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<moldybits>
in CLOS, i have a class that no methods specialize on, but i want to handle any attempt of applying any method to it. (defmethod whatever ((x number)) x) (defclass foo () ()) (whatever (make-instance 'foo)) ; instead of erroring i want to intercept this
<moldybits>
my goal is to have an object that defers every method application and slot-value to another object seamlessly, except for chosen methods/slots that i want to override
<no-defun-allowed>
(defmethod no-applicable-method :around (gf &rest arguments) (if (find-if (lambda (x) (typep x 'anti-social-class)) arguments) do-something-else (call-next-method))) might work
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<pjb>
LdBeth: this can be done trivially with font-locking. But indeed, the regexp may be complex if you want to avoid strings, (and comments), notably in CL where strings can stand on several lines, and comments can be embedded.
<pjb>
with the compose-region operator…
<beach>
Good morning everyone!
<LdBeth>
beach: morning
<LdBeth>
pjb: for my purpose these should be inserted by user and doesn’t mean to be preserved across sessions
<pjb>
LdBeth: you can let the user type the )))) using paredit, and display them as a single ]
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<ck_>
Good morning
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<no-defun-allowed>
Does anyone have a CCL 1.12beta image for ARM I could have a copy of?
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<jmercouris>
ok, good to know that it is non-standard
<Bike>
um, so the object itself is a "timestamp".
<jmercouris>
I was wondering how I had not learned about this
<jmercouris>
interesting, a timestamp object...
<jmercouris>
I guess that makes a lot of sense
<jmercouris>
ok, so I'm getting these timestamps from SXQL, I am wondering if instead there is a way to just query by time instead of checking the timestamp
<jmercouris>
something like (select-dao 'object (where :created_at < date-24-hours-ago))
<jmercouris>
I guess I'll have to look into how sxql accepts/creates dates
<jmercouris>
maybe I can pass a timestamp object...
<jdz>
Back in the day there was pc-lisp, if I remember correctly.
<jdz>
It tried to be compatible with franz-lisp.
<lionrouge>
jdz, really. It's for a school which still has mixed MS-DOS/Linux environment
<aeth>
The lack of updates in 25-30 years and the limitations of 16-bit will be painful to work with. Shouldn't be hard to run in DOSBox, though
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<lionrouge>
it's for educational purposes
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<jdz>
I remember writing lisp in Notepad.exe; the only way it was educational was suffering.
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<jdz>
That's probably the purpose of modern education, though.
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<aeth>
The way a Lisp usually works (although 16-bit ones might be different because of necessity) is that they have tag bits on everything, which means that anything that cannot fit in a word *with* the tag bit has to be heap allocated except in niche circumstances.
<aeth>
e.g. single-floats fit in a 64-bit Lisp's word size, but not double-floats, since 64-bit floats need some tag bits. But in 32-bit Lisps, even single-floats will be heap allocated if they're 32-bit IEEE single-precision floating point
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<aeth>
And a fixnum is basically the largest signed integer that isn't heap allocated on an implementation. So e.g. for 64-bit SBCL that's a 63-bit unsigned integer because it uses one bit as a tag. Unsigned fixnums are used for most minimum sizes, which means at most you get 2 less than the word size in bits, or 62-bit for SBCL.
<aeth>
So if I'm doing this correctly, then for a 16-bit implementation that uses the absolute largest fixnum like 64-bit SBCL does for 64-bit you get this as your largest non-bignum integer (= (- (expt 2 14) 1) 16383)
<aeth>
At most 16383. Some implementations might be less, and that doesn't mean that your largest array has 16383 elements because it depends on e.g. how its tagging works.
<aeth>
The minimum value for array-total-size-limit is 1024. It's definitely possible that the DOS Common Lisp you find does actually have this value. That means some docstrings are too large.
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<aeth>
If you use a 64-bit CL you basically never have to think about limits and this is esoteric knowledge. If you use a 32-bit CL, you might hit certain limits if you're working with e.g. images or video. If you use a 16-bit made-for-DOS CL, you have to change how you write programs to work around certain limits. It doesn't sound like it would give people a good impression of the language at least imo.
<aeth>
I guess unless the point of the exercise was working around the limitations.
<moldybits>
maybe elisp or scheme is more appropriate?
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<edgar-rft>
lionrouge: there's an XLISP-PLUS interpreter from 2016 that still runs on MS-DOS at the bottom of the page -> http://www.almy.us/xlisp.html
<jackdaniel>
do you have opinions about data-frame concept in general? is there some good CL library implementing the abstraction? if not, would people find it useful?
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<jackdaniel>
(data frames are basically arrays with named columns and rows where you may select particular columns and/or rows depending on what you need, used i.e in statistics or in ggplot2)
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* ck_
has to resist dark memories of trying to ''program'' in R
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<dlowe>
I've made ad-hoc data frames and associated functions, but I never put it all into a library
<jackdaniel>
does it cons when subsets are selected?
<jackdaniel>
(i.e copies data)
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<grewal>
I've never used a data frame, but if I needed that sort of abstraction, I'd probably just use an array of structs
<dlowe>
jackdaniel: no, it didn't. I was only operating on medium sized datasets, though.
<dlowe>
datasets too large to mess with by hand but still fitting comfortably in a corner of memory
<jackdaniel>
dlowe: thank you. is the repository public?
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<dlowe>
"I never put it all into a library"
<jackdaniel>
yes, but you might have put it as a file in some other project
<jackdaniel>
I didn't miss that part
<dlowe>
No, sorry :/
<dlowe>
it was for work
<jackdaniel>
understood, thank you
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<[6502]>
Hello... in a toy lisp interpreter I'm playing with I "mark" environments that are captured in lambdas (and I follow up the environment parent chain until the global environment or a marked one is found)...
<[6502]>
...When executing a function call I check if after the body evaluation the environment has been made reachable by a lambda capture and when this is not the case I recycle it immediately instead of leaving the job to the gc...
<[6502]>
...Are there reason for which this trick shouldn't work? it saves me a LOT of consing.
<dlowe>
[6502]: this is a forum for Common Lisp. I think you want ##lisp which focuses on the lisp family
<dlowe>
I mean, unless you're writing it in CL
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<[6502]>
no... the interpreter is in C++
<Bike>
there's no reason for it not to work. most of the time you don't even need to allocate an environment.
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<jeosol>
jackdaniel: are you planning on writing or working on dataframe? I think it will be useful. This was brought up here a while ago, and I recall someone had something in CL similar to python pandas.
<jeosol>
but not fully implemented or something like that
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<jackdaniel>
jeosol: I wrote a working prototype of polyclot (mcclim application to plot data) and now I'm rewriting it into something with arms and legs
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<jackdaniel>
and data-frames are very convenient as a way for mapping dataset to the aesthetics
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<jackdaniel>
(so I'm apparently writing a barebone implementation which will serve these needs)
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<jmercouris>
I'm having a bit of an issue with cl-csv it seems to be swallowing things up
<jmercouris>
or I can't go through the same CSV twice
<jmercouris>
I tried making a stream twice to get past this
<jmercouris>
I do (flexi-streams:make-flexi-stream ...) from a file I get, I do this twice, but you can only read a stream once
<jmercouris>
alexandria:copy-stream?
<jeosol>
sjl: it's possible it this one but if my memory serves me right, the one I was talking had functionalities to allow panda-like manipulations, some of which jackdaniel alluded above
<sjl>
ah
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<jmercouris>
how can I take a stream and produce two flexi-streams from it?
<sjl>
jmercouris: once you read from a stream, that's it. that's how streams work. copy-stream isn't what you want (that's for piping one stream to another)
<sjl>
what are you actually trying to do?
<jmercouris>
sjl: well, I have a CSV that I am trying to go through twice with two different functions
<jmercouris>
both of those functions use cl-csv to traverse the CSV
<sjl>
and you don't want to (with-open-file (...) (do-thing-1 ...)) (with-open-file (...) (do-thing-2 ...)) ?
<jmercouris>
sjl: I can't say I do, this is the upload to a server, and so I get a stream from the web framework
<sjl>
By default Lisp (probably) won't save the whole contents of a stream... if someone updates a 100gb file, the whole point of using a stream is to not have to hold it all in memory
<jmercouris>
yes
<jackdaniel>
jmercouris: first read stream into some kind of sequence
<jackdaniel>
and then use said sequence
<jackdaniel>
if you are sure that it is not too much data
<jmercouris>
I am sure
<jmercouris>
it is usually around ~500kb
<sjl>
Yeah, if it's small enough to keep in memory, read it from the initial stream into a buffer and then work with that.
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<sjl>
then use flexi-streams' make-in-memory-input-stream twice to make two streams you can give to the CSV parser
<jmercouris>
how do I copy a stream into a sequence?
<aeth>
jmercouris: But under the hood, which you can even see there, the pipe is just going to either (a) read into a buffer or (b) read into a /tmp file (I go with a, many go with b)
<jackdaniel>
how about (with-input-from-string …) ;?
<jackdaniel>
(after you have your sequence read to a string)
<jmercouris>
this is turning way too complex :D
<jackdaniel>
(let ((string (a:read-stream-content-insto-string stream))) (w-i-f-s (s string) (deactivate-targets s)) (w-i-f-s (s string) (do-csv (row s) …)))
<jackdaniel>
>afk<
<aeth>
with-output-to-string combined with with-input-from-string seems like it might work if it's small enough and it doesn't have to be used interactively
<jmercouris>
I'm getting really close to rewriting my code..
<jmercouris>
to just somehow magically go through the same stream
<jmercouris>
cl-csv:read-csv can take a string
<aeth>
Well, you're probably getting UTF-8 and you need to translate that into the internal format of the implementation, which is probably UTF-32. Unless the library is already translating UTF-8 to UTF-32, in which case you just need to CODE-CHAR it.
<jmercouris>
cl-csv:do-csv cannot, and must take a pathname or whatever
<jmercouris>
aeth: what if I do not get UTF-8 though? what if a windows user uses the application?
<aeth>
I don't think there's a convenient, universal way to detect all encodings.
<aeth>
Especially all of the legacy ones that look like extended ASCII with special characters in the upper half.
<aeth>
You might be able to determine which Unicode encoding it is.
<jmercouris>
:\
<jmercouris>
there must be a simpler way
<jmercouris>
it was working taking the stream and just piping into cl-csv
<jmercouris>
why can I not just duplicate a stream somehow?
<jmercouris>
copy the contents of one stream into two streams
<dlowe>
read-byte from one, write-byte into a echo-stream
<dlowe>
read-byte from the echo streams
<jmercouris>
dlowe: did you mean write-byte into echo streams?
<dlowe>
yes
<aeth>
jmercouris: the thing is, being naive about encodings will work fine for characters 0 through 127
<aeth>
usually.
<aeth>
try adding é to your input and see what happens
<jmercouris>
no thanks :D
<aeth>
it's possible some library or the implementation is already handling things
<jmercouris>
how can I just make a stream?
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<jmercouris>
make-in-memory-output-stream?
<jmercouris>
I however want to be able to write to the echo stream, and then read from it... no?
<dlowe>
that's what echo streams do
<jmercouris>
I'm confused here
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<aeth>
It looks like flexi-streams does its own encoding handling.
<aeth>
You could probably add some logic that defaults to UTF-8 but also attempts to detect if it's using whatever Windows's default format is instead.
<aeth>
That would cover 99.9% of all things, probably.
<jmercouris>
I guess I could, but I don't want to go down that path
<dlowe>
just assume utf-8 and if you find some other encoding, it's wrong :p
<aeth>
yeah, or that
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<aeth>
It's probably not to hard to do utf-8 on Windows since almost the entire web speaks utf-8 now.
<jmercouris>
make-in-memory-input-stream does not support an encoding..
<aeth>
I guess because that works on octets? Are you working on (CL) characters or octets?
<jmercouris>
I have no idea, I'm just working wit whatever caveman gives me
<jmercouris>
s/wit/with
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<aeth>
jmercouris: So your issue is you need to pass a stream from caveman into a CSV library twice, right? The simplest answer is to put it into a string and then with-input-from-string twice if it's small enough, right?
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<aeth>
So the remaining issue then is getting it into a string
<aeth>
If I'm understanding things correctly
<jmercouris>
yeah that would be the simplest
<jmercouris>
but all of my code is using cl-csv:do-csv
<jmercouris>
and not read-csv which can take a string..
<dlowe>
with-input-from-string will turn a string into a stream
<aeth>
well, if do-csv takes a stream and with-input-from-string makes a stream from a string, then there's no issue
<aeth>
The issue is reduced to turning your input into a string
<jmercouris>
ok, I gave up
<jmercouris>
I just go through the stream once and handle it in both palces
<jmercouris>
plaes*
<aeth>
with-output-to-string is the easiest solution, if it's a bidirectional character stream
<jmercouris>
places*
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<jmercouris>
it is
<jmercouris>
but it was having problems reading the encoding for some reason
<jmercouris>
I dont know I might revisit this code
<jmercouris>
but I'm tired of looking at it :\
<jmercouris>
at least it works now
<jmercouris>
thank you all for your help/patience :D
<jmercouris>
at least this code is more efficient by just going through the stream once :D
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<jmercouris>
goodbye everyone
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<kenu>
hi
<kenu>
Is there a way to have quicklisp and asdf work with each other flawlessly?
<kenu>
I've got my stuff in common-lisp folder as per asdf manual
<kenu>
but quickload dosn't store downloaded packages there
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<kenu>
manually moving the folders doesnt feel to be the right way...
<pjb>
kenu: you can symlink your stuff into ~/quicklisp/local-projects/
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<Xach>
kenu: systems provided by quicklisp will always be stored in the quicklisp directory in a certain structure.
<Xach>
kenu: other systems can go anywhere as long as asdf's find-system can find them.
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<Xach>
kenu: I'm curious - what prompts the desire to have downloaded stuff go there?
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<manualcrank>
hey, people
<manualcrank>
a few days ago i complained about the performance of sbcl on the competitive programming site open.kattis.com, specifically the awful performance (compared to other languages there) of READ-LINE.
<manualcrank>
You absolutely need to be able to consume input as fast as possible on this site. Using ios_base::sync_with_stdio(false) in C++ or memory mapped input in C can chew through the input in literally 0 seconds vs. TLE (time limit exceeded) in Lisp.
<manualcrank>
Ditto one based on READ-SEQUENCE (in my tests READ-SEQUENCE --- on *STANDARD-INPUT* --- is _slower_ than READ-LINE).
<manualcrank>
So anyway i managed to accidentally cobble together a solution using DEFINE-ALIEN-ROUTINE, which I can't really explain how it works because I'm a complete newbie at foreign function stuff.
<no-defun-allowed>
nice, i was going to suggest that
<manualcrank>
It calls C's gets(). Performance is dramatically better (finishes in < 0.6s, which is average).
<manualcrank>
But (1) it still creates a string object for every line and (2) what I really wanted to do was be able to call fgets_unlocked(), but couldn't figure out how to convert between stdin and *STANDARD-INPUT*