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<Josh_2>
Xach: you use Sly over Slime?
<Josh_2>
Xach: you use Sly over Slime?
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<pillton>
jasom: Does it make moresense to write something which accumulates the data up until the --- and then process that subset with the existing functionality?
<pillton>
jasom: Does it make moresense to write something which accumulates the data up until the --- and then process that subset with the existing functionality?
<minion>
pillton, memo from jasom: I *can* make nyaml a streaming parser (it would mean dumping esrap, but the parts of esrap I use aren't terribly hard to copy). It would still process an entire document at a time though, as I don't really care to find all the places where backtracking can't happen
<minion>
pillton, memo from jasom: I *can* make nyaml a streaming parser (it would mean dumping esrap, but the parts of esrap I use aren't terribly hard to copy). It would still process an entire document at a time though, as I don't really care to find all the places where backtracking can't happen
<pillton>
Oh sorry. I read that on the IRC logs.
<pillton>
Oh sorry. I read that on the IRC logs.
<pillton>
And then wrote my question.
<pillton>
And then wrote my question.
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<asarch>
I do (ql:quickload :caveman2 and then (caveman2:make-project #P"tacos" :autor "Jonh Doe") and, well, the full output log is here: https://pastebin.com/1pdksVym
<asarch>
I do (ql:quickload :caveman2 and then (caveman2:make-project #P"tacos" :autor "Jonh Doe") and, well, the full output log is here: https://pastebin.com/1pdksVym
<asarch>
In the file src/web.lisp is where all the action occurs and that is where I need the package of the HTML generator
<asarch>
In the file src/web.lisp is where all the action occurs and that is where I need the package of the HTML generator
<asarch>
In Slime I can (load #P"src/guacamole.lisp") and then (use-package :tamales) in order to create the form object: (let ((my-form (make-instance 'form :title "Add new Tacos"...))) ...)
<asarch>
In Slime I can (load #P"src/guacamole.lisp") and then (use-package :tamales) in order to create the form object: (let ((my-form (make-instance 'form :title "Add new Tacos"...))) ...)
<asarch>
But, in the src/web.lisp it simply doesn't work
<asarch>
But, in the src/web.lisp it simply doesn't work
<asarch>
When I start the project, SBCL actually reads the content of the src/guacamole.lisp but when I try to use the package with (use-package :tamales) in src/web.lisp, it replies the error that the form class actually is not available in the TACOS.WEB package
<asarch>
When I start the project, SBCL actually reads the content of the src/guacamole.lisp but when I try to use the package with (use-package :tamales) in src/web.lisp, it replies the error that the form class actually is not available in the TACOS.WEB package
<asarch>
I've tried different ways to use the package 'tamales' in the 'guacamole.lisp' file in the 'src/web.lisp' file methods :-(
<asarch>
I've tried different ways to use the package 'tamales' in the 'guacamole.lisp' file in the 'src/web.lisp' file methods :-(
<asarch>
Caveman2 uses Envy for its configuration setup
<asarch>
Caveman2 uses Envy for its configuration setup
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<asarch>
How would you add this package to the project?
<asarch>
How would you add this package to the project?
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<beach>
Good morning everyone!
<beach>
Good morning everyone!
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<Josh_2>
Morning beach
<Josh_2>
Morning beach
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<jackdaniel>
jmercouris: running outdated software is a security consideration on its own term
<jackdaniel>
jmercouris: running outdated software is a security consideration on its own term
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<fiddlerwoaroof>
White_Flame: I have the general impression that Eudoxia's projects are relatively unmaintained
<fiddlerwoaroof>
White_Flame: I have the general impression that Eudoxia's projects are relatively unmaintained
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<pillton>
,quit
<pillton>
,quit
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<srandon111>
why common lisp is case insensitive?
<srandon111>
why common lisp is case insensitive?
<srandon111>
for function names
<srandon111>
for function names
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<White_Flame>
srandon111: symbols are technically case sensitive
<White_Flame>
srandon111: symbols are technically case sensitive
<White_Flame>
'|a| is not 'a/'A
<White_Flame>
'|a| is not 'a/'A
<White_Flame>
the reader's default case mode is to uppercase on read
<White_Flame>
the reader's default case mode is to uppercase on read
<White_Flame>
that can be changed, and pipes override the default case
<White_Flame>
that can be changed, and pipes override the default case
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<beach>
srandon111: Common Lisp is the way it is because it tried to be somewhat compatible with several different Lisp dialects that existed when it was created.
<beach>
srandon111: Common Lisp is the way it is because it tried to be somewhat compatible with several different Lisp dialects that existed when it was created.
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<aggin>
oh ok
<aggin>
oh ok
<aggin>
thanks
<aggin>
thanks
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<didi>
What does the "n" stands for in mutating functions like `nreverse'?
<didi>
What does the "n" stands for in mutating functions like `nreverse'?
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<flip214>
Kingsy: I'm here now, what's the issue?
<flip214>
Kingsy: I'm here now, what's the issue?
<Bike>
ndestructive
<Bike>
ndestructive
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<flip214>
wasn't it "not consing"?
<flip214>
wasn't it "not consing"?
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<didi>
Bike: :-)
<didi>
Bike: :-)
<Kingsy>
flip214: thats ok! I have taken a different tact. I am going to give emacs a spin!
<Kingsy>
flip214: thats ok! I have taken a different tact. I am going to give emacs a spin!
<Kingsy>
I never thought I would be I am constantly fighting against vim and its starting to become annoying. All of the things I want with nvim seem to be available on emacs too. like lsp support for common languages. it runs in a terminal.. so screw it. I'm going to give it a go.
<Kingsy>
I never thought I would be I am constantly fighting against vim and its starting to become annoying. All of the things I want with nvim seem to be available on emacs too. like lsp support for common languages. it runs in a terminal.. so screw it. I'm going to give it a go.
<didi>
Kingsy: Beware of Emacs terminal. Some key combinations won't work in a terminal.
<didi>
Kingsy: Beware of Emacs terminal. Some key combinations won't work in a terminal.
<Kingsy>
didi: well. I'm going to use emacs gtk for now. but its handy knowing I have a terminal version I can use on my vps IF I do like emacs and start to use it over vim.
<Kingsy>
didi: well. I'm going to use emacs gtk for now. but its handy knowing I have a terminal version I can use on my vps IF I do like emacs and start to use it over vim.
<ChoHag>
didi: 'n-place.
<ChoHag>
didi: 'n-place.
<didi>
Kingsy: I use TRAMP to edit remote files.
<didi>
Kingsy: I use TRAMP to edit remote files.
<didi>
ChoHag: Ah, nice.
<didi>
ChoHag: Ah, nice.
<ChoHag>
Kingsy: You could try one if the vims that have been ported to emacs.
<ChoHag>
Kingsy: You could try one if the vims that have been ported to emacs.
<ChoHag>
I use evil.
<ChoHag>
I use evil.
<Kingsy>
ChoHag: yeah! I think I will.. BUT. I want to messa round with the emacs bindings first. might aswell.
<Kingsy>
ChoHag: yeah! I think I will.. BUT. I want to messa round with the emacs bindings first. might aswell.
<flip214>
Kingsy: good luck! whatever meets your ends is okay. Just.... don't ever start python (the language) ;)
<flip214>
Kingsy: good luck! whatever meets your ends is okay. Just.... don't ever start python (the language) ;)
<Kingsy>
didi: wowÂ! tramp looks amazing
<Kingsy>
didi: wowÂ! tramp looks amazing
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<didi>
Kingsy: It's awesome.
<didi>
Kingsy: It's awesome.
<Kingsy>
how is emacs memory footprint? I know vim is super low.. obviously its a gui.. it is a fAir amount more?
<Kingsy>
how is emacs memory footprint? I know vim is super low.. obviously its a gui.. it is a fAir amount more?
<Xach>
emacs stands for "eight megs and constantly swapping".
<Xach>
emacs stands for "eight megs and constantly swapping".
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<Xach>
Kingsy: it's a fair amount more than vim
<Xach>
Kingsy: it's a fair amount more than vim
<gabc>
Kingsy: depends also on the amount of package you add
<gabc>
Kingsy: depends also on the amount of package you add
<Kingsy>
haha its got to be less than the intellij suite.. which is what I currently use :D
<Kingsy>
haha its got to be less than the intellij suite.. which is what I currently use :D
<gabc>
It probably will, but it really depends on what you do with it
<gabc>
It probably will, but it really depends on what you do with it
<flip214>
Is there a function to shallowly copy a CLOS instance?
<flip214>
Is there a function to shallowly copy a CLOS instance?
<Kingsy>
of cours eyeah
<Kingsy>
of cours eyeah
<Bike>
flip214: no.
<Bike>
flip214: no.
<flip214>
Bike: not even in CLOSER-MOP or ALEXANDRIA?
<flip214>
Bike: not even in CLOSER-MOP or ALEXANDRIA?
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<Bike>
i don't think they do. you could write one with mop, assuming you only wanted to handle standard slots
<Bike>
i don't think they do. you could write one with mop, assuming you only wanted to handle standard slots
<flip214>
yeah, exactly....
<flip214>
yeah, exactly....
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<flip214>
thanks
<flip214>
thanks
<gabc>
Kingsy: right now my emacs takes 73MB of ram if that is of any help
<gabc>
Kingsy: right now my emacs takes 73MB of ram if that is of any help
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<ChoHag>
Kingsy: Says I'm using ~70MB here.
<ChoHag>
Kingsy: Says I'm using ~70MB here.
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<didi>
233 MB.
<didi>
233 MB.
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<ChoHag>
Well I rebooted a few weeks ago.
<ChoHag>
Well I rebooted a few weeks ago.
<gabc>
I don't use emacs much on my work computer too, mostly just for magit
<gabc>
I don't use emacs much on my work computer too, mostly just for magit
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<ChoHag>
By way of comparison, firehose is taking 500MB and I only have a dozen or so tabs open and it crashes every few days.
<ChoHag>
By way of comparison, firehose is taking 500MB and I only have a dozen or so tabs open and it crashes every few days.
<Kingsy>
yeah thats not much.
<Kingsy>
yeah thats not much.
<Kingsy>
firefox is using 2gb
<Kingsy>
firefox is using 2gb
<Kingsy>
:D
<Kingsy>
:D
<Kingsy>
anyway thansk for the info
<Kingsy>
anyway thansk for the info
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<ChoHag>
Oh and hey, if emacs doesn't work out you could head the other way on the editor spectrum and try ed.
<ChoHag>
Oh and hey, if emacs doesn't work out you could head the other way on the editor spectrum and try ed.
<Kingsy>
hahaha
<Kingsy>
hahaha
* Odin-
remembers using edlin on DOS.
* Odin-
remembers using edlin on DOS.
<Odin->
That was ... different. :p
<Odin->
That was ... different. :p
<gabc>
I got quite good with 'ed' a few years back, was fun
<gabc>
I got quite good with 'ed' a few years back, was fun
<Josh_2>
Good afternoon
<Josh_2>
Good afternoon
<aeth>
I only learned the basics of ed (and vim), several times. So I'm probably completely rusty again if I ever had to navigate either.
<aeth>
I only learned the basics of ed (and vim), several times. So I'm probably completely rusty again if I ever had to navigate either.
<aeth>
Any good ed-in-CL editors? I think there have to be several.
<aeth>
Any good ed-in-CL editors? I think there have to be several.
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<ChoHag>
ed is (mostly) just what you type after : in vi.
<ChoHag>
ed is (mostly) just what you type after : in vi.
<aeth>
Yes, the VIsual mode for ex, which I guess should be called EdX
<aeth>
Yes, the VIsual mode for ex, which I guess should be called EdX
<gabc>
aeth: lem is good, but not ed
<gabc>
aeth: lem is good, but not ed
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<Josh_2>
Emacs gooder
<Josh_2>
Emacs gooder
<Xach>
aeth: i feel like i've seen one or two before, but the names escape me
<Xach>
aeth: i feel like i've seen one or two before, but the names escape me
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<beach>
flip214: The term "CLOS instance" is meaningless. Every Common Lisp object is an instance of some class.
<beach>
flip214: The term "CLOS instance" is meaningless. Every Common Lisp object is an instance of some class.
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<phoe>
some are instances of standard-classes
<phoe>
some are instances of standard-classes
<phoe>
and some are instances of substandard classes
<phoe>
and some are instances of substandard classes
<beach>
Yes. What's the point?
<beach>
Yes. What's the point?
<phoe>
I assume flip214 meant "standard-object" instead of "CLOS instance"
<phoe>
I assume flip214 meant "standard-object" instead of "CLOS instance"
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<beach>
I think it is a mistake to assume that. It is much better to have flip214 use the correct terminology.
<beach>
I think it is a mistake to assume that. It is much better to have flip214 use the correct terminology.
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<edgar-rft>
beach: somehow "the term CLOS instance is meaningless" together with "every Common Lisp object is an instance of some class" makes me conclude that "every Common Lisp object is meaningless"?
<edgar-rft>
beach: somehow "the term CLOS instance is meaningless" together with "every Common Lisp object is an instance of some class" makes me conclude that "every Common Lisp object is meaningless"?
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<beach>
edgar-rft: I am sorry to hear that.
<beach>
edgar-rft: I am sorry to hear that.
<edgar-rft>
in Common Lisp (+ 1 1) is an OOP program!
<edgar-rft>
in Common Lisp (+ 1 1) is an OOP program!
<phoe>
so is 1 + 1 in smalltalk though
<phoe>
so is 1 + 1 in smalltalk though
<phoe>
don't even get me started about java...
<phoe>
don't even get me started about java...
<gabc>
In python too I guess? and in ruby
<gabc>
In python too I guess? and in ruby
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* edgar-rft
suggests to replace "he/she/it/" by "CLOS instance"
* edgar-rft
suggests to replace "he/she/it/" by "CLOS instance"
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<edgar-rft>
...because in Common Lisp everyone is a CLOS instance
<edgar-rft>
...because in Common Lisp everyone is a CLOS instance
<Josh_2>
I like this
<Josh_2>
I like this
<shinohai>
aha
<shinohai>
aha
<aeth>
just say "the instance"
<aeth>
just say "the instance"
<aeth>
or "they", same meaning
<aeth>
or "they", same meaning
<Josh_2>
"I'll tell the instance of <name> "
<Josh_2>
"I'll tell the instance of <name> "
<aeth>
"they" = "thei" = "the instance(s)"
<aeth>
"they" = "thei" = "the instance(s)"
<Josh_2>
verbose == more gooder
<Josh_2>
verbose == more gooder
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<aeth>
But, more seriously, this grammar argument has been held over the internet for like 15 years or so, if not longer. Just using "they/their/them" as singular/plural to refer to a user is perfectly valid English and takes up way less space without offending (almost) anyone. The only confusing part is when translating it, it might be unclear if it's singular or plural or unspecified.
<aeth>
But, more seriously, this grammar argument has been held over the internet for like 15 years or so, if not longer. Just using "they/their/them" as singular/plural to refer to a user is perfectly valid English and takes up way less space without offending (almost) anyone. The only confusing part is when translating it, it might be unclear if it's singular or plural or unspecified.
<aeth>
And it's so subtle, nobody's even going to notice it unless they look for it.
<aeth>
And it's so subtle, nobody's even going to notice it unless they look for it.
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<White_Flame>
since this is IRC, "I'll tell FOO when someone or something claiming that handle speaks next"
<White_Flame>
since this is IRC, "I'll tell FOO when someone or something claiming that handle speaks next"
<Josh_2>
instance of is more Lisp specific
<Josh_2>
instance of is more Lisp specific
<Alfr>
What happened to choosing the most specific construct?
<Alfr>
What happened to choosing the most specific construct?
<edgar-rft>
The point is that as a CLOS instance you're meaningless
<edgar-rft>
The point is that as a CLOS instance you're meaningless
<phoe>
Alfr: people don't understand multiple inheritance so the concept kinda went down the drain
<phoe>
Alfr: people don't understand multiple inheritance so the concept kinda went down the drain
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<aeth>
("nobody's even going to notice it unless they look for it" is exactly an example of what I'm talking about, by the way, since "nobody" is singular)
<aeth>
("nobody's even going to notice it unless they look for it" is exactly an example of what I'm talking about, by the way, since "nobody" is singular)
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<edgar-rft>
the internet is full of nobodies (plural)
<edgar-rft>
the internet is full of nobodies (plural)
<aeth>
Quite the paradox.
<aeth>
Quite the paradox.
<aeth>
It's like how with continuous probabilities, p(x) for any x is 0, and yet, you have a distribution that sums to 1.
<aeth>
It's like how with continuous probabilities, p(x) for any x is 0, and yet, you have a distribution that sums to 1.
<Alfr>
Move this to the cafe? ;)
<Alfr>
Move this to the cafe? ;)
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<aeth>
absolutely.
<aeth>
absolutely.
<aeth>
Although my serious point is imo on-topic since there should be a style guide not just for Lisp code, but also for Lisp documentation. (wait, people write documentation?)
<aeth>
Although my serious point is imo on-topic since there should be a style guide not just for Lisp code, but also for Lisp documentation. (wait, people write documentation?)
* shinohai
apologizes, didn't mean to start off-topic convo with mere joke ....
* shinohai
apologizes, didn't mean to start off-topic convo with mere joke ....
<Josh_2>
No there shouldn't aeth
<Josh_2>
No there shouldn't aeth
* White_Flame
prefers a bit of cheekiness, especially in bots
* White_Flame
prefers a bit of cheekiness, especially in bots
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<jasom>
edgar-rft: it's the modifier "clos" that is the meaningless part of "CLOS instance" Unless you can point to an object that isn't a CLOS instance
<jasom>
edgar-rft: it's the modifier "clos" that is the meaningless part of "CLOS instance" Unless you can point to an object that isn't a CLOS instance
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<edgar-rft>
jasom: I don't need CLOS to be meaningless :-)
<edgar-rft>
jasom: I don't need CLOS to be meaningless :-)
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<Odin->
aeth: Documentation is a myth.
<Odin->
aeth: Documentation is a myth.
<ChoHag>
I write documentation.
<ChoHag>
I write documentation.
<ChoHag>
Nobody reads it.
<ChoHag>
Nobody reads it.
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<MrtnDk[m]>
Odin- Do you know Odin-lap?
<MrtnDk[m]>
Odin- Do you know Odin-lap?
<White_Flame>
I write documentation. *I* read it
<White_Flame>
I write documentation. *I* read it
<Josh_2>
^
<Josh_2>
^
<moon-child>
you write your own documentation?
<moon-child>
you write your own documentation?
<moon-child>
narcissist
<moon-child>
narcissist
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<Josh_2>
Well might struggle to find someone else to write it
<Josh_2>
Well might struggle to find someone else to write it
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<ChoHag>
White_Flame: Honestly I think that's the most useful purpose of the stuff.
<ChoHag>
White_Flame: Honestly I think that's the most useful purpose of the stuff.
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<ChoHag>
I don't know wtf I was thinking last night. How can I possibly remember what this code I wrote last year did?
<ChoHag>
I don't know wtf I was thinking last night. How can I possibly remember what this code I wrote last year did?
<Odin->
MrtnDk[m]: ... is that nick active?
<Odin->
MrtnDk[m]: ... is that nick active?
<ChoHag>
moon-child: Code's not complete without documentation.
<ChoHag>
moon-child: Code's not complete without documentation.
<MrtnDk[m]>
Odin- It used to be.
<MrtnDk[m]>
Odin- It used to be.
<Odin->
Well, yes. Usually at a similar time as this one, depending on which computer I was using at the time.
<Odin->
Well, yes. Usually at a similar time as this one, depending on which computer I was using at the time.
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<MrtnDk[m]>
Odin- Are you Odin-lap?
<MrtnDk[m]>
Odin- Are you Odin-lap?
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<MrtnDk[m]>
on another nick name
<MrtnDk[m]>
on another nick name
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<fiddlerwoaroof>
I right executable documentation...
<fiddlerwoaroof>
I right executable documentation...
<fiddlerwoaroof>
I also confuse homophones
<fiddlerwoaroof>
I also confuse homophones
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<sabasedigh>
I am on Linux and I need to learn lisp. could you help me?
<sabasedigh>
I am on Linux and I need to learn lisp. could you help me?
<raeda>
I recommend Portacle to get an IDE (Emacs) and a Common Lisp up and running quickly https://portacle.github.io/
<raeda>
I recommend Portacle to get an IDE (Emacs) and a Common Lisp up and running quickly https://portacle.github.io/
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<copec>
I'm setting up a new mac install and installed Aquamacs, but elpha is only showing slime-company slime-theme slime-docker slime-volleyball as possible packages to install for emacs. What am I missing?
<copec>
I'm setting up a new mac install and installed Aquamacs, but elpha is only showing slime-company slime-theme slime-docker slime-volleyball as possible packages to install for emacs. What am I missing?
<jmercouris>
You are missing melpa
<jmercouris>
You are missing melpa
<jmercouris>
But that is neither here nor there, please just use Emacsforosx.com build
<jmercouris>
But that is neither here nor there, please just use Emacsforosx.com build
<copec>
I would like that. I was only using Aquamacs because the X11 emacs was fugly
<copec>
I would like that. I was only using Aquamacs because the X11 emacs was fugly
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* fiddlerwoaroof
always uses the "railwaycat" build: it has much better polish on macOS than the "official" build
* fiddlerwoaroof
always uses the "railwaycat" build: it has much better polish on macOS than the "official" build
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