malc changed the topic of #ocaml to: OCaml 3.06 released: http://caml.inria.fr/ocaml/distrib.html | http://www.ocaml.org/ | http://caml.inria.fr/oreilly-book/ | http://icfp2002.cs.brown.edu/ | SWIG now supports OCaml
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<scott> anyone here done cgi with ocaml?
<_mattam_> no, but did you looked at ocamlnet?
<scott> I looked at the front page
<_mattam_> I looked inside the sources (there's a file manager example) and it's quite nice and powerful
<scott> cool, I'll check it out
<scott> I was writing my first cgi script with REBOL when I discovered I can't change environment variables w/o buying the full version :(
<_mattam_> huh
<_mattam_> I don't like proprietary languages (say Java) but that restricting it seems really awful
<scott> yeah, they don't call it restricting it, it's just that that feature "is only available in the pro version" :)
<scott> it's an awesome language, I was loving it, but you have to be able to change env vars..
<_mattam_> well, could you do it at a lower level? I saw an article on it and it seemed very net and gui oriented, with convenient libs only
<_mattam_> and i dislike [ ] for blocks BTW
<scott> you can't, infact it is still low level even with the nonfree version
<scott> you care what character they use to designate blocks? :)
<_mattam_> yes, i do have preferences for code aesthetics... I read a lot of
<scott> and what's your favorite character for blocks?
<_mattam_> nothing(if indented :) or {}
<_mattam_> but that's just my taste :)
<scott> I don't really care much, as long as the language has the other 10 million features I want :)
<_mattam_> lisp as features anybody could want... but a strange syntax
<scott> know where I get ocamlfind?
<scott> in debian
<_mattam_> I know it is packaged for debian, but where?
<scott> like which packag
<scott> e
<_mattam_> apt-cache search package :)
<scott> hmm, trying make on ocaml net
<scott> configure says it found PCRE
<scott> but make says it can't find package pcre
<_mattam_> you can query with ocamlfind
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<scott> ocamlfind query doesn't find pcre
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<karryall> pnou, t'es par là ?
<pnou> ouaip
<pnou> toujours là ?
<karryall> oui, à propos du crash du compilo que j'avais l'autre jour
<karryall> je l'ai recompilé
<karryall> et ça ne doit pas être la faute de gcc3
<karryall> car ça plante pendant le coldstart
<karryall> alors qu'il utilise boot/ocamlrun
<pnou> hum
<karryall> étrange hein ?
<karryall> il doit y avoir une couille dans mon système
<pnou> ouais plutôt
<pnou> t'as essayé de virer l'ancienne version avant de compiler ?
<karryall> l'ancienne version de ocaml ?
<karryall> mais elle est pas utilisée
<karryall> il utilise boot/ocamlrun qui vient dans le tarball, non ?
<karryall> ah ben non tiens
<karryall> cp byterun/ocamlrun boot/ocamlrun
<karryall> bon ben ça doit bien être gcc3
<karryall> hurmmm, rmm
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<pnou> bah si il utilise ocamlrun du tarball
<pnou> mais bon, peut-être qu'il y a une lib dynamique ou un truc dans le genre qui fait foireux
<pnou> enfin j'ai pas vraiment d'argument, mais vu que ça marche chez tout le monde sauf chez toi ça doit être un problème d'environnement
<karryall> ok je crois que j'ai trouvé
<karryall> j'avais la version i686 de la glibc
<karryall> j'ai viré et remplacé par la version i386
<karryall> ça a l'air de mieux marcher
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<pnou> marrant
<karryall> mouais
<karryall> c'est un pentium II comme processeur
<karryall> c'est pourtant bien un i686 ?
<pnou> voui
<pnou> tu avais des problèmes qu'avec ocaml ?
<karryall> hum, oui
<pnou> peut-être qu'il a un bug qui ne se rélève qu'avec la libc i686
<karryall> peut-etre, mais comme c'est pas trés reproductible ...
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<pnou> bon icfp !
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<karryall> quoi, ça a commencé ?
<xtrm_> ca commence a minuit non?
<karryall> 12h00 UTC -7
<karryall> donc 21h00 ici
<xtrm_> ah j'ai pas fait attention
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<Miwong> hello
<smkl> hi
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<karryall> salut
<two-face> yo
<two-face> ah tiens , c'est toi :)
<karryall> yep :)
<two-face> enchanté
<two-face> pnou participe à l'icfp ?
<karryall> on dirait ...
<karryall> je viens de lire le truc
<two-face> ?
<karryall> l'"énoncé" pour l'icfp
<karryall> c'est rigolo
<two-face> ah oui
<two-face> je suis en train
<karryall> une bataille de robots
<two-face> on a la liste des équipes ?
<karryall> euh non je pense pas
<karryall> la participation est libre de toutes façons
<two-face> les fois précédentes, il y avait des équipes
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<karryall> "Players may enter alone or as teams of any size. Anyone is eligible to enter"
<two-face> oui
<karryall> donc oui il y a des equipes
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<pnou_icfp> nan on a pas la liste
<pnou_icfp> on donne le nom de son équipe que quand on soumet
<two-face> pnou_icfp: tu es tout seul ?
<pnou_icfp> l'est pas très rigolo le sujet cette année :/
<pnou_icfp> nan avec un pote
<pnou_icfp> si y en a qui veulent aider... :)
<two-face> je ne peux pas
<two-face> pnou_icfp: je termine cameleon
<pnou_icfp> tu t'en sors comment alors avec les sources d'ocaml ?
<two-face> pnou_icfp: j'essaie de minimiser la compilation : make world opt doit suffire ?
<pnou_icfp> ouais
<two-face> pnou_icfp: par contre maintenant, j'ai un pb coté deb de lablgtk
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<pnou_icfp> oué lequel ?
<pnou_icfp> (désolé d'être un peu long, j'icfpise :)
<two-face> pnou_icfp: il y a des cmo qui manquent dans le paquet :)
<pnou_icfp> c'est parce qu'ils sont pas installés
<two-face> par défaut ?
<pnou_icfp> faut changer le makefile
<two-face> c'est un bug ?
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<pnou_icfp> je pense, j'ai pas encore de réponse
<two-face> merci de prévenir !! :)
<gl-LAN> salut mes petits amis virtuels!
<two-face> salut gl-LAN
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<Torquemada> ca a commencé, l'ICFP .
<Torquemada> ?
<two-face> oui
<Torquemada> je suis en retard pour coder alors ? :)
<two-face> j'imagine :)
<pnou_icfp> oué oué on t'attend Torquemada !
<pnou_icfp> yop gl au fait :)
<Torquemada> yo :)
<Torquemada> y'a un LAN en ce moment chez moi
<Torquemada> c'est un peu le bordel mais bon, on fait bien mumuse
<pnou_icfp> vous jouez à des jeux, vous écoutez de la musique à fond et vous vous saoulez la gueule ? :)
<Torquemada> OUASI #@!
<Torquemada> :)
<Torquemada> warcraft3, quake3, Dark Age of Camelot, Dunjeon Siege, etc
<pnou_icfp> j'en connais aucun :)
<Torquemada> :/
<pnou_icfp> mais je connais les 2 de warcraft et quake
<two-face> DOOM 3 !
<Torquemada> mh
<Torquemada> celui la je l'attends avec impatience
<Torquemada> mais entre temps faut que je m'achete un 2.8Gh et une GeForce 4 Ti4600 !)
<two-face> tu as une machine suffisante :)
<Torquemada> non pas vraiment, j'ai un celeron 600 avec geforce2 :)
<two-face> alors pleure ta mère :)
<Torquemada> ouais :/ heureusement j'ai bossé cet été pour m'offrir des choses..
<two-face> hihi
<two-face> mon Dieu
<Torquemada> enfin bon, la je viens de commander un laptop dell, j'ai un gros trou dans mon porte-feuille
<Torquemada> bon j'y retourne la
* Torquemada &
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<two-face> hello anonymous people
<demoncrat> hello
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<two-face> you aren't?
<demoncrat> just came by in case there was icfp-contest chat here
<two-face> some people are doing it ATM
<karryall> ATM ?
<karryall> koi ca ?
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<two-face> At The Moment
<two-face> cf Jargon
<karryall> oké
<karryall> two-face: tu utilises ocamlsdl pour un projet ou tu package juste ?
<two-face> karryall: je souhaite m'en servir dans de futurs projets
<two-face> karryall: vous comptez stabiliser pour bientot?
<karryall> ça a pas mal avancé,
<karryall> c'est presque complet maintenant
<karryall> mais tout n'est pas testé ;)
<two-face> je recompile souvent et j'ai été surpris un moment pas ttf :)
<two-face> heureusement luc a rajouté un test:)
<karryall> pourquoi, il se passait quoi ?
<karryall> ah oui, le test sur le num de version
<two-face> ya pas de sdltt2 dans debian encore
<karryall> j'ai pas trop fait gaffe c'est vrai
<karryall> j'ai pris la dernière version
<karryall> mais c'est surtout les modules video et events qui vont beaucoup changer
<two-face> disons qu'il faut que je fasse gaffe de mon côté
<karryall> bah de toutes facons, j'ai pas l'impression qu'il y ait enormement d'utilisateurs
<two-face> je ne peux pas les comptabiliser
<karryall> en tout cas, la ML de dev est plutot calme ...
<two-face> :)
<smkl> in case somebody is interested, here is a page for a game i'm writing: http://kokatrix.sourceforge.net/tutorial.html
<two-face> smkl: very nice
<karryall> smkl: do you known of other projects using ocamlsdl ?
<smkl> karryall: nope. i've written some simple stuff, but they are not up-to-date atm
<karryall> those in the games dir in the repository ?
<smkl> those, and something similar stuff
<smkl> those games need better graphics and user interfaces
<karryall> speaking of UI, I see you're using lablGTK with SDL, right ?
<karryall> is it easy to get them working together ?
<smkl> well, there are no real problems, because they don't really interact
<karryall> ok, so nothing special
<smkl> i don't know if it's possible to for example embed the SDL window inside a gtk+ widget etc.
<karryall> that's possible, there's an example of this somewhere on the SDL website
<karryall> I thought you were doing this
<two-face> karryall: is it possible to use lablGL with ocamlSDL ?
<karryall> two-face: I plan to investigate this
<karryall> I compiled lablGL this afternoon :)
<karryall> I guess it should be possible
<two-face> sdl makes it possible to use GL, so
<karryall> smkl: here it is http://www.libsdl.org/projects/gtk-demo/
<karryall> yep
<karryall> mais j'y connais que dalle en GL alors ...
<two-face> hmm
<karryall> two-face: t'as essayé ?
<smkl> see te globe example in games directory, it uses opengl
<smkl> the
<two-face> karryall: non, c'était juste un interrogation
<karryall> smkl: great !
<karryall> I'll put a blurb in the documenation about lalbGTL and lablGL
<karryall> pnou_icfp: alors, les robots déménageurs ?
<pnou_icfp> on a fait nos structures
<pnou_icfp> je commence à faire le parser de la sortie du serveur
<pnou_icfp> ce qui est relou c'est qu'ils ont pas l'air de fournir le serveur
<karryall> si dans la FAQ ils disent qu'il y aura un serveur de test
<smkl> to put an sdl window inside gtk window, you need to initialize sdl after the gtk window is created, and the gtk-window needs to have a corresponding x window (i don't know if gtk has an x window for every widget)
<karryall> no I don't think so ...
<smkl> well, i guess lablgtk widgets with #misc have associated x window (since misc ops and events are just "gdk" (read xlib) stuff)
<karryall> yeah ... something like that
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<karryall> damn
<karryall> I didn't compile SDL with GL support
<two-face> bye
<karryall> 'tcho
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<smkl> karryall: is color handling broken?
<karryall> smkl: you mean in ocamlsdl ?
<karryall> not that I known of ...
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<karryall> smkl: nice, globe works great !
<smkl> #ifdef __GNUC__ #define SDL_COLOR_FROM_VALUE ...: what is this trying to accomplish? and i think that the float colors are not handled, too...
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<karryall> in sdlvideo or sdlvideo2 ?
<smkl> sdlvideo_stub.h
<karryall> hum, yes it is totally buggy
<karryall> I'll just leave the previous macro
<smkl> it will work for most cases. i don't think anyone uses the float colors
<karryall> yes, that's what I think too
<karryall> maybe we should drop them
<smkl> theoretically, somebody might need 16bit color components... btw gtk+ uses them
<karryall> smkl: I fixed the SDL_COLOR_FROM stuff
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<smkl> karryall: thanks
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<smkl> hmm, #haskell has Simon PJ
<karryall> who is Simon PJ ?
<smkl> Simon Peyton-Jones, author of GHC Haskell Compiler
<smkl> when #ocaml has 100 users, X Leroy will be here
<smkl> i promise
<smkl> VOTE ME!!!
<karryall> :)
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<uberfunk_> hello all
<uberfunk_> i'm reading through an ocaml tutorial, and scoping is confusing me
<uberfunk_> anyone around to give me a hint?
<smkl> hey
<karryall> yep
<uberfunk_> ok, well I've lost the URL, so i'll just paste the code
<uberfunk_> # let sum i =
<uberfunk_> let sum2 j =
<uberfunk_> i + j
<uberfunk_> in
<uberfunk_> sum2;;
<uberfunk_> val sum : int -> int -> int = <fun>
<uberfunk_> I don't understand the type of that statement
<uberfunk_> perhaps you could talk me through the statement
<karryall> well you define sum
<karryall> it has one argument : i
<karryall> which is an int
<karryall> in the definition of sum
<uberfunk_> yes
<smkl> let sum2 j = i + j in sum2 ==> let sum2 = fun j -> i + j in sum2 ==> fun j -> i + j
<karryall> you declare sum2
<karryall> sum2 is a function taking another int as argument
<karryall> sum2 returns an int (i+j
<karryall> so, the type of sum2 is int -> int
<karryall> now, the return value of sum is sum2 itself
<uberfunk_> ok
<karryall> so the type of sum is int -> (int -> int)
<uberfunk_> ok
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<uberfunk_> which is the same as int -> int -> int
<karryall> exactly
<uberfunk_> is the = <fun> just sugar then?
<karryall> that's just an indication of the toplevel
<uberfunk_> ok
<uberfunk_> its not really part of the type?
<karryall> not part of the langage
<uberfunk_> or is fun a type?
<karryall> no
<uberfunk_> ok
<karryall> it is a fun value (no type)
<uberfunk_> 1. how does sum2 get its return value
<smkl> it is just the way the toplevel prints functions
<uberfunk_> 2. how does j become an argument to sum
<karryall> it's not exactly an argument to sum
<karryall> when you do sum a b
<karryall> if first applies a to sum
<karryall> this yields sum2
<uberfunk_> ok
<karryall> with i bound to a
<karryall> and then it applies b to sum2
<karryall> sum2 is then fully applied
<karryall> with a bound to i and b boudn to j
<uberfunk_> I think I understand
<karryall> and it computes the result
<uberfunk_> i'm going to keep going, and perhaps pop back in here if something throws me
<uberfunk_> thanks for your help
<karryall> you're welcome