<Ian_Daniher>
Hey, does the nanonote have userspace-accessible I2C? I've checked on the wiki, and it's referenced, but nothing terribly clear.
<Ian_Daniher>
From what I've read, pins 23 and 24 on Port D may be I2C, but nothing concrete is written.
<Guest46218>
is xiangfu use emacs irc in debian nanonote
<Guest46218>
is xiangfu use emacs in debian in nanonote
<wolfspraul>
Guest46218: hi Xiangfu :-)
<Guest46218>
me too.
<Guest46218>
see you
<xiangfu>
sorry. I saw some message like "level for a while".
<mth>
Ian_Daniher: the JZ hardware support for I2C uses those two pins, but if you use the Linux GPIO I2C driver, you can select any two free pins
<Guest46218>
sorry i saw my own messagee
<mth>
the kernel config and board source for the NanoNote don't include I2C though
<mth>
so you'll have to build your own kernel to use it
<wolfspraul>
mth: if I'm not confused I think I saw some excellent kernel patches you did. just wanted to say thanks!
<wolfspraul>
really cool stuff
<wolfspraul>
I am so excited that Lars has now submitted his work upstream. let's see how it goes...
<mth>
well, I did the SLCD driver, but it's not excellent yet ;)
<mth>
I did encounter some bugs in the existing drivers though, because they are used in slightly different ways on the Dingoo
<mth>
and fixed them together with larsc
<wolfspraul>
yeah I'm just happy :-)
<wolfspraul>
upstream is all this project is about
<wolfspraul>
at least for me
<wolfspraul>
"if it's not maintanable, don't build it"
<wolfspraul>
of course when we started that was not the case, and still isn't
<wolfspraul>
but seeing Lars and now you and others work in that direction is just great
<wolfspraul>
(with "if it's not maintanable, don't build it", I mean hardware should not be built that cannot be run with maintanble software)
<mth>
that's exactly the reason I started the OpenDingux kernel based on qi-kernel instead of sticking with the existing 2.6.24 one
<wolfspraul>
cool
<wolfspraul>
I will hammer this into Ingenic
<wolfspraul>
maybe I can get them to switch
<wolfspraul>
it's like talking to the wall though
<wolfspraul>
just to keep everybody synced, Ingenic works on a new chip, 4760
<wolfspraul>
I am trying to get them to do more things 'right' early on
<wolfspraul>
of course they are already hacking like crazy on all their different kernel forks
<mth>
the Ingenic drivers tend to ignore existing kernel infrastructure, so they'd have a hard time getting things accepted upstream
<mth>
probably they are not even trying that though
<LunaVorax>
Hi everyone !
<wolfspraul>
mth: hard to say. you need to be realistic about the quality of people they have.
<wolfspraul>
they hardly understand what 'upstream' is
<wolfspraul>
anyway, we get there
<LunaVorax>
I just recieved my Ben Nanonote today <_<
<wolfspraul>
so what I wanted to say about 4760 is that Xiangfu will try to get early access to some EVBs, and first get 4760 support into more recent u-boot versions
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: cool! do you like it?
<LunaVorax>
Yes I finally realize how small it is
<wolfspraul>
yeah :-)
<LunaVorax>
However I'm a linux noob so I hardly know what cool things I can do with it
<wolfspraul>
oh
<wolfspraul>
there is a lot to learn
<mth>
they might have electronic engineers who know how to program: they seem to understand the hardware just fine, but have trouble writing maintainable code
<LunaVorax>
I'm very used to Ubuntu, so do you think it's a good idea to flash Debian into it ?
<wolfspraul>
do you have Linux on your notebook at least?
<LunaVorax>
Yes I use it all the time
<LunaVorax>
I mean I use ubuntu all the time
<wolfspraul>
I suggest you first reflash the latest OpenWrt image on it
<wolfspraul>
unfortunately the new devices still have quite old software on them, 20100113 image
<LunaVorax>
Can do, I'll check the doc
<wolfspraul>
and old u-boot
<wolfspraul>
hopefully it will go smooth
<wolfspraul>
the device (software) still has rough edges, although things improve every month
<wolfspraul>
if there is any problem, come to this channel
<wolfspraul>
we have unbricked many a NanoNote
<wolfspraul>
:-)
<LunaVorax>
haha
<LunaVorax>
Just a moment I'm looking for the image
<wolfspraul>
mth: are you interested in hacking on other XBurst-based devices?
<wolfspraul>
I have a whole pile of them. Not that I am so crazy about XBurst, in the long run it's still a proprietary SoC.
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: you need to run the reflash_ben script
<wolfspraul>
there should be instructions in the wiki
<arctanx>
ordered a nanonote after spotting it yesterday on slashdot
<arctanx>
The shipping dept hasn't been slashdotted, has it? :)
<wolfspraul>
no
<wolfspraul>
arctanx: last I checked there were 49 orders from the US that I would say are coming from slashdot
<arctanx>
good to hear
<mth>
wolfspraul: not right now, still plenty of work to be done on the Dingoo support
<wolfspraul>
for us that's really good
<mth>
maybe later it would be fun though
<arctanx>
is in AU
<wolfspraul>
mth: then rather let's get the Dingoo to work really well first
<wolfspraul>
I don't like 20 devices that all work 'somewhat'
<wolfspraul>
just me personally of course. rather have a few that work really well.
<wolfspraul>
that's the point of a good kernel - to get everything reasonable out of the HW. Isn't it?
<wolfspraul>
arctanx: AU = Australia?
<wolfspraul>
we are still looking for a distributor in australia, who is interested in copyleft hardware in the long run
<wolfspraul>
in the whole concept
<wolfspraul>
volumes and margins make it impossible to make money right now though
<wolfspraul>
if you know some real free software fanatic, who wants to get his nose bloody with hardware, send them here :-)
<wolfspraul>
they can become our AU distributor...
<arctanx>
wolfspraul: Yes, Australia. Good luck with that. Though I'd love to see it, I'm not aware of any copyleft hardware action in this country
<wolfspraul>
actually we have quite a few orders from Australia
<wolfspraul>
with 'quite a few' I mean maybe 20 or so
<arctanx>
That's good. I'll have to keep an eye out then
<wolfspraul>
you can subscribe to the discussion list
<wolfspraul>
compared to those the NanoNote is just a little pocked calculator...
<wolfspraul>
pocket
<arctanx>
I'm an EE, I love pocket calculators :)
<wolfspraul>
xdpirate: I think you pointed out the broken irclogs symlink the other day, thanks again! I fixed it...
<LunaVorax>
haha
<wolfspraul>
arctanx: EE, wow - we need you guys
<xdpirate>
wolfspraul, heh np mate :)
<xdpirate>
my nn is still stuck in customs >.<
<xdpirate>
03 Jun 2010 11:23:33 Oslo Customs Clearance In Progress.
<LunaVorax>
I would sure join the team if I was an EE :'(
<wolfspraul>
arctanx: well are you inclined to help a bit here and there with some copyleft EE projects?
<LunaVorax>
I'll call you in 8years when I'll have my doctor's degree
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: maybe you would reconsider that if you found out you had to work for free until eternity... :-)
<LunaVorax>
ah darn failed again
<LunaVorax>
lol wolfspraul, maybe it's part of the challenge
<arctanx>
wolfspraul: it sounds cool and I'm a big fan of free software, but I can't commit to anything just now. I don't graduate for another 6 months so lots on the go
<wolfspraul>
ah studying, nice
<arctanx>
so I'm going to get my nanonote, have a play with it, and see what I can do from there :)
<wolfspraul>
good
<wolfspraul>
the NanoNote for hardware hackers is called SAKC
<wolfspraul>
disconnect your Nano, take the battery out
<LunaVorax>
x_o ?
<LunaVorax>
ok
<wolfspraul>
press the 'u' button and plug the USB cable back in (without battery still)
<wolfspraul>
normally when you connect the USB cable and have no battery, it will turn on
<wolfspraul>
but because you press 'u' (if u-boot in nand is working), it will go to usb-boot mode
<wolfspraul>
then check 'lsusb' on your host to see whether the 0x601a:4740 ID shows up
<wolfspraul>
if it does, run reflash_ben again
<LunaVorax>
ok apparently the device is in usb boot mode
<LunaVorax>
reflashing...
<wolfspraul>
good
<LunaVorax>
man
<wolfspraul>
if it doesn't work again, maybe we try to reflash the rootfs manually
<LunaVorax>
Who knew i'll have such an adventure
<wolfspraul>
ah
<wolfspraul>
you are at the beginning
<LunaVorax>
:P
<wolfspraul>
level 1
<LunaVorax>
haha
<wolfspraul>
seriously
<LunaVorax>
I don't mind
<wolfspraul>
it's not an iPad
<LunaVorax>
hahaha
<wolfspraul>
we have that level of polish in 10 years, maybe
<LunaVorax>
If the project lives that long ?
<LunaVorax>
I hope so
<wolfspraul>
it better does
<LunaVorax>
yes
<wolfspraul>
we are 1 year into it now
<wolfspraul>
achieved a lot
<LunaVorax>
Indeed you've done a great job
<LunaVorax>
I read a lot about the nanonote before buying one
<wolfspraul>
anyway, let's kick your nano alive...
<wolfspraul>
flashing again now?
<wolfspraul>
it may well break again, especially if it did the first time
<LunaVorax>
yes still doing it
<wolfspraul>
I am no expert in this script actually
<wolfspraul>
I hate reflash_ben.sh :-)
<LunaVorax>
haha
<wolfspraul>
but I admit I have no better alternative that works _today_
<wolfspraul>
only some dreams about how it could be
<wolfspraul>
:-)
<LunaVorax>
maybe i should delete the .qi folder next try
<wolfspraul>
no no
<LunaVorax>
If there was a bad download ?
<wolfspraul>
why that?
<LunaVorax>
Oh ok
<wolfspraul>
I doubt that
<LunaVorax>
No just wondering
<wolfspraul>
the problem is the transfer from your host to Nano, and flashing into NAND
<wolfspraul>
there is no real kernel running on the other side
<wolfspraul>
just a small stub
<LunaVorax>
ok then
<wolfspraul>
that stub doesn't implement USB properly, or NAND, or anything
<LunaVorax>
A question out of subject
<wolfspraul>
so the 'proper' way would be to load a Linux kernel into RAM, then reflash the NAND from there
<wolfspraul>
but that's only in theory
<LunaVorax>
I forgot if the nanonote can actually play music oob
<wolfspraul>
of course it can
<wolfspraul>
just no MP3
<wolfspraul>
I saw some MP3 instructions in the wiki, we need to delete them
<LunaVorax>
Yes I knew mp3 wasn't in the way :P
<LunaVorax>
No pb as long as it play oog
<LunaVorax>
ogg
<arctanx>
honestly, who buys a copyleft computer and tries to use mp3 on it? -_-
<LunaVorax>
haha
<wolfspraul>
urandom is not in irc...
<LunaVorax>
There's a lot of people still heavily using this format unfortunately :/
<wolfspraul>
he added the MP3 instructions (hack) into the wiki
<wolfspraul>
but unfortunately I need to delete them
<wolfspraul>
yes but the format is patented, and the patent owners are very stringent in the enforcement of their rights
<xdpirate>
my whole 30 gb music collection is in mp3 and i'm not about to start mass-converting it all into .ogg, so I'd rather have gmu play mp3s :P
<wolfspraul>
so if I don't delete that wiki section, they will shutdown my entire server etc.
<wolfspraul>
xdpirate: I'm not taking you your hack, but we cannot leave those instructions in the wiki.
<xdpirate>
i understand that mate :)
<wolfspraul>
what we need to keep MP3 free is:
<LunaVorax>
It's not a hack it's a regulat plugin, no ?
<wolfspraul>
1) software on the ben as it is shipped
<xdpirate>
i made a pokedex for the ben, all hail me
<wolfspraul>
2) installable pacakges as long as the installation only uses resources controlled by people affiliated with the company/project
<arctanx>
xdpirate: brilliant!
<xdpirate>
inorite
<arctanx>
have any screenshots?
<wolfspraul>
3) wiki can be removed 'as reasonably possible' (they understand wiki edits can be made by anyone)
<xdpirate>
it's a commandline tool atm, i will make an sdl gui later
<LunaVorax>
xdpirate: lol pokedex
<wolfspraul>
I think that's it
<xdpirate>
fuck yeah pokeymanz
<LunaVorax>
wolfspraul: i agree and understand with all of that
<LunaVorax>
HEY
<LunaVorax>
Flashing done !!1
<wolfspraul>
puh
<wolfspraul>
my fingers already cramped
<LunaVorax>
hahaha
<LunaVorax>
can't wait to use it
<xdpirate>
here's the nanonote binary if anyone wants to test it: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7046011/redblue.bnn (it's got an extension because dropbox sends bogus mimetypes for non-extention-files)
<wolfspraul>
now it gets even better: does it boot? :-)
<LunaVorax>
Do I have to deconnect an put again the battery
<wolfspraul>
disconnect the USB cable, put the battery back in, turn on
<LunaVorax>
Ok
<wolfspraul>
well this sequence guarantees that it was really off
<LunaVorax>
YEAH
<LunaVorax>
oooh graphical environment !
<wolfspraul>
next thing you will notice the flickering
<wolfspraul>
sorry about that
<wolfspraul>
already fixed, but no released image yet
<LunaVorax>
Yes it flickers, nvm
<wolfspraul>
the next image should have Lars nice new 2.6.34 kernel with lots of fixes
<LunaVorax>
It's awesome already
<wolfspraul>
great, happy to hear that
<LunaVorax>
Oh the very last kernel ? cool update
<wolfspraul>
well right now it's 2.6.32 (what you have)
<wolfspraul>
which is also pretty impressive for an embedded device, and no binary blobs at all
<LunaVorax>
yes indeed
<wolfspraul>
2.6.34 is coming, in fact Lars submitted a whole set of 2.6.34 patches upstream, so if we are lucky at some point we get an upstream kernel running on the Ben
<LunaVorax>
lol i pushed nearly all the keys to understand how to launch a programm
<LunaVorax>
-m
<wolfspraul>
yeah it's strange. needs work.
<wolfspraul>
like I said, I would estimate we have maybe 1000 construction sites or so.
<xdpirate>
the source for gmenu2x is available, it's mapped to dingoo buttons
<wolfspraul>
at least that's how I feel
<LunaVorax>
wolfspraul: what's a "construction site" ?
<LunaVorax>
I'm not a ntaive speaker sorry
<xdpirate>
you launch programs with left alt if zear didn't change the buttons
<xdpirate>
(that's what the dingoo B button is mapped to in linux)
<LunaVorax>
xdpirate: I actually lauch them with X key
<LunaVorax>
I don't quite understand how to mount the nanonote to transfer files from my pc to it
<LunaVorax>
Can someone help me with that ?
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: hmm, I always just scp to copy files
<LunaVorax>
oh ok
<wolfspraul>
I read somewhere usb-storage may not work yet in the official image
<LunaVorax>
I'll search for taht
<LunaVorax>
oh
<wolfspraul>
maybe you can also copy with NFS shares, although maybe a bit too hard to setup, unless you are an NFS junkie
<LunaVorax>
So I have to do the usb ethernet thing
<wolfspraul>
well you need to connect the USB cable for sure
<zear>
wolfspraul, there's no usb storage support in the nn kernel, is there?
<LunaVorax>
yes of course
<wolfspraul>
or you copy over the microSD card, that's another option of course
<wolfspraul>
zear: I am not sure, I read something about it needing DMA support
<LunaVorax>
But I was talking about the ethernet connection thtough usb
<wolfspraul>
and DMA support is only in the new kernel Lars and others were working on? mth may know more...
<zear>
wolfspraul, well, if you plug it in, it acts as a usb ethernet gadget device
<LunaVorax>
(yes but I don't have microsd card here right now :/)
<LunaVorax>
Hum
<zear>
LunaVorax, just scp files to it over network
<LunaVorax>
zear: of course but i don't know the ip adress of the nano note
<LunaVorax>
192.168.1.1 ?
<zear>
i think there are programs to simulate scp as a filesystem
<zear>
so you can "mount" it on your pc and transfer files with your favourite file browser
<xiangfu>
zear: sshfs
<LunaVorax>
hum
<zear>
xiangfu, yeah, this :D Thanks
<LunaVorax>
I just want to send a file ._.
<mth>
wolfspraul: descriptorless DMA has been supported for quite some time; larsc added support for scatter/gather lists using DMA descriptors recently
<arctanx>
I'm looking at this openwrt-xburst build system... could anyone tell me where the kernel is, and where it's configured beyond what modules to include?
<zear>
and i also think he got a nanonote, am i right?
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: hmm
<zear>
mth, still, a "dingux-ng" as for "new generation" would be a better name ;)
<wolfspraul>
has anybody ever heard of problems with Nanos turning off by themselves?
<wolfspraul>
absolutely first time for me
<mth>
zear: that's a matter of taste :)
<zear>
xiangfu, ah, great. Thanks for posting that on the wiki :)
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: first let's try to make it more repeatable. Turn off the Nano, boot again.
<zear>
mth, yeah, the name is not really important, just i think it sounds silly the way it is now :)
<LunaVorax>
done
<wolfspraul>
if you want to make sure you start from a known point, remove the battery and USB cable.
<wolfspraul>
then the CPU has no power and it's guaranteed to be off
<zear>
wolfspraul, yes, it turned off by itself a couple of times for me
<LunaVorax>
wolfspraul: it happenned when I was in console mode with Ctrl + Alt + F1
<wolfspraul>
then battery back in, press power button
<wolfspraul>
zear: ah, really? tell us more then
<wolfspraul>
how/why/when/how did you fix it, etc?
<zear>
in the first days of my nanonote
<zear>
i think i haven't experienced it on newer kernels
<zear>
also, it could be that the battery got disconnected somehow
<wolfspraul>
ah good point
<zear>
like, lose pins, etc
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: was your USB cable connected when it turned off by itself?
<zear>
*loose
<LunaVorax>
both, first it was connected second time it wasnt
<wolfspraul>
the battery connector is not the way I want it, unfortunately
<wolfspraul>
we try to improve this in Ya
<wolfspraul>
but now it's the way it is, so we live with it...
<LunaVorax>
ssh connection isn't possible oob ?
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: maybe a software issue
<wolfspraul>
let's see
<wolfspraul>
it's booting now?
<LunaVorax>
yes
<wolfspraul>
already up?
<LunaVorax>
yes
<wolfspraul>
hmm
<wolfspraul>
keep an eye on it
<wolfspraul>
in general all I've heard is that the kernel (and device) are very stable
<wolfspraul>
I mean I'm using it myself all the time.
<wolfspraul>
but of course you see what you see, so we need to find out what's going on...
<wolfspraul>
there is always room for improvement
<LunaVorax>
going in command line
<wolfspraul>
the screen goes black for me after a while, but I never had a problem bringing it back
<wolfspraul>
also I'm not sure whether that's a full suspend or just a 'screen off' mode
<wolfspraul>
I believe even full suspend should be stable.
<LunaVorax>
oooh did it again T_T
<LunaVorax>
I was connected to usb
<LunaVorax>
In command line and running "top"
<LunaVorax>
it's a bit annoying
<zear>
wolfspraul, so.. the first 500 units are sold. But does that translate into an increased support from the community? Any new projects going on? Or the nanos got out of the qi-hardware's warehouses, but are still in the hands of the 3rd party distributors?
<wolfspraul>
oh he left...
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: yeah, strange
<wolfspraul>
was the USB cable plugged in?
<LunaVorax>
Yes
<LunaVorax>
Now I can't connect to my nanonote
<LunaVorax>
ohlala
<wolfspraul>
hmm
<wolfspraul>
one by one
<LunaVorax>
Connection reufsed on port 22
<LunaVorax>
yes
<wolfspraul>
so you booted again?
<LunaVorax>
yes
<LunaVorax>
(and I can't connect)
<wolfspraul>
and it's up? but you cannot connect?
<wolfspraul>
can you do 'telnet 127.0.0.1 22' on the device?
<wolfspraul>
I'd say disconnect and reconnect USB cable
<wolfspraul>
it's interesting, I tried to reproduce your problem and my device is sitting in the console and won't blank the screen at all
<wolfspraul>
just stays on
<wolfspraul>
I believe I saw screen blanking in earlier images, maybe it's gone in the latest (0507)
<LunaVorax>
I can't tell it telnet work
<LunaVorax>
It just hangs
<wolfspraul>
do you see something on the screen? can you type?
<LunaVorax>
apparently it worked
<LunaVorax>
Because it asked me to type other keys when I've done ctrl+c
<LunaVorax>
I'm trying again just to be sure
<wolfspraul>
yes, ctrl-c then 'e' to exit telnet
<LunaVorax>
yes
<wolfspraul>
I just wanted to see whether dropbear responds on the device
<LunaVorax>
ok
<wolfspraul>
disconnect and reconnect your USB cable
<LunaVorax>
done
<LunaVorax>
still dont want to connect
<wolfspraul>
if you get 'connection refused', that's normally coming from the other side I think
<wolfspraul>
did you setup a password?
<LunaVorax>
so what should I do
<LunaVorax>
yes
<LunaVorax>
do I have to set it up everytime ?
<wolfspraul>
don't think so, I don't
<LunaVorax>
ok
<wolfspraul>
what should you do? don't know right now :-) relax and get a drink
<LunaVorax>
haha
<LunaVorax>
it is indeed frustrating :/
<wolfspraul>
you already made it this far at least with your Nano. reflashed it and booted. cherish the successes!
<LunaVorax>
I still haven't played any music on it yet
<LunaVorax>
haha
<LunaVorax>
i'll get some water brb
<wolfspraul>
you will get to the bottom of the problems I'm sure
<wolfspraul>
there you go :-)
<LunaVorax>
hum
<LunaVorax>
if only I could do ssh root@192.168.254.101
<xdpirate>
wolfspraul, should i remove the gmu mp3 thing on the wiki?
<kristianpaul>
i think pople there must know what is beeng doing here that can help others
<wolfspraul>
why are they pointing to the Qi server setup document?
<kristianpaul>
i pointed
<kristianpaul>
bad?
<wolfspraul>
no, not at all
<xdpirate>
wolfspraul, tell him to keep his instructions on his blog or something :P
<wolfspraul>
you mean they should do the same for their servers?
<wolfspraul>
xdpirate: yes of course. in the wild internet :-)
<xdpirate>
i should set up a devblog too but i'm too lazy
<kristianpaul>
autonomo needed from my point of view also manuals aboout setuing up free services
<xdpirate>
who controls the qi-hardware.com domain?
<kristianpaul>
wolfspraul: no no, is just for people want steps to follow for their own server
<kristianpaul>
for seting up*
<wolfspraul>
xdpirate: I registered the domain
<wolfspraul>
that's why I need to police the patent stuff
<wolfspraul>
thankfully
<wolfspraul>
should send a bill somewhere...
<kristianpaul>
i mean autonomo have a cool wush list but there is nothing about how to get working sofware in that list so qi wiki have good info about it :)
<xdpirate>
sweet, how about setting up a subdomain redirect to a future blog of mine? x]
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: ok I'm out for the day soon, what's the latest for your nano?
<LunaVorax>
The latest ?
<wolfspraul>
yeah are you still playing around?
<wolfspraul>
gotta find the source of your problem
<LunaVorax>
Well no I'm kinda locked
<LunaVorax>
I continue to try connect to it
<LunaVorax>
I'll keep you up to date if I remember to go back to this irc chan
<wolfspraul>
run 'ifconfig usb0'
<wolfspraul>
on the device
<wolfspraul>
is the network interface up?
<wolfspraul>
should be
<wolfspraul>
if you get a 'connection refused' I think that must come from the actual dropbear
<LunaVorax>
yes apparently
<wolfspraul>
random guess - just try 'passwd' again
<wolfspraul>
just guessing...
<wolfspraul>
worst case just reflash the entire device again :-)
<kristianpaul>
wolfspraul: about 3D scanning i give up, they are asking me for 1500usd for the process :(
<wolfspraul>
give yourself a bit of time to play with the device
<kristianpaul>
wolfspraul: anbd
<LunaVorax>
sure !
<kristianpaul>
wolfspraul: i need that money fort other things ;)
<wolfspraul>
sure that's crazy
<wolfspraul>
kristianpaul: are you still trying to hookup that GPS module to TP4/5?
<kristianpaul>
wolfspraul: yes but i'm finishing the reprap  first, i need to be ready for cparty
<kristianpaul>
s/i/it
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: for the 'turn off by itself' problem, just to rule out some things try to power the device over USB only (no battery)
<wolfspraul>
or with battery only (no USB)
<wolfspraul>
we need to find a better pattern of what is really causing it
<LunaVorax>
ok i'll try that
<wolfspraul>
if you have a microSD card, you could also install Debian on it and try that - that's a totally different rootfs
<wolfspraul>
Xiangfu just posted quite nice instructions on how to get this going
<wolfspraul>
for now I can tell you, most likely, 99.9%, the hardware is just perfectly fine
<LunaVorax>
I wonder if scummvm runs smoothly on the nanonote
<wolfspraul>
if you would have a hardware problem, you would in fact be the first one ever
<LunaVorax>
wow
<wolfspraul>
the hardware design, manufacturing, and production testing is really rock solid and mass-market quality
<LunaVorax>
I'll be kind of proud if that happens :P
<wolfspraul>
we have spent endless time and money to get this right (hardware quality)
<wolfspraul>
so we can focus on the software side
<wolfspraul>
because we know software is still rough in a lot of places
<wolfspraul>
good software needs time to mature, especially free software which has other goals sometimes than proprietary software, especially around maintainability etc.
<wolfspraul>
but anyway, all talk. your Nano has to be stable so you can enjoy it...
<LunaVorax>
I think I'll have to reflash my nanonote
<LunaVorax>
:/
<wolfspraul>
do you have a microSD card?
<wolfspraul>
maybe you could try Debian
<LunaVorax>
not yet wolfspraul
<LunaVorax>
Debian ?
<LunaVorax>
Oh ok
<wolfspraul>
yes
<kristianpaul>
sd will avoid reflash all time, i need one too )
<LunaVorax>
I'm more used to debian anyway
<kristianpaul>
wolfspraul: are you runnng debian t
<kristianpaul>
?
<wolfspraul>
Xiangfu just posted a mail with easy instructions on how to make this happen on one of the lists
<wolfspraul>
but with xiangfu's latest 'for dummies' level I think it's ready for me now
<kristianpaul>
i like that option at least gcc is already there :)
<wolfspraul>
kristianpaul: yes, and LunaVorax could rule out openwrt-specific rootfs issues for his bugs
<wolfspraul>
at least he has another rootfs to compare with, could gie interesting results
<kristianpaul>
nice
<wolfspraul>
give
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: take it easy a bit with the Nano, if you can. No stress.
<LunaVorax>
don't worry
<wolfspraul>
k :-)
<LunaVorax>
:P
<xiangfu>
is try to install mplayer in debian in nanonote
<wolfspraul>
ah nice, mplayer
<LunaVorax>
can it play ogm ?
<xiangfu>
just for fun. give that a try
<kristianpaul>
xdpirate: ohh let us now how it goes :)
<wolfspraul>
need to hook it up to the CPU's SIMD instructions too...
<xiangfu>
LunaVorax: installing ...
<kristianpaul>
xdpirate: can you try tangogps too ? :)
<LunaVorax>
Haha yes xiangfu, so you don't know yet what can it does ?
<LunaVorax>
I definitely need to buy a microsd card
<kristianpaul>
have one somwhere..
<xdpirate>
kristianpaul, did you quote the wrong name? =P
<kristianpaul>
xdpirate: ahh yes
<kristianpaul>
xiangfu: ^
<xdpirate>
^^
<xiangfu>
kristianpaul: ok, tangogps after mplayer :-)
<xiangfu>
4 package left to unpack...
<xiangfu>
now unpacking mplayer :-)
<wolfspraul>
qwebirc71368: qwebirc91896 some people using the web interface, nice. welcome!
<wolfspraul>
LunaVorax: if we miss each other here, and you have more or new trouble with your Nano, please also don't hesitate to email our discussion list
<wolfspraul>
best is to subscribe yourself first, then you can follow answers better
<emeb>
The stuff about filling out FCC form 740 - do I have to do that?
<xdpirate>
um, no idea, i'm based in europe
<emeb>
ok - thanks.
<xdpirate>
"'Importer's Name and Address' and 'Consignee's Name and Address' will be whoever ordered our products"
<xdpirate>
"'Entry Number' and 'Port of Entry' will be filled out by FedEx or other couriers"
<xdpirate>
seems like they do it for you
<xdpirate>
(they fill out your info on the form when they send it)
<xdpirate>
emeb, it actually says so right there
<xdpirate>
"US customers who order our product at our online shop don't need to worry about filling out FCC Form 740. The form will be prepared for you by Sharism once you place your orders. "
<emeb>
RTFM.
<xdpirate>
(:
<urandom_>
ah and emeb they are not being built by hand to order, that was the pandora
<emeb>
Pandora... How long has it been?
<urandom_>
i think people had to wait for the pandora like two years or something like that ^^
<xdpirate>
Pandora is overrated *cough*
<xdpirate>
£240 for a device that does what any cheaper laptop/netbook could handle >:)
<xdpirate>
£270*
<urandom_>
well it is a really nive handheld but not open hardware
<urandom_>
nice
<urandom_>
netbooks are a lot bigger
<emeb>
Decent processor though - omap3530 is a powerhouse (I've got a Beagleboard)
<emeb>
but yeah - a lot of money
<urandom_>
well there are plans for a omap4 based nanonote for 200¬ :P
<emeb>
Who is doing that?
<emeb>
I know a guy here in the US who's thinking about it.
<urandom_>
not qi directly, some other team, they have been on irc one day
<emeb>
but AFAIK it's just in the "wouldn't it be cool if..." stage
<urandom_>
killing the time while waiting for the bus
<emeb>
cute!
<xdpirate>
:P
<emeb>
Looks like  you could port a variety of text-based games (adventure type stuff)
<xdpirate>
yeah zears frotz emulator already runs alot of them
<xdpirate>
for example all zork games
<emeb>
there you go.
<xdpirate>
i don't actually have my nanonote yet tho
<emeb>
I wonder about command-line utils.
<xdpirate>
waiting for it to arrive :<
<urandom_>
and we can play all dingoo games!
<emeb>
Maybe something like Octave for math/programming?
<urandom_>
well dingux games i mean
<xdpirate>
urandom_, without overclocking though :P
<xdpirate>
so many emulators doesn't behave good at 336 mhz
<xdpirate>
snes needs 430 to run without slowdowns
<xdpirate>
(i got a dingoo)
<xdpirate>
which was what put me on to the nanonote in the first place
<xdpirate>
same specs as a dingoo, but with a keyboard aswell
<xdpirate>
sounds like a deal to me
<urandom_>
and betther display as the a320!
<urandom_>
and micro-sd slot
<urandom_>
and hardware usb boot mode
<urandom_>
and being open hardware
<urandom_>
ok thats all i think :P
<urandom_>
the speaker is a bit bigger i think ^^
<xdpirate>
the screen is already good on the a320, i have a bunch of sd sleeves anyway, there's a hardware usb boot mode on the dingoo too, and there's 2 speakers! :P
<urandom_>
ok they are both awesome
<urandom_>
xdpirate "I also write LUA, but thats pretty much useless for anything thats not a WoW AddOn" -> love is going to be ported on dingoo/nanonote so it will not be useless ;)
<xdpirate>
urandom_, hehehe :P
<urandom_>
omg love on nanonote will be so awesome, i really need to get some c++ skills so i can help
<xdpirate>
urandom_, I actually made that minigame for dex that i was talking about
<wolfspraul>
urandom_: ah there you are
<wolfspraul>
I saw you took out the MP3 section in the wiki already, thanks
<urandom_>
yeah
<wolfspraul>
I am sorry that I need to police this. have no real other choice.
<wolfspraul>
the DNS is registered to me, and the servers too
<wolfspraul>
really I apologize, please continue contributing to the wiki (non-MP3 please :-))
<urandom_>
sory i did not know it could be a problem, i thought it is only a problem shipping it with mp3 codecs preinstalled
<xdpirate>
Hehe :P
<wolfspraul>
the owners of the MP3 patents are super aggressive, I had to deal with them several times
<xdpirate>
urandom_, wanna take the dex for a spin?
<urandom_>
xdpirate yeah
<mth>
how much longer will MP3 patents be a problem, by the way? they should expire in the not too distant future
<xdpirate>
urandom_, sweet, just test out the dex features (list by name or number), and the mini-game :) i'll compile it for mips now
<urandom_>
i hope they do soon expire , it is hard to explain to people why something cant be shipped with mp3 codecs installed
<wolfspraul>
mth: Wikipedia says they 'should' expire somewhere between 2013 and 2017
<wolfspraul>
it will differ from country to country
<wolfspraul>
and the patent owners will do nothing to clarify this
<wolfspraul>
in fact they may well try to or have already found some way to latch newer patents onto it
<wolfspraul>
they have a lot of time and lawyers to carefully think about every last option the law they are abusing offers for them
<xdpirate>
urandom_, just sent you a file over irc, it's the nanonote binary
<urandom_>
xdpirate dcc doesnt really work for me, just upload it for everyone
<urandom_>
wolfspraul so it is already illegal if you say you could download mp3 codecs from extern source? i dont understand this licensing shit
<wolfspraul>
urandom_: short story: the patent owners have allowed free software people to use their patents for free
<wolfspraul>
because they know they can't make money there anyway :-)
<wolfspraul>
but not so for device manufacturers
<wolfspraul>
so they work with customs in the whole world to stop products that can play MP3
<wolfspraul>
what they define as 'can play' is the maximum they can get away with in the law
<wolfspraul>
of course in theory, and if you have a compiler / source codes, every computer 'can play' MP3
<wolfspraul>
if the law would let them they would claim that
<wolfspraul>
but given as it is right now, they have a case against a device manufacturer if:
<wolfspraul>
1) the device as shipped can play MP3 ('can play' = normal user using the UI, not a C programmer writing code)
<wolfspraul>
2) MP3 play capability can be installed through an app-store, or any means controlled by the manufacturer
<wolfspraul>
3) the manufacturer ships documentation, or has instructions on how to play MP3 on any websites he controls
<wolfspraul>
so the problem is they will find me :-) and they will say you register the qi-hardware.com DNS, the servers
<urandom_>
but the documentation is not shipped, it is an wiki with user contributions
<wolfspraul>
yes
<wolfspraul>
that's why they 'accept' that the wiki is cleaned as it is 'reasonably possible'
<wolfspraul>
so I see the MP3 -> I say "we have to delete this"
<wolfspraul>
the law in action
<wolfspraul>
if I don't do this, much worse things will come after me
<wolfspraul>
I am actually very happy that the Debian project saw through their tricks and kicked out MP3 everywhere
<wolfspraul>
very good!
<urandom_>
ah and next time i do something like that you dont have to wait for me, you can remove it yourself if you want to, just leave a short note why
<wolfspraul>
whereas Canonical/Ubuntu helps them fool us all
<wolfspraul>
urandom_: no problem
<wolfspraul>
I hate to do this anyway.
<wolfspraul>
it's embarassing
<wolfspraul>
so I say: thank you Debian! Bad Ubuntu!
<wolfspraul>
:-)
<mth>
unfortunately there aren't many shops that sells Oggs
<mth>
Magnatune is the only one I know of at the moment
<urandom_>
well thats why i got the thinking it is ok, in many distribution you can just install the codecs
<wolfspraul>
I told you they play smart.
<wolfspraul>
they learnt from the gif debacle
<urandom_>
and ubuntu is overrated anyway
<wolfspraul>
I cannot change the legal situation. So I comply and move on.
<wolfspraul>
the MP3 situation caused endless pain at Openmoko
<wolfspraul>
and for some of the Openmoko distributors
<wolfspraul>
of course I hope the patents expire asap :-)
<wolfspraul>
until then it's MP2 (supposedly patent-free), Ogg, etc.
<mth>
I don't think anyone uses MP2 though
<wolfspraul>
Debian does
<wolfspraul>
last time I checked...
<mth>
why not Ogg Vorbis?
<wolfspraul>
most MP3 players can also play mp2
<mth>
ah, that's true, Vorbis support in hardware is rare
<mth>
and in software it will drain the battery
<urandom_>
are tools for converting mp3 in something different "Illegal" too?
<mth>
distributing them as part of a device without paying licensing probably is
<mth>
but if you as an end user compile them for yourself, it's a different matter
<xdpirate>
it was your idea, you will be credited :3
<urandom_>
playing the game at this moment
<urandom_>
like it :)
<xdpirate>
wohoo :P
<xdpirate>
i got kinda hung up with it myself, stopped coding for half an hour trying to get a high percentage :p
<urandom_>
but if you gues two times wrong shouldnt it ask if you want to play again?
<xdpirate>
yeah? it doesn't?
<xdpirate>
it does here
<urandom_>
it does i just got confused
<xdpirate>
ah :P
<xdpirate>
if you input anything else but "y" or "Y" at the "try again" screen, it quits :P
<urandom_>
yeah i typed enter too fast
<xdpirate>
ah x]
<urandom_>
oh couldnt it auto detect if parameter is a number?
<urandom_>
like if paramter is number, display pokemod with this number else if pokemon name then display pokemon with this name else if parameter is game then run game or so
<xdpirate>
yeah i'll do that later, for now it was easier to just use name or num as a parameter
<urandom_>
worse is better approach :P
<xdpirate>
(:
<urandom_>
oh and good job! will you release source so it can be includet in next official image? ;)
<xdpirate>
thanks mate
<xdpirate>
i'll release it once i actually get my nanonote lol,
<urandom_>
it would be cool if it could display pictures of the pokemon too this would make some different mode for the game possible
<xdpirate>
yeah, as stated in my previous blog post, i will probably make an sdl gui around it eventually, and make it usable on both dingux and the nanonote
<urandom_>
wow i got named two times on you blog
<xdpirate>
:P
<urandom_>
speaking of you blog, you could add my mp3 how to on it if you want (but someone should test is before)
<wolfspraul>
I'm smiling, hopefully the lawyers let me...
<xdpirate>
hehe, we'll see once i get the actual nanonote and get to fiddle around with it :)
<xdpirate>
usually game companies are quick to send C&D letters when they feel their copyrights are being violated
<urandom_>
well i think they dont want to mess up with fans and overlook some things
<xdpirate>
also, this app is non-profit, non-commercial and for educational purposes only (:
<urandom_>
true
<xdpirate>
"the fair use of a copyrighted work, including such use by reproduction in copies or phonorecords or by any other means specified by that section, for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research, is not an infringement of copyright"
<wolfspraul>
wikipedia will not accept fair-use, neither do we (Qi hardware)
<wolfspraul>
we follow wikipedia standards
<wolfspraul>
but similar to MP3 that doesn't mean individuals can do whatever they like
<wolfspraul>
I think trackpoint is in there already
<wolfspraul>
this list is basis for our work
<wolfspraul>
so if it's in there, it won't be forgotten
<wolfspraul>
but it has to make economic sense
<wolfspraul>
so in other words we need to be able to afford to build a feature, and that investment needs to generate the additional sales to make that same money back
<wolfspraul>
we already have lots of people working for free, and huge free software community help, all of this is not really sustainable in the long run
<wolfspraul>
but with how things are going, so far so good :-)
<urandom_>
yeah i am trying to support this project as much as i can
<wolfspraul>
I also want to spend a little more time on typically invisible things
<wolfspraul>
like GPL'ed production testing software
<wolfspraul>
and maybe some work to free up the case design, although that heavily depends on free tools like HeeksCAD and mostly they are not ready for production
<wolfspraul>
transflective screen would be nice, many things would be nice
<urandom_>
lot of work to do
<wolfspraul>
yeah
<wolfspraul>
so we try to enjoy it as much as possible
<wolfspraul>
take some more time for the fun parts of it
<wolfspraul>
Adam is now doing some excellent work to document the SMT process
<wolfspraul>
it's for the Milkymist One board, but once we establish a certain 'quality level' for free documentation, we will aim for that level on any copyleft production we are doing
<wolfspraul>
there's a lot more we can dig up there to bring copyleft hardware alive, we are really pioneers so it takes some time to even establish what exactly a 'good' copyleft hardware product is
<wolfspraul>
I want to have some kind of checklist
<wolfspraul>
so we know what we are working towards
<wolfspraul>
because in the end, the project is only successful if there are truly independent improved products made by someone
<wolfspraul>
and that's a long way out I think
<urandom_>
taking copyleft hardware serious requires a lot of extra work that nobody is seeing, other projects like pandora just call themselfs open cause it can run linux and get away with it
<urandom_>
well wasted enough of your time, getting some sleep now