azonenberg changed the topic of #homecmos to: Homebrew CMOS and MEMS foundry design | Wiki: http://homecmos.drawersteak.com/wiki/Main_Page | Repository: http://code.google.com/p/homecmos/ | Logs: http://en.qi-hardware.com/homecmos-logs/
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<SpeedEvil> whitequark: On direct coagulation... - a number of vendors on alibaba seem to have AlO polish in the 0.3um range.
<SpeedEvil> whitequark: I have not properly investigated if this is a typo for 0.3mm, though it seems plausible that it is not in at least some cases.
<Noxz> Al2O3 ?
<SpeedEvil> yes
<Noxz> shouldn't that be just about any aluminum powder, as it will oxidize in air?
<SpeedEvil> fine aluminium will not burn/oxidise into a homogenous powder
<SpeedEvil> this process - I think - wants a hard dense blob
<Noxz> hrm
<SpeedEvil> which - happily - are also the properties you want for an abrasive
<Noxz> cheaper than diamond paste?
<whitequark> SpeedEvil: no, this process requires powder with very high surface area
<whitequark> well, polishing either, really, mirror finish is under 1 micron
<SpeedEvil> yes - 10m^3 is equal to that particle diameter of 'square' particles
<SpeedEvil> unless I screwed up on the dimensions
<SpeedEvil> ^cubic
<whitequark> yep
<whitequark> vendors on alibaba probably do have it in 0.3 micron range.
<whitequark> that would be just fumed alumina
<whitequark> burning some compound of aluminium in oxygen. I don't remember which. organoaluminium, maybe
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<whitequark> another way to get is to find 'linde a' gem polishing powder
<whitequark> but that's expensive as hell
<whitequark> i have an ounce of linde a.
<SpeedEvil> I might have some. I have way too much from an old rock shops stock
<whitequark> oh cool
<whitequark> how much
<SpeedEvil> ~100kg of various SiC/SnO/CeO/...
<SpeedEvil> Poorly catalogued
<whitequark> holy fuck
<whitequark> actually that sounds interesting even from a polishing perspective
<whitequark> ceria, mmmmmm
<_Sync_> polishing shits cheap usually in bulk
<SpeedEvil> yeah.
<SpeedEvil> I was seeing prices of $1/kg
<SpeedEvil> (@10 tons FOB)
<SpeedEvil> I wonder if there is an analogous process for SiC
<whitequark> I think SiC is done by, well, melting Si with C
<whitequark> at least that's what USSR did
<SpeedEvil> I was meaning a low-energyish near-net-shape process
<whitequark> oh
<whitequark> no deason DCC can't work for SiC
<whitequark> reason
<SpeedEvil> If you can call a process where you sinter for a day at 1700C low energy
<whitequark> a vacuum induction oven!
<SpeedEvil> I want to make a vacuum furnace.
<whitequark> I *am* making one
<SpeedEvil> I think the key to making it easy is to seperate the two parts.
<whitequark> the what and what?
<SpeedEvil> the vacuum and the furnace.
<whitequark> er.
<SpeedEvil> That is - the vacuum structure remains 'cold' - and the furnace is just several layers of radiation shielding with no forces on it
<whitequark> yes, that was my idea as well.
<whitequark> use Mo or Ta sheets.
<whitequark> I'm told six or so are enough.
<_Sync_> you don't need Mo or Ta in the later shields
<whitequark> Mo is cheap enough you could just make the entire thing out of it
<_Sync_> the trick is to have very low thermal conductivity between the shields
<whitequark> spot-weld it to a Mo C-beam on which the crucible will stand
<_Sync_> because at those temperatures conduction is not relevant
<SpeedEvil> It would be nice if medium vacuum would work for vacuum insulation
<SpeedEvil> Well - without fumed silica or something in the way
<_Sync_> why would you put any insulation in there?
<_Sync_> there is no need
<_Sync_> calculate the mean free path
<SpeedEvil> yes - mean free path means it needs to get well under a pascal for anything to happen.
<SpeedEvil> This - while fine in a nice pumped enclosure - isn't ideal in - for example - a vacuum insulation panel
<_Sync_> well, imho vacuum insulation panels for houses are not a really good idea
<_Sync_> I'd rather see aerogels
<SpeedEvil> You can combine them for more fun
<SpeedEvil> And yes - aerogels are awesome.
<whitequark> have you seen what happens to a marshmallow under vacuum
<SpeedEvil> I've been wondering about making quite a lot in a scaffolding tube.
<_Sync_> 0o
<SpeedEvil> It can handle the pressure easily
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<_Sync_> well, they are also pretty small
<SpeedEvil> Well 'lot' as in several litres at a time.
<SpeedEvil> 1m^3@250C/500PSI or whatever would be harder
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