<DocScrutinizer05>
and wpwrak is missing all the fun
<dos1>
hah, didn't notice that he left
<dos1>
wrote it here mainly for him :D
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<hellekin>
there was a storm. Maybe his connection was lost.
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<DocScrutinizer05>
I heard "brownout"
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2013-12-03 00:01:15] <wpwrak> have to quit for while and try to bring one of my graphics cards after the brownout ...
<DocScrutinizer05>
[2013-12-03 00:01:16] <-- wpwrak has left this server (Quit: Leaving).
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<sanderr>
DocScrutinizer0, doc1: Congrats with the 200-mark! And the slashdot article might even help reaching the 1000-mark.
<DocScrutinizer05>
hmm, don't see that happen yet, but sure it will help
<DocScrutinizer05>
I more hope for secondary articles triggered from /. - and most I hope for the chain reaction effect as described in https://blogs.fsfe.org/pboddie/?p=596
<DocScrutinizer05>
potential customers noticing that we reached 200, thus felling more "safe2 when they jump on the train as well
<DocScrutinizer05>
feeling*
<DocScrutinizer05>
psychology of the masses: "others were excited and joined, so why should't I, this MUST be something awesome"
<DocScrutinizer05>
you can even force this by spreading rumours about timelines approaching where it will "be too late"
<DocScrutinizer05>
but we won't do this yet
<DocScrutinizer05>
first we will showcase a fully working first prototype maybe february
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<sanderr>
DocScrutinizer05: That's how I got into the NanoNote.
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<DocScrutinizer05>
we might reach 500 til then. Then announce the window will close soon and open up true preorders, to catch up another maybe 500
<sanderr>
(I'm reading Paul's blog post for a bit)
<DocScrutinizer05>
it's nice
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<sanderr>
Indeed! I agree that the only sustainable way forward with freedom is with open hard- and software.
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<sanderr>
But the way you guys juggle electronics design and programming is way over my head. I only get 50-60% of it.
<sanderr>
Still, it's fun and interesting to learn.
<sanderr>
And I will do my part in promoting the project by pointing interested people to this initiative.
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<DocScrutinizer05>
thanks! :-)
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<DocScrutinizer05>
hehe, maybe I should mumble something like "of course those 350 1GB RAM chips will go to the first 350 preorders. Let's see if we can get more of them"
<whitequark>
DocScrutinizer05: btw is there any more certainty about particular component choices?
<whitequark>
like specific supported wifi/bt standards
<DocScrutinizer05>
no
<DocScrutinizer05>
we know we will use 320AIC34 audio mixer, P*S8 modem (probably), we know quite a bit about some sensors etc we'll use
<DocScrutinizer05>
but WLAN for example hasn't been a topic yet for evaluation and/or sourcing
<DocScrutinizer05>
in 3 months there might be better modules available than today
<whitequark>
I see
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<wpwrak>
aah, baaack ! for once, the brute-force miracle cure worked
<wpwrak>
(had one of my video cards not come up under X, so i was down from triple-head to single-head. it did this in the past but usually snapped out of it after a few reboots. but not this time. fortunately, a distribution upgrade cured this)
<wpwrak>
hmm, is it just me or is gitorious having problems ? (502 Bad Gateway)
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<paul_boddie>
wpwrak: gitorius looks OK to me, but it should be quite local to me, too.
<eintopf>
wpwrak: welcome back :)
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<wpwrak>
ah, now i can reach it, too. must have been a glitch.
<wpwrak>
(at the beginning it looks a bit like an sr-71 but it's a b-52)
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<wpwrak>
nicksydney: btw, the laser printer i use for toner transfer is an old hp lj 1320. they're some USD 100 on ebay. the toner transfer will contaminate the printer with time, so you don't want a "nice" one for that job
<wpwrak>
even better would be a lj 2100, c4170a. that's an even older model that worked even better. about the same price used.
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<DocScrutinizer05>
o.O
<DocScrutinizer05>
PCB etching?
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<wpwrak>
trying to get him hooked, yup :)
<DocScrutinizer05>
always a mess
<DocScrutinizer05>
I prefer spending a 50 bucks for a 160*100 dualside with via every day
<wpwrak>
you can't beat the processing time :)
<wpwrak>
finish design at 6 pm, print at 7, etch at 8, have the board smt'ed and running at 10 :)
<wpwrak>
takes a little longer if the board is very delicate since you have to do the two sides separately. but still. it's fast. especially if you don't have an affordable "next business day" pcb-making service in town
<DocScrutinizer05>
then rather mill than etch
<wpwrak>
too unreliable
<wpwrak>
hmm, can't find the pictures i took of one of those experiments :(
<rjeffries>
wpwrak maybe your work on bluetooth (when/IF it happens) might be leveraged by the Neo900 team? Evidently that product will not include wi-fi (it seems)
<wpwrak>
apparently, they will. but i don't know what module.
<wpwrak>
DocScrutinizer05: do you already have a list of wlan candidates ?
<DocScrutinizer05>
see feasibility study
<DocScrutinizer05>
page 14 iirc
<DocScrutinizer05>
meh, 18, or scrap that
<DocScrutinizer05>
we also might use wl1251/71
<DocScrutinizer05>
based modules
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<DocScrutinizer05>
known to work, somewhat
<DocScrutinizer05>
kernel drivers RE'ed and augmented to do injection and monitor
<DocScrutinizer05>
still closed blob firmware
<DocScrutinizer05>
afaik
<DocScrutinizer05>
wl1251 used in N900
<wpwrak>
but the kernel driver is open ?
<DocScrutinizer05>
yep, the re'ed one is
<DocScrutinizer05>
search for n900 injection driver
<DocScrutinizer05>
or somesuch
<DocScrutinizer05>
I bought it when they guy still asked for a donation
<DocScrutinizer05>
-y
<DocScrutinizer05>
so I dunno how it's called today
<DocScrutinizer05>
when it becomes available for aftermarket, it's already EOL
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<DocScrutinizer05>
:-/
<wpwrak>
ironically, mouser have it as "New Product: New from this manufacturer."
<wpwrak>
maybe this is the answer: "Special Note
<wpwrak>
TI no longer supports new WiLink6 software driver development. The LSR TiWi-BLE module is still an active product and supported by LSR."
<DocScrutinizer05>
yep
<DocScrutinizer05>
not too bad
<wpwrak>
mouser will get some on xmas :) more to arrive in february. nice lead times ;-)
<DocScrutinizer05>
be happy! ;-P
<DocScrutinizer05>
could be worse
<DocScrutinizer05>
nah, it seems there are a few choices now, yet to evaluate them all
<DocScrutinizer05>
211
<wpwrak>
i wonder how they get these lead times .. even if the factory was on the moon and they require cash first, the round-trip would only have about 10 weeks.
<DocScrutinizer05>
*shrug*
<DocScrutinizer05>
maybe they first need to build the factory?
<DocScrutinizer05>
no idea
<wpwrak>
hmm yes, drive a truck to the hinterlands and deliver a first batch of sticks and stones. wait until they master them. then proceed with simple metals ...
<paul_boddie>
Maybe that Chinese Lunar rover is scouting out places for factories.
<DocScrutinizer05>
you missed the /. fun
<wpwrak>
"Jade Rabbit Corp., 123 Dust Rd., Bay of Rainbows, Moon, PRC"
<wpwrak>
doesn't sound too different from today's names
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<rjeffries>
Will Neo900 support bluetooth? ideally, BTLE...
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<DocScrutinizer05>
BT sure, BTLE maybe, not yet decided
<wpwrak>
shortwave radio would also be nice. imagine "lost" if they had had that: pick up any cell phone, call the rescue services, leave it on to send a beacon, happy rescue a few hours later, let the NTSB worry about the technical details. all efficiently done in one episode
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<paul_boddie>
wpwrak: Spoiler alert!
<dos1>
Paul Boddie... Paul Boddie...
<dos1>
oh, you're that guy from the blog!
<paul_boddie>
Another spoiler: it's the same guy! ;-)
<paul_boddie>
But I have to blog about something.
<dos1>
wonderful posts about Neo900 and Nanonote, one of the best I've seen on the web
<paul_boddie>
Well, I knew I'd get into trouble if I got the details wrong. ;-)
<dos1>
very informative and to the point, thanks a lot :)
<paul_boddie>
Have you tried to get it onto LWN?
<dos1>
nope, but good suggestion
<paul_boddie>
It's worth a shot given that they had Improv featured a few days ago.
<wpwrak>
that's a nice idea ! lwn certainly draws a much more high-profile audience than slashdot
<paul_boddie>
Well, more high-brow is perhaps how I'd put it.
<wpwrak>
that works, too :)
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<wpwrak>
NickSydney: heya, still like the slider idea ?
<NickSydney>
yeah
<NickSydney>
sorry didn't get a chance to chat and look into the project as been troubleshooting issues with day job
<wpwrak>
let's see then what the list thinks about it
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<NickSydney>
wpwrak: the slider that i've seen in dev boards are capacitive sensor ... is that correct ?
<wpwrak>
btw, this would also be a nice sub-project to get started with experimenting with making PCBs and such :)
<wpwrak>
yes. lemme see if it can find a description of that design ...
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: the only issue with PCB making for me is the laser jet..which is next to impossible for me to buy :( as it's expensive financially for me
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: any other idea you can think of making your own PCB without laser jet ?
<wpwrak>
used laserjets are some USD 100
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: unless I make PCB via company like seeesstudio :)
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: used laserjet in this part of the world is VERY hard to get
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: let's see what i can come up with :)
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<NickSydney>
wpwrak: i find kicad harder to use than Eagle as newbie
<wpwrak>
bah, you can even find a used 1320 here. even only around USD 100. almost suspiciously low :)
<wpwrak>
i can't compare - never used eagle.
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: need to practise a bit with kicad
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<wpwrak>
hmm, freescale don't have any much material on touch sensor design :(
<wpwrak>
the section in the quick reference manual gives you an idea, though. dsv klqr then chapter 10, page 105
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: TI or Microchip ?
<NickSydney>
I've seen Microchip demo before if I remember correctly
<wpwrak>
freescale :)
<wpwrak>
but yes, all the vendors have somethign :)
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<NickSydney>
say for example you go ahead and add touch...will that means there will extra chip for that ?
<NickSydney>
or we can hook it up using the available pin on M0
<wpwrak>
the kl25 has a touch sensor controller. it's all in my post :)
<wpwrak>
and if you get a frdm-kl25z, you can even try the sensor without extra hw (well, but the sensor itself)
<wpwrak>
but you'll of course want the oled, too, which can be powered from the frdm as well, but it'll need a wee bit of local circuitry
<NickSydney>
the graph on the right side of that picture is that showing voltage reading ?
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: i have the oled that i bought from buy-display few months ago .. i knew it will come in handy
<wpwrak>
something readings ;-) basically capacitance, however it is determined
<wpwrak>
oh, that one's a monster ;-)
<wpwrak>
(if you're talking about the 5")
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<wpwrak>
using the same as in anelok will also allow to determine the effect of interferences
<wpwrak>
ah, farnell has thinner than 0.4 mm pcbs without excessive lead times. not a lot, though
<wpwrak>
but they've definitely won the price for the most obscure location in their product category tree: pcbs are under "Semiconductors - Tools"
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: no i do have the oled (not the 5")
<NickSydney>
wpwrak: initially i was going to use it to practise for building a LCD driver board ... as i'm obsessed with display :)
<wpwrak>
oh, you have the 1.3" model ? great !
<wpwrak>
it's extremely easy to get it to work. i was pleasantly surprised
<wpwrak>
anelok/dui/ has the board i made for testing oled and wheel with an external cpu
<NickSydney>
cool...will take a look at that
<NickSydney>
ok going back to work now..catch you later
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<wpwrak>
hmm, i think farnell are lying. these "ultra-thin" pcbs are in fact normal ones. you'd think after all these aeons of being neighbours, they'd have figured out how to read french data sheets ...
<wpwrak>
(i.e., those "35 um" are not the pcb but the copper on it
<DocScrutinizer05>
"Semiconductors - Tools" LOL
<whitequark>
wpwrak: um, 35um PCBs?
<whitequark>
what were you smoking? :p
<whitequark>
that's twice thinner than household aluminum foil
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<paul_boddie>
Isn't aluminium foil part of the smoker's smoking equipment? ;-)
<paul_boddie>
I was going to ask about laser cutting of stuff for prototyping purposes. Anyone here with experiences of that?
<DocScrutinizer05>
I have some laser-cut stencils here, which look pretty nice
<DocScrutinizer05>
for prototyping however...
<paul_boddie>
I wondered if you could do some kind of keyboard/keymat with the right material, engraving and even partial cutting.
<DocScrutinizer05>
well, a lot of PC keyboard keycaps are laser-engraved
<DocScrutinizer05>
rather: burned
<DocScrutinizer05>
anyway sounds almost like an XY-problem
<paul_boddie>
Yes, the legends/labels should be straightforward, but I wondered about the ability to make the keymat flex "precisely" and thus activate only one key in the matrix beneath.
<DocScrutinizer05>
IOW, depends on your laser, your design, but most of all on your material for the keymat