<wpwrak>
rejon: ah, vga line length ... make that 4096 pixels. it's 2048 bytes and the bus is only 4 bits wide. not that i'd really expect to come anywhere near that kind of resolution ;-) (it's not only a question of the ben but also of the monitor. if the monitor accepts an extremely low refresh rate, which a digital monitor could, then the ben could send it truly monstrous images)
<rejon>
wpwrak cool
<rejon>
slowfi
<wpwrak>
rejon: e.g., at the moment (bit-banging), i get about 50 Hz refresh for "single" mode and 30 Hz for "double" mode. those 30 Hz are where the monitor cuts off, either because it thinks the signal makes no sense or because we're at the limit of some internal counter/divider.
<wpwrak>
slovga/slowga :)
<rejon>
cool
<rejon>
slovga
<rejon>
hahaha
<wpwrak>
googling ... no porn star pics appear. good :)
<kristianpaul>
hmm, to much slow*, not !!
<wpwrak>
kristianpaul: yeah, better to make it faster than to figure out how to market something slow ;-)
<kristianpaul>
oh, yes i agree
<kristianpaul>
s/faster/usable/turnkey? :-)
<kristianpaul>
gustavo_: is your nanonote booting linux finally?
<kristianpaul>
I wonder if you got hardware usbboot to work..
<rozzin>
Well, I finally lost one of the little rubber feet on my NanoNote.
<wpwrak>
grmbl. this msc controller is a pain to trick into submission
<gustavo_>
kristianpaul, not
<gustavo_>
not for usbboot without the battery
<wpwrak>
*hmm* seems that the effect does indeed depend on chip-internal capacitance
<dvdk>
haha, found some mplayer options to tune:
<dvdk>
mplayer -novideo : > 20% CPU load
<dvdk>
mplayer -novideo -quiet : ca 10% CPU load
<dvdk>
:)
<dvdk>
mplayer console output taking 10% cpu load? maybe it's doing floating point math?
<dvdk>
now compiling with --enable-tremor-low to get audio decoding below 10% load
<dvdk>
ha, with --enable-tremor-low we're now at 7% cpu load
<dvdk>
nice, it now also properly plays back a 30 FPS ntsc video that it previously couldn't
<wpwrak>
dvdk: soon, you'll have HDTV with 3D ;-)
<dvdk>
wpwrak: we're still waiting for your bit-banged DVI port :)
<wpwrak>
dvdk: hmm, if we add a shift register and put the three channels together, we might be able to have monochrome DVI ;-)
<dvdk>
wpwrak: plus a high-speed clock to shift out the bits?  :)
<wpwrak>
dvdk: the MSC controller starts to come apart at 59 MHz, which is about half the speed DVI needs. i didn't look at the signals as 59 MHz. they're probably not very pretty ;-)
<wpwrak>
dvdk: yeah, some clock doubler or quadrupler :)
<dvdk>
wpwrak: why do we need that high clock anyways?  just make neighboring bits have the same value.  bit clock isn't transmitted anyways?
<wpwrak>
i thought in dvi it was ... checking ...
<dvdk>
wpwrak: ahh, ok mixing up dvi and hdmi
<wpwrak>
yup. clock is sent as well
<wpwrak>
hdmi should have it too, since it's based on dvi. checking ...
<dvdk>
wpwrak: well, then just wire up the sdio?  somehow need to fake the 8:10 encoding, though?
<wolfspraul>
roh: ah hi. I had another idea for the dmx tx push button problem - we make the entire case 1-2mm higher (the side panels)
<wolfspraul>
it turns out that the retention spring connector has the following problems:
<wolfspraul>
1) it is relatively rare compared to the push button version, so hard to get today, in the future, or for others that want to reuse the design. also it being discontinued is more likely than with the push button one.
<wolfspraul>
2) it has a slightly different pcb footprint than the push button one
<wolfspraul>
3) the mechanical stability of the retention spring is less than with the push button (I will compare the two myself later this week)
<wolfspraul>
I don't like making a big cut/notch into the top acrylic - that looks ugly. so maybe we just leave everything as-is.
<wolfspraul>
or... I was just thinking, we make the case 1-2mm higher.
<wolfspraul>
the height is 36mm right now
<roh>
is it the space between the button and the top or the thickness of the sheet?
<wolfspraul>
I'm seeing roughly 8mm below the DMX connectors, and 5mm above them
<roh>
thickness 'behind' the button i mean
<wolfspraul>
the push button is hard to reach because the massive round DMX cable is reaching in there
<roh>
ah.. at the top
<wolfspraul>
so your finger has to press between the DMX cable and the top acrylic, and push the button down there
<wolfspraul>
so we have 8mm below the DMX connectors, but only 5 above
<wolfspraul>
if the height would add say 2mm, maybe it's easier to press down the push button
<wolfspraul>
it probably is
<roh>
i see.. so giving it some 3mm there could already help
<wolfspraul>
sure I think so
<wolfspraul>
do you have a DMX cable there?
<roh>
'centering' of the dmx socket
<roh>
nope.. but some xlr mike cable
<wolfspraul>
if you have one, just plug into the TX connector and try to push the 'push' button
<roh>
in the end its a xlr 3pin right?
<wolfspraul>
you will immediately see the problem
<wolfspraul>
yes I think mic is male too, right?
<roh>
has both ends
<wolfspraul>
you can try to connect it
<roh>
the cable i mean
<wolfspraul>
great, just try
<roh>
will do as soon as i got a table ;)
<wolfspraul>
actually I think you designed the height of the case after the 'push' button
<wolfspraul>
because it _barely_ fits
<wolfspraul>
the top side of the push button is basically touching the top acrylic
<wolfspraul>
I don't think adding 2 or 3 mm will destroy the overall look of the case, but you never know
<roh>
i think thats more by accident
<wolfspraul>
it certainly adds a lot more air inside, because nobody but the DMX connectors needs this much height
<roh>
i will see what that involves at the end. will check for availability of spacers
<roh>
the top spacers would need to be longer
<wolfspraul>
ahh
<wolfspraul>
good point
<wolfspraul>
I forgot that
<roh>
;)
<wolfspraul>
and they are a nice 30mm right now
<roh>
exactly
<wolfspraul>
well I think cutting into the top acrylic above the push button is really ugly
<wolfspraul>
but who knows, maybe others think that's fine?
<wolfspraul>
maybe in the end we leave everything as-is :-)
<wolfspraul>
try with your xlr cable and let me know what you think...
<wolfspraul>
I will compare retention spring and push button connectors later this week
<roh>
sure. will take a few days till we are operational here anyhow
<roh>
just did a quick check.. 35mm seems the next common size for spacers
<wolfspraul>
too high I think
<wolfspraul>
let's scratch that idea
<wpwrak>
given a cable that carries signals "red", "green", and "blue", how would we color-code them ? obviously, red = orange, green = red, blue = medium brown.
<wolfspraul>
roh: how do you like a 'notch' in the top acrylic, design-wise?
<wolfspraul>
a curve-shaped cutout above the dmx tx push button...
<roh>
not that much. would look weird
<wolfspraul>
hmm. ok. what bugs me the most about the retention spring connector is that it clearly seems rarer than the push button one.
<wolfspraul>
from a copyleft perspective that's bad.
<roh>
sure. but in xlr and speakon there is no way to reasonable way beyond neutrik anyhow
<wolfspraul>
it's still from Neutrik so most likely it will be available for a long time, many years. but still. anyway I will compare the two in terms of mechanical stability first.
<wolfspraul>
I will compare the connectors, then I know whether I think the retention spring one is just crap mechanically. which I doubt it is.
<wolfspraul>
at that point we can use it, and done.
<wolfspraul>
or we leave everything as-is
<roh>
i used these connectors in many variants and clones before. and there is simply no reason besides trouble to buy from another vendor
<wolfspraul>
or we add a cutout into the top acrylic
<wolfspraul>
nobody is talking about another vendor
<wolfspraul>
neutrik has a retention spring version, without 'push' button
<wolfspraul>
we can switch to that
<roh>
just mentioning.. that we are bound to that vendor regardless which product
<wolfspraul>
that's one option
<wolfspraul>
yes but the retention spring seems to be rarer
<wolfspraul>
digikey, mouser, all have the push one in stock, the retention spring either 0 or very low quantities (like ca. 20)
<roh>
hm. yes. that trouble
<wolfspraul>
mouser - push button 6259, retention spring 24 (Adam just bought 2 and brought it from 26 to 24 :-))
<wolfspraul>
that kind of thing
<wolfspraul>
not good
<wolfspraul>
factory lead time 10 weeks
<wolfspraul>
we could rotate just the dx connector left 90 degrees, but that's also ugly, and we cannot roate the RX connector because the push button is on the cable there, needs to be on top to be reachable
<wolfspraul>
I meant "just the tx connector"
<roh>
heh. troubles of ME ;)
<wolfspraul>
farnell - push button 2459, retention spring 0
<wolfspraul>
maybe a cutout in the top acrylic is a good idea
<wolfspraul>
it's all about pros and cons
<wolfspraul>
think about it...
<aw>
wolfspraul, forgot to mention that being rarer to get retention spring. even later you get samples and feel that, I still don't think that we should change to retention spring one. :-)
<aw>
i just finished testing on  2A fuse / 2* Zeners. :-)
<aw>
I'll carefully read the results and send results to list though. :-)
<wolfspraul>
aw: let me first compare the 2 connectors mechanically
<wolfspraul>
but yes, it sounds like retention spring is not a good idea, for me primarily because it's rare, and we are really trying hard to build a reusable base for the future
<wolfspraul>
so that's a big thing for me
<wolfspraul>
then we are down so some other optios
<aw>
wolfspraul, hmm..
<wolfspraul>
1) leave everything as-is
<wolfspraul>
2) turn dmx tx 90 degree to the left, leave dmx rx as-is (sebastien says ugly)
<wolfspraul>
3) cutout top acrylic above the push button (roh says ugly)
<wolfspraul>
we'll contemplate :-)
<wolfspraul>
let's not get stuck on this one, it's a small thing and if we cannot come up with an improvement, we simply leave everything as-is
<wolfspraul>
I cannot disconnect DMX TX with my thumb, but with my point finger I can. oh well.
<wolfspraul>
:-)
<wolfspraul>
I don't think the DMX cables need to be connected and disconnected many times, say like something on USB, VGA, Ethernet, even video-in
<aw>
me either...hard to disconnect DMX TX cable. .
<aw>
yup...personal idea that should rarely plug in/out DMX cable. but well I am not the mature DJ, so I quite don't know how often they use them.
<wolfspraul>
roh: you could even make 2 such cutouts, just like half-moon shaped, above both the DMX TX as well as DMX RX connectors
<wolfspraul>
that would probably look better, and the DMX RX also has a push button, although it is on the cable so far better to reach than the one on the DMX TX connector
<wolfspraul>
maybe 2 cutouts would look funny though (=not good), don't know
<roh>
dunno. also it would thin the already small rim which holds the side panel
<wolfspraul>
true, above the DMX RX is the rim. oh well :-) like you say, welcome to ME...
<wolfspraul>
that was just for symmetry, it's not needed in order to release the DMX RX cable
<kristianpaul>
argg, spam back...
<Fusin>
hi 2 all
<kristianpaul>
hi
<Fusin>
;)
<Fusin>
hmm, i found pages talking bout Ya Nanonote as 'successor' to Ben.
<Fusin>
Is it planned to stop producing Ben?
<Fusin>
btw.: just for the interest: how many ben's are sold?
<kristianpaul>
Fusin: more thatn 1100 units i remenber sold
<kristianpaul>
and yes it still been produced Fusin
<kristianpaul>
last 1000 units batch was early this year i remenber
<Fusin>
i hope it still will in 10 years
<kristianpaul>
and i think there is one more left, i think...
<kristianpaul>
well in 10 years we should have a milkymist portable computer at least :D
<Fusin>
remembers the development on good old c64. The older it was, the better the software ;)
<kristianpaul>
well i hope my ben will still working, for a long time also, and if some passive component reach the end of life i could easilly replace it :-)
<Fusin>
I see this Ben as a good base for a PIM/PDA with good possibilities for little games (like those old 8bit-games [boulder-dash/sokoban/tetris/elite/mercenars/etc.pp]
<Fusin>
also good as ogg-player ;)
<Fusin>
No need for more. Bigger would be a sub-netbook :D
<Fusin>
Laptop battery is empty, /me leaves ans waves to all 'Good night guys'
<rjeffries>
wolfspraul we have not had an update on Nanonote sales for quite a while. I realize you do not have data on sell-through by your distributors
<rjeffries>
but could you tell us how many Bens Sharism has shipped? As mentioned before, my gut feeling is that rate of sales is quite slow recently, based on no newbiews showing up on irc or mail list
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: (nordic) sounds proprietary. that norduino page is also amazingly non-specific about any technical details
<rjeffries>
the radios are all proprietary including ATben/ATusb
<rjeffries>
I think the rest of his stuff is open a la Jee Labs
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: wrong. atben/atusb is IEEE 802.15.4-compliant
<rjeffries>
agree
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: the nordic stuff doesn't claim compatibility with anything
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: also, IEEE 802.15.4 defined various PHYs. the most likely to be able to talk to others is the 2450 MHz O-QPSK PHY. (IEEE 802.15.4, 2450 MHz is enough to identify it. there are other 2450 MHz PHYs, but defined in other documents, 803.25.4a and such)
<wpwrak>
err, 802.15.4a
<rjeffries>
I have asked them about what license they use and about the Nordic chip
<rjeffries>
I seem to remember in dim recesses that Nordic is doing their own thing
<rjeffries>
the beauty of the Nordic chip is very low power
<rjeffries>
wpwrak have you had any status at all from Tuxbrain re the fisrt manufacturing run? teh silence is deafening
<rjeffries>
wpwrak what has to happen (once you have eveerything working) to be able to easily install ATusb code on Ubuntu
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: (ant) sounds like a dead end, like so many "vendor standards" that perished when a proper standard came out
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: (tuxbrain) he says he's very busy. i should have some more news from him soonish, though. (btw, i did mention this on the channel. you should stay logged in / read the logs :)
<wpwrak>
(ubuntu) ubuntu will be hard, because of their freakish custom kernel. the path of least resistance would be via upstream. so expect a few months until it's there. (or figure out how to build a vanilla kernel that works on ubuntu)
<rjeffries>
wpwrak I am not promotingAnt protocol. I do wonder how well 6LoWpan will perform as in environment where a node only needs to connect once or twice an hour
<rjeffries>
wpwrak I do not understand what this statement means, sorry... "the path of least resistance would be via upstream..."
<rjeffries>
wpwrak putting Ubuntu aside, what distro are you working with for ATusb?
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: my workstation is running ubuntu. i haven't touched kernel support for atusb yet. (richard has written a skeleton driver, though. no idea what distro he uses.)
<wpwrak>
rjeffries: (path of least resistance) means that building a kernel that works is a bit messy with ubuntu (or at last it was the last time i tried)