00:10 <mnutt_> ocdtrekkie: have you looked into where all of the storage is going, via the grain backup? I'd imagine it'd be pretty easy to do a cleanup?

00:11 <mnutt_> and yeah, I guess non-sqlite is pretty annoying for inspecting

00:14 <mnutt_> pretty happy that one of the 3 people who rated Davros as "needs fix" (due to the Owncloud crashing issue) tried yesterday's update and is having success. I haven't yet had to rate anything "needs fix" yet so I don't know what the flow looks like, but maybe afterwards it could link to the app's issue tracker so that they could file and issue and get updated when a fix is present?

00:24 <mokomull> ocdtrekkie: if it's InnoDB-backed, the files *never* get truncate()d. No idea about MyISAM since that's terribad.

00:52 <ocdtrekkie> mnutt_: I tried to make sense of it once, but it's really not my expertise.

00:59 <ocdtrekkie> TTRSS is supposed to purge old articles and stuff after x number of days, I don't know if it works correctly or not in the Sandstorm package. For all I know, 91 MB is just the largest the database has ever needed to be or something.

00:59 <ocdtrekkie> It compresses super well as a backup.

01:00 <ocdtrekkie> 92.9 MB on Sandstorm, 8.3 MB as a backup file.

02:03 <digitalcircuit> mnutt_: As a heads-up, just ran into this issue for the first time, found that someone else has it, too: https://github.com/mnutt/davros/issues/33 ("'#' in file and folder names causes problems") Maybe just a path escaping issue?

02:03 <digitalcircuit> Otherwise, new Davros update seems really nice!

02:04 <mnutt_> thanks! and yeah, definitely a path escaping issue. I've been meaning to figure out whether I can just special-case '#' or if I need to do something more comprehensive

02:09 <digitalcircuit> Duly noted. If there's anything I can help test, let me know, though I suspect you don't need extra help. UTF-8 filenames, perhaps?

03:15 <mnutt_> I expect the next version will have the demo files removed and empty directories will say "This directory is empty. [Upload some files] or just drag them in, or [add some demo files]"

03:16 <digitalcircuit> mnutt_: Alright, something like that makes sense.

04:36 <mnutt_> so apparently libreoffice really, really wants /proc to exist :-(

04:36 <mnutt_> > ERROR: /proc not mounted - LibreOffice is unlikely to work well if at all

04:37 <digitalcircuit> mnutt_: Trying to package the web version of LibreOffice?

04:37 <mnutt_> no, just generate some word doc previews

04:37 <mnutt_> that'd be interesting too, though

04:52 <mnutt_> I'm going to see what happens if I just build libreoffice from scratch without that check, but I don't have very high hopes

04:53 <digitalcircuit> Preview functionality seems like a nice idea! Good luck :)

05:02 <mnutt_> kentonv: would you happen to have any ideas for missing /proc workarounds?

05:03 <asheesh> mnutt_: Hi!

05:03 <asheesh> I have some ideas : P

05:03 <asheesh> What are you running into?

05:03 <mnutt_> asheesh: awesome, thanks!

05:03 <asheesh> My favorite is to snapshot the files; let me show you what I did for Andrew Wansley

05:04 <mnutt_> libreoffice checks "/proc/version" exists, and bails if not

05:04 <mnutt_> I think if that was any type of file, it'd probably get past that

05:04 <asheesh> https://github.com/awans/mark/blob/master/.sandstorm/sandstorm-pkgdef.capnp + https://github.com/awans/mark/tree/master/.sandstorm/proc-sys/kernel

05:04 <asheesh> https://github.com/awans/mark/blob/master/.sandstorm/sandstorm-pkgdef.capnp#L144 specifically

05:05 <asheesh> You _might_ be able to map a file in that way, not just a directory.

05:05 <asheesh> In that case, you'd:

05:05 <mnutt_> cool, let me give that a try. happy to abandon my libreoffice dependency quest

05:05 <asheesh> - Create a file called ".sandstorm/fake-slash-proc-version"

05:05 <asheesh> - Add `( packagePath = "proc/version", sourcePath = "/opt/app/.sandstorm/fake-slash-proc-version" ),` to your .sandstorm/sandstorm-pkgdef.capnp

05:05 <asheesh> - See if the app successfully launches correctly : )

05:07 <asheesh> If that doesn't work, you can patch Sandstorm to do something similar to https://github.com/sandstorm-io/sandstorm/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=proc+cpuinfo but it's a few different files to patch.

05:07 <asheesh> Particularly, you'd need to:

05:08 <asheesh> - Modify `spk` to create a new empty file like it does for /proc/version - https://github.com/sandstorm-io/sandstorm/blob/1d13090e0483e5f0857a9144b5c1129a04f361d1/src/sandstorm/spk.c%2B%2B#L1037

05:09 <asheesh> - Other stuff, too, but probably you can do what I said actually.

05:09 <asheesh> mnutt_: Let me know!

05:09 <mnutt_> trying it now

05:10 <asheesh> : )

06:52 <asheesh> (discussed more by PM)

17:37 <JonTheNiceGuy[m]> Evening :)

17:37 <JonTheNiceGuy[m]> Or rather #TZAppropriateGreeting

17:39 <JonTheNiceGuy[m]> I hacked out that bug I reported the other week, by reinstalling Sandstorm and not using sandcats. Sorry :( I was going to try to save the state for you to take a look through, but it had all the documents about an upcoming holiday and my wife was stressing

17:48 <asheesh> That's life; thanks for dealing with it in a way that worked for you.

17:49 <asheesh> Sorry I wasn't able to help in a more timely way. I don't suppose you have a backup that reproduces the problem, or something, though? If not, then that's OK; I'll remember this exchange in case it comes up in the future for someone else.

17:51 <ocdtrekkie> The usual "Google deleted your account" stories are pretty horrific, but now they've stepped that up to Google Cloud Platform, it seems: http://www.fredtrotter.com/2016/08/22/google-intrusion-detection-problems/

17:54 <asheesh> I guess the test is finding out how Google reacts.

19:41 <digitalcircuit> ocdtrekkie: The end seems to sum it up fairly well for Google in general - "While Google Cloud offers some powerful features, they are not safe to use until Google abandons its “guilty until proven innocent, without an option to prove” threat response model."

19:41 <digitalcircuit> ...which is a good reason for Sandstorm at scale :)

19:53 <mokomull> Other than the people involved, there's nothing preventing cloud-hosted Sandstorm from having the same issue, no?

20:22 <zarvox> Yeah, but you can also run Sandstorm on your own bare metal, if that's a risk you want to hedge against.

20:24 <mokomull> zarvox: Well, the article is about services which you can already run on your own bare metal, but the operator chose to use the Cloud™ instead.

20:30 <digitalcircuit> mokomull: Good point! The advantage to Sandstorm in this case might be the ease with which you can switch from cloud-hosted to self-hosted - download grain backups, upload to your own server. A mass-export and mass-import option could make this more manageable.

20:31 <digitalcircuit> I'm not sure if there's a way to reuse the work for Google Cloud compatible projects with other service providers.

20:34 <mokomull> I wonder if a mass-export of Sandstorm grains would be any less cumbersome than backing up, e.g., a hundred-GB EBS volume. You're still fighting your various service providers in the time-domain.

20:35 <mokomull> Single grains: yeah, way easier to export a document than it would be to pick that document out of the MySQL database out of the filesystem stored atop that cloud block device.

23:15 <ocdtrekkie> digitalcircuit: I guess what Sandstorm mass backup would need to do to be efficient would be like we can currently do with file systems pretty easily: Only download changed or new files.

23:15 <ocdtrekkie> asheesh: According to the author, Google reactivated his account four hours after he tweeted out the blog post.

23:34 <awans> so i'm like || <- that close to getting my distributed social bookmarking thing running on sandstorm

23:34 <awans> i've got one-way sync working (using the hack-session HTTP get capnp call)

23:34 <awans> but to get two-way sync working, i need to expose an API

23:35 <awans> so imagine my sadness when on the plane home from my sister's wedding this weekend, i hit `vagrant-spk dev` one last time and got

23:35 <awans> Error getting endpoint URL: hack-session.capnp:HackSessionContext.generateApiToken: rpc exception: remote exception: remote exception: remote exception: Error: generateApiToken() has been removed. Use offer templates instead.

23:35 <awans> what do y'all think? is there any other option for me? I can use offer templates, but the UX is pretty janky for what I'm doing.

23:36 <awans> (I think the best case scenario is telling the user to mysteriously copy paste a URL from one textarea to another..)

23:36 <awans> i understand for the git / mobile app use-case offer templates are quite elegant, but for apps that need to know their own URL (to, for instance, tell others to come say hello there), it's not awesome