sipa changed the topic of #bitcoin-wizards to: This channel is for discussing theoretical ideas with regard to cryptocurrencies, not about short-term Bitcoin development | http://bitcoin.ninja/ | This channel is logged. | For logs and more information, visit http://bitcoin.ninja
alpalp has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
musalbas has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
musalbas has joined #bitcoin-wizards
alpalp has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Aranjedeath has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
CubicEarth has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
brguy has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
alpalp has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
Aranjedeath has joined #bitcoin-wizards
kinlo has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
kinlo has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
alpalp has joined #bitcoin-wizards
rusty has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
rusty2 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
ThomasV has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
q4 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
q4 has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
btcdrak has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
echonaut has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
echonaut has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
lamassu has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
windsok has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Ylbam has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
Chris_Stewart_5 has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
lamassu has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
lamassu has joined #bitcoin-wizards
ibrightly has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
DigiByteDev has joined #bitcoin-wizards
ibrightly has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
aalex__ has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
xissburg_ has joined #bitcoin-wizards
kinlo has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
weeeeeew has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Noldorin has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
xissburg has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Alanius has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
murchandamus has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
aalex__ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
murchandamus has joined #bitcoin-wizards
kinlo has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Alanius has joined #bitcoin-wizards
alpalp has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
weeeeeew has joined #bitcoin-wizards
fkinglag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
windsok has joined #bitcoin-wizards
xissburg_ is now known as xissburg
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
PERSIAN has quit [Quit: PERSIAN]
CubicEarth has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
pro has quit [Quit: Leaving]
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
v20100 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Alopex has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
CubicEarth has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
kanzure has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
Alopex has joined #bitcoin-wizards
kanzure has joined #bitcoin-wizards
DigiByteDev has quit [Quit: DigiByteDev]
lamassu has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.4]
btcdrak has joined #bitcoin-wizards
legogris has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
legogris has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Giszmo has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
DigiByteDev has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Alopex has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Alopex has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
Alopex has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Alopex has joined #bitcoin-wizards
[7] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
TheSeven has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Aranjedeath has quit [Quit: Three sheets to the wind]
jtimon has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
rusty2 has left #bitcoin-wizards [#bitcoin-wizards]
CubicEarth has quit []
CubicEarth has joined #bitcoin-wizards
luke-jr has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
luke-jr has joined #bitcoin-wizards
<TD-Linux>
andytoshi, I have made SO much HN karma spamming your papers
CrazyLoaf has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
v20100 has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
gsdgdfs has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Transisto2 has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
Transisto2 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
gsdgdfs has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
Ylbam has joined #bitcoin-wizards
CubicEarth has quit []
mariorz has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
mariorz has joined #bitcoin-wizards
ThomasV has joined #bitcoin-wizards
aalex__ has joined #bitcoin-wizards
MoALTz has joined #bitcoin-wizards
coryfields has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.]
airbreather has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
airbreather has joined #bitcoin-wizards
cluckj has quit [Quit: Leaving]
markus-k has joined #bitcoin-wizards
ThomasV has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
aalex__ has joined #bitcoin-wizards
airbreather has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
aalex__ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
ThomasV has joined #bitcoin-wizards
q4 has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
v20100 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
q4 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
YOU-JI has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Giszmo has joined #bitcoin-wizards
dnaleor has quit [Quit: Leaving]
Noldorin has joined #bitcoin-wizards
BonyM1 has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
airbreather has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
pro has joined #bitcoin-wizards
airbreather has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
BonyM1 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
mountaingoat has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.6]
mountaingoat has joined #bitcoin-wizards
v20100 has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
rustyn has quit []
BonyM1 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
ThomasV has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
jtimon has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Chris_Stewart_5 has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
dnaleor has joined #bitcoin-wizards
BonyM1 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
airbreather has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
se3000 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
YOU-JI has quit [Quit: Leaving...]
AaronvanW has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
AaronvanW has joined #bitcoin-wizards
AaronvanW has joined #bitcoin-wizards
AaronvanW has quit [Changing host]
aalex__ has joined #bitcoin-wizards
aalex__ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
Newyorkadam has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Newyorkadam has quit [Client Quit]
ThomasV has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Davasny has joined #bitcoin-wizards
se3000 has quit [Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
<adiabat>
Taek: also to combine with this, need to increase granularity of output amounts
<adiabat>
the ultimate would be removing the 8-byte amount field entirely, with every utxo implicity worth "1"
<adiabat>
but since that's a little ugly in terms of utxo size, I think like 2^x, where x is 1 byte
<adiabat>
though 1 byte is overkill; could use 4 or 5 bits
Kiss has quit []
CrazyLoaf has joined #bitcoin-wizards
se3000 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
luke-jr has quit [Excess Flood]
luke-jr has joined #bitcoin-wizards
v20100 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
rubensayshi has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Davasny_ has joined #bitcoin-wizards
Davasny has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
<zmanian>
andytoshi: Hoping to make it to your talk tonight. The part of mimblewimble I'm most confused about is the excess outputs. I haven't been able to understand how they operate as proofs of authority
<kanzure>
is it streamed?
<zmanian>
They are always recorded. Intermittently streamed. No idea what the plan for tonight is
nikivi has joined #bitcoin-wizards
<Taek>
adiabat: if you don't have any 'amount' field you can't do change outputs, which I think would be necessary.
se3000 has quit [Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
Davasny_ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
Davasny has joined #bitcoin-wizards
dnaleor has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
<adiabat>
taek: but there wouldn't be need for change outputs in that case
<adiabat>
you'd always spend exactly as many utxos as you'd need
cluckj has joined #bitcoin-wizards
<Taek>
that doesn't scale very well b/c you need so many signatures
<adiabat>
right, way too many utxos
paveljanik has joined #bitcoin-wizards
paveljanik has joined #bitcoin-wizards
paveljanik has quit [Changing host]
nikivi has quit [Quit: irc]
<adiabat>
restricting to power-of-2 sized output amouts is kindof half-way, more utxos but still doable
cluckj has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
Chris_Stewart_5 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
kaalia has joined #bitcoin-wizards
cluckj has joined #bitcoin-wizards
<andytoshi>
zmanian: kk, i've got more time and i'll drop the content i skimmed in milan so hopefully i can say more about this
Chris_Stewart_5 has joined #bitcoin-wizards
<instagibbs>
understanding excess to me was everything locking into place. Need a good, easy to understand explanation.
<andytoshi>
mm yeah, me too. ok, i'll think about this
<andytoshi>
it's unfortunately a bit technical
<kanzure>
maybe also current status of grin
<andytoshi>
yeah, i'll talk about that briefly, i actually don't know what the status of the whole system is, i've just been poking at core..
laurentmt has joined #bitcoin-wizards
laurentmt has quit [Client Quit]
<Taek>
adiabat: if you can't split outputs apart at all you run into issues where you might not have any small tokens left. I imagine that merchants would end up with lots of small tokens and consumers would be stuck with big tokens - merchant income is from many sales, consumer income is from giant paychecks
kaalia is now known as kaalikahn
<Taek>
so you end up having to play this balancing game
<Taek>
you can't really do trades either (e.g. I send some small stuff you return big stuff) because that either requires trust or atomicity, and if it's atomic then you can link them together
<Taek>
well... barring some special protocol like CoinJoin which can remove the linkability
igno_peverell has joined #bitcoin-wizards
<nsh>
andytoshi, is your talk being streamed/recorded/kanzured?