ec changed the topic of #elliottcable to: a 𝕯𝖊𝖓 𝖔𝖋 𝕯𝖊𝖙𝖊𝖗𝖒𝖎𝖓𝖊𝖉 𝕯𝖆𝖒𝖘𝖊𝖑𝖘 slash s͔̞u͕͙p͙͓e̜̺r̼̦i̼̜o̖̬r̙̙ c̝͉ụ̧͘ḷ̡͙ţ͓̀ || #ELLIOTTCABLE is not about ELLIOTTCABLE
<Pyrrh> ec: i know we aren't close-close but I've never ingested marijuana either
* Pyrrh necros dead conversation
<jfhbrook> I smoked off and on through college but committed in a big way during grad school
<jfhbrook> like in a "oh look josh thinks he's a pothead now" kinda way
<jfhbrook> ec: marak was the "dev evangelist" from nodejitsu
<jfhbrook> and my boss for about 2 years
<joepie91> I'm stepping through a bunch of canvas-drawing code with a debugger to figure out why a change isn't being drawn
<joepie91> kill me now
* joepie91 hates obscure bugs like this
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<yorick> ec: I lost a few smart people to pot, so yeah, not touching that stuff
<yorick> some of my friends have been enjoying MDMA though
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<ec> yorick: I'd be so down for e or lsd
<ec> and I'm currently *on* illegal meth, I guess???
<ec> but pot, jesus
<ec> it doesn't seem to have any upside beyond convincing-you-it-has-upsides
<ec> “oh I'm so much more ~~creative~~ on pot!” no you're not your art is terrible
<ec> “but I'm so charismatic and social on pot!” no you're not you're (even more of?) an annoyance
<ec> I *want* to say “I can't fathom taking a drug that makes me *visibly dumber* by choice” ... but I drink alcohol?
<ec> idk I think it should be legal, but boring and mostly ignored. a thing reasonable, productive adults do once a month, and only Really Shitty people do every day. alcohol-level.
<jfhbrook> I like how it makes me feel
<jfhbrook> regardless of how it makes me appear from the outside (baked)
* ec hugs jfhbrook
<jfhbrook> though honestly, at a certain point and with a certain pattern of use it's not really getting wrecked anymore
<ec> even I don't want to take something that feels good away from the people I care about
<ec> I'm Very Aware this is all in my own head /=
<jfhbrook> like a few beers isn't getting sloppy y'know?
<jfhbrook> or at least might not be
<ec> thx jfhbrook
<ec> u do u
<ec> also maybe do me too
<ec> uh that was supposed to imply “write my code”
<ec> it came out implying “fuck my body”
<ec> oops
<ec> so Things.app is literally the freaking best
* swart still uses org mode
<swart> other people on my tl raving about things tho
<swart> not just ec. it's like a conspiracy of effective people
<ec> lmao
<ec> the raving is just b/cuz of the big release.
<ec> it's simple:
<ec> 1. Things is proprietary,
<ec> 2. *and* Things only works if you dedicate your *entire* life to it
<swart> omg
<ec> (very effective business-model, that. 🤔)
<swart> it's like the company I work at has gone all in on pivotal cloud
<swart> managers chanting the mantra of the "pivotal way"
<ec> 3. They haven't released a serious update in literally like *four or five years*, Things 3 has been vapourware forever
* swart is always skeptical of new religions
<ec> but like worse, they've been responding to complaints or requests in half of that period with “We won't be making many more changes because there's a big release” basically
<swart> old ones too tbh
<ec> so 4. everyone is FREAKING THE FUCK OUT that Things 3 is finally here
<swart> 8 bucks tho
<ec> for those of us who use it, we've been desperately waiting for it, with not a lot of options
<ec> oh, no, more like $50
<swart> that's like 2 coffee milkshakes
<ec> Things.app for Mac: $40
<ec> Things.app for iPhone: idk
<ec> Things.app for iPad: shit idk either
<ec> thought iTunes would show me, but it won't
<ec> but iPad is like $25, and iPhone is like $10
<ec> iirc
<ec> and that's *on sale* for the new release
<ec> tbh, it *is* extremely well designed
<ec> there's a reason it engenders such investment (money, time, *and* proprietary-investiture)
<ec> it just sucks to be shackled to this one company's release-cycle
<ec> while we're at it: goddamn new Pastebot is awesome, too
<swart> things 3 for iphone is $7.99
<swart> I don't have an ipad anymore
<swart> I think the main reason I don't use gtk style apps is I just don't like keeping track of a lot of stuff
<swart> if it doesn't fit in the top of my head I just assume someone will remind me if it's important
<swart> ^gtk^gtd
<ec> gtk?
<ec> ah yes
<ec> heh
<ec> if that works for you, grand
<ec> people don't remind me, except by “you fucker, you forgot to do that???”
<swart> I dunno if it works :)
<ec> >,>
<swart> I rely a lot on routine
<swart> oh it's 5:00 better feed the dog
<ec> I have no routine, so GTD and calendar are *super fucking essential for me*
<swart> oh the dog wants to go out, better walk the dog
<ec> at any given moment in my life the *only* idea I have what I'm going to do next, is Things.app's Today view
<ec> that's been true for a solid decade I think
<ec> or however-long Things has existed — a long fucking time
<swart> I just spent 4 days on one technical task. super annoying
<swart> I have text files and directories full of projects I've started and then abandonded
<swart> for a while I tried to organize and prioritize all that
<swart> but this thing I was stuck on was an interesting use of that
<swart> I suddenly realized on Saturday afternoon that I solved a similar problem a while ago
<swart> found some python code from Feb 2014 - nailed it
<swart> was weird. when I looked at the code it was like someone else had written it
<swart> but I took the time to understand it and the answer to this problem just fell out
<swart> now nobody cares but me because I'm on a new project
<swart> every week I get a "knowledge of the week" email extolling "soft skills training"
<swart> why does it offend me
<swart> the term "soft skills" - as if these vaguely defined things are somehow different from never-defined "hard skills"
<jfhbrook> just because people are bad at defining things (they are) doesn't mean there's no such thing as soft skills tho
<swart> todays example "thinking outside the box"
<swart> jfhbrook: maybe but it seems like the term deserves criticism :)
<swart> tbh I'm filled with rage but at a containable level
<ec> soft skills are a very real thing
<ec> and they're a thing programmers are terrible at
<swart> is empathy a skill
<ec> and they're ill-defined, not clean and logical, and thus something that, *far worse*, programmers are bad terrible at *becoming un-terrible at *
<ec> “What? That's not a real thing! Explain to me immediately and in in-depth logical detail what this is, or I refuse to accept I am bad at it. Hah! You can't!”
<swart> like "thinking outside the box"?
<swart> that's not a skill, it's a cliche
<ec> what's that cliché about clichés being cliché for a reason
<ec> ;)
<swart> someone has the job of sending emails helping us with soft skills
<swart> and not just programmers, everyone in the company
<ec> well that person is obviously terrible at their job, too
<swart> we have like 200 people in IT out of 6000 employees
<swart> I'm not insisting on perfect definitions
<swart> just critical thinking
<jfhbrook> empathy is a thing you can train, yes
<jfhbrook> I think creativity is as well, though harder to train for
<ec> so soft skills: how to *improve them in other people*, idk; but they're pretty easy to work on, yourself
<jfhbrook> like "write every day" or whatever is that kind of thing
<ec> it's *literally* just a matter of trying, as far as I can tell
<ec> 90% of people who seem bad at interpersonal stuff ... seem to be reactionary, insisting they're not bad at such things, refusing to examine their own failures
<ec> literally *all* you have to do is swallow your ego, and then ... keep living? for like five years?
<swart> I'm bad at personal stuff. sometimes I try to get better sometimes I get in a funk and can't be bothered
<swart> but I do try sometimes and I get good feedback for that
<ec> if you even barely pay attention to your own wrongs, you'll just start to naturally (and *easily*, tbh) improve. The only truly-terrible people I know, the ones I don't ever see improve, are the ones who insist that stuff doesn't matter, and they're Already Better because they're Logical™.
<swart> thankfully I don't have to deal with too many people like that anymore
<ec> which they're not, ofc; “Logical” is always used as just an wayyy-more-ill-defined excuse to not self-examine 🙄
<ec> </rant>
<swart> but it means I can't get a job at a SV tech firm anymore either ;)
<ec> 10:36:46 AM <swart> I'm bad at personal stuff. sometimes I try to get better sometimes I get in a funk and can't be bothered
<ec> relatable af
<swart> I don't think I'm a logical person
<swart> I know I'm extremely emotional. always have been
* ec high-fives swart
<swart> I'm better as I've gotten olders
<swart> but I like analyzing stuff, especially if it's things that people tend to agree on without thinking about what they mean
<swart> sometimes people get mad when you question their assumptions. I don't see that as a win really
<swart> I guess it goes back to the lsd/e references earlier
<swart> I used to love that shit but that was a whole lifetime ago
<ec> rando thought
<swart> now I dull my senses with wine because that's what's acceptable
<ec> go to that boring person and tell them it's not working
<ec> maybe they just need feedback, or to be informed that someone actually cares (even if only to hate them) about those stupid emails :P
<swart> you mean the person who sent me the email?
<swart> oh yeah I could try and help
<ec> instant increase in interest and effort invested into the ‘soft skills’ section
<swart> I have a bad habit of getting in arguments with HR
<ec> excellent opportunity to make them appreciate you mby
<ec> i'm off
<swart> for some reason they still like me
<swart> laters
<swart> thanks for the inputs
* ec disappears in a cloud of Things.app tasks
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<pikajude> why do rom hosting sites stay up