<rqou> azonenberg plz 2 look at my code :P
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<azonenberg> rqou: after work
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<qu1j0t3> looks like Intel launched Quartus Prime 17.1 today, with
<qu1j0t3> HLS C++ compiler (for free!) surprising for them
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<rqou> whitequark: can you make the MTVRE meetup on Wednesday evening?
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<whitequark> rqou: sure can
<rqou> you should go; now we can have twice the meetups :P
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<rqou> azonenberg look at my codez pl0x
<awygle> i wish ansible could bootstrap without python, just with ssh and maybe sudo
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<whitequark> awygle: you can do that
<whitequark> use a local command that ssh's there and installs python
<whitequark> should be pretty trivial
<awygle> whitequark: hm. that sounds familiar.
<whitequark> local_action: shell ssh root@{{inventory_hostname}} apt-get install -y python
<whitequark> or whatever
<awygle> oh cool, "raw". that _is_ easy
<whitequark> raw?
<awygle> or shell or command apparently, but http://docs.ansible.com/ansible/latest/raw_module.html was in the first google result
<whitequark> oh yeah raw is better than what I said
<awygle> either i forgot how non-horrible ansible is, or it's gotten a lot better since i last used it
<whitequark> it has gotten quite a bit better
<whitequark> look into roles
<whitequark> they made them almost usable
<awygle> iirc those used to exist but i couldn't find a way to make them useful?
<whitequark> they are useful now
<whitequark> they even mostly work as described!
<awygle> wonder of wonder miracle of miracles
<whitequark> take a look here
<awygle> ooooo
<awygle> there is a high chance i'm going to rip off your mail config
<whitequark> lol go ahead
<whitequark> you might even convince me to separate it as a role
<whitequark> since i was gonna do that anyway
<awygle> email seems really intimidating but super valueable to self-host
<cr1901_modern> It's tedious. Not difficult.
<awygle> or selfadminister? is it self-hosting if it's on digital ocean? lol
<awygle> even when i was sysadminning professionally we always had hosted email
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<whitequark> self-administer sounds like something you would do with a research chemical
<awygle> true
<awygle> hmm i wonder if i can install jenkins plugins with ansible..
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<rqou> winter is coming
<rqou> i can tell because the breaker tripping shenanigans are starting again
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<gruetzkopf> streetwide breakers or what
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<rqou> gruetzkopf: have you not been paying attention last year when this happened? :P
<rqou> my shitty apartment has shitty electrical wiring and only a 30A breaker for the whole unit
<sn00n> what happened?
<qu1j0t3> > breaker tripping shenanigans
<rqou> ~every day the breaker will get tripped
<rqou> e.g. whenever somebody tries to use the microwave or the toaster
<rqou> but don't worry, you can get about 2 minutes of microwaving between trips!
<sn00n> what a trip
<sn00n> that's enough for an egg?
<rqou> there's been jokes of making a "smart grid app" that temporarily disconnects the computer UPSs so that you can toast something :P
<rqou> also jokes of making a breaker reset robot
<sn00n> what if you break the breaker
<sn00n> blocking the mechanism with sophisticated tools like toothpicks?
<rqou> well, there's no locks on the panel covers, so... 😉
<sn00n> :>
<rqou> actually, that doesn't work
<sn00n> replace 30A with 60A
<rqou> apparently breakers are now designed so that jamming the handle doesn't prevent them from tripping
<sn00n> hmmm
<sn00n> really no way to jam them?
<gruetzkopf> not really
<sn00n> wow
<gruetzkopf> but replacing them is easy (if sketchy)
<pie_> rqou, dont forget to replace after a couple years lol, (how many switchings are breakers usually rated for again_)
<pie_> ?
<rqou> not my problem lol
<sn00n> replacing it by a copper bar
<gruetzkopf> my room is on 3 32A breakers ;)
<rqou> I'm only going to be here for 7 more months or so
<sn00n> sounds like germany
<mtp> i've seen breakers fuse shut :)
<gruetzkopf> (thanks european 3-phase)
<sn00n> breakers & FI everywhere
<pie_> mtp, good god
<rqou> sn00n: replacing with copper bars was what happened when my father was a university student :P
<sn00n> rqou: good old times?
<rqou> as well as using 120V light bulbs during the daily brownouts from 240V to 130V
<sn00n> hehe
<pie_> a lightbulb a day
<rqou> nah, you change it back when you notice them getting brighter
<qu1j0t3> LOL
<pie_> as long as brown-in is slow
<rqou> one of the professors would occasionally borrow a variac from the EE lab to power a TV for watching sportsball
<gruetzkopf> using some LED light with 110-240V rated PSU would be easier
<gruetzkopf> these days
<rqou> those didn't exist back then :P
<rqou> this was China in the 1980s
<rqou> gruetzkopf: one thing that did happen was that all the students would turn on all the flourescent lights in all of the rooms before the brownouts started
<rqou> because you need a high voltage to light them but not to keep them on
<rqou> oh yeah, those brownouts were on a regular schedule :P
<pie_> ah well
<pie_> thats easier then :P
<rqou> here it's just comically undersized breakers
<rqou> something something shady landlords definitely not associated with Lakireddy
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<rqou> offtopic: does anybody here understand ETH? does ETH have formal verification tools?
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<jn__> ETH Zurich?
<rqou> Etherium
<jn__> ah
<rqou> the cryptocurrency thing that apparently had a huge problem this morning?
<jn__> i heard about that story
<azonenberg> afaik it was one wallet that had the bug
<azonenberg> not ETH in general?
<azonenberg> but everyone using that wallet to do multi-signature transactions now cant withdraw their funds
<rqou> idk
<rqou> also azonenberg plz 2 look at my c0dez :P
<azonenberg> Like i said, i'm busy... i'll get to it when i have time
<qu1j0t3> rqou: pretty sure they haven't even _heard_ of formal verification...
<balrog> azonenberg: I thought the library that everyone was using to generate multi-signature wallets had that bug
<balrog> and someone triggered it with one wallet
<balrog> qu1j0t3: someone's started to work on it https://github.com/pirapira/ethereum-formal-verification-overview
<balrog> part of the problem is that the Solidity language is not the best for this
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<balrog> ah, that's someone who works at Ethereum Dev
<azonenberg> how was it even possible to delete this thing?
<azonenberg> i thought the whole point of the blockchain is that you cant undo the past
<balrog> https://ethereum.github.io/yellowpaper/paper.pdf that's the paper that describes Ethereum
<balrog> it's more of a contract platform built on blockchain
<rqou> <troll>it's more of a Ponzi scheme built on blockchain</troll>
<azonenberg> rqou: no that's BTC
<azonenberg> :P
<qu1j0t3> yeah, was about to say--
<rqou> aren't they the same?
<awygle> BTC is a ponzi scheme, I'm not sure what ETH is, and ICOs are straight up fraud
<awygle> BTC also has some good qualities, maybe ETH does too
<qu1j0t3> such as?
<qu1j0t3> i've really come up with nothing so far.
<qu1j0t3> well, actually, a lot of negatives. so what's a positive?
<azonenberg> The energy consumed to process one BTC transaction is ridiculously large
<qu1j0t3> that's one of the biggest negatives, yeah. unsustainable.
<qu1j0t3> that some people think it's okay to ignore that, or don't know, are both scary facts
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<rqou> but then there's this tweet that whitequark RT'd:
<rqou> "nobody's burning electricity for fun, people do it to route around the damage that is ACH, international wire transfer, FinCEN, and KYC/AML"
<awygle> Yeah that's basically what I was talking about
<awygle> There are lots of better ways to solve those problems but bitcoin exists now
<awygle> It's also presumably insulated from some types of "the government of my country has gone insane" scenarios.
<qu1j0t3> rqou: rubbish
<qu1j0t3> rqou: even if that were true, it's a non-solution
<whitequark> bullshit
<whitequark> of course it is a solution to gatekeeping. what else do you do if visa and paypal refuse to work with you?
<qu1j0t3> read above. it's a terrible, unsustainable design. why not come up with something that works?
<qu1j0t3> also -- that isn't the only problem with it
<whitequark> because i'm not interested in coming up with virtual currencies, i'm interested in providing services
<qu1j0t3> ok, but those problems will bite users in the end.
<qu1j0t3> but even aside from technical -- how do you stop it being taken over, as it clearly is now, by speculators and capital, reproducing every inequity in conventional currencies?
<whitequark> that's not my problem? my customer converts cash to BTC, I convert BTC back to cash
<whitequark> if BTC stops working, good riddance
<qu1j0t3> fair enough.
<qu1j0t3> if those ETH people had got their cash out quicker, they'd have been good too :)
<qu1j0t3> whitequark: your relation to BTC is like my relation to dirty cash :)
<awygle> qu1j0t3: dirty cash as in "cash is icky" or as in "I work for the mob and inexplicably decided to out myself on irc"?
<qu1j0t3> the former, officer.
<whitequark> qu1j0t3: which country are you living in?
<qu1j0t3> does it matter?
<whitequark> I'm wondering.
<qu1j0t3> one where yes, i use banks.
<qu1j0t3> so somewhat privileged, i suppose.
<whitequark> abandoning cash means a high degree of trust in institutions
<whitequark> no, not *using banks*. *not using cash* rather is what weirds me out
<qu1j0t3> i meant more just using it as a trading medium.
<qu1j0t3> rather than speculation
<whitequark> ah, sure. I consider speculation of all sorts a waste of time
<qu1j0t3> i rarely handle cash. i think maybe my comment wasn't clear.
<qu1j0t3> but i understand how you use BTC now.
<awygle> I don't currently use cash ~at all. I am very aware that that surrenders a lot of control, but I'm willing currently to do so for convenience
<qu1j0t3> awygle: right.
<awygle> Hopefully if circumstances change such that I'm not willing to do that anymore, they do so slowly enough that I can correct
<qu1j0t3> the recent experiences of India in "demonetisation" are probably worth studying since it will probably be attempted elsewhere soon enough
<awygle> But maybe not. You pays your money and you takes your chances.
<awygle> qu1j0t3: link? I'm unfamiliar
<qu1j0t3> (also the irony of FORBES taking this position, lol)
<qu1j0t3> anyway, sorry all, this is awfully OT.
<qu1j0t3> shapr: suspiciously on topic
<awygle> The documentation for this serializer is somehow both incredibly comprehensive and nearly useless.
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