sipa changed the topic of #bitcoin-wizards to: This channel is for discussing theoretical ideas with regard to cryptocurrencies, not about short-term Bitcoin development | http://bitcoin.ninja/ | This channel is logged. | For logs and more information, visit http://bitcoin.ninja
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<waxwing>
petertodd: reading your recent post, thanks, wondering about section 2, it's a nice intuitive explanation but it doesn't include the idea of amount hiding with pedersen commitments?
<waxwing>
or is the implication of that last sentence in 2.1 that there's a smarter way to avoid disclosing others' balances
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<instagibbs>
waxwing, sounds right, leaves' blinds could be customer-chosen as well.
<instagibbs>
or customer would be informed, whatever
<waxwing>
instagibbs: the idea was in some old pdf/presentation about 'provable solvency' that described maxwell-todd, it included that, don't know how accurate it was
<waxwing>
well, not sure what i mean by 'accurate', there it is
<instagibbs>
right it's probably already been designed and completely ignored by industry 5 years ago :P
<waxwing>
:) i wonder if anyone has written up what *does* get done? i know a few exchanges have various merkly type things on their websites, i'm sure i saw at least one myself.
<instagibbs>
thanks for the slide link, yeah looks like some older-style rangeproofs, CT style would be good fit
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<bsm1175321>
Is any form of "proof of solvency" valuable when the next block and stolen keys could scatter your proven solvency to the 4 corners of the earth?
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<instagibbs>
Defense in depth, nothing wrong with it.
<bsm1175321>
You'd also want some kind of timelock or covenant on the funds...
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<waxwing>
audits exist, and i think with good reason. one troublesome point is that with a "bottom up" approach (the users participate), users aren't as motivated as they might be, especially if it involves having to make an effort.
<othe>
But u can't audit the usd reserves for exchanges anyway
<qwertyLoL>
donate me pls 68 $ for new video card !!!+++156T9eSZCFjZixrjUxFzz9K2DrnWnXHuJg+++!!! thx and sorry
<qwertyLoL>
))
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<bsm1175321>
Dude is connected to the webchat via a VPS in Belize. Not sketchy in the slightest.
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<Eliel>
bsm1175321: Proof of Solvency is valuable in that insolvency can't be hidden for long. But I agree that covenant could improve things further. Timelock is less clearly useful because if the private keys have leaked, it mostly just delays the inevitable.
<Eliel>
although, if the exploit has merely given the hacker temporary ability to use the private keys to sign, then timelock can be helpful.
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