14:13 <notlikeme> hi there. i have few newb questions regarding expected Neo900 user experience. on what i managed to look at from list of potentially compatible OS/interfaces: QtMoko is dead? (last updated 12.12.2013), SHR is dead? (last ticket on trac is updated somewhere in 2013), Debian -- as i understand its very solid option, but does it have something usable for smartphone on top (UI/applications)? Replicant -- i have never seen it in action

14:16 <notlikeme> So if to generalize my question -- will it be possible to use something alive, modern and comfortable, not semi-dead obsolete environments? I understand that everything listed above is driven by enthusiasts, but still...

14:22 <hendi> hoi

14:27 <amatus> ohi

14:48 <pigeons> notlikeme: I know they want maemo to work well right waway. I would expect probably devuan at least eventually. Of course you can run whatever software you like, perhaps android

15:00 <ceene> replicant is basically android, isn't it?

15:01 <pigeons> yes

15:01 <notlikeme> pigeons: and if to stick with "opensource only" - what usable options do we have left? i think about using Skype+Viber+Chromium on Neo900 in some jailed environment (like i currently have with LXC container on my desktop). Do you know will it be possible on Neo900?

15:02 <pigeons> maemo is open source except for a few tiny parts that are being cloned and devuan is open source

15:02 <DocScrutinizer05> skype isn't

15:02 <pigeons> skype is farthest from open source, i dont know what viber is, and though chromium claims to be open source, good luck actually building it, plus it downloads binary blobs

15:03 <DocScrutinizer05> ouch

15:03 <DocScrutinizer05> didn't know

15:03 <pigeons> yeah the binary blobs activate your microphone!

15:03 <DocScrutinizer05> LOL

15:03 <DocScrutinizer05> good luck with that on Neo900 ;-)

15:03 <notlikeme> no, i mean opensource OS / environment + good jail (LXC?) for proprietary stuff

15:04 <DocScrutinizer05> should work

15:05 <DocScrutinizer05> heck, they had win98 and OS-X running on the N900 ;-) In qemu or whatever virtulization. And actually "running" is maybe the wrong term ;-)

15:06 <DocScrutinizer05> I think OS-X took like an hour to boot up ;-)

15:06 <pigeons> this is when i gave up on chromium. https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=786909

15:06 <DocScrutinizer05> prolly swap hell extreme

15:06 <pigeons> and yeah if you seriously want a hole in your head try to compile it. some of the pre-requisites are wget | sh

15:07 <DocScrutinizer05> AAARRRRRRGHH!

15:07 <notlikeme> so to have it working on Neo900 i'll need to stick with Debian system only? i just trying to imagine my OS/environment/technologies to work with when ill order Neo900 board, since my used N900 is arriving tomorrow and there is no way back :)

15:07 <pigeons> it does lots of fun things https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=792580

15:07 <DocScrutinizer05> s/debian/devuan/ and you're fine

15:07 <pigeons> notlikeme: why do you say you need to stick with debian?

15:08 <pigeons> but yeah that will have the most support at first besides maemo

15:08 <DocScrutinizer05> Jaromil promised we'll have a Neo900 devuan

15:09 <pigeons> awesome

15:09 <DocScrutinizer05> http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1506773

15:09 <notlikeme> since i dont know if it will be possible to jail something on Replicant and i dont want proprietary stuff to run in-the-wild, looks like Debian is the only option left?

15:11 <pigeons> you can run any software you want. devuan/debian and maemo should be supported right away

15:11 <pigeons> what option are you hoping for?

15:12 <notlikeme> LXC support to isolate everything potentially insecure/suspicious

15:12 <pigeons> should be fine as Doc said

15:12 <notlikeme> or at least some type of chroot hardening like GrSecurity is able to

15:13 <notlikeme> kk, got it :)

15:14 <pigeons> that doesnt really have to do with the neo900. the debian/devuan kernel should be able to do it. The maemo kernel is rahter old so I'm not sure what is supported.

15:15 <notlikeme> i have one more Q regarding UI: what is the most solid solution for using mobile-related stuff on top of Debian? i mean desktop for touch, SMS/calls/contact list/etc

15:15 <DocScrutinizer05> FPTF is on 4.x meanwhile

15:15 <DocScrutinizer05> kernel, that is

15:15 <DocScrutinizer05> notlikeme: in my book that's maemo

15:16 <DocScrutinizer05> despite many uninformed gossip, maemo is mostly a standard debian

15:17 <DocScrutinizer05> well, ok, it stole upstart from buntkuh

15:17 <notlikeme> DocScrutinizer05: so it will be possible to just take all the maemo userland and install it on top of modern Debian?

15:17 <DocScrutinizer05> and added some OHM on top

15:18 <DocScrutinizer05> hmm, on devuan we hope for that, yes

15:18 <DocScrutinizer05> though it will be tricky for sure

15:19 <notlikeme> wow, sounds good

15:19 <DocScrutinizer05> many of the libs that userland stuff got linked against are obsolete now, and the new lib versions are no longer compatible

15:19 <DocScrutinizer05> of course you *could* start each app with its own libs

15:20 <DocScrutinizer05> or use a chroot to run maemo inside

15:21 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway NB that the Neo900 company isn't involved into sw development. We only support community projects that tackle this

15:22 <notlikeme> i see. thank you for answers. it made things clear for me.

15:23 <DocScrutinizer05> you're very welcome

15:23 <DocScrutinizer05> trhanks for your interest :-)

15:24 <DocScrutinizer05> drop by any time and ask whatever you want to know. Always happy to answer ;-)

15:25 <notlikeme> 10x! :)

15:38 <wpwrak> DocScrutinizer05: you'll love this. pity they don't build the nano with two adapters ;-) http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/adafruit-industries-llc/2658/1528-1360-ND/5604373

22:29 <pigeons> https://lists.dns-oarc.net/pipermail/dns-operations/2016-June/014964.html

22:38 <FIQ> https://lists.dns-oarc.net/pipermail/dns-operations/2016-June/014964.html

22:38 <FIQ> oh, someone linked already, sorry

22:38 <pigeons> :)

22:39 <pigeons> only place you can post that stuff without getting responses of, "Oh so you want to force me to maintain my shitty sysv ini scripts"?