<benzrf>
Ive been looking into ruby because it looks like it has most of what i like about python + some nice conveniences, syntactical shortcuts, & FP support
<DanBoy>
run this exactly
<DanBoy>
./sandbox.rb
<DanBoy>
and show me what it says
<benzrf>
in retrospect I wish id chosen ruby to start with
<benzrf>
LI
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<banisterfiend>
benzrf ruby is a cute language with quite a bit of hidden depth once u start learning about the more esoteric parts
<coca_rails>
ayy!
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<DanBoy>
?
<benzrf>
banisterfiend: i could say the same about python
<benzrf>
;)
<benzrf>
ever heard of __prepare__?
<coca_rails>
*yayy!
<banisterfiend>
probably
<banisterfiend>
though i never found python cute
<ecksit>
hey, i need a hand with customising the thor gem to accept params separated by colons instead of spaces. any ideas? or just i can debug it further?
<coca_rails>
interesting. it ran it until the exit part
<DanBoy>
did a bunch of numbers print out? :P
<banisterfiend>
it was too rigid and autistic to be cute
<coca_rails>
so the second program didnt run
<coca_rails>
Yea it iterated over the array and puts'd it
<DanBoy>
ya ok you got it now
<DanBoy>
follow that format
<benzrf>
banisterfiend: well isnt that mean
<coca_rails>
Sweet. Can you explain after the exit part
<DanBoy>
example mess around, when your done add the exit so it doesn't try and run all your other examples
<coca_rails>
So basically the code exit(0) says exit ruby
<DanBoy>
yes
<benzrf>
how does exit work in ruby btw?
<coca_rails>
sweet.
<benzrf>
is it like system.exit in java or does it raise an exc like in py
<DanBoy>
that first example is just me setting up the pattern
<coca_rails>
Yea, i like it thanks!
<banisterfiend>
benzrf raises SystemExit
<coca_rails>
DanBoy: can i pm you
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<DanBoy>
make and example then exit() so it doesn't try and run the whole thing
<DanBoy>
ya sure
<benzrf>
banisterfiend: wait really?
<benzrf>
that is literally exactly the same as python
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<banisterfiend>
benzrf ruby came after python, it took the good bits ;)
<coca_rails>
Danboy you rock!
<benzrf>
buh
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<banisterfiend>
benzrf took a few other things from python too, such as loop {} trapping Iterator exceptions
<banisterfiend>
StopIteration
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<banisterfiend>
and i think the ruby generator API is inspired by python'sone
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<benzrf>
i just wish ruby used significant whitespace
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<benzrf>
& I may prefer the python philosophy
<benzrf>
sue e
<benzrf>
*me
<banisterfiend>
benzrf i don't, i haven't done much python, but i've done enough coffee script (which has significant whitespace) to find it a bit annoying
<banisterfiend>
one thing that bugs me is you can't just select your entire program code and tell your editor to 'fix up the indentation'
<banisterfiend>
in a whitespace significant language that operation doesn't really make sense
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<benzrf>
i find ends to be an eyesore myself
<benzrf>
btw you should check out livescript
<benzrf>
it has some haskell bits & a shitload of syntactic sugar
<benzrf>
& it fixes the scoping issue in CS
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<banisterfiend>
i do too, but the practicality of 'end' outweighs the aesthetic qualities
<benzrf>
meh
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<benzrf>
i can only hope the lack of parens helps compensate for all of the ends
<benzrf>
~_~
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<havenwood>
usually `update-alternatives` is what people use
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<near89>
but i did that before..
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<havenwood>
Any Ruby apt users around?
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<bnagy>
it's not Hanmac o'clock for hours :/
<havenwood>
near89: When i'm on Debian systems is usually install ruby-install and chruby. Then can easily get whatever Ruby I want and I prefer to do a local install anyways to avoid `sudo`.
<havenwood>
tjbarber: Yeah, a lot less to remember (i messed it up), and easy to read.
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<Anon542>
hey
<havenwood>
tjbarber: I like pry-theme for pretty colors and pry-byebug for debugging.
<havenwood>
Anon542: hiya
<Anon542>
im new here
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<havenwood>
Anon542: Welcome to #ruby.
<tjbarber>
havenwood so pry-byebug is basically like breakpoints?
<havenwood>
Anon542: New to Ruby as well?
<tjbarber>
that's what it looks like
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<tjbarber>
similar, not quite
<havenwood>
tjbarber: Yeah, like pry-debugger was for 1.9.x.
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<havenwood>
tjbarber: Pry can do a binding.pry break, just normal Pry.
<havenwood>
tjbarber: But having next, back, etc.
<tjbarber>
totally
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<havenwood>
My only complaint about Pry was that when I tried to name a globally scoped local variable `cat` it would conflict (yeah... i run into this surprisingly often)
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<havenwood>
So a line in ~/.pryrc solves it: Pry.commands.rename_command '%cat', 'cat'
<havenwood>
And for pretty colors: Pry.config.theme = 'railscasts'
<havenwood>
Also I like a minimalist prompt (unless i explicitly decide I care about line number), so: Pry.config.prompt = Pry::SIMPLE_PROMPT
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<havenwood>
Anyone going to RubyConf?
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<havenwood>
Day 1, 3pm: REPL driven development with Pry ~cirwin
<near89>
i needed to uninstall the previous version of ruby
<near89>
thanks a lot!
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<butblack>
I have a sound track, I'm trying to measure the number of times that the decibels go about a specific threshold, is there a gem that might be able to do that?
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<ecksit>
what is the best way to debug a method call to get a call stack?
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<ecksit>
i.e. i need to track down what is calling my method and at what stage it is being manipulated.
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<jrobeson>
you could play with pry
<ecksit>
do you have some docs or example around ti?
<ecksit>
it*
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<bnagy>
you can just look at caller
<ecksit>
yeah, i am currently using puts caller.inspect
<ecksit>
just wondering if that is the best way
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<bnagy>
2.0 has funky new TracePoint stuff
<bnagy>
I would have thought caller would be sufficient for most stuff though
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<ecksit>
damn, now the json gem won't work.
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<ecksit>
odd.
<ecksit>
looks like it is ignoring my .ruby-version file :(
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<keanehsiao>
hi. I would like to ask, I install ruby on windows using ruby installer. but when every time I handling around gem install, when gem operating & face the file moving with .bat file. it display "permission denied". I already operate with administrator. and if I delete .bat file, everything goes fine.. only with .bat file.. can anybody help me on that? thanks.
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<keanehsiao>
RubyPanther: no, I installed that, but still same. I am searching around, and seems it's issue with cygwin.. also the gem-exefy. still searching..
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<navyant24>
Hi, I'm working on Backbone.js as front-end with Ruby on Rails on back-end. I want to redirect the user away from the "show" page of my "post" model, "only" if they click the delete button while on that page. Any ideas?
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<sevenseacat>
sounds unrelated to ruby
<RubyPanther>
keanehsiao: generally you have to remove the cygwin stuff from the PATH if you want to use devkit
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<DanBoy>
#rubyonrails for that dude
<navyant24>
thanks
<RubyPanther>
for me if I'm using devkit it is because it doesn't have cygwin
<navyant24>
will check there
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<keanehsiao>
RubyPanther: but I don't see it in PATH… however, I think one gem I try to install has cygwin contain? which is rhodes
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<sevenseacat>
no.
<emanu>
got it
<emanu>
anybody here?
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<RubyPanther>
keanehsiao: if you're trying to develop cross platform mobile apps on windows, I recommend using a VM to run linux on windows, and dev in linux.
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<emanu>
I have a bit of a niche question: I wrote a ruby script that does simply: "while true ; end" and I ran it and am looking at the cpu cores on my mac using istat menus on OSX. I noticed that 4 out of the 8 cores of my machine are showing about 50% usage going up and down.
<emanu>
why is this if a ruby process is multi threaded?
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<RubyPanther>
emanu: because your app didn't use any threads
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<emanu>
sorry
<emanu>
I meant if it's single threaded
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<keanehsiao>
RubyPartner: ok, I will try it.. however, It works fine one week ago, and my contractor connect to my computer & setup something, and it was totally broken… so I reinstall whole ruby, and everything dead… :(
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<RubyPanther>
keanehsiao: right, it is finicky because of rhodes. windows just isn't good at cross-platform tools. cygwin helps, except if it is underfoot. But a VM running linux is almost always better than cygwin these days.
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<keanehsiao>
RubyPanther: I develop on mac, but rhosimulator crash often, so I use windows, simulator was stable. never use linux with rhodes.. will give it a try.. thanks. :)
<dobry-den>
emdub: it's 4 virtual cores and 4 physical cores.
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<dobry-den>
emdub: you shoudln't have seen more than 100% cpu usage in activity monitory
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<emdub>
hmm?
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<ecksit>
hey, can someone tell me how i can turn this array ["domains:list", "-e", "dev"] into ["domains", "list", "-e", "dev"]? i need to keep the same order and just split it into two arrays items on that colon.
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<bnagy>
you can also cheat and sort_by {|e| e.fast.object_id }
<bnagy>
but it's pretty awful :)
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<apeiros>
bnagy: what'd be the point of that?
<apeiros>
ah, you mean avoid the ternary
<bnagy>
just a convenient way to get a sortable vaue out of a boolean
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<apeiros>
but it still needs the second part
<bnagy>
s/convenient/ugly
<apeiros>
since he obviously wants to sort by more than just the boolean
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<swingha>
apeiros, No, just by boolean, the id is for the example. The problem is false items are not in order with a.sort_by! { |m| m.fast ? 0 : 1 }
<bnagy>
oh it's supposed to be fast then by id?
<apeiros>
swingha: you're not making sense. in your example, the result IS ordered by boolean
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<sevenseacat>
there is no order for the false items
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<swingha>
apeiros, id:2 is before id:1 in result
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<apeiros>
if you want stable sort (retain current order) for items which have the same ordering value, then you have to use the current index as additional sorting value.
<apeiros>
swingha: yes, so you want to sort by boolean AND id
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<apeiros>
*sob*
<apeiros>
make up your mind what you want, tell it, the others can surely help you. I've got to commute.
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<bnagy>
swingha: try apeiros example, I'm pretty sure it's what you want
<Cope>
I'm trying to write a test that connects to the tomcat manager, which uses http basic auth; I can connect with w3m with username/password, but both curl and my net.http code return a blank response.body
<Cope>
Is there somethingI could be missing?
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<roolo>
I am writing Sinatra API and it looks like namespace from sinatra-contrib interfere with rake namespaces (tasks behave like without namespace)
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<roolo>
Have you encoutered/fixed this issue?
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<polysics>
Hacker News people do not like Ruby any more. There is one "Ruby is dead" post a week. Ah well.
<polysics>
hipster programmers abound
<popl>
"Hacker News people"?
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<polysics>
whoever votes HN articles up
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<Hanmac1>
thats your problem ... you care about what others say ;P
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<polysics>
I do not care. In fact, my opinion is that an "X is dead" article means X is mature.
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<polysics>
it just means you are getting rid of hipsters and amateurs.
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<mengu>
]]l
<mengu>
damn
<mengu>
polysics: they all be doin nodejs now
<polysics>
for the next 2 weeks, yes :D
<mengu>
i don't think anything would kill rails, if you are referring to that post
<mengu>
only rails is gonna kill itself
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<polysics>
I like the workflow a guy talks about, prototype in Rails and eventually port to Go if needed
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<polysics>
and I agree on that too, Rails might kill itself - the core team should start doing less hipstery things themselves.
<mengu>
but then ruby is not just rails
<mengu>
you can go and enjoy ramaze
<mengu>
or padrino
<mengu>
or sinatra
<polysics>
I do not even do much web dev
<polysics>
but I understand the importance Rails has for Ruby, and that should not be underplayed
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<Hanmac>
i can do window apps or 3D rendering in ruby too without rails
<mengu>
i mainly do web with python
<polysics>
Hanmac: I am the first in line to tell people "Ruby is not just Rails"
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<polysics>
but mine is a "political" remark: the success of Ruby is built on Rails
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<Hanmac>
my first contact with ruby was as scripting language in a Game Editor ,P
<polysics>
what matter is "This fourth printing of Learn to Program, 2nd edition has been updated for Ruby 2.0."
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<kaushal>
polysics: please point me to the url
<polysics>
and the PragProg website will certainly sell you the latest
<polysics>
that's the correct page, just get the eBook off that
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<kaushal>
but it says 2nd edition
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<kaushal>
when you select ebook format. Please confirm
<polysics>
they made it a little tricky, it's the fourth printing but you want the 2nd edition
<kaushal>
ok
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<wald0_>
im reading some cheatsheets / reference of ruby, but is there any equivalent one in CODE?, i mean... these references has a small sentence of "what is" something, but doesnt make me understand it if i have not already read about that
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<wald0_>
so in "code" as i mean, its an example code including all the ruby language/elements, like "this $? is the return value of the last returned process finished" (which you can probably run, etc)
<kaushal>
polysics: Thanks a lot for the encouragement
<kaushal>
have ordered it online and will start reading it
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<polysics>
you will love it. Also, you chose the right language to start from :)
<kaushal>
cook
<kaushal>
cool*
<kaushal>
Thanks again
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<polysics>
cheers, and swing by when you have questions :)
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<kaushal>
polysics: sure and meanwhile can i refer ruby website to get started?
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<kaushal>
polysics: do you think thats the right approach?
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<polysics>
the ruby website is not very start-friendl
<polysics>
*y
<polysics>
you are better off with a good book
<kaushal>
ok
<wald0_>
polysics: thx, well i meant more like something very small, like a code of 2-3 pages longs which includes examples (in code, with commented, more like in text), about examples of the ruby lang
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<polysics>
that would never fit in 3 pages, Ruby is not Go :D
<kaushal>
polysics: how long you have been coding in Ruby?
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<polysics>
professionally? 3 years now
<kaushal>
ok
<polysics>
10 years of PHP and JS and C before that
<kaushal>
polysics: You started of with reading a book or online tutorials?
<polysics>
you know, I do not really remember :D
<mikecmpbll>
just write ruby
<kaushal>
mikecmpbll: ok
<wald0_>
polysics: btw, i started reading "begining ruby" because i liked a lot how the examples are made on it, maybe its a bit basic for me since i already know bash and C so i hesistate to continue reading from another book like the pixaxe, friends suggested me the well-grounded one, what you think that can be a good option?
<polysics>
you can never read enough books.
<mikecmpbll>
learn as you go. the notion that you can learn a language by reading a book cover to cover is frankly bizarre to me.
<polysics>
I am not a great fan of the pickaxe
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<popl>
The pickaxe is a great invention.
<polysics>
mikecmpbll: that is why I put greater value in Eloquent Ruby or The Well-Grounded Rubyist, or Metaprogramming Ruby
<polysics>
they have more value than just "language"
* mikecmpbll
shrugs. never used a book for anything but reference
<wald0_>
when i searched books i skipped the pixaxe one because it wont included "nice examples" (so more hard to understand), by other side i assume that is the more complete/advanced one?
<polysics>
popl: my personal preference goes to Matz's book
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<polysics>
Pickaxe and Matz's are about the language
<polysics>
the others mentioned are about practices
<wald0_>
unfortunately Matz's book is very old (old ruby version), isn't ?
<polysics>
there might not be a Ruby 2.0 version
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<kaushal>
I am really astonished how people invent proggramming language :)
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<wald0_>
well, Matz's is not even 1.9, is 1.8 iirc
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<wald0_>
kaushal: programming language is just a shortcut way to tell the computer what you want to do :), your imagination does everything creating the language "ways of"
<kaushal>
Yukihiro Matsumoto is a brilliant person to invent Ruby :)
<kaushal>
wald0_: your thoughts?
<polysics>
Ruby was created for "programmer happiness" above all
<kaushal>
is ruby interpretor created by Yukihiro Matsumoto?
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<kaushal>
or the program syntax
<polysics>
I think Matz built the first Ruby interpreters
<polysics>
but he mostly started the syntax
<polysics>
nowadays implementations (interpreters) are managed by other people
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<kaushal>
so the interpreters are written in C?
<polysics>
when I met Matz, I had the impression Ruby is still an academic project to him
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<kaushal>
polysics: ok
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<polysics>
kaushal: the "normal" interpreters are in C
<polysics>
JRuby is Java, and Rubinius is… Ruby
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<polysics>
but for all practical purposes only C Ruby and JRuby exist :)
<kaushal>
Any specific reason to use C to write interpreters?
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<kaushal>
is it due to the low level architecture available in C?
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<polysics>
C is still the best compromise between low-level and an usable langauge
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<polysics>
yes, exactly
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<lupine>
I dunno, D is good too
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<lupine>
anyway, rbx is C++ where it's not ruby
<polysics>
that C is still unbeaten after all these years speaks volumes
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<polysics>
you should not even care about rbx tbh
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<lupine>
be nice
<kaushal>
I think C is the mother of all Programming Languages
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<kaushal>
hats off and still it is very much used
<lupine>
kaushal, that's ignoring approximately half of the field
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<vasilakisFiL>
hey may sound stupid but I don't know how to split some lines.. for instance this line here is 88 chars (with identation). header_fields[:If_Unmodified_Since] = line.split(/^If-Unmodified-Since:\s/)[1] How should I split it?
<kaushal>
lupine: not sure i understand that
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<polysics>
well, not really - the Algol family won hands down :)
<lupine>
C is not the mother of lisp or its derivatives
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<polysics>
whose market share comprises approximately one pixel of the C character. :D
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<polysics>
academic merits aside, of course
<lupine>
it may look that way in your subset of the market
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<lupine>
but I wasn't really bringing market share up
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<kaushal>
polysics: what did you liked about Matz?
<polysics>
feature-wise, Lisp is as important as C
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<kaushal>
I mean when you met him personally
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<polysics>
Matz is really relaxed and outgoing, I was not expecting that from a "celebrity"
<polysics>
just go to a conference he is speaking at and meet him :D
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<kaushal>
outgoing meaning down to earth?
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<polysics>
yes
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<polysics>
but just as C is not "programming" Matz no longer "is Ruby" nowadays
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<kaushal>
polysics: ok
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<kaushal>
is Matz working for some organization?
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<kebomix>
hello guys, just installed ruby/rails on new server , when ever i run rake task i get this error http://pastebin.com/ik8PThKi
<kebomix>
and ideas how to solve ?
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<polysics>
you know, I have no idea - I think he was consulting for Github but I might be wrong
<polysics>
he is in academy
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<polysics>
never seen that O_o
<kaushal>
polysics: what did you learned from him?
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<kaushal>
during the meeting
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<polysics>
not much, we ate dinner and were actually discussing conference logistics with Jim Freeze and others :)
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<kaushal>
Its really encouraging when you write some code and that works as you expect it to do
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<vasilakisFiL>
anyone? :P
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<wald0_>
kaushal: yes, my thoughts, nothing officially stated anywhere :)
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<mojjojo>
what does this error mean: undefined method `days_ago' for 11:Fixnum ?
<Hanmac>
andrewvos: last time i checked gems does not want to connect to rubygems unless https is used
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<Deele>
Hanmac testing...
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<Deele>
Hanmac, Errno::ETIMEDOUT
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<dzan>
hi, could someone please have a look ( minimal example ) I've been at this for 2 days can't find it but i'm still learning ruby: http://pastebin.com/WmQideYd
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<dzan>
problem is when I comment out 1 of the regexes it's correct
<dzan>
when I leave them both in place the second one return a wrong line number
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<hoelzro>
what's wrong about the line number?
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<dzan>
hoelzro, it returns the wrong result
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<dzan>
but it's correct when I just have 1 regex
<hoelzro>
and what is the wrong result?
<hoelzro>
you need to provide more information
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<hoelzro>
I have no idea what the regexes you're using are
<hoelzro>
nor the data they're being used on
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<dzan>
hoelzro, it's not really relevant because I determined the regexes not to be the issue they work seperatly ( when I comment one of them out )
<dzan>
it's just when I have them both evaluated like in the paste the second one is messed up
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<apeiros>
dzan: awesome
<apeiros>
you don't know what the problem is, yet you feel fit to rule out what it isn't…
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<dzan>
apeiros, ok hold on i'll provide more
<dzan>
people always ask for a minimal example is all
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<apeiros>
dzan: yes. and what you gave is not.
<apeiros>
minimal *reproducable* example
<apeiros>
the reproducable part is pivotal.
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<hoelzro>
line 50 contains a start and end comment...
<hoelzro>
graph: /* Empty */
<_br_>
andrewvos: For production deployment its often also a good idea to cram everything into a virtual guest, gives you a bit more isolation in case something goes wrong.
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<dzan>
hoelzro, i know
<dzan>
hoelzro, there must be something I don't understand :D
<hoelzro>
oh, sorry, I misunderstood
<hoelzro>
that's the *expected* output
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<dzan>
yeah :)
<dzan>
I get 50 & 2
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<andrewvos>
_br_: You mean like inside a container or a VM?
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<hoelzro>
hmm
<hoelzro>
well
<apeiros>
dzan: you're iterating lines
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<apeiros>
line 50 is already consumed
<hoelzro>
I'm guessing that find_index on a file updates the file pointer
<apeiros>
2 lines later you get an end
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<dzan>
oh
<dzan>
that wasn't clear from the docs for me
<apeiros>
on another note: why do you recreate the regex all the time?
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<dzan>
should first reset the iterator? or is there a better way
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<dzan>
apeiros, because I'm new to ruby :) doing some stupid stuff probably
<_br_>
andrewvos: Yep, its something you want to do for ease of maintenance and security. Also, that together with Vagrant+Docker is a nice combination for development and deploys.
<dzan>
well it's not ruby related I shouldn't create objects
<dzan>
like that
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<andrewvos>
I'm starting to think vagrant is a pain
<andrewvos>
_br_:
<andrewvos>
It's just too slow
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<apeiros>
dzan: just put the regex in the hash
<andrewvos>
It feel like I'm going into a fight with a gigantic hammer that is too heavy to lify
<dzan>
hoelzro, yeah that's one thing I don't like about ruby... it's possible to do the same thing in 10 different ways
<hoelzro>
dzan: what's your programming background?
<dzan>
leaving me with the idea of whatever I write it's not the best way to go
<_br_>
andrewvos: Google, enslave? Well, corporations have too much power these days.
<dzan>
hoelzro, C / Java / asm
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<dzan>
I needed to learn a good scripting language
<dzan>
tired of bash
<hoelzro>
alright
<dzan>
or js
<hoelzro>
heh
<wald0_>
if im writing something in Vim, like a.freeze, and I want to "read the doc" to know, what is the more handy way to get doc when needed?
<hoelzro>
well, it's my opinion that no matter which language you're working with, there's always more than one way to do something
<hoelzro>
in spite of claims to the contrary
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<wald0_>
dzan: hey, you have just the same problem as me :), i was doing everything on bash and i got tired of its no-features and hacky ways to try to include features :), so im learning ruby now!
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<hoelzro>
wald0_, dzan: out of curiosity, what made you choose Ruby as a scripting language to learn?
<dzan>
hoelzro, I mean like why allow both ('s or not or have methods both with '.' or '#' ...
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<dzan>
hoelzro, imo there were 2 options, ruby or python
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<dzan>
there is perl but there are more libs for the others that interest me
<wald0_>
dzan: i have the same feeling about "not the best way", but i have not started to code anything yet so for now its just a feeling
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<dzan>
and python with the 2.x 3.x screwup and the indentation stuff nah
<dzan>
also RoR is interesting
<hoelzro>
methods with '#' are nomenclature for pointing out an instance method
<hoelzro>
what libraries did you feel Perl was missing?
<dzan>
wald0, yes there are a lot of options :p
<wald0_>
hoelzro: basically i discovered ruby recently, i mean "i have see what nice things has", maybe from the 20-minutes thingy of the website, idk, so i feeled interested thinking "oh nice! oh nice!" and i continue reading about it :)
<hoelzro>
I've been using it for 8 years and I've never found a library that was available in for a langauge but not for Perl
<dzan>
hoelzro, not 'missing' but if I'm about to create a quick ui I don't see me using perl
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<hoelzro>
desktop or web UI?
<dzan>
dekstop
<dzan>
desktop*
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<hoelzro>
hmm
<hoelzro>
for which OS?
<wald0_>
hoelzro: by other side, answering your question, i needed a powerful language which allows me to do "anything" in a handy-to-code way, ruby seems to fit perfectly, and I also needed to use some C libs so with FFI seems that i can perfectly do that
<dzan>
python is most used for that purpose but everone knows python :p
<hoelzro>
wald0_: cool =) what's your background?
<dzan>
hoelzro, debian
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<wald0_>
dzan: i was never convinced with python too, by some reason, also i dont like that identation rules
<hoelzro>
dzan: Perl does have GTK and Qt bindings
<hoelzro>
but I'll stop evangelizing Perl in a Ruby channel now ;)
<wald0_>
hoelzro: no web, im only interested (needed of) desktop UI / apps
<wald0_>
for linux
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<hoelzro>
wald0_: and what languages do you already know?
<dzan>
hoelzro, not saying it doens't have them
<dzan>
hoelzro, but i'd like a real oo language for ui programming
<dzan>
and I know you can fake oo in perl but that's not the purpose
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<hoelzro>
I would call doing OO in C "faking" OO
<hoelzro>
but Perl has OO builtin
<dzan>
hoelzro, it is
<maasha>
gday
<dzan>
hoelzro, have you seen the implementation? :)
<hoelzro>
it's not as pervasive in the language as in Ruby, sure
<wald0_>
hoelzro: background? well, i have always coded every need in bash, used zenity for simple gui interfaces, and i have some knowledge with C but never really used of it because is more "long" to code (as the contrary in ruby)
<maasha>
hoelzro: perl has OO added
<hoelzro>
dzan: I've seen and written several =)
<hoelzro>
maasha: I'm aware =)
<dzan>
:-) anyway quick ui's => java
<maasha>
hoelzro: you wrote builtin. not quite the same :o)
<hoelzro>
maasha: the semantics for OO are built into Perl
<wald0_>
yeah, OO is very welcome now for me... im just not "used" for it, for example, i dont know how to code an installer (which is a linear process) using OO concepts lol
<dzan>
wald0, create a class Step :p
<dzan>
bam objects
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<wald0_>
dzan: i mean, im "used to" write things like "do foo, then bar, call pre-made function for improve structure here"... but my brain is not yet used to "create an object structure with X elements..." it makes me confused
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<andrewvos>
I always thought sinatra would do that, but it seems the whole world is insane.
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<wald0_>
i have hard to remember/understand whats the difference between a method, a class, and a module
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<jaredl>
Hey
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<apeiros>
wald0_: a class can have instances, a module can't
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<apeiros>
wald0_: a module can be included into a class, and object can be extended with it - but not with a class
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<apeiros>
other than that, they're quite similar
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<apeiros>
Module is even Class' superclass
<wald0_>
apeiros: so a module is just like a function in "functional programming" (iirc) ? so functions that doesnt modify any data but just "processes" ?
<apeiros>
wald0_: no
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<apeiros>
a module is a method and constant container
<apeiros>
same as a class
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<tobiasvl>
wald0_: a METHOD is like a function in functional programming (except that it belongs to a class/object, and can have side effect)
<apeiros>
a method belongs to a receiver, the receiver is what is referred to as `self` within the method
<apeiros>
he implementation of the method may be in a class or a module.
<apeiros>
*the
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<maasha>
all this talk about modules reminds my that I have this error I am trying to nail: fasta.rb:29:in `<module:BioPieces>': superclass mismatch for class Fasta (TypeError)
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<maasha>
The offending line is this: class Fasta < BioPieces::Filesys
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<maasha>
How can I gather more relevant info about that error so I understand what is going wrong?
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<tobiasvl>
maasha: when you say "Prefixing Fasta with BioPieces::Fasta does not [work]", what do you mean? what happens?
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<maasha>
tobiasvl: the problem is probably in align.rb with the Fasta manipulation there - which I cant remember what does - and that looks crufty. I should probably kill it and reimplement something nice
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<tobiasvl>
you're sure you require the different files in the correct order?
<maasha>
tobiasvl: I keep getting fasta.rb:29:in `<module:BioPieces>': superclass mismatch for class Fasta (TypeError)
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<tobiasvl>
so filesys.rb is required before fasta.rb?
<maasha>
tobiasvl: and removing the class Fasta block from align.rb fixes this
<maasha>
tobiasvl: it should be
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<tobiasvl>
s/filesys.rb/align.rb
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<tobiasvl>
the error is, at any rate, that there's no way to redefine a class's superclass. it's impossible.
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<tobiasvl>
ok, so align, filesys, fasta. in align.rb, BioPieces::Fasta is created as a class with Object as its superclass
<tobiasvl>
that's the default superclass
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<tobiasvl>
then, in fasta.rb, you attempt to reopen BioPieces::Fasta and make BioPieces::Filesys its superclass. that's not possible, as BioPieces::Fasta already has a superclass, namely Object.
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<tobiasvl>
maasha: understand?
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<tobiasvl>
so: in align.rb, s/class Fasta/class Fasta < BioPieces::Filesys/ should do the trick. if it doesn't, then also do in fasta.rb: s/class Fasta/class BioPieces::Fasta/
<maasha>
tobiasvl: I think I am getting it.
<tobiasvl>
i can't test right now, but you shouldn't need the namespace resolution in fasta.rb.
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<tobiasvl>
as there's no ambiguity
<maasha>
tobiasvl: I require align.rb and that defines Fasta. Then I require fasta.rb and that tries to redefine Fasta with inherintance - and that counts as a redefine which is illegal. if I then require fasta.rb before align.rb I should be safe?
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<tobiasvl>
well, yes, in regards to Fasta. but i would keep the requiring order in case something else needs that specific order…
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<tobiasvl>
but the thing is that you need to define the inheritance in the FIRST definition of the class, not in the reopening.
<tobiasvl>
how you fix that is up to you :)
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<maasha>
tobiasvl: ok. I see a new world of problems including files in the wrong order that I was not aware of until now :o)
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<tobiasvl>
exactly ;)
<maasha>
tobiasvl: and reversing the include order of fasta.rb and align.rb makes the error goes away! nice! super! thanks!
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<dzan>
basic (stupid question): I have a class A < B with an instance variable @var
<maasha>
of cause, all unit tests are now red
<tobiasvl>
maasha: hehe. good luck!
<dzan>
when I try to use @var in a method it should be in scope right?
<shevy>
I think it depends what self is at the time
<maasha>
instance variables should be defined in the initialize method for sanity, IMHO
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<shevy>
dzan just put your @var inside initialize() and re-run your code
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<shevy>
and when it works
<jaredl>
agree with maasha
<shevy>
get rid of all @@vars :D
<dzan>
shevy, I did, but seems like my initialize needs to take 3 arguments ( figuring that out, probably because I inherit from Thor )
<shevy>
aha
<shevy>
Thor Wauki throws lightning hammer at you!
<dzan>
shevy, ok, seemed like a good idea because they belong to the class and not to an object
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<dzan>
:-)
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<maasha>
you can use super
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<shevy>
the best way IMO in ruby is to try to remain as simple as possible, unless there are clear reasons or advantage for complexity
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<maasha>
shevy: goes for all things in life
<shevy>
which is why I hate the @@foo things
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<shevy>
maasha well but you also want to add code to add new features
<shevy>
like when you want to make something more convenient to use or more reliant
<maasha>
of cause.
<shevy>
or to write test code to test your code
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<shevy>
it would be simpler to not write test code :D
<maasha>
reading about fibers makes my head spin
<wald0_>
nobody uses vim? i wonder which is a good editor for ruby
<tobiasvl>
i use vim
<tobiasvl>
for
<tobiasvl>
EVERYTHING
<thyagobr>
i use vim and sublime, depends on mood :P
* hoelzro
uses Vim
<maasha>
vim works
<wald0_>
suggested plugins for vim for ruby ? :)
<maasha>
I was hiring a sysadm. Last inver view question was always "what is your favorite editor?"
<thyagobr>
=D
<wald0_>
maasha: is this a discrimination procedure or a simple profile thing?
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<maasha>
mostly for fun
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<thyagobr>
did anyone ever try to overload the .== method on irb? everything you do seems to call it multiple times, i was kinda curious to know why
<psih>
Hello, looks like i've runned into something rare and nasty, I'm trying to setup a redmine and when I connect to it - I get an Illegal seek on the socket by the look of the strace
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<apeiros>
thyagobr: could you please be a bit less specific? all that information irritates me…
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<psih>
I'm a php guy myself, so I would be rather happy if someone could help out
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<jaredl>
@psih only god can do it
* jaredl
just kidding
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<psih>
:) I just don't know what to do about it. Google is mute on the subject :(
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<jaredl>
well I dunno, provide probably nginx, unicorn configuration example
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<jaredl>
never had any sort of issues with redmine
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<psih>
I do not think this is a redmine specific issue
<psih>
this is an issue with sockets under the hood
<jaredl>
maybe when I said that only god can help you with, It wasn't a joke?
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<jaredl>
lol
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<vt102>
In ruby, when I have foo.each { |i| puts i }, is the code block an anonymous function being passed as an argument to the each method of foo? Is i simply the argument to that anonymous function?
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<hoelzro>
vt102: that's pretty much how it works
<hoelzro>
there's a few more details, but that's the idea
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<vt102>
Thanks hoelzro
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<artmann_>
Hi, I need some code style advice. If you look at the save function in https://github.com/fog/fog/blob/master/lib/fog/glesys/models/compute/server.rb you will se that it creates a server if the id is nil otherwise it will raise and exception as editing existing servers are not implemented. What is the best way to implement that? wrap it with an if/else statement?
<artmann_>
or would it be better to call another function?
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<shevy>
what I see is right now a lot of code and I have no idea what it does
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<bean__>
fog is a gem for interacting with the AWS api.
<shevy>
I think it would be helpful if you let us know what line is the one you are curious about
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<artmann_>
shevy: I will try to create a gist with a better explanation
<waxjar>
raise an NotImplementedError?
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<waxjar>
*a
<shevy>
artmann_ I think github allows line highlighting
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<shevy>
what is seld?
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<artmann_>
misspelling of self :P
<shevy>
class Object resides in one of your module? or is it the core class Object one
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<artmann_>
Its in my module
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<shevy>
when I see a method called save, I expect it to save an object, so the part of your code that saves it seems ok to me
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<shevy>
you however may also create a new object
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<artmann_>
The concern I have is that the if statement will get pretty big
<artmann_>
line wise
<shevy>
and from looking at the method name alone, I would not expect for save() to create a new object
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<shevy>
do you use a method to create a new object?
<shevy>
how many conditions do you have to handle?
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<artmann_>
only one condition but I meant the block
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<artmann_>
to handle all the update/create code
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<wald0_>
maasha: then i hope you ask that editor question by releasing the pen, put more comfortable, and after a small pause and a very serious voice... "now, tell me what is your favorite editor" :)
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<shevy>
well, just put the create object functionality into a method, and call that method
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<shevy>
maasha for such questions I only know two answers I will never give - vim or emacs :D
<maasha>
wald0_: and the leaning back in the chair and staring at the ceiling after the answer ...
<artmann_>
shevy: thanks for the input, I will have to give this some thought
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<maasha>
the red or the blue pill
<shevy>
maasha I take the pink one
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<waxjar>
looks like you've got a function called save that actually creates a server right now artmann_
<capncrunch4me>
if i was pulling results from a linux terminal result set with net:ssh, how could i stream that result to the browser?
<waxjar>
also data.status == 200 ? true : false => make that just data.status == 200 please :P
<artmann_>
waxjar: that's true
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<artmann_>
waxjar: yea that line is abit wierd
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<artmann_>
Not my code but I'm planning a pull request :P
<artmann_>
and it's my first one so I wanna make it good ;)
<shevy>
Mr. perfection!
<artmann_>
Open source is scary
<shevy>
yeah
<shevy>
they made me remove cusswords from my comment ... :(
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<shevy>
*comments
<artmann_>
thoose bastards!
<shevy>
I am hiding them between the lines
<shevy>
update_dataset # This does not work as expected.
<shevy>
original version:
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<shevy>
update_dataset # what a §/()%()=/& crap!
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<capncrunch4me>
anyone have a good rec for streaming from ruby controller
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<epscy>
capncrunch4me: don't do it?
<capncrunch4me>
epscy, why?
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<epscy>
apache is better at that kind of thing
<capncrunch4me>
i need to stream the results of a linux command to browser window
<epscy>
oh i see
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<epscy>
well that should be ok, as long as you don't need to scale anytime soon
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<capncrunch4me>
?
<capncrunch4me>
scale?
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<capncrunch4me>
window scaling or perf scaling?
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<epscy>
perf
<capncrunch4me>
mmk
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<capncrunch4me>
but actually what I'm looking for is the proper tool to stream to browser
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<maasha>
ok, next task. I have a bunch of ruby scripts that can be piped together on the command line. What is a good way to do integration test of such? I used to have some bash hacks, but perhaps Ruby have something cool?
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<dzan>
gues var += "string" doesnt work in ruby? :) ( var contains a string too )
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<hoelzro>
dzan: it should work
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<dzan>
hoelzro, strange then I must mess up somewhere else :)
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<dzan>
hoelzro, the strange scoping again
<dzan>
hoelzro, my var is declared in a function, i add to it in a block
<dzan>
( block in that function )
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<dzan>
s/function/method/
<dzan>
guess it's not the same var then
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<hoelzro>
dzan: could you paste the code?
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<pixelgremlins>
hey b = "a string" -- a="another string" -- I want to do something like a.scan(/b/) -- how do I make the b be a variable?
<pixelgremlins>
what switching back to Ruby from PHP?
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<shevy>
dzan no I mean the part with the block you mentioned, only that part, not the ten thousand other lines :D <dzan> hoelzro, my var is declared in a function, i add to it in a block
<shevy>
but php did not give me anything that ruby could not give
<pixelgremlins>
true-- but try deploying Ruby 3.2 on hostgator shared--and that being the only major requirement of the project
<shevy>
dzan btw you can use << for string appending, it's faster than +=
<shevy>
because += will create a new object everytime you use it
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<shevy>
Ruby 3.2?
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<pixelgremlins>
I wrote 70% of an app in Rails till I was thrown the fact that it had to be on Hostgator--then switched to Laravel which is VERY rails-esque
<pixelgremlins>
sorry Rails 3.2
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<pixelgremlins>
but Rails seems hotter job prospect wise (I earn $15/hour -- want to earn 80k eventually.. would settle for 60k at this point in time) --
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<shevy>
good that I started with ruby before rails
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<dzan>
shevy, << didn't do the trick ofc, and yeah it line 60 - 120 but i'll google bit more :) thanks!
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<shevy>
well << of course would only work if you dont just add nil
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<shevy>
but it is rather clear that the code you have here overwhelms you
<shevy>
because "<dzan> gues var += "string" doesnt work in ruby?" 100% works in ruby.
<platzhirsch>
Anyone used the event parser of Oj yet?
<pixelgremlins>
so I have a= "CodeEval" b = "C.*Eval" and when I do print a.scan(/${b}/) I get [] but if I do a.scan(/C.*Eval/) - I get "CodeEval" .. what gives?
<Mon_Ouie>
It's #{…}, not ${…}
<pixelgremlins>
whoops
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<Hanmac>
sorry maasha, "real world setting" is temporally not available
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<maasha>
Hanmac: well, I think I would avoid a mockup world
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<dzan>
Hanmac, I see the difference but it doesn't help me :)
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<shevy>
maasha use it often for your own use
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<shevy>
it'll get better quickly
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<psih>
Did anyone runned into a bug when an accept on a socket gave Illegal seek?
<bean__>
Deele: to me the sinatra bits only make it more useful for generating your oauth tokens
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<maasha>
maybe the correct term is validation testing
<Deele>
bean can you point out, which are those sinatra specific bits?
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<derebos>
hello
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<derebos>
i'm using ruby aws gem i tried to set root / volume more than the actual using this http://pastie.org/8445772 but i still got the old volume without changes
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<derebos>
what am i doing wrong
<derebos>
?
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<jwest>
derebos: Not an expert with this, but when you say you got the old volume, are you checking with df or by examining the volume in the AWS console or something similar?
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<derebos>
jwang, df -h
<derebos>
jwest, , df -h
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<andredurao>
q
<jwest>
Check the AWS console. It might have built the volume at the higher size, but you just can't see it because the file system is still fixed at the AMI size.
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<jwest>
derebos: And if that doesn't prove true, you'll be well beyond my depth of knowledge with it.
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<derebos>
jwest, it's created but how can i fix this as you told AMI fixed size?
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<jwest>
derebos: That's going to be specific to your file system type. If the capacity is right in the AWS console, you might try asking about file system resizing in the appropriate channel for your OS.
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<derebos>
jwest, i want to do this at launch time
<jwest>
derebos: It might take generating an appropriately sized AMI, then. I'm just speculating, though.
<Methylated>
How would I go about profiling an app running on mod_ruby? Is it possible to do so externally, or to have the profiler not overwrite results on every request (aggregate)
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<qubit>
Anyone know if the foreman gem is abandoned? It's got a ton of really old and significant bugs, and it's got almost no activity
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<Methylated>
How would I go about profiling an app running on mod_ruby? Is it possible to do so externally, or to have the profiler not overwrite results on every request (aggregate)? I'm using ruby 1.8.7 w/ gc patch
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<lectrick_>
Is it possible for me to care so much about programming well that I end up being a shitty employee because my long term design priorities lead to more upfront cost which causes managers to fail to see my true value?
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<lectrick_>
Or is this merely another lie I tell myself as I cry myself to sleep in self-doubt after losing yet another job
<lectrick_>
At least I got my github.
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<lectrick_>
Note: Haven't lost it yet, but I'm going on a "work plan" which is essentially the same thing, and my usual reaction to those is "fuck off, I'm going to just do my own thing"
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<breakingthings>
depends on what those upfront costs manifested themselves as
<breakingthings>
time cost
<breakingthings>
money cost
<breakingthings>
all costs
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<lmmx>
hey, anyone know how to use an upto loop?
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<lmmx>
I tried it out but it ain't running :( stackoverflow.com/questions/19712412
<Hanmac>
yes, anyone know
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<canton7>
that's a roo question, not a #upto one
<lmmx>
is the upto syntax all correct then?
<dr_bob>
yes
<dr_bob>
or did you see an error?
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<canton7>
test it yourself: 1.upto(5){ |i| puts i } # is the output what you expect?
<lmmx>
well it just puts out the first row number, which doesn't sound like it's doing anything very loop-like
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<canton7>
all of your 'puts' statements are in 'if' statements - put a 'puts' at the top of the loop, not inside any 'if's, to seeif the loop is running properly
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<canton7>
if it is, then your if statement's case is failing
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<wald0_>
just out of curiosity, in ruby can i define something like "less than" which reffers to < ? (basically because my example includes a space)
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<vt102>
Why is 'true ? puts "T" : puts "F"' a syntax error, but 'true ? (puts "T") : (puts "F")' not?
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<terrellt>
vt102: Read the first line like a parser - Ruby doesn't require parenthesis, so that first line has multiple interpretations. puts ("T" : puts "F") for instance
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<jwest>
vt102: But if you wrote it like it required parens, it would also work: true ? puts("T") : puts("F")
<Douglish>
Hello everyone, I have a script for reading data from id3 tags and importing data to database. But when I read data, some texts are prepended with "??", what that means?
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<Eiam>
utf characters?
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<mikeg>
I'm iterating over an array in an erb. I need to do something different when I'm on the first item. What's a good way to identify that. I could do something like array.first for the first one and then loop over the rest with array.<some method to get the rest of them>
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<mikeg>
or could do a count = 1. if count = 1 <do something differnet> and then increment the count each iteration
<Nilium>
each_with_index?
<mikeg>
looking for best practice or some cool method that allows me to treat the first iteration differently
<lupine>
array.shift ; special logic ; array.each { ... }
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<lupine>
would be cleanest
<lupine>
if you're not allowed to modify the array, it might not be an option
<mikeg>
cool. I'll try that
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<lupine>
in which case, I'd come down on each_with_index
<nobitanobi>
If I have a method in a module, and I want to use a private method from the module. How am I supposed to call it? I have tried self.my_private_method
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<Nilium>
If you can't modify the array, dup it.
<Nilium>
If you can't dup it, use each_with_index.
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<lupine>
I don't think dup's that cheap, is it?
<Nilium>
Should you really be trying to call a private method?
<vt102>
mikeg: create car and cdr methods, like LISP. ;-)
<nobitanobi>
So.. From a public method on the Module, I want to call a private method.
<lupine>
hehe
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<Nilium>
Either way, using send should work to call any method.
<mikeg>
I can modify. I'll look into both ideas
<lupine>
nobitanobi, don't use self.method_name
<lupine>
otherwise, it should Just Work
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<lupine>
(so just method_name - avoid shadowing it with local variables)
<nobitanobi>
lupine: but I thought that when there is no specific object, the method always refers to self?
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<lupine>
kind of
<nobitanobi>
so...why if I specify self it hangs :/
<MisutoWolf>
So, a sort of question of opinion (I guess?) I'm starting (brand new) to get into Rails development, and I've been reading that apparently Ruby on Windows can be a total pain in the ass to deal with, since various gems don't seem to like Windows environments.
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<nobitanobi>
lupine: hum
<MisutoWolf>
I'm currently using Win8, x64. Would it be worth my time to maybe do my Ruby dev in a Linux VM, since I really don't want to invest the HD space or time in setting up a dual-boot environment just for coding.
<rcs>
MisutoWolf: Yes.
<lupine>
for better or worse, calling self.method is treated as though you're not in scope for private methods
<rcs>
Very strongly yes.
<nobitanobi>
I see...
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<nobitanobi>
interesting
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<lupine>
changing that would require making self more special than it already is, and I'd probably come down against it, on balance
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<nobitanobi>
MisutoWolf: yes. I would suggest having a dual-boot. It won't take much time
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<nobitanobi>
lupine: I have read two ruby books. And I still don't find myself comfy with self :D
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<nobitanobi>
anyway, thanks :)
<MisutoWolf>
I had a duaboot a few weeks ago, but got tired of rebooting every time I wanted to play a game, and then again when I wanted to go back to coding. =x
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<MisutoWolf>
That's why I was considering a VM instead, it seems more...convenient?
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<MisutoWolf>
(WINE is a pain in the ass)
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<Methylated>
How would I go about profiling an app running on mod_ruby? Is it possible to do so externally, or to have the profiler not overwrite results on every request (aggregate)? I'm using ruby 1.8.7 w/ gc patch. I see the RubyRun and RubyProfile classes for mod_ruby
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<lupine>
np, it still gets me at times
<Methylated>
but I want to execute ruby from outside
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<sam113101>
WINE and PITA? sounds good
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<MisutoWolf>
sam113101, rofl
<MisutoWolf>
It -does- sound classy...
<dream_in_ruby>
Methylated: rubyprof is for 1.8.7 and lower
<mikeg>
Nilium: each_with_index worked great. thanks again
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<dream_in_ruby>
if anyone likes playing with their lambda as much as I do wants to see hangman done all in lambdas.... -> https://gist.github.com/dreamr/7187332
<nobitanobi>
MisutoWolf: do a partition and install Ubuntu for example
<nobitanobi>
come on, tired of rebooting? How long it takes ~20 sec?
<s3itz>
MisutoWolf: VM option is pretty painless; a good option would be Arch w/ XFCE4
<nobitanobi>
relax for ~20 sec while rebooting. Think about the sky and the stars or something :D
<dream_in_ruby>
#playwithruby while rebooting
<MisutoWolf>
s3itz, that does sound like a good idea. Sounds pretty lightweight.
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<s3itz>
It is, performs pretty well and the install is very quick and light
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<lupine>
it's like the worst of both worlds, though
<nobitanobi>
I wouldn't go for a VM.
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<nobitanobi>
But, tastes are tastes...
<lupine>
ideally, you'd put windows in the VM and pass it an adequate GPU through
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<MisutoWolf>
Hmmmmmmmmmmm.
<lupine>
well
<s3itz>
Linux operates under a VM much better than Windows
<lupine>
ideally, you'd run steamonlinux and be happy with the games selection
<MisutoWolf>
Honestly
<MisutoWolf>
That would be fine
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<MisutoWolf>
If Valve would hurry up and port CS:GO to Linux, instead of porting every CS -but- GO.
<lupine>
they'll get around to it
<MisutoWolf>
I suppose.
<MisutoWolf>
At least Hearthstone runs really well under Wine.
<s3itz>
playonlinux will boot steam and run CS:GO w/o issue
<MisutoWolf>
I have -horrendus- framerate problems with CS:GO under Wine.
<MisutoWolf>
Maybe it's some weird driver problem. I have a Radeon 7850
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<MisutoWolf>
On a sidenote, I really do like XFCE.
<Nilium>
Xfce is the one true desktop.
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<Nilium>
Also a good place for Gnome 2 users to retreat to.
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<Nilium>
Still nowhere for KDE2 fans to go, though.
<lupine>
I've got MATE at work right now
<lupine>
probably going to throw in the LTSP towel and move to a local-install desktop
<Nilium>
I miss KDE 2. It was so stable and normal.
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<Nilium>
Then KDE 3 made everything unstable, and then KDE 4 made it unstable and they tried to be all flashy like Vista and that backfired spectacularly.
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<MisutoWolf>
I've never actually tried MATE before
<MisutoWolf>
I've used...uh...
<MisutoWolf>
XFCE, GNOME Shell (Gnome 3, I guess?), and I tried KDE4 (and hated it)
<MisutoWolf>
I tried awesomewm once
<MisutoWolf>
It was...interesting.
<s3itz>
hehe
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<MisutoWolf>
Interesting in a good way, but I couldn't get used to it at all. Tiling windows does sound neat, though.
<s3itz>
You have to really tweak AWM to get it the way you want
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<MisutoWolf>
Yeah, it just seemed like more trouble than it was worth to set up a desktop environment if I could just install GNOME/etc. and get to working on stuff.
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<MisutoWolf>
I think I'll probably just shrink down my Win8 partition, install Xubuntu 13.04 on it (Since I'm already pretty familiar with Ubuntu), and then I'll have XFCE...and I can also install MATE and play with that, too.
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<MisutoWolf>
I wonder what Arch is like.
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<MisutoWolf>
I used it once before, but haven't since then.
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<havenwood>
MisutoWolf: Seems nice enough but i'm not sure i want to get on board with the AUR, seems a bit of a mess to me.
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<MisutoWolf>
Does Arch have a graphical installer? I don't think it did when I installed it a few years back.
<havenwood>
MisutoWolf: Arch, Gentoo and FreeBSD all seem nice to me. I do like OS X though.
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<MisutoWolf>
I think my first exposure to Linux was Gentoo.
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<s3itz>
MisutoWolf: Not officially, but all you do is setup a few pre-reqs and bootstrap
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<havenwood>
I think the latest Fedoras are great as far as a gui os.
<MisutoWolf>
Hm.
<thomasss>
hello
<MisutoWolf>
I do like Fedora.
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<thomasss>
I'm new comer
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<MisutoWolf>
Once I finish writing this paper for my roomate, I'll pick a distro and get that shit going.
<thomasss>
Is this place where I can get professional help on Ruby on Rails ??
<havenwood>
Fedora 19+ ships with 2.0.0-p247, and not an insane package like apt's.
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<MisutoWolf>
I want to write some damn code tonight.
<havenwood>
thomasss: #RubyOnRails is the Rails channel, but there are tons of Rubyists here.
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<thomasss>
Thank you
<thomasss>
I have no idea of how to join channels ;)
<thomasss>
:( *
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<havenwood>
thomasss: /join #rubyonrails
<s3itz>
MisutoWolf: Stick to your original decision of Xubuntu :)
<thomasss>
thank you a lot
<MisutoWolf>
=)
<robonerd>
freebsd is the best
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<s3itz>
Arch will have you up and running in like 10 minutes w/ XFCE (depending on your connection), but it takes a little more maintenance
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<thomasss>
join rubyonrails
<thomasss>
srr :D
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<havenwood>
FreeBSD is pretty similar to OS X, I guess not surprising since a bunch of FreeBSD core are Darwin devs.
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<havenwood>
The command flag differences between the BSD and Linux OSes though is such a source of annoyance.
<robonerd>
s/bunch/couple
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<thomasss>
Hey
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<havenwood>
robonerd: a good percentage :P
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<robonerd>
simoz, hey i live in hawaii too. which island?
<thomasss>
Is there a ruby pro who can mentor me ?
<yxhuvud>
havenwood: it usually works out if you keep to posix. but both sides have their own set of extensions
<havenwood>
thomasss: What are you looking to learn?
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<thomasss>
Well, TDD this is important to find job as Ruby Developer
<thomasss>
I can't find any good and clear tutorial on RSpec
<havenwood>
yxhuvud: well bash, zsh, sh whatever are of course the same, but all the unix tool flags... uhhg!
<thomasss>
Also I have lots of questions, I'm looking for Ruby friends to answer them for me :)
<yxhuvud>
as I said, they are mostly identical if you keep to posix.
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<s3itz>
codeschool has a free RSpec course
<thomasss>
really didn't know
<yxhuvud>
of course, posix is pretty limited unless you have a lot of patience :)
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<MisutoWolf>
s3itz, really? That's awesome. I might have to look into that for sure.
<thomasss>
thank you a lot
<Methylated>
How would I go about profiling an app running on mod_ruby? Is it possible to do so externally, or to have the profiler not overwrite results on every request (aggregate)? I'm using ruby 1.8.7 w/ gc patch. I see the RubyRun and RubyProfile classes for mod_ruby ?
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<s3itz>
erm, correction, 'level 1' is free
<havenwood>
Methylated: That is a pretty antiquated way of serving up Ruby. Legacy system or something?
<thomasss>
Do you think that *codementor* website is good ? Is it expensive ??
<havenwood>
thomasss: I don't know if Avdi Grimm still does paid mentoring.
<havenwood>
thomasss: Here is a great place to ask free Ruby questions.
<Methylated>
havenwood: yes, legacy is an understatement. It was poorly done from the start
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<norm>
i'm thinking about moving to fish shell (http://fishshell.com/), but IRB doesn't seem to find it's history file (~/.irb-history) and i don't have any IRB history. has anyone tried fish before? had this problem?
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<Methylated>
norm: use pry
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<havenwood>
speaking of posix... bad fish, no cookie!
<thomasss>
Awesome, I will take a look
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<thomasss>
I used Treehouse so fat, but I don't feel like I learned enough there
<thomasss>
far*
<Methylated>
All those sites suck. They're a good intro and they are "fun"
<Methylated>
but you need to buy books, read and do the examples, and avoid any online tutorials and screencasts
<norm>
Methylated / havenwood: mmm, i looked at this before. will check it out, thanks
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<thomasss>
I would like to have real world experience along with a developer who can say what I'm doing wrong and why
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<thomasss>
I have a person helping me now, but he answer my questions once a week ..
<bean__>
I completely disagree with not learning ruby online
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<thomasss>
Maybe I shouldn't ask but If there's anyone who can answer ruby questions and is patient, could you please let me know
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<MisutoWolf>
So work on a project, and if you have problems, hit up IRC and ask the channel about your issue. It's what I've been doing (I'm new to Ruby/Rails), and it's been working out so far.
<MisutoWolf>
As opposed to finding an actual 'mentor'.
<thomasss>
I'd like to add that person on facebook and ask whenever I'm stuck
<bean__>
thomasss: most people would prefer to not do that. Ask in IRC.
<Methylated>
You can learn online. I just realized that reading a good book teaches me at a much faster rate than tutorials that barely brush up on specific topics
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<thomasss>
You think this is better?
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<havenwood>
thomasss: Just ask in irc whenever you're stuck. If you need specialized help, pick a person who you noticed explains well for your style of learning on irc and pay em.
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<MisutoWolf>
Also, if I get stuck with something, before I ask here, I end up looking to see if it's something someone else has asked on StackOverflow
<zoo-zed>
@thomasss, Sinatra is a great tool for learning how to build web services. Then, from there you can play with Rails to get an idea what it brings to the party.
<zoo-zed>
^ agreed
<thomasss>
nice stuff :D
<thomasss>
I'm very greatful for help
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<zoo-zed>
I like building data services in Sinatra. It's clean, and lightweight.
<havenwood>
thomasss: Sinatra is simpler, smaller, less convention. Rails is more complex, bigger, comes with more things preconfigured and decided.
<havenwood>
zoo-zed: I totally agree.
<thomasss>
Hmm
<zoo-zed>
^ it's Rail's way, or the highway basically. You don't bend Rails to your will, it bends your mind to its will. :-)
<thomasss>
Also .. is it true that in order to get a job as RoR you need to know noSQL DB ?
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<havenwood>
thomasss: Often a Sinatra and Rails app live side-by-side. There is more than one way to do it.
<havenwood>
thomasss: no
<zoo-zed>
no
<havenwood>
thomasss: That is false.
<thomasss>
I see, old mentor told me that you need to know it
<zoo-zed>
Who's filling your mind with falsehoods? Reject their reality and discover your own.
<thomasss>
as it's new and companies prefer to use it
<thomasss>
rather than SQL
<havenwood>
thomasss: A minority of Rails apps are NoSQL.
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<thomasss>
I see
<zoo-zed>
SQL, whatever flavor, has great features in enterprises. Caches and nosql and similar do too, but there are reasons for each.
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<thomasss>
so better to stick to ActiveRecord then
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<havenwood>
thomasss: That is the status quo.
<robonerd>
is sinatra staying true to being minimal and developing in that way? or is going the way of rails and adding feature after feature?
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<zoo-zed>
If you're using Rails ActiveRecord is the path of least resistance.
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<zoo-zed>
Sinatra is lean and mean. Well, not mean, but clean.
<havenwood>
robonerd: Staying simple. There are other options like NYNY that are compatible with Sinatra but paired down. Or Cuba and Scorched are there own takes on Sinatra alternatives.
<havenwood>
thier*
<zoo-zed>
IMO, learning and taking lessons from Rails is a great way to see why to use Sinatra.
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<robonerd>
good to know sinatra isn't growing
<zoo-zed>
Padrino is a decent Sinatra <—> Rails middleground
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<havenwood>
zoo-zed: I always look at it and never choose it.
<havenwood>
Padrino i mean.
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<thomasss>
Is there anything else that I must learn ??
<zoo-zed>
I've used it a couple times, but mostly lean toward Sinatra, but I do background services.
<zoo-zed>
@thomasss, what don't you know. Learn those things.
<thomasss>
I'm talking about things outside rails, like sinatra
<thomasss>
jQuery jRuby
<havenwood>
thomasss: Just learn Ruby. Become fluent. Then the rest is cake.
<robonerd>
is sinatra appropriate for web apps with web site UIs as well as web apps with only REST interface?
<thomasss>
Nice :D
<robonerd>
network service components
<havenwood>
thomasss: Too many people learn Rails and not Ruby.
<thomasss>
I have to admit .. I did the same
<thomasss>
I was so impressed with rails
<thomasss>
that I didn't start with Ruby
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<robonerd>
yes, i also got into ruby through the rails door
<robonerd>
i did 1 web app then went right to ruby
<havenwood>
robonerd: Usually REST APIs. But you could roll your own gui webapp.
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<thomasss>
It's impressive how fast development is
<havenwood>
robonerd: For imitating Rails, adding Padrino on to Sinatra gets you part of the way.
<zoo-zed>
ugh. Rails before Ruby is a sure path to thinking Ruby is full of blackmagic and voodoo.
<thomasss>
I come from PHP world so switching to Rails is a big step and fun
<zoo-zed>
Learn Ruby before Rails and Rails suddenly makes sense
<robonerd>
havenwood sweet. anyone know of sinatra being used as the node front end to cloud/grid services?
<havenwood>
zoo-zed: That is almost the "Rails Way", to just use it and treat it as magic.
<zoo-zed>
yes, which is a disservice to the developer.
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<thomasss>
Writing SQL's was worst experience ever :D
<robonerd>
thomasss i also went from php to ruby. this was in 2005 tho
<havenwood>
robonerd: often used as APIs for mobile apps, or bridges to the cloud, widely imitated by other language libraries
<DanBoy>
most people tend to skip the part of ruby when learning ruby on rails
<thomasss>
ActiveRecord made me cry when I found out about it haha
<havenwood>
scalatra, etc etc
<robonerd>
havenwood ah ok so it's even inspired other work
<havenwood>
robonerd: a TON of other work
<thomasss>
I wish I have so much experience with Ruby by now
<robonerd>
how does sinatra and sequel do?
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<havenwood>
robonerd: any language worth its salt has a Sinatra clone
<robonerd>
thomasss just build it. it comes fast
<robonerd>
i did a TON of ruby after i left rails
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<robonerd>
havenwood does sinatra employ async and other operational paradigms?
<zoo-zed>
@robonerd, Sinatra and Sequel is a great combo.
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<thomasss>
I still have unanswered question .. It's newbie so I'm a bit ashamed to ask :/
<havenwood>
robonerd: i use Sequel gem with Sinatra, love it
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<thomasss>
Well lets say I write a big code in ruby, where do I put this file ? and how to use it inside of rails app ?
<thomasss>
I know that inside controller I do require 'my_file'
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<robonerd>
i see the example on sinatra's web page, but i wonder: what would the handler method look like for the route "/" with passed url string variables ?hello=world&test=1, let's say if i wanted to print world and 1 from within the handler method.
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<zoo-zed>
@thomasss, if it's really newbie we'll only laugh. :-)
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<thomasss>
Well I'm used to answers like -> "Are you kidding me?" :D
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<zoo-zed>
scroll down to the "Route patterns may include named parameters, accessible via the params hash" section
<zoo-zed>
That's how you grab parameters
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<yekta>
return x==7 and y==8 => void value expression
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<yekta>
Why can't `and` be used?
<vt102>
If I run "1".to_i, I'm calling the to_i method of the "1" object. However, if I run ["1"].map(&:to_i), am I calling a global to_i method?
<robonerd>
zoo-zed that gets route path components
<robonerd>
like /hello
<robonerd>
i'm looking for ?foo=bar stuff
<robonerd>
the path variables
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<zoo-zed>
you can get them from the params hash
<thomasss>
nice, do you know any real world examples of using this ?
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<thomasss>
zoo-zed : So let's say I write new .rb file and use something like -> def hello *some code* end then I can call it inside my controller and use hello method ?
<zoo-zed>
@thomasss I'll put something on gist… gimme a minute
<zoo-zed>
Sinatra is a DSL - domain-specific language. It takes advantage of Ruby's "method_missing" method to create/add new functionality to Ruby at run-time. Things like "get" and "post" for instance
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<zoo-zed>
so "get" and "post" are methods that we pass blocks to. Sinatra runs the block and executes our commands. So, it becomes an extension of Ruby's basic/core command-set.
<thomasss>
Does Sinatra help with the loading time of your app ?
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<zoo-zed>
@thomasss, NP. Sinatra is a sweetheart app. Combine Sinatra, Sequel and HAML and you've got a really nice suite of tools for quickly building small REST data services.
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<zoo-zed>
Rails is a great framework but it's way too heavy for back-end work like I do. I don't have human users, just automated ones, so HAML is only there for small pages to direct the programmers of the other automation on how to use the interface
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<zoo-zed>
We've got a whole set of small command-line apps that all understand a "—json" flag. I wrote a small Sinatra server that lets remote apps call those command-line tools using REST-type calls, and get results as JSON so the CLI tools get dual-interfaces (CLI and web) and doubled use.
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<zoo-zed>
@thomasss "Does Sinatra help with the loading time of your app ?" Compared to what? To Rails? Heck yes. To a straight Ruby app? No, but it's not a fair comparison either.
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<thomasss>
I see
<zoo-zed>
Starting up a web server isn't instantaneous, but it's fast enough and plenty fast for normal stuff once running.
<zoo-zed>
And, if you need faster load Nginx with Passenger and stick your Sinatra-based code inside that environment.
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<thomasss>
So does big websites like Groupon use sinatra ?
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<graft_>
argh... can someone point me to the dang ruby C extension documentation?
<graft_>
google is not helping me at all
<robonerd>
zoo-zed what is HAML to you?
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<atmosx>
hello
<momomomomo>
hello
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<graft_>
why is this so goddamn difficult to find?!?
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<atmosx>
in the case where the argument of a method is a symbold... does it change anything? method(:my_callback)
<sam113101>
graft_: I will try it
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<momomomomo>
atmosx: No, then you're just passing a symbol
<vt102>
If I run "1".to_i, I'm calling the to_i method of the "1" object. However, if I run ["1"].map(&:to_i), is the symbol I am referencing a global to_i method?
<atmosx>
momomomomo: okay
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<graft_>
vt102: no, the symbol is just a symbol
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<graft_>
vt102: it's just a string until it gets passed to the "1" object, which has a method defined that it maps to that symbol
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<graft_>
vt102: which is why you can do ["1", 0.25, 155].map(&:to_i), and each member will respond correctly
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<momomomomo>
graft_: vt102 What you're doing is actually sending the to_proc method :to_i on the objects
<momomomomo>
ie: & is to_proc
<vt102>
graft_: I guess my confusion is how that mapping occurs...why does &:to_i get translated to a method on that object, but a block of code just get executed? At what point is the symbol evaluated...
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<thomasss>
Whar is better TDD or BDD ??
<Hanmac>
but if you want to use a global method use this:
<robonerd>
if i use HAML to create say form and form elements, does it automatically hot beef inject javascript encoding into those form/elements? so it not just templates html, and content, but also basic javascript identification payload?
<graft_>
sam113101: yeah i saw that, but it seems to be for 1.8
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<Hanmac>
graft_: hm no this README is for trunk so 2.0+
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<graft_>
Hanmac: is there a better reference than that?
<vt102>
momomomomo: So, I get that &:to_i is returning a Proc object. My question is, when the :to_i is evaluated, what is it evaluating to (or what is the block in the Proc object)? It looks to me that it is evaluated before being passed on the array object ["1"].collect(&:to_i) so it can't be "1"'s to_i, can it?
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<nobitanobi>
Hi guys I have a question. An elegant way of checking if a string contains either one string or another one? Right now I do x.include?('myfirststring') || x.include?('mysecondstring')
<Hanmac>
graft_: hm no the README.EXT is the newest i know ... (but i also read the header files, they are also a bit helpful)
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<graft_>
Hanmac: how do you allocate memory and such? just with malloc/calloc?
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<graft_>
momomomomo: more properly, it maps to {|x| x.send :to_s} (or as Hanmac says {|x| x.public_send :to_s} - so the symbol gets evaluated by the object's own send method.
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<ravster>
I'm looking at a CSV file with headers that have spaces in them, and I'd like to process it without the spaces. Is there a way to strip the headers when reading in a CSV file, or do I just change the file headers manually?
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<vt102>
momomomomo graft_: I think I get it. Thanks!
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<Hanmac>
graft_: hm maybe it does not uses the send method and does all the "shit" internal .. (to be faster) ... so when you change the send or public send method it may not change how the &:sym reacts to the object
<apeiros>
ravster: assuming you read the csv into an array of arrays - just shift the first row away.
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<apeiros>
see Array#shift
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<ravster>
apeiros: will do, thanks
<jaredl>
exit
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<jb__>
you know the way every program starts with require <gem name> - should you put an if statement around that, so that there's an error message if one of the requires comes out false?
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<jb__>
or is that just not done? it seems like common sense to me...
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<Hanmac1>
jb__ you missunderstand the return value ... require returns false if the gem/file is already loaded ... so an if does not work as you want at this place
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<jb__>
oh yeah
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<jb__>
well shouldn't there be some check though
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<jb__>
if (the following are all true) then (run all this code)
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<apeiros>
jb__: what for?
<jb__>
well if i don't have the gem installed
<apeiros>
if the require fails, no code will be run
<jb__>
really?
<apeiros>
really. require raises an exception in that case.
<jb__>
ahhh ok lol sorry
<jb__>
makes sense
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<momomomomo>
just to reiterate on earlier graft_ I denoted 'imagine' since (s)he's just trying to grasp the concept.
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<platzhirsch>
so, what's up in the Ruby Mine
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<robonerd>
ok guys you know how sinatra abstracts the basic functionality of http into some callbacks? well is there something even more generic but similar cool design, where all network .. events? are implemented in a basic abstract way
<robonerd>
so rather than GET / .., another level like HTTP GET / ...
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<farsonic>
morning all
<havenwood>
g'afternoon
<farsonic>
:)
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<farsonic>
working on my first Ruby website…just to see what I can learn
<farsonic>
so far so good
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<farsonic>
but, going to get more difficult after the basics I think
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<farsonic>
I've set up a simple site…such as 127.0.0.1:3000/users/news/
<volty>
steady, slow:and sleeping let your neurals (re)organize
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<farsonic>
works ok…however I'm now passing information to it from an external system that is presenting it as 127.0.0.1:3000/users/new?firstname=fred$&surname=smith
<farsonic>
my basic site (understandably) doesn't like this :)
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<farsonic>
need to work out how to process the fields after the ?
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<havenwood>
farsonic: Are you using Rack or Sinatra or what?
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<shevy>
DIE!
<shevy>
SOME EVIL KIDS TRIED TO GET INTO MY HOME
<shevy>
I LOCKED THE DOOR AND MADE IT ALL DARK SO THAT THEY WOULD NOT FIND ME!
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<shevy>
hmmm
<volty>
a horror plot? :)
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<shevy>
Is there no project out there that generates <html> tags?
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<atmosx>
shevy: seriously?
<atmosx>
shevy: generates html tags out of what? doc?
<shevy>
atmosx hmm out of anything
<atmosx>
shevy: sure, many.
<shevy>
it seems in the rails world there is erb used, but erb is such an ugly piece that I don't understand how anyone can use it
<volty>
many many
<atmosx>
shevy: hmm, erb is pretty close to HTML
<atmosx>
I use HAML
<shevy>
atmosx do you use erb?
<atmosx>
shevy: not directly but I understand it
<atmosx>
it's easy
<shevy>
how is HAML used?
<havenwood>
i use erb, never bothered to haml
<shevy>
I am hopeful for any alternative to erb at this point!
<volty>
I use cgi
<atmosx>
shevy: it has a more straight-forward syntax than HAML, there are thers, like less and slim
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<atmosx>
havenwood: not a big deal really...
<shevy>
volty I too right now but I'd still like things to be much better
<atmosx>
shevy: no
<atmosx>
shevy: rails == ( erb && activerecord)
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<shevy>
damn
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<atmosx>
shevy: HAML is good for prototyping, or writing API's and other small apps on frameworks like Sinatra and a couple of thousand others (in ruby)
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<atmosx>
shevy: I believe the question is, do you know HTML :-P
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<atmosx>
shevy: I mean, can you design a website in HTML?
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<atmosx>
if you can, erb is not hard at all. If you can't then you should spent some time reading HTML. I bought a book and really helped a lot.
<MrZYX>
I think I'd recommend slim these days if you're going to learn a HTML dsl
<atmosx>
note that you still have to write CSS3 (which I prefer to SASS because I'm not proficient at it)
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<shevy>
hmm
<atmosx>
also this framework seems interesting. But to use it efficiently you have to look at sinatra. http://scorchedrb.com
<shevy>
ah well
<shevy>
it looks a bit better than erb but not by that much
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<shevy>
<h1><%= post.title %></h1>
<shevy>
erb
<shevy>
%h1= post.title
<shevy>
haml
<shevy>
hmmmmm
<shevy>
how can people use erb... how do they survive that!
<atmosx>
shevy: identation in HAML will be a pain in the ass, I tell you. But once you get hte hold of it... it's fine
<shevy>
I would be fine if I'd be much nicer. I think I'll look how slim does that
<shevy>
ohh...
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<shevy>
it also requires indentation?
<AntelopeSalad>
probably because most editors take a lot of the repetition out of erb
<atmosx>
shevy: haml sure
<havenwood>
If i have to deal with bloody html, i'd prefer it to look like the html it's generating. But haml standing alone is nicer, i just don't care to switch after the cost of yet another abstraction context switch. Maybe if I did more html.
<shevy>
no, I mean... slim too or? at least I see a lot of indent on the demo
<havenwood>
The whole html and css thing is so bizarre and insane... But entrenched enough we'll have to deal with it for some time.
<atmosx>
I think it's clear enough for everyone to understand. Much more clear than ruby blocks ...
<volty>
are you about generating or about parsing?
<shevy>
generating
<volty>
sorry, i was asking havenwood
<atmosx>
Once you figure out how things work, all you need to do really is spent time to design something that doesn't suck, Making it is easy.
<havenwood>
volty: generally, generating more than parsing, but whatever the whole thing
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<havenwood>
atmosx: sure with effort you can comprehend the madness but it is a horror
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<havenwood>
atmosx: you'd think a joke, but is is real, we make amazing things with it, but holy hell
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<atmosx>
Heh there are so many things to master these days, that it's insane: JS, HTML/CSS3, backend (ruby/go/node.js?) if you wanna create a modern website.
<atmosx>
not to mention about scalability shit
<atmosx>
concurrency and the list goes on
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<havenwood>
atmosx: I'm sure you could design a better method of markup and styling than html and css. They are hard to comprehend, error prone, just generally not simple and usable.
<atmosx>
havenwood: hmm probably you could, if there are languages like slim and haml out there..
<volty>
mmmmmm
<atmosx>
could be extended
<havenwood>
atmosx: Of course we can manage. But the inflexibility of the entrenchment of our browsers generates this bizarre ecosystem.
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<atmosx>
hm
<atmosx>
might be
<atmosx>
I'm gonna grab my book and head over to bed
<atmosx>
good night guys
<atmosx>
as always, nice talking to you
<havenwood>
g'night
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