperator> zzak, thanks!
<banisterfiend> what's the good news? :)
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<imperator> i got a haircut
<banisterfiend> \o/
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<imperator> oh, that too
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<zzak> :D
<zzak> imperator: thank you for helping improve windows support in ruby!
<imperator> you're welcome!
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<psihius> Hi, is here someone actually developing the ruby? I think I've found a bug
<psihius> that makes no sense
<breakingthings> developing the rubies
<psihius> I'm trying to setup a redmine app, all is good, everything launches
<psihius> but when I try to access it - it just connects and hangs with no response
<psihius> I've made an strace on the process
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<psihius> need someone to look at it and say is there a bug or i'm just an idiot
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<Technodrome> self automatically receives message that don't have an explicit receiver: , what does this exactly mean here?
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<[spoiler]> Technodrome: `hello` is the same as `self.hello`
<[spoiler]> if there's no explicit receiver defined, it will be implied that you're sending to `self` of the current context
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<Technodrome> [spoiler]: i thought main would be the receiver here?
<[spoiler]> Technodrome: main is the "root self" of a ruby script
<[spoiler]> here's an example
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<Technodrome> meep is the receiver here correct?
<[spoiler]> yup
<[spoiler]> but look at lines 7 and 8
<Technodrome> yes self is Meep
<[spoiler]> they do the same thing, basically
<[spoiler]> self (inside a method) is the instance of a Meep
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<Technodrome> self.awesomeness in that case is like a class method almost
<[spoiler]> Do you mean a singleton method of the Meep class?
<[spoiler]> it's not, though
<[spoiler]> self inside a method block referes to the object which is an instance of meep, but "direct" self inside a class block refers to the class
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<[spoiler]> Here's an example: https://eval.in/private/1f2df1f442028d
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<[spoiler]> the first puts will print Class because `Meep` is an instance of `Class`
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<[spoiler]> the second self will print Meep because the object's an instance of `Meep`
<[spoiler]> ping Technodrome
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<rchar> a
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<yorickpeterse> b
<mistym> c
<yorickpeterse> z
<mistym> A
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<yorickpeterse> meh, people rehashing the same conference talk over and over and over again
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<Technodrome> [spoiler]: ah, i think i got it now :)
<Technodrome> i really appreciate your explanation
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<[spoiler]> Technodrome: np :)
<Technodrome> [spoiler]: how long you been using ruby?
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<[spoiler]> Technodrome: well, hard to answer. Probably a little under a year?
<[spoiler]> i'd say between 6 and 8 months of properly using ruby
<[spoiler]> I've been interested in it before that, though
<Technodrome> i started using it way back in say 2004 or what not , but been using Python since
<[spoiler]> Oh, I've never been much into python
<[spoiler]> I tried it, but I fell in love with ruby
<wnd> I haven't looked back to python after trying ruby for the first time
<[spoiler]> wnd: same
<wnd> ruby just makes sense
<[spoiler]> wnd: ruby just rubys
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<Technodrome> what happened to me
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<Technodrome> ruby is so much better than python :(
<yorickpeterse> __init__(self):
<yorickpeterse> lol()
<Technodrome> i hate the __something__ stuff as well
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<toretore> like __send__
<yorickpeterse> Personally I enjoy the hypocrisy of PEP8/stdlib
<yorickpeterse> e.g. urllib and urllib2
<yorickpeterse> and 2.6/2.7 having two logger libraries last time I checked, though I'm not sure if that's still the case
<yorickpeterse> and packaging
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<yorickpeterse> fuck
<yorickpeterse> python
<yorickpeterse> packaging
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<rchar> my favorite python class is LifoQueue
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<Technodrome> there is multiple reasons to like Ruby more than Python
<Technodrome> and a few for Python as well
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<Technodrome> they're pretty obvious and reflect the reality and the culture of both camps
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<zerokarmaleft> https://gist.github.com/zerokarmaleft/7256791 <= trying to mock out the std i/o streams to test against HighLine in RSpec, and I'm oddly finding the input stream exhausted when it should be at pos 0 when the assertion fails
<zerokarmaleft> if I inspect the input with pry, it actually is at pos 0
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<zzak> yorickpeterse: i need to get a wireless HHK
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<yorickpeterse> why a wireless one?
<yorickpeterse> the cable isn't that bad
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<yorickpeterse> http://www.techempower.com/benchmarks/#section=data-r7&hw=i7&test=db interesting to see that Ruby is slow but apparently has a pretty good latency
<yorickpeterse> wonder what's up with that
<yorickpeterse> oh, it's just the DB latency
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<[spoiler]> yorickpeterse: I'm surprised Lua's so high, actually? Am I missing something? :s
<yorickpeterse> Lua is pretty fast actually
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<[spoiler]> I'm looking at Lua right now
<[spoiler]> I always thought it's like ruby in terms of performance
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<Technodrome> those are so unreliable it seems
<Technodrome> asp.net mvc getting near ruby speeds is nuts
<yorickpeterse> [spoiler]: luaJit is supposedly amazingly fast
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<yorickpeterse> is that a US thing?
<yorickpeterse> "HERE COME WORK FOR US WE'LL GIVE YOU 1% OF OUR COMPANY"
* yorickpeterse grumbles
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<[spoiler]> yorickpeterse: "Hi, we pay you with 0.1% of our worthless shit"
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<yorickpeterse> well at least you're the 99%
<Technodrome> stock options are quite common these days yorickpeterse
<athaeryn> anyone know why this doesn't work? http://vpaste.net/KeyMB
<yorickpeterse> I'd rather have money, I can actually buy my groceries with that
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<Technodrome> you can sell your stock options yorickpeterse
<yorickpeterse> athaeryn: what exactly doesn't work?
<yorickpeterse> Technodrome: ....no shit
<Technodrome> i sold mine at my last job
<yorickpeterse> you're missing the point I think
<athaeryn> yorickpeterse: it's rendering "<a href=\"\"></a>"
<Technodrome> yorickpeterse: they can come into handy
<Technodrome> i sold mine for around 50k
<Technodrome> it wasn't just like few hundred dollars you were implying :P
<yorickpeterse> young startups tend not to be worth a lot for the first few years
<Technodrome> usually got to work there 2-3 years to sell them
<yorickpeterse> so unless you intend to stay for a long time I don't think it would gain you a lot
<yorickpeterse> Of course there are some exceptions, but they are that: exceptions
<Technodrome> so get a good salary >120k and some nice stock options, in 2 years you can leave that year making 170k or so
<yorickpeterse> Either way, it's pretty interesting to see how different NL is compared to the US (as far as I know at least)
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<yorickpeterse> also 120k is insanely large for here
<drbrain> don't forget that the VC investors get special shares that are worth several of the employee shares and get cashed out first if the company tanks
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<Technodrome> yorickpeterse: you're jumping to conclusions on how it works and their worth, of course if the company doesn't do good, it won't be good , but for many people it works out
<Technodrome> very true drbrain but they usually are the ones who made it possible in the first place
<yorickpeterse> tl;dr I prefer having money at the end of the month, every month, without having to go through stock bs
<Technodrome> yorickpeterse: 120 seems to be the number most experienced people "shoot for"
<Technodrome> you will get the same salary either way, the stock option is a bonus
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<yorickpeterse> I think if you shoot for that here you'll get laughed at unless it's some really big company
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<Technodrome> there is plenty of people that work here doing programming for 70-100 as well yorickpeterse , but i'm saying that's what most people shoot for
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<Technodrome> yorickpeterse: but some people get even more lucky, like the instagram guys etc, literally have 20 or so employees make a quick 100k or so
<Technodrome> or even more
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<yorickpeterse> like I said, the exceptions
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<Technodrome> yorickpeterse: no, the exceptions are where you get real lucky, if the company grows as usual you will still make out a lot better than not having it
<Technodrome> like i said though, its completely separate from salary
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<Technodrome> its not like you get paid 100 and stock options or 120 and without, its 120 with or without
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<Technodrome> [spoiler]: why does that puts just in a class all by itself get executed?
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<drbrain> Technodrome: puts is Kernel#puts which lives everywhere
<[spoiler]> Technodrome: because it's insie a class definition, it's part of the class "creation" proces
<Technodrome> i mean why is it executed though?
<[spoiler]> process
<[spoiler]> it's not a sub-routine, like a method
<[spoiler]> attr_accessor and the likes
<[spoiler]> are just functions
<[spoiler]> or methods, if you will, that
<[spoiler]> take keys as parameters
<[spoiler]> erm
<[spoiler]> symbols
<Technodrome> so anything in the class that is not in a method gets executed on object creation?
<Technodrome> i guess it makes sense
<[spoiler]> no, it gets executed as soon as it's ready to be executed (as soon as it's "parsed," i guess)
<Technodrome> oh
<[spoiler]> there's a special method `initialize` that gets executed on object creation
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<[spoiler]> >> class Poop; puts "hello world"; end
<eval-in> [spoiler] => hello world ... (https://eval.in/59295)
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<Technodrome> [spoiler]: yeah, i understand initialize, its just a normal java constructor or __init__ in python
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<drbrain> Technodrome: the class body is just a pile of code
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<drbrain> just like top level
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<[spoiler]> ^
<drbrain> it just has a different self
<Technodrome> yes
<Technodrome> interesting
<[spoiler]> Technodrome: have you ever used `attr_accessor :foo, :bar`?
<Technodrome> yes
<Technodrome> they just add methods to the class like almost a get/set 'er
<[spoiler]> that's just like `puts`, basically
<[spoiler]> just a method
<[spoiler]> thaty gets called
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<Technodrome> that gets called and adds methods to the class
<[spoiler]> it's not some special ruby keyword
<Technodrome> ?
<[spoiler]> yeah
<Technodrome> yeah i thought it was just a method
<Technodrome> didn't think of when it was called though
<Technodrome> now it makes sense , its setup at parse time
<[spoiler]> well, loosely speaking, yeah
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<Technodrome> [spoiler]: what's loose? :)
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<[spoiler]> well, stuff happens in between execution and parsing, but its too obscure & beyond my ability to explain
<[spoiler]> or even fully understand :P
<Technodrome> so you just can't do self.x = "this" in a class?
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<whitequark> no, not at parsing time.
<whitequark> class or method definitions and, say, method bodies are executed in exactly same way
<whitequark> so when you run the file, it just goes from top to bottom, executing everything it encounters
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<Technodrome> whitequark: why can't you do just self.variable = 10 in a class?
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<whitequark> because self.variable = 10 is a syntax for calling a method "variable=" with argument "10" on "self"
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<whitequark> unless you define it, there's no such method.
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<Technodrome> whitequark: its going to take me a little to realize that there is no such thing as a "property" in the sense of python in ruby
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<[spoiler]> whitequark: method definitions are not executed the same as class definitions, or are they? Because if that were the case, then this shouldn't work: https://eval.in/private/c6c573b2dc5116
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<[spoiler]> Technodrome: sure there are properties, you just need to make getters and setters for them :)
<Technodrome> yeah
<[spoiler]> Also, you can play with method_missing to achieve the JS-like property behaviour
<Technodrome> [spoiler]: in a way you could say its more Java like than java
<Technodrome> what is ruby is like "typeof" in ruby?
<Technodrome> err js
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<[spoiler]> .class
<[spoiler]> can work
<toretore> obj.is_a?(Klass)
<[spoiler]> toretore: it's not the same as JS's `typeof`
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<toretore> js doesn't have class inheritance
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<toretore> so it is
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<toretore> neither is actually like typeof, but they're both similar to it
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<whitequark> [spoiler]: they are
<whitequark> so first a class Meep is defined, then a method "a" is defined, then a method "b" is defined
<whitequark> then you create an instance of Meep and call "a" on it, both methods are already defined at that point.
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<[spoiler]> whitequark: but, method a calls method b inside of it. the way you said it sounded like there'd be an error when "b" was encountered inside of a
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<Technodrome> if i make a quick function in the global space, and i call .class on it, why do i get "NilClass" nothing is int it ,but still?
<whitequark> because empty statements implicitly return nil
<whitequark> >>
<eval-in> whitequark => nil (https://eval.in/59307)
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<toretore> you're not calling class on the method, you're calling it on whatever the method returns, which is nil
<Technodrome> how can i get the type of it (method) without running the function?
<Technodrome> yes
<[spoiler]> method(:method_name).class
<[spoiler]> >> def a; end; method(:a)
<eval-in> [spoiler] => #<Method: Object#a> (https://eval.in/59309)
<Technodrome> yep
<Technodrome> thank you
<Technodrome> does ruby have that smalltalk thing?
<Technodrome> where i can call like
<Technodrome> Object method1; method2; method3; method4
<Technodrome> but each following method doesn't operate on the return type, it just sends it directly to Object
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<[spoiler]> erm. I don't think so. At least I never encountered it
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<Technodrome> i forget what smalltalk calls that operation
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<whitequark> it doesn't
<whitequark> because in smalltalk that would be a single method called method1:method2:method3:method4
<drbrain> it sounds more like the VB with
<[spoiler]> Technodrome: you could allow it by returning self. So, object.one.two.whee
<whitequark> drbrain: in smalltalk, you can interleave method name and actual parameters
<whitequark> it's weird
<drbrain> whitequark: yeah, I know
<drbrain> I've never heard of Object method1; method2; method3; method4 (semicolons) in smalltalk
<Technodrome> drbrain: have you used smalltalk quite a bit? I might be wrong, but back when i used it quite a bit i remember doing something very similar
<Technodrome> but its been years
<Technodrome> but a semi colon was involved somehow i think :)
<Technodrome> i don't think it was just colons
<drbrain> Technodrome: I haven't. The semicolons would be the same as: Object method1. Object method2. Object method3. Object method4 ⁇
<Technodrome> yes
<Technodrome> it was just shorthand pretty much
<drbrain> ah, here we go
<drbrain> "cascade"
<[spoiler]> drbrain: that's a weird questionmark
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<[spoiler]> "⁇"
<drbrain> just above "Code blocks"
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<drbrain> [spoiler]: DOUBLE QUESTION MARK‼
<mistym> [spoiler]: ‽
<[spoiler]> WAT IS THIS
<[spoiler]> I had no idea these even existed
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<[spoiler]> is this sorcery? wotfok
<whitequark> this is unicode⸘
<drbrain> [spoiler]: ↑ ☺
<[spoiler]> :(
<[spoiler]> How do you even type those, though
<drbrain> I use OS X text replacements
<drbrain> find them in character viewer
<Technodrome> drbrain: yep cascade
<[spoiler]> Oh. I'm just a humble windows user
<Technodrome> that's it
<Technodrome> smalltalk guys love those things
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<Technodrome> i liked them as well :P
<drbrain> on windows there's probably an alt+numpad sequence to type it
<[spoiler]> i have a "character chart" in my client
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<[spoiler]> Ü happy U!
<whitequark> I use X11 compose key
<[spoiler]> Ю < this is actually hangul, why is hangul in the character chart
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<drbrain> on OS X some of the extended punctuation is available from through ⌥ (like EM DASH — or ELLIPSIS …)
<whitequark> Ю? hangul?! that's cyrillic
<[spoiler]> no wait, it's not hangul, hangul one
<[spoiler]> is the other way around
<[spoiler]> yeah, hangul one's "O-|"
<Technodrome> cyrillic , stay away!
<whitequark> кириллица *g*
<[spoiler]> ♪OMG A NOTE SYMBOL
<[spoiler]> i need to google unicode icons now
<mistym> And of course if your font supports it there's emoji
<[spoiler]> oh, it doesn't :/
<[spoiler]> I use a monospacefont
<mistym> Your life is made poorer by the lack of a moon viewing ceremony glyph
<drbrain> OS X borrows glyphs from other fonts
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<Technodrome> ᚅᚊᚖᚕᚙᚏ
<Technodrome> can you guys see that?
<drbrain> so while I use Source Code Pro in my terminal and IRC client, I still see emoji
<[spoiler]> they look like domines to me
<drbrain> I would think windows would do the same
<Technodrome> its my native language [spoiler]
<mistym> drbrain: Linux definitely does the same at least
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<Technodrome> ah no , not that
<drbrain> Technodrome: I can see it, but google translate doesn't know what it says
<Technodrome> probably doesn't translate it
<drbrain> Technodrome: so you're a time traveler?
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<Technodrome> no i'm just kidding
<drbrain> Wikipedia says "Ogham: Time periodc. 4th–10th centuries"
<Technodrome> but its still in alphabet that is in use in certain sectors
<Technodrome> still widely used in celtic academia and writing