#ruby on 2012-01-09 — irc logs at freenode.irclog.whitequark.org

2011-11-28 00:09 Topic for #ruby is now Ruby programming language || ruby-lang.org || RUBY SUMMER OF CODE! rubysoc.org/ || Paste >3 lines of text in http://pastie.org || Para a nossa audiencia em portugues http://ruby-br.org/

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00:48 <rottenrec1> does anyone know what the equivalent of "remote_file_exists"in the latest version of capistrano is?

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00:49 <rottenrec1> i need to check if a file (actually, a symlink to a directory) exists on the server in one of my hooks

00:49 <pabloh> rottenrec1: File.exists?

00:50 <rottenrec1> hrmm...

00:50 <rottenrec1> lemme try that

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00:51 <rottenrec1> pabloh: thanks, i think that worked

00:51 <pabloh> rottenrec1: np ;)

00:52 <rottenrec1> i woulda asked on the capsitrano channel, but i've been there like 10 times and i've never see anyone answer any questions

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01:16 <shevy> so who of you always wanted to write a package manager in ruby

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01:21 <oddmunds> for ruby or for something else?

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01:27 <shevy> oddmunds a general purpose one of course

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01:28 <shevy> for ruby there is already rubygems

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01:32 <ale`> what's the best way to get "SampleApp" out of "/path/to/sample_app" ?

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01:35 <shevy> ale` that would be twofold

01:35 <shevy> first, get the last part

01:35 <shevy> second, convert to camelcase

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01:36 <shevy> x = File.basename "/path/to/sample_app" # => "sample_app"

01:36 <shevy> and the second part to convert x to camelcase

01:37 <shevy> "sample_app".split('_').map { |_| _.capitalize }.join # => "SampleApp"

01:39 <ale`> shevy: yeah I was doing it that way actually... wondering if there was something ready :-)

01:39 <ale`> ahh

01:40 <ale`> thanks for the File.basename thing!

01:40 <ale`> I was doing it with a regex ^^;

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01:40 <shevy> yeah there are many ways to Rome

01:40 <shevy> regex is probably a bit slower though

01:42 <ale`> also uglier..

01:42 <ale`> does Dir.pwd return / separated paths on windows?

01:43 <ale`> if not, the regex I was using wouldn't work there

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01:43 <shevy> not sure

01:43 <shevy> I think it tends to work though

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01:44 <shevy> there is also ... File.join something

01:44 <shevy> File.join("path", "to", "join")

01:44 <shevy> "path/to/join"

01:44 <shevy> but

01:44 <shevy> it should not be necessary

01:44 <shevy> ale`, http://stackoverflow.com/questions/597488/how-to-do-a-safe-join-pathname-in-ruby

01:45 <shevy> if you need to know the separator, you can always use

01:45 <shevy> File::SEPARATOR

01:45 <rottenrec1> is there something like php.net's online manual for ruby? i.e. where you can search for a function/keyword (e.g. "operators", "variables", "scope") and it'll pull up a page with the documentation for that keyword?

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01:53 <ale`> shevy: thanks again :-)

01:54 <shevy> welcome

01:54 * ale` is on his way to emacs/watchr/rspec integration

01:54 <shevy> rottenrec1 hmm dont think so... i usually just google and the ruby doc shows up

01:54 <shevy> rottenrec1, for instance when I search for "ruby file join"

01:54 <shevy> the first result is:

01:54 <shevy> http://ruby-doc.org/core-1.9.3/File.html

01:54 <shevy> or, even before that, an intralink to:

01:55 <shevy> "Zu join springen?: join(string, ...)"

01:55 <shevy> silly german

01:55 <shevy> ^^^ means "Jump to join"

01:55 <shevy> and a link that I can click

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01:58 <banister`sleep> shevy: areyou my mommy

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02:10 <rottenrec1> shevy: I guess I'll just try that then

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02:41 <ale`> is there a way to do something like x,,y = [1,2,3] => x == 1, y == 3?

02:41 <ale`> I mean without littering with useless local vars

02:46 <shevy> ale` hmmm

02:47 <shevy> not really

02:47 <shevy> you could try something like ...

02:47 <shevy> x, *y = [1,2,3] perhaps

02:47 <shevy> y # => [2, 3]

02:47 <ale`> mhmh, how about x, _, y = [1,2,3]?

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02:48 <shevy> yeah

02:48 <shevy> it's still a local var though

02:48 <shevy> I love _ though

02:48 <ale`> It's the first time I use it... looks good for that :-)

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02:59 <thorncp> this seems to work: x,*,y = [1,2,3,4,5,6]

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03:01 <ale`> thorncp: interesting, I will keep in mind this one too

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03:02 <shevy> hmm straaange

03:03 <shevy> that really works???

03:03 <shevy> someone explain that to me then please :(

03:03 <shevy> hmm

03:03 <shevy> does not work in ruby 1.8.x

03:03 <shevy> I am relieved. :)

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04:20 <localredhead> NickServ

04:20 <localredhead> ls

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04:20 <localredhead> hello

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04:29 <zenergi> Is it possible to get the attachment size of an email without having to download the entire email/attachment?

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04:47 <nekid> how do I denote every third item in an array

04:48 <nekid> 2 & 2+3n?

04:48 <robyurkowski> 3n - 1

04:48 <robyurkowski> 0, 2, 5, 7

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04:49 <robyurkowski> 0 < n < !!!

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07:42 <ce_pemalu> sepi

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09:23 <andreime> how are variables passed in ruby to methods ? reference or copy ?

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09:35 <pigoz> andreime: copy like C, but everything is an object, so you copy the reference to the object

09:36 <andreime> pigoz: ok, so it would be ok to pass a big object as param to method

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09:42 <diverdude> hello. I am trying to run the command: bundle and i get this error: An error occured while installing nokogiri (1.5.0), and Bundler cannot continue. How can i see what this error is so that i can try to solve the issue?

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09:48 <diverdude> ok nevermind...i found the issue

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09:50 <luoluoluo> anyone here?

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09:57 <andreime> yes

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10:42 <clipartcat> ary = [1,2,3,4,5] why [] = ary[6,0], nil = ary[6] but nil = ary[7,0], nil = ary[7]

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10:45 <lenochka> hello, how can I use help in ruby?

10:46 <Okasu> lenochka: привет леночка

10:46 <Okasu> lol

10:46 <lenochka> whenever I enter some command there, it would say that the nothing is found

10:46 <Okasu> lenochka: use ri

10:46 <lenochka> privet! spasibo!

10:47 <lenochka> in irb?

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10:48 <Hanmac> nope use ri in the shell

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10:48 <lenochka> OK.. what about in irb? is there help?

10:49 <Hanmac> you can use object.methods to display all methods object has

10:50 <lenochka> OK, sounds useful

10:50 <lenochka> anything more specific? like some commands that would describe the method?

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10:50 <banister`sleep> Okasu: tell him about pry and show-doc

10:51 <Okasu> banister`sleep: stop it, im not belong to you!

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10:51 <banister`sleep> Okasu: i thought we were married

10:52 <Okasu> banister`sleep: it's all over now

10:52 * Okasu rub away and cry

10:53 <Okasu> banister`sleep: you alwayse been so rude

10:53 <Okasu> im not your personal toy, banister`sleep

10:53 <banister`sleep> Okasu: you used to beat me

10:53 <Okasu> banister`sleep: stop it, children may listen

10:54 <lenochka> Hanmac: so any specific command for description of the method?

10:54 <Hanmac> not in irb

10:55 <lenochka> all right then

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10:56 <Okasu> < banister`sleep> robgleeson: i love u

10:56 <Okasu> you cheating me!

10:56 <Okasu> dirty liar

10:57 <lenochka> would this ri work in cmd?

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11:00 <Okasu> lenochka: what do you mean?

11:00 <Okasu> just put ri *whatever* in your cmd and hit enter

11:00 <lenochka> hmm.. it gives all the time same result: nothing found .. bla bla

11:01 <Okasu> it should be method or module(class) name

11:01 <Okasu> ri puts

11:01 <Okasu> for example

11:02 <lenochka> Okasu: yes. of course :) I did put a method there.. i wonder if i would have to install something additionally

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12:01 <nobitanobi> Hi. I've a question about http://pastie.org/3153828 -- What would be the difference between the "tutorial" vs "mine" approach? Why would you use block when opening an URI?

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12:03 <rb2k> has anybody in here used the "grape" gem?

12:03 <rb2k> I have no idea how to use the authentication "middleware"?

12:03 <rb2k> it could be that it's a rack middleware

12:03 <rb2k> there are specs: https://github.com/intridea/grape/blob/master/spec/grape/middleware/auth/basic_spec.rb

12:03 <rb2k> but I can't say I understand the setup completely

12:03 <rb2k> :(

12:04 <Hanmac> nobitanobi: because you does not close the IO

12:05 <nobitanobi> but if I happen to do myfile.close that would be the same right?

12:06 <Hanmac> normaly yeah, but using a block does the stuff for you

12:06 <nobitanobi> I didn't know the block in that case "automatically" close the file

12:06 <nobitanobi> thanks Hanmac

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12:31 <coucher> hey all

12:31 <coucher> is there any way to install the required ruby version directly from the rvmrc file? Is that recommended or is it a bad idea?

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12:58 <adac> I do delete a file like this: File.delete("/root/bin/dumpcompare.log") however when tis file does not exist i get an error of course. What is a common way to avoid this error? just ceck previously if the file exists?

12:59 <workmad3> adac: yeah... File.delete(path) if File.exists?(path)

13:00 <adac> workmad3, thank you

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13:01 <Okasu> https://github.com/ryanb/ruby-warrior nice trainig for ruby beginner

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13:04 <`brendan> morning all

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13:08 <nobitanobi> anyone has by chance a good reading for a newbie that is trying to understand yield and blocks?

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13:12 <apeiros_> nobitanobi: consider yield a method call and the block the method you're calling

13:12 <apeiros_> and instead of 'return' you use 'next' in a block

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13:13 <nobitanobi> but if I do yield argument1,argument2 and then I do yield argument1,argument2,argument3 -> In the block, what should I expect? The max of parameters given by the yield right?

13:14 <apeiros_> just like with a method definition: foo do |arg1, arg2, *args|

13:14 <apeiros_> ruby is more forgiving wrt arguments passed to blocks, though

13:14 <apeiros_> I suggest you fire up irb and test a bit :)

13:15 <nobitanobi> yes thanks. I'm reading this http://www.robertsosinski.com/2008/12/21/understanding-ruby-blocks-procs-and-lambdas/ - it's helping too

13:15 <nobitanobi> :)

13:15 <nobitanobi> it's just weird to me the use of blocks in methods and having yield as a "pipe" between both

13:16 <apeiros_> it's not weirder than any other method you call ;-)

13:16 <workmad3> nobitanobi: it's just like a normal method, apart from the location where it is defined

13:17 <shevy> hey nobitanobi

13:17 <nobitanobi> ok, I think it will take a little bit to digest it :P

13:17 <nobitanobi> hi shevy, how are you?

13:17 <shevy> were you able to find a solution to the rescue-retry thing you were looking?

13:17 <shevy> dunno, kinda tired. stayed up for too long, slept only 5 hours

13:17 <nobitanobi> yes I did, thanks shevy

13:18 <shevy> cool

13:18 <shevy> you learn fast!

13:18 <nobitanobi> not really... But I really like Ruby so far, so I'm enjoying it

13:18 <nobitanobi> going to have lunch now, talk to you later guys, thanks for the help

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13:52 <catphish> what is the best multithreaded rack server?

13:52 <catphish> i usually use unicorn, but he has no threading

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13:54 <csmrfx> wait, what

13:57 <shevy> hehe

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15:03 <apeiros_> catphish: errr? and why'd you prefer threading over forking?

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15:05 <catphish> apeiros_: that's a good question

15:05 <catphish> and not one i have a good answer to :)

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15:07 <catphish> i'd prefer to have both

15:07 <catphish> several multithreaded forks

15:07 ascarter_ [ascarter_!~ascarter@64.122.126.156] has joined #ruby

15:07 <catphish> in order to maximize SMP but reduce overhead for long-running clients

15:08 <catphish> which i believe is the model that apache httpd uses

15:08 robyurkowski [robyurkowski!~robyurkow@64.254.250.82] has joined #ruby

15:08 <catphish> on a well configured day

15:11 <apeiros_> it's also a great way to get tripped up over race conditions and other concurrency issues…

15:11 <catphish> only if your app isn't thread safe

15:12 v0n [v0n!~v4n@2607:fad8:4:0:21e:8cff:fe4d:2f7d] has joined #ruby

15:12 <catphish> and ruby does make that astonishingly easy

15:13 <workmad3> apeiros_: threading is a bit lower overhead afaik, and easier to share information between compared to processes iirc

15:14 <workmad3> multi-process is great if everything can be run isolated

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15:19 <catphish> all this is true

15:20 <catphish> but doesn't strictly answer my question :)

15:20 <catphish> though if forking is memory-cheap enough i may just stick with a big pack of unicorns

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15:23 <apeiros_> workmad3: theoretically, if ruby didn't use a somewhat fucked up memory layout, forking would be very low overhead, thanks to COW

15:24 <apeiros_> but yes, I think even pthreads are still less overhead than a fork

15:26 cfrugard [cfrugard!~cfrugard@69.64.196.98] has joined #ruby

15:26 <cfrugard> hello?

15:26 FND_ [FND_!~FND@p57B3A52E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ruby

15:26 <cfrugard> have a question regarding opening files in ruby

15:27 pietro [pietro!~pietro@2-227-162-47.ip187.fastwebnet.it] has joined #ruby

15:27 <FND_> assuming I create a gem, can that gem somehow get to its own name (without manually parsing the gemspec)

15:27 <cfrugard> can anyone hear me?

15:28 <apeiros_> cfrugard: yes, we can read you

15:28 <cfrugard> excellent

15:28 <cfrugard> I got a dump of a ton of files from someone

15:28 <cfrugard> that have a random structure, somewhat

15:29 <apeiros_> catphish: I'm unaware of a forking + threading server for ruby

15:29 <cfrugard> the last directory title is arbitrary

15:29 <catphish> what about a good threading server?

15:29 <cfrugard> I need to be able to locate a file and open in using something like File.read("/path/to/file/*/file.txt")

15:30 virunga [virunga!~virunga@151.64.22.171] has joined #ruby

15:30 <catphish> i want something to pitch against unicorn and see what's faster / more maintainable

15:30 <cfrugard> where I cannot be certain of the last directory name

15:30 alse [alse!~Alex@108.162.180.72] has joined #ruby

15:30 <catphish> my app is very small and i hope very threadsafe

15:30 <workmad3> cfrugard: is it definitely only going to exist in one subdir?

15:30 <cfrugard> and there is always one directory there

15:31 <cfrugard> warkmad3: yes

15:31 <workmad3> cfrugard: if so, then File.read(Dir["/path/to/file/**/file.txt"].first)

15:31 araujo [araujo!~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #ruby

15:31 mmokrysz [mmokrysz!~mmokrysz@pdpc/supporter/student/mmokrysz] has joined #ruby

15:31 <cfrugard> awesome, many thanks workmad3!

15:32 <cfrugard> couldnt find it online

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15:32 <apeiros_> catphish: use thin and write your own?

15:33 <catphish> i thought thin was a server

15:33 <catphish> what would i need to write?

15:33 <cfrugard> worked

15:35 cakery [cakery!~cakery@gatekeeper-ext.zeus.com] has joined #ruby

15:36 <cakery> any help? http://dpaste.com/684502/

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15:41 <confounds> cakery the problem is that `initialize': can't convert URI::HTTP into String (TypeError)

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15:43 <catphish> Net::HTTP.new doesn't accept a URL

15:43 <catphish> try passing it uri.host and uri.port

15:43 <catphish> iirc

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15:45 <cakery> catphish, put I don't have them separately, shall I just split on ':'?

15:45 Ankhers [Ankhers!~user@76-10-149-67.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #ruby

15:45 <catphish> no

15:45 davidboy [davidboy!u3228@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hqsdnefwrebnwwhn] has joined #ruby

15:45 <catphish> uri is a URI model

15:45 <catphish> you gave it a string

15:45 kenperkins [kenperkins!~textual@50-47-18-37.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #ruby

15:45 <confounds> reading the api could help

15:45 <catphish> and it will split it for you

15:45 <cakery> ahhh

15:46 <workmad3> cakery: URI.parse(uri)

15:46 <catphish> read http://www.ruby-doc.org/stdlib-1.9.3/libdoc/net/http/rdoc/Net/HTTP.html and http://www.ruby-doc.org/stdlib-1.9.3/libdoc/uri/rdoc/URI.html

15:47 <cakery> all working now, thanks :) - i'll read the docs

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15:51 <nhance> Is there a way to share rspec spec/support files across gems?

15:51 <nhance> I have a gem I'm using and I would really like to use the test fixtures it provides in the app that requires the gem

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15:59 nobitanobi [nobitanobi!~novito@103.Red-213-96-26.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ruby

15:59 <nobitanobi> hi

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16:07 <leex> hi everyone, i am trying to write a crypttcpsocket: https://gist.github.com/1583528 but send(:sym,..) seems not to work on sockets (just guessing it was overwritten somewhere to send "a", 0) so my implementation of method missing doesn't work, every idea on how to fix it would be welcome.

16:08 jergason [jergason!~jergason@128.187.186.67] has joined #ruby

16:08 <workmad3> leex: __send__

16:08 <leex> workmad3: works ;)

16:08 <leex> workmad3: thanks!

16:08 <workmad3> leex: if you ever encounter anything that overrides __send__... shout at them ;)

16:09 <Mon_Ouie> Or any method that starts with two underscores actually

16:09 * leex shouts at everyone responsible for writing the tcpsockets ;)

16:09 <Tasser> leex, ah well, #send may be overwritten

16:10 quest88 [quest88!~quest88@c-98-207-205-137.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #ruby

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16:11 ferbass [ferbass!~ferbass@187.81.223.112] has joined #ruby

16:11 <leex> Tasser: yes, that's the problem and __send__ fixes it, didn't know the __functions__ existed

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16:16 <jroes> I have a method that takes a method name and a value as an argument. I need to create several setters that redirect to this method. how would I go about doing this? method_missing?

16:17 <cakery> how do i make a request with https in 1.8.7? i was following the docs but I think it's changed since

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16:23 emocakes [emocakes!~om@200-181-185-157.mganm703.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #ruby

16:23 <nobitanobi> I've a question... When we say "everything is an object in ruby", are we saying "if statement" is an object too?

16:24 carlyle [carlyle!~carlyle@216.133.69.20] has joined #ruby

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16:24 <Hanmac> not realy ...

16:24 <nobitanobi> then, what is it?

16:24 <billy_ran_away> Can anyone help me get this test to pass? https://github.com/billy-ran-away/maskable_attribute/commit/8c2d0bed336352a39926bcf7e5d1fe0c89abd4a5#commitcomment-844393

16:25 <workmad3> nobitanobi: it's code

16:25 <emocakes> its an operation nobitanobi...

16:25 <emocakes> lol

16:25 <emocakes> honestly, what kind of question is that?

16:25 <billy_ran_away> I'm trying to make a Rails plugin and I need to figure out the ActiveRecord instance that's calling this method...

16:26 <nobitanobi> it's a question from a rookie who has read "in ruby everything is an Object".

16:27 <nobitanobi> sorry if my question disturb you emocakes

16:27 <emocakes> you should be

16:27 lkba [lkba!~AndChat@acol243.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #ruby

16:27 <leex> emocakes: LISP?

16:27 <emocakes> but think of it this way, if if was an object, what difference would it make?

16:28 <leex> nobitanobi: don't be offended, it not a dumb question

16:28 <nobitanobi> I'm not looking for any kind of difference. It was just a curiosity

16:28 <emocakes> sorry for being rude then

16:28 <nobitanobi> don't be sorry, is your own problem :)

16:30 _solomon [_solomon!~solomon@216-80-83-169.c3-0.arm-ubr1.chi-arm.il.cable.rcn.com] has joined #ruby

16:30 <nobitanobi> "In Ruby, everything is an object. Every bit of information and code can be given their own properties and actions" -- from here http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/about/

16:31 _0biJuan [_0biJuan!~ysiad1@24.39.125.227] has joined #ruby

16:33 <Mon_Ouie> In Ruby code isn't represented as objects, and there are loops and conditionals that aren't method calls

16:34 <nobitanobi> ok Mon_Ouie, then I suppose that "every bit of information and code" is a bit too much :/

16:34 <emocakes> marketing nobitanobi

16:34 <emocakes> :p

16:34 <emocakes> RUBY IS MAGIC

16:35 josefig [josefig!~josefig@unaffiliated/josefig] has joined #ruby

16:35 <workmad3> Mon_Ouie: hmm... doesn't rubinius give you access to a lot more of the ruby code in the form of objects?

16:35 <catphish> i really should learn how ruby works

16:36 <workmad3> catphish: magic and bottled unicorns

16:36 <Mon_Ouie> Even then, that's not quite part of the language

16:36 <Hanmac> yeah ... very black magic :P

16:36 <Mon_Ouie> They have methods to access the bytecode from a method or block

16:36 <catphish> some kind of node tree and bytecode afaik

16:37 <workmad3> catphish: oh, in that sense... the interpreter generates an abstract syntax tree, which is then walked to produce bytecode. The bytecode is then executed in the VM

16:37 <workmad3> (in 1.8, the AST is executed directly, no bytecode compilation or VM)

16:37 <workmad3> 1.8 == 1.8 MRI

16:38 ascarter_ [ascarter_!~ascarter@209.119.253.66] has joined #ruby

16:38 <catphish> is the AST on a per-method basis?

16:38 <catphish> which is then linked?

16:39 luckyruby [luckyruby!~luckyruby@rrcs-24-129-162-10.se.biz.rr.com] has joined #ruby

16:39 <workmad3> hmm... not sure on that front... my interest ran out after ASTs, vms and bytecode :)

16:39 <shevy> nobitanobi in syntax of course not always is an object involved

16:39 <leex> can anyone answer yet another question: https://gist.github.com/1583528 works fine until i remove the comment from line 35 and thereby inlcude a module which overwrites functions and somehow method_missing doesn't work correctly anymore, can anyone explain me why?

16:40 <nobitanobi> yep shevy that's what it seems :) I was just impressed by that sentence in the official Ruby page :)

16:41 <shevy> what I also wonder is if messages are objects or not

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16:42 <workmad3> leex: what do you mean 'doesn't work correctly'?

16:42 <leex> ofcourse i could change my implementation of cryptsocket, but that would be nice OO

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16:44 <leex> workmad3: if I run the code, puts and gets (from the cryptpus module) aren't executed correctly (or let's say: in the way i wan't it wo work)

16:44 <workmad3> leex: that's not enough explanation... what happens with them?

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16:46 <leex> workmad3: well good question, that's what I am not sure about, I don't know what super in in module that is included in a class calls

16:47 mikewintermute [mikewintermute!~mikewinte@188-223-213-21.zone14.bethere.co.uk] has joined #ruby

16:48 <workmad3> leex: it restarts the method lookup at the next point in the ancestor chain

16:48 <leex> workmad3: module B; def puts str; super str + "ohai"; end; class A; include B; and then the method missing part; end;

16:48 <leex> workmad3: where do I find a good documentation about the ancestor chain?

16:48 <workmad3> leex: just call SomeClass.ancestors

16:49 charlenopires_ [charlenopires_!~quassel@186.194.13.186] has joined #ruby

16:49 <workmad3> leex: also, be wary of gets and puts... they are defined on Kernel, so chances are every object has them

16:50 <leex> workmad3: ok

16:50 <workmad3> leex: or, in other words, with gets and puts, method_missing will likely never be called ;)

16:51 <leex> in my decorator it does call them correctly, until i try to write these function myself in a module

16:52 luckyruby [luckyruby!~luckyruby@rrcs-24-129-162-10.se.biz.rr.com] has joined #ruby

16:52 <workmad3> leex: could be that method_missing takes over with a private method call too... but inside your module the private version is accessible

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16:55 <leex> workmad3: ok, I will debug a but, and if I can't figure it out. I will try to ask a better (more informative) question, thanks

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16:56 <catphish> is there a good reason why in ruby local methods and local variables use the same syntax, that ambiguity is the one thing that upsets me about coding ruby

16:57 <workmad3> catphish: any suggestions as to how they could be differentiated?

16:57 <workmad3> catphish: also, I'd suggest that if it causes problems, your methods are too long ;)

16:57 <catphish> yes, make self.method work as method does

16:57 <catphish> and enforce its use

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16:58 <workmad3> catphish: bleh, then you end up with more verbose and nastier looking code

16:58 <catphish> yes, but its not ambiguous :(

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16:59 <workmad3> catphish: I rarely find it ambiguous... if I do, then it's because I've got a method where I can't easily see it all at once and so can't see all the local vars

16:59 <Hanmac> then you can do it in your code, but leave otheres alone if there dont want to do that

16:59 <shevy> catphish well then you would also have to use object.method_call()

16:59 <workmad3> catphish: apart from the obvious self.field = ... flaw (that one is annoying I'll admit)

17:00 <shevy> catphish which also works. but there is one strong argument, if you write 100000 lines of code in ruby, the shorter variants are almost always better

17:00 <catphish> object.method_call sounds horrific :)

17:00 <_solomon> I'm trying to get the length of audio files (in seconds). Does anyone know how to do this? Most files will be mp3, but possibly some other audio types.

17:01 <shevy> catphish dont mind the name, just the () vs. omitting them

17:01 <shevy> _solomon if you can use ffmpeg, sure! :>

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17:01 <catphish> yeah, i use () to differentiate, does that actually tell the interpreter it's a method?

17:01 <Sir_Rai> What is the best way to manage Web Services on different versions of ruby to start? I have created aliases that replace the corresponding binary versions, so I can reasly run: ruby-switch19 or ruby-switch18. My workflow is a bit toucheggs: 1. (switch to ruby 19 -> start nginx that runs the ruby 1.9 app.) 2. (What is the best way to launch this ruby app 1.8 with nginx or apache? how are you guys managing that?

17:02 <_solomon> shevy, I'm on heroku, so using ffmpeg is tough...

17:02 <catphish> sadly there's no similar way to say it's not a method

17:02 <shevy> hmm

17:02 <catphish> personally i love self.method but that doesn't do a local call sadly

17:02 <shevy> _solomon for mp3 there is some ruby library ... http://ruby-mp3info.rubyforge.org/

17:02 <workmad3> catphish: () does indeed tell ruby that it's a method

17:02 <shevy> catphish yeah I think so, it will probably not go through the "ambiguity" checking

17:03 <shevy> perhaps using () is faster :P

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17:03 <_solomon> shevy, I checked it out, the only issue is it only supports mp3's...

17:03 <catphish> the problem comes when you're using 'variable' and if someone forgets to define it, you call a method instead

17:03 <workmad3> catphish: don't forget to define it then :P

17:04 <shevy> _solomon well. ffmpeg is sweet. I am not sure how else you want to solve things :) but with ffmpeg .. I just match to the duration info .match(/Duration: (\d\d:\d\d:\d\d.\d\d)/)[1]

17:04 <workmad3> catphish: I personally don't see why a language should cater for carelessness or stupidity ;)

17:04 <catphish> i mostly just hate reading people's code and not knowing where to look when they've used for example 'id'

17:04 eywu [eywu!~Adium@205-170-107-4.dia.static.qwest.net] has joined #ruby

17:04 <catphish> especially in rails where it can be a method_missing

17:04 <shevy> yeah catphish I also hate reading other people's code

17:04 <_solomon> cool, thanks shevy, I'm going to do some more research to see what others are doing on heroku with ffmpeg...

17:05 <shevy> my rule of thumb is when I see a lot of metaprogramming shit, I throw it away

17:05 <shevy> I think the only project I use dynamic methods generation is a configuration object that supports both object['foo'] and object.foo

17:06 <shevy> but I wonder how to simplify it, because it seems as if it may be a somewhat common pattern, compared to other things

17:06 ascarter_ [ascarter_!~ascarter@74.211.208.178] has joined #ruby

17:06 <workmad3> catphish: yeah, reading someone elses code can be bad if it's not nicely written... however, if you have 5 lines of code and none of them are 'id = something' then you know in less than 1s that a call to 'id' is a method call, not a local var ;)

17:06 <catphish> one man's valuable abstraction is another man's meta-shit

17:06 <shevy> (hmm and be able to specify the action you want to do on your own, when object.foo does not exist.)

17:06 <catphish> workmad3: true, thats ok when methods are short

17:06 <workmad3> catphish: I try to refactor when methods get longer than about 10 lines

17:07 <shevy> workmad3 usually, when I see ruby code that is not bundled into a class, I tend to throw it away

17:07 <catphish> i write a fair bit of binary parsing

17:07 <catphish> those methods get long

17:07 <catphish> with a lot of local vars

17:07 <catphish> though unpack is certainly a blessing

17:08 froy [froy!~troy@manuel.dublan.net] has joined #ruby

17:08 <Tasser> is unpack contextfree?

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17:08 <workmad3> shevy: you throw away modules? :P

17:08 <catphish> unpack does does a lot of work in almost no code :)

17:08 <shevy> workmad3 hmm not really. but I think they are crippled classes anyway. I dont like the concept behind modules, it feels anti-synchron to the whole subclass model too

17:09 <shevy> *anti-synchronimy-something ...

17:09 * shevy wants to coin a new word...

17:09 <workmad3> shevy: hmm, I much prefer building up with modules over extensive subclassing

17:10 <workmad3> shevy: subclassing is a much stricter relationship... adding in a module is more 'this has some bit of functionality' as opposed to 'this is a ThingAMaBob'

17:10 * catphish recommends finded - a new past tense spelling of find

17:10 cjlicata [cjlicata!~carlyle@70.43.205.70.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #ruby

17:12 <catphish> i still don't understand the difference between a module and a class

17:12 <shevy> catphish yeah. basically you can do more things with a class than you can with a module

17:13 <catphish> except that modules can be included in classes, but are also used as containers for classes

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17:13 <catphish> confusing? i think so

17:13 <shevy> yeah

17:13 <Tasser> catphish, Class.is_a? Module

17:13 <Tasser> => true

17:13 <shevy> you can also use class as namespace though

17:13 <shevy> class Foo

17:13 <shevy> class Bar

17:13 <workmad3> shevy: you can extend or mixin multiple modules into a module or class, but can only inherit from one class in a class

17:13 Tomasso [Tomasso!~papito@186.23.14.175] has joined #ruby

17:13 <Tasser> catphish, oh, and the other way too :-)

17:13 <shevy> yup workmad3 I find this extremely annoying

17:13 <catphish> but why have both?

17:13 robotmay [robotmay!~robotmay@94.30.13.228] has joined #ruby

17:13 <shevy> but when I realized that modules are more limited than classes, I switched to use more classes

17:14 <workmad3> catphish: because it allows multiple inheritance of implementation using mixin modules without introducing the 'diamond of death' of full-blown multiple inheritance

17:14 <shevy> what I do with modules mostly these days is ... collect some CONSTANTS... a few not so important methods perhaps ... and use it as general namespace for a project

17:15 <workmad3> shevy: I'm switching the other way... modules are fantastic ways to compose objects :)

17:15 <shevy> been there, tried it, didn't work for me :)

17:15 <workmad3> shevy: especially once you find out that you can do 'super if defined?(super)' to pass up the chain rather than the whole crap of alias method chaining

17:16 <shevy> that looks ugly!

17:16 <workmad3> shevy: it's not as ugly as doing this_method_without_this_feature

17:16 <shevy> see catphish? that's ruby, noone can agree on common things

17:16 <catphish> i use modules as containers for classes, and for modules, but those 2 things seem conflicting

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17:16 <workmad3> shevy: which is what you'd do with an alias method chain to wrap around a method call to extend it

17:16 <shevy> try classes as containers for classes catphish :D

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17:19 <workmad3> shevy: sounds like you'd be right at home in java btw ;) they like nice big class hierarchies over there :P

17:19 <shevy> nah

17:19 <workmad3> </strawman>

17:19 <shevy> java is verbose for no need

17:19 <shevy> I try to be as terse as possible, when that is possible

17:20 <catphish> i would probably like java

17:20 <workmad3> shevy: ah, perl it is then ;)

17:20 Vaevictus [Vaevictus!~vae@184.91.160.244] has joined #ruby

17:20 <shevy> yeah, the idea is nice, but perl is simply unreadable when it is terse

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17:20 SegFaultAX|work [SegFaultAX|work!~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #ruby

17:20 <Vaevictus> i was trying to use gem just a bit ago on my ubuntu lts server... and it's failing trying to require 'thread'

17:21 <shevy> catphish but java really is way too verbose

17:21 <shevy> it is as if the whole language is designed around the sell-programs-to-client-for-lines-of-code-written

17:21 <catphish> lol

17:21 <Vaevictus> shevy - it's better to say that the optimal readability level of perl is both less terse than ruby and less terse than it can be :D

17:21 <catphish> my coding style is pretty verbose anyway

17:22 <shevy> someon on #ruby-lang gave a nice example but I dont remember who :(

17:22 <shevy> yeah Vaevictus

17:22 <catphish> i suspect it would be much the same in java

17:22 <shevy> what perl lacked back then was probably competition from other languages

17:22 <catphish> i don't tend to make use of inject and friends

17:22 <Vaevictus> shevy - and a nice standard html interpretation layer

17:22 <shevy> growing a new language is hard, look at how difficult it is for Io http://iolanguage.com/ to gain any adoption

17:23 <Vaevictus> shevy: it had not particular focus areas: it wasn't a scripting language... it was a specific purpose language designed to do everything.

17:23 <shevy> hehe

17:23 palcu [palcu!~alex@89.122.187.223] has joined #ruby

17:23 <shevy> then PHP came along and kicked its butt!

17:23 <Vaevictus> alongside perl, php did most things horribly (see php4) and destroyed perl in use for it's simple asp mode

17:23 alse [alse!~Alex@108.162.180.72] has joined #ruby

17:24 <Vaevictus> shevy: very few mature coders migrated from perl to php :D

17:24 <shevy> yup the fossil C hackers still use perl

17:24 SegFault1X|work [SegFault1X|work!~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #ruby

17:24 <Vaevictus> shevy: no, fossil C hackers still use C

17:24 <shevy> though I think quite some use python these days

17:24 adeponte [adeponte!~adeponte@67.110.253.162.ptr.us.xo.net] has joined #ruby

17:24 <Vaevictus> and they're still good at it

17:24 <catphish> i'd be interested to write some stuff in java to see how it compares to ruby

17:24 <shevy> Vaevictus, the combination of perl & C is still not too uncommon, look at the git bindings using perl. I dont think they do that just because perl would be faster than python or ruby

17:25 <Vaevictus> anyone have an FAQ as to why rubygems doesn't work on my ubuntu due to thread ?

17:25 <catphish> in principal it seems pretty similare

17:25 <shevy> catphish, just that it is more verbose and lacks things like blocks

17:25 <shevy> then there is the Factory Factory joke

17:25 bier_ [bier_!~bier@p54A5AB6C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ruby

17:25 <shevy> create a factory first before making another factory

17:25 <Vaevictus> java's statically typed too, isn't it?

17:26 <catphish> isn't ruby exceptionally statically typed?

17:26 <shevy> what means statically typed

17:26 <Vaevictus> lol

17:26 <shevy> protected List<AbstraktesFahrzeug> fahrzeuge = new ArrayList<AbstraktesFahrzeug>();

17:26 <catphish> A programming language is said to use static typing when type checking is performed during compile-time as opposed to run-time

17:26 csavola [csavola!~csavola@76-10-149-67.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #ruby

17:26 <catphish> so i suppose ruby isn't

17:27 TomJ_ [TomJ_!~TomJ@88.96.227.182] has joined #ruby

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17:27 <shevy> well there is no compile time in ruby?

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17:27 <catphish> as you can pass anything to anything

17:27 <Vaevictus> catphish: not even close

17:27 <catphish> shevy: yes there is

17:27 <Vaevictus> shevy: yes, there is, it's just at runtime :D

17:27 <shevy> ok so all languages are compiled then

17:27 <Nowaker> ruby is not statically typed

17:27 <Nowaker> but is STRONG typed

17:27 <catphish> and yes, i see now

17:27 <Nowaker> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_typing

17:28 <catphish> i was thinking about strong typed, it not the mush that is PHP typing

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17:29 <workmad3> catphish: or C typing... that's lovely and weak :)

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17:29 <catphish> is it?

17:30 <catphish> i thought C was pretty inflexible in its array types

17:30 <catphish> whereas numeric types you take your chances

17:30 <catphish> no blocks in java? :(

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17:31 <Vaevictus> catphish: "array types" ... C has blocks of memory. you can do with them as you wish

17:31 <workmad3> catphish: C, you can cast anything to anything because you can cast anything to a void* pointer and a void* pointer to anything

17:31 <catphish> ah

17:32 <Tasser> Vaevictus, C is a domain-specific language for modifing the registers of a von-neumann machine ;-)

17:32 <Mon_Ouie> You can't cast a struct {int x, y; } into a void*

17:32 <Vaevictus> Tasser: ^_^

17:32 devdazed [devdazed!~russ_nyc@static-96-239-59-191.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #ruby

17:32 <catphish> i had real trouble trying to cast a string into a long in C when i tried

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17:32 <Mon_Ouie> A string is just a pointer in C

17:32 <arpegius> how can i check if a variable is of a certain type? something like myvar.is_time ?

17:32 ph^ [ph^!~ph^@cm-84.212.225.74.getinternet.no] has joined #ruby

17:33 <Mon_Ouie> If you want to actually convert it you need to call a function

17:33 <Vaevictus> life is just a pointer

17:33 <Vaevictus> Mon_Ouie: bah. convert it yourself :D

17:33 berserkr [berserkr!~david@212.122.111.205.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #ruby

17:33 <catphish> indeed, and i couldn't seem to take the destination of that pointer and turn it into a long

17:33 <catphish> but maybe i was doing it wrong :)

17:33 badabim [badabim!~badabim@17.212.166.202] has joined #ruby

17:33 <Mon_Ouie> The destination of that pointer is a char, the first character of your string

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17:34 <catphish> it is indeed, but making a long that started at that first char seemed tricky

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17:34 <Vaevictus> if (0x30 <= c <= 0x39) { c = c - 0x30; } ...

17:35 devdazed [devdazed!~russ_nyc@static-96-239-59-191.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #ruby

17:35 <Okasu> [1,2,3].inject(Hash.new(Array.new)) do |hash, item| hash[item] << item; hash end

17:35 <Mon_Ouie> And multiply by 10^i (if starting from the end of the string)

17:35 <Okasu> why it returns empty hash?

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17:35 <Mon_Ouie> Because you didn't add any key

17:36 <catphish> Okasu: because you keep making a new hash

17:36 devdazed [devdazed!~devdazed@static-96-239-59-191.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #ruby

17:36 <Mon_Ouie> No, he doesn't

17:36 _debo_ [_debo_!~marco.deb@141.0.34.138] has joined #ruby

17:36 <catphish> oh, no, ignore me :(

17:36 <catphish> i'm going home now

17:36 <Mon_Ouie> There's only one hash, and two arrays. The one used as the default value of the hash, and [1, 2, 3]

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17:36 <Mon_Ouie> Since it's a default value, it isn't added to the hash when you access it

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17:37 <Mon_Ouie> And you most likely don't want Hash.new(Array.new)

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17:38 <catphish> i didn't know Hash.new accepted an array

17:38 <catphish> does that actually do something useful?

17:38 <catphish> if its populated?

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17:39 <Hanmac> hihihi i knew the failure :P

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17:39 <Mon_Ouie> It's used as a default value

17:39 <Mon_Ouie> It accepts any object

17:39 <Mon_Ouie> And a block which will be called when an empty keys is accessed

17:40 <Mon_Ouie> Which is most likely what should be used here

17:40 <Hanmac> hash[item] << item; is bad in this content, hash[item] += [item]; is a little better

17:40 <Okasu> [1,2,3].inject(Hash.new) { |hash, item| hash[item] ||= []; hash[item] << item; hash }

17:40 <Okasu> worjs fine thx

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17:41 <Mon_Ouie> It's not bad

17:41 alfism [alfism!~alfism@2620:149:4:1201:f95d:9746:6c44:80a4] has joined #ruby

17:41 <Mon_Ouie> Hash.new { |h, k| h[k] = [] }

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18:15 <toy_battery> when does it make sense to have a custom class that includes enumerable for holding data vs an array

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18:17 <soulcutter> toy_battery: when you want to encapsulate behavior for a certain collection of data

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18:19 <toy_battery> so something that holds nodes in a document would make sense for that case

18:20 <toy_battery> so what should ensure only certain types of data go in that container?

18:21 <toy_battery> the container itself or the object holding the container?

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18:22 <toy_battery> iow i'm adding more nodes to the document, should the document class control what goes in?

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18:24 <davidcelis> The container should control what it allows inside

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18:25 <davidcelis> The object doesn't need to know if it can be contained; it'll be told if it can or can't by the container

18:27 <toy_battery> ok so if class B has a class C for holding data, class C validates what is allowed in or class B?

18:27 <davidcelis> whichever is the container

18:28 <davidcelis> class C is a container for class B? class C does the validating

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18:28 <toy_battery> class B represents the document class C represents a container of document nodes for example

18:29 <davidcelis> So you have... Document, DocumentNode, and DocumentNodeCollection or something?

18:29 <toy_battery> right

18:29 <davidcelis> DocumentNodeCollection should verify that what is being added is a DocumentNode

18:30 <davidcelis> and if it's not a document node, it should probably raise a custom exception

18:30 <Hanmac> or if possible turn the object into an document node

18:30 <toy_battery> ok that makes alot of sense

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18:31 <toy_battery> Hanmac: how would you go about doing that?

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18:33 <Hanmac> i dont know ... i know how to do it with color objects or Vectors (x,y)

18:33 <Hanmac> but you could accespt a string and then parse it to an Node

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18:35 <toy_battery> i like that idea of parsing a string

18:35 <Hanmac> and i like duck typing :P

18:35 <toy_battery> so is there a naming convention used for the custom data containers ie DocumentNodeSet, DocumentNodeCollection, DocumentNodeList?

18:36 <toy_battery> i like duck typing to

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18:36 <Hanmac> nope i think both are okay ... but for xml stuff i prefer nokogriri :P

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18:37 <toy_battery> yeah i like how nokogiri does DocumentNodeSet

18:37 <davidcelis> toy_battery: depends on what it is

18:37 <davidcelis> if it's a Set, i'd expect it to not allow dupilicate items

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18:37 <davidcelis> the other two, i suppose, are roughly the same

18:37 <toy_battery> good point, ie the mathematical idea of a set

18:37 <nobitanobi> I've a question regarding ranges and cover method. If I do test = "AA".."ZZ" why does test.cover? "ABC" turn to be "true"?

18:38 <nobitanobi> is it because it covers "AB" from "ABC" ? :/

18:39 <davidcelis> nobitanobi: maybe it's only taking the first two characters of ABC into account?

18:39 <davidcelis> like, sorting-wise or something?

18:39 <nobitanobi> Is this how cover works though? "Returns true if obj is between beg and end, i.e beg <= obj <= end (or end exclusive when exclude_end? is true)."

18:40 <nobitanobi> I don't think "ABC" is betwen "AA" - "BB"

18:40 <davidcelis> ah

18:40 <davidcelis> yes

18:40 <davidcelis> try both of those conditionals with "AA", "ABC", and "AZ"

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18:41 <davidcelis> "ABC" does come inbetween "AA" and "AZ" because "A" >= "A" and "B" is >= "Z"

18:41 <davidcelis> er, "B" is <= "Z"

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18:42 <davidcelis> it will only check the first two characters of "ABC" because the range only covers the first two

18:42 <nobitanobi> oh ok...

18:43 <nobitanobi> davidcelis: How do you explain then that: newrange = "A".."X" - newrange.cover? "X" --> true // newrange.cover? "XX" --> false

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18:45 <toy_battery> because it doesn't cover 'xx'

18:45 <toy_battery> err 'XX'

18:46 <toy_battery> ('a'..'zz').cover? 'xx' #=> true

18:48 <Mon_Ouie> "XX" > "X", the longest string is considered as the greatest by String#<=> in that case

18:48 <nobitanobi> oh ok!

18:48 <toy_battery> 'a','b','c'...'aa','ab','ac'... so 'xx' is not in ('a'..'z')

18:49 <toy_battery> yeah because 'xx' comes after 'x'

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18:49 <nobitanobi> but then why ('a'..'x') covers ax? isn't ax > x ?

18:49 wyhaines [wyhaines!~wyhaines@65.39.118.15] has joined #ruby

18:49 <Mon_Ouie> No, because "a" is before "x"

18:49 <phus> im a unix sysadmin should I learn ruby or python

18:49 <toy_battery> hmm

18:50 <Mon_Ouie> Also notice cover? is not the same as include?

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18:51 <Mon_Ouie> include? will iterate over the range and see if any element is equal to the argument, cover? is merely arg >= begin && arg <= end (and checking if the end is included in the range)

18:52 <Hanmac> phus: i think python is more usefull for an admin, but i like ruby more

18:52 <phus> Hanmac, that's whatI thought too thanks

18:53 <toy_battery> both are nice languages, just play around with each of them to see which one you like most

18:53 <toy_battery> i stuck with ruby because i felt it was more consistent

18:53 <Hanmac> ruby has more potential to be evil ... i hope you can resist :P

18:53 <nobitanobi> Mon_Ouie thanks for that explanation, I will play a little bit

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18:54 <a|i> how to include some c/c++ in ruby gem which can be compiled at installation time?

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18:57 <Hanmac> a|i i think you are looking for http://ruby-doc.org/docs/ProgrammingRuby/html/ext_ruby.html ?

18:57 <a|i> Hanmac: I think I'm looking for rake-compiler :)

18:58 <a|i> Hanmac: however, I do not want to wrap a c++ lib by ruby, I simply want to build it natively, and then run it from shell. would it makes sense to do in a gem?

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19:00 <Hanmac> maybe if you want expensive calculation , c++ can faster then ruby, is that what you want?

19:01 <Hanmac> and if you had looked at the link you would see that is not only for wraping

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19:05 <toy_battery> so in terms of writing a document, should each DocumentNode be responsible for return it's string form or should something else be responsible for handling writing

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19:07 <Mon_Ouie> Anyway you can use Rubygems' extensions support to build C programs that aren't C extensions at all

19:07 <Mon_Ouie> (gemspec.extensions = ["some_ruby_script.rb"])

19:08 ylluminate [ylluminate!~ylluminat@rrcs-24-123-53-166.central.biz.rr.com] has joined #ruby

19:08 <a|i> Hanmac: it's not for expensive calculates (only), I'm trying to use a 3rd party c++ lib in my gem.

19:08 crankycoder [crankycoder!~crankycod@out-on-220.wireless.telus.com] has joined #ruby

19:08 <Mon_Ouie> If you want to call a C++ lib from Ruby code, that's what wrapping it means

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19:09 <Hanmac> what is not a problem ... i use the CEGUI C++lib inside ruby ... and i plan an gem for Ogre3D so there is no problem

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19:10 <a|i> good.

19:10 <gheegh> simple question. I've got an array of variable length.. i'm trying to keep from passing an array of greater than 20 items into it.. so i sliced it [].slice(20). But, if it's less than 20, it returns nil. How should I be doing this? It seems like doing a bunch of lookups of the size and stuff isn't the right way… thoughts?

19:10 <gheegh> in my statement.. it = another function that takes this array as an argument.

19:11 <Mon_Ouie> gheegh: Array#slice is most likely not what you want

19:11 <Mon_Ouie> Well, not slice(index) at least

19:11 <Mon_Ouie> Since it's just the same as []

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19:11 <gheegh> Yep.. figured that out.. it gives me nil, which is clearly not suboptimal..

19:12 <gheegh> it seems like there should be a ruby function for this, but i'm not finding it

19:12 <Hanmac> gheegh: try array[0..19] ?

19:12 <Mon_Ouie> But what do you want? Getting the 20 first elements?

19:13 <Mon_Ouie> I'd rather do array[0, 20], to avoid off-by-one errors

19:13 <gheegh> i want to iterate over the array split into 20 element arrays

19:13 <Mon_Ouie> each_slice(20) do |sub_array| … end

19:13 <gheegh> so, if it's 35 items long, i'd want 2 arrays, 1 of 20 and 1 of 15

19:14 <gheegh> right.. each_slice(20) returns nil if the array is less than 20 items long

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19:14 <Mon_Ouie> No, it doesn't

19:14 <gheegh> so, nothing gets processed, and it errors because nil doesn't have enumerator

19:15 <gheegh> sorry.. "each_slice"

19:15 <gheegh> yes

19:15 <gheegh> that's what i was looking for.. I knew there was something.. Thanks Mon_Ouie

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19:28 <becom33> http://pastebin.com/RUgD86re how can I get body text from this ?

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19:31 <ElitestFX> becom33, http://house9-code-samples.blogspot.com/2010/01/ruby-http-get.html

19:31 kakashi__ [kakashi__!~kakashi_@nltk/kakashi] has joined #ruby

19:31 <ElitestFX> pretty good beginning to a ruby implemented web spider

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19:38 <gheegh> becom33: I'd recommend you use Typhoeus if you're planning on doing anything heavy..

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19:43 <becom33> - ElitestFX its not a spider . just class name is spider

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19:51 <ghanima> hey all quick question. I am new to ruby so please bare with me... Was wondering if someone could point me in the write direction to how to accomplish said tasks. I have a pseudo xml file where each entry is defined by Is there a gem that parses things like this if I define how the tags are defined

19:52 <centipedefarmer> ?

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19:52 <centipedefarmer> defined by three spaces, got it.

19:53 <becom33> http://pastebin.com/7LgXzXJB I get code but not the body :(

19:53 <burgestrand> ghanima: xml => http://nokogiri.org/

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19:55 <balgarath> just installed ruby from source on an ubuntu machine, but im getting a segfault when I run ruby -v ...any ideas how to troubleshoot

19:55 <balgarath> ?

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19:59 <davidcelis> you made it from source?

19:59 <davidcelis> you probably are missing dependencies/libraries

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20:02 <balgarath> k ill double check those

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20:07 <Jay_Levitt> Anyone know how to install an older version of rubygems on a Mac *without* using rvm - i.e. installing it into /System/Library/Frameworks?

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20:14 <Kireji> how can I find out where my gems are being written to?

20:15 <Kireji> foudn it "gem environment"

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20:19 <balgarath> davidcelis: still no go - I have: zlib1g zlib1g-dev libreadline5 libreadline5-dev libssl-dev build-essential (ubuntu packages)

20:19 <davidcelis> balgarath: this is why tools like rbenv and rvm exist

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20:19 <patrick99e99> hi everyone.. I am a little stuck on something-- what is the proper way to do this: http://pastie.org/3156250

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20:20 <burgestrand> patrick99e99: self.class.lol

20:20 manizzle [manizzle!~manizzle@pcp046660pcs.pcv.reshall.calpoly.edu] has joined #ruby

20:20 <burgestrand> patrick99e99: class is a keyword

20:21 <patrick99e99> hmm can't change the value of self it says

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20:21 <burgestrand> patrick99e99: that’s because you can’t

20:21 <patrick99e99> aha

20:21 <patrick99e99> ok.. I can get around that.. thanks

20:21 <burgestrand> patrick99e99: the proper way is to either return a new instance, or modify the current instances’ state

20:22 <balgarath> sure, rvm would make it a lot easier. but im not giving up lol

20:22 <yxhuvud> Hmm. I wonder if it is possible to hack something like it in rbx.

20:23 <burgestrand> banister`sleep wrote a C extension gem to replace an object, I believe

20:23 <yxhuvud> yes evil.rb but that was many versions of ruby ago.

20:24 akem [akem!~akem@unaffiliated/akem] has joined #ruby

20:24 <yxhuvud> or maybe that was another that did something similar.

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20:27 <banister`sleep> yxhuvud: evil.rb was more limited as you could only replace objects that had the same internal type

20:28 <yxhuvud> I see

20:28 <yxhuvud> and I seem to recall some limitations with arrays etc so you are probably correct :)

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20:34 <jstew> Greetings

20:35 <jstew> Anyone know of a decent link checker written in Ruby?

20:36 <regismesquita> jstew link checker?

20:36 <emocakes> jstew, a regex?

20:36 ianbrandt [ianbrandt!~ianbrandt@99-111-99-153.uvs.sndgca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #ruby

20:37 <Afal> jstew: what do you mean by "link checker"?

20:37 <burgestrand> something that crawls websites looking for broken links, I’d assume

20:37 <jstew> burgestrand: You win :)

20:38 <burgestrand> I know of none I’m afraid

20:38 <jstew> something like this: http://linkchecker.sourceforge.net/, but in Ruby.

20:38 <robyurkowski> i knew of a few, jstew

20:38 <robyurkowski> i wrote one myself

20:38 <robyurkowski> but it's shit

20:38 <robyurkowski> let me find one for you

20:38 <jstew> I like to use my favorite language when I can.

20:38 <robyurkowski> http://deveiate.org/projects/Ruby-LinkParser

20:38 <robyurkowski> http://thechangelog.com/post/2833125978/rawler-crawl-your-website-and-find-broken-links-with-rub

20:39 <robyurkowski> that latter one looks best

20:39 <jstew> Yeah, that looks simple and nice actually. Thanks.

20:40 <robyurkowski> np

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21:08 <Keva161> is their a way in Ruby to print a single element from an array and it's position? So if the array was [1, 2, 3] it wold print out 1(0) 2(1) etc...?

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21:10 <Hanmac> keva161: are you looking for each_with_index?

21:11 <Keva161> ah yes... that looks it will do great :)

21:11 <Keva161> thankyou!

21:14 <banister`sleep> robyurkowski: your website is a misspelling of 'deviate' ? :P

21:14 ciopte7_ [ciopte7_!~thomascio@cpe-071-071-034-129.triad.res.rr.com] has joined #ruby

21:14 <robyurkowski> banister`sleep: haha, no, that's not mine

21:15 <robyurkowski> that was just a link i tredged up off of google

21:15 <banister`sleep> H

21:15 <banister`sleep> ah

21:15 <robyurkowski> mine is closed source, sadly

21:15 <robyurkowski> proprietary software i worked on for someone :(

21:15 <robyurkowski> and my website is currently busted

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21:39 <banister`sleep> burgestrand: finally figured how to write tests for the bitch https://github.com/banister/pry-stack_explorer/blob/master/test/test_commands.rb#L50-78

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22:09 <SJrX> I'm just working with some ruby code, having experience with PHP and Java primarily. In Java everything should be a nice class, well OO, etc.... In PHP I get blank stares when I make a collection of functions of similar purpose a class. If I'm doing something similar in Ruby, should I use a class?

22:10 <Aristata> Example of what you are doing?

22:10 <apeiros_> SJrX: classes are cheap, use them judiciously

22:10 <robert_> sup banister`sleep

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22:11 <banister`sleep> robert_: not a lot why

22:11 <banister`sleep> about to go on a hike

22:11 <robert_> just wondering, lol.

22:11 <robert_> oh fun

22:11 kwoodson|2 [kwoodson|2!kvirc@nat/redhat/x-xcrsekpryswfjyvp] has joined #ruby

22:11 <robert_> I'm wondering how you embed a hex char inside a string

22:11 <robert_> lol

22:12 <SJrX> Like so three files in this code have the same tmp_dir() function. I'm going to refactor it into a new file, should I just create a tmp_dir function there, or should I make it a class, say config, with tmp_dir as a method

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22:12 <banister`sleep> robert_: y did that require a 'lol'

22:12 <apeiros_> SJrX: tmp_dir sounds like something that ruby has already…

22:13 <SJrX> This tmp_dir is different, as it needs to point to a shared folder on a compute cluster

22:13 <robert_> beause I'm probably being stupid and overlooking something very simple

22:13 <apeiros_> it sounds like a utility function, stuff like that goes usually into a module. take a look at Module#module_function

22:13 <robert_> and besides, it's a conversational "lol"

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22:13 <apeiros_> it allows you to define a method `bar` in module Foo and use it in both ways: `Foo.bar` or `include Foo; bar`

22:13 <banister`sleep> robert_: pls stop the 'lol' :) (it sounds retarded IMO)

22:14 carlyle_ [carlyle_!~carlyle@rrcs-96-10-255-203.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has joined #ruby

22:14 <SJrX> Where on the documentation would Module#module_function make sense? Like there is a lot of stuff on the documentation page

22:14 zenergi_ [zenergi_!~zenergi@pdpc/supporter/student/zenergi] has joined #ruby

22:15 <SJrX> Core?

22:15 <robert_> oh, so I just "\0xNNNNblah"?

22:15 <robert_> and it auto converts it to the correct notation?

22:16 <burgestrand> banister`sleep: awesome :)

22:16 <apeiros_> SJrX: in your shell, type `ri Module#module_function`

22:16 <apeiros_> the notation is to be read as: instance method 'module_function' in class 'Module'

22:16 <apeiros_> the # denotes an instance method. a :: would denote a class method.

22:17 <apeiros_> (only in documentation, in code, you invoke methods always by . )

22:22 pietro [pietro!~pietro@2-227-162-47.ip187.fastwebnet.it] has joined #ruby

22:23 <SJrX> ri Module#module_function:

22:23 <SJrX> Nothing known about Module

22:24 <SJrX> Hmmmm what is the difference between a Module and a class?

22:25 <deryl> a Module you can not instantiate. A class you can. Modules usually get incorporated into classes

22:25 <workmad3> SJrX: also, you can extend or include a module into a class

22:25 <SJrX> Hmmmmm is there a reason why I couldn't turn a module into a class later?

22:25 blanciq [blanciq!blanciq@bshellz.pl] has joined #ruby

22:25 <workmad3> SJrX: you'd probably need to change how you were using it quite drastically

22:25 <deryl> you remove the Module portion and exchange it for class MyClass

22:26 <deryl> and you woud need to remove references to it as a module form any classes that contain the Module

22:26 <deryl> call

22:26 <blanciq> Hello, i've gotta problem with qt bindings. I kinda new in ruby. I need to use QPixmap class from Qt, there is Pixmap class but it seems empty. What does it mean ?

22:26 <blanciq> http://www.koders.com/ruby/fidABEC48F7D473AF45EDE04FDC527C28DEAD2ED6D6.aspx?s=socket#L418

22:27 <deryl> as workmad3, your usage would change drastically. Think of Modules as bags of functions/functionality you want your classes to ahve.

22:27 <SJrX> Okay let me take a step back, in Java we have java properties files which we can point to and read, does Ruby have a similiar thing?

22:27 <deryl> well he ones you include the module in at least

22:27 <ghanima> hey all quick question. I am new to ruby so please bare with me... Was wondering if someone could point me in the write direction to how to accomplish said tasks. I have a pseudo xml file where each entry is defined by Is there a gem that parses things like this if I define how the tags are defined

22:27 beilabs [beilabs!~jonathan@ppp59-167-171-134.static.internode.on.net] has joined #ruby

22:27 <deryl> no clue i don't knw crap about java. tried learning it, hate it, dont remember crap about it

22:27 <workmad3> SJrX: you can read in properties from files, yes

22:27 <SJrX> like what's the best way to do configuration files in Ruby, without reinventing the wheel

22:27 <workmad3> SJrX: that's hardly difficult ;) (in ruby, the tendency is to use yaml)

22:28 <deryl> ahh. usually something like yaml files

22:28 <SJrX> interesting

22:28 <deryl> hjehe workmad3 faster than i am

22:28 jaemin-kr [jaemin-kr!~jaemin-kr@155-99-212-242.uconnect.utah.edu] has joined #ruby

22:28 <SJrX> So If I make the stuff I need a module, I can later user YAML to make it read from a config file?

22:29 <workmad3> SJrX: if you want to relate to java, think of modules as interfaces, but you can inherit implementation along with the interface

22:29 <workmad3> SJrX: there's more to it than that, but that's frequently a good starting point when coming from java ;)

22:30 <SJrX> okay

22:30 <SJrX> thank you

22:30 <workmad3> SJrX: modules are also dual-purposed as namespaces in ruby too

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22:31 <SJrX> okay one more question (I'm in the middle of cleaning up code), in PHP I Can trigger errors at various reporting levels, in Java I can mark methods Deprecated. If I want to 'flag' something as to fix later, but fine in runtime, what's the best mechanism in Ruby?

22:31 <workmad3> SJrX: hopefully that makes it clearer as to the difficulty with changing a module to a class... it would be like changing an interface to a class in java (possible, but a lot of work, and would require major rethinking about how you're using stuff)

22:32 <rtyler> howdy folks, I'm using the i18n gem (ruby-i18n.org) with an existing rails project, I'm having a bit of trouble finding a good how-to do internationalization in a gem to be distributed

22:32 <workmad3> SJrX: honestly? I'd just give it a #TODO comment

22:32 <SJrX> Well changing an interface to a class, in Java would be simply with the exception that you couldn't inherient multiple classes, is that what you mean workmad3?

22:32 <apeiros_> SJrX: re "Nothing known about Module" - it means your docs are not installed

22:32 <SJrX> ah

22:32 <apeiros_> SJrX: if you installed ruby using rvm, you can install the docs by: rvm docs generate

22:33 <SJrX> thanks

22:33 <blanciq> Somebody use Qt in Ruby and can help ?

22:33 <SJrX> Conventions for file names?

22:34 <apeiros_> SJrX: Foo::BarBaz should be in foo/barbaz.rb

22:34 <workmad3> SJrX: I'd posit that you don't normally change an interface to a class, because they have very different usages ;)

22:34 <apeiros_> except if you're in a rails-app, there it should be foo/bar_baz.rb

22:35 <SJrX> Wait? Isn't Foo the module, and BarBaz the method?

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22:36 <apeiros_> no

22:36 <apeiros_> Foo can be either a class or a module (classes are modules and thus can serve the same namespacing purposes)

22:36 <apeiros_> and BarBaz can be about anything

22:36 <Hanmac> Module is a Class, and Class is a Module :P

22:36 <apeiros_> technically, Foo is just a constant (which usually "happens" to reference a class or a module)

22:37 <apeiros_> Hanmac: also class subclasses Module

22:37 <apeiros_> wanna throw Object and Kernel into the mix and confuse him completely? :)

22:37 <SJrX> Okay if I'm naming my Module Config, and have a method tmpdir(), I was going to put it in the system/config.rb

22:37 <apeiros_> ew

22:37 <apeiros_> don't make files for individual methods

22:37 <apeiros_> one file per module/class

22:37 <SJrX> no there will be more stuff later

22:38 <apeiros_> doesn't matter

22:38 <SJrX> ?

22:38 shadoi [shadoi!~Adium@2001:5a8:4:68e0:183f:c5fc:c2bf:bfc2] has joined #ruby

22:38 <SJrX> I don't understand your comment

22:38 <apeiros_> if your method is in Config, then it should be in config.rb

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22:38 <SJrX> yeah?

22:38 <apeiros_> yes

22:38 <apeiros_> system/config.rb implies System::Config

22:38 <SJrX> You can split module/class definitions accross files in ruby?

22:38 <apeiros_> yes

22:39 <SJrX> oh, that seems icky

22:39 <apeiros_> classes are open. you can add stuff whenever you want.

22:39 <SJrX> no system/config.rb was just meant to seperate the configuration out from other things

22:39 <apeiros_> I'd say java's inability to do so seems icky.

22:39 <SJrX> like system would contain system related methods

22:39 <Hanmac> and you also can remove suff but this is black magic

22:39 <apeiros_> SJrX: yes, I understood. don't do that.

22:40 <SJrX> that's true, that wasn't meant to be a slight against ruby

22:40 <apeiros_> SJrX: I'm telling you how naming conventions are in ruby. I strongly suggest you follow them.

22:40 <SJrX> Yeah I'm still not sure I understand

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22:40 <rtyler> I found this useless post on SO too: <http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7761243/how-to-bundle-i18n-translations-within-a-ruby-gem> :/

22:41 <SJrX> Basically this hole project I'm looking at is a collection of ruby scripts, all in one directory, with only functions, it looks like

22:41 <SJrX> I was hoping to add more logical structure both to the code, and to the file system

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22:46 <SJrX> apeiros_, I don't think I understand since it seems like I would never split my program over multiple directories?

22:46 <apeiros_> SJrX: time to learn new things then.

22:46 <SJrX> So that is correct, apeiros_?

22:46 <apeiros_> if your program is reasonably complex, you should, and if you code by convention, you eventually will.

22:47 <apeiros_> in ruby at least.

22:47 <abstrakt> does anyone have experience with pik? the docs are a bit thin - I'm wondering if pik requires ruby 1.8, for example

22:47 <abstrakt> because the pik docs don't mention ruby 1.9 at all

22:47 <abstrakt> mainly I'm wondering about this in regards to RubyInstaller, because last I checked, ruby installer is going to ask me if I want to add ruby to my %PATH% environment var

22:47 andrewhl [andrewhl!~andrew@24-246-14-26.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #ruby

22:47 <abstrakt> and it wouldn't make sense really to have two rubies add themselves to %PATH% because that seems to be the purpose of pik

22:48 <abstrakt> so what I want to know is: am I required to install ruby 1.8 prior to installing ruby 1.9? does it matter? i.e. if I install ruby 1.9 and have that be the canonical ruby on my system, is that gonna make a difference with anything?

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22:54 <SJrX> Why doesn't the following work: http://pastebin.com/FVcUQWL0

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22:55 <apeiros_> SJrX: because you defined it as an instance method and called it as a class method

22:55 <apeiros_> use either module_function :shared_tmpdir or define it as def self.shared_tmpdir

22:56 <apeiros_> IMO former is to preferred for utility functions

22:57 <SJrX> So change line 14 to ALConfig :shared_tmpdir ?

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23:03 <SJrX> Ah got it

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23:08 <SJrX> robbyoconnor, long time no see

23:08 <SJrX> Hmmmm, will ruby not parse something like ~/foo as current users home directory / foo (if running on a unix enviroment).

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23:13 <Hanmac> SjrX not direct ... because its a shell feature ... but you can use File.expandPath

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23:18 <SJrX> thanks

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23:37 <cconstantine> Hey all, I have a class that I want to return the same instance when the constructor is called with the same (single) parameter. Is there an easy way to memoize that?

23:38 <epochwolf|vps> cconstantine: http://ruby-doc.org/stdlib-1.9.3/libdoc/singleton/rdoc/Singleton.html

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23:39 <cconstantine> it's not really a singleton

23:40 <cconstantine> Klass.new("a") != Klass.new("b")

23:40 <cconstantine> Klass.new("a") == Klass.new("a") # identity equal

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23:50 <nobitanobi> gnight !

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