<dialectic>
How do I make sure a macro is available in the same file that I'm defining it in? I'm wrapping in eval-when (:compile-toplevel :load-toplevel) but I still get an undefined symbol warning on sbcl and no expansion occurs. Let me be more specific:
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<Xach>
dialectic: include :execute
<Xach>
(that might not be your whole problem)
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<dialectic>
No-dice.
<grewal>
Package issue? It's hard to tell without the code
<dialectic>
Implementation I'm using is sbcl. I'm executing the repl, using ql:quickload to load my system. Executing the function results in symbol-undefined for my macro call. Here is the code: https://hastebin.com/civahodeqo.lisp
<dialectic>
Macroexpanding in the repl on a quoted list works as expected so I don't really know what it is. :(
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<dialectic>
Probably a process thing. I am not really used to the interactive development yet of saving changes and then loading the whole system again.
<grewal>
As far as I can tell, (cond (make-clause 1 ONE) is first macro-expanded into (if make-clause (progn 1 one) nil), where make-clause is no-longer in a position where it can be macroexpanded
<dialectic>
Oh, cond is a macro on sbcl?
<Xach>
dialectic: you can't put macro forms in places that aren't evaluated in a normal way
<dialectic>
That explains the weird if expansion I was seeing in some of the compiler output.
<Xach>
dialectic: a cond clause is not evaluated like a normal function application
<Xach>
just like you can't do (defclass foo () ((make-slot myslot)))
<dialectic>
Oh. So macro calls are only ever expanded when they could be function calls?
<Xach>
dialectic: sort of. wherever normal form evaluation would take place.
<dialectic>
Ok. I'll reread the spec. That wasn't intuitive, but then again, I didn't really have a justification for my prior belief of how it worked.
<Xach>
macros and special forms introduce new meaning for forms and their structure, so macros will only work where the meaning is "normal"
<dialectic>
Thanks all
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<mfiano>
Why was it considered a good idea to have uiop:define-package take a &rest list of clauses instead of &body? Is it preferable that the first clause be indented differently? This is the sole reason I prefer defpackage-plus over the more ubiquitous option when I need non-standard packaging features.
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<seok>
hello,
<seok>
(defun start ()
<seok>
ndard-output*)
<seok>
trying to echo output stream to *standard-output*, and this doesn't work.
<seok>
any ideas?
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<beach>
Good morning everyone!
<beach>
seok: I think your code was cut off. Please use a pastebin site to show the entire code.
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<LdBeth>
Good afternoon
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<splittist>
good day
<beach>
Hello splittist.
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<asarch>
How would you parse the output of an external program using uiop:run-program?
<asarch>
So far, I can: (let ((process (sb-ext:run-program "/usr/bin/apt-cache" '("search" "sbcl") :output :stream))) (loop for line = (read-line (sb-ext:process-output process) nil) while line do (format t "~a~%" line)))
<asarch>
But it seems that sb-ext:run-program is not portable at all
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<d4ryus>
asarch: there is a somewhat portable uiop:launch-program
<asarch>
Thank you!
<asarch>
Next question: how would you split a string? "One Two Three Four Five" into '("One" "Two" "Three" "Four" "Five")
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<ck_>
asarch: there's split-sequence in quicklisp
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<asarch>
Thank you!
<asarch>
How would you slurp a file?
<pjb>
com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.file:binary-file-contents P F
<pjb>
com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.file:sexp-file-contents P F
<pjb>
com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.file:sexp-list-file-contents P F
<pjb>
com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.file:string-list-text-file-contents P F
<pjb>
com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.file:text-file-contents P F
<pjb>
<pjb>
Note: they're accessors, you can also use them to barf a file.
<asarch>
One last question: how do you concatenate strings?
<shrdlu68>
(concatenate 'string "foo" "bar")
<asarch>
Thank you!
<asarch>
Thank you very much guys!
<asarch>
Thank you! :-)
<asarch>
I needed those "routines" for my small web server with aserve
<pjb>
Why don't you know them already?
<pjb>
You never learned anything?
<pjb>
Are you a free loader?
<asarch>
Free loader?
<pjb>
s/ //
<asarch>
Well, in my tons of notes I could only find the way to get the third column from a file that line matches a regexp
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<pjb>
asarch: brains work better than notes…
<asarch>
(with-open-file (stream "big-file") (loop for line = (read-line stream nil nil) wile line when (regexp-match-line-p regexp line) do (print (third-column line))))
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<asarch>
Not my brain :'-(
<shrdlu68>
asarch: I also use format to concatenate strings a lot: (format nil "~{~A~^ ~}" '("foo" "bar" "baz"))
<ck_>
brains and notes work best in tandem
<LdBeth>
Build a small library, it’s better than copy from either brain or notes everywhere
<asarch>
Yeah, I used to have a small web app connected to a PostgreSQL cluster for my notes when I was learning Perl
<asarch>
And that's exactly what I am building right now with Common Lisp a la Common Lisp way
<asarch>
For example, the problem of "<!DOCTYPE html>" from net.html.generator:html I could solved with:
<pjb>
LdBeth: There are a lot of serialization/deserialization libraries. But since you don't want a general one, you can only write your own specific one!
<pjb>
LdBeth: anyways writing such code is much fun, so you should definitely write your own.
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<mpcjanssen>
and then after having been burned by all the corner cases, use a standard one and appreciate the inherent complexity :)
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<jackdaniel>
cl-store allows writing a specialized backend
<jackdaniel>
so I'd start from there
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<ober>
+1 cl-store
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<LdBeth>
question about eclector: if i want to get the content of skipped comment, should i set the reader for semicolon or define a speclized else where?
<beach>
I am pretty sure you should not modify the reader macro associated with semicolon.
<LdBeth>
the method make-skipped-input-result is called when stream position is after skipped content
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<beach>
So I think you need to define a method on that generic function, specialized to your client instance.
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<LdBeth>
for example, if i specialized make-skipped-input-result with body of (read stream), the next atom after the comment is lost
<LdBeth>
i don't find a place where I can call something before the skipping happens
<beach>
Sounds reasonable. Why would you do that?
<beach>
What is it that you want to do before the skipping happens?
<LdBeth>
I'm making a lisp to tex printer, in this senerio the comments and many other things should be preserved
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<LdBeth>
*scenario
<beach>
Yes, but it is not the right think to call READ to get the skipped input.
<LdBeth>
so I see backquote readers calls generic functions to construct forms
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<LdBeth>
maybe we can add a call to a generic functions in semicolon reader which accepts the skipped things and by default does nothing
<beach>
It looks to me like the technique to be used is clearly documented.
<beach>
According to the documentation, you remember the stream position before the call to READ, and then recover the skipped input in NOTE-SKIPPED-INPUT.
<LdBeth>
the reason why I ask if I should set semicolon reader is because the behavior I want to have actually doesn't skip contents
<LdBeth>
beach: you mean I have to add a daemon to eclector.parse-result:read ?
<beach>
No, that is not what I mean.
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<beach>
If you plan to use the eclector-.parse-result system, you must define methods on make-expression-result and make-skipped-input-result.
<beach>
The note-skipped-input technique that I cited before is available in the ordinary reader.
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<LdBeth>
beach: I see, so I have to make a special variable and adds modifier to note-skipped-input and read-common to set stream position to it, am I right?
<beach>
That's one way of doing it. Or you can use a Gray stream.
<beach>
A Gray stream is often the easiest solution. Just read the entire file into a string, and then feed Eclector from the string. Then you can do what you want with the string contents.
<beach>
For SICL source tracking, I read the source file into a list of lines, each line being a string.
<beach>
That way, I don't have to worry about how newlines are represented in the operating system.
<LdBeth>
So it relies on the stream has backup?
<beach>
SICL does, because I store the entire source with the compiled code.
<beach>
You might get away with setting the stream position and reading characters of skipped input.
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<LdBeth>
A ordinary character stream is not recommanded. Well...
<beach>
Does it say that?
<LdBeth>
beach: have you looked at Pragmatic Parsing in Common Lisp
<beach>
Never heard of it.
<scymtym>
it is Baker's META parser
<beach>
I see.
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<LdBeth>
It demonstrates a technique building parser capable to parse both streams and seqences. And it can parse a large set of grammer including Common Lisp source and lambda lists
<beach>
Well, that is possible only if you use the Common Lisp reader algorithm.
<beach>
... which is why we wrote Eclector.
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<LdBeth>
as final decision I'd override semicolon reader to call a generic function receives consumed input. for me I'd expect ordinary stream just works and one pass without backup is good enough.
* LdBeth
goes to sleep
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<scymtym>
we could accumulate input characters as they are skipped and pass the accumulated string to MAKE-SKIPPED-INPUT-RESULT. but that would be wasteful in case the accumulated string was not used
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<beach>
Yeah, not a good idea in my opinion.
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<scymtym>
maybe the documentation needs a list with problems and solutions for cases such as "i want comments as nodes in the concrete syntax tree", "i want skipped input ranges as strings", etc. those questions have come up several times already
<beach>
Oh, that would be fantastic.
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<beach>
scymtym: I am unable to work on the new version of SICL bootstrapping at the moment, because my computer keeps crashing when I do. So until I get a new processor, I will work on other aspects of SICL. One such aspect is to remove obsolete code.
<beach>
I am thinking I should replace the SICL reader in Second Climacs by Eclector soon-ish, so that I can remove the obsolete reader. As a consequence, I will likely read documentation and code examples from Eclector in the near future.
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<scymtym>
beach: great. please keep me posted. i'm sure another set of shortcomings will be exposed (which is a good thing)
<beach>
Maybe so. I'll definitely keep you informed.
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<skidd0>
I'm experiencing some inconsistencies with cl-json and want to make sure i'm not just blundering over a simple mistake.
<skidd0>
it seems the alist <-> Object conversion with cl-json is inconsistent
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<sjl>
this is probably related to cl-json:encode-json-alist
<sjl>
but I gotta run
<skidd0>
sjl: okay thank you
<Xach>
sjl: !!
<Xach>
i have a failure report but i will post to github
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<ck_>
Xach: your Naggum c.l.l archive has links to the message-ids on google groups, the Warnock archive doesn't. Is that because you found most weren't archived there?
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<mSSM>
Is there anyone here using slimv? I am looking for an overview of keybindings, such as ,c
<grewal>
If you use gVim, all the menu options also show you the (default) key-binding
<skidd0>
for the paredit stuff
<mSSM>
grewal: I use cli vim
<Xach>
ck_: I don't remember the exact reason, sorry.
<ck_>
Xach: thank you. I'll accept the mystery.
<mSSM>
skidd0: This is great, thank you. Can look this up in vim help
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<skidd0>
mSSM: it is the vim help
<mSSM>
Yeah :D
<aeth>
Is it possible to get GNU Emacs to indent elaborate macros correctly? Basically add to what SLIME does with common-lisp-init-standard-indentation? I'm not sure what put is doing there in that function, and it's an unsearchable name.
<dlowe>
aeth: slime uses the &body keyword of macros as a formatting hint, but it'd be pretty hard with something more complicated
<aeth>
Does anyone ship elisp to properly indent and highlight their elaborate macros?
<aeth>
dlowe: SLIME works on like 90% of macros, but only if they fit the common forms. It won't work on e.g. a custom flet
<aeth>
dlowe: SLIME also won't highlight stuff like the built-ins unless they begin with define- or with- or a handful of other things.
<Bike>
it's not obvious how to indent flet from its "lambda list", though
<aeth>
Common Lisp with SLIME also doesn't highlight types-or-classes green (iirc) like other Emacs modes, e.g. in defmethod or in custom macros.
<aeth>
Bike: Exactly, a custom flet-like form absolutely needs custom elisp because there's no way to determine it
<Bike>
are you talking about indenting emacs lisp code or common lisp code
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<Bike>
you can configure slime to indent some macro's forms like flet, and stuff like that
<aeth>
Bike: I need to ship Emacs Lisp with my Common Lisp code to (1) autoindent a handful of macros that SLIME can't handle, such as ones that are similar to flet, (2) highlight certain forms that are not highlighted but should be (since it only auto highlights a handful like define- and with-), and
<aeth>
(3) highlight classes/types in certain contexts like in other Emacs language modes (e.g. c-mode) including probably defmethod
<aeth>
Ideally through customizing SLIME
<Bike>
sure, throw in some puts or whatnot
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<Bike>
my .emacs has a thing to tab make-instance less. it's like one line
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<Bike>
highlighting is also configurable, but i forget how
<Bike>
i think that's a builtin emacs thing that does regexing
<aeth>
If I were to highlight types-or-classes green, assuming SLIME doesn't have that functionality at all, which forms would I need to do that in? Obviously just talking about the standard ones, I know where in my macros. Would look out of place if my macros did this but not the standard forms. defmethod, declare, the, check-type? Maybe :type in slots and an array's :element-type, but that probably would look out of place.
<aeth>
(Well, green for me, might not be green for you.)
<Bike>
forms? i don't think the mechanism is that sophisticated
<aeth>
oh, that's unfortunate if it's not that sophisticated.
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<Bike>
in my emacs, if i do (let ((check-foo 4)) ...) check-foo is highlighted, but it's obviously a variable in context
<aeth>
Would Emacs easily have the capability to have (defmethod foo ((bar bar)) ...) highlight the second bar green like it highlights the bar green in void foo (bar b) { /* ... */ } in c-mode?
<aeth>
If it can't do that easily, that might be why it doesn't.
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<Bike>
it just does a regex search
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<Bike>
well, and a bunch of other stuff, but looks like mostly regex
<aeth>
seems like it would be a nightmare to use regex even if it's possible beacuse of stuff like &key (foo 42)
<Xach>
welcome to the nightmare
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<aeth>
And in my custom define-function, I permit &key (foo 42) as well as &key (foo 42 integer)
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<Bike>
i'm just looking at the value of font-lock-keywords in a buffer and deciding to not look any further
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<dlowe>
The CL editor climacs pretty much ran aground trying to provide a rigorous partial-form parser for fast accurate syntax formatting.
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<dialectic>
Formatting, or highlighting?
<dialectic>
Seems like there's only one real way to format lisp code. Although, I would prefer to put go-tags on the same indentation level as the block form itself, but parinfer ties my hands there...
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<dlowe>
dialectic: well, both
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<ober>
dialectic: thanks for protecting all my electronics
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<Josh_2>
I want to store threads in a hash table, however bt:make-thread starts the thread object, can I create the object without starting it?
<dlowe>
Josh_2: nope
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<Josh_2>
I can store the names of threads and the functions maybe and use that instead then
<dialectic>
What is a thread that isn't started? Sounds like a thunk to me.
<Josh_2>
could be a thunk
<hackware>
thunk...?
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<Bike>
a thunk is a function of no arguments.
<Bike>
a delayed computation.
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<aeth>
Josh_2: why not store the lambda that's used to make the thread?
<Josh_2>
that's what I'm going to do
<hackware>
was just wondering how an unstarted thread was a thunk...?
<Bike>
make-thread takes a thunk as an argument
<Bike>
the thunk represents the computation that will be done in the thread
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<hackware>
too deep 4 this noob... bak 2 clnoobs...
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<ober>
(lambda () (thunk)) vs (lambda (p) (not-thunk p))
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<aeth>
ober: (lambda (p) (lambda () (thunk p)))
<aeth>
although technically the thunk is the unnamed inner lambda, just like in your examples the thunk are the lambdas, not the named functions
<aeth>
(the thunk-or-not-thunk)
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<dialectic>
Is there a reader macro for evaling my defuns at compile time and load time? Should I just prefix the defun form with #. and be done with it? Or is that going to cause issues?
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<Bike>
you should evaluate things at read time as little as possible. maybe eval-when would work for you?
<dialectic>
I know there's also #, for load-time, was just hoping for another shortcut. wrapping in eval-when is not a problem, though
<Bike>
there is no #,
<Bike>
or maybe that was clisp only or something
<Bike>
in any case, #. is basically for values, not for entire big forms
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<Bike>
using it for a defun is definitely a hack
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<White_Flame>
dialectic: the cleanest way to control what prerequisites are visible at compile-time is to split it up into multiple files, and make sure the dependency is in an earlier-loaded fine
<White_Flame>
*file
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<dialectic>
That doesn't come without cost. I like to keep my macro definitions closer to the "one big function" I use them in.
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<White_Flame>
minion: memo for dialectic: If you have a macro that's only used in 1 function, then use MACROLET locally
<minion>
Remembered. I'll tell dialectic when he/she/it next speaks.
<White_Flame>
minion: memo for dialectic: You can even scope a MACROLET around multiple DEFUNs if you want
<minion>
Remembered. I'll tell dialectic when he/she/it next speaks.
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<no-defun-allowed>
Xach: sorry to bug you again, but wrt cl-ipfs-api2, should my friend resubmit her application now that the warning has been fixed?