<azonenberg>
each Mux16to1_raw fits in a single slice
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<wolfspraul>
just unpacking my iCon iCreativ
<wolfspraul>
first impressions: HEAVY! :-)
<wolfspraul>
packaging and plastics/metal all have a cheap feel to them
<wolfspraul>
cheap chinese heavy metal :-)
<wolfspraul>
but not bad
<wolfspraul>
I'm wondering whether I can safely open it to look at the internals without damaging it right away
<wolfspraul>
ha, ok. whatever button I press - something happens ;-)
<wolfspraul>
they know how to please the dummies
<wolfspraul>
all red though, tiring
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<wpwrak>
hehe ;-)
<wpwrak>
and yes, you can open it. you'll be impressed by the amount of chips on that pcb :)
<wpwrak>
there's one chip for usb, one for the touch screen, the mcu, plus a few more i didn't bother to try to identify. perhaps led drivers.
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<wpwrak>
(cheap) you should try the korg nanoKONTROL for comparison :)
<wpwrak>
if you have a recent build installed (soc and all), then turning the knobs etc. should produce variable changes in the MIDI dialog
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<GitHub78>
[scripts] xiangfu pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/LZRgcA
<GitHub78>
[scripts/master] format make-up, fix one type on AR - Xiangfu Liu
<wpwrak>
xiangfu: btw, do your builds also track changes in SoC, FPGA, etc. ? wolfgang will need usb-midi soonish, and i'm not sure what he should install
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, the build track changes on all git repos about Milkymist under github: '/milkymist' '/flickernoise' '/autotest-m1' '/mtk' '/rtems-yaffs2' '/liboscparse' 'script'
<xiangfu>
wpwrak, I should add the wernermisc. since there are some patches in your wernermisc. :)
<wpwrak>
xiangfu: and you also rebuild the SoC (soc.fpg) ?
<wpwrak>
(patches in wernermisc) hmm, hopefully only very few :)
<xiangfu>
yes. rebuild all images that needs by m1.
<xiangfu>
yes. sure.
<wpwrak>
excellent, thanks
<xiangfu>
maybe we can add another one about ftpd.
<wolfspraul>
I see a lot of weaknesses already :-)
<wolfspraul>
for now - if I would have a free option between the icreativ and a similar software running on an ipad, I would prefer the ipad
<wpwrak>
the mechnical quality is good for the price range (as far as MIDI devices are concerned). but yes, it has its obvious shortcomings
<wolfspraul>
but that's very early, I haven't used it yet and I definitely will
<wolfspraul>
I can only tell over time whether I start to really *like* this thing or not
<wolfspraul>
oh my feedback is super early, just because you ask
<wpwrak>
i think tablets will be worth looking into, yes
<wolfspraul>
well, I think if mechanical quality is good, maybe that will be superior to tablets
<wolfspraul>
but I don't see that with the icreativ right now
<wpwrak>
elements the icreativ has that are missing in a tablet are the encoders and the faders. not sure how well an emulation will do. it's probably hard to emulate encoders. the fader may be okay.just needs a bit of space.
<wpwrak>
the touch pad of the icreativ has about the same size of a 7" tablet. so you can imagine how to arrange the controls there
<wolfspraul>
sure
<wpwrak>
one thing you may want to investigate when back in china would be the price of ipad replacement screens, and how easy it is to find/translate documentation on the interfaces
<wolfspraul>
but if I see myself using the icreativ, and 'the other' vjs have an ipad, I know I am old
<wpwrak>
;-))
<wolfspraul>
unless retro is my style
<wolfspraul>
isn't it true?
<wpwrak>
the icreativ is pretty new :)
<wolfspraul>
yes it's just my impression
<wpwrak>
and i'm sure you can whack an ipad to pieces with it, while the opposite probably doesn't work :)
<wolfspraul>
and some people like to use old-school stuff
<wpwrak>
mechanical feedback has its benefits in dark rooms
<wpwrak>
the build quality of the icreativ defeats this to some extent, but still. perhaps the ideal solution would be a pad with buttons on the small sides.
<wpwrak>
that way, mode switches could move to a "safe" place and there would be more room for controls
<wolfspraul>
don't get me wrong, I like it
<wolfspraul>
but it's my FIRST THOUGHTS
<wolfspraul>
it feels old, the heavy metal etc.
<wolfspraul>
industrial
<wolfspraul>
pinball machines
<wolfspraul>
I'm not sure whether that's enough of a niche for the product
<wpwrak>
heavy may be a design feature. also the kaossilator is a bit on the heavy side. i think djs and vjs may like their equipment to stay in place
<wolfspraul>
sure some people like this style and ruggedness, but how long. and why exactly? a notebook with usb mouse of course is horrible on stage
<wpwrak>
yeah. i could see this fail in many ways ;-)
<wpwrak>
i think an M2 with built-in tablet and buttons could be quite nice
<wpwrak>
also with a more solid case -> also the weight increases
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<sb0>
wolfspraul, happy new year!
<sb0>
back home tomorrow. been exploring kilometer-long abandoned steel factories lately, quite a holiday :-)
<wolfspraul>
he
<wolfspraul>
then I wish a good trip back now - travel safely
<wpwrak>
wolfspraul: i looked a bit at android tablets available in argentina. there's basically a < USD 200-300 segment with resistive screens and a > USD 300-400 segment with capacitative screens. not sure if a resistive screen (= no multi-touch) would be sufficient for our purposes. something for future exploration.
<wpwrak>
sb0: you're looking for the new year in very odd places :)
<wolfspraul>
I think most of them will disappear
<wpwrak>
probably
<wolfspraul>
we are early in that category
<sb0>
use a wacom-style sensor :)
<sb0>
seriously it's 'just' a piece of PCB with an array of printed coils
<sb0>
(...and some control electronics and software)
<wpwrak>
do they make them for fingers now ?
<sb0>
no but we can perhaps have a wiimote-style pen instead
<wpwrak>
you'll not make many friends with a pen :)
<sb0>
ok, call that a 'magic wand' then :-)
<wpwrak>
then it'll be big enough to break the display :)
<sb0>
or conducting baton
<wpwrak>
and if you go wacom, you either need to OEM one of the very few display and tablet combos with such features or you need to do those finicky mechanics yourself
<sb0>
finicky?
<sb0>
stuffing a PCB right behind a LCM isn't finicky
<wpwrak>
with a regular touch screen (res or cap), you can simply get a premade assembly. no dust/dirt issues, minimum calibration, ...
<wpwrak>
i don't think pcb behind lcm really works :)
<sb0>
that's how wacom does it
<wpwrak>
so how do they deal with the lcm messing up the fields ?
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<sb0>
look, many highly successful products had innovative UIs - wiimote, kinect, iphone ...
<sb0>
can we just follow with a second-class resistive touch screen?
<sb0>
or will it be another M1?
<wpwrak>
maybe we should have an ass-operated pad then. i think that sector is still under-innovated ;-)
<wpwrak>
i''d focus on usability. use the tech that gives the best result. if resistive is enough, great. if it has to be cap, then so be it.
<wpwrak>
with a pen/stick/baton, i see the problems that it a) requires too precise handling and that b) you're always at risk of losing it at the wrong moment
<wpwrak>
you could of course have a huge baton, more like the torches jugglers use, but that would kinda change the category
<wpwrak>
naw, i'd say the fewer moving parts the better. and especially not moving small parts. no dongles, no pens, no loose covers, ...
<wpwrak>
oh, and resistive pads can measure pressure. not sure if the capacitative ones do that yet.
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