apeiros_ changed the topic of #ruby to: Ruby 1.9.3-p327: http://ruby-lang.org || Paste >3 lines of text on http://gist.github.com
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<devdude> Hi #ruby, first off happy thanksgiving. I have a question. What were your first programming projects with ruby? I want to explore Back End Development. Currently the furthest I've been is slicing and implementing .psd web designs and I'm looking to go further.
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<dantesun> devdude: maybe http://ruby.railstutorial.org/ could help you
<devdude> thanks I'll take a look at these tonight
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<devdude> dantesun: I will consider the screencasts, but I'd like to know if you've had any experience with teamtreehouse or tutsplus.
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<devdude> I was considering the yearly subscription to tutspremium to supplement my out of date college coursework
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<dantesun> devdude: Sorry, but I believe the spirit of Internet is free. :) It's really not necessary to pay , you can get everyting on Internet.
<devdude> Yeah, I agree
<devdude> are you a front end dev as well dantesun?
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<dantesun> I am working on backend most of time. But I am a fan of front end :)
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<devdude> cool
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<joofsh> how can i call a method with a string of the name. so if i have a def foo; end
<joofsh> and a sample_string = "foo"
<joofsh> is there a way to call the method, using the sample_string?
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<ryanf> use send()
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<Cadwallion> joofsh: https://gist.github.com/4133772
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<joofsh> thank you
<joofsh> ahh
<joofsh> cadwallion: Aha! I was trying to put the class Foo inside the send()
<joofsh> makes more sense. thank you sir
<Cadwallion> np :)
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<shevy> havenn_, on purpose? not a mistake??
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<havenn_> shevy: Yup, guess they are switching to semantic versioning. Was pretty odd to have rake not be 1.0! :P
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<rssfan99> hi
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<seanstickle> Allo
<rssfan99> anyone know a good place to find Ruby freelancers
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<seanstickle> rssfan99: depends on how much money you have
<rssfan99> hmm can I pose my question here?
<rssfan99> I'm not soliciting anything
<seanstickle> My answer is pretty direct.
<seanstickle> Have a lot of money, and the number of places to find Ruby freelancers increases.
<rssfan99> My budget is around $1,000
<seanstickle> That gets you about 10 hours of a reasonable freelancer.
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<rssfan99> I am trying to do this http://hastebin.com/mopuwaxima.vhdl
<rssfan99> I think it's not possible given my budget? :x
<seanstickle> You'd spend that budget better with PHP
<shevy> rssfan99 sounds more fitting to rubyonrails
<shevy> "let them enter their feed url" that's pretty much a web-only task
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<rssfan99> well I tried there
<rssfan99> but unfortunatley it would not let me post
<rssfan99> seanstickle are you familiar with feedburner?
<seanstickle> rssfan99: yup
<rssfan99> what would be best for that: Perl, PHP or RubyonRails
<seanstickle> Makes absolutely no difference.
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<rssfan99> however, given the budget, php would be best, correct?
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<seanstickle> Yup
<rssfan99> Of course I can do things with php so the project isnt start to finish
<rssfan99> no way id get the whole service, finished site and stuff, for 1 grand
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<rssfan99> thanks for your help seanstickle :)
<seanstickle> Sure
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<havenn_> rssfan99: I'd use Rails if you can find someone. Might want to see if anyone in #RubyOnRails bites.
<seanstickle> You might be able to afford 8 hours of someone there. :)
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<rssfan99> Yeah I think they are too good for this lol
<rssfan99> I am a college student don't have much money :)
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<seanstickle> Or just learn how to program yourself.
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<rssfan99> I am, slowly.
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<rssfan99> It's unrealistic to finish the project without outside help though
<Bane> yo shinji
<rssfan99> *impossible probably
<shevy> 18.0148.round(4) hmm there was no easy way to round for floats?
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<seanstickle> 18.0148.round(4) #=> 18.0148
<seanstickle> Is that a problem?
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<rssfan99> well thanks for the advice, Happy Thanksgiving
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<hadees> i'm having some trouble metaprograming. http://pastie.org/5421452 I wrote this method parse to make things easier for me but when I use it the methods I define don't seem to have access to the instance variables. What am I doing wrong? I even tried instance_variable_get(:@scope)
<cirwin> hadees: when you do "yield" it runs the block in the scope that it was defined
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<cirwin> so it's looking for the @scope variable on the class
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<cirwin> what you probably want is value = instance_eval(&block) if block
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<hadees> cirwin: i figured it was something along those lines, thanks!
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<average_drifter> hey
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<average_drifter> heard you guys got problems with the speed !
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<average_drifter> or the lack thereof
<average_drifter> are there plans on improving Ruby's interpreter speed ?
<cirwin> average_drifter: I think since 1.9 ruby's pretty competitive speed-wise
<average_drifter> cirwin: orly , very nice
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<average_drifter> very very nice
<cirwin> 2.0 has some widely publicised improvements on start-up time, and I suspect some other imrpovements
<cirwin> and jruby are always telling us they're even faster than MRI
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<havenn_> mruby HPC edition should make the fortran competition: https://www.cps-jp.org/~mosir/pub/2012/2012-03-05/03_nakamura/pub-web/HPC_Ruby_Compiler.pdf
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<Cadwallion> stuck in the mode where I want to code, but I've had enough wine that I can't mentally block out everyone in the room
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<shevy> lol
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<witchdoc> hi all
<durre> I want to write load/stress tests for a non ruby application. I'm looking for something like selenium but without the browser. jmeter is too hard to version-handle between projects. is there anything with ruby?
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<durre> it needs to be able to login (save cookies)
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<seanstickle> durre: mechanize?
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<durre> seanstickle: maybe, I will check it out. I also found something called Blitz that I will look at
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<ksinkar> what is difference between Array#size and Array#length and Array#count?
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<clocKwize> ksinkar, nothing
<clocKwize> size is an alias for length
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<clocKwize> and count (in activesupport, not core) is an alias for one of those 2
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<postmodern> ksinkar, #count is from Enumerable
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<clocKwize> oh ;p
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<clocKwize> so, count comes from core too, just on the Enumerable module. and has more functionality than length/size
<postmodern> clocKwize, size is definitely aliased to length, and Enumerable depends on #size for various calculations
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<_bart> Didn't know banisterfiend made pry, cool
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<ksinkar> postmodern: not really, right now I am facing a case, where I have an array
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<ksinkar> array.count gives me 0 but array.size gives me the size of the array
<habib> hi everyone
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<habib> i've installed rvm yesterday. and now ran ruby -v. it says 1.8.7. but rvm list says 1.9.3
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<habib> how do i do ruby -v to give 1.9.3?
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<clocKwize> habib
<clocKwize> rvm use 1.9.3
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<habib> i did. it's still 1.8.7 when ruby-v
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<clocKwize> then you did something wrong :/
<clocKwize> did you follow rvm notes, rvm requirements etc?
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<habib> yeah
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<clocKwize> did you add the rvm script thing to your .bash_profile/rc etc
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<habib> yes i did
<habib> i'll reinstall it now
<clocKwize> which ruby
<clocKwize> is probably looking at /usr/bin
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<clocKwize> when rvm is symlinking ruby in ~/.rvm
<clocKwize> and you need that in your PATH
<clocKwize> (just guessing)
<clocKwize> when I do which ruby
<clocKwize> I get /home/michael/.rvm/rubies/ruby-1.9.3-p194-railsexpress/bin/ruby
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<habib> clocKwize: thnx. i'll try it
<habib> just when it end reinstall
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<habib> clocKwize: How do i add the path
<habib> ?
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<habib> so
<habib> i've just reinstalled RVM
<habib> and afterall ruby -v says 1.8.7
<habib> how to solve it?
<habib> rvm list => 1.9.3
<habib> gem -v
<CamonZ> habib: open a new terminal session and write which ruby
<habib> /usr/bin/ruby
<habib> how to change PATH?
<habib> or what do i need to do
<CamonZ> in the new shell write: source ~/.rvm/scripts/rvm
<CamonZ> that should load rvm everytime you open a new shell
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<CamonZ> after running that, open a new shell and type: type rvm | head -n 1
<CamonZ> you should get a message saying "rvm is a function"
<habib> no it sais rvm is /home/habib/.rvm/bin/rvm
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<CamonZ> habib: when you installed rvm it should have modified your environment automatically to be loaded when a new shell opens
<CamonZ> maybe you got an error during the installation process
<habib> i can reinstall it and check it
<habib> i allready read it
<habib> there were no errors during the installation
<habib> can u lead me through the instalation process?
<habib> first i do what https://rvm.io/rvm/install/ been said
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<CamonZ> habib: do a ls -a on your $HOME dir, you should have a .bash_profile or .bashrc or .profile
<CamonZ> 1 of those 3 files should have a command like [[ -s "$HOME/.rvm/scripts/rvm" ]] && source "$HOME/.rvm/scripts/rvm"
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<CamonZ> if you don't have it, add it;
<CamonZ> habib: what are you running, linux, osx?
<habib> mint
<CamonZ> mint?
<habib> LinuxMint 14
<CamonZ> ok
<CamonZ> are you using bash?
<habib> no
<CamonZ> or zsh or something else?
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<habib> no
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<CamonZ> what shell are you using?
<habib> ah
<habib> yeah bash
<habib> cmon i'm second week on linux)
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<CamonZ> ok, on your .bashrc put the [[ -s "$HOME/.rvm/scripts/rvm" ]] && source "$HOME/.rvm/scripts/rvm" command
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<habib> ok
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<habib> and then?
<CamonZ> open a new shell
<habib> done
<CamonZ> and test the type rvm | head -n 1
<habib> it worked
<CamonZ> cool
<habib> thnx man:)
<habib> you're so kind :)
<CamonZ> testing the type rvm | head -n 1 should render you the "rvm is a function" message
<CamonZ> habib: you're welcome :)
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<habib> when i run rvm | head -n 1
<bubuz> hi guys - anyone have any suggestions how to parition a system used for RoR app/web server?
<habib> it gives...
<CamonZ> bubuz: try asking on #rubyonrails
<bubuz> ta
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<CamonZ> habib: did you run it correctly? look at https://gist.github.com/4135047
<CamonZ> the [~/Code] ➔ bit is how my prompt looks
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<habib> my one is habib@habib-305U1A ~ $
<CamonZ> ok
<habib> is it ok?
<CamonZ> yeah, that's the default
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<habib> and now it's type rvm | head -n 1
<habib> rvm is a function
<habib> bash: type: write error: Broken pipe
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<CamonZ> that last part is a bit worrysome; my linux fu is not strong enough to solve that one
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<CamonZ> but… if rvm is working for you
<CamonZ> then I guess it's ok
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<habib> haha :) ok then
<habib> thnx anyway CamonZ
<CamonZ> np
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<shevy> hmm broken pipe can have several reasons
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<shevy> habib does the part "| head -n 1" work for other commands?
<habib> shevy: with like what?
<habib> what is this comandfor?
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<nkts> Hi, any good and simple searchers for datamapper? I have tried dm-searcher, but it's not working for me.
<shevy> habib with any other command. head -n 1 should show the first line of a file
<habib> ah ok
<shevy> try to find a text file, then cat it... "cat foo.txt | head -n 1"
<shevy> I once had a broken pipe due to a miscompiled lex parser
<shevy> I could no longer compile anything needing that (I think it was bison... or flex. cant remember)
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<habib> shevy: it worked for ruby
<habib> without any pipes broken
<habib> but for rvm it's still working with broken pipe
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<shevy> yeah, now you know that it works in general, but something doesn't with rvm. I am not sure if that is for everyone or not, I don't use rvm myself
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<UukGoblin> what does a "void value expression" error mean?
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<apeiros_> UukGoblin: hurray for giving so much context, bravo!
<apeiros_> </sarcasm>
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<UukGoblin> apeiros_, no, I'm serious ;-) I'm curious what the error means, and see an example of where it can occur
<apeiros_> UukGoblin: let me guess, you go to your carshop without your car too and ask why the motor doesn't work, yes?
<UukGoblin> I'm not interested in solving an occurence of it in my code just yet ;-)
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<UukGoblin> apeiros_, more like, "what would it mean if my car showed an 'error #135'?"
<apeiros_> UukGoblin: yes, and you don't tell him what model, what brand etc.
<UukGoblin> ruby 1.9.2p290 (2011-07-09 revision 32553) [x86_64-linux]
<UukGoblin> ;-P
<apeiros_> yeah, fail
<apeiros_> the error means: void value expression. there. that's all to be told with the info you gave.
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<UukGoblin> what is a void value in ruby?
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<UukGoblin> well, with some languages, you can get nice descriptions (documentation) of every error there can be - is there such a thing in ruby?
<apeiros_> UukGoblin: you fail to comprehend that there is *language* and there is *code*
<apeiros_> and 99.9% of all errors are *code* related
<UukGoblin> cause all the occurrences on google seem to be someone with bad syntax asking for help
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<UukGoblin> well, I sort of meant language compilers / interpreters
<UukGoblin> and perhaps change ruby into MRI
<apeiros_> there is nothing called "void value" in the language.
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<UukGoblin> so how can I make an expression that involves it? :-O
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<apeiros_> you tell me
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<banisterfiend> UukGoblin: you got the error message, show the code you used that generated that error message
<apeiros_> banisterfiend: did you just tell him to give context? oh noes!
* apeiros_ needs more sarcasm tags
<UukGoblin> banisterfiend, yeah will do in a bit once I narrow it down
<UukGoblin> but I was kind of asking for some documentation / more info on the error itself
<banisterfiend> UukGoblin: i've never seen it before
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<UukGoblin> problem is, once I narrow it down, I'll see for myself what was "wrong" ;-]
<banisterfiend> UukGoblin: doesn't it give you a line number?
<UukGoblin> it occurs for instance in: def foo; return (3 == 3) and false; end
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<UukGoblin> I guess 'and' is low-priority and it's interpreting it as (return(3==3)) and false
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<banisterfiend> UukGoblin: sounds right
<UukGoblin> this optional omission of brackets is always tricky, also in other languages
<UukGoblin> so I guess a 'return' is a void value as it doesn't evaluate to anything sensible in an expression
<UukGoblin> i.e. in: (return) and false
<banisterfiend> UukGoblin: Yeah makes sense
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<D4T> is it possible to convert a REXML doc into a string? Not sure the best way to do it.
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<D4T> in ruby 1.8.7
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<shevy> dunno. I gave up on XML many years ago and I have to say, I love not having to deal with it
<shevy> oh
<shevy> you mean, how to convert
<shevy> hmmm
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<shevy> should work with #to_s, if not the authors are silly
<apeiros_> D4T: have you tried to_s?
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<D4T> haha stupid me… i blame the fact its a friday
<D4T> thanks guys
<D4T> (or gals)
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* Hanmac prefers Nokogiri for xml parsing/building
<D4T> Hanmac: I think lots too :)
<shevy> well it's some kind of assumed-ruby, most objects should have a string representation, so to_s or to_str should work
<shevy> I always forget the difference between these two :\
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<yxhuvud> to_str is a string representation. to_s is not - it is just some string output that could be anything.
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<Hanmac> shevy to_str is used if the object can transformed into an string without losing information
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<shevy> hmm
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<shevy> aaah backup complete, time to reinstall a new OS!!!
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<apeiros_> to_s is IMO a misnomer, should be printable (or similar)
<yxhuvud> to_print to follow the pattern
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<emka> hey can someone help me out with something
<emka> adding a value to an array seems to bug or something
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<hoelzro> emka: what kind of bug? could you paste some code?
<emka> yes working on it hoelzro
<hoelzro> just making sure ;)
<emka> there
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<hoelzro> so what's the bug? what do you expect?
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<arturaz> emka, 1. that is rails
<emka> yes
<arturaz> #rubyonrails
<emka> this is ruby right...
<arturaz> 2. i'd expect save after <<
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<emka> yeah but it's quite llike a muse in there
<emka> asave on the array?
<arturaz> a save on role
<arturaz> erm, self
<emka> shouldnt I be able to have an array a = ['a'] and then do a << 'b'
<yxhuvud> Doesn't << autosave?
<emka> the save is not the issue
<yxhuvud> and anyhow, it is in before_save so saving there should be a bug in any case
<emka> check the log
<arturaz> emka, my advice - stop trying to roll your own auth solution, use one of gazillion plugins out there
<emka> Array a = [2] and I do a << '3'
<emka> should out ut of a be [2,3]
<arturaz> irb(main):001:0> a = []
<arturaz> => []
<arturaz> irb(main):003:0> a
<arturaz> => ["b"]
<arturaz> irb(main):002:0> a << 'b'
<arturaz> => ["b"]
<arturaz> it is
<emka> Yes!
<emka> that is what I am saying
<arturaz> the thing is - role_ids probably is not a regular array
<emka> is not the case here
<emka> aah ok
<emka> puts role_ids outputs Array
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<arturaz> class Foo < Array; end
<arturaz> puts Foo.new.to_s
<arturaz> []
<emka> k
<arturaz> so does this
<arturaz> #rubyonrails might help you
<CamonZ> if I pass some variables to a Proc, and modify them inside it; do they retain the new value after the Proc gets executed?
<arturaz> emka, also you can try out .inspect on objects, but that can be faked too
<emka> ok thanks
<arturaz> CamonZ, how about trying it out?
<emka> I think Iäll put the after_create instead and just add the object as a relationship dirctly
<CamonZ> arturaz: I will, but it's nice to ask
<arturaz> irb(main):007:0> a = 3
<arturaz> => 3
<arturaz> irb(main):008:0> proc { |x| x += 1 }.call(a)
<arturaz> irb(main):009:0> a
<arturaz> => 4
<arturaz> => 3
<CamonZ> :)
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<CamonZ> arturaz: thanks
<arturaz> of course if a is an object and you change its properties it will persist :)
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<arturaz> emka, one of the things I actually left Ruby after 6 years. Got a bit tired of never knowing what stuff was until runtime :)
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<CamonZ> arturaz: thanks again; the idea is to refactor this bit https://gist.github.com/4135549
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<CamonZ> with a hash to avoid the case structure
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<_bart> When I do `titles.map { |title| ((title[0,2] == ': ') ? title[2..-1]! : title) }` not a single title is being touched, even though there is one that has ': blabla'
<_bart> eh without the !, that's invalid ruby
<apeiros_> because you don't do anything
<shevy> hehe
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<apeiros_> title[2..-1] *returns* a substring
<apeiros_> it doesn't modify the receiver
<apeiros_> and map *returns* a new array
<apeiros_> it doesn't modify the receiver
<apeiros_> you want: mapped_titles = titles.map { … }
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<_bart> apeiros_: or .map! { } ?
<apeiros_> depends on what you want
<_bart> apeiros_: modify the original
<_bart> ah it works
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<shevy> :)
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<shevy> hmmm
<shevy> is shoes really useable?
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<Muz> In what sense? The real ballache is "are Shoes based apps really distributable"
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<shevy> require 'shoes'
<shevy> Sorry, this gem currently does nothing. Team Shoes is working on Gemifying Shoes, and this is just a placeholder until then.
<shevy> :(
<seanstickle> People still use Shoes?
<shevy> I guess noone uses ruby + GUI anymore
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<seanstickle> I use a GUI with Ruby all the time
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<shevy> seanstickle what are you using?
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<seanstickle> shevy: HTML/CSS/JS
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<seanstickle> shevy: works right nice
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<Xeago> seanstickle: the gui in your case is HTML/CSS using JS to manipulate it
<Xeago> not ruby
<seanstickle> Xeago: nah, it's all driven by Ruby
<shevy> :(
<seanstickle> Xeago: the GUI is just enhanced by some JS, and very little at that
<Xeago> in the end it is HTML that is the gui
<Xeago> not any ruby-display
<shevy> it seems to me as if, with the proliferation of HTML5, the "classical" toolkits died almost instantly
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<Xeago> shevy: kinda
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<seanstickle> I see no reason to fiddle around with brain dead butchery like Qt
<shevy> ruby-gnome - barely active. shoes - placeholder message when doing "gem install shoes", qtruby - rdale is missing in action since many months
<shevy> tcl/tk - still looks like inferior shit
<seanstickle> Or, god help me, WX or Swing
<shevy> I guess it's time to bite the bullet and start embracing javascript
<arturaz> android/ios still uses native toolkits :)
<arturaz> on the other hand - writing gui apps with ruby wasn't popular at any given time
<shevy> yeah that had a huge effect too
<seanstickle> I've been tinkering with PhoneGap, which is pleasant enough.
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<shevy> arturaz, it may not have been popular but it kinda worked in the past. I cant even get the up-to-date ruby-gnome bindings to compile at all
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<arturaz> guys
<arturaz> how do you feel about static typing? do you think ruby would benefit from it?
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<seanstickle> arturaz: with or without autoboxing?
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<arturaz> seanstickle, autoboxing doesn't make much sense in ruby world :) or we have different definitions of autoboxing
<seanstickle> arturaz: neither does static typing
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<seanstickle> arturaz: but you brought that up too :)
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<arturaz> seanstickle, well, ok, lets rephrase that - do you think something like mirah (staticly typed with ruby syntax) has potential?
<seanstickle> It definitely has potential.
<seanstickle> We'll see if it can be actualized.
<shevy> arturaz if it would be not the default, perhaps
<shevy> arturaz if it would become the default, ruby would lose flexibility
<Xeago> for completely different usecases
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<arturaz> groovy has taken this approach. its dynamic by default, but you can mark certain portions as statically typed
<shevy> hmm doesn't groovy syntax suck?
<arturaz> shevy, i largely believe that "would lose flexibility" is a myth
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<shevy> g = new Greet('world')
<Xeago> arturaz: you certainly achieve some amount of flexibility with using automatical typing of variables and such
<Xeago> but the real treat comes from ducktyping in static languages
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<shevy> arturaz, why? if I am _forced_ to spend time thinking about types, I do lose time compared to when I do _not_ have to think about it at all whatsoever
<arturaz> you still think about types
<shevy> and you not?
<Xeago> you don't think about static interfaces
<arturaz> don't lie to yourself :)
<Xeago> and inheritance chains
<shevy> you wrote "staticly typed with ruby syntax"
<seanstickle> When I want something like that, I just use Perl 6
<arturaz> is it out yet?
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<shevy> def content = [:]
<shevy> ^^^ groovy code
<shevy> def invokeMethod(String name, Object args) {
<apeiros_> arturaz: does mirah use type inference?
<shevy> where is it optional where I can define the type please?
<arturaz> apeiros_, seems so.
<apeiros_> nice
<shevy> def foo = new Foo()
<apeiros_> arturaz: and what does it accept as type? classes only? or modules too?
<shevy> hmmm kinda odd
<arturaz> apeiros_, no idea. :)
<apeiros_> arturaz: ok
<apeiros_> arturaz: of course it has potential, c.f. all the existing strictly typed languages
<arturaz> the thing is - i've recently migrated to scala (1 year) after 6 years of ruby
<seanstickle> arturaz: Perl 6 has been out for some time
<apeiros_> but whether it is any good depends on so many details…
<seanstickle> arturaz: it's just not hugely popular yet
<arturaz> and more scala I learn the more I think that dynamic typing is just a huge mistake
<shevy> perl 6 still requires perl 5 to compile from source :(
<arturaz> which is kind of sad given that I've been promoting dynamic languages for 10 years
<apeiros_> arturaz: got any actual examples of where you noticed that?
<arturaz> apeiros_, well, i write same amount of code, but it has less bugs
<shevy> pfffft
<apeiros_> arturaz: concrete examples of bugs?
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<shevy> syntax errors
<shevy> :P
<arturaz> apeiros_, type bugs, mistypes, etc...
<shevy> apeiros_ you must have all kind of type bugs in your ruby code!
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<shevy> MILLIONS of them
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<apeiros_> shevy: I write perfect code
<shevy> hehe
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<apeiros_> at first try.
<Hanmac> shevy look at RbConfig::CONFIG["BASERUBY"] :D
<apeiros_> I only know the meaning of the word "bug" from hearsay
<shevy> see arturaz? that's the way to go about it... the perfect hacker writes bug free software
<apeiros_> ;-)
<arturaz> yeah, right :D
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<shevy> RbConfig::CONFIG["BASERUBY"] # => nil
<shevy> Hanmac I am on 1.8.x temporarily btw :\
<apeiros_> arturaz: ok, that's still pretty vague. but do you think it'd have taken you significantly longer to find those bugs in ruby? if so, why?
<arturaz> apeiros_, well, i had one case in particular
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<arturaz> where a wrong type was passed
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<arturaz> more over - it was silently accepted
<arturaz> no crashes, nothing
<arturaz> but the actual result was wrong
<Hanmac> on ruby1.9 RbConfig::CONFIG["BASERUBY"] => "/usr/bin/ruby1.8"
<arturaz> resulting in slow over-time DB corruption
<arturaz> which sucked.
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<Hanmac> shevy why are you on 1.8? and why did you install your system new?
<apeiros_> arturaz: slow bugs are annoying, but they can happen with strictly typed software too
<arturaz> apeiros_, of course they can. but type checker would have prevented this one :)
<apeiros_> arturaz: any occasions where you missed dynamic typing?
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<seanstickle> shevy: Ruby still requires C to compile from source
<arturaz> apeiros_, not really. rspec maybe, but you just have to write code in a bit different way to be able to stub out "static" methods
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<arturaz> and scala actually has Dynamic trait, which allows you to do method_missing (xml builders?)
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<apeiros_> arturaz: tbh, I don't really see the "earlier bug catching" as a real advantage of statically typed languages. But that doesn't mean that a) I'm right about that and b) there weren't other merits.
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<arturaz> apeiros_, well, catching bugs which happen in production can be really bad
<arturaz> especially when you have a realtime service :)
<apeiros_> yes, but bugs will happen, no matter what.
<arturaz> ever had to answer to a bunch of angry mmo gamers? :D
<apeiros_> and you can always throw more tests at a problem
<apeiros_> static typing is just one more test
<Xeago> rofl..
<Xeago> why not implement static typechecking in rspecs..
<apeiros_> arturaz: i.e., with regards to bug catching, I favor DBC over static typing any day. but I lack experience.
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<Cadwallion> why write specs when you can force your language to tie your arm behind you?
<Cadwallion> :P
<shevy> seanstickle yes, C. not itself however
<apeiros_> DBC provides much better tests than static typing ever could. and that while being more flexible.
<shevy> perl5 requires C too
<arturaz> apeiros_, DBC?
<apeiros_> design by contract
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<arturaz> like in "it should have those method & properties"?
<shevy> Hanmac usually 1.8.7 compiles faster for me, and I installed this distribution ~1 hour ago. need a bit time to transition everything
<seanstickle> shevy: right, so some languages require other languages to compile
<apeiros_> I'd love if ruby supported that on a syntax level. some things of it you can't add without (especially the 'old' pseudo-variable)
<seanstickle> shevy: not exactly shocking, izzit?
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<arturaz> younnes, please stop that. we're having a discussion.
<apeiros_> arturaz: no, like in pre-conditions, post-conditions and class-invariants
<shevy> seanstickle if the evolution of a language requires legacy then this is showing that the evolution goes backwards
<apeiros_> arturaz: eiffel.com has some good videos about it
<shevy> perl 6 is a dead end
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<Hanmac> shevy that does not answer why you reinstall your system
<seanstickle> shevy: Perl 6 is pragmatically a different language
<seanstickle> shevy: not just Perl 5 with some new features
<shevy> Hanmac some things weren't working -lpthread for instance failed
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<arturaz> apeiros_, i'll check that out, thanks :)
<apeiros_> arturaz: what stops you from typechecking in ruby?
<Hanmac> shevy: "perl 6 is a dead end" and Haskell is a step more far :D
<shevy> seanstickle yeah it's why perl 5 is more active :)
<arturaz> apeiros_, nothing. but then you realize that you don't want ruby anymore.
<shevy> oh god haskell
<seanstickle> shevy: PHP is more active than Ruby too
<shevy> 120 MB size?!?!
<seanstickle> shevy: not sure that tells me much
<shevy> seanstickle true :(
<apeiros_> arturaz: not sure. it's a tradeoff.
<apeiros_> arturaz: if you only punctually want typechecking, and elsewhere prefer the dynamic style, you'd stay with ruby
<shevy> arturaz what was your biggest project in ruby?
<arturaz> a multithreaded game server with celluloid
<Hanmac> seanstickle: thats only becaue in php you need more lines than in ruby :D
<shevy> arturaz what happened to it? you let it die, didn't you? :>
<arturaz> nah, it still works
<shevy> cool, that looks like an insame amount of work
<arturaz> yeah, it was
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<Cadwallion> must teleport home. why are there no teleporters? Gathered enough coherency to work on spinel's resource manager last night
<Cadwallion> must continue...
<Blue_Ice> Is there a difference in used paths or such when using "irb file.rb" opposed to "ruby file.rb"? The first finds my installed gem, the latter not ...
<Xeago> irb probably loads ruby gems or stuff
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<apeiros_> Blue_Ice: irb can load an irbrc
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<apeiros_> which might have additional stuff in it
<apeiros_> also, it is possible that your irb executes a different ruby than your ruby command
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<arturaz> shevy, what happened that as the codebase grew I wanted to know what stuff comes in and what comes out more and more.
<apeiros_> check with `which irb` and `head -n1 <the irb path>`
<apeiros_> (and `which ruby` to compare)
<arturaz> and there's no good way for that with ruby :(
<arturaz> also ruby was too slow for some tasks, which led me to writing those in java and then later in scala
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<arturaz> and now its like 80% jruby / 20% scala
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<arturaz> which is a hell if you're trying to use a debugger
<Hanmac> arturaz, i does an 3d engine binding for ruby
<Hanmac> and with the right driver you have >200FPS
<arturaz> Hanmac, binding.
<arturaz> right?
<arturaz> you do not do you math stuff in ruby, right?
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<shevy> arturaz kinda true, growing complexity still annoys me
<arturaz> your*
<shevy> but to replace ruby with java ...
<shevy> maaaaaan
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<shevy> Hanmac! where is the documentation!!!!!!!
<arturaz> shevy, yeah, but if map generation takes 45 secs with ruby, you gotta do what you gotta do
<arturaz> java killed my mojo though, that's why I discovered scala :)
<Hanmac> arturaz i dont do, and its not my math suff, do you know OGRE? i did an ruby interface for it
<Hanmac> and shevy yeah i know but currently i try to make the samples for rwx
<arturaz> which was kind of ruby but with static typing
<Xeago> arturaz: hell no
<arturaz> Hanmac, yeah, I know ogre :)
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<Xeago> arturaz: is NO WHERE NEAR
<arturaz> why not?
<Blue_Ice> apeiros_: thanks for the suggestion. head -n 1 ruby gave lots of garbage, but it worked on the irb (which gave a full path to a ruby binary). Ran the script with also the full path to that binary, no avail. I'll try requiring rubygems first to test
<apeiros_> Blue_Ice: …
<apeiros_> I said head -n 1 ***PATH_TO_IRB***
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<apeiros_> not ruby
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<apeiros_> and the point is that you compare the path to that ruby binary with the result of `which ruby`
<Blue_Ice> apeiros_: ok, misunderstood it. Either way, just did an explicit load of rubygems, that did the trick
<apeiros_> if they're different, you obviously run irb with a different ruby than your `ruby` command
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<apeiros_> if you have to require rubygems explicitly, then you're using a deprecated version of ruby and should update.
<Blue_Ice> apeiros_: they were the same, just not obvious at first sight since /usr/bin/ruby was a symlink to /Library/System ..../usr/bin/ruby (and that full path was in the irb header)
<Xeago> 1.8.7 is not deprecated apeiros_
<Xeago> !
<havenn> Xeago: Soon...
<apeiros_> Xeago: yes, officially.
<Xeago> :)
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<Xeago> neways
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<Xeago> i'm too drunk to be on irc..
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<Hanmac> Xeago it is allready dead, it is only not buried yet
<havenn> Xeago: What is it, June, when they stop security patches? That is about as deprecated as you can get!
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<havenn> Already it just gets bugfixes. 1.8 is *almost* ten years old. Long live 2.0!
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<arturaz> (1..7).reject { |i| i % 3 == 0 }.inject(1) { |i, a| i * a }
<arturaz> (1 to 7).filterNot(_ % 3 == 0).fold(1) { _ * _ }
<shevy> Xeago why are you drunk at this time of the day?
<arturaz> (1 to 7).filterNot(_ % 3 == 0).fold(1) { case (i1, i2) => i1 * i2 }
<arturaz> shevy, depends on timezone ;)
<shevy> whoa... who owns the [younnes] bot here?
<apeiros_> arturaz: .inject(1, :*)
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<shevy> must be the horseman
<arturaz> apeiros_, yeah :)
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<arturaz> the point is - its not so scary
<arturaz> at least not java scary
<apeiros_> arturaz: ah
<arturaz> which would be a lot more scarier :D
<apeiros_> arturaz: no doubt about that
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<shevy> test
<roll> is
<arturaz> i still dislike java :)
<apeiros_> java ain't scarry, just bloaty :-p
<arturaz> well, yeah
<arturaz> and stupidly restricted
<apeiros_> but it got better, or so I heard
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<arturaz> apeiros_, sort of. when java8 comes out
<roll> What does ruby stand for?
<shevy> it surely will never abandon its bloaty origin
<shevy> roll, it's a pun following the naming of "perl"
<Mon_Ouie> It's still verbose. I have to do lots of it for school homework. :(
<havenn> roll: It stands for the birthstone.
<apeiros_> but last time I wrote java (Java 1.5 back then), an exercise at school took my teacher ~250 lines of java, me ~150 lines of java and ~40 lines of ruby
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<roll> Wow
<roll> That is really nice
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<apeiros_> the amount of java could probably have been reduced, but I was a beginner. but given that the teacher wrote even more code than I… :)
<arturaz> although you have to love some java ide features. like if there is only 1 var of required type in scope it gets autoinserted into method call
<roll> So what can I do with ruby?
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<havenn> roll: All the things.
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<havenn> A nice comparison of Ruby vs Scala from a Rubyist's perspective: http://www.confreaks.com/videos/1288-rubyconf2012-ruby-vs-the-world
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<havenn> Once you skip through Go and Closure :P
<apeiros_> arturaz: well, my teacher wrote professionally with java, so not a propellerhead (supposedly at least)
<apeiros_> s/with//
<roll> Can I write scripts ?
<havenn> roll: Yes.
<apeiros_> then again, he had german variables and methods, eeeek :-S
<arturaz> havenn, any time tag?
<roll> Are they efficient ones ?
<shevy> apeiros_ schwyzerdeutsch variables????
<apeiros_> shevy: no, german, schwyzerdütsch would have added to the hilarity, though :)
<havenn> arturaz: 28:23
<roll> youness shut up troll
<roll> youness shut up troll
<roll> youness shut up troll
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<apeiros_> lol?
<arturaz> havenn, ok, lets take a look :)
<shevy> there is a bot, youness. I put him on my /ignore, but it seems roll is being targeted too
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<apeiros_> I only see younnes
<shevy> oh yes
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<shevy> my fingers don't find the energy to properly type!
<apeiros_> though, roll called him youness too…
<apeiros_> whatever
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<shevy> yeah, somehow the bot hat -youness- and for a moment it looked as if ChanServ was talking to me
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<`|`roll> I want to write excellent ruby scriptz
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<fearoffish> `|`roll: step one is to learn to spell like an adult.
<fearoffish> ;-)
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<`|`roll> So where do i start?
<`|`roll> I want fully operational scriptz with good loops and breaks.
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<shevy> `|`roll hehe good loops?
<shevy> easiest way to loop:
<shevy> loop {
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<shevy> user_input = $stdin.gets.chomp
<shevy> break if user_input[0,1] == 'q'
<shevy> }
<`|`roll> Can I use foo ?
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<shevy> `|`roll you can use whatever name you like
<`|`roll> What about Coo ?
<shevy> `|`roll did you use scripting languages before?
<`|`roll> Is that allowed?
<shevy> `|`roll I mean by now it's clear you are trolling
<`|`roll> I tried rubyonrails
<shevy> no you did not
<fearoffish> indeed
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<`|`roll> i didnt?
<fearoffish> Took a while to see the 'Troll' in your name, how dumb are we ;-)
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<fearoffish> What an awesome way to spend your Friday. Your mum must be proud :)
<maxok> Hi, I have a question regarding ruby threads. I receive error: Thread (35) (ThreadError) too many threads. Is this due to the reason that I should force ruby to close the threads after finish, or does it do it automatically?
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<fearoffish> maxok: show us some code that's faulty
<`l`roll> I got an SQLi on my RUBY interface
<`l`roll> can I harden it?
<shevy> `l`roll, go away
<`l`roll> Can you help me secure my interface?
<`l`roll> I think I have SQLI on it?
<shevy> `l`roll, why are you still here?
<Hanmac> `l`roll ask Banistergalaxy :D
<`l`roll> Why is Ruby so insecure?
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<shevy> `l`roll you must leave now
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<`l`roll> FUCK
<`l`roll> FUCK
<`l`roll> FUCK
<`l`roll> FUCK
<`l`roll> YOU
<`l`roll> YOU
`l`roll was kicked from #ruby by seanstickle [`l`roll]
* shevy gives seanstickle a cookie
* fearoffish sighs
<seanstickle> So sad
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<maxok> fearoffish: It's a bit complicated to show the code. Can you please be so kind to inform me, after I do threads.join, does ruby close the threads after they are finished?
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<super_sid> Hi could someone help me out with this question on reading from sockets? http://stackoverflow.com/questions/13533382/how-to-read-from-a-tcpserver-socket-in-ruby-using-read-readpartial-and-read-non
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<fearoffish> maxok: no idea what 'threads' is, so I can't answer you. If x is a thread, and you call x.join then it will wait until that thread is finished before closing it, yes
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<arturaz> maxok, it should
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<gozes> Hello everyone
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<gozes> I just start it to use ctags with vim today and I was wandering.
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<gozes> If I generate ctags for ruby will it also ganerated the tags for the gemsets or will I have to append that to my tag file
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<ddd> you need to add gem-ctags
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<p4tux> h
<p4tux> hi
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<p4tux> I am working with vagrant-hostmaster gem, and trying to disable local modifications, so the method look like this: https://gist.github.com/4136884
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<p4tux> being new to ruby, I don not fully understand what is happening there, I if is just assigning true everytime the function goes there
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<p4tux> I would like to disable to get in process_local, I dont want to run any process_local
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<ninp0> Simple Ruby Script to Update All of Your Ubuntu Machines Securely Over SSH from One Central Location: http://hang4r.blogspot.com/2012/11/simple-script-to-update-all-of-your.html
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<alx-> hello - im looking to create a video slideshow out of a collection of images. is there a gem that can do that? has anyone done it before?
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<alex88> hi guys, I was going to learn a bit of ruby and what to have to get started with web development, frameworks or such.. any overview?
<seanstickle> alx-: Ruby not really needed for that
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<alx-> seanstickle: it works with ffmpeg, but i'm not sure how i can pass the list of images to it from a rails app
<seanstickle> shell out
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<alx-> seanstickle: thanks, ill try it out
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<Banistergalaxy> Apeiros sup JO bro
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<alex88> someone?
<shevy> what
<shevy> alex88 there are not so many choices. sinatra... or rails. sinatra is much smaller
<seanstickle> alex88: there you go'
<alex88> oh ok, thank you guys :)
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<shevy> alex88 it may be best to just stay in pure ruby alone, without any framework
<shevy> for a few weeks
<shevy> then you can transition into rails or sinatra or ramaze or... hmm
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<alex88> shevy, ok, thanks for the tip!
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<alex88> I'm trying the tryruby.org, what's the difference between array.sort and array.sort!
<alex88> ?
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<alex88> I don't get that
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<seanstickle> foo.sort leaves foo unchanged, just returns a copy of the array that is sorted
<seanstickle> foo.sort! changes foo into a sorted array
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<alex88> seanstickle, so with ! is like foo = foo.sort?
<seanstickle> yup
<alex88> seanstickle, thanks for explainig
<alex88> *explaining
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<deepgray> hi
<seanstickle> hoy
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<deepgray> http://pastie.org/5424640 why self.games instead @games = games ?
<deepgray> what difference, i understand taht @ - is instance variable.
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<Mon_Ouie> self.games = games calls the setter method #games=
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<Mon_Ouie> If you define that method with attr_(writer|accessor), it's the same thing as simply setting the ivar
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<Mon_Ouie> But that method could set the attribute completely differently
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<shevy> deepgray it's because they want to call the method
<shevy> and "games = games" alone wouldn't quite work for that
<deepgray> thx
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<deepgray> attr_accessor :games - creates instance variable?
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<shevy> deepgray do not get confused
<shevy> this is really a helper way
<shevy> it makes a reader for games, and a setter for games
<shevy> it is exactly as if you would do this:
<shevy> def games; @games; end
<shevy> and
<shevy> def games=(i); @games = i; end
<shevy> deepgray, you see?
<shevy> attr_accessor combines attr_reader and attr_writer, both of which do the above code each
<Mon_Ouie> As you can see, it defines *methods*. Those methods access an instance variable, but the instance variable itself is only created when you set it for the first time on each instance of your class.
<deepgray> yep, understand. thanks
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<shevy> imagine if this would use ruby
<seanstickle> Another package manager?
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<shevy> IN RuBY
<shevy> you are just not using ruby anymore seanstickle :(
<shevy> whoa
<shevy> unless I am mistaken, they use scheme ...
<shevy> :\
<shevy> (propagated-inputs `(("m4" ,m4)))
<shevy> hmm
<shevy> one can define a method like "propagated-inputs" in ruby? via .send perhaps?
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<seanstickle> shevy: I still use Ruby
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<shevy> test
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<toekutr> can anyone point me to a good explanation of metaclasses/metaprogramming in ruby?
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<havenn> Just wrote a blurb on Futures, thought I'd share cause I'm wallowing in idleness this holiday: https://gist.github.com/4137688
<havenn> toekutr: Very good video on the subject: http://mtnwestrubyconf2008.confreaks.com/11farley.html
<toekutr> thanks. my background is in lisp, and we do metaprogramming totally differently over there
<havenn> toekutr: For an esoteric discussion of metaprogramming there is the recent RubyRogues podcast as well: http://rubyrogues.com/080-rr-practical-metaprogramming-with-steven-harms/
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<havenn> I know I'm bored when I find myself adding Travis CI to a deck of cards: https://github.com/Havenwood/deck-of-cards
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<havenn> Was surprised how simple it is to get Code Climate and Travis CI hooked in.
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