Topic for #ruby-lang is now Ruby 1.9.3p0: http://ruby-lang.org | Paste >3 Lines of Text on http://pastie.org
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<zenspider> wmoxam: what'd I miss?
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<zenspider> br1an: you might want to look at reek
<br1an> oddmunds: zenspider thanks! in another chat, but will look at b oth of those...
<br1an> appreciate it, and may be back in a few to discuss more if you're both still here!
<oddmunds> we're always here because we are not people
<zenspider> speak for yourself... I'm a people
<lake> can anyone here point me in a direction for doing TDD with qt/ruby via qtbindings?
<lake> i wasn't able to find any good examples on teh githubz
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<rue> zenspider: You missed, apparently, someone trolling #ruby
<oddmunds> i rushed to #ruby to see the trolling, but i think i missed it too.
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<rue> Sad
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<wmoxam> zenspider: a flood
<wmoxam> :p
<wmoxam> zenspider: placker@182.7.10.55, I think he was just kicked, not banned
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<rippa> soo
<rue> Harasoo
<rippa> jruby is now 3 times faster?
<rippa> Compared to JRuby on Java 6, JRuby on Java 7 without invokedynamic is around 25% faster, and JRuby with invokedynamic is nearly 3 times faster.
<rue> Weeell, on *certain* benches
<rue> It's not 3x across the board. I think the figures quoted were something like 5-10% from JVM6->7 alone though
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<ryanf> has anyone done benchmarks against mri?
<ryanf> apparently headius is too polite to publicize his
<rue> I'd like to see some test suite runs, and real-world apps!
<rue> Working on it, actually…
<drbrain> ryanf: make benchmark
<drbrain> ryanf: you can run make benchmark with any two ruby implementations
<ryanf> oh cool
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<ksinkar> is there any way to find a date nearest to the given date from a set of dates in ruby?
<manveru> ksinkar: sure
<manveru> >> [Date.new(2011,1,1), Date.new(2011,6,1), Date.new(2011,12,31)].min_by{|d| (Date.new(2011,4,1) - d).abs }
<manveru> => #<Date: 2011-06-01 ((2455714j,0s,0n),+0s,2299161j)>
<rippa> ksinkar: also don't crospost
<rippa> *ss
<manveru> crosspost?
<rippa> #ruby/#ruby-lang
<manveru> why are you in #ruby?
<rippa> why not
<manveru> because you have to complain about crossposting?
<molgrew> to catch a cross-poster
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<josh9> is it a good practise to raise an exception when attempting to instantiate my class without the required parameter?
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<tobiasvl> josh9: yeah
<tobiasvl> ArgumentError is raised by default i think?
<molgrew> odd wording, you get that for free, don't you
<josh9> tobiasvl: ArgumentError: wrong number of arguments (0 for 1) i guess so..
<josh9> i guess all i need is to add it to my minitest.
<josh9> i think it's assert_throws.. trying it now
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<josh9> assert_throws ArgumentError do; User.new; end this is not working..anyone can demonstrate how to use assert_throws?
<josh9> according to the source code the first argument should be a symbol. not sure what kind of symbol though.
<molgrew> errors are raised, something else, which escapes me at the moment, is thrown
<molgrew> assert_throws is not the right method here
<tobiasvl> molgrew: exceptions?
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<josh9> ok. so how do i test that an exception was raised?
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<josh9> assert_raises(*exp)
<molgrew> 'exceptions' seem to be it
<tobiasvl> catch it
<josh9> yeah. now it's working. i am a bit confuse with the difference between exceptions and errors.
<josh9> and maybe it's about time to read his 'Exceptional Ruby'
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<josh9> ok. here is the TLDR of that post: begin/raise/rescue is used for errors. catch/throw is used for terminating the execution when there is no more work to be done (nested loops is a good usecase).
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<shevy> josh9 hmm... but can't you do the same as catch throw does by using begin/rescue/raise/ensure ?
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<darix> shevy: i think the catch values over multiple loops/function calls might be tough with begin/rescue/raise/ensure
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<rue> catch/throw does make some things easier
<rue> And strictly speaking, error handling should be just that, not flow control
<rue> But all that said, josh9, catch/throw should be used extremely judiciously
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<imperator2> a.slice('1'.to_sym) => TypeError
<imperator2> a.slice!('1'.to_sym) => nil
<imperator2> wtf?
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<rue> imperator2: Not in .3
<imperator2> rue, what?
<rue> It's a TypeError in both cases in 1.9.3
<rippa> yes
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<imperator2> oic, thanks
<rue> An odd error, though
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<Jake232> I'm just looking an Rubinius, and wondering
<Jake232> What disadvantages does it have to MRI?
<Jake232> I can only find advntages
<Jake232> Besides a very small amount of gems being incompatible.
<nuclearsandwich> Jake232: Ruby 1.9 support isn't there yet.
<nuclearsandwich> and it still has odd performance characteristics in some places MRI doesn't.
<rippa> and doesn't work on wondows
<nuclearsandwich> rippa: that's okay, neither do I. :D
<nuclearsandwich> But yeah, Windows support dropped behind and I hope they pick it up again.
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<Jake232_> As per usual, ask a question
<Jake232_> and my internet drops off
<Jake232> nuclearsandwich: I'm new to Ruby, but wasn't the actual main difference between 1.8 and 1.9
<Jake232> a speed increase?
<Jake232> And in which case, Rubinus would out-perform anyway
<nuclearsandwich> Yes and No.
<nuclearsandwich> Ruby 1.9 introduces new syntax for a number of things
<nuclearsandwich> changes the standard library some
<nuclearsandwich> and adds Encodings to String
<Jake232> Hmm
<nuclearsandwich> which is one of the biggest changes the Rubinius team still has to implement.
<nuclearsandwich> petercooper has a Ruby 1.9 walkthrough
<nuclearsandwich> that goes through all the differences in detail.
<Jake232> Alright thanks, I'll take a read
<nuclearsandwich> Jake232: alas, it is a video. And I believe it costs money.
<Jake232> Just noticed that
<Jake232> May not be worth it for me haha, seeing as though I never even learnt Ruby 1.8
<nuclearsandwich> Not sure how much, I got it as the coda to his Ruby Reloaded course.
<Jake232> 1.9 was out when I started.
<nuclearsandwich> Probably not at this time.
<nuclearsandwich> I actually found it really useful because I had to go back and update a 1.8 app. I was able to apply the walkthrough in reverse essentially.
<Jake232> I would imagine there werent all that many changes though
<nuclearsandwich> When I started out 1.8.7 was still recommended and 1.9.1 was causing segfaults in Rails. It was jolly good fun.
<Jake232> new functions will have been added for convinience etc
<Jake232> But I'd imagine 95%+ is exactly the same as it was, but maybe I'm wrong ;)
<manveru> finally! the next generation is here :D
<nuclearsandwich> sure, 95% is probably the same
<nuclearsandwich> but the corner-case semantics have all been tweaked.
<nuclearsandwich> the behavior of Proc.new, proc, and lambda...
<Mon_Ouie> The changes to the String class are far from corner-cases I think
<nuclearsandwich> Mon_Ouie: I mentioned the total changes Encodings brought above. Sorry.
<nuclearsandwich> but those changes are also pretty transparent if you're new to Ruby entirely.
<nuclearsandwich> Encodings haven't really bit me in the face yet. Then again... any place they might've, benevolent library maintainers have kindly updated their work for me. So I'm probably insulated.
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<infid> if jruby is faster than ruby and gives you more libraries and interoperability to other languages, is there any real good reason to not be using it?
<heftig> starts much slower
<heftig> higher memory usage
<robgleeson> if you need Kernel#fork, ObjectSpace.each_object, …
<robgleeson> but yeah, JRuby is solid, and a good choice if you don't have dependencies on those two things.
<shevy> infid it requires java too as far as I know
<heftig> jruby is ruby for java, I wouldn't use it as a replacement for cruby
<bougyman> depends on the usage.
<robgleeson> it's not just that
<robgleeson> it's Ruby on the JVM
<bougyman> for a long-running process, jruby can have advantages over cruby
<manveru> if you c extentions
<nuclearsandwich> JRuby also has real threads, which if you have naive concurrency may cause terrible things to happen to you.
<manveru> *if you use c extensions
<robgleeson> manveru: hey, they have C API support now :p
<robgleeson> not sure how good it is, though
<shevy> C API support?
<Mon_Ouie> Worked well enough for me
<manveru> heh
<bougyman> is jruby fully 1.9 yet?
<Jake232> nuclearsandwich: But if you use it correctly, it can be great
<Jake232> :)
<nuclearsandwich> Exactly
<manveru> bougyman: no
<bougyman> well there's the killer, then.
<shevy> rubinius ain't either!
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<manveru> bougyman: actually, it is much better now
<manveru> i haven't tested 1.6.5 yet
<Jake232> I suppose it depends whether your primary concern is easy of use / quick development time
<Jake232> or speed.
<shevy> ruby & speed? :D
<Jake232> Although if speed is a major concern, you probably wouldn't be using Ruby
<bougyman> depends.
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<shevy> haven't you heard of "The Ruby Tribute Minute" before
<bougyman> speed, to me, includes development time.
<bougyman> how quick to get from concept to product. runtime can always be optimized after that.
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<Jake232> bougyman: It can, but using Ruby limits how much difference optimization makes.
<bougyman> Jake232: i haven't found that to be much of a factor in data-heavy applications.
<bougyman> the data source is generally the bottleneck, there.
<Jake232> I've only ever developed in "slow" langauges anyway, PHP, Python and Ruby
<Jake232> So Ruby doesn't seem slow to me at all ;)
<infid> Jake232: then you must have only ever been using one type of hardware, because hardware makes all the difference on languages like those
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<sh1nji> hi, im a fairly new web developer working with a ruby based app using postgresql, when I try to have it access the db, do a query to pull a specific attribute for a table, and then display it in a haml page...unfortunately when i do all that, it doesn't display the number value, instead its a "#"
<manveru> did you inspect the source?
<manveru> the html source ,that is
<sh1nji> hmm
<sh1nji> let me see
<bougyman> you probably have an object.
<bougyman> what db layer are you using, and what web publishing method?
<Jake232> infid: hardware makes a difference with every language doesn't it?
<Jake232> However I think no matter what hardware you were running, you'd have a pretty good arguement stating that ruby was relatively "slow".
<sh1nji> i looked at the source and didn't see anything other than just "#"
<Jake232> But it's still more than fast enough for most tasks.
<Jake232> sh1nji: What are you trying to display? As bougyman says, you're likely trying to output the whole object
<sh1nji> im using postgresql
<Jake232> rather than a attribute of it
<bougyman> sh1nji: can you show us your source you're using for this?
<sh1nji> an attribute from a table
<infid> Jake232: well, you'd have a weak argument saying it's "slow" without saying what it's slow at, it's fast with development time. But I know what you meant
<sh1nji> let me get the source
<manveru> there are lots of bounds... if you happen to be I/O bound, a better language won't help much
<Jake232> infid: Most dynamic languages are awesome for development time, they do pretty much everything which could be classed as low-level for you
<infid> in my view, developer time is part of execution performance since if i could have ran my ruby program 5000 times before you finished even developing your C app, I win (for now, or maybe forever if launch date was the most important factor)
<Jake232> But I think that's most probably why they are slow.
<infid> Jake232: yeah but i could equally say that dynamic languages suck because there's no type checking to help prevent bugs
<Jake232> The one thing I've noticed with Ruby, that seems to suck
<Jake232> is the fact the GUI's seem to not be Ruby's thing
<infid> there are some hybrid languages
<Jake232> they all seem to suck
<Jake232> and have problems
<manveru> hehe
<manveru> tk ftw
<infid> i wish there was a one-true-web language. Funny thing is, flash was that and we killed it
<infid> now we're back to needing 3-5 languages to set up a web page
<infid> well java applets were that even better and we killed those too
<manveru> you can do it with one if you use lisp or smalltalk :)
<Mon_Ouie> Web pages that used flash for all the content always sucked
<Jake232> Flash sucks
<shevy> hmm
<shevy> it depends
<infid> i'm not saying it was done right, just that it was moving toward uniformity
<bougyman> infid: urweb accomplishes that.
<shevy> I say 80% suck not 100%
<bougyman> you write everything in ML
<Jake232> Well, it has it's purpose, but not for the whole site.
<bougyman> it compiles the js and manages longpoll/request-cycles, all that.
<shevy> infid - problem is, as with everything, things won't get simpler and easier. there will be more and more languages rather than just one to describe it all
<infid> bougyman: apparently not if i've never heard of it and i imagine most people haven't :p
<Jake232> Like now, people are starting to develop games etc, in HTML 5 / JS, and Flash can achieve the same thing, if not better.
<bougyman> infid: just because you haven't heard of it doesn't make it so.
<shevy> damn javascript
<rue> Lol Flash
<Jake232> I don't think Flash should be forgotten and avoided, it was just getting used for the wrong purpose.
<bougyman> infid: it does just that, in fact.
<rue> Jake232: Yes, the internet
<infid> bougyman: well hopefully it'll catch on then
<rue> Flash is perfectly fine in the privacy of your own home
<bougyman> infid: doesn't mean I'd want to use it :)
<manveru> anything that can be, will be abused :)
<shevy> yeah
<bougyman> it looks good on you, though :)
<rippa> flash is widely used in games
<shevy> give someone a feature and they will suddenly rip your whole leg out of you
<rippa> for interface
<rippa> via Scaleform
<shevy> I am playing some flash browsergames
<infid> abuse is a negative way of saying "pushing to its limits" :p
<shevy> it's so lala, medium fun...
<rippa> for example in Skyrim interface is in Flash
<Jake232> Still need to purchase Skyrim.
<shevy> when flash was new, I was a big fan. I even used macromedia flash for a while to create small stuppid flash things... a moving ball that kinda exploded in red after a while
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<shevy> and a mouse that chased after cheese
<manveru> i used swich to make an awesome flash intro for my page in 2002 or so... it ate your cpu for breakfast :)
<Jake232> I once made a flash game, for a local university
<manveru> *swish
<infid> i was big on flash in those days too, treated javascript with the same contempt that i know treat flash and adore javascript
<Jake232> It sucked hard, but they didn't pay for it, so what can they expect
<Jake232> ;)
<infid> what a funny concept that happened back then, that people believed that javascript would be disabled most of the time yet flash would run everywhere
<Jake232> ^ My awesome game
<shevy> hmmm
<shevy> if I could just use ruby to create flash games
<Spooner> I use Ruby to make Flash-quality games. Nearly works :D
<rue> Wasn't there a Ruby->Flash bridge?
<shevy> hehe Spooner
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<Spooner> I'm wondering if something like NaCl is the answer, because I am getting annoyed with all the cross-platform woes and making people download :(
<Jake232> Well, I need food, so I shall return later!
<Jake232> Cya
<infid> i'm glad that there's finally a new huge platform to make a living developing for than the crummy web: mobile phones. I just wish it wasn't even less fun to develop for, ugh.
<infid> where consumers want to go often seems to not be where people who enjoy programming also want to go
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* jaimef hunts for a way to process multiline record output.
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<rue> Be vewy vewy qwiet
<jaimef> :P
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<jaimef> multiline wecords, not wabbits
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<chris2> is nathaniel talbott here?
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<aarkerio> hi! I am a PHP developer trying to learn Ruby,
<aarkerio> what is the equivalent in ruby to: die(var_dump($foo_hash));
<aarkerio> I mean to debug a hash or an array
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<imperator> puts hash.inspect
<imperator> or: p hash for the short version
<aarkerio> thanks!
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<aarkerio> using:
<aarkerio> {:first=>'John', :middle=>'M.', :last=>'Smith'}.each do |g| p 'String 1 ' + ' String 2'+" #{g} " end
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<aarkerio> "String 1 String 2 middleM. "
<aarkerio> how can I puts only the value and not the key?
<aarkerio> I mean:
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<aarkerio> "String 1 String 2 M. "
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<any-key> h.values?
<any-key> where h is your hash
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<aarkerio> puts => ["M.", "Smith", "John"]
<aarkerio> but not
<aarkerio> "String 1 String 2 M. "
<aarkerio> and so
<any-key> I'm confused.
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<aarkerio> my hash is : {:first=>'John', :middle=>'M.', :last=>'Smith'}
<aarkerio> I want to print "first is John"
<any-key> ah
<any-key> h.each { |k,v| puts "#{k.to_s} is #{v}" }
<aarkerio> perfect!!
<aarkerio> thanks
<any-key> forget the .to_s
<any-key> you don't need it
<aarkerio> BT: h.each { |k,v| puts "#{k.to_s} is #{v}" }
<aarkerio> and
<aarkerio> h.each do |k,v| puts "#{k.to_s} is #{v}" end
<aarkerio> are the same thing right?
<any-key> yes
<any-key> both are blocks
<aarkerio> cool
<Mon_Ouie> { … } and do … end have different precedence
<Mon_Ouie> foo bar { block_1 } do block_2 end # block_1 is passed to bar, block_2 is passed to foo
<aarkerio> mmm, let me google for a tutorial, thanks pals!
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<aarkerio> why this is incorrect?
<aarkerio> {:first=>'John', :middle=>'M.', :last=>'Smith'}.each(do |x g| p 'String 1 ' + ' String 2'+" #{g}" end)
<aarkerio> but:
<aarkerio> {:first=>'John', :middle=>'M.', :last=>'Smith'}.each do |x g| p 'String 1 ' + ' String 2'+" #{g}" end
<aarkerio> is correct
<aarkerio> I think each is a method
<any-key> aarkerio: you need a comma between x and g
<any-key> and you can pass in a proc as an argument, but you're using a block which is not the same thing
<burgestrand> aarkerio: blocks are passed outside the argument list
<burgestrand> aarkerio: thingy.each() do |*args| end
<andrewhl> is there a method for finding the highest number in a hash?
<aarkerio> mmm, I will need read the ruby API
<aarkerio> thanks again
<burgestrand> aarkerio: unless you’re sending in an object you can convert into a proc (and in effect also a block), in which case you can do thingy.each(&object_responding_to_to_proc)
<andrewhl> or an array
<burgestrand> andrewhl: array.max
<andrewhl> thanks
<shevy> array.to_infinity
<shevy> array.to_infinity!!!!
<shevy> AND BEYOND
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<shevy> <OmniMancer> python works on haiku
<shevy> :(
<shevy> why ruby does not work!
<shevy> WHY!
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<zenspider> haiku meaning beos?
<zenspider> shevy: ^
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<Jake232> Seems quiet in here tonight
<zenspider> tonight?!? that's because it is daytime!
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<yxhuvud> zenspider: no, it's 00:00.
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<zenspider> nuh uh
<JosephRuby> :D
<zenspider> JosephRuby: treetop is slower
<JosephRuby> :(
<zenspider> I'm still reading...
<JosephRuby> That was my next course of action.
<zenspider> you're not actually using strscanner tho... and you're manipulating the string for some reason
<zenspider> and your indentation is wrong and it makes it harder to read
<JosephRuby> I tried strscanner going to custom string manip was about 50% faster
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<zenspider> I guarantee that modifying the string is slower than not modifying the strintg
<zenspider> string
<JosephRuby> the indentation on the gist or on stack?
<zenspider> stack
<JosephRuby> strscanner makes a dup of the string then modifies the duped copy
<yxhuvud> also, wouldn't it be a lot faster to match all regexen at once instead of looping?
<zenspider> strscanner doesn't modify the string
<JosephRuby> yxhuvud: that was one of my questions.
<zenspider> strscanner w/o modification will be a much faster route to take
<zenspider> tabs? really?
<zenspider> Hash[[[":)" , "happily"], [":(" , "sadly"]]] ?/
<zenspider> wtf is that?
<zenspider> where w = "why"
<zenspider> I can almost guarantee that gsub! is 80% of your problem
<zenspider> doesn't even make sense in some of the places you're using it
<zenspider> 80+%
<JosephRuby> zenspider: ty for the input, will do it in strscan again gotta run fer now.
<yxhuvud> the loop over the input seems very suspekt as well. iterate over it, once.
<JosephRuby> back tomorrow
<zenspider> yxhuvud: he should get that by switching to strscanner
<yxhuvud> true
<zenspider> I just rebuilt my emacs IN my emacs process... um. I should prolly restart.
<zenspider> yay
<shevy> zenspider yeah, the "successor" to BeOS
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<zenspider> JosephRuby: you spend 12.38% of your time in gsub! alone
<Jake232> Whats the best way for me to creat my own client facing "markup language", and then parse it.
<Jake232> eg:
<zenspider> by reusing someone else's
<shevy> hehe
<Jake232> I want them to be able to enter :video(#http://youtube.com/example), and then parse it to a actual video
<Jake232> is regex too slow?
<Jake232> zenspider: Such as? ;)
<Jake232> I just want it to have basic ways, for them to add videos, and images
<Jake232> maybe a easy hyperlink method.
<zenspider> such as using markdown instead of making yet another
<zenspider> but... if you were to create your own. design a grammar for it, write a parser, generate an AST, and write visitors that walk the AST and translate it to other formats
<zenspider> that's the BEST way... which is what you asked for
<zenspider> the worst way is to use regexps
<Jake232> I'm guessing I can't do that, seeing as though I don't even know what AST is.
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<zenspider> JosephRuby: I'm already at 55% just by doing what I said last week: use the right tool for the job. You're not using hashes as hashes... at all.
<JosephRuby> zenspider: oyi, ty greatly for looking at the code, could I ask you to leave comments on either gist or SO? my coding time for today is over, I won't have time to really look at what you are suggesting right now.
<zenspider> I'm not sure I can fit any more comments into this overly commented code
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* jaimef ponders how to test for [nil]
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<zenspider> jaimef: what's to ponder?
<zenspider> 22% of the original
<zenspider> and I still haven't converted to strscanner
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<jaimef> https://gist.github.com/11ed8fae7010027b28b7 is how I am testing it.
<jaimef> just seems very unclean
<zenspider> why are you using a splat var anyways?
<zenspider> you can't pass [something] to grep anyways
<zenspider> so, def list_templates filter=nil
<zenspider> result = exec_on_dom0 "xe template-list"
<zenspider> result = result.grep(filter) if filter
<zenspider> end
<zenspider> result; end... sorry