<kristianpaul>
"Information (including all of my work) is not scarce. Attention (time) is."
<xiangfu>
kristianpaul: sorry. what you mean?
<xiangfu>
kristianpaul: the case of that adapter. is not open by me, it's open by exploded, there are some black things on that screw
<xiangfu>
exploded dust  :)
<rjeffries>
.
<wpwrak>
rejon: (slowpan) of course, there's the lingering question: why call it SLoWPAN if 6LoWPAN already has a perfectly good name ? after all, we don't, for example, measure current in Torvalds to honor our benevolent dictator
<larsc>
hm... 5owWPAN
<wpwrak>
rejon: the trademark issue because of which we had to rename "MicroSD" to "8:10" doesn't exist there
<larsc>
5LoWPAN
<larsc>
as a compromise
<wpwrak>
larsc: Sow-pan is what you call it when it doesn't work or is too slow ;-)
<dvdk>
hi
<dvdk>
who's done the mplayer port for ben?
<dvdk>
kyak, was that yoyu?
<dvdk>
need somebody to complain to :)
<wpwrak>
dvdk: just imagine it was kyak while you hurl your abuse at him ;-)
<dvdk>
wpwrak :)
<dvdk>
btw have hardware-scaling support working in mplayer.
<dvdk>
so full-screen playback possible at 24 FPS (using less-than-fullscreen video)
<wpwrak>
dvdk: kewl. when will we have full HDTV ? :)
<dvdk>
unfortunately the ogg demuxer of our mplayer version has some problems
<dvdk>
wpwrak: as soon as you added the dvi port to ben :)
<wpwrak>
wonders if one could bit-bang DVI ...
<kyak>
dvdk: hi there
<dvdk>
kyak: mahlzeit
<wpwrak>
dvdk: in what range is the maximum original resolution that still yields an acceptable frame rate ?
<dvdk>
wpwrak: depends on the codec.  with current theora (compiled with -Os), I get 256x144 without problems (maybe 80% CPU use)
<dvdk>
in theory we should be able to decode 320x240 if the codec were properly optimized and compiled
<dvdk>
(using the hardware for yuv->rgb step only)
<dvdk>
quality is quite fine when looked at from 0.5m :)
<dvdk>
btw kyak, is that mplayer port maintained by you?
<kyak>
dvdk: kind of. :)
<dvdk>
kyak: i think we need to upgrade.  the ogg/theora demuxer seems to have a bug.
<dvdk>
my test video drops video after 60s (even without hw accel -vo fbdev).
<dvdk>
some strange message about "frame duration too long)
<dvdk>
PC mplayer (svn) does not have the problem
<dvdk>
(however mplayer svn has yet another ogg/theore bug)
<kyak>
dvdk: you don't need to ask for my permission to upgrade ;)
<wpwrak>
dvdk: not bad :)
<dvdk>
kyak: yeah, but I'm a little short on time here :)
<kyak>
dvdk: i somehow have a feeling that increasing the version in makefile would do it
<kyak>
there are no patches
<dvdk>
kyak: is there even a newer version released?
<dvdk>
ok, ok, going to have a loog at it.
<kyak>
dunno, you just told me like it did :)
<dvdk>
s/loog/luck
<dvdk>
s/loog/luck/look
<dvdk>
kyak: maybe we have to use svn?
<kyak>
i think you already proposed it once. Are you sure it's a better options than using release?
<dvdk>
wait, going to upload my demo video (big buck bunny) plus the new vidix driver, to help motivate you :)
<kyak>
all right :)
<kyak>
have to go now. btw, mplayer is missing libggi dependency
<kyak>
just letting you know
<dvdk>
ok. cu.
<kyak>
this have been in my TODO list for some time now, i was waiting for a godo change to add it in Makefile :)
<wpwrak>
kyak: nice ... the transition from to-do to go-do
<dvdk>
kyak: looks like mplayer does not release tarballs any more.  use of svn is recommended.  just looking into patching our Makefile accordingly.
<vladkorotnev>
hello everyone :P
<rjeffries__>
wpwrask there is a thin line between "realist" and "defeatist" //grin
<kristianpaul>
rjeffries__: what side you already cross?
<rjeffries__>
smiles
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: indeed, and there is a line between "can't do" and "can do". very often, it exists only inside someone's mind :)
<kristianpaul>
:D
<rjeffries__>
may 1,000 flowers bloom.
<rjeffries__>
beleive it or not, I am not at all risk averse.
<rjeffries__>
new topic?
<kristianpaul>
ha..
<rjeffries__>
smiles again. anyway, why do we think Ben sales are so sluggish?
<kristianpaul>
may be more people thinking like some body we know...
<kristianpaul>
you got your ipad finally, right?
<kristianpaul>
:-)
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: ben sales, perhaps lack of exposure. nanonote sales on general, i'd blame lack of a follow-on product
<kristianpaul>
you mean a missing/strong marketing strategy?
<urandom__>
what about lack of usb-host? :P
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: (exposure) visibility
<rjeffries__>
yes without a strong follow-on BEN is a VERY VOOL niche inside a niche inside an imperceptibly small target market
<wpwrak>
urandom__: "see also \"follow-on product\""
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: indeed. continuity also creates long-term credibility creates access to additional markets
<rjeffries__>
the business case for creating a new Ben unfortunately does not exist.
<rjeffries__>
I can understand why wolfspraul is focusing Sharism resources in the direction og Milylisy, a totally different marejt
<rjeffries__>
s/marejt/market
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: oh, i think the biz case for a better ben does exist.
<rjeffries__>
wpwrak including a new case to allow a decent keyboard and a larger touch sensitive screen?
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: it's just difficult to convey to potential investors. at least difficult enough that, combined with the general lack of investor-attracting skills in the qi-hw community, it's insufficient (so far)
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: i would consider a new case a requirement. i wouldn't change the form factor, though
<rjeffries__>
why would an investor risk capital funding something that by definition can be easily reproduced anywhere anytime? it does not compute
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: if you want a netbook, there are dozens of choices. it would be insane to go there.
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: likewise for a "tablet"
<rjeffries__>
no much smaller than netbook but enough larger to allow more comfortable use
<rjeffries__>
agreed
<rjeffries__>
there are many existence proofs (read smart phone in various packages) where one gets a larger screen, and a better keybaord
<rjeffries__>
actually I am not positive physical keyboard is required
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: the easy reproduction anytime only happens if the reproducer is convinced there's a market share worth stealing and that there won't be severe enough punishment
<urandom__>
form factor is good as is but marketing must focus more on showing how small it is and that the keyboard really is awesome, though we need bigger screen so that it doesnt look like a toy anymore
<rjeffries__>
what are the use cases that make a Ben compelling...
<rjeffries__>
other than "I want a totally open device"
<rjeffries__>
That's it, end of story. it does not approach a smart phone form two years ago in usability
<urandom__>
i would like to see an nanonote with fpga, so we get the fpga hacker also and are more flexibel
<kristianpaul>
may be fpga with built-in arm chip.. :-)
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: well, it all depends on what you're trying to sell in the end, and to whom. if it's devices to regular consumers, it's difficult. if it's devices to vars, openness is an enabler and a very strong differentiator as well.
<mth>
the biggest NN limitation for the average consumer is no wireless internet, imo
<kristianpaul>
is ebook market still young?
<wpwrak>
urandom__: i think an fpha nanonote would only make sense after a ben successor. there are still many important things we don't "own" yet.
<rjeffries__>
mth you are correct and that is off the table because of philosophical reason
<wpwrak>
urandom__: such as mechanical design
<kristianpaul>
but. nah devel time sloq down those toughts..
<kristianpaul>
slow*
<kristianpaul>
wpwrak: how long take freerunner to be developed btw?
<rjeffries__>
I don't want to own this mechanical design, but a new fresh approach would be interesting
<kristianpaul>
s/take/took
<urandom__>
the nanonote makes a good translator/e-book, those stuff isnt cheap, we just need to make user friendly software
<wpwrak>
mth: my list of troublemakers has: usb host, wireless, display resolution, memory. not sure about the ranking.
<kristianpaul>
indeed with urandom__
<wpwrak>
mth: (troublemakers) for first sales
<mth>
wpwrak: bluetooth is also encumbered? because sharing a network connection with a phone would also be an option
<rjeffries__>
wpwrak add some more i/o in particulat I2C, also a second 8:10 port
<kristianpaul>
better fint the another vesion of the color digital dictionary and free it?
<kristianpaul>
that take time a cost, but surelly is cheap than develop own hardware
<wpwrak>
mth: BT is also a problem, yes. it may not even be so much the standards per se, but access to chips/modules. if you can't get chips with useful documentation, you lose.
<kristianpaul>
anyone with all the interes and time, can help on the support of touch screen displays, so a mechincal side could be develop faster i gues..
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: oh, i definitely want two 8:10 ports :) one inside, one outside
<rjeffries__>
keyboard needs backlight
<wpwrak>
rjeffries__: yup
<kristianpaul>
btw you can use a UBB for a DIY led light ;)
<kristianpaul>
s/a/an
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: true ;-))
<wpwrak>
i have a set of mean high-power leds. should adapt one ;-) unfortunately, they're all soldered to some board that's not very useful in hindsight
<kristianpaul>
i think thats something rjeffries__ can achieve at home easilly :-)
<kristianpaul>
high-power leds = how may watts? :o
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: maybe around one. don't quite remember.
<kristianpaul>
I was thiking an opto isolated addon, but i need to source if the local electronic shop sells "optoacopladores"
<kristianpaul>
hmm LVT-xx
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: the local shop will almost certainly have them. they're very very common.
<kristianpaul>
i hope here..
<kristianpaul>
btw to save me some reading do you rememnber mac current i can driver with the 8:10 port?
<kristianpaul>
s/port/pins
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: your diodes probably have better counterparts inside the chips. so they may not do much. also, if one side is entirely 3.3 V and the other entirely 5 V, you don't need to clamp the 3.3 V -> 5 V direction
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: on the I/Os ... i think about 4 mA
<kristianpaul>
tunner need SDA and SCL,
<kristianpaul>
also a CE pin
<kristianpaul>
and a LOCK signal to be read
<kristianpaul>
i dont get the part about ( you don't need to clamp the 3.3 V -> 5 V direction)
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: WRT54GL.TX -> PINGUINO.RX, why the diode ?
<kristianpaul>
ah..
<kristianpaul>
bad sch
<kristianpaul>
pinguino is 5V ttl, not 3v3 compatible
<kristianpaul>
but in the case of the nanonote i need 3v3 to 5V in both directions
<wpwrak>
also,  the chip on the WRT54GL.RX side probably has its own diode. and it probably has a lower voltage drop than the 1N4148. so you may still send about (5-3.3-0.3)/330 A through it, and very little through the 1N4148
<kristianpaul>
i see
<wpwrak>
you may want to check how the chip on the WRT54GL side is specified
<kristianpaul>
i think i'll just end using a transitors as on/off gate to driver the 5V signal
<wpwrak>
you may need two, so that you don't invert it
<kristianpaul>
and for the coming LOCK signal from tunner just  adiode or voltage divider to drop it to near/bellow 3v3
<kristianpaul>
ok
<kristianpaul>
ah, you mena darlington bridge?
<kristianpaul>
s/mena/mean
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: hmm, no, darlington also inverts