apeiros_ changed the topic of #ruby-lang to: Ruby 2.0.0-p0: http://ruby-lang.org (Ruby 1.9.3-p392) || Paste >3 lines of text on http://gist.github.com
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<blowmage> zenspider: curious, what was the issue in ar?
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<zenspider> blowmage: hi!
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<TheNotary> I just learned a trick about using '!!' to get a true/false value from things like nil and strings and such. But my IDE shows that ruby throws a little warning when I use the trick. Is the trick bad to use?
<drbrain> TheNotary: needing exactly true or exactly false is a code smell
<drbrain> you should almost never need exactly true or exactly false
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<TheNotary> hmm.. What if it's for a function named with a question mark? e.g. valid_yaml_string?
<erikh> true is all the things not false or nil
<erikh> so the conversion is likely needless
<erikh> that's really expensive
<erikh> maybe load the yaml and store it elsewhere, and then return the yaml in that method?
<erikh> err, the hash
<erikh> or whatever YAML.load returns.
<TheNotary> yeah a hash
<erikh> right, so just return the hash
<erikh> you would already have it loaded and stored by this point
<erikh> loading it is going to be rather expensive.
<TheNotary> i'm still in the first pass, so I'm keeping things maxed out in terms of testability and readability, but I note that about saving the yaml output
<erikh> ok cool. the important thing is that the hash is true
<erikh> and an array or string from yaml (also possibilities) is also true
<erikh> now, if the yaml loads and evaluates to false, well, heh
<erikh> or nil
* erikh checks
<erikh> yeah, hah
<erikh> maybe that's not the best method.
<erikh> YAML.load('~') is totally legit yaml and totally nil
<erikh> drbrain: how do you guys deal with this in rubygems?
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<TheNotary> lol, I see why he did the !! then. So this is approximately the only case where !! should be implemented? I'm glad I brought the gist into it
<erikh> no, it doesn't matter
<erikh> you want an exception here
<drbrain> erikh: we check for a Gem::Specification explicitly
<erikh> TheNotary: do you know what type of object you expect?
<erikh> drbrain: thx
<TheNotary> erikh: None, this is like a very early stage utility method I'm using
<TheNotary> if it turns out the thing being loaded isn't proper yaml
<TheNotary> it trys another url
<TheNotary> 1 sec, lemme pull up the code I'm writing
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<drbrain> "valid yaml string" ha! there's lots and lots of strings that are nonsense YAML but still valid YAML strings
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<erikh> TheNotary: damn near everything is valid yaml
<drbrain> … and syck (the old parser) allows several invalid yaml strings
<drbrain> TheNotary: also, loading random YAML from the internet is a great step towards remote code execution
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<TheNotary> I'm doing things really hackishly to solve a problem I encountered at a higher level.
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<TheNotary> drbrain: woah, I hadn't thought of that
<TheNotary> the situation I'm doing is I have a gem going to a github repo
<drbrain> TheNotary: there's a lower-level API in psych that allows you to work around this
<TheNotary> or it's going directly to a file on a github repo
<drbrain> if you can fix the URL and verify certificates, you should be fine
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<erikh> I'm gonna be giving a friend some one-on-one ruby stuff
<TheNotary> if it just goes to the github repo and sees that "oh, there's no yaml config file here" then it tries to navigate to the raw cfg file that's located within that repo
<erikh> he's an ops guy; new to programming as I understadn it
<erikh> can anyone think of good starter things, presuming no programming experience, that are technically oriented?
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<erikh> not fib()
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<erikh> I meet with him saturday, been wracking my brain thinking of simple things.
<TheNotary> i'm goona sleep on my algorithm and see if I can't come up with something better than what I'm trying
<erikh> TheNotary: if you know it'll be a hash
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<TheNotary> erikh: have you seen codecademy.com ?
<drbrain> erikh: I've almost finished my libpcap wrapper, maybe he can do something with that?
<erikh> consider YAML.load(text) === Hash
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<erikh> drbrain: hmm lemme peek
<drbrain> erikh: I built drbdump on top of it: https://github.com/drbrain/drbdump
<erikh> I have some things in that department too, but we're talking "here's what a for loop does" level
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<erikh> need to bail soon, will look later
<erikh> oh! you might dig this: https://github.com/erikh/archive
<erikh> FFI, but still, not really good options for libarchive stuff.
<erikh> (needed JRuby support)
<erikh> oh, man, I know someone who really could use capp.
<drbrain> ❤ libarchive
<erikh> yeah, me too.
<erikh> I'll email it to him.
<drbrain> the other two ruby libpcap wrappers don't extract packet headers
<drbrain> which is the part you probably awnt
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<imperator> mix & match args? C'MON MAN!
<erikh> drbrain: previous job was at the makers of snort
<erikh> let's say... they have a need for something like this.
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<TheNotary> drbrain: For security purposes, should I use xml as a configuration file format rather than yaml? I'm planning an app where people trade post-install configurations for their OS (you know the tweaks you do to setup the UI and all that?). I want to make it like dotfile sharing, only for the OS itself (apt-get is invoked, gems are installed, .js files are patched, etc.). It's a big project riddled with security issues that I'll have to sort out dow
<TheNotary> n the road, but would using XML nip one such security problem in the bud?
<drbrain> TheNotary: the danger with YAML is that you can use it to construct ruby objects
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<drbrain> so XML would prevent remote code exploits on load
<drbrain> you can avoid YAML exploits on load by avoiding using YAML.load or Psych.load
<drbrain> but it takes more work
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<TheNotary> drbrain: k, great, I think I found something safe_yaml, but github is down so I can't be sure https://github.com/dtao/safe_yaml
<TheNotary> and "ALL OUR CODES ARE GONE!"
<TheNotary> ;)
<erikh> it's up for me
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<erikh> ok bbl
<infecto> anyone have experience using rspec?
<TheNotary> infecto: Yeah, what's the question
<zenspider> ew
<infecto> sry
<infecto> my question is getting the #food_calories test to work correctly, I am having trouble reading the hash that is stored in an array based on lines 9-10
<infecto> that is also a terribly worded question
<TheNotary> infecto: what is "double"? are you missing something like Double.new(blah)
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<infecto> double() is a rspec method that creates an object for testing
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<TheNotary> I think that snippet needs to show a little bit more about the Person class before anyone can help
<TheNotary> although we can of course implement a Person class for you w/ this info, it might not be too helpful ;)
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<infecto> its mostly my lack of understanding on how lines containg the double() work within rspec
<erikh> let creates a method called food1 that yields the contents of that block
<erikh> when called
<erikh> so near the bottom, you have person.eat(double("food1", :calories => 100))
<erikh> line 25
<erikh> effectively, that is
<erikh> does that help at all? I have no idea what double() does.
<infecto> it is a method stub within rspec, if that helps
<infecto> =)
<erikh> sure, so it's just creating something associated with the food1 string right?
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<erikh> like Food.new(:calories => 100) ?
<infecto> yes
<erikh> well, there you go.
<erikh> keep in mind your prospective employer and/or professors aren't going to let it go this far
<erikh> so you should probably read up
<infecto> this is just on my own
<TheNotary> infector: are you new to classes by any chance? I have things passing after implementing a Person class on my side
<infecto> someone sent me this rspec and I was trying to figure it out
<infecto> and no TheNotary
<infecto> just rspec
<TheNotary> ah, I see now
<TheNotary> interesting, starting with the testing framework and then moving to ruby
<TheNotary> You should google "ruby class" and that will provide lots of good info for you
<infecto> sry I was replying to the first question
<infecto> not new to classes or ruby
<infecto> only rspec
<TheNotary> oh
<infecto> i am new to TDD and rspec
<infecto> and no this is not a help me with my homework
<infecto> just playing around with this rspec file
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<TheNotary> RSpec::Mocks::MockExpectationError: Double "food1" received unexpected message :[] with (:calories)
<infecto> that was my problem
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<infecto> when I read the tests I assumed there was an array and within the array it owuld look like [["food1",{:calories=>150}]]
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<TheNotary> that's really odd, food1.calories works, but food1[:calories] fails
<TheNotary> this is the least intuitive piece of rspec I've ever seen
<TheNotary> so double doesn't act like a hash, it acts like an object that exposes attributes
<TheNotary> and you define those attributes... with a hash
<infecto> AHHH OK!
<infecto> while not intuitive, it makes sense now
<infecto> so if you pushed the double food1 & food2 into an array
<infecto> you could call index1 calories, array[0].calories
<infecto> lol
<infecto> that was throwing me off
<infecto> TheNotary you saved my evening
<infecto> thank you so much kind sir
<TheNotary> any time, it's always fun to see new things like double
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<infecto> you have no idea how helpful that was
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<NemesisD> is there a good reason in ruby why a stack level too deep error in a fairly complex rails app would have either no backtrace or a 1 line backtrace in some seemingly unrelated rails file
<NemesisD> could something be corrupting the stack?
<drbrain> NemesisD: ruby collapses identical frames
<zenspider> and they filter their own stack traces
<NemesisD> zenspider: they being rails or...
<drbrain> ruby
<zenspider> rails. isn't that what we're talking about?
<drbrain> ruby collapses identical frames for SystemStackError
<drbrain> rails does other filtering
<NemesisD> maybe i should step back and describe what's going on since its seriously weird
<NemesisD> we've got a resque job system running with about 3 worker machines. all of the sudden jobs, seemingly at random are failing to run with a stack level too deep error. each one reports either no stack trace in resque or a 1 line stack trace somewhere in the middle of AR or activesupport
<NemesisD> any attempt to run the job with the same arguments on the rails console works fine.
<NemesisD> so i could understand some collapsing in the stack trace but this seems like something else. i've been trying to bash on this problem for a few hours now and have gotten nowhere
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<drbrain> NemesisD: look at lib/active_record/connection_adapters/abstract/connection_pool.rb:348
<drbrain> notice anything funny there?
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<drbrain> NemesisD: looks like your class hierarchy got messed up somehow
<drbrain> so you have a class that is its own superclass and get caught in a loop
<drbrain> running any C extensions?
<imperator> a class that's its own superclass?
<NemesisD> i wonder if its an autoload thing
<NemesisD> im sure we're running C extensions from dependencies, but nothing we've written
<drbrain> you could modify retrieve_connection_pool to see what class is doing it
<drbrain> that might help
<NemesisD> drbrain: ah yeah. so the 2 lines in connection_pool are: pool = @connection_pools[klass.name] and Thread.current.object_id
<NemesisD> not sure if that's significant
<drbrain> NemesisD: the important one is that retrieve_connection_pool calls itself with the superclass
<drbrain> this shouldn't be a problem as eventually you get to BasicObject which has a superclass of nil
<drbrain> or you hit ActiveRecord::Base
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<NemesisD> hmm. another one of those backtrace call sites is a bit of metaprogramming for the class_attribute method, and its referencing the name of an attribue i think
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<NemesisD> oh and i should mention if it isn't obvious that those backtrace lines in the pastie are not part of the same backtrace. any backtrace resulting from ths stack level too deep is a single solitary line
<drbrain> I think the three connection ones are related somehow
<NemesisD> hmm
<NemesisD> would this happen if rails environment got double-loaded?
<drbrain> unknown
<zenspider> rawr! minitest 5 is gonna be freakin awesome
<drbrain> it shouldn't
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<blowmage> i am a minitest believer
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<zenspider> blowmage: phiggins and I had a nice pairing session and cleaned up a bunch of stuff
<blowmage> woo
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<zenspider> all mutex / synchronize code has been pushed to parallel_each.rb
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<zenspider> among other things
<zenspider> blowmage: if you could do a code review and really bash on it I'd appreciate it
<blowmage> okay! i'll bang on it tomorrow afternoon
<zenspider> I DO NOT WANT TO WAIT! I WANT CRITICISM NOOOOOOOWWWWWWWW!!!
<NemesisD> let the hate flow through you
<ryanf> zenspider: how come there's no minitest-bacon gem anyway? is it not done yet?
<zenspider> yeah. just haven't bothered yet. focusing on minitest5
<r0bglees0n> what's so great about minitest5?
<blowmage> Minitest::Test is infinitely superior to MiniTest::Unit::TestCase
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<r0bglees0n> in what sense?
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<zenspider> it is INFINITE... so EVERY SENSE. DUH
<zenspider> all you have to do to prove it is to make a mapping between senses and integers
<r0bglees0n> okay, but what is better about minitest5?
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<r0bglees0n> apart from the superclass change, what's new?
<blowmage> mt5 adds reporters which enable better integration
<r0bglees0n> some awesome changes
<r0bglees0n> i like the Test::Unit style of tests
<ryanf> haha I can see why this isn't going into ruby core :)
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<zenspider> it isn't going into ruby core because I refuse to "fix" test/unit
<r0bglees0n> i dont think test/unit is too terrible for writing tests
<r0bglees0n> it could be better but it has never really failed me
<zenspider> you've obviously never read the code
<r0bglees0n> nope i havent :)
<r0bglees0n> but i like writing tests that way, i've never had to worry about details
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<zenspider> you could make the same argument about rspec... but you'd be wrong.
<zenspider> you should strive to have your test tools be as simple and clean as possible. after all, you're using them to verify your software
<r0bglees0n> yeah rspec is alright, it wouldnt be my first choice on a personal project, i prefer simple subclasses for testing.
<zenspider> woosh
<r0bglees0n> you can write rspec that looks pretty
<zenspider> double-woosh
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<zenspider> argh. ruby trunk isn't building for me
<zenspider> I dunno what I did wrong
<zenspider> it should be clean
<zenspider> or damn close to clean
<zenspider> man I love make -j 8 on an MBA w/ SSD
<zenspider> zooom
<zenspider> ok. finally working. had to nuke .ext again. :(
<zenspider> so much for proper dependencies
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<xuser> zenspider: no gem for version 5?
<zenspider> xuser: not yet
<blowmage> what was the deal with the ar tests? how did you get them working?
<zenspider> ... trying to remember.
<zenspider> oh. prolly the last sticking point in mt5
<zenspider> I rename __name__ to name
<zenspider> and they have a setup that defines a constant ivar @name = "fred" or whatever
<zenspider> and that borked the run
<blowmage> yeah, i don't like that
<zenspider> not sure what was up with the pausing part... but it makes sense once I could dig into it
<zenspider> I need a better name
<zenspider> I nix __name__
<zenspider> and I _think_ I nix rails' method_name
<zenspider> can't have the word "test" in it either
<blowmage> as:tc messes with the spec name as well, but i haven't had many issues with that for a while now...
<blowmage> in minitest-rails
<zenspider> propose
<blowmage> so did you remove as:tc's @name?
<blowmage> i would like it to not use @name
<blowmage> that is my proposal :)
<blowmage> ugh, i can't look at that now
* blowmage goes back to working on talk
<xuser> why does the README.txt says to use "require 'rubygems'" and "gem 'minitest'" for ruby 1.9?
<xuser> zenspider: ^^
<zenspider> blowmage: they have alias_method :method_name, :name
<zenspider> I don't see any other reference, do you?
<zenspider> xuser: because it is old
<zenspider> xuser: well. no. it says to require rubygems because it is old
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<zenspider> it says to gem minitest for exactly the reason stated on the same line
<xuser> zenspider: wouldn't require 'minitest/autorun' just use the latest version?
<zenspider> ah yes. it does now. good point
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<zenspider> tho it depends on what version of ruby you're using
<zenspider> ruby 1.9.3-p0 and up seem fine
<xuser> you are still supporting 1.8?
<zenspider> yup
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<xuser> let it go ;)
<zenspider> I _use_ 1.8... so ... no
<zenspider> fixed the redame
<zenspider> readme even
<zenspider> aaand merged 4.7.4 into ruby core
<xuser> zenspider: you push to github?
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<xuser> guess not
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<zenspider> push what to github?
<xuser> the README
<zenspider> it'll push itself
<zenspider> 2 min
<xuser> ok
<zenspider> ok. beer && code is too noisy and my brain is done. laters
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<erikh> oof
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<yorickpeterse> morning
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<yorickpeterse> Hm, 170 "stars" on GH (if that means anything). notbad.jpg
<yorickpeterse> (for my linter)
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<erikh> nice
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<tbuehlmann> when running `$ RUBYOPT=-w rake test` I'd like to save the warning output to a file. `> warnings.log` just works for the actual test output and not the warnings. any idea?
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<judofyr> tbuehlmann: 2> warnings.log
<judofyr> tbuehlmann: or 2>&1 > warnings.log if you want everything
<tbuehlmann> perfect, thanks
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<yorickpeterse> Rails autoloader, y u so shit
<yorickpeterse> inb4 omakase
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<injekt> morning
<gnufied> morning .
<erikh> hi
<erikh> almost finished with this virualbox provisioner
<erikh> then it's all about the vmware
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<injekt> !
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<injekt> I thought you'd be sleeping, I commented on your fb pic :D
<erikh> oh ha
<erikh> I haven't looked yet
<erikh> been coding.
<injekt> it was silly
<injekt> (so a normal message from me)
<erikh> Indeed it was
<injekt> \o/
<erikh> "bae"?
<injekt> you haven't seen that meme?
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<erikh> maybe, don't recognize the term
<injekt> it's pretty new, some girl took a pic of herself saying "bae caught be slippin" and in the mirror you can see she clearly took the photo herself
<injekt> then came the parody pics
<injekt> so it's nothing at all like your pic
<injekt> so i dont know why i wrote it
<injekt> im tired
<yorickpeterse> that shit's old
<injekt> it's internet old
<yorickpeterse> your face is old
<injekt> you are internet old
<injekt> my face IS pretty old
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<injekt> I dont age well
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<erikh> hehe
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<erikh> man, you look like british bieber
<erikh> just sayin'
<erikh> pretty boy.
<injekt> hahaha fuck you
<yorickpeterse> hahahaha
<injekt> im not a pretty boy!
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<gnufied> your mom is old
<erikh> don't worry. in like 10 years you'll look like me
<injekt> I laughed milk out my nose then
<erikh> grumpy and crusty and old
<erikh> and fat probably too
<injekt> I dont think I'll ever be able to grow a beard
<judofyr> got TIlt down to 17 issues (where 10 are feature requests I'm going to look at later!) :D https://github.com/rtomayko/tilt/issues
<erikh> it's ok I can't either
<injekt> na I've been fat already and lost it
<erikh> that took me like, 4 months
<injekt> erikh: lol :D
<injekt> judofyr: nice work!
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<erikh> judofyr: indeed, nice
<injekt> that reminds me I need to clean up mechanize today
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<gnufied> judofyr: nice!
<erikh> injekt: oh, are you the maintainer now?
<injekt> got down from ~30 issues to ~7 but some of them are retarded
<injekt> erikh: mostly me and knu yeah
<erikh> neato
<injekt> ntlm sucks and i dont know how to test it
<erikh> oh, yeah.
<erikh> hm.
<judofyr> injekt: nice! keep up the good work :)
<injekt> judofyr: thanks! :)
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<erikh> I think there's an apache module that checks against samba
<injekt> erikh: ouch :(
<erikh> well, ntlm
<erikh> on unix
<erikh> think about that for a minute
<injekt> heh exactly
<injekt> so I have issues like "Request to change ntlm-http to ruby-ntlm due to license issue"
<erikh> hah really?
<erikh> man, I would just torch support
<erikh> but I'm an asshole
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<injekt> thinking of that, it's there but untested and none of us have managed to build good tests for it
<injekt> and the guy who put the issue forward doesn't really want to help
<erikh> yeah, is he @ microsoft or something?
<injekt> open source eh?
<injekt> i dunno
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<injekt> oh no
<yorickpeterse> open sores
<injekt> he just maintains fedora packages...
<erikh> oh, is he a lawyer?
<erikh> oh
<erikh> then tell him to sit and spin
<injekt> he's one of them
<erikh> yeah.
<erikh> that's how you handle those.
<injekt> a darix
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<injekt> darix is cool though
<erikh> well, that's how *I* handle those.
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<erikh> I like darix.
<erikh> he's helpful.
<injekt> indeed
<erikh> most of the package maintainers I've ran into are seagulls
<erikh> fly in, shit on everything, fly away
<injekt> yup
<injekt> I got shit on by a segull in venice a couple weeks ago :(
<erikh> haha
<injekt> seagull*
<erikh> come to america
<erikh> I can show you places
<erikh> where seagulls are responsible for whole natural wonders
<injekt> do you say that to all the guys?
<erikh> yes
<injekt> :D
<erikh> but seriously, off the coast of san diego
<erikh> tons of small islands
<erikh> "islands"
<injekt> nice
<injekt> where the poopers be poopin'
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<erikh> indeed.
<injekt> fresh warm bread, I can't think of things much nicer than that
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<erikh> cocain
<erikh> e
<erikh> damnit
<erikh> totally had that.
<injekt> fresh warm bread laced with cocaine
<injekt> I got you bro
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<erikh> holy crap that sounds like an amazing combination
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<erikh> "that's some mighty great french toast may I have another"
<erikh> keep in mind I've never actually done that ever
<injekt> :D
<erikh> I just like to dream
<injekt> it could probably be called portland toast
<erikh> heh
<erikh> actually, pretty sure the bay has the win in that department on the west coast
<erikh> at least just from casual conversation. there's always some venture douche looking for coke at bars I end up at.
<injekt> lol
<injekt> judofyr: are rails core considering tilt, then?
<judofyr> injekt: not sure, but it was mentioned here: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rubyonrails-gsoc/N7uDY_6513I
<injekt> judofyr: ah yeah
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<judofyr> injekt: Sprockets is already using it
<judofyr> injekt: I should have looked it this before Rails 4 though :/
<injekt> judofyr: :D
<judofyr> not sure if they're willing to change it in a point-release
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<judofyr> or well, this is Rails
<judofyr> they change everything all the time
<injekt> :)
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<judofyr> I think it would be a good thing for Tilt 2.0
<judofyr> (to make it versatile enough to handle Rails)
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<gnufied> judofyr: you will have to likely push for it yourself though
<judofyr> gnufied: yeah, I'm afraid so
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<yorickpeterse> whitequark: your article made it to Ruby Weekly
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<yorickpeterse> precious pageviews
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<yorickpeterse> and parser is also featured
<yorickpeterse> lucky bastard
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<andrewvos> sweet sweet pageviews
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<andrewvos> Damn whitequark that parser article looks very cool.
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<tbuehlmann> I don't see where that's a duplicated range. ideas?
<judofyr> tbuehlmann: i and i
<judofyr> tbuehlmann: I think you mean /\p{digit}/
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<fowl> warning: possibly useless use of a literal in void context nice warning :o
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<tbuehlmann> judofyr, aren't there new matchers like [:digit:], [:space:] and stuff?
<judofyr> tbuehlmann: I think it's [[:digit:]]
<tbuehlmann> ah
<tbuehlmann> foo.rb:1: warning: character class has duplicated range: /[[:digit]]/
<fowl> :]]
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<tbuehlmann> aw, man
<tbuehlmann> great, thank you
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<erikh> injekt: the equivalent of a box add, then boot 4 machines to fully booted state, then shut them down
<erikh> 90s
<erikh> well, booted enough to respond to ssh
<erikh> sorry 85s.
<erikh> :P
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<erikh> the import is about 25-30 seconds of that, fwiw.
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<injekt> :D
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<injekt> I just rewrote a csv importer I built for work from 2 lines of Ruby to 67 lines of Go :/
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<yorickpeterse> yeah but it's webscale
<yorickpeterse> Post on HN about it, you'll get mad karma
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<injekt> lol
<injekt> na im not that kinda guy
<darix> injekt: well try in java. i think you can beat the linecount from Go. maybe 100+ lines!;
<darix> ;)
<injekt> it did save me 150% in performance
<erikh> 100
<erikh> you're being generous
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<erikh> 100 lines just for the class boilerplate
<erikh> and the maven pom files
<erikh> injekt: that's right, you and dom like go
<injekt> erikh: we use it at work now
<erikh> been wanting to do more clojure, but this project is sapping all my time
<erikh> oh, nice!
<injekt> well, 'we' being me
<erikh> heh
<injekt> our api is written in go
<erikh> very cool
<erikh> I had this idea for an API throttling proxy
<erikh> was going to do it in clj
<injekt> neat
<erikh> basically, because API services rarely deal with cache headers properly
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<erikh> proxy/cache the last response to the initial request
<erikh> then poll in the background as a part of the proxy
<erikh> only update the cache when the state changes
<erikh> useful for status APIs, things people tend to hammer.
<erikh> but ENOTIME
<injekt> heh i know that feeling
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<erikh> well I'm really happy
<erikh> the tests already do more work than the old vagrant stuff
<erikh> and have a runtime of 60-70% of the vagrant stuff
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<yorickpeterse> TIL const_missing doesn't take namespacing into account
<yorickpeterse> errr, scoping
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<whitequark> constant handling is in pretty sorry state in ruby, imo
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<kleech> Anyone have any thoughts on what you would called an object which represents a location (lng/lat) and time?
<whitequark> SpaceTimePoint
<yorickpeterse> I was also kinda surprised you can reassign constants used for classes
<yorickpeterse> Hm, I wonder how that works with instances
<kleech> @whitequark Thanks, Point was my only thought :)
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: you do understand that all constants are created equal, right?
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: yes
<yorickpeterse> but I was hoping for some kind of protection. However, it seems it doesn't actually break instances
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<yorickpeterse> >> class Person; def name; 'Matz'; end; end; p = Person.new; Person = 10; p.name
<eval-in> yorickpeterse => /tmp/execpad-ca4b31332483/source-ca4b31332483:2: warning: already initialized constant Person ... (http://eval.in/19776)
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: you do understand instances do not refer to constants, right?
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: #class does
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: nope
<whitequark> #class refers to the Class instance
<whitequark> >> Class.new.new
<eval-in> whitequark => #<#<Class:0x4080d654>:0x4080d62c> (http://eval.in/19777)
<yorickpeterse> >> class Person; end; Person.new.class
<eval-in> yorickpeterse => Person (http://eval.in/19778)
<yorickpeterse> Pretty sure I'm seeing "Person" there
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: so?
<whitequark> it *still* refers to the Class instance.
<whitequark> look
<whitequark> >> c = Class.new; i = c.new; p i; A = c; p i
<eval-in> whitequark => #<#<Class:0x412f14bc>:0x412f1494> ... (http://eval.in/19779)
<yorickpeterse> yeah I can't fucking read that
<whitequark> well
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<whitequark> when you assign a Module instance to a constant, its name gets assigned to the canonical constant name
<whitequark> a special case.
<yorickpeterse> What I was meaning to say is that I somewhere in the back of my head expected it to break when re-assigning a constant used for a class
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<whitequark> argh, I really need to open-source Foundry's partial evaluator
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<erikh> classes have an object_id just like any other object
<erikh> the inspect output tries to get the name first
<erikh> Class#name
<erikh> barring that, it falls back to object
<whitequark> ^
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<erikh> you can see this
<erikh> Class.new.name should still be empty on rubies
<erikh> nope, it's nil these days. even better.
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<erikh> compare with class Foo; end; Foo.name
<erikh> hth
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<yorickpeterse> yes yes I get it already
<erikh> hhahah
<erikh> sorry, lots of caffeine today
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<whitequark> is it a workday already
<yorickpeterse> not in Russia
<erikh> nah I'm jobless
<charliesome> >> class A; end; module M; end; Marshal.load("\x04\bIe:\x06Mc\x06A\x06:\x12__classpath__I\"\x13new class name\x06:\x06ET"); A.name
<eval-in> charliesome => "new class name" (http://eval.in/19781)
<whitequark> I just typed this URL because maybe it exists
<erikh> haha
<whitequark> charliesome: hmm... does that mean you can rescue fatal?
<charliesome> whitequark: wha
<whitequark> charliesome: you supposedly cannot rescue "fatal", a subclass of Exception because of its name
<charliesome> never heard of fatal
<yorickpeterse> good, because I heard it's bad for you
<charliesome> lemme try
<charliesome> whitequark: how do you trigger fatal?
<whitequark> charliesome: seems that you can do something with RUBYLIB_PREFIX env var: http://rxr.whitequark.org/mri/source/ruby.c#186
<whitequark> but overall it's hard
<erikh> free a null pointer in a C exception
<erikh> extension
<erikh> arg
<whitequark> ^ or that, but if you don't want to write a Cext (in which case just use rb_fatal directly), it's the only way
<erikh> oh, that's just a pathspec
<erikh> probably setting it to :: or ;; would work
<charliesome> hang on
<charliesome> maybe figured out how to rescue it
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<charliesome> whitequark: yeah you can pull it from the object space
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<charliesome> >> (-1024..1024).map { |i| ObjectSpace._id2ref(SignalException.object_id + i) rescue nil }.grep(Class).select { |k| k < Exception }.select { |k| k.to_s[0] == "#" }.first
<eval-in> charliesome => #<Class:0x413b63ac> (http://eval.in/19798)
<charliesome> thats fatal
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<charliesome> whitequark ^
<yorickpeterse> wat
<charliesome> that's the fatal class
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<charliesome> i ran it locally with a c extension that returned rb_eFatal to me
<charliesome> that line of code returned the same object as rb_eFatal
<whitequark> cool
<whitequark> can it be rescued
<yorickpeterse> charliesome: are you some kind of hacker?
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<charliesome> >> fatal = (-1024..1024).map { |i| ObjectSpace._id2ref(SignalException.object_id + i) rescue nil }.grep(Class).select { |k| k < Exception }.select { |k| k.to_s[0] == "#" }.first; begin; raise fatal; rescue fatal; puts "yes"; end
<eval-in> charliesome => yes ... (http://eval.in/19799)
<charliesome> yes
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<yorickpeterse> heh
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<yorickpeterse> injekt: damn, with your new Twitter photo you really do look like british bieber
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<charliesome> whitequark: have you seen the one where you can write to an arbitrary memory location in pure ruby
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<injekt> yorickpeterse: what the hell
<injekt> yorickpeterse: i have short hair!
<injekt> yorickpeterse: maybe if i put your hair on my head
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<whitequark> charliesome: it's quite restricted though
<charliesome> still funny though
<charliesome> imagine if MRI ran in browsers
<injekt> then we'd have slower web pages!
<injekt> :troll:
<yorickpeterse> injekt: heh jokes on you, I had a haircut
<yorickpeterse> like, a month ago
<injekt> yorickpeterse: :o
<yorickpeterse> but still!
<charliesome> injekt: and everyone would be pwned :p
<injekt> yorickpeterse: but your long locks!
<injekt> charliesome: :D
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<yorickpeterse> basically now it's just a bit shorter and a bit more to the side
<injekt> cool, mine sucks because my forehead is HUGE
<whitequark> hair. hair everywhere
<injekt> I blame it on my massive brain, but that rarely works
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<yorickpeterse> hm, I might have a pretty photo somewhere
<yorickpeterse> hm no, that's just a photo of the side of me eating korean food
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<yorickpeterse> in unrelated news, there's a bird here that keeps looking at himself in every car mirror
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<yorickpeterse> and he actually moves from car to car to check himself out
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<injekt> damn ego birds
<whitequark> from car to cdr
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<yorickpeterse> Hm, tempted to give lolcommits a try
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<yorickpeterse> though it's probably OS Cook only
<yorickpeterse> oh shit, it actually works on the linux as well
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<judofyr> oh god, I just found a bug in iOS WebKit
<charliesome> judofyr: what's the bug?
<judofyr> appearently: if you have a CSS-node with `:active` (doesn't actually have to match) AND an <input type="search"> AND tries to embed YouTube, it's not possible to click on the video
<GarethAdams> it's not a bug to play Pop Idol content
<judofyr> (e.g. touches do nothing)
<GarethAdams> no matter how much you want it to
<GarethAdams> *be
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<charliesome> judofyr: hah
<judofyr> load the URL in iOS 6 and try to play the video
<judofyr> won't work
<judofyr> remove the type="search": everything is fine
<judofyr> remove the :active: everything is fine
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<judofyr> :(
<judofyr> I don't even
<judofyr> the odd thing is that the video is inside an iframe
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<judofyr> but the styling/markup on the parent changes the behavior
<judofyr> I wonder what the *actual* bug is, but I'm not going to debug YouTube's JS now
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<yorickpeterse> wohoo, got lolcommits to work
<yorickpeterse> too much backlight though
<yorickpeterse> lets fix that
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<whitequark> backlight?
<yorickpeterse> er, background light or w/e
<yorickpeterse> There's a window right behind me
<yorickpeterse> so everything in the picture is too dark
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<ddfreyne> whitequark: What book were you referring to on Twitter?
<ddfreyne> (series)
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<whitequark> ddfreyne: it's in russian
<ddfreyne> KITTY
<whitequark> *facedesk*
<whitequark> the first one is pretty good. better than 90% of stuff which is printed. the second one... well... I hope that third is *actually* better.
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<whitequark> ddfreyne: if you want something random & good, read True Names by Vernor Vinge
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<judofyr> whitequark: you here?
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<jaclinuxhelp> how can i make spinach generate just one given feature file ?
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<yorickpeterse> herro
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<erikh> hi
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<yorickpeterse> currently watching it on the toilet
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<erikh> just learned about rb_intern
<erikh> how ... why .. is it named that
<erikh> why not rb_object_id
<erikh> or something ... less surprising
<erikh> it doens't convert to symbols
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<yorickpeterse> because MRI
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<whitequark> erikh: lisp
<erikh> whitequark: intern converts strings to symbols in lisp
<whitequark> yeah
<erikh> rb_intern is basically #object_id
<whitequark> hm...
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<whitequark> it converts strings to raw symbol IDs, right?
<whitequark> not VALUEs
<whitequark> I think they're distinct from what #object_id returns
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<judofyr> gah, I hate waiting :(
<judofyr> it's been five hours! I want to merge this thing: https://github.com/rtomayko/tilt/pull/187
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<yorickpeterse> rb_intern returns the symbol for a given string
<yorickpeterse> rb_intern("foo") is basically :foo
<erikh> it returns the ID
<yorickpeterse> erikh: yes, but it's the ID of the symbol
<yorickpeterse> similar to how VALUEs are IDs
<erikh> hmm
<erikh> you're probably right. that makes more sense
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<erikh> I was thinking it just pulled it off the heap for whatever was passed
<erikh> or, well, ruby's equivalent
<whitequark> I would still expect it to return a VALUE...
<erikh> there is one that returns a value
<erikh> it's just not rb_intern
<whitequark> but yeah, returning an ID makes sense
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<whitequark> sure
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<yorickpeterse> NIIIIICEEE, my Mozilla phone is being shipped
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<yorickpeterse> (completely related)
<whitequark> javascript on your phone! what could possibly go wrong
<erikh> heh
<erikh> whitequark: horribru
<whitequark> erikh: I just view this as a completely wrong route
<whitequark> "let's tie generally unrelated stuff with a very bad accidental implementation detail because X"
<whitequark> is wrong
<whitequark> regardless of X.
<yorickpeterse> Oh, I don't like the JS part either
<yorickpeterse> (because fuck JS)
<yorickpeterse> but for 150 euros I don't mind, I need a new phone anyway
<whitequark> huh
<yorickpeterse> (I got the expensive one)
<erikh> whitequark: I get your sentiment
<yorickpeterse> http://shop.geeksphone.com/en/ <- prices
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<yorickpeterse> tbh I'm very tempted to write a big rant on how I dislike Javascript but I feel it would turn into a "X is a ghetto" rant
<injekt> BITCHES
<injekt> wow
<injekt> wrong box
<yorickpeterse> hai bieber
<injekt> oi
<yorickpeterse> hahaha
<erikh> injekt: hahah
<injekt> apparently t'was the right box
<yorickpeterse> injekt: you know, that's exactly the same way I say hi in another channel once in a while
<injekt> and mostly directed at yorickpeterse
<injekt> yorickpeterse: :D
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<yorickpeterse> but yeah, for 150 (or 90) bucks I don't mind having Douglas on my phone
<whitequark> sigh... windows 8 product placement is FAR worse when it's on a macbook
<yorickpeterse> if worst comes to worst I'll just turn it into a glorified Raspberry pi
<injekt> what's a douglas
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: (replace this with a rant about rpi)
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<yorickpeterse> heh
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<yorickpeterse> On my way home I actually thought about writing "scriptcoffee" that would compile Javascript to Coffeescript, just to show how silly this whole "COMPILE ALL THE THINGS TO JS" mentality is
<yorickpeterse> then I realized people would probably actually try to use it
<whitequark> I'm sure it already exists...
<whitequark> actually, this is wrong on more than one level
<yorickpeterse> haha
<whitequark> "compile all things to JVM bytecode" is similarly wrong, though JVM indeed does offer a more sane and suitable environment
<yorickpeterse> http://js2coffee.org/ loooool
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<whitequark> you'll find much less people advocating to not compile stuff down to jvm ;)
<yorickpeterse> or: use Opal to compile Ruby to Javascript and then compile that to Coffeescript
<whitequark> Opal isn't Ruby in the slightest
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: the JVM is at least a viable platform
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: I know that
<yorickpeterse> and the parser is...odd
<judofyr> and here's the combination: http://int3.github.io/doppio/
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: I'm not sure what is more viable, tbh, JVM or JS
<yorickpeterse> JVM has a far better toolchain
<yorickpeterse> it's also much more mature, has more tuning features, etc
<judofyr> I guess this page is better: http://int3.github.io/doppio/about.html - "Java on Coffeescript."
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: what the fuck
<yorickpeterse> where do these people get their drugs?
<yorickpeterse> My main issue is not compiling to JS per se, it's the fact that people are locking themselves down to a single language in browser in combination with it
<yorickpeterse> similar to how people locked themselves down to Flash and ActiveX
<yorickpeterse> instead of making it possible to use more than JS
<whitequark> similar to how people lock themselves to JVM
<yorickpeterse> also JS is a retarded language
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: I'd probably bitch equally if the JVM was actually relevant to what I do
<whitequark> it all boils down to the fact that we suck at interfacing code in different languages
<whitequark> if it's not C and anything (and even if it is)
<yorickpeterse> and don't get me started on asm.js
<whitequark> asm.js is needed but overhyped
<erikh> whitequark: llvm seems to be a step in the right direction there
<judofyr> I actually think asm.js is a good idea
<whitequark> I speculated that V8 would be able to run asm.js-conformant code without a separate compiler
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: needed for what? I can't think of anything where it would be useful
<whitequark> and indeed, V8 devs think exactly the same
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: compiling C to the browser
<yorickpeterse> I fear the day some nerd uses it to speed up his DOM crap
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: it's basically a codification of rules which emscripten uses
<whitequark> just that.
<yorickpeterse> "Oh yeah, I rewrote jQuery in asm.js because it's cool"
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: pls read what asm.js actually is before ranting.
<whitequark> erikh: I afraid no.
<yorickpeterse> I have?
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: then you'll now that asm.js can't communicate with the DOM at all
<whitequark> LLVM almost entirely solves the problem of writing your own target-dependent and other low-level optimization passes, and compiler backends
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<yorickpeterse> ok note to self: stupid jokes don't work in this channel because people take you too seriously
<whitequark> erikh: however... it does nothing to ease interfacing. it doesn't even support the C ABI directly.
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: FINALLY
<erikh> oh, ok
<erikh> I misunderstood
<erikh> good to know, thanks.
<yorickpeterse> I just want to see JS die so badly
<whitequark> erikh: LLVM is amazing but it's basically a replacement for compiling your language to C then down to machine code
<erikh> right
<whitequark> as you probably know, a lot of languages did that
<erikh> yep
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<erikh> as is probably obvious, I've only done a little reading about it
<whitequark> so it's just a much more direct, sane, and simple mapping to the semantics of underlying hardware.
<whitequark> erikh: I'm using LLVM quite a lot... feel free to ask if you have questions.
<yorickpeterse> is it webscale?
<erikh> maybe, but I'm lost in devops land for a little while longer.
<whitequark> *facedesk*
<erikh> my next hobby task is to write a proper bootloader that inits enough video to display an image in 1080p
<judofyr> erikh: I wouldn't trust whitequark. he's been writing this Ruby-thingie *forever* and it doesn't even run Rails yet.
<erikh> judofyr: eh
<erikh> judofyr: so it's more feature rich than rubinius
* erikh hides
<whitequark> LOL
<erikh> i am a horrible person
<whitequark> erikh: platform?
<erikh> whitequark: oh, just standard ia32 stuff.
<yorickpeterse> erikh: hey, Rbx actually runs Rails
<erikh> whitequark: just want to learn how to do it, no other real goal in mind.
<whitequark> erikh: you'll probably have a hard time with 1080p
<yorickpeterse> in fact, I was quite amazed to see that one of our two big apps actually runs just fine on it
<erikh> yeah, vesa's gonna require PM from what I read
<whitequark> erikh: no no
<erikh> err, protected mode, not power management
<whitequark> erikh: VBE generally works in real mode, and you specifically need VBE3 to be able to use it from PM
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: is it faster?
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<erikh> whitequark: hm. mind if I prod you when I get back to this task?
<whitequark> erikh: I just didn't see much cards which exported 1920x1080 video which actually worked... but then again it was 5 years ago
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<whitequark> erikh: sure
<erikh> yeah, a lot has changed in 5 years.
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: I tested it in dev mode so I'm not sure, didn't really benchmark beyond checking memory usage
<erikh> it's hard to find video these days that won't do it
<yorickpeterse> which is about 2x as much
<whitequark> erikh: my video card supported the resolution even at those days
<whitequark> but didn't export it as a working VBE mode
<erikh> sure, but were they shipping over HDMI exclusively?
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<erikh> anyhow, details for another time
<whitequark> ok
<yorickpeterse> Hm wait, I actually think both our main apps ran on Rbx
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<judofyr> what's the real advantages of rbx these days (other than "cleaner internals"). is it faster? no GIL?
<yorickpeterse> but jruby failed at one of them due to the use of some MRI specific stuff
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<yorickpeterse> judofyr: No GIL, actual threads, easy to contribute (most is Just Ruby TM)
<erikh> it's GIL-free with C
<yorickpeterse> No half-assed C API
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<yorickpeterse> works with most C extensions btw
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<erikh> and the whole ruby thing.
<yorickpeterse> since they have a nice compat layer
<yorickpeterse> only some very specific MRI stuff doesn't seem to work (e.g. ruby-prof)
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<whitequark> for... some reason, each time I tried rbx it crashed on me in various, often funny (segv) ways
<judofyr> so actual advantages for *me*: actual threads and no GIL.
<yorickpeterse> plus I'd prefer to put my money on brixen than on the MRI team (no offence)
<whitequark> ...
<whitequark> I won't comment on that
<yorickpeterse> When I look at the way stuff goes in MRI I see very smart people that at some time kinda lost control of the project
<yorickpeterse> I suppose part of that is natural due to the age
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: interesting. I have the exact opposite feeling
<whitequark> that MRI is undergoing changes in one of the best possible ways
<yorickpeterse> I mean, the Rbx source code is a bit of a clusterfuck when you first start out but it's much better if you're only dealing with the pure Ruby stuff
<erikh> yeah, I've never had rbx do anything but segfault for me.
<whitequark> look, 1.8 transition is... mostly... over; compare with python where almost everyone is still on python2.7
<yorickpeterse> I'm talking about Rbx 2.0 HEAD btw
<dbussink> erikh: please report issues like that then
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<judofyr> dbussink: it segfaults on travis too: https://travis-ci.org/rtomayko/tilt/jobs/6697665
<judofyr> (randomly)
<dbussink> judofyr: can you please open an issue for that?
<yorickpeterse> MRI will never have proper threading (unless Raptor jesus starts writing MRI code), that alone is alarming for me
<whitequark> MRI team is getting somewhat more open to the contributions to spec thanks to headius' work
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: so?
<yorickpeterse> since at $WORK we have *a lot* of use cases for proper threading
<judofyr> I've started ignoring "The build is broken" emails because I always know it's rbx segfaulting…
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: you just answered your own question
<dbussink> judofyr: please report them to us so we can fix them
<yorickpeterse> whitequark: I didn't ask a question
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: it's a Reference implementation
<dbussink> judofyr: if we don't know about them, we can't fix them :(
<yorickpeterse> I also never said MRI wasn't improving
<yorickpeterse> So stop making assumptions
<erikh> relax and kiss folks
<whitequark> its main purpose is to provide something to compare your implementation behavior to
<erikh> I'm installing a compiler! be happy for me
<yorickpeterse> the thing is that there's nothing substantial to compare to. There's MRI but you should know well enough that it isn't exactly standarized
<whitequark> so: use rbx or jruby in production, as you're supposed to, by the MRI team
<erikh> I have no idea why, but be happy anyhow
<judofyr> dbussink: also: is rbx-18mode considered stable/actively developed?
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<whitequark> yorickpeterse: it's "good enough"
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: eh, give me a sec and I'll see what tilt does on my laptop on Rbx
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<whitequark> yorickpeterse: there is no Python spec. there is nothing close to a compatible Perl implementation
<yorickpeterse> Python at least has the PEPs...that nobody follows
<erikh> there is a python spec
<whitequark> at least we have rubyspec which is better than nothing
<dbussink> judofyr: 1.8 mode doesn't get much changes except the generic vm improvements etc.
<whitequark> erikh: gimme
<erikh> or so I thought?
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<yorickpeterse> whitequark: yes, and Rubyspec is mostly reverse engineered by brixen
<erikh> it's the PEP stuff right?
<yorickpeterse> from what MRI does
<erikh> oh, ok
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<yorickpeterse> MRI is fine for most people though
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: yeah. it's better than nothing and better than our neighbors' situation
<judofyr> dbussink: linked some errors here: https://github.com/rubinius/rubinius/issues/2329
<dbussink> judofyr: ok, thanks!
<whitequark> yorickpeterse: ISO standard is also Good To Have
<yorickpeterse> meh, I should probably find a way to get $WORK to buy it
<yorickpeterse> cbf spending that amount of money myself
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: what do I run in order to run Tilt's test suite?
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: `bundle; bundle exec rake`
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<judofyr> yorickpeterse: it's quite dependency-heavy
<whitequark> judofyr: how much hundreds?
<yorickpeterse> meh that's fine, I already have....wait
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: you can also just try `rake test`
<yorickpeterse> only 73 gems?
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<yorickpeterse> Hm, probably cleaned them up a while ago
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<whitequark> argh, linode's IO alerts are mostly useless
<judofyr> whitequark: not that bad: cat Gemfile.lock | wc -l # => 78
<whitequark> I don't care if I have lots of IO... I want to know WHY do I have lots of io
<judofyr> 36 gems
<judofyr> template engines (luckily) don't have many dependencies
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<judofyr> but I think Tilt alone provides support for template engines in ~22 different gems
<whitequark> hm, I wonder
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<whitequark> erikh: as a devops guy. what would you want from a module system built into a programming language?
<erikh> oh, rubygems?
<yorickpeterse> if anything, no .h files plz
<whitequark> and by module system I mean scheme's, java's (failed?) Project Jigsaw, go's, etc
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<erikh> hmm
<erikh> let's chat about this later
<whitequark> C, C++ and Ruby don't have any
<erikh> I do have ideas
<erikh> lots of them
<erikh> but, I'll be plain: I like jars a lot
<whitequark> erikh: I'd have to design such a system for Foundry soon...
<erikh> they are basically the simplest thing that could possibly work
<whitequark> erikh: hm. Java devs disagree and want to transition *from* jars
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<judofyr> whitequark: what do they want to transition to?
<erikh> that's just because most java devs have never used anything else
<erikh> I'd have to read a lot of that
<erikh> will store in pocket atm
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<whitequark> erikh: this is the high-level overview: http://cr.openjdk.java.net/~mr/jigsaw/notes/jigsaw-big-picture-01
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<whitequark> I have the same goals
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<whitequark> (mostly?)
<judofyr> hm. versioning in modules.
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<judofyr> one thing I miss in Ruby: only one version on a gem it the runtime at the same time (as opposed to Node's approach)
<judofyr> s/it//
<judofyr> s/on/of/
<judofyr> gah, or something
<judofyr> you get it, right?
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<whitequark> hmmm
<whitequark> I think drbrain said he'd remove the "multiple installed versions" feature from rubygems, as well
<whitequark> if he did it from scratch
<whitequark> there's merit to it.
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<judofyr> well, you need to change the language to handle multiple versions of the same gem in the same runtime
<yxhuvud> whaaat. That part I *really* like.
<yorickpeterse> Ruby's require system is pretty basic sadly
<yorickpeterse> well, it's whole module system (or lack thereof)
<whitequark> judofyr: no. you don't.
<whitequark> it produces more problems than it solves
<whitequark> you can kind of do that with a proper module system
<yxhuvud> sure, it takes bundler oslt to work out as it should, but not being able tohave multiple installed versions is really nice.
<judofyr> whitequark: I disagree. as long as you have a way of specifying which dependencies that should be shared you should be fine (e.g http://blog.nodejs.org/2013/02/07/peer-dependencies/)
<whitequark> yxhuvud: yes this is the whole point
<whitequark> yxhuvud: the system gems have just one version, everything else uses project-specific bundle
<whitequark> also solves interaction with package managers
<yxhuvud> from what I've seen of packaged gems, not allowing multiples is the least problem.
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<yorickpeterse> judofyr: tests run fine on Rbx
<yorickpeterse> this is from Git HEAD though
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: latest master is the same commit as the released 1.4.0 :)
<yorickpeterse> lets see what 1.8 mode does
<yorickpeterse> judofyr: eeeehh nope
<yorickpeterse> or do you mean Tilt?
<yorickpeterse> also, 1.8 mode explodes
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: ah. yes, I mean't Tilt :)
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: trying undefine a method that doesn't exist?
<yorickpeterse> not sure, running with --trace so I can actually see the stacktrace of Rake
<yorickpeterse> pastie coming up
<yorickpeterse> undefined class or module Encoding (ArgumentError) # wat
<judofyr> huh
<yorickpeterse> also lol, ANSI
<judofyr> in the JSON gem
<judofyr> odd
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: try RUBYLIB=lib:test ruby test/tilt_compilesite_test.rb
<yorickpeterse> hm, it's not a direct dep either
<yorickpeterse> so I can't update it to see what that does
<judofyr> that's the Travis has been having problems with
<yorickpeterse> works fine
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<yorickpeterse> rbx-19mode => try rbx-head
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<yorickpeterse> not sure if you can specify it to then run in 1.9 mode though, I think it just uses 1.8 in that case
<yorickpeterse> (in .travis.yml)
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<dbussink> yorickpeterse: maybe it's a platform difference with linux
<dbussink> that can result in different timings / semantics for certain cases etc.
<yorickpeterse> Well, I'm on Linux
<yorickpeterse> and so is Travis
<yorickpeterse> I do have a much newer Kernel but I highly doubt that's related
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<yorickpeterse> judofyr: hm, execjs seems to have a specific version dependency of JSON
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<yorickpeterse> hm, stacktrace shows that it also fails with JSON 1.7
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<yorickpeterse> it's a bug in the JSON gem
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<yorickpeterse> a simple `require 'json'` in IRB also blows up
<yorickpeterse> oh derp
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<yorickpeterse> hahahaha
<yorickpeterse> forgot `require 'rubygems'`
<yorickpeterse> nope, still blows up
<yorickpeterse> json bug confirmed
* yorickpeterse is rubberducking on IRC
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<yxhuvud> seems a bit strange. it is not as if json is a rare thing to require.
<yorickpeterse> dbussink: http://pastie.org/pastes/7754608/text?key=mwxxyxjnux1ldsxgrc03g is this an Rbx issue or one with the JSON gem?
<dbussink> yorickpeterse: sounds like a gem compile for 1.9 mode
<dbussink> and loaded in 1.8
<yorickpeterse> hmmmmmmm
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<yorickpeterse> dbussink: correct
<yorickpeterse> bah
<judofyr> yorickpeterse: /home/yorickpeterse/ruby/rbx-git/gems/1.9/gems/json-1.7.7 is an odd path
<judofyr> 1.9
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<judofyr> yorickpeterse: I'd check `gem env`
<yorickpeterse> installed it under 1.9 the first time
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<injekt> gems/gems/gems
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<tonni> semi-ood question: How do I recover from $stdin.reopen("/dev/null") ?
<tonni> semi-odd even
<erikh> recover from it?
<erikh> you mean, get original stdin back?
<athaeryn> semi-ood? does is have red eye?
<tonni> I mean, how do I restore $stdin to the way it was before the reopen()
<erikh> ah
<erikh> so, the easiest way to do this is to not use reopen at all
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<erikh> are you only going to be dealing with stdin in ruby?
<erikh> e.g., not in C or a fork, etc
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<tonni> only ruby - and I "can't" avoid the reopen()
<erikh> why not?
<tonni> without patching unicorn
<erikh> old_stdin = $stdin; $stdin = File.open("/dev/null")
<erikh> that'll give $stdin a new descriptor but it will be pointing at /dev/null
<erikh> otherwise, you need to do some dup/for_fd tricks in IO
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<tonni> unicorn does the repoen() right before instance_eval'ing the configfile... And I need to be able to use $stdin in the config file
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<erikh> oh, then you're screwed
<erikh> without patching unicorn
<tonni> crap
<darix> hmhm
<tonni> pardon me french
<darix> doesnt STDIN still has the original value?
<erikh> darix: file descriptor is modified
<drbrain> darix: not after reopen()
<darix> erikh: someone said here the other day that if you modify $stdin it doesnt touch STDIN
<darix> ah
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<darix> tonni: why do you need stdin anyway?
<erikh> darix: fd is still 0, but it points at /dev/null now
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<tonni> If I do comment out reopen() in unicorn, it works perfectly
<erikh> drbrain: any chance you have a freebsd box lying about?
<darix> erikh: need another tester?
<drbrain> $stdin.reopen IO::NULL; $stdin.reopen open "/dev/stdin";
<erikh> darix: ideally for freebsd, yeah
<drbrain> however, you will lose all the data entered on stdin before the reopen
<erikh> I know he's a fan of the system or was at some point
<darix> let me ping our lighty tester
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<drbrain> erikh: I have a local virtual box VM and some real hardware
<whitequark> >> IO::NULL
<erikh> you'll want the real hardware -- it's a hefty test
<eval-in> whitequark => "/dev/null" (http://eval.in/20035)
<erikh> if you don't mind testing that is
<erikh> it's that libarchive binding
<erikh> ran into some issues on smartos with a BSD-distributed libarchive, wondering if I'll see the same on FBSD.
<drbrain> tonni: so while you can reconnect stdin, it probably isn't useful
<drbrain> tonni: try: ruby -e '$stdin.reopen IO::NULL; $stdin.reopen open "/dev/stdin"; sleep 2; p gets'
<drbrain> erikh: how do I run this test?
<erikh> git clone https://github.com/erikh/archive; cd archive; bundle; bundle exec rake test
<erikh> it'll take 7-8 minutes to run
<erikh> so don't freak out if it looks like it's stalling
<darix> and comment out everything but minitest and rake in the gemspec
<darix> ;)
<erikh> feh
<darix> (from the dev deps:p)
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<tonni> drbrain: Hmm.. it doesn't stop and wait for input on $stdin.gets
<drbrain> tonni: nope, since all that input was thrown away when you reopened stdin
<whitequark> erikh: ... how much
<drbrain> tonni: why do you need to read from stdin when starting up a server?
<erikh> whitequark: what?
<whitequark> erikh: 7-8 minutes
<whitequark> one hell of a testsuite
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<erikh> whitequark: it's very i/o intensive
<drbrain> erikh: will need to install git
<erikh> about 30 threads spamming extract/compress routines, twice
<erikh> drbrain: ok. it's ffi-based too, if you need that with your ruby.
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<whitequark> erikh: what about using tmpfs?
<erikh> whitequark: that would require system dependent knowledge
<erikh> the whole point of this is to keep off that stuff.
<whitequark> hrm... sounds like a good opt-in way to keep the execution time small
<erikh> possibly, but even on a SSD it takes this long
<whitequark> but I get your reasoning too
<erikh> well, on a ssd it takes about 5 minutes
<whitequark> well, tmpfs is at least 1-2 orders of magnitude faster?
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<erikh> in ram though, right?
<erikh> maybe. I'll think about it.
<tonni> drbrain: I need to enter some password to open a keystore before workers are forked
<whitequark> yes... basically tmpfs is just like a normal fs, but it never syncs its cache
<whitequark> with the backing storage
<drbrain> tonni: and you can't put it in a file?
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<tonni> drbrain: I'm not allowed to
<tonni> (by some authorities)
<drbrain> tonni: then reopen /dev/stdin and write a prompt
<drbrain> at that point you can enter the password
<drbrain> wait, let me check again
<tonni> https://gist.github.com/ta/5505418 illustrates the issue
<drbrain> ah, no, that doesn't work, I confused myself
<drbrain> I have no idea
<tonni> oki, thx for trying
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<drbrain> could you have a separate process that listens on a socket for password requests?
<tonni> uh, how would I do that?
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<drbrain> use a UNIXServer and have the unicorn connect to it and get the password
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<tonni> I'll look into that, thx
<whitequark> tonni: sorry to jump in the middle of conversation... but you can just do ruby -rmy_password_lib -S unicorn
<whitequark> and set a global var (or whatever) in the my_password_lib when it's being loaded (before unicorn)
<tonni> Hmm.. that could work
<erikh> bbl
<tonni> not sure how to do that with bundler - I'll investigate
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<whitequark> iirc unicorn has its own -r switch
<drbrain> tonni: you could try to dup $stdin and read from it later in your config file
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<tonni> whitequark: it does! thx
<tonni> drbrain: dup $stdin in test_app ?
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<tonni> whitequark: and it - also with unicorn in daemon-mode
<tonni> and it *work*
<tonni> s
* tonni moves away from the keyboard
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<whitequark> wow, my isp just made a routing loop
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<parndt> weird, Chanserv gave me a really old topic when I joined about Ruby 1.9.2 being out :)
<parndt> Not so much a topic, I think the bot sent me a ctcp
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<zzak> parndt: this one? 04:19 -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- [#ruby-lang] Ruby - The programming language, http://ruby-lang.org | Ruby 1.9.2 is out | Read http://ruby.stadik.net/ | Paste >3 Lines of Text on http://pastie.org
<parndt> that's the one zzak!
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<drbrain> I updated it!
<parndt> thanks :)
<zzak> nice
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<parndt> indeed!
<zzak> can you fix the topic in #ruby-core?
<zzak> ive probably asked you this before
<zzak> hsbt reset it somehow
<fowl> LOL how many ruby channels are there
<drbrain> I don't have ops in #ruby-core
<zzak> i will ask when i am at asakusa.rb next month!
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<parndt> how deep down the rabbit hole do you want to go, fowl? ;)
<fowl> parndt: seems silly since there are already two fairly large unofficial channels
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<drbrain> this is the official channel according to ruby-lang.org, but making it the official channel on freenode requires herding some cats
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