<terrellt>
shevy: No, but my employer is, and free computers are good.
<benzrf>
shevy: i use linix
<shevy>
platzhirsch we two are like the last linuxers
<lewellyn>
Linux duchess.greenviolet.net 2.6.32-358.23.2.el6.x86_64 #1 SMP Wed Oct 16 11:13:47 CDT 2013 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
<shevy>
didn't you say you use windows!
<lewellyn>
as a window manager.
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<lewellyn>
Interix boojum 6.2 10.0.7063.0 x86 Intel_x86_Family6_Model58_Stepping9 Windows
<lewellyn>
i have a local shell, of course, though.
<terrellt>
platzhirsch: What is this?
<terrellt>
platzhirsch: Metadata census that is.
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<platzhirsch>
terrellt: It's my master's thesis project
<benzrf>
platzhirsch: o:
<platzhirsch>
metadata aggregator, computes quality metrics on open government data portals and ranks them
<terrellt>
platzhirsch: For where? Sorry, library developer for a university, you peaked my interest.
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<terrellt>
platzhirsch: How is quality defined?
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<lewellyn>
terrellt: qualitatively!
<platzhirsch>
by different metrics, like completeness (number of fields filled out), readability (reading ease), availability (url link checker), etc. each results in a metric score that get aggregated to a total score
<terrellt>
Masters in CS?
<benzrf>
nice bootstrap
<benzrf>
:3
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<platzhirsch>
terrellt: yeah
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<terrellt>
platzhirsch: Librarians may be interested in this. When you're done, you may want to shoot a note to the mailing list behind code4lib. Very cool dude, platzhirsch++
<platzhirsch>
terrellt: good to know, I will take note.
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<benzrf>
bbl
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<platzhirsch>
shevy: there are these startups which offer you full Apple equipment as a perk
<platzhirsch>
I wonder if that includes any other vendor
<platzhirsch>
Sorry, Mac only, you have to leave this company again
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<platzhirsch>
and if not you would be the ultimate outcast, everytime there is a problem on your machine and not the others... they will hate you
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<Ohga>
hi, anyone testing with the Bacon gem around? I've got a strange exception when calling #it without a block. I should get a failure "not implemented" but it raise ArgumentError
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<shevy>
I am looking at a pdf generator in ruby, the fpdf one
<shevy>
there are things like:
<shevy>
out '/Decode [1 0 1 0 1 0 1 0]'
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<Ohga>
.. and I'm running the tests with a Rake::TestTask
<shevy>
I understand that this is some pdf specification probably. anyone knows if this is official documentation I can view?
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<shevy>
I haven't seen this yet
<shevy>
platzhirsch, which of the two ^^^ do you prefer?
<ericwood>
lol updating it to work with ruby 1.9
<platzhirsch>
shevy: I tend to prefer the require ones
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<platzhirsch>
I think I switched some of mine to require_relative to work equally when calling code from a Raketask
<shevy>
hmm
<shevy>
they are about the same length in the example here now
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<platzhirsch>
shevy: but it seems _relative has more redundant characters, so if you compress the file at some point you save more file size?
<shevy>
I don't mind the file size compressed
<shevy>
I mind the time it takes me for extra keystrokes
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<shevy>
or for how easy it is to read something
<shevy>
platzhirsch, right now I stare at:
<shevy>
i.read(1).unpack('C')
<shevy>
where i is input to a method... hmm
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<shevy>
I have seen unpack before
<shevy>
but .read(1) ? hmm
<platzhirsch>
Reminds me of the PhD thesis which could be summarized as: If you look at Van Gogh’s paintings closely, you’ll realize you’re using your brain to analyze them.
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<platzhirsch>
shevy: yeah that's definitely some fun time you found there
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<shevy>
I kinda morphed parts of it already so I can better understand it
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<shevy>
self.Cell(l/1000.0*@FontSize,h,s[j,i],0,0,'',0,link) if i!=j
<shevy>
:\
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<platzhirsch>
just found old chat logs of you shevy
<platzhirsch>
god I hate irc logging that gets indexed by google
<shevy>
lol
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<shevy>
there is so much information crammed into just one method call
<shevy>
I mean take it... not only is it capitalized, it accepts at the least 8 arguments
<platzhirsch>
so your first two projects in Ruby were an IRC bot and a game? And you certainly broke the bot
<shevy>
:(
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<shevy>
platzhirsch, yeah...
<shevy>
it was how I came to ruby
<platzhirsch>
Robot means slave
<shevy>
I failed to make a bot in php
<shevy>
but my bot worked in ruby
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<shevy>
that means that the better language helps a dumber person move further down the road
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<platzhirsch>
Sounds like a book title
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<platzhirsch>
"Learn Ruby and feel dumber while solving problems"
<shevy>
it's more like elementary wisdom
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<shevy>
nono not just ruby, I mean in general
<shevy>
things like "use the right tool for the job"
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<shevy>
I changed it to "use the better tool for the job"
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<shevy>
man, I find so many weird things in this project
<shevy>
nl=nl+1
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<platzhirsch>
wow I guess you need to slam a lot of Ruby idioms into the refactoring process
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<shevy>
how can you make a method with 107 lines!
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<platzhirsch>
Might it be he translated the PHP code line by line?
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<shevy>
I think so
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<shevy>
the code is very atypical for ruby
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<shevy>
while (c = freadbyte(f)) != 0xff
<shevy>
I guess I am convincing myself to give up and use prawn instead
<platzhirsch>
Yesterday I started to use a Ruby idiom in Python, which seems really wrong. While it make sense, one should stick to the native language's idioms
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<shevy>
another cool example:
<shevy>
@InFooter = true
<shevy>
self.Footer
<platzhirsch>
xD
<shevy>
well, I'd like to have this compared
<platzhirsch>
prawn looks like a proper open source king pin. 2,4k commits
<shevy>
like, take 10 projects from PHP written by a good PHP hacker. and take 10 projects from python written by a good python hacker
<shevy>
and then have one ruby hacker, a good ruby guy, translate these things into ruby
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<shevy>
(with a time limit)
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<shevy>
I'd assume that the code from the python will be cleaner, even translated into ruby
<terrellt>
Well, you just had one guy write 20 projects.
<terrellt>
He's probably tired.
<miah>
i have yet to see nice oop python code
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<platzhirsch>
My institute does this language comparison every year or two. One project, different teams, different languages, same project specification
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<terrellt>
platzhirsch: More than one team per language I hope.
<platzhirsch>
terrellt: It's often difficult to find enough volunteers
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<fire5>
I'm a curious, does anyone know how to call a method from another method? I'm having trouble solving a puzzle I'm working on and I think that is what its trying to get me to do.
<binaryhat>
blehh
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<shevy>
fire5 you can call a method inside of a method
<shevy>
def foo; puts 'foo'; end; def bar; foo; end
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<benzrf>
fire5: thers nowhere to call methods from besides other methods...
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<benzrf>
i guess from blocks?
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<benzrf>
oh i guess there are class bodies
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<fire5>
benzrf: Here is the example then. x=measure {sleep 5}. Then x should equal 5.
<fire5>
I assume what this block is doing is calling on another method called sleep.
<fire5>
Which is taking in 1 arguement which is a number.
<fire5>
So If I make a sleep method.
<fire5>
It should call on that method, no?
<benzrf>
yeah
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<fire5>
benzrf: I did that and it says it fails.
<benzrf>
sleep already exists though
<fire5>
Its is a puzzle that is basically rspec tests.
<fire5>
I made one method called measure and another called sleep.
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<benzrf>
sleep already exists
<benzrf>
it pauses for the number of seconds you pass it
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<shevy>
def sleep(i); return i; end; def measure; return yield if block_given?; end; x = measure { sleep 5 }; p x # => 5
<shevy>
<fire5>
benzrf: So its basically a default method already in ruby?
<benzrf>
fire5: right
<benzrf>
it is in Kernel i think
<fire5>
Sigh, then I am lost.
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<fire5>
I passed one test which basically just calls on measure with a blank block. It returns 0.
<benzrf>
i think the idea is that you are supposed to write a method called measure which times the block
<fire5>
I basically put 0 in the method and get test to pass.
<fire5>
Then the above occurs and I am lost how to make that pass.
<fire5>
benzrf: You are right.
<fire5>
That is the idea.
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<fire5>
I'm sucking at this puzzle too.
<benzrf>
heh
<fire5>
benzrf: Is a timing thing is the time ruby docs?
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<fire5>
benzrf: Or am I approaching this completely wrong?
<benzrf>
think about it.
<benzrf>
don't try to think in terms of ruby
<benzrf>
think in terms of common sense
<benzrf>
if you want to know how long something takes, how can you find out?
<benzrf>
if you do not have a stop watch
<fire5>
count
<benzrf>
:p
<benzrf>
lets say it's a multi-minute thing
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<benzrf>
you want to find out how long it takes you to walk accross your town
<benzrf>
no counting/stopwatche
<benzrf>
s
<benzrf>
how can you find out?
<benzrf>
dont try to be clever
<fire5>
Ummm, let me try to think, um...
<benzrf>
just think of how you would actually do it
<fire5>
measure the distance and compare where the sun is when you started til finish?
<benzrf>
09:13 < benzrf> dont try to be clever
<benzrf>
look at a clock at the beginning
<benzrf>
look at one at the end
<benzrf>
subtract
<fire5>
Oh, sorry.
<fire5>
I was making this too complicated.
<fire5>
I see.
<benzrf>
i find that beginners tend to do that a lot
<fire5>
So then maybe just make an object.
<fire5>
Have it be time.now
<benzrf>
programming is just telling the computer what to do in a way that it understands
<fire5>
and then compare to the new time .
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<benzrf>
right!
<Jake232>
a = Time.now; do_something; time_taken = Time.now - a;
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<fire5>
Thanks, jeez, I don't know why I didn't see this.
<fire5>
I really enjoy programming, but I have a lot to learn.
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<benzrf>
get used to it
<benzrf>
programming means running into that feeling at least once per day for the rest of your life
<benzrf>
assuming you program every day
<benzrf>
you will never escape the 'OH CRAP IT WAS OBVIOUS'
<Jake232>
I wish it was only once per day ;)
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<benzrf>
i said 'at least'
<fire5>
Yeah, but I'm really bad right now. And I eventually want to get a job in this.
<fire5>
I work in finance right now.
<benzrf>
no way man
<fire5>
But really want this.
<fire5>
Its just frusterating I guess.
<benzrf>
the fact that you managed to jump from a real life description to how to do it in code shows that you at least have a LITTLE skill yet
<benzrf>
;p
<Jake232>
Be glad you ended up with ruby anyway
<Jake232>
or python
<Jake232>
and not PHP
<Jake232>
;)
<benzrf>
programming is the art of training yourself to think in ways other than your natural state
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<fire5>
I guess, I'm still stuggling here. I wont ask for any more help though. I will try to solve it from here and come back tomorrow if I can't figure it out.
<fire5>
For some more hints.
<benzrf>
:0
<benzrf>
no shame in hints
<benzrf>
i ask for help all the time
<benzrf>
copying code is How It's Done
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<benzrf>
your skill as a programmer is creating a program that:
<fire5>
Yeah, but I guess I need to figure things out on my own otherwise IDK. I wish I had some mentor in real life who could help guide me.
<benzrf>
a. does what it should
<benzrf>
b. is readable and alterable
<benzrf>
anything else is secondary\
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<benzrf>
if you copy somebody else's code, that does not make you a bad programmer
<benzrf>
it makes you a resourceful one
<benzrf>
;)
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<fire5>
Yeah, true :).
<fire5>
That is what I do, is google a lot.
<fire5>
And look at stack overflow.
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<benzrf>
that is the mark of a smart programmer
<benzrf>
stackoverflow is invaluable
<Jake232>
I kid you not, one of the best skills a programmer can have
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<Jake232>
is learning how to google their questions correctly
<Jake232>
If you can work out how to ask what you want, and put it into words
<fire5>
If I cant find it that way, I come here or somewhere else I guess, lol :P.
<benzrf>
figuring out all of the tricky little ways to solve specific problems like timing things is very tempty
<benzrf>
*tempting
<Jake232>
the chances are somebody has been in the situtation before, and generally somebody who is a better programmer than you has already asked it
<benzrf>
but it is not the real point
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<benzrf>
if you can figure it out, good for you!
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<benzrf>
if not, googling it is not something to be ashamed of
<benzrf>
but since they get their point across, they are still good stories
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<benzrf>
*good stories are, w/e
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<fire5>
Yeah, true.
<benzrf>
but dont sweat the not-figuring-things-out part
<fire5>
I will keep googling and "cheating" then, even though its really just learning.
<benzrf>
no matter how good you get there will always be somebody smarter who figured out your problem already
<benzrf>
fire5: it's good to try to figure it out, just to acclimate yourself to the language
<benzrf>
just don't concentrate on something to the point of wasting time when you could be looking it up
<fire5>
benzrf: True.
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<benzrf>
the real key is to get yourself to think in terms of the language
<fire5>
benzrf: I'm going to be going to sleep soon. Do you think the article that Jake linked would help me solve this btw?
<benzrf>
maybe, i didnt look at it
<fire5>
Jake232: Thanks for the article btw.
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<fire5>
benzrf: Reason I ask is because I was going to bookmark it and save it.
<fire5>
And read it tomorrow after work.
<fire5>
Or, if not, I would just ask for one more hint before leaving.
<Jake232>
fire5: No problem.
<benzrf>
fire5: that looks like it explains how to use a nice built in module in ruby designed for solving this
<benzrf>
not how to do it from scratch
<fire5>
oh, probably not what I want then.
<benzrf>
you figured it out earlier anyway :)
<benzrf>
i said the looking at clocks thing and you replied with a description of the correct answer
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<fire5>
Yes, I don't know how to turn it into code to solve this rspec though.
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<benzrf>
ah
<fire5>
There is code before this.
<fire5>
That asked to see if time didn't pass.
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<fire5>
basically, just a the method with no block.
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<fire5>
I put 0 in the method.
<fire5>
It solved the problem.
<fire5>
Then the sleep 5 was introduced.
<fire5>
And now I'm lost.
<benzrf>
well, running that block takes 5 seconds
<benzrf>
more like 5.000001 actually or something
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<benzrf>
the sleep call should take just about 5 seconds to complete because that is what sleep does
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<benzrf>
how do you define a method that figures out how long it takes to run the block you give it?
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<fire5>
I'm trying to think.
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<benzrf>
just write down a series of steps
<benzrf>
think of it as what you would do if you were the computer
<fire5>
1.) Define method
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<fire5>
2.) compare start time to new time
<fire5>
3.) Return the difference
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<benzrf>
ok, now turn that into code
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<benzrf>
dont worry about if its correct
<benzrf>
once you have something incorrect but extant, you have something to work off o
<benzrf>
f
<benzrf>
like writing a bad draft, then correcting it
<Galgorth>
Hi, quick newbie question.. if I define a method in rib, why doesn't that method show up as a class when I use .class on it? For example, a_plus_b.class returns an error message 'wrong number of arguments'
<Galgorth>
*irb
<benzrf>
it's easier to see the problem sometimes if you write it down
<benzrf>
Galgorth: what do you mean?
<benzrf>
Galgorth: you are trying to call a_plus_b, then call class on the result
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<benzrf>
Galgorth: but you arent giving a_plus_b any args
<fire5>
Time.now-Time.now
<fire5>
Inside the method
<Galgorth>
benzrf: Can't I just call class on the method itself?
<fire5>
Solved the problem, although I had to vary that code a bit to match with the instance variable.
<benzrf>
Galgorth: the method itself isnt an object
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<benzrf>
fire5: sort of.
<Galgorth>
benzrf: I read that everything in ruby is an object though
<benzrf>
fire5: you need to measure how long _running the block_ takes
<benzrf>
Galgorth: all values are objects
<benzrf>
Galgorth: methods are not values
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<benzrf>
Galgorth: methods are in a separate namespace from variables
<Galgorth>
benzrf: Ahhh ok, so not *everything* is an object lol.. guess that article must have been incorrect
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<benzrf>
Galgorth: no, all values are objects
<benzrf>
Galgorth: methods just arent values
<fire5>
benzrf: I think I read the rspec code more and figure out what its doing. Its setting an initial time of 11:00am.
<Galgorth>
benzrf: Ok, thanks
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<benzrf>
fire5: let's say you have a block in front of you.
<Galgorth>
benzrf: Where can I read about the different namespaces underlying ruby?
<fire5>
It is then in the first two asking if nothing is passed in a block, what time has passed.
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<benzrf>
fire5: how can you figure out how long running the block takes?
<benzrf>
Galgorth: I can tell you :)
<benzrf>
Galgorth: there are constants, ivars, methods, local vars, and class vars
<benzrf>
there, that's it
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<fire5>
Look at the time when it started and compare to when it finished.
<benzrf>
Galgorth: have you done any other languages?
<fire5>
And subtract the two times.
<Galgorth>
benzrf: I see.. so all of those are objects except methods? And what are ivars?
<benzrf>
fire5: ok, turn that into a series of steps.
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<benzrf>
Galgorth: no, those are namespaces
<benzrf>
Galgorth: meaning, sets of names where the same one overlaps
<benzrf>
Galgorth: so you have have a local var and a method called the same thing
<benzrf>
Galgorth: but not 2 local vars named the same
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<progrock>
Hi, I'm a pretty well versed programmer... looking to pick up the basics of ruby's syntax.... anyone got a good reference site... maybe one directed towards programmers?
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<toastynerd>
progrock: what language backgrounds do you have?
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<toastynerd>
"well versed programmer" can mean a lot of different things
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<progrock>
toastynerd: many years ago PHP, C++, Java.... not as many Python, Scala.... but primarily JavaScript
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<progrock>
toastynerd: enough that a syntax overview would cover 95% of what I need to know right now... and I can learn from looking at libraries and code examples to figure out common design patterns
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<progrock>
Supposed to be helping a girl learn ro program in Ruby to prep for a course (she's very smart, but its her first language).. so I want to know enough that I can be confident in what I tell her
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<flaccid>
google.com, but alas there should be a ton of resources if you look
<progrock>
reading the first section of ProgrammingRuby on ruby-docs.com ... seems like a decent reference to skim
<progrock>
heh these modifier one liners look funky at first... are they pretty common practice?
<progrock>
I guess its s imilar concept to using && or || instead of if's.. or as a coalesce
<toastynerd>
yeah, they're very common and a while to get used if you haven't used a similar language
<toastynerd>
take a while*
<progrock>
Gotta love seeing regular expressions in the first few pages of a book... always a good sign
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<toastynerd>
after you get through the basics, look into bloc/proc/lambdas and metaprogramming
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<progrock>
Mastering regular expressions is still by a logn shot my favorite technical book... my coworkers make fun of me because of how much I like it
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<progrock>
toastynerd: oh.. now those do sound interesting
<toastynerd>
progrock: yeah, they're really the aspects of Ruby that make it worth learning.
<progrock>
hoping ruby isn't as crazy as scala with regards to looking at deveopers code.
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<ar>
progrock: regular expressions are nice, but aren't usually the proper solution
<progrock>
Ruby doesnt have block level scoping, right?... just classes and methods?
<progrock>
ar: sad that its true... that book makes you want to use them for everything... but itis true I only use them for very few tasks
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<toastynerd>
progrock: for scoping, you can use either block level or classes/methods
<shevy>
progrock ruby is rather economic in its expressions, that's why one liners are often there
<shevy>
progrock a block to a method has its own scope. you can also use procs/lambdas and .call on them at a later time
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<progrock>
shevy: understandable... I was mroe saying, from my experience with scala... its usually taken a little further than it should be (IMMO) to the point code is no longer verbose
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<shevy>
don't know scala
<progrock>
ok, guess I need to read a bit on scoping
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<shevy>
ruby is more like perl 2.0 (they way how perl should have been done)
<shevy>
*the
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<shevy>
progrock read less, write more :)
<progrock>
heh, I'm kinda glad that y experiece in perll didnt go much further than online form submission
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<toastynerd>
well, if you didn't like perl, you might not like ruby....
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<progrock>
|name| notation... is that primarily used in loops to define a reference to the element in the array?
<shevy>
progrock a string object in ruby has inbuilt support for regex. x = "abc def"; x[/(e)f/]; $1 # => "e"
<toastynerd>
it's used in blocks, which can be part of loops
<progrock>
I briefly messed with perl.... it wasnt that bad... but at that time for some reason (dnt know why) I was interested in TCL and TK... never got very far tho
<shevy>
progrock if you have a container object like an array, it responds to #each, and you need to give these elements some name inside the block in order to acces sthem
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<shevy>
I didn't like perl much
<shevy>
6 months later I had no idea what I had written
<shevy>
my own code looked like alien spaghetti
<progrock>
hmm, ok well at least the basic use of |..| I get... definitely seems a little odd to me... but, we'll see if it gets crazier as I read
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<progrock>
shevy: heh, reminds me of my JS back in 1999 to like 2002... used to think it was so ugly... now, its 95% of what I do.. and I think much more highly of it
<ayaz>
I loved Perl when I was heavily using it. It truly is 'Black Magic'.
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<ayaz>
I still have The Camel book lying around with me.
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<toastynerd>
a block is essentially ruby's version of functional programming, think of the |...| as parameters into javascript's anonymous functions (most of the time)
<toastynerd>
yes I have, it's what inspired me to mess around in the js console
<toastynerd>
love that video
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<progrock>
That null >= 0 sounds like an interview question at a place that doesnt know how to interview people, lol
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<progrock>
I'm always amused when I'm asked questions that are about corner cases you would very rarely run into
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<progrock>
or even worse, when asked about shit very ffew people would ever memorize
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<progrock>
was asked the default styles for H1 through H6 once... my response "I could google that in 3 seconds"
<rcs>
null == 0 would make me very sad.
<rcs>
I can't imagine wanting that to work.
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<toastynerd>
true that, like I said, "fun fact" not really useful
<canton7>
NULL == 0 is true in C ;)
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<canton7>
well, almost always
<progrock>
rcs: well its JS, use === if you want to be careful
<rcs>
canton7: I would very sad if (void*)0 != 0 .
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<toastynerd>
rcs: it's more that null >= 0 works but not either part of that statement by itself
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<progrock>
toastynerd: so apparently its because when using >= and <= with null (or any other values) its coerced to a number.. while with == null is not coerced toa number, but rather to undefined
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<progrock>
still pretty strange
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<toastynerd>
progrock: exactly, it's one of the reasons I can't stand JS.
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<toastynerd>
personal preference
<progrock>
toastynerd: lots of people have problems with JS.. especially the Scala developers at my old job... but from my experience actually developing in it, I very much enjoy it
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<toastynerd>
I will say, I like node for some reason and it's mostly the DOM api I don't like
<toastynerd>
but I wouldn't want to work with JS on a day to day basis
<progrock>
But I suppose I've been doing it for long enough that I have imbedded in my head many things "not to do".... and have gotten accustomed to certain patterns that are less dangerous... but it can be scary ooking at an inexperienced developes JS
<toastynerd>
progrock: so true and I am pretty inexperienced in js
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<progrock>
well I was doing JS back when browsers were horrific and most JS code was very ugly... so compared to now, things are so much better that I can look past any issues I have
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<progrock>
And I get to do a lot of development with d3.js ... and the author, Mike Bostock, is a fucking genius... it is such a pleasure to look at and learn from his code
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<progrock>
and he just happens to program in a similar style to me.... not using JS as if it was a truely object oriented language
<Mon_Ouie>
canton7: As far as I understand it, the standard guarantees that converting integer zero into a pointer gives null, and vice versa; it just doesn't guarantee that the byte-level representation will be all 0s
<progrock>
yet another favorite, laughable, interview question "do you program in object oriented JS"
<progrock>
no
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<Mon_Ouie>
(so, for example, if you memset it to 0, it wouldn't necessarily work)ç
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<progrock>
so class variables (@@) are shared across all instances of the class I would assume?
<tobiasvl>
progrock: yes, but don't use them
<toastynerd>
yes
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<toastynerd>
yeah, unless you have a very good reason to (you probably don't)
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<progrock>
tobiasvl: haha, ok. Just needed to know since thats the first piece of code this girl showed me that I couldn;t guess at without looking it up
<progrock>
I just need to be confident enough withthe basic that I dont feed her misinformation
<progrock>
basics* [of Ruby]
<sandelius>
Is it possible to remove CommonLogger from the default Rack middleware?
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<toastynerd>
sandelius: you could monkey patch it....
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<sandelius>
toastynerd Yeah but that's what I'm trying to avoid :)
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<toastynerd>
sandelius: I figured =P
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<progrock>
well you guys definitely win with regards to IRC programmer community (or I just picked a good time to come in here, lol)
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<toastynerd>
progrock: good luck!
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<progrock>
Thanks for the help, I'm sure I'll be back when I dive deeper
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<progrock>
one quick OT question, but maybe I'll get lucky. I'm rusty with IRSSI... using it on a chromebook... I remapped my volume keys to page up and down.... but I can;t figure out what button I need to have to press first to be able to back scroll... anychance anyone knows?
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<robonerd>
heya
<progrock>
Im thinking it may be scroll lock.. but I just cant remmeber and didnt find out in a google search
<robonerd>
what is the easiest way to build web apps with ruby? i can do low level stuff, but i want to more 'bang out' rapid prototyping
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<robonerd>
normally i write everything myself, but with this i was to use the latest but quality way of building stuff
<robonerd>
w/e gems that is
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<robonerd>
i want to rapidly dev web apps (with jason api interface too) and a db backend
<robonerd>
sqlite, pgsql, should be modular
<progrock>
robonerd: Thats not entirely true.. I find JS easier... with node and the fact that front end and back end code is the same language (but totally personal preference there.. I' sure ruby is quite good for webapps)
<robonerd>
(without having to change api used in app logic)
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<robonerd>
what isn't entirely true?
<progrock>
oh.. shit I read why not what
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<progrock>
I cant read, sorry... almost 4 am here
<robonerd>
np, so what's up then?
<zxd>
hi the # is not for comments here is it ? default['yum']['main']['bandwidth'] = nil # /^\d+$/
<progrock>
me about to go to sleep... but was getting some great help on the basics of ruby, lol
<tobiasvl>
zxd: yes it is
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<zxd>
tobiasvl: so it's strange that they have code there
<progrock>
zxd: looks like a commented out regex to me... but let someone mroe knowledgable confirm that
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<ferr>
https://gist.github.com/anonymous/8315732 I got the issue with this piece of code. The only get the last song in the file, so I believe it is something related with overwriting
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<Hanmac1>
ferr you dont need f.close there
<ferr>
ok but it doesn't solve it
<pontiki>
also, i think you want to reverse the order of those blocks
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<pontiki>
open the file, then loop through each playlist entry
<Hanmac1>
ferr look at L27-L32 you do it wrong
<ferr>
that makes sense
<pontiki>
currently, you overwrite the file with each song
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<pontiki>
you could also shorting things up a bit by doing something like File.write(filename, playlist.join("\n"))
<ferr>
thanks
<dEPy>
I have a problem (ofcourse else I wouldn't be talking here), so... I have a class (service) for authentication and in this class I do @@secret = CONFIG[:secret]
<dEPy>
When testing rspec complains (ofcourse) that it doesn't know what CONFIG is
<dEPy>
Now, I might need this CONFIG in alot of other services and I don't want to do it this way with class variable because it seems bad.
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<pontiki>
not sure what the question is, dEPy
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<mrnugget>
Is there a way to access ruby vm settings from inside ruby? e.g. see what RUBY_HEAP_MIN_SLOTS is set to, without any environment variables
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<alexherbo2>
how make StringScanner returns MatchData, instead of matched string ?
<dEPy>
pontiki: well, how should I handle configs? is the way I do it ok?
<alexherbo2>
tobiasvl: i would avoid
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<alexherbo2>
i have to parse text on stream
<dEPy>
and on the other hand doesn't the thing that you need to do some mumbo jumbo with missing dependency classes in tests tell you something is wrong?
<pontiki>
dEPy: i don't have enough info about what you're doing, really
<pontiki>
just assuming you're talking about configuring an application, i'd build that into a singleton class in the app
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<dEPy>
pontiki: I have a yaml cofiguration that is loaded into CONFIG object (hash), then in my AuthenticationService I do @@secret = CONFIG[:secret]
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<dEPy>
and in my tests I don't want to load real configuration and I can't stub_const in before block because I'm assigning CONFIG to class variable
<dEPy>
So my thought was that doing @@secret = CONFIG[:secret] is not a good way to do it
<dEPy>
on the other hand I don't want to make an object instnance of that AuthenticationService cause then I'll have to pass in configuration every time
<asattar>
Hello, I just finished reading the "The Ruby Programming Language" book by David Flanagan and Matz, I want to read another book writing code, in "The Ruby way"
<asattar>
Is there any good book you can suggest?
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<pontiki>
i don't know what the class variable gets you in any case
<pontiki>
so, yeah, dump that
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<dEPy>
pontiki: so just use CONFIG[:secret] everywhere I need it?
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<dreinull_>
I have a bunch of Date objects for each day of the month but it just doesn't respond to #sunday? I checked with is_a? Date and it's true. Nothing's wrong with it. And I'm certain one of the objects is a sunday.
<zxd>
is this not valid syntax ["foo"]["bar"]["cheese"] = [] ?
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<zxd>
1:in `[]': can't convert String into Integer (TypeError)
<tobiasvl>
zxd: is that the entire code?
<tobiasvl>
what are you indexing?
<zxd>
that isn't the entire code, but how do I need to define other values before?
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<tobiasvl>
define what? you don't use any variables
<tobiasvl>
please show the entire code
<tobiasvl>
(all relevant code)
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<zxd>
ah
<zxd>
sec
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<tobiasvl>
i think you have an array where you think you have a hash
<tobiasvl>
arrays can only have integer indices
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<dreinull_>
slightly embarrassing, the mistake is elsewhere, never mind :)
<zxd>
tobiasvl: see
<zxd>
I see
<zxd>
this also dosen't work default["foo"]["bar"]["cheese"] = []
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<tobiasvl>
what is default and what does it contain?
<zxd>
nothing
<zxd>
not defined before
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<tobiasvl>
well you need to define it
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<tobiasvl>
you want default to be a hash that looks kind of like this? {"foo" => {"bar" => {"cheese" => []}}}
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<tobiasvl>
is this JSON?
<zxd>
no
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<zxd>
chef
<zxd>
heh
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<zxd>
why JSON
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<tobiasvl>
because JSON is represented like nested hashes in ruby
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<tobiasvl>
i'm just guessing what you want to achieve here, because you're not telling us ;)
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<zxd>
tobiasvl: because I took it from chef cookbook, it dosen't show the whole code has it's own DSL
<zxd>
but's it's ruby
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<zxd>
default["system"]["packages"]["install"] should be defined
<zxd>
I am trying to save it to something more easy to work with to push to eat more elements
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<zxd>
like e = default["system"]["packages"]["install"] ; e.push %w{ ...
<zxd>
don't know if this is valid syntax
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<zxd>
to it*
<zxd>
not eat
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<zxd>
can I do that ? tobiasvl
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<tobiasvl>
it is valid syntax.
<tobiasvl>
>> e = default["foo"]["bar"]["cheese"]; e.push [1]; puts default
<tobiasvl>
sorry
<vlad_starkov>
Question: Any suggestion of a good SOA on Ruby/RoR books?
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<alexherbo2>
no one to solve my problem?
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<zxd>
tobiasvl: is this valid ruby syntax {"b" => {"platform_family" => {"rhel" => []}}}
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<DouweM>
try it out in irb
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<workmad3>
Oog: because daemonised processes are detached from a terminal?
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<Oog>
workmad3: so im running on heroku and cant log to a file afaik... any way to get logs? advice?
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<workmad3>
Oog: maybe by not using the daemons gem?
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<Oog>
alternative?
<workmad3>
Oog: heroku uses foreman to spin up services
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<workmad3>
Oog: just run your long-running process on a worker dyno maybe?
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<Oog>
workmad3: thats waht im doing but i want each dyno to run multiple processes
<workmad3>
Oog: there shouldn't be a need to mess around with heroku to turn it into a daemonised service
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<waxjar>
Oog: daemons lets you set up a log file, no?
<Oog>
otherwise id have to pay for 4 dynos
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<workmad3>
Oog: or maybe you should consider something other than heroku?
<workmad3>
Oog: this is kinda one of the heroku restrictions :P
<Oog>
waxjar: yes - but i dont think heroku does...
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<waxjar>
ah, no. heroku doesn't let you use a (persistent) file system
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<workmad3>
also heroku expects a 12-factor app, which means you log to stdout (and don't detach yourself from a terminal)
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<Oog>
so basically not possible?
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<workmad3>
Oog: you might be able to hack something together by forking yourself and handling logging in a sensible manner
<workmad3>
Oog: but it's not something that heroku makes easy... after all, this is what they charge for
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<waxjar>
you set it up in a Procfile and let heroku handle everything. that's why one would choose heroku, so you dont have to deal with all that
<workmad3>
Oog: unicorn manages with multiple child processes, for example
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<Oog>
can unicorn do what daemonize does?
<Oog>
i use unicorn on the webserver
<Oog>
and that logging works
<workmad3>
Oog: no, unicorn is the app server
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<workmad3>
Oog: it just forks child processes to handle requests
<workmad3>
and then has a master process to keep track and manage them
<workmad3>
it's not a service framework... I'm pointing out that what you want is possible, but it's not necessarily easy and requires you to know what you're doing regarding unix process forking
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<workmad3>
and as waxjar said, if you're doing that then why are you bothering with heroku? heroku charges you a premium so you don't have to give a crap about any of this stuff :)
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<workmad3>
if you're gonna do this level of work, why not get a cheaper VPS and just set it up yourself? it'll be easier
<Oog>
yeah i dont want to care about this stuff but.... id like a little logging
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<waxjar>
a logging add-on is how heroku does that, i believe
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<workmad3>
waxjar: as I already said, heroku expects stdout to be your log, and makes that available to you
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<waxjar>
ah, makes sense
<workmad3>
waxjar: but yeah, they add an extra bit into rails apps on deploy to force them to log to stdout
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<workmad3>
12-factor app :)
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<AntelopeSalad>
i never had logs only goto stdout before but it does make sense to do
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<workmad3>
it's a useful way to separate concerns... if you log to stdout, then you can have some form of central logging just attached to the pipe and handle it completely outside your app without extra config
<workmad3>
or you can just pipe to a file
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<benzrf|semiafk>
hrku
<AntelopeSalad>
yeah it seems like a great thing to have if you are using multiple servers
<benzrf|semiafk>
it is p good
<benzrf|semiafk>
i use it to host any web apps i have writen
<benzrf|semiafk>
which is like 2
<AntelopeSalad>
dealing with log rotation and running out of disk space stinks haha
<AntelopeSalad>
(on your app servers)
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<AntelopeSalad>
btw workmad3, thanks again for recommending that rvm cookbook, it's so much more seamless than the alternatives
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<Oog>
thanks for the help
<workmad3>
AntelopeSalad: no probs... it would be a good idea to consider using poise or similar in the future though
<AntelopeSalad>
yeah, but right now it's at a weird point
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<AntelopeSalad>
the poise author says it's pg's fault and the pg's author says there's nothing he can do it about it
<workmad3>
AntelopeSalad: yeah, you're transitioning atm too, which leads to odd problems anyway :)
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<AntelopeSalad>
i was happy though, the rvm setup code in my recipe was like 2 lines
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<ferr>
can I assign a variable to file content like this "variable = File.read(filename)"
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<waxjar>
sure
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<tobiasvl>
what's File#read
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<tobiasvl>
oh yeah
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<user10121>
this is probably a very newbie-level question. i need to see as much of the code as possible while coding. sometimes i even prefer to "minify", which considerably affects readability but maximizes the amount of code i can see at once.
<user10121>
#1 am i a rare case? if so, what do you think are your compensatory practices or skills? #2 what are some of the tools you [think i could] use for this? something that shows a reasonably detailed outline of the code (with support for comments/annotations?). something that makes it easy to find my way around my own code.
<tobiasvl>
user10121: what editor do you use?
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<ferr>
I've got a string with three commas and at first one I need it to split into two pieces, any suggestions?
<waxjar>
>>"1,2,3".split ",", 2
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<MrPopinjay>
Hello all. I've written a short script in Ruby 2.0.0. I want to run it on my co-worker's machine, which has 1.9.7 installed, but it seems that with 1.8.7 the IO class doesn't have the write method. Other than upgrading his version of ruby, how ought I get around this problem? Thank you.
<wmoxam>
MrPopinjay: maybe it's a different problem?
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<MrPopinjay>
I'm confused, is that a different function with the same name, or am I misunderstanding something
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<Hanmac1>
there is also IO.write / File.write as class method, but it seems that 1.8.7 dind had it yet
<MrPopinjay>
Ah, wait, I think I have it. 'File.open(yourfile, 'w') { |file| file.write("your text") }' Pretty ugly in comparison to 2.0.0's IO.write, but it'll do
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<benzrf|semiafk>
oh hi MrPopinjay
<benzrf|semiafk>
didnt i see you in #haskell?
<benzrf|semiafk>
like weeks ago
<benzrf|semiafk>
*months
<MrPopinjay>
Probably, I bounce about all over the place with languages
<benzrf|semiafk>
i think i ranted at you about monads and stuff
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<Hanmac1>
your coworkers machine should be updated ... ruby does not support 1.8.7 anymore (so no security fixes)
<LadyRainicorn>
monads are monadic.
<benzrf|semiafk>
algebraic!
<LadyRainicorn>
MATHEMATICAL!
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<waxjar>
confusing!
<MrPopinjay>
Hanmac1: Really? Oh dear. Convincing people to upgrade is difficult...
<LadyRainicorn>
l i e s
* LadyRainicorn
gives waxjar the test of the candy guardians.
<benzrf|semiafk>
Alphanumeric!
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<Hanmac1>
LadyRainicorn: ROMBUS!
<LadyRainicorn>
noooo
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<waxjar>
i would probably eat those LadyRainicorn
<Hanmac1>
;P
<benzrf|semiafk>
both archer & at resume on the 13th
<waxjar>
i like candy
<tobiasvl>
MrPopinjay: he should at the very least run 1.9.3
<LadyRainicorn>
rhombus
<benzrf|semiafk>
the question here is which one should i watch first
<LadyRainicorn>
Me too.
<LadyRainicorn>
Buy me candy, waxjar.
<waxjar>
whats in it for me
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<benzrf|semiafk>
waxjar: as a jar, you can hold the candy
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<waxjar>
wax and candy? hmm
<LadyRainicorn>
I will eat the candy and it will be yummy and you will smile knowing you made me happy.
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<Fuzai>
If Datamapper has been left for dead, and Ruby Object Mapper isn't ready yet, what does someone use as a replacement that can use mongo as a backend database?
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<benzrf|semiafk>
screw mongo use postgres
<benzrf|semiafk>
B)
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<MrPopinjay>
Hello again. I'm on OS X. When I run a script as './scriptname.rb' rather than 'ruby scriptname.rb' it uses an older version of ruby, even though it's not the first in my $PATH. What ought I do about this?
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<Hanmac1>
MrPopinjay: what is the very first line in the ruby script?
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<MrPopinjay>
Hanmac1: The shebang, ah. Ok. So if I were to change the symlink in /usr/bin/ to the new version, do you think there would be a problem?
<benzrf|semiafk>
MrPopinjay: shebang line
<benzrf|semiafk>
MrPopinjay: just change your sheban
<benzrf|semiafk>
g
<benzrf|semiafk>
or use env
<MrPopinjay>
It's linking to the old one at the moment
<benzrf|semiafk>
$ man env
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<benzrf|semiafk>
MrPopinjay: 'env' can be used to execute a command as it appears in your path
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<olivier_bK>
in my compagnie we use for dns for establish a connection between two server
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<makerops>
hi, whats the best pattern for writing a piece of code for a time window
<makerops>
backoff timer doesnt seem to be what i need
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<makerops>
ie, im processing a stream of messages, and I want to correlate the last 30 seconds repeatedly
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<Jamo>
Id probably just make a new thread, set it to sleep for correct time...
<Jamo>
but there probably is a nicer way to do that...
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<makerops>
well, i have a constant stream of messages coming in, when it does, i send it to a process method
<makerops>
so spawn a thread off the process method?
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<platzhirsch>
Just installed pry on a new machine and strings are colored red instead of green
<platzhirsch>
That doesn't even make any sense
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<benzrf|semiafk>
my god
<benzrf|semiafk>
there is now a cryptocurrency called 'coinye'
<benzrf|semiafk>
formerly 'coinye west'
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<platzhirsch>
Just another digital currency
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<rhys>
so have a question on patterns. i want to build a gem that wraps up other DNS gems. such that i can go add/del/update a and cname records, and then have various other gems under the hood go and do that
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<joelio>
I guess I'm probably looking for a magic elixir that doesn't exist, but are there any decent gem's that can handle openoffice and office docs.. specifically for dealing with the metadata/fields. I guess it's all 'just XML' but interested to hear
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<joelio>
motive being the generate document templates with pre-filled fields based on arbirtary data stored in a webapp
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<benzrf|semiafk>
are class-vars accessed from a method defined in a module looked up in the module or in the class of the object you call the method on?
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<gcds>
Hello, maybe someone could help to fix spelling and grammar on my project description it's only one page not full
<gcds>
Because English is not my first language
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<benzrf|semiafk>
gcds: sure@
<benzrf|semiafk>
*sure!
<benzrf|semiafk>
link please?
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<Galgorth>
How does the initialize method in classes work?
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<Galgorth>
Hanmac1: That just confuses me more haha
<benzrf|semiafk>
Galgorth: after the object is already created, it automatically gets initialize called on it
<benzrf|semiafk>
with the arguments you sent to new
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<Galgorth>
benzrf: Hrmm ok, I'm just reading this code example: https://gist.github.com/gphummer/8321775 dealing with closures, and it looks like initialize was explicitly defined there
<benzrf|semiafk>
Galgorth: do you know what a closure is?
<benzrf|semiafk>
Galgorth: yeah, initialize is defined by you
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<benzrf|semiafk>
Galgorth: then when you call 'new' on a class, the new method internally will call initialize on the new object
<benzrf|semiafk>
after it is created
<benzrf|semiafk>
that way you can set up some code that will be run for every time you create an object of that class
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<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: I see
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<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: From what I gather, a closure is a method that you can call from outside the scope of a class
<benzrf|semiafk>
not exaxctly
<benzrf|semiafk>
a closure is a piece of code like a proc or a function that remembers the variables that were around it when it was defined
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<benzrf|semiafk>
that is, when a piece of code is lexically scoped
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<benzrf|semiafk>
if a language supports passing functions around and has lexical scope but does not support closures, that would mean that if you defined a function and then gave it back, it would not be able to see the variables in the scope where it was defined unless that scope still exists
<benzrf|semiafk>
with closures, the proc 'closes over' the variables around it
<benzrf|semiafk>
even if the scope it was defined in is otherwise lost
<benzrf|semiafk>
for example
<benzrf|semiafk>
local vars are scoped to one run-through (or invocation) of a method
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<benzrf|semiafk>
so they go away when the method finishes that run-through
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<benzrf|semiafk>
but if you make a proc in that method and return it, the variables you defined in the method will still be visible to the proc
<benzrf|semiafk>
even though that scope no longer exists in any other way
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<benzrf|semiafk>
the method is 'closed over' that scope
<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: Cool, so a proc is a way to save the variables in a method that you don't want to go away
<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: after the method completes
<benzrf|semiafk>
well, normally you just return any values you give back
<benzrf|semiafk>
*you want to give back
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<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: What does give back mean in this context?
<benzrf|semiafk>
you return it
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<benzrf|semiafk>
the values that the variables in the method point to still exist even if the variables go away, as long as you keep ahold of a reference to it
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<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: I see
<benzrf|semiafk>
closures just mean that you are free to talk about the variables near you when you define a proc without worrying about them no longer being available if you run the proc somewhere else entirely
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<benzrf|semiafk>
so I can do this:
<benzrf|semiafk>
def foo
<benzrf|semiafk>
a = 3
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<benzrf|semiafk>
proc {a + 1}
<benzrf|semiafk>
end
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<benzrf|semiafk>
closure = foo
<benzrf|semiafk>
closure.call
<benzrf|semiafk>
^that gives 4
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<benzrf|semiafk>
even though the method finished, the proc can still see 'a'
<benzrf|semiafk>
because it is closed over it
<benzrf|semiafk>
it sees the variables from where it is defined, not from where it is called
<Galgorth>
and a is saved to 3 in that case
<benzrf|semiafk>
right
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<Galgorth>
if you did close.call again
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<Galgorth>
er
<Galgorth>
closure.call
<Galgorth>
would it output 5?
<benzrf|semiafk>
no
<benzrf|semiafk>
I'm not /setting/ a
<benzrf|semiafk>
just looking at it
<benzrf|semiafk>
proc {a + 1}
<Galgorth>
ahhh right
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<benzrf|semiafk>
anyway, a block is a new scope
<benzrf|semiafk>
lvars defined or changed in a block will not persist outside the block
<benzrf|semiafk>
look @ this:
<benzrf|semiafk>
def foo
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<benzrf|semiafk>
thing = proc {a = 2}
<benzrf|semiafk>
thing.call
<benzrf|semiafk>
a
<benzrf|semiafk>
end
<benzrf|semiafk>
^that will error
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<benzrf|semiafk>
even though proc can see the scope it was defined in, it can't /change/
<benzrf|semiafk>
it
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<benzrf|semiafk>
that defines a new lvar called a
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<benzrf|semiafk>
*blocks are scopes for lvars too
<benzrf|semiafk>
not just methods
<benzrf|semiafk>
class blocks are also lvar scopes
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<Galgorth>
i see
<benzrf|semiafk>
an important thing to understand is the distinction between variables/names and objects/values
<benzrf|semiafk>
changing an object is NOT the same as moving variables around
<benzrf|semiafk>
when I do this:
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = "foo"
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = "bar"
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<benzrf|semiafk>
I changed what str1 refers to
<benzrf|semiafk>
but i DIDN'T change the original string object that contained "foo"
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<benzrf|semiafk>
it stil exists somewhere, impossible to reach since I don't have any way of finding it
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<Galgorth>
interesting
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<benzrf|semiafk>
eventually ruby will throw it away when it realizes that it can't be seen
<benzrf|semiafk>
that's called garbage collection
<Galgorth>
so there are two str1 objects in memory then?
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<benzrf|semiafk>
not str1 objects
<benzrf|semiafk>
objects don't know what variable they're in
<benzrf|semiafk>
variables are names that point to objects or values
<benzrf|semiafk>
now...
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = "foo"
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1.reverse!
<benzrf|semiafk>
THAT actually changed the object
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<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 still points to the same object as before
<benzrf|semiafk>
but now the object is different!
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = "foo"
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<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = str1.reverse
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<benzrf|semiafk>
'reverse' returns a new string without changing the old one
<benzrf|semiafk>
so that last example DOESNT change the original string
<Galgorth>
yeah
<benzrf|semiafk>
it just changes what str1 points to
<benzrf|semiafk>
changing an object is called 'mutation'
<benzrf|semiafk>
changing what a name points to is called 'reassignment'
<terrellt>
Er, why is this important? Definitely neat, but unless you want to deal with the garbage collector..
<benzrf|semiafk>
terrellt: because I know the pain of not understanding the difference between reassignment and mutation
<benzrf|semiafk>
it caused me issues
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<Galgorth>
str1.reverse! changes str1 permanently instead of just modifying str1 temporarily?
<benzrf|semiafk>
it changes the object str1 points to
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 is not repointed
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<Galgorth>
i see
<benzrf|semiafk>
while reassigning str1 leaves the original object alone, and repoints str1
<Galgorth>
str1.reverse and str1.reverse! are two different methods
<benzrf|semiafk>
yeah!
<Galgorth>
reverse! permanently changes it
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<benzrf|semiafk>
while reverse gives back a new string
<Galgorth>
yep, cool
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<benzrf|semiafk>
here is an example of when this matters:
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = "foo"
<benzrf|semiafk>
str2 = str1
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = str1.reverse
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<Galgorth>
ahhhh
<Galgorth>
does it point to
<benzrf|semiafk>
^in that case, str1 still points to the original string
<Galgorth>
foo
<Galgorth>
or oof?
<benzrf|semiafk>
while str2 points to a new string
<benzrf|semiafk>
oops
<benzrf|semiafk>
got it backward
<benzrf|semiafk>
my bad
<Galgorth>
str2 points to foo
<Galgorth>
while str1 points to oof
<benzrf|semiafk>
right
<benzrf|semiafk>
now, if I did this:
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1 = "foo"
<benzrf|semiafk>
str2 = str1
<benzrf|semiafk>
str1.reverse!
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<benzrf|semiafk>
now BOTH are "oof"
<Galgorth>
interesting
<benzrf|semiafk>
because you changed the single object that they both point to
<benzrf|semiafk>
that can cause bugs if you don't understand what's going on!
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<Galgorth>
lol i bet
<benzrf|semiafk>
this is why you don't want to change objects given to your methods at will
<benzrf|semiafk>
if you have a method called 'get_user' that takes a string for a username
<benzrf|semiafk>
and you change that string
<benzrf|semiafk>
the code that calls it might keep using the same string you passed to the method
<benzrf|semiafk>
even though now it's different!
<benzrf|semiafk>
for example:
<benzrf|semiafk>
user = get_user(username)
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<|RicharD|>
hi i have updated to ruby 2.1
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<benzrf|semiafk>
most other popular languages nowadays (afaik) have immutable strings
<benzrf|semiafk>
which means there's no way to change a string object
<benzrf|semiafk>
you can only get back new ones
<benzrf|semiafk>
to prevent exactly the kind of bug you see above
<Galgorth>
yeah
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<Galgorth>
from the rails reading i've done
<Galgorth>
it seems like they haven't changed objects very much
<Galgorth>
it's almost all been reassignment
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<Galgorth>
in the tutorials, at least
<bilbo_swaggins>
Galgorth, it takes longer, but I really recommend learning Ruby before Rails
<Galgorth>
bilbo_swaggins: I came to that painstaking conclusion last night ;p
<bilbo_swaggins>
Rails is my least favorite thing about Ruby. Don't get me wrong: it's neat and has a lot going for it, but Ruby is a powerful language and is useful for many things.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
With great power comes great debugging
<madhadron>
Does anyone know how to get an authentication token for 'gem push' without actually pushing?
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<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: actually, if you changed the string-object in the 'get_user' method, wouldn't it return back an error since that string no longer exists?
<Galgorth>
benzrf|semiafk: rather than printing the wrong string
<bilbo_swaggins>
Galgorth, can you provide more context? Scope is all-important in this case.
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<Galgorth>
bilbo_swaggins: I'm referring to benzrf's example of the 'get_user' method where the input is changed at the memory object level rather than reassigned
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<mechanicalfish>
madhadron: you can just call the api, no?
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<madhadron>
mechanicalfish: I suppose I can. Was hoping for a less inscrutable shell command, but I can certainly do that.
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<mechanicalfish>
madhadron: I was looking around in gem documentation but can't find anything useful
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<madhadron>
mechanicalfish: Nor could I.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
Galgorth: if I understand correctly, then, we're talking about a single object pointed two by two variables: one within a method and one without
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<bilbo_swaggins>
You want to avoid making editions to an object referenced in multiple places, unless you know exactly what you're doing
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<bilbo_swaggins>
Luckily, you can instead create a new object from the previous, with the changes you desire, without modifying the latter
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* madhadron
files some issues on the gem team to add authentication commands and a --dry-run option to gem push.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
The general rule (but don't *rely* on this) is that methods which mutate objects have an exclamation point at the end of their name
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<bilbo_swaggins>
So, as previously discussed, "foo".reverse and "foo".reverse! are doing quite different things
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<bilbo_swaggins>
They still return the same value, but the exclamationy one permanently alters the object rather than creating a new one with the changes you wanted
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<Galgorth>
bilbo_swaggins: ok
<Galgorth>
bilbo_swaggins: i'm using the pragmatic programmers 1.9/2.0 ruby tutorial book
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<Galgorth>
bilbo_swaggins: gonna read that some more then I'm sure I will have more questions ;p
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<Galgorth>
bilbo_swaggins: thanks
<bilbo_swaggins>
Is this your first language?
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<bilbo_swaggins>
In some ways it introduces programming concepts gracefully, but in others it presents many pitfalls
<madhadron>
Yes, for a first language you're probably much better off with Scheme.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
I'll save you the pain I spent months of debugging a sudoku-solver on: object.copy does not do what you might think it does
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<bilbo_swaggins>
madhadron: not sure if serious
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: Me? Absolutely. But I'm also responsible for the Unix daemon utilities in Haskell.
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<madhadron>
Scheme has about the lowest incidental complexity for a new programmer of any language I know. Forth requires too much time to learn stack discipline. Logo, maybe...
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<bilbo_swaggins>
I still need to learn a proper functional language
<bilbo_swaggins>
But oh the stacks of books I "need" to read
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: *grin* Yup. True for everyone.
<bilbo_swaggins>
on both counts, to be sure
<madhadron>
I was only referring to the books. Lots of folks get by fine without learning a pure functional language.
<madhadron>
Or go down the Prolog path instead.
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<Xeago>
how about clojure?
<madhadron>
Xeago: Neat, neat language.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
I'm intrigued what the "atoms" in clojure are
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<bilbo_swaggins>
explain like I'm five?
<Xeago>
thread safety things
<madhadron>
For learning a functional language, I recommend going to somewhere that won't let you use previous knowledge as a crutch, though. Ergo: Haskell.
<Xeago>
sorry, that's all I know
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<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: Anything that isn't a list is an atom.
<bilbo_swaggins>
madhadron: that's precisely what I was thinking
<bilbo_swaggins>
oh alright
<bilbo_swaggins>
typed primitives
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<Xeago>
madhadron: I think haskell is awkward for that, the naming of things are way too weird
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<Xeago>
and not guessable imo
<madhadron>
So the EBNF of a Lisp is expr := atom | '(' expr+ ')'
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<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: No, not at all. Syntax, not semantics.
<madhadron>
Xeago: I felt the same way about Ruby when I learned it.
<madhadron>
Intuitive is not usually a good indicator of anything except what your background is.
<bilbo_swaggins>
Xeago: don't you know programming is all about doing things the hard way to prove your manliness?
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<Xeago>
ruby reads like english?
<Xeago>
english is my background
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<benzrf|semiafk>
Xeago: haskell is excellent
<madhadron>
Xeago: And Haskell comes from a math background.
<benzrf|semiafk>
dem monads
<bilbo_swaggins>
abstract algebra is the dopest
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<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: If you mean symbols, i.e., 'something, then that's a different beast.
<Xeago>
s/background/foundation
<ericwood>
I like haskell, but I feel like I'd only truly enjoy it if I were a math person
<havenwood>
benzrf|semiafk: no woman no cry, no types no monads
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<Xeago>
no monads no types
<Xeago>
that fits the lyrics
* madhadron
admits to being a mathematician in a previous career phase.
<bilbo_swaggins>
madhadron: I don't know what you mean
<havenwood>
Xeago: good point, types isn't multi-syllabic enough
<bilbo_swaggins>
I wanted to be a physicist since age 8. Didn't pan out that way. :P
<Xeago>
neither is cry
<Xeago>
tihypes I guess?
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: I studied to be a physicist, and then ended up in math and then biology.
<bilbo_swaggins>
oh I didn't like biology at first, but now see the error of my ways
<bilbo_swaggins>
I'm fascinated by self-assembling machinery
<madhadron>
That is, how do you tell Lisp that you want an actual piece of data, not something executed.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
madhadron: I'm way out of my element with that
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<bilbo_swaggins>
oh oh I get it
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: Hmm. Maybe this will help. There are various atoms in a language: strings ("abc"), numbers (32), etc....but what do you call things like 'if'?
<bilbo_swaggins>
okay no I don't
<madhadron>
bbs, work calls
<bilbo_swaggins>
alright
<bilbo_swaggins>
I'll try to parse out what you're describing
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<bilbo_swaggins>
so it's the treatment of code as data?
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<benzrf|semiafk>
madhadron: semantically or syntactically?
<bilbo_swaggins>
syntactically, they're reserved words / control structures / etc
<bilbo_swaggins>
semantically, I assume code as data
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<benzrf|semiafk>
you can write a metacircular evaluator in Io the way you can in lisp
<benzrf|semiafk>
i think
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<bilbo_swaggins>
That's alright. I realized I wasn't as smart as I thought I was when I got 3/4 of the way through Goedel's proofs. I think I'm okay with not knowing everything. :P
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<benzrf|semiafk>
i read about 1/2 of GEB
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<benzrf|semiafk>
which is where i got my basic understanding of the incompleteness thereom
<benzrf|semiafk>
*theorem
<benzrf|semiafk>
of course that was years ago, maybe id understand it better now
<benzrf|semiafk>
@_@
<benzrf|semiafk>
i could barely process it @ that point
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<bilbo_swaggins>
I was taking nothing as given and working through it
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: All syntactically at this point.
<bilbo_swaggins>
Now I see why Goedel starved to death
<benzrf|semiafk>
this looks a little bit more impenetrable than GEB
<benzrf|semiafk>
@_@
<bilbo_swaggins>
yeah and this is the *handholding* version
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<madhadron>
So if an atom is "123" we say it's a string. If it's 123 we say it's a number. If it's if we say it's a symbol.
<madhadron>
If you were writing a parser, that's what you would call the types representing the atoms.
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<madhadron>
Lisp (and Ruby, actually) let you get symbols as values. In Lisp, you can put them into lists and tell the Lisp compiler to compile what you've created.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
okay
<bilbo_swaggins>
how long have you been programming?
<madhadron>
Umm...17 years now, I guess.
<bilbo_swaggins>
oh wow okay
<bilbo_swaggins>
I tried to learn C++ when I was 15. Terrible choice of a first language.
<bilbo_swaggins>
I put down coding for a long time after that
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<madhadron>
I guess I learned QBASIC from my father earlier than 17 years ago, but that was when I started doing stuff seriously.
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<bilbo_swaggins>
Ruby has been my first serious venture into programming.
<madhadron>
C was the first language I learned. Then Perl, PHP, JavaScript, and then Lisp and Forth oddly enough.
<benzrf|semiafk>
I learned True BASIC from /my/ father!
<bilbo_swaggins>
actually, C is nice
<benzrf|semiafk>
it will have been about 10 years in a bit
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<benzrf|semiafk>
i think
<bilbo_swaggins>
making something complex is difficult, but there are few parts
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: C is not nice. It is simply ubiquitous.
<benzrf|semiafk>
ive never done qbasic
<madhadron>
It has lots of jagged edges.
<bilbo_swaggins>
fair enough; that's why I stick with my 'easy' languages
<madhadron>
I suggest ALGOL W as an interesting example of an old procedural language with a very clean design.
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<benzrf|semiafk>
easy language ftw B)
<benzrf|semiafk>
*languages
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<madhadron>
*shrugs* I regard Ruby as a hard language. Lots of sharp edges. Lots of incidental complexity.
<bilbo_swaggins>
pretty much what I was saying to Galgorth
<bilbo_swaggins>
:P
<benzrf|semiafk>
madhadron: yeah :|
<bilbo_swaggins>
I'm self-taught and actually really dug getting into CS theory. However, I want to study advanced concepts that school would really help with
<guilund>
hey guys, how can i create a hash using .map? it always writes a []
<benzrf|semiafk>
bilbo_swaggins: same :D
<benzrf|semiafk>
guilund: map makes [], that is what map does
<benzrf|semiafk>
guilund: you can turn it back into a hash if you wish
<benzrf|semiafk>
use Hash.[]
<bilbo_swaggins>
[].map {}.hash
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: Hey, I never took a programming class. I did physics and math, and went to grad school in biology.
<guilund>
hmm
<bilbo_swaggins>
although that's leaving out a lot of important things to consider
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<bilbo_swaggins>
I think #hash lines up [0] as the key to [1], [2] to [3], etc
<bilbo_swaggins>
grad school is what I want to go to
<guilund>
.hash gives me a number
<bilbo_swaggins>
Perhaps I could just get a bachelors in music and then convince someone to let me study AI
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<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: I can't recommend grad school to anyone.
<benzrf|semiafk>
bilbo_swaggins: perhaps you mean #to_hash
<bilbo_swaggins>
madhadron: I'm insane enough to want it
<guilund>
benzrf|semiafk: thats the thing, it returns empty :P
<guilund>
benzrf|semiafk: i tried already
<benzrf|semiafk>
guilund: it expects an arg list of alternating k/v
<benzrf|semiafk>
not a single list
<benzrf|semiafk>
use *
<bilbo_swaggins>
moreso I want the environment of other motivated people
<benzrf|semiafk>
guilund: these are both valid:
<bilbo_swaggins>
hence, I spend a lot of time on IRC
<benzrf|semiafk>
Hash[:a, 1, :b, 2]
<benzrf|semiafk>
Hash[[[:a, 1], [:b, 2]]]
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<guilund>
hmmm
<benzrf|semiafk>
give it either straight args or a list of pairs
<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: That doesn't require gradschool.
<benzrf|semiafk>
NOT a list of args
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<benzrf|semiafk>
that is, Hash[[:a, 1, :b, 2]] is wrong
<guilund>
then the hash will be k => v with 0, 1
<guilund>
?
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<benzrf|semiafk>
hm?
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<bilbo_swaggins>
well, the reason I didn't do well in school in the first place is I'm an arrogant bastard of a student, so you may have a point
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<guilund>
{ :a => 1 }, { :b => 2 }
<benzrf|semiafk>
guilund: yes
<b00stfr3ak>
I'm having trouble using strict_encode/strict_decode64 I get the following error `unpack': invalid base64
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<madhadron>
bilbo_swaggins: *shrugs* So are half the folks you would be in grad school with. It's more that it's a very dysfunctional environment in most places and disciplines.
<benzrf|semiafk>
if you have a list of alternating k/v, use Hash[*the_list]
<benzrf|semiafk>
if you have a list of lists where the sublists look like [k, v], use Hash[the_list]
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<b00stfr3ak>
I'm trying to encrypt/decrypt contents of a file
<guilund>
it work deep in the array?
<benzrf|semiafk>
hm?
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<guilund>
[k, [[k, v] [k,v]]]
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<guilund>
something like that
<bilbo_swaggins>
guilund: if you have a list of keys and a list of values, you could zip them together first, ensuring an alternating set of keys and values
<bilbo_swaggins>
I'm not sure about the data you're operating on, though
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<guilund>
im trying to 'draw' a hash with a lot of data, like a json
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<guilund>
to liquid template
<madhadron>
b00stfr3ak: Do you see any newlines or the like in your base64 encoded output?
<guilund>
ok guys, thanks
<guilund>
let me play a little with this Has
<b00stfr3ak>
madhadron: looks like just one line
<madhadron>
b00stfr3ak: If it says invalid base64, typically that means you've got a character that's not part of the encoding in it.
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<b00stfr3ak>
madhadron: ok it is encoding the \n because the file has new lines (hmmm)
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<madhadron>
b00stfr3ak: Of course it encodes the \n. base64 is for encoding binary sequences of bytes to be safely transmitted as ASCII.
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<madhadron>
Wixy, If you don't care about race conditions you don't need much of anything. Ruby has a Global Interpreter Lock.
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<guilund>
almost returns what i need, but it puts another [] in each item
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<madhadron>
Wixy: Unless you need to always leave @foo in a particular state.
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<guilund>
how can i get rid of these [] ?
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<guilund>
{"page"=>[[{"titulo"=>"Clinica"}, {"url"=>"Clinica"}], [{"titulo"=>"Teste 2"}, {"url"=>"Teste 2"}]]} returns something like this
<Wixy>
madhadron, what do you mean by global interpreter?
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<Hanmac1>
guilund: are you sure you want [{ 'titulo' => nav.titulo}, {'url'=>nav.titulo}] and not { 'titulo' => nav.titulo, 'url'=>nav.titulo} ?
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<madhadron>
Wixy: Ruby only runs a single thread at once, no matter how many processors you have.
<Wixy>
alright, so it won't crash
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<DouweM>
madhadron: MRI has a GIL, not Ruby per se.
<Wixy>
but there will be race conditions
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<Wixy>
right?
<madhadron>
Anyway, off to work
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<guilund>
hanmac: this way you told
<Wixy>
ok thanks :P
<guilund>
hanmac: i made a mistake
<guilund>
hanmac: this {"menu" => [{ "label"=>"Clinica", "url"=>"Clinica", "titulo" => "Titulo da Page" }, { "label"=>"Lorem", "url"=>"lorem", "titulo" => "Titulo da Page" }] } works
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<DouweM>
Wixy: that single thread stuff is about MRI. If your script is ever going to be run on another implementation, you'll run into problems
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<Wixy>
MRI?
<Wixy>
I'm running it with "ruby", is it MRI?
<Wixy>
whatever it means
<DouweM>
Matz's Ruby Interpreter
<Wixy>
I didn't even know there were other implementations
<DouweM>
there are, JRuby, Rubinius etc
<Wixy>
oh, ok, sure
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<billiam>
I want to check whether two arrays have an intersection, but don't actually care what that insersection is. Is there a more expressive/concise way of writing `([:a, :b] & [:b, :c]).empty?`
<Wixy>
I knew JRuby actually
<Wixy>
but no, it's with MRI
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<DouweM>
so, the global interpreter lock stuff mentioned only counts for MRI
<benzrf|semiafk>
billiam: you could use sets
<benzrf|semiafk>
but otherwise no :\
<Wixy>
ok, thanks
<DouweM>
Wixy: i you're sure no-ones gonna run it on another impl, go ahead
<benzrf|semiafk>
see you all later
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<Wixy>
what's the fastest btw?
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<terrellt>
Wixy: If one was obviously better there wouldn't be three.
<Wixy>
that's not true
<DouweM>
Wixy: depends. a large plus on the side of JRuby is that it doesn't have a GIL and so has actual concurrency with threads
<terrellt>
Wixy: Well, one isn't obviously better, so there's three.
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<Wixy>
alright, thanks guys
<guilund>
Hanmac: shit, its easy, i dont know why i didnt realize that [] in the map is not necessary
<guilund>
ashamed
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<Eiam>
billiam: sure..
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<Eiam>
>> [1,2] & [3,2] ? true : false
<billiam>
Eiam: oh?
<Eiam>
>> [1,2] & [3,2] ? true : false
* Eiam
stabs the bot
<DouweM>
Eiam: `? true : false` is pretty pointless
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<Eiam>
DouweM: no its there to indicate it provides those values..
<billiam>
also, isn't an empty array truthy?
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<Hanmac>
guilund: it is if you want to return more than one element
<terrellt>
Hey, if Rails can pollute ruby namespace, so can I.
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<Eiam>
terrellt: oh what a fantastic justification
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<Eiam>
cause rails fuckign with the namespace never bit anyone in the ass ever
<DouweM>
:)
<Eiam>
(me, several times.)
<Eiam>
*staring at ruby documentation.. "but thats exactly what the method does.."*
<terrellt>
=)
<Eiam>
2 hours later
<Eiam>
RAILS YOU MOTHER FUCKERS
<DouweM>
hah, yeah that sounds familiar
<terrellt>
But yeah, writing Array#intersects? isn't -that- bad, since it's adding a method.
<DouweM>
exactly
<Eiam>
I guess. I just hate clever.
<Eiam>
its my least favorite part of ruby people
<Eiam>
being clever.
<DouweM>
haha
<Eiam>
oh look meta programmer jerk off code I get to understand and extend
<Eiam>
fantastic. just what I wanted to do today
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<Eiam>
fuck yeah he's using method missing everywhere, someone get me some coffee and a piece of paper stat
* Eiam
gouges eyeballs and pounds face into desk
<terrellt>
That's how I write all my code. Method missing and a big switch case.
<DouweM>
lol
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<bilbo_swaggins>
metaprogramming is dark voodoo not meant for man to comprehend
<Eiam>
my boss came in one day and said hey I wrote this cool new thing it does all this stuff that we always wanted
<Eiam>
so I was thinking cool thats good, good problem to solve
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<Eiam>
so I go read the code, its all method missing based, regexing on args and a switch-esque logic based on what regex find in the args, then re-calling itself again against method missing with new args from those args
<DouweM>
ew ew ew
<DouweM>
you made him fire himself right
<Eiam>
I spent about 3 hours that evening making sense of it, texted him and told him his code was really clever
<Eiam>
and that he's an asshole and i hate him.
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<b00stfr3ak>
madhadron: figured it out. dumb me wasn't adding a new line to the file i was writing to.
<Eiam>
he also didn't implement a respond_to_mssing
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<Hanmac>
Eiam "respond_to_missing?" is not always needed but a nice to have
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<Eiam>
DouweM: nah, I just called him an asshole and said he's too clever for his own good. even smart people can do dumb things. I think he realized when he had to later go extend the functionality how difficult it was to remember how all the metaprogramming worked originally now that he'd forgotten
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<Eiam>
everything makes sense *when you write it*
<Eiam>
its two months later that I care about, because heyo my job involves a lot of maintenance programming
<DouweM>
Eiam: yeah, I was just kidding. I've gone too far with cleverness on occasion as well
<Eiam>
I rarely write new code from scratch, hell I'm lost trying to bring up new projects from scratch
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<|RicharD|>
I have a big problem
<|RicharD|>
i do a simple script that search on twitter
<Eiam>
|RicharD|: better get it resolved quick! =)
<Eiam>
I have 0 desire to ever "relearn" C++ (like I ever knew it anyway, even after 4 years of doing it)
<Eiam>
i'll learn haskell before I learn C++
<|RicharD|>
i can paste the script because there are the tokens :S anyway it works fine…it show me the twitter messages
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<bilbo_swaggins>
Eiam: I agree that Ruby does have a lot of cleverness. Attractive nuisances, to borrow a legal term.
<|RicharD|>
but then, when have "finished" give me this error, at my co-workers/friend NO
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<|RicharD|>
I use: witter (5.5.1) and ruby 2.0.0p353 (2013-11-22 revision 43784) [x86_64-darwin12.5.0] like my friend
<Eiam>
bilbo_swaggins: I mean its fine, I love ruby after all, but it does attract a bit too much of that kind of people for me, but thats okay, I rarely have to deal with their code, and I certainly don't have to write code like that, so its OK
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<Hanmac>
Eiam i use C macros do bind C++ functions to ruby ;P (and you are only safe because i am to lazy to add other languages into the equalization ;P)
<Eiam>
DSLs are reaching face punch reaction for me too lately but w/e
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<Eiam>
I'm a quirky dude =)
<Eiam>
fantastic you mean I can't actually read your code either until I first learn your subset of ruby, lovely. thanks asshole.
<bilbo_swaggins>
my code, my rules
<bilbo_swaggins>
:P
<|RicharD|>
Any idea/suggest ?
<bilbo_swaggins>
I'm going to monkey patch control structures
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<jeremyevans>
If anyone here knows MRI internals well, is INSN.operand_size (compile.c) allowed to be negative?
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<Hanmac>
jeremyevans: what is INSN?
<jeremyevans>
I'm investigating a crash on OpenBSD/sparc64 where it is negative, and want to know if I can catch it when the INSN is created instead of later where it is used
<jeremyevans>
Hanmac: typedef struct iseq_insn_data in compile.c
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<kt__>
What's up with this:
<kt__>
rake aborted!
<kt__>
undefined method `join' for LL(:migrate, "db"):Rake::Scope
<kt__>
happens after the rake contract changes between versions
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<sec^nd>
What is the correct to use should ? I was doing error (my function) error?.should == false and then I switched to error?.should be_false, "Message" and now it fails because there is no be_false
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<sec^nd>
What is the correct to do assertions with error messages in ruby?
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<chebyte>
hi guys I have a question I was using wkhtmlpdf and when I generate a pdf from html with 72 dpi in linux it generates a empty page and in mac is ok
<chebyte>
anyone knows why?
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<drewgle_>
Is there a similarly succinct form of enum_of_objects.map(&:attr) for an enum of hashes?
<user10121>
this is probably a very newbie-level question. i need to see as much of the code as possible while coding. sometimes i even prefer to "minify", which considerably affects readability but maximizes the amount of code i can see at once.
<user10121>
#1 am i a rare case? if so, what do you think are your compensatory practices or skills? #2 what are some of the tools you [think i could] use for this? something that shows a reasonably detailed outline of the code (with support for comments/annotations?). something that makes it easy to find my way around my own code.
<benzrf>
user10121: nice reposting :)
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<user10121>
benzrf: no answer reached me last time
<benzrf>
I'm proofreading something for a guy here but I dont remember his nick, are you there? I still have your email
<benzrf>
user10121: yeah
<benzrf>
user10121: I dont really have too much of an issue with that
<benzrf>
user10121: dunno if other people do
<user10121>
benzrf: do you just have a very good visual memory?
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<benzrf>
user10121: it's ok
<benzrf>
but why would you need visual memory?
<benzrf>
maybe the issue is with your program design and not your ability to code
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<benzrf>
if you have a whole lot of methods, that might make it hard to remember which one you need
<benzrf>
vs. a few methods that take parameters
<user10121>
benzrf: i don't know... i often end up having to think of the whole program... i guess
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<benzrf>
alright
<benzrf>
well, ive heard people lauding ST's minimap feature
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<benzrf>
which you can also get for gvim
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<benzrf>
personally i just hop around the code if I need to see another part of ItSANgo
<benzrf>
or are you talking about overall structure?
<user10121>
that too
<benzrf>
*it, not ItSANgo
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<benzrf>
well, if your program is well-designed, you shouldn't have to be thinking about anything other than the part you're working on and what it calls
<benzrf>
;p
<user10121>
but quick/efficient navigation and especially very efficient ways to switch back to my previous location would be tremendous
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<benzrf>
what editor do you use?
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<user10121>
i know how well vim supports this, but i don't use vim
<benzrf>
what tho
<user10121>
i use kate, but i guess i'm supposed to switch to emacs sooner or later (which can mean as soon as this week)
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<benzrf>
why emacs??
<user10121>
they say it's wildly extendable
<benzrf>
it is
<user10121>
i would use it with vimperator anyway
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<benzrf>
vim is also great though
<user10121>
because i like modal editing
<benzrf>
basically
<benzrf>
vim is amazing for the nuts and bolts of editing
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<user10121>
yeah, i know that
<benzrf>
i.e. shifting stuff around, jumping to places, altering text
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<user10121>
have you ever tried vimperator, by the way?
<benzrf>
no
<benzrf>
i thought emacs had evil and viper, not vimperator
<benzrf>
isnt that a firefox plugin?
<user10121>
i was wondering how good a replacement it was
<user10121>
sorry
<user10121>
viper
<user10121>
is what i meant
<benzrf>
ah
<benzrf>
well, emacs is largely good at understanding and manipulating code, vs text
<benzrf>
vim is powerful at understanding text, emacs at code
<benzrf>
debatable
<benzrf>
*debatably
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<benzrf>
i use vim, but i dont dispute that id probably like emacs if I learned it
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<benzrf>
still, it is my duty as a cultist of vim to inform you that if you don't use vim you are literally the worst person in the world
<user10121>
:)
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<lewellyn>
benzrf: i use the one true vi. :) Version SVR4.0, Solaris 2.5.0
<lewellyn>
(that's the literal :version output, yes.)
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<benzrf>
heresy
<benzrf>
you cant even install surround.vim
<benzrf>
you pitiable fool
<lewellyn>
it's what you could call... a joy to use.
<lewellyn>
(the greybeards are free to groan at that)
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<user10121>
lewellyn: are you serious? isn't it limited?
<benzrf>
why ;-;
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<benzrf>
why would you make that kind of pun
<lewellyn>
user10121: depends on your definition of "limited".
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<lewellyn>
it's a hell of a lot faster for screen updates, though. :D
<benzrf>
pfft
<lewellyn>
(for real hell, try vim on a 9600 bps connection...)
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<benzrf>
who even has that
<user10121>
lewellyn: i guess it lacks a lot of the vim additions
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<makkura>
user10121: I use SublimeText and RubyMine. SublimeText has a section to the side where you can see the general flow of the code [like a very zoomed out version of the code] with a highlight on the section currently visible... RubyMine allows for collapsing of code blocks.. These are both things I've found helpful in finding or getting the right code on screen.
<lewellyn>
user10121: vim is marginally vi-compatible.
<makkura>
Poor folks like myself that never learned the vi/vim keyboard shortcuts are stuck with sluggish gui tools :/
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<lewellyn>
benzrf: anyone with a serial console.
<user10121>
makkura: oh, thanks a lot. i'm going to check it out.
<benzrf>
makkura: if i learned vim you can learn vim
<benzrf>
user10121: vim has code folding too
<benzrf>
so does emacs
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<benzrf>
EVERYTHING has code folding
<benzrf>
that isnt friggin notepad
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<benzrf>
ok so my vps host says i havent paid for my last bill yet
<benzrf>
but i couldve sworn i did
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<benzrf>
so if this overdraws me im going to sue them
<user10121>
lewellyn: well, yes. but i was thinking that the other way around wasn't true.
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<makkura>
sublimetext doesn't.. but it's a glorified notepad [syntax highlighting, regex] .. i certainly don't want a full IDE suggesting things to me all the time [which is why i don't use RubyMine all the time]
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<makkura>
benzrf: costly vps?
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<benzrf>
only 3.50 ;p
<benzrf>
p/m
<benzrf>
but i have either 3.80 in my acc right now or .30
<lewellyn>
user10121: there are some marginally-used bits of sysv vi which aren't in vim. and none of the vim extensions are in most vis.
<benzrf>
depending on whether the last payment went through
<benzrf>
oh go|dfish
<benzrf>
*god
<benzrf>
'Failed to authorize: Authorization Failed '
<benzrf>
wtf is this
<benzrf>
oh shit did my card expire
<makkura>
ouch :(
<benzrf>
oh fft
<makkura>
3.50? is that USD? I thought mine was cheap at $10.50
<benzrf>
i wrote down my name as 'Ben RF' instead of my full name
<benzrf>
oops
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<benzrf>
...and still not working
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<benzrf>
oh nooo
<benzrf>
it is supposed to expire 2/14
<benzrf>
it is not 2/14!
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<makkura>
It's a bit specific but I'm having issues with RVM trying to grab ruby install files from the jruby amazon cloud. Can't seem to get a work around. Anyone else have similar issues? rvm channel is abit dead atm so thought i'd go ahead and ask
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<makkura>
benzrf: your bank might be blocking it if you haven't successfully charged there before? small transactions from international locations can look fraudulent .. just a guess though
<benzrf>
I have though
<makkura>
mm that's different then
<benzrf>
ive been paying for it just fine for a few months
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<makkura>
Confirm your funds? I'd assume it's charging is as credit rather than debit [since you have $ in the account it sounds like a checking debit/credit card]
<makkura>
as credit it may not overdraft and reject instead?
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<benzrf>
it is debi
<benzrf>
t
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<benzrf>
i have no direct way to check
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<benzrf>
i -never- remember my acc info on the bank website
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<makkura>
ahh
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<makkura>
alternative such as paypal?
<benzrf>
no money in it :|
<benzrf>
well i have a few days
<benzrf>
ill work something out
<benzrf>
u-u
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<shevy>
matti why are you still awake, go to bed!
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<matti>
shevy: Its 10pm.
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<matti>
shevy: U nuts?
<matti>
;]
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<benzrf>
makkura: haha what is that
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<shevy>
matti I just woke up :(
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<matti>
;s
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<shevy>
869 folks here
<shevy>
we'll hit 1000 too eventually
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<|RicharD|>
hi to all
<shevy>
hi IRichie
<Jdubs>
shevy, are you ever not here?
<Jdubs>
seriously
<Jdubs>
lol
<shevy>
Jdubs dunno, I rarely restart my computer and IRC is always running in a window
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<benzrf>
Jdubs: he is omnipresent
<benzrf>
within this channel
<benzrf>
he is never not here
<benzrf>
he is the Eternal One
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<shevy>
you make me older than I am :(
<shevy>
but benzrf one day you'll be old as well!
* shevy
shakes fist
<jonnyro>
Is this a valid way to define a hash containing hashes? a = { 1=> {:x => 'dog', :y => 'cat', :z => 'llama'}, 2=> {:x=>'wombat', :y => 'marmoset', :z => 'llama } }
<benzrf>
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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<benzrf>
jonnyro: of course
<shevy>
jonnyro, I tried it in IRB and it does not work
<shevy>
I assume because 'llama has no closing '
<benzrf>
oh hmm
<jonnyro>
Is this a valid way to define a hash containing hashes? a = { 1=> {:x => 'dog', :y => 'cat', :z => 'llama'}, 2=> {:x=>'wombat', :y => 'marmoset', :z => 'llama' } }
<benzrf>
jonnyro: keep in mind that ruby 1.9 and greater support 'foo: bar' as a shorthand for ':foo => bar'
<shevy>
jonnyro can you not return all values by doing .values?
<benzrf>
include? is for keys
<shevy>
or .has_value
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<shevy>
I mean
<shevy>
.has_value?()
<benzrf>
jonnyro: why are you using a hash anyway?
<jonnyro>
My apologies, I would like to check only 2 of the 3 attributes
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<benzrf>
number-key hashes should really be arrays
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<jonnyro>
otherwise i think .has_value would work
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<jonnyro>
benzrf: the example is a simplified version of something else that requires a hash
<shevy>
jonnyro can you use .select ?
<benzrf>
jonnyro: oh
<jonnyro>
select is interesting
<benzrf>
jonnyro: why not use any? with a block that compares
<jonnyro>
do a select and check that it is not empty
<jonnyro>
ah
<benzrf>
jonnyro: any? is like that but one method
<jonnyro>
Excellent!
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<benzrf>
=]
<jonnyro>
exactly what i was looking for
<jonnyro>
Being new to ruby, i am constantly feeling like I am doing the wrong thing. There must be an easier method
<shevy>
benzrf have you had a new revelation in ruby?
<jonnyro>
benzrf: the keys in this case are likely to be 1,2,80001,80005. They are very sparse
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<jonnyro>
Does Array hurt you when your keys are not 1,2,3,..,n,n+1
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<benzrf>
hm
<shevy>
I would assume that array would be faster than hashes
<benzrf>
?
<jonnyro>
i think it would be faster. I just dont want it to allocate a bunch of nil entries
<benzrf>
shevy: what is this revelation
<shevy>
you can kill nil entries from an array with .compact! method
<benzrf>
shevy: spares arrays via hashes are well-documented i think
<jonnyro>
its possible that Array is smart enough to not store anything between a[1] and a[5] when a[2..4] were never assigned
<shevy>
benzrf I dunno, you usually have learned something new
<benzrf>
shevy: yes but he must look up entries via numbers
<benzrf>
silly
<benzrf>
shevy: well i have managed to push at least one commit per day on Legend
<benzrf>
=D
<benzrf>
so far
<benzrf>
hopefully i will not break that todaty
<benzrf>
*today
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<shevy>
jonnyro first off, array starts at [0] so when you say a[2..4] to never be assigned, but a[1] and a[5], it confuses me why you omit a[0] :)
<jonnyro>
You are correct
<benzrf>
wait hold on
<shevy>
as for entries in between two elements of the array
<benzrf>
hmm push
<shevy>
ruby apparently seems to fill them up with nils
<shevy>
array = []
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<jonnyro>
a = Array.new ; a[1]=2 ; puts a yields "[nil,2]"
<shevy>
array[0] = 5
<benzrf>
i guess i have not pushed commits every day since starting ;-;
<shevy>
array[5] = 6
<shevy>
array # => [5, nil, nil, nil, nil, 6]
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<jonnyro>
So really what i'm asking, are the nils in the middle run length encoded or something
<benzrf>
jonnyro: ignore shevy
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<shevy>
apparently they are stored
<benzrf>
jonnyro: hashes are fine for spares arrays
<benzrf>
jonnyro: and downright common for sparse grids
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<shevy>
jonnyro btw if the data structure is complicated for you, it may be best to access that data structure through method calls
<jonnyro>
the indices in this case are auto generated positive integers at the front of mysql table rows
<shevy>
rather than directly fiddling with it
<jonnyro>
shevy: you raise an interesting point, i should probably just wrap this in a class
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<shevy>
<benzrf> jonnyro: why are you using a hash anyway?
<shevy>
<benzrf> jonnyro: hashes are fine for spares arrays
<shevy>
!!!
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<shevy>
jonnyro: ignore benzrf
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<benzrf>
bbiab
<shevy>
he can't decide what he wants to suggest
<benzrf>
see you
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<jonnyro>
thanks
<shevy>
jonnyro for a while, complicated hash structures annoyed me until I started to try to simplify the data structures in the first place
<shevy>
and when that still did not work out, I wrapped it into methods (or as you said perhaps even a class)
<|RicharD|>
I have a simple script that use twitter gem, but after it show me all messages etc…it give me this error: /Users/riccardo/.rvm/gems/ruby-2.0.0-p353/gems/twitter-5.5.1/lib/twitter/rest/client.rb:143:in `rescue in request': execution expired (Twitter::Error)
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<shevy>
I created a class Configuration simply because I want to do this:
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<|RicharD|>
At a friend mine, not give this error…and we use the same ruby version, same twitter gem version
<shevy>
configuration = Configuration.new('path_to_the_config_dir_here'); configuration.debug = true # now the project feedsback a lot of debug values
<shevy>
configuration.debug = false # now it is mute again
<shevy>
and all config-values also become method calls automatically in this configuration object
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<jonnyro>
thanks for the help shevy
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<|RicharD|>
anyone can try my script ? i can give the link in private because have the api keys...
<|RicharD|>
please
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<TigerWolf>
dammit github, you have one job :P
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<lewellyn>
hahahaha. github's been down for like an hour now :P
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