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<DocScrutinizer> roh: ping
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<roh> pong
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<roh> DocScrutinizer: pong
<roh> *blink*
<DocScrutinizer> roh: hi! :-)
<DocScrutinizer> roh: any news or ETA guessing for the big move of doc.om.org et al? seems quite some people are missing svn and a few others
<roh> nope... sean sadly doesnt react on mail so its delaying
<DocScrutinizer> :-S
<roh> but i think i will happen sometime soon
<roh> propably while regular work-hours
<DocScrutinizer> any chances you kick svn and doc vserver? until the move
<roh> the vm is up, but its filtered on the outside
<DocScrutinizer> o.O ??
<roh> had some 'guest' using it as spam-relay quite a while ago
<DocScrutinizer> yeah, munin seemed to suggest they are all running
<roh> kicked him out, but the block needs (signed?) paperwork
<DocScrutinizer> oh shit
<roh> well.. it will be resolved with the move, afaik
<DocScrutinizer> could somebody (me?) contact hetzner and ask what's the deal?
<roh> nope.
<DocScrutinizer> re block
<roh> in the current legal think i think sean would need to sign, but since we change all that it will be much easier.
<roh> legal thing of course
<DocScrutinizer> mhm
<roh> relay. is ostermontag. nothing will happen in germany anyhow.
<roh> irgh. relax
<DocScrutinizer> sure
<DocScrutinizer> no hurry, no hassle. Just asking
<DocScrutinizer> esp since admintrac is down
<DocScrutinizer> and I published nagging me via IRC is the fallback method then
<DocScrutinizer> s/down/blocked
<roh> weird.
<roh> hetzer said they replaced the hw..
<roh> well.. it seems agni is completely down and i dont know why.
<DocScrutinizer> duh, again?
<DocScrutinizer> not since long
<roh> i cant reach it.
<roh> anyhow.. will drive to the lab now. and dont think much will happen soon
<roh> bbl
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<kyak> xiangfu: hi
<kyak> xiangfu: a question: do we still need everything from nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files/etc/uci-defaults?
<kyak> it's setting up some links which was a workaround in previous releases, but now it could be unnecessary/dangerous
<kyak> xiangfu: another question: nananote-base-files only provides kernel-6x11-font. Maybe we should move it to script-files and get rid of base-files at all? It seems strange that we provide both scripts/data with script-files and kernel-6x11-font looks like forgotten in base-files :)
<kyak> xiangfu: and the last question; is there a reason why you decided not to send all openwrt-xburst patches to openwrt upstream?
<kyak> my understanding is that if we use these patches for release, they are all ready for openwrt upstream. I'm not saying they are ready for kernel upstream
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<xiangfu> kyak, Hi.
<xiangfu> just back from lunch.
<xiangfu> 1.(nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files/etc/uci-defaults) I think we still need this one: 01-optimization-for-ben-nanonote. the other two can remove.
<xiangfu> 2. (kernel-6x11-font) totally agree.
<xiangfu> the plan is 'scripts' for the files that nanonote needs and don't over-write any other openwrt base files.
<xiangfu> and hte 'data/qi_lb60/files' is for the files that over-write the openwrt base files.
<xiangfu> I needs clean up them.
<xiangfu> I think the namd of 'script-files' is not fit for those files any more.
<xiangfu> I will move all files to base-files. just like the openwrt names
<kyak> this is a good idea
<kyak> btw, do we need the posinstall section in nanonote-files Makefile?
<kyak> i think the idea was to overwrite openwrt base-files, but this doesn't always work (depends on installation order).. since we set up a symlink like feeds/local_qipackages/nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files/ in openwrt-xburst, we coudl remove the postinstall
<xiangfu> I think we needs keep the nanonote-data-files/postinst. it should be works fine on overwrite
<xiangfu> kyak, my plan is remove the 'CONFIG_PACKAGE_nanonote-base-files=y' in config.full_system.
<xiangfu> but people can still opkg install this package.
<kyak> ah
<xiangfu> the opkg install should works fine with postinstall.
<kyak> yeah, totally agree then
<xiangfu> kyak, the build order. yes correct.
<xiangfu> I think we needs move 'gmen2x' to base-files
<kyak> xiangfu: maybe we should do like that: put all gmenu2x icons in nanonote-gmenu2x-icons package, OR - just get rid of all nanonote-whatever-package and just keep everything (except for example files) in nanonote-base-files
<kyak> to make things simple
<xiangfu> (nanonote-gmenu2x-icons) great.
<kyak> xiangfu: btw, gmenu2x-settings, can't exit on "S" -\
<kyak> have to kill gmenu2x :)
<kyak> we kind of paid too small attention to gmenu2x, and it floated away in direction of dingoo.. too many regressions on Ben
<xiangfu> let me commit first. I will split the gmenu2x-icons in next commit.
<kyak> it's great if we reorganize nanonote-files in a smart way. I'm starting to get lost in all those files :)
<xiangfu> kyak,(gmenu2x) maybe we switch to David's 'alfilesel' someday :-)
<kyak> yeah! it's simple and just works
<qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu: cgminer update to 2.3.2, update the BIT_ENDIAN patch (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/9d550b8
<qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu: nanonote-files: cleanup the file structure. update version to 201204 (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/223a158
<xiangfu> kyak, yes. gmen2x is big. complicate.
<kyak> xiangfu: so basically it's like that now: 1) nanonote-base-files is to keep all files (both scripts and data) except for gmenu2x icons and /etc. 2) Those files in /etc are provided by the "files" symlink or nanonote-data-files on "opkg install" 3) nanonote-gmenu2x-icons holds gmenu2x icons
<xiangfu> kyak, yes.
<kyak> 4) and there is nanonote-example-files holding music and whatever
<xiangfu> yes.
<qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu: naonote-files: split the gmenu2x icons to one package (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/65baf01
<qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu: nanonote-files: config.full_system include gmenu2x-icons (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/625f215
<kyak> ok, this is great.. perhaps i would suggest one more change to make it more clear: move nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60/files to nanonote-files/files (so that other directories in nanonote-files/data/qi_lb60 don't confuse)
<kyak> then by looking at root of nanonote-files/ we can't directly say which directory goes where
<kyak> *we can
<qi-bot> Jon Phillips: @christopheradam made a concise post about @qihardware and @milkymistvj + has a great new picture of the hardware: http://t.co/l7P8mabZ ( 189239979438907392@rejon - 1m ago via Ping.fm )
<xiangfu> kyak, yes.
<kyak> i wonder if git will handle it when i pull all the changes :)
<kyak> need to recreate the symlink in openwrt-xburst then
<qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu: nanonote-files: cleanup the file structure. move data/qi_lb60/files to package root (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/f74c593
<xiangfu> kyak, also needs update the buildhost compile script file.
<xiangfu> more clear is better.
<xiangfu> I will add a 'wpan-ipv4.ogg' for video sample
<kyak> i like David's sample video with bunny, not sure about the size though
<xiangfu> 20MB
<kyak> probably too much
<qi-bot> [commit] Xiangfu: nanonote-files: compile-openwrt-xburst.sh update the files symlink (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/openwrt-packages/b2d577a
<kyak> xiangfu: thanks a lot!
<xiangfu> kyak, example video. 20MB should be ok. since people should install to /data/
<kyak> xiangfu: that is, if /data is actually mounted :)
<kyak> and probably opkg will fail downloading ipk that big anyway
<kyak> due to RAM
<xiangfu> ok. yes. correct.
<kyak> xiangfu: what about the openwrt upstream patches?
<xiangfu> we are use /usr/share/opkg for download hte package. but same situation .
<xiangfu> kyak, the patches I didn't send out are 3 parts 1. WPAN patches. 2. KS7010 patches. 3. the Nanonote patches (logo, keyboard)
<kyak> i see! any good reason for that?
<xiangfu> 1. (wpan) I needs split it to atUSB and atBen. for atUSB needs to send to target/linux/generic for all targets.
<xiangfu> 2. not sure if we need that any more. keep in our repo first.
<xiangfu> 3. since those patches is for Ben Nanonote not fit for 'xburst' target.
<kyak> ah, ok; sure
<xiangfu> it will influence other xburst target.
<kyak> yeah, i understand now
<xiangfu> next task split WPAN first. atUSB atBen.
<xiangfu> if we have atUSB upstream that will be great. Ben Nanonote can connect to openwrt router(with usb host)
<kyak> yes, this would be great
<kyak> i will go an upgrade my router to the one with usb host right away :)
<kyak> xiangfu: do you know if atUSB is compilable is module?
<kyak> i remember it could only be built monolitically
<xiangfu> not sure that.
<xiangfu> I haven't try atUSB yet. :(
<xiangfu> only tried 2 atBen talk to each other.
<kyak> i did try atusb, and it is really disturbing that i had to compile it in
<xiangfu> will pay attention on this built-in.
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<xiangfu> I have asked sdwalker add openwrt-package
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<LunaVorax> Hello everyone!
<wolfspraul> hi
<Fallenou> hi
<wolfspraul> Fallenou: hey, nice to see you in Qi Hardware too! ;-)
<wolfspraul> I thought you were an exclusive milkymister
<Fallenou> hehe I'm trying to be more social
<Fallenou> I have just read your email
<Fallenou> about Ya NanoNote being based on Milkymist SoC
<Fallenou> what a crazy (and awesome) idea :)
<wolfspraul> well, why do we work on an SoC if we then don't use it *everywhere*?
<wolfspraul> it's like the Linux kernel, my friends for many years knew me as someone who would first install Linux on *every* computing device he got. OF COURSE!? huh?
<wolfspraul> :-)
<wolfspraul> so let's see. I am learning about IC design and SoC. total beginner.
<wolfspraul> but I think we will use a free IC design as the central digital signalling hub for everything, sure. yes. what else? :-)
<wolfspraul> is there any legacy stuff left out there?
<Fallenou> that makes totally sense to me
<wolfspraul> see!?
<wolfspraul> I knew it
<wolfspraul> so then
<Fallenou> why using some proprietary chip if there is a functional competitive alternative which is open source :)
<wolfspraul> yes, a few pieces of legacy here and there, we clean them up, and then into the future
<Fallenou> indeed it's work
<Fallenou> but I think you don't fear working =)
<wolfspraul> there's just enormous power available to us once we move beyond the x86/arm black box / iron curtain
<wolfspraul> since I only do what I love, how could I fear anything?
<wolfspraul> no, it feels right
<wolfspraul> milkymist one today is still too basic, many things it could do don't work today
<wolfspraul> so...
<DocScrutinizer> moo
<Fallenou> yes a lot of work to do
<Fallenou> you would need a few dozen engineers
<Fallenou> every open source project does not have the Linux work force
<wolfspraul> well I don't like to look at this just by how much one could work
<wolfspraul> the reason there are many linux devs is because linux is valuable to many companies and lots of the devs make their living that way
<wolfspraul> keep in mind that we made a usable and fun product around the milkymist soc today
<wolfspraul> it's not like "we need another xyz"
<wolfspraul> no we need nothing
<wolfspraul> we just need m1 and some good music
<wolfspraul> the rest is non-technical :-)
<Fallenou> sure
<Fallenou> I was just thinking about work force because there is a road map and a lot to do (usb, mmu, linux etc)
<wolfspraul> every creator is faced with shortage of resources
<wolfspraul> from people with access to vast resources - how many create something lasting?
<wolfspraul> so let's see. you have limited resources, and became passionate about the mmu, which a lot of people would love to have. is it enough to create something? we shall find out :-)
<wolfspraul> but whatever the result is, it's worth trying and the most important is that you enjoy being on that path! irrespective of the result
<wolfspraul> by the time we just buy what we need things are boring
<wolfspraul> Fallenou: you mentioned some roadblocks recently? did sleeping over them help in any way?
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<wolfspraul> writing this up could be helpful in itself, since there are a number of beginners/lurkers around
<Fallenou> oh a sum up of the state of the mmu dev ?
<Fallenou> I'm planning on sending a sum up email with a call for advices and ideas, not done yet, I tried a few more things yesterday
<wolfspraul> you mentioned something you got stuck on
<wolfspraul> ah ok
<Fallenou> yes I'm still stuck :(
<wolfspraul> I see
<Fallenou> I asked a few fpga engineers , they didn't help much about my problem
<Fallenou> but they did point a few things in Milkymist design
<Fallenou> not sure if it's a real issue but I could talk to lekernel about it
<Fallenou> about meta stability, asynchronous reset and DCM initialization
<wolfspraul> trust yourself
<Fallenou> I lost a few hours trying to get my hands on ModelSim , a verilog simulator
<wolfspraul> the most those people can often help you with is to be angry at their uselessness and finally realize yourself what's going on :-)
<Fallenou> right now I am doing simulations using ISim (ISE stuff)
<Fallenou> I wanted to try something else, since ISim does not help much here
<Fallenou> the MMU is working in ISim, so there must be something wrong with the simulation being too optimistic somewhere :)
<Fallenou> 17:11 < wolfspraul> the most those people can often help you with is to be angry at their uselessness and finally realize yourself what's going on :-) < ahah yes, that's the good moments, when you eventually figure out what is going wrong and fix it yourself :)
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<kyak> !seen dvdk
<qi-bot> kyak, dvdk (~dvdkhlng@g225045026.adsl.alicedsl.de) was last seen quitting #milkymist 1 day 16 hours 52 minutes ago (08.04. 00:06) stating "Remote host closed the connection" after spending 3 hours 37 minutes there.
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