<rjeffries>
that milkymist screen shot is ultra cool
<wpwrak>
autocrap travesty of the day: seems that they discovered "quiet" builds. of course, unlike everyone else who adds a means to enable verbosity (V=1 or such), they had to hard-code the quietness in the makefile. as if a build under the auspices of autocrap could possibly ever fail ...
<jow_laptop>
:D :D :D
<jow_laptop>
I usually patch the quiet patch out
<jow_laptop>
erm quiet stuff
<wpwrak>
i like it for making warnings and such more visible. but there has to be a quick way to see the whole truth when debugging ...
<qi-bot>
[commit] Werner Almesberger: install/: kernel and system utilities build instructions (preliminary) http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/fb5bb5a
<qi-bot>
[commit] Werner Almesberger: atben/README-PCB, atusb/README-PCB: clarifications regarding holes http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-wpan/6487c32
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: yesterday, we heard about russian postal snails. how are the spanish smt snails doing ? :)
<tuxbrain>
wpwrak: the snails said this afternoon they will make a "sprint" and send the quote.... I want a world with the efficiency of germany, patience of Japanese , Chinese production, Hindu spirituality, Netherlands legislation sense, EEUU entrepreneur spirit, Spanish  improvisation skill and (ok some French cheese ,bread and pastry can pass the filter too)  , Russian maths toughness,  Nordic mythology and metal, Swiss economical skills... (add/remove you
<tuxbrain>
own receipt to the ideal world)... until then let's wait the spanish efficiency with EEUU patience :P
<wpwrak>
heh, let's hope for the best then :)
<tuxbrain>
and the snails have made the sprint :)
<methril_work>
:O
<tuxbrain>
wpwrak: I have send you a email with the quoting , no info about the usb connector apart of the warning on the paneling , I have requested for the ref/vendor and/or datasheet of it.
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: "Pantalla Serigrafia Niquel" is the stencil ?
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: prices look so-so to me. not excessive, but i also don't know if they couldn't be substantially lower. maybe ask adam for his opinion.
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: (usb conn) great.
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: i'll be afk for a few hours. let's see of more data arrives :)
<kristianpaul>
he, a C structure is very cool :-)
<kristianpaul>
usefull
<kristianpaul>
reading about tcp/ip
<methril_work>
kristianpaul, C structure allows OO in C
<Jay7>
but you should pass structure pointer to object functions directly then :)
<Jay7>
is using some kind of such things..
<whitequark>
has anyone managed to get qt running on ben?
<Jay7>
fb->plot_pixel(fb, x, y, color);
<whitequark>
per my experience, 32mb is too little for it, but maybe i'm compiling qt the wrong way
<kristianpaul>
methril_work: he, i was thiking same actually
<kristianpaul>
whitequark: it is
<kristianpaul>
check nanomap for example
<kristianpaul>
and others games i think
<kristianpaul>
qdict too
<methril_work>
kristianpaul, it`s used like that in kernel VFS
<methril_work>
i did some serialization of "objects" -> C structs
<methril_work>
and sent over the net
<methril_work>
it works nice :)
<kristianpaul>
"object functions" :o
<wpwrak>
methril: in VFs and a gazillion other places :)
<wpwrak>
tuxbrain: regarding the component substitutions: the 1 uF can is in fact the one i specified. the others are okay as well.
<tuxbrain>
whitequark: you have to be some restrictive (example I'm getting problems if I use large fonts) but with starndard ones I was able to compile on pc and run some demos on NN and I'm developing a code editor app for arduino on QT creator
<lekernel>
yeah
<tuxbrain>
gn8 dudes, today I'm tired and need to rest. and there is no caffeine arround to make me change of opinion. c u
<whitequark>
so, what graphical environment may be used on ben? I've tried gmenu2x, and it works perfectly (of course), but is not very feature-rich and the code is somewhat crappy
<steve|m>
wpwrak: since I can't take a look at the mmone-jtag, can you tell me how to add a SMD mini usb jack with KiCad?
<steve|m>
is there some special library I need?
<Jay7>
whitequark: jlime is using kdrive+matchbox iirc
<Jay7>
or may be xorg+matchbox
<whitequark>
Jay7: looking at their screenshots, matchbox requires touchscreen, am I right?
<Jay7>
whitequark: no, jlime's one is driven by keyboard
<whitequark>
hmm, that's not very easy when you have maybe 8 keys
<Jay7>
nanonote have lot of keys :)
<whitequark>
the particular thing I'm searching an environment for has much less, but otherwise has very similar hardware
<whitequark>
well, of course I may attach a keyboard on i2c, but I do not want to do that
<Jay7>
minimal keys requirement is 2 :)
<Jay7>
down and select :)
<Jay7>
better with 3 - up/down/select :)
<Jay7>
you should be happy with 5 :)
<whitequark>
hm.
<mth>
are you looking for a toolkit, menu, desktop?
<Jay7>
ah, yes, some key for closing window and changing between
<Jay7>
one modified should be enough :)
<Jay7>
*modifier
<whitequark>
mth: if I've had 64mb of memory, I'd just use qt for everything and be happy. I'm looking for everything I need to build an usable media player on top of Linux, of course FOSS
<whitequark>
but qt is too fat to run simultaneously with mplayer, and gtk is not something I'm happy with, too
<Jay7>
whitequark: opie? :)
<whitequark>
qtopia is dead
<Jay7>
but still working :)
<whitequark>
for an one-time project it would work (iirc it has used only ~7mb of memory by itself, through on arm), but I'd like to make something which may be reused
<mth>
whitequark: DirectFB is pretty light and was designed for use on set-top boxes
<mth>
you can run wxWidgets on top of it if you need a widget toolkit
<whitequark>
hm, wxwidgets
<whitequark>
i'll look into that, thanks
<whitequark>
Jay7: opie.handhelds.org is down too
<mth>
wxWidgets is highly modular, so you can disable widgets you don't need
<Jay7>
whitequark: opie.sf.net
<Jay7>
opie is moved from hh.org long time ago
<mth>
although I ran into compile errors when I did that, but they weren't hard to fix
<mth>
and all my patches from back then were integrated by the maintainers
<whitequark>
mth: looking at their screenshots, they use some underlying graphics library, win32 or gtk
<mth>
it can do that, but it can also use its own widgets on a low-level gfx lib like DirectFB
<mth>
we had a user interface for an embedded system running on it
<whitequark>
oh yes, I see it. looks like we're back in '95
<mth>
DirectFB + wxWidgets had a much smaller flash footprint than kdrive + wxWidgets
<roh>
wxwidgets is shit. dont use it.
<mth>
we did implement a custom theme to make it look good
<whitequark>
mth: do you have a repo of that?
<mth>
no, it was a proprietary app
<roh>
make stuff look ugly and breaks thing which worked before on all platforms
<mth>
which was also the reason we didn't use Qt
<mth>
they didn't want GPL licensing and the per-unit cost of Qt was also too high
<mth>
this was before Qt was LGPL-ed
<whitequark>
roh: any suggestions on your side?
<mth>
if you have enough resources, go for Qt instead of wxWidgets
<roh>
well.. directfb alone isnt a toolkit. its like gdk
<mth>
but in this particular restricted environment wxWidgets worked well for us
<whitequark>
mth: 32mb and a processor roughly like ben's
<roh>
its for drawing and windowing, but for a actual toolkit you need something more. usually people use wither gtk or something completely different.
<roh>
there is some very simple stuff.. i forgot the name. mompls
<whitequark>
roh: gtk looks nice and has not very big footprint, but its c interface makes me cry
<roh>
'lite'
<mth>
there was a framebuffer port of gtk, but it was unclear to me whether it was maintained
<roh>
whitequark: you can still code in different languages.. vala?
<roh>
and compile down to binary.
<roh>
c++ is nearly always much bigger in binary and memory footprint size
<roh>
mth: gtk on dfb is what debian used afaik for the installer.
<mth>
I've always installed Debian with a text mode installer :)
<roh>
dfb can also run on dumb framebuffers. its 'abstracting' the hw of the fbdev so you can use accel if available.
<whitequark>
roh: back when I've looked at it, it was looking like in very early stage, is it stable now?
<whitequark>
roh: yes, deb's graphical installer uses dfb. I'm thinking about implementing some graphical acceleration with DMA, through I don't know how efficient that would be
<roh>
lite? dunno. i havent worked with that stuff for years. but i know that directfb is still maintained and used in real products.. tv's and such
<whitequark>
roh: no, vala
<roh>
whitequark: dfb does abstract that for you (accel)
<whitequark>
roh: sure, but it would fall back to slow way like naive memcpy
<roh>
instead of e.g. a userspace x11 driver one has a userspace dfb driver and (usually) a kernel component (the fbdev) which allows mapping/access to registers and dies modesetting.
<whitequark>
well I use jz4740-fb just in NN
<roh>
so accel is usually in userspace, and modesetting in kernelspace. sometimes even simple blitting (for scrolling)
<whitequark>
I particularily like some features of dma like striding and descriptors, it may be possible to implement acceleration for simple ops (like blt) with these
<roh>
nah. usually not
<mth>
with 320x240 resolution, often software rendering is fast enough