jhass changed the topic of #ruby to: Welcome new users migrating from #ruby-lang! || Rules & more: http://ruby-community.com || Ruby 2.2.2; 2.1.6; 2.0.0-p645: https://ruby-lang.org || Paste >3 lines of text on https://gist.github.com || log @ http://irclog.whitequark.org/ruby/
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<Ox0dea> [7.bin, 7.bin(false), 7.bin(true)] => ['111', '0b111', '0B111']
<Ox0dea> Is good API?
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<drbrain> Ox0dea: I don't think so, I don't know what false or true mean
<drbrain> that both false and true cause the binary marker to appear is confusing
<drbrain> Ox0dea: I think using keyword arguments would be better
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<drbrain> marker: :upcase or marker: :downcase
<Ox0dea> There aren't many core methods which take keyword arguments.
<drbrain> I don't know why that would stop you
<Ox0dea> Consistency, if nothing else.
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<drbrain> open, system, Process.spawn all do
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<drbrain> Integer#upto
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<drbrain> and that's without looking at the documentation
<Ox0dea> Which version of Ruby gives Integer#upto a keyword argument?
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<drbrain> if you want to base it off of "what core methods do" then "use true/false/nil for three-state logic" is something none of them do
<drbrain> 2.2 does
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<dfockler> Ox0dea: just read the method call out of syntax and see if you can tell what it's doing
<Ox0dea> >> [RUBY_VERSION, Integer.instance_method(:upto).arity]
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => ["2.2.0", 1] (https://eval.in/386506)
<dfockler> 7.bin(true), doesn't indicate what the true is doing
<drbrain> Ox0dea: sorry, it's step, not upto
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<Ox0dea> `7.bin(prefix: :uppercase)` is almost humorously verbose.
<dfockler> 7.bin.prefix isn't that bad
<drbrain>
<Ox0dea> What should String#prefix do in other contexts?
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<dfockler> maybe the bin method doesn't return a string
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<dfockler> because it has state
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<drbrain> when I'm unfamiliar with what a method does, the more verbose its calling structure is the more likely I can guess what it does without spending 5 minutes looking up its API
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<Ox0dea> dfockler: That '111'.bin => 7 would seem to suggest that 7.bin should => '111'.
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<Ox0dea> But '0b111'.bin also => 7, and being able to round-trip seems like a Good Thing.
<dfockler> >> '0b01001'.upcase
<ruboto> dfockler # => "0B01001" (https://eval.in/386507)
<dfockler> so if you are returning a string then you don't need to worry if it's uppercase or not
<Ox0dea> I should perhaps have specified that I intend to submit a proposal that Numeric#bin/#hex/#oct be added to core.
<Ox0dea> I'd like the methods to do "the Ruby thing" as much as possible.
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<baweaver> Honestly I prefer humorously verbose to Perl / Haskell
<drbrain> Ox0dea: it's probably easier to get the addition of prefix: for #to_s accepted than three new methods
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<dfockler> >> 9.to_s(2)
<ruboto> dfockler # => "1001" (https://eval.in/386509)
<baweaver> xs, ys, $?, $!
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<dfockler> 9.to_s(2) <- That doesn't make a whole lot sense
<baweaver> alo shevy
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<dorei> dfockler: why not?
<dorei> >>"1001".to_i(2)
<ruboto> dorei # => 9 (https://eval.in/386510)
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<dfockler> because it's a string instead of a number
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<baweaver> yeah, radix is a bit more vague on strings
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<baweaver> I'd prefer 9.bin.to_s
<drbrain> use Integer instead of to_i unless you know your input is a valid number
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<drbrain> or, I suppose, know -> is supposed to be
<dorei> changing a radix doesnt change the number, only its representation, in this case it's string representation
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<baweaver> cantu4: group_by is a thing
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<doctorly> I am trying to figure out how to get a scroll bar on a nested slot in green shoes, but every time I try to add one, it is added to the parent slot. Does anyone know why? Or does anyone have an example app I can examine?
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<jfarmer> baweaver What would 9.bin return?
<baweaver> see above
<Ox0dea> For what it's worth, Big/Fixnum#to_s and String#to_i have perfectly logical and consistent APIs.
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<drbrain> I don't think I need even A fingers to count the number of times I've needed to use even to_i with a base in the last year
<cantu4> baweaver: ok but how would I use it here?
<baweaver> you have response[:choice]
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<jfarmer> baweaver I did; unless it's _wayyy_ up there.
<Ox0dea> drbrain: Adding an optional prefix to #to_s for the sake of only three radixes doesn't seem reasonable.
<baweaver> that
<baweaver> which you're checking its value
<baweaver> also, detect is find is one result
<baweaver> This looks like Rails though
<drbrain> Ox0dea: you'll see the argument of "who will use this?" for the addition of bin/hex/oct, so you will need to establish that people need to use it often
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<drbrain> ↑ so you know how to best present your propsal
<Ox0dea> Sure, that makes sense.
<zenspider> I to_s(16) often enough... but only because I'm lazy
<Ox0dea> zenspider: And would you rather hex? :)
<zenspider> but to_i(base)? almost never
<cantu4> baweaver: could you do some example code? Not fully understanding
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<zenspider> Ox0dea: not really.
<zenspider> he says, mistyping 0x0dea again and again
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<baweaver> cantu4: What you'd want to do is something like: responses.map { |r| r[:choice] }.group_by(&:itself).map { |k,v| [k, v.size] }.to_h
<baweaver> well, that first map is unnecessary
<zenspider> don't know why you're arguing for #hex when your own username is broken
<baweaver> only if you want to get those out for later.
<cantu4> baweaver: where would this replace?
<baweaver> really you need to post sample data
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<baweaver> otherwise it's impossible to tell
<baweaver> put it in a gist and link to it
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<baweaver> I have a feeling there's a lot more wrong with that than I can see from that code.
<baweaver> just post what responses looks like, that should do.
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<cantu4> baweaver: http://imgur.com/y3iZhIw this is what it produces
<baweaver> something's not adding up here
<Ox0dea> After some cursory research, it does seem that Fixnum#bin/#hex/#oct are a little too niche for inclusion into core.
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<baweaver> you sure that's what responses returns?
<cantu4> baweaver: What it does it take the difference between the latest polls on Pollster, then uses a T-Distribution to find the odds of a person winning
<cantu4> Yes, I just ran it
<Ox0dea> >> ['1'.hex, '1'.oct, ('1'.bin rescue 'bad')]
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => [1, 1, "bad"] (https://eval.in/386512)
<Ox0dea> That feels worth addressing, though.
<cantu4> baweaver: I want to change the names I have inputted like rubio[:value], into whatever the user chooses
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<baweaver> you ran the entire program and gave me the result of that, I meant the results variable, sorry.
<baweaver> responses
<baweaver> lordy...
<baweaver> typing is hard today.
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<cantu4> baweaver: You want me to run just the responses?
<baweaver> yeah, comment out everything else and just get that data.
<zenspider> an image??
<doctorly> promet: no problem, you usually want to put environment variables in the bashrc
<baweaver> also, gist.github.com
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<doctorly> sorry wrong chan
<cantu4> baweaver: that section alone doesn't produce anything
<baweaver> You have to use a p there
<baweaver> p responses
<baweaver> otherwise it doesn't output anything
<cantu4> baweaver, wehre do I put it?
<baweaver> cantu4: Have you ever tried a REPL?
<cantu4> baweaver: don't think so
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<baweaver> where do you think you should put it?
<baweaver> type in irb in your console
<baweaver> require those libraries
<baweaver> and try playing with the data like that
<zenspider> cantu4: "where do I put it" suggests that you aren't even thinking about this problem or the suggestions given. THINK about this problems and then YOU suggest to US where it should go
<baweaver> Read Eval Print Loop, lets you execute code as you will
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<zenspider> we'll let you know if it is incorrect, but you have to meet us half way
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<cantu4> baweaver: http://imgur.com/Zo60rE6
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<baweaver> I'm going to ignore imgur
<baweaver> put the code in gist.github.com
<zenspider> images?? again? wtf
<baweaver> otherwise I have to type it all to do anything with it
<baweaver> thanks
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<baweaver> Give me a sec
<baweaver> in the mean time, try out irb in your terminal
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<baweaver> type in: responses = (what you put in that gist)
<baweaver> and play with that data
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<baweaver> now, you have two values you need, choice and value
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<baweaver> that looks an awful lot like a key value pair
<baweaver> and you need to dynamically get names to compare
<baweaver> What happens if you make choice and value into a hash of choice and value?
<baweaver> You can prompt the user after you get that data to provide a choice from the keys of that hash
<baweaver> then run comparisons by retrieving the values
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<baweaver> I don't intend to give you a straight answer, you're going to have to think through this cantu4
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<baweaver> >> [{a: 'foo', b: 1}, {a: 'bar', b: 21}, {a: 'baz', b: 13}]
<ruboto> baweaver # => [{:a=>"foo", :b=>1}, {:a=>"bar", :b=>21}, {:a=>"baz", :b=>13}] (https://eval.in/386515)
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<baweaver> So how do we go from that, to this:
<baweaver> >> {'foo' => 1, 'bar' => 21, 'baz' => 13}
<ruboto> baweaver # => {"foo"=>1, "bar"=>21, "baz"=>13} (https://eval.in/386516)
<baweaver> You figure that out and you have the answer pretty well set
<baweaver> hint: It has to do with map and to_h
<baweaver> >> [:a, 1].to_h
<ruboto> baweaver # => wrong element type Symbol at 0 (expected array) (TypeError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386517)
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<baweaver> >> [[:a, 1]].to_h
<ruboto> baweaver # => {:a=>1} (https://eval.in/386518)
<baweaver> picky thing
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<baweaver> Anyways, I persisted that to the SO question as Lemur
<baweaver> I'll be back on some time later tonight.
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<no_face> Ruby confirmed for SJW stronghold. The fall of Opal marks the beginning of the end.
<sevenseacat> err, what?
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<no_face> What, are you not aware of the SJW movement?
<sevenseacat> it seems like an irrelevant discussion for this channel.
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<no_face> Opal is a popular ruby project, so it's hardly irrelevant
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<sevenseacat> I'll have to disagree with you there. on the irrelevancy part, at least.
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<sevenseacat> and people that throw around the term 'SJW' like an insult, well
<no_face> Well then, Opal is about to lose its two top contributors in order to appease the SJW movement, namely, a fat man wearing a pink wig.
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<sevenseacat> !Mute no_face
<havenwood> no_face: Be nice or you're not welcome here.
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<sevenseacat> timeout.
<zenspider> no_face: not here
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<no_face> Oh no, the SJWs are turning against me because I am against the concept of thought police
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<havenwood> !ban no_face !T 1h "Be nice."
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<sevenseacat> oh, my mute didnt work. oh well.
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<al2o3-cr> capital m
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<Booyah> I love you all
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<masterprime> Hola. Here's the deal. I am not trying to learn ruby. I am trying to get a bot written in ruby to run on my subreddit. https://github.com/jensechu/twitchit <- this bot. The install instructions have an expectation of knowledge. Knowledge I do not have. Where do I run these commands? Specifically "bundle install"
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<Aeyrix> Terminal.
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<masterprime> like command prompt with ruby?
<Aeyrix> > command prompt
<Aeyrix> uh oh
<sevenseacat> the same place you ran git clone and cd
<Aeyrix> If you're on Windows, this isn't going to work for you.
<BrianBoyko> I did it!!!!
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<masterprime> Is it actually not going to work for me or is it just a pain in the ass? I've got linux on my laptop but I kinda need this to run all the time.
<Aeyrix> You need a server, then.
<Aeyrix> That's what they're for.
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<masterprime> I've got a crappy webhost. Would that work?
<Aeyrix> Do you have command line access?
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<masterprime> yeah.
<Aeyrix> I mean for the web host.
<masterprime> I know. I have shell access.
<Aeyrix> Then yes, it'll work, so long as you can run `ruby`.
<Aeyrix> And the version is 2.x.
<Aeyrix> `ruby --version`.
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<BrianBoyko> Hey, if jhass comes by, tell him I got my thing working!
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<masterprime> Okay. Finally got putty and my keys working. I don't do this often so it can be a pain. I'm on ruby 1.8.7. Is there a command to get the latest stable version?
<Ox0dea> ?windows
<ruboto> I don't know anything about windows
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<BrianBoyko> god help me, I'm in a "just one more commit" cycle... and I haven't eaten for 12 hours.
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<acovrig> given: “up time: 01:31:54, idle time: 06:01:03, sleep time: 00:00:00 “.match(//) what would I use for a regexp to get “01:31:54”? /(?:up time: )([0-9]{2}:[0-9]{2}:[0-9]{2})/
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<acovrig> nevermind, got that, now what about the 06:01:03 part?
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<sevenseacat> same thing?
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<acovrig> sevenseacat: then I would just get the 01:31:54.
<nofxx> acovrig, up, iddle, sleep = txt.scan(/\d{2}: ..
<crowell> acovrig: or the lazy way .split(" ")[5].chomp(',')
<nofxx> would be easier , no?
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<nofxx> unless you expect they to change order*
<sevenseacat> well running the \d{2}:\d{2}:\d{2} regex will get you three matches - you want the first and second, no?
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<Ox0dea> acovrig: up, idle, sleep = str.scan(/\d\d:\d\d:\d\d/)
<acovrig> sevenseacat: yes, can I do .match()[1]?
<sevenseacat> what Ox0dea said, prety much
<Ox0dea> sevenseacat: Pretty much?
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<sevenseacat> i dont like the \d\d notation :P
<Ox0dea> I'm a golfer at heart.
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<sevenseacat> makes sense
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<acovrig> it might change order, I would like to match “up time “<time>, and not ‘capture’ the “up time “, it seems like I can do (?:<string to match, but not capture>), is that not right?
<EasyCo> Hey team, I'm parsing an ugly date like so:
<EasyCo> >> Date.parse("08.08.15").strftime("%d/%m/%y")
<ruboto> EasyCo # => uninitialized constant Date (NameError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386543)
<EasyCo> >> require 'Date'; Date.parse("08.08.15").strftime("%d/%m/%y")
<ruboto> EasyCo # => cannot load such file -- Date (LoadError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386544)
<zenspider> case sensitive
<havenwood> EasyCo: #=> "15/08/08"
<EasyCo> Hah, yah, exactly, thanks.
<EasyCo> Anyways, the date is actually 08/08/2015
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<EasyCo> Anyway around that issue other then manually parsing the date using regex?
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<Ox0dea> EasyCo: Date.strptime takes a second argument specifying the format to expect.
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<EasyCo> Ox0dea: Thanks, I did not know that. I just noticed that the data I'm parsing has no standard date input so it's all over the shop... So strptime wont work, cool nonetheless. Cheers.
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<Ox0dea> EasyCo: I have known the torment of heuristical date parsing.
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<EasyCo> Ox0dea: Yep, ~50 Google spreadsheets averaging a few thousand rows each with no normalized data to be parsed and exported into a specific system format. Fun Fun.
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<Ox0dea> EasyCo: Are you using Kiba?
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<EasyCo> Ox0dea: Nah, jus rolled my own
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<Ox0dea> EasyCo: There's just something about homemade wheels, eh? :)
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<EasyCo> Ox0dea: Yep, 166 lines of gorgeous regex and loops!
<Ox0dea> acovrig: If you're not opposed to matching against the string several times, the two-argument form of String#[] is pretty convenient.
<Ox0dea> >> 'foobar'[/foo(bar)/, 1]
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => "bar" (https://eval.in/386545)
<acovrig> Ox0dea: I’m currently using “up time: 01:31:54, idle time: 06:01:03, sleep time: 00:00:00 ”.match(/(?:up time: )(\d{2}:\d{2}:\d{2})/).to_s.sub(/up time: /,'')
<Ox0dea> Gross.
<Ox0dea> %w[up idle sleep].map { |t| str[/#{t} time: (\d\d:\d\d:\d\d)/, 1] }
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<acovrig> %w is the string I’m working with?
<Ox0dea> No, that's `str`.
<Ox0dea> %w creates an array of "words".
<Ox0dea> >> %w[foo bar baz]
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => ["foo", "bar", "baz"] (https://eval.in/386546)
<al2o3-cr> /\d{2}:\d{2}:\d{2}/ # will match up time if that is you only want
<Ox0dea> He mentioned earlier that he'd also like to capture the idle time.
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<al2o3-cr> ah, must of missed that
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<acovrig> Ox0dea: handy, thanks
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<Ox0dea> acovrig: Sure thing.
<Ox0dea> There's admittedly a lot going on in that, so feel free to ask for clarification.
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<Ox0dea> >> str = 'up time: 01:31:54, idle time: 06:01:03, sleep time: 00:00:00'; Hash[str.scan(/(\w+) time: (\d\d:\d\d:\d\d)/)]
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => {"up"=>"01:31:54", "idle"=>"06:01:03", "sleep"=>"00:00:00"} (https://eval.in/386556)
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<acovrig> O.o what is this beautiful magic :D
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<Aeyrix> Regex.
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<baweaver> beauty is in the eyes of the beholder
* baweaver glares at RFC Email Regex
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<havenwood> >> 'up time: 01:31:54, idle time: 06:01:03, sleep time: 00:00:00'.split(', ').map { |s| s.split ' time: ' }.to_h
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<ruboto> havenwood # => {"up"=>"01:31:54", "idle"=>"06:01:03", "sleep"=>"00:00:00"} (https://eval.in/386560)
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<havenwood> *requisite non-regexp solution
* baweaver golf claps
<acovrig> thanks all, many ways to complete a task shows differnet methods of thinking; I’m off to bed, it’s midnight here.
<sevenseacat> havenwood: nice.
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<Radar> baweaver: My favourite part of the email RFC is where it allows comments in email addresses
* baweaver weeps silently
<Radar> \o/
<sevenseacat> nice.
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<bitcycle> Hey all. Is there a way to tell Net::ssh to not use .ssh/config?
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<derylbear> whats the best IDE for Ruby?
<bitcycle> vim
<baweaver> oh hey
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<baweaver> none
<sevenseacat> oh hello again
<derylbear> vim is better than sublime?
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<bitcycle> yes
<baweaver> yes
<sevenseacat> probably.
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<derylbear> ok, ty
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<baweaver> Go forth and code young one!
<baweaver> whoops, dc'd again
<baweaver> and now we wait for the inevitable "What do you mean there's no mouse support!?!?!" replies
<bitcycle> Hey all. Is there a way to tell Net::ssh to not use .ssh/config?
<sevenseacat> "does vim have autocomplete?"
<baweaver> Tim Pope says yes to all the things
<Ox0dea> bitcycle: There is a configuration option named :config, which you'll want to set to false.
<wmoxam> O_o
<baweaver> Ox0dea: I swear you're like a fountain of strange wisdoms
<Ox0dea> I just... use Ruby a lot?
<baweaver> well, granted that one wasn't out there like the BF interpreter
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<Ox0dea> I would hesitate to consider programming without alphanumerics to be even remotely wise, but the compliment is appreciated nevertheless.
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<Ox0dea> That said, I do quite like that the whole thing hinges on being able to acquire a 1 with $$/$$.
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<shevy> Ox0dea are you still sore that regex only treats $1 up to $9 in a special way?
<Ox0dea> shevy: Remember it turned out that those are treated specially only insofar as they are artificially appended to the array returned by Kernel::global_variables?
<shevy> yeah you angrily showed the code here
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<Ox0dea> I still don't understand why that's done.
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<shevy> read the comment!
<shevy> :D
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<Ox0dea> > Returns an array of the names of global variables.
<Ox0dea> Nowhere does it say "and also pretends that $1-9 aren't magic".
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<Ox0dea> To be clear, I'm not really opposed to their being in there, but the rationale is certainly lost on me.
<Ox0dea> Also, why doesn't English define aliases for them if they're so special?
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<flughafen> morning
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<zenspider> Ox0dea: they're treated specially because they reset on scope boundaries
<flughafen> slow morning here
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<Radar> flughafen: Do you speak German? I have a translation question I need to ask a German speaker and saw you're here :)
<sevenseacat> given the name
<Radar> If anyone is: what is the German equivalent of i.e.?
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<Ox0dea> zenspider: Aye, I'm fine with that, but why artifically include them in global_variables? https://github.com/ruby/ruby/blob/trunk/variable.c#L908-L912
<Radar> d.h.?
* sevenseacat is suddenly very interested in this speck of dust
<Radar> my hero
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<baweaver> das ist
<baweaver> ah
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<Ox0dea> I suspect idiomatic German doesn't actually use d.i., though.
<baweaver> I know enough german to stay out of trouble
<Ox0dea> Idiomatic English doesn't translate the Latin, anyhow.
<baweaver> my brother knows enough to get into it
<Ox0dea> I know just enough German to have gotten a giggle out of seeing the name Madchen in the credits.
<sevenseacat> my cats have picked up enough German to know what hahnchen is.
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<flughafen> sevenseacat: meowen sie deutsch?
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<Ox0dea> zenspider: Do you reckon their inclusion was done in observation of the principle of least surprise?
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<Aeyrix> Ox0dea: were you surprised?
<JayJay> Hey there!
<sevenseacat> they learnt chicken and would come running for food whenever it was mentioned. then they learnt hahnchen. smart fuckers.
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<JayJay> Anyone into Opal?
<flughafen> sevenseacat: how many cats do youu have
<Ox0dea> >> ('a' * 10)[/#{'(a)' * 10}/]; g = global_variables; [$10, g.include?(:$9), g.include?(:$10)]
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => ["a", true, false] (https://eval.in/386586)
<sevenseacat> two.
<Ox0dea> Aeyrix: I think that's at least a little surprising.
<Aeyrix> Ox0dea: Then probably not principle of least surprise. :P
<Ox0dea> I believe you've mistaken the point I meant to make.
<Aeyrix> probably
<Aeyrix> i'm more concerned about these doritos tbh
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<Ox0dea> In that snippet, $10 exists, is a global variable, and has a value, and yet it does not show up in Kernel::global_variables, whereas $9 does.
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<Ox0dea> This only because $1-9 are artifically added to the array returned by the aforementioned method.
<Ox0dea> *artificially
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* flughafen still hasn't gotten his package from dhl. they're still on strike and it's been in my city for 2.5 weeks
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<Aeyrix> go and get it yourself
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<zenspider> Ox0dea: because they start with "$" and are therefore globals?
<flughafen> weather has been bad, but i'll go today . i only have a motorcycle
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<flughafen> if it stays nice
<zenspider> I don't see why it is "artifically included"
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<zenspider> JayJay: not here
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<Ox0dea> I just don't see why $10 should be treated any differently than $9.
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<flughafen> Ox0dea: what does [/#{'(a)' * 10}] do?
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<zenspider> builds a big dumb regexp just like the string before it
<flughafen> hey Radar , are there any drones flying over me?
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<zenspider> could be (.) too
<Radar> flughafen: yeah sorry about those but we feel like you're a threat to national security
<Radar> oops that was meant to be in PM too bad now I gues
<zenspider> I'm kinda surprised that $10 is populated
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<zenspider> huh. it is in 1.8 too
<zenspider> so it isn't an onigaruma thing
<flughafen> Radar: !!!
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<_mh_> apparently it populates up to $50 at least
<zenspider> ah.. interesting: 1.8 outputs: ["j", false, false]
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<_mh_> hmm...
<_mh_> even $1000 can be populated this way. I suppose it's making a shorthand for access on the last match there?
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<zenspider> oh. strings vs symbols
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<Ox0dea> >> ''[/#{'()' * 32767}/]; $32767
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => "" (https://eval.in/386592)
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<_mh_> Ox0dea: Seems there's not really a limit, but they are not treated completely as globals?
<Ox0dea> The limit is 32767.
<_mh_> ok.
<Ox0dea> >> /#{'()' * 32768}/
<ruboto> Ox0dea, I'm terribly sorry, I could not evaluate your code because of an error: OpenURI::HTTPError:500 Internal Server Error
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<_mh_> Ox0dea: the error is a 'too many capture groups' though.
<Ox0dea> Right.
<zenspider> so, apparently, they're always accessable
<zenspider> >> ''[/(.)/]; $100
<ruboto> zenspider # => nil (https://eval.in/386594)
<Ox0dea> All global variables are always "accessible".
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<zenspider> even with -w it doesn't warn that it isn't defined
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<Ox0dea> Every global variable "exists", after a fashion, but it would certainly be unwise to include them all in Kernel::global_variables' output.
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<zenspider> % ruby -we 'p $woot'
<zenspider> -e:1: warning: global variable `$woot' not initialized
<Ox0dea> $1-9 are just as magical as $10 and beyond, but it was decided that they should appear in the output of that method, and I'd really like to know why.
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<zenspider> Ox0dea: probably an oversight. Send in a patch
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<Ox0dea> zenspider: In fact, nobu refactored the code that adds them six years ago.
<zenspider> I don't find this nearly as interesting as you do. If you want it fixed, fix it.
<Ox0dea> I am much more interested in the "why".
<zenspider> $0 always needs to be there. $1 and up should probably only be there based on values in $~.to_a
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<zenspider> asking "why" in cases like this is a waste of time
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<ljarvis> mornin'
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<maloik> hiya
<flughafen> yo ljarvis
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<saadq> Out of curiosity, do you guys use a text editor or an IDE for Ruby?
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<ljarvis> saadq: I use vim
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<saadq> I've been using Vintage mode on Sublime Text, I've been thinking about switching over to vim
<sevenseacat> i use sublime text.
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<flughafen> sevenseacat: vim
<sevenseacat> what did you call me
<ljarvis> lol
<flughafen> oops, hahaha
<zenspider> emacs, bitches
<flughafen> zenspider uses bsd and hasn't showered in 3 years
<flughafen> ;)
<zenspider> true facts
<zenspider> dust baths don't count, right?
<flughafen> not really. ask sevenseacat
<flughafen> she likes dust
<sevenseacat> heh
<sevenseacat> I've tried atom, but don't see a reason to switch to it.
* flughafen likes vim
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<flughafen> but i do use eclipse for java stuff at work.
<zenspider> I'm switching to the new visual studio editor
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* flughafen will definitely switch to neovim
<zenspider> try spacemacs
<flughafen> zenspider: is it like emacs in spaced?
<flughafen> space*
<zenspider> apparently a lot of vimmers like it
<zenspider> it's emacs w/ a strong vim influence, I guess
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<haudoing> hello everybody I have a noob question...
<haudoing> what is this syntax mean?
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<adaedra> which one?
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<haudoing> can u check out the gist?
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<sevenseacat> theres a lot of syntax in that code
<ddv> haudoing: just a method that received and yields a block
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<ddv> receives*
<haudoing> I know do and end is like curly
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<haudoing> ok.. so it's like a method?
<adaedra> careful, because curly braces can mean two things: block and hash
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<haudoing> I thought we use "def" to define a method
<adaedra> the code between do end is a block, that is passed as argument to service
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<adaedra> it's not exactly a method
<ddv> haudoing: look up implementation
<bucaran> hi folks, I am thinking of creating a "learning ruby from javascript" guide since I cant find a decent one, but maybe I havent looked hard enough
<bucaran> do you know any?
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<bucaran> most guides have too many definitions and misc information, I am looking for a comprenhensive "here is ruby and then here is js" with pertinent notes and thats it, but i cant find anything decent
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<sevenseacat> bucaran: just comparing the syntax? because theyre two different beasts in ideology
<sevenseacat> lots of it doesnt translate
<bucaran> @sevenseacat: those details can be explained via sidenotes IMO
<sevenseacat> you want to explain object oriented programming via sidenotes?
<bucaran> can totally skip that
<sevenseacat> o.o
<sevenseacat> but... you want to learn ruby, dont you?
<bucaran> hold, no need to explain that bc the target for the guide is folks that already know js well
<bucaran> so we can make some safe assumptions, if i dont define any scope then ill end up writing a book lol
<sevenseacat> right, so now you need to teach them object oriented programming
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<bucaran> well, we have classes in es6 that are really wrappers for javascript prototypical inheritance model, but classes nevertheless, it does not have to be 100% perfect
<bucaran> they support basic polyphormism via extend
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<bucaran> this would be mostly for syntax and idiomatic ruby
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<bucaran> OO concepts that apply in ruby that do not apply in js (like what? may I ask) we can safely leave for later, I just want to get started
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<bucaran> flughagen: Thanks!
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<flughafen> bucaran: there is tab autocomplete
<bucaran> flughafen: Got it! :)
<bucaran> irrsi?
<flughafen> bucaran: most all of them?
<bucaran> flughafen: :) hehe k
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<bucaran> indeed
<adaedra> IRC clients that do not do tab-complete are not worthy.
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<bucaran> worthy of what?
<adaedra> worthy.
<flughafen> they aren't worthy of being worthy
<bucaran> at all?
<bucaran> too strict
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<bucaran> havent looked too hard into irrsi customization options, but is it possible to change the UI colors? like e.g, the time stamp would be nicer if gray
<[k-> I thought it's irssi
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<ytti> bucaran, there are probably 100s of themes in irssi homepages
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<bucaran> thanks
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<flughafen> bucaran: use weechat
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<bucaran> I was looking for a quick, one liner to make the stamp gray right away, but Ill get me some nice themes
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<adaedra> And here we go
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<zenspider> ddv: you don't know that yields the block
<bucaran> test
<zenspider> only that the service call receives one
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<bucaran> ytti: themes are working, but the time stamp color does not change, damn software
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<yorickpeterse> morning
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<[k-> morning
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<bucaran> > puts "hi"
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<bucaran> how can I type ruby code from here? is there like a bot or something roaming these channel?
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<flughafen> bucaran: it's in your console and it's called irb
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<bucaran> flughafen: some channels do have a bot that let you do this
<ljarvis> bucaran: you can use ruboto (the channel bot) by prepending >> -- however, that's just for demonstration purposes, you should use irb as flughafen says
<bucaran> flughafen: just asking if there is one in _this_ channel
<[k-> ?experiment
<ruboto> Please use your local irb or pry (see ?pry) to experiment, ruboto's eval functionality is for demonstration purposes only.
<pagios> hi guys, can i do something like currentConfig = [ "`ip route | awk '/default/ { print $3 }'`" ] , embed the result of a command directlyu in a array element?
<ljarvis> pagios: did you try it?
<pagios> i am checking if it is good practice
<ljarvis> if it works, it's fine
<bucaran> ljarvis: thanks
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<pagios> it works, thanks
<ljarvis> pagios: you should use snake_case variable names though
<bucaran> bear w me, im a ruby newbie, so what is this "namespace" method/function in rails?
<bucaran> namespace :symbol do stuff end
<ljarvis> bucaran: pardon?
<adaedra> ?rails
<ruboto> Please join #RubyOnRails for Rails questions. You need to be identified with NickServ, see /msg NickServ HELP
<bucaran> wrong channel?
<ljarvis> bucaran: namespace is just a method, but yes for rails questions you should check out the other channel
<bucaran> well, I wonder if this is really a rails question tho
<ljarvis> the non-rails part I just answered
<bucaran> it's a method, K
<bucaran> thx
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<pagios> whats a quick way of creating an array of object like javascript: array = [ {name: 'X' ,age:'Y' } , {name: 'A' , age: 'B' } ] ?
<ljarvis> pagios: did you try the same thing in Ruby?
<pagios> lol no
<ljarvis> :/
<ljarvis> i guess you should probably *try* before you ask for help, as willing as we all are
<pagios> currentConfig = [ gateway: "`ip route | awk '/default/ { print $3 }'`" ]
<adaedra> you don't need "" around your command, `` is sufficient
<pagios> any difference between :gw or gw: /
<ljarvis> in a hash key? no
<ljarvis> >> { :foo => "bar" } == { foo: "bar" }
<ruboto> ljarvis # => true (https://eval.in/386665)
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<[k-> yay hash rockets!
<[k-> people use hash rockets for compatibility with 1.8
<[k-> so you should keep that in mind
<flughafen> i will forever be a hashrocketer
<[k-> 18>> {a:_""}
<ruboto> [k- # => /tmp/execpad-7c7e45f0272e/source-7c7e45f0272e:2: syntax error, unexpected tSYMBEG, expecting kDO or ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386666)
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<adaedra> or because you want to have something else than a symbol as key
<[k-> 18>> {a:""}
<ruboto> [k- # => /tmp/execpad-f547fcf0357a/source-f547fcf0357a:2: syntax error, unexpected tSYMBEG, expecting kDO or ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386667)
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<[k-> turdurr
<[k-> the a: syntax doesn't work in 1.8
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<adaedra> or because the => syntax is more explicit (I use it in .join in Sequel, :fk => :id is more explicit)
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<adaedra> (imo)
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<ljarvis> adaedra: than fk: :id?
<adaedra> yeah, there's the idea of the first pointing to the other one
<ljarvis> heh
<[k-> I prefer the a: syntax
<[k-> "": doesn't work as you expect, does it
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<yorickpeterse> It does in 2.2
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<ljarvis> not really, unless you actually expect it to be a symbol
<[k-> no, it just turns into a symbol (2.2.0p0)
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<adaedra> looks right to me
<yorickpeterse> >> def foo(a: 10); a; end; foo('a': 20)
<ruboto> yorickpeterse # => 20 (https://eval.in/386668)
<yorickpeterse> works fine
<GitGud> yes it does
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<ljarvis> that's an awful example. If someone new tried { "foo": "bar" } I *bet* they would expect it to be the same as { "foo" => "bar" }
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<jesterfraud> it isn't? D:
<ljarvis> see
<ljarvis> imo they should have just not added it
<pagios> >> config = { gateway: "test" } config.gateway
<ruboto> pagios # => /tmp/execpad-7de3e8af7c7e/source-7de3e8af7c7e:2: syntax error, unexpected tIDENTIFIER, expecting key ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386669)
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<yorickpeterse> ljarvis: well, blame Ruby for that
<ljarvis> yorickpeterse: I do :D
<yorickpeterse> blame it for not having proper kwargs and instead mapping it to hashes
<ljarvis> heh
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<[k-> pagios, missing ;
<pagios> >> config = { gateway: "test" } ; config.gateway
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<ruboto> pagios # => undefined method `gateway' for {:gateway=>"test"}:Hash (NoMethodError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386670)
<[k-> :p only in javascript
<pagios> ^ ljarvis :D
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<ljarvis> pagios: what?
<yorickpeterse> pagios: ehm, Ruby doesn't work like that
<pagios> it doesnt work like javascript
<ljarvis> ...
<ljarvis> I never said it did
<adaedra> ♪ >> require 'ostruct'; o = OpenStruct.new(gateway: "test"); o.gateway
<yorickpeterse> be grateful it doesn't work like Javascript
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<adaedra> >> require 'ostruct'; o = OpenStruct.new(gateway: "test"); o.gateway
<ruboto> adaedra # => "test" (https://eval.in/386672)
<yorickpeterse> we'd have a terrible language _and_ a terrible stdlib
<[k-> ostruct is slow
<[k-> slow slow slow
<[k-> JavaScript has stdlib?
<adaedra> Go optimise it them
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<pagios> equiv in ruby?
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<ljarvis> pagios: do you have a book or something you're learning Ruby from?
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<yorickpeterse> adaedra: you have no idea how openstruct works right?
<ljarvis> this is very basic stuff
<[k-> I'm not going to maintain ostruct
<ljarvis> the speed is the least bad thing about openstruct
<adaedra> yorickpeterse: no really, I only use it
<adaedra> and not often enough to really care
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<[k-> plus, I don't have optimising knowledge
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<[k-> or the knowledge of the use case of ostruct
<yorickpeterse> ^ that is one of the reasons it sucks perf wise
<[k-> no wonder its slow
<adaedra> wouldn't a method_missing mapping to a hash be better?
<[k-> at least it's not method_missint
<[k-> no!
<adaedra> ok
<ljarvis> then you add overhead for *every* call
<adaedra> ah yes
<yorickpeterse> method_missing is slow
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<flughafen> yay! got my package.
<adaedra> everything is slow
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<ljarvis> it's true
<[k-> that's our world :/
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<jesterfraud> slow is relative
<yorickpeterse> https://eval.in/386674 example
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<[k-> of what
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<yorickpeterse> err wait, I don't think I got that entirely right
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<pagios> ljarvis: i know how to do it via Class decleration, any easier way|?
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<yorickpeterse> That "only" invalidates class/constant caches IIRC
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<[k-> def an_instance.==
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<yorickpeterse> pagios: what are you trying to do?
<yorickpeterse> Ruby is not Javascript, you're not supposed to create random objects and define methods on them directly
<pagios> yo61: store an object with different properties and then access these properties :)
<yorickpeterse> That's common in a prototype based language such as JS/self, but not Ruby
<yorickpeterse> For Ruby you use classes, or Struct if you have to
<[k-> >> Class A; end; a = A.new; def a.== *args; true; end; a == Hash
<ruboto> [k- # => /tmp/execpad-362b91361538/source-362b91361538:3: syntax error, unexpected keyword_rescue, expecting ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386688)
<yorickpeterse> hey what the, seems OpenStruct on 2.2 doesn't flush global method caches anymore
<yorickpeterse> unless I'm doing dumb things
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<yorickpeterse> either way it defines methods dynamically, so that's going to hurt in some shape or form
<[k-> Class A; end; a = A.new; def a.== *args; true; end; a == Hash;
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<[k-> pls wait while I try this out
<ljarvis> pagios: you can use a Hash just like you've been doing
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<[k-> it works!
<tomjoro> That's a common thing to do when passing options to a method.. but in new ruby you could also used named parameters which is cleaner
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<yorickpeterse> [k-: eh yeah, you can define singleton methods on any objects
<yorickpeterse> * object
<[k-> you can actually monkey patch hash to accept .call
<[k-> >> class Hash; alias_method :call, :[]; end; a = {a: "b"}; a.(:a)
<ruboto> [k- # => "b" (https://eval.in/386711)
<[k-> turdurrrr
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<jesterfraud> [k-, but why would you do that anyway?
<[k-> it is less elegant than [] tho
<jesterfraud> hashes are hashes, and you use them as such
<[k-> to make it resemble JavaScript ;-;
<adaedra> don;t
<adaedra> don't
<jesterfraud> that's a reason not to :P
<adaedra> js is js, ruby is ruby
<[k-> I'm obviously not going to use that
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<[k-> I'm not sure what pagios wants ;-;
<pagios> hash hash
<pagios> works for me
<pagios> :D
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<[k-> OK :D
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<qiukun> hi i’d like to find something like ipython for ruby
<qiukun> there are iruby
<[k-> what is this ipython
<qiukun> ipython notebook
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<flughafen> [k-: it's like irb or the python interperter console but good
<qiukun> however iruby could use sth like %time
<[k-> why not submit a pull request!
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<_mh_> IO.popen and co seems to set $? after the spawned child terminated. Is there any less ugly way to get the exitcode of a terminated child process?
<[k-> the Ruby community will <3 u
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<qiukun> well, my coding power isnt that strong yet
<qiukun> <3
<[k-> the iruby team will review your code and suggest changes as long as you state that you aren't that good in ruby
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<[k-> at least I hope so
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<_mh_> an iruby sounds very interesting.
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<[k-> mh: require English ;-;
<bnagy> _mh_: check out Open3
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<bnagy> there are a bunch of useful capture methods, depending on what else you want to know about the execution
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<[k-> it looks cool
<bnagy> afaik you can't get a straight up code, though, you get a crappy Process::Status thing
<_mh_> Process::Status is fine... just $? is driving me nuts
<bnagy> I know, I hates it. :(
<_mh_> esp. as I can't get any document telling me how long this var survives :(
<[k-> you could just define a method that fetches it, although that would be costly
<bnagy> _mh_: until something else sets it
<bnagy> which I'm sure is hilarious if you're threading
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<_mh_> yeah, likely :(
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<_mh_> [k-: I would be curious as to how you would manually fetch it. the API doc doesn't yield anything I recognized.
<bnagy> I haven't looked at src for capture2 etc...
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<bnagy> oh it just threads out itself and gets the return value from the Thread
<bnagy> that should actually be safe \o/
<_mh_> well... at least something.
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<[k-> don't know, didnt use processes in my life
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<_mh_> Hmm... Process#waitpid2 using the pid of the io...
<_mh_> bnagy: that seems a usable approach, still ugly as hell, but better as $?
<bnagy> what are you trying to do?
<_mh_> bnagy: I just want to wait for a command to terminate and read it's exit code.
<bnagy> 17:22 < bnagy> _mh_: check out Open3
<_mh_> open3's another gem... adding gems to our project here at work is ... let's say interesting.
<bnagy> what?
<bnagy> it's stdlib
<_mh_> uuh? okay, I'm confusing it with something then. Cancel everything after good morning.
<_mh_> bnagy: going to look at it, thanks.
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<bnagy> _b
<haudoing> hello
<Ox0dea> haudoing: Hau doing?
<ljarvis> heuheuheu
<[k-> haha
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<lugub> how do we read from stdin mid way through a program?
<lugub> like a getch
<[k-> gets
<lugub> AH
<lugub> thanks
<[k-> yw
<haudoing> Ox0dea: what's up
<Ox0dea> haudoing: I'm making Kernel.global_variables less of a liar. :)
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<yorickpeterse> lugub: make sure you call STDIN.gets
<yorickpeterse> not just "gets"
<yorickpeterse> because the 2 are different
<ljarvis> herp derp
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<haudoing> Ox0dea: huh?
<[k-> those evil changes
<yorickpeterse> at least I recall there being some sort of difference
<bnagy> anyone know offhand is there's a measurable perf difference between "foo" and 'foo' for non-interpolated strings?
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<[k-> >> $>
<ruboto> [k- # => #<IO:<STDOUT>> (https://eval.in/386742)
<haudoing> help
<[k-> oh
<[k-> yes?
<yorickpeterse> bnagy: No
<ljarvis> bnagy: nope
<bnagy> it's the sort of thing we used to fret about years ago, but I thought it was a nonissue now
<yorickpeterse> bnagy: there is no performance difference
<[k-> bnagy, nonissue
<_mh_> bnagy: should be fine.
<[k-> ^
<bnagy> yorickpeterse: does it get caught by preprocessor / compiler?
<yorickpeterse> As in, the literal "foo" is exactly the same as 'foo'
<bnagy> yeah ok
<lugub> yorickpeterse: thanks. STDIN.gets = answer still isn't stopping for input though
<[k-> yes it does
<yorickpeterse> It's not until you add interpolation that it becomes different
<lugub> I mean answer = STDIN.gets
<yorickpeterse> lugub: `answer = STDIN.gets`
<[k-> escapes
<bnagy> what about the code path during creation?
<Ox0dea> >> [->{'foo'}, ->{"foo"}].map { |x| RubyVM::InstructionSequence.of(x).to_a }.reduce(:==)
<ruboto> Ox0dea # => true (https://eval.in/386743)
<Ox0dea> bnagy: They are literally the exact same bytecode.
<[k-> :/
<yorickpeterse> >> RubyVM::InstructionSequence.compile('"foo"').disasm
<ruboto> yorickpeterse # => "== disasm: <RubyVM::InstructionSequence:<compiled>@<compiled>>==========\n0000 trace 1 ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386745)
<bnagy> after creation, yes
<yorickpeterse> >> RubyVM::InstructionSequence.compile("'foo'").disasm
<ruboto> yorickpeterse # => "== disasm: <RubyVM::InstructionSequence:<compiled>@<compiled>>==========\n0000 trace 1 ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386746)
<yorickpeterse> ^ check links, instructions are exactly the same
<[k-> pls why so deep
<bnagy> thanks :)
<yorickpeterse> The bikeshedding occurs because people have no idea how to measure performance
<yorickpeterse> "OMG DOUBLE QUOTES SO SLOW SUCH IMPORTANT WOW"
<[k-> >> $<
<ruboto> [k- # => ARGF (https://eval.in/386748)
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<[k-> >> p $stdin, stdin, STDIN
<ruboto> [k- # => undefined local variable or method `stdin' for main:Object (NameError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386749)
<lugub> yorickpeterse: could optsparse be taking away from gets?
<bnagy> yorickpeterse: yeah I'm having a half-argument with a friend on twitter and I was too lazy to check whether it's 'not worth worrying about' or "exactly the same"
<yorickpeterse> lugub: no idea, hard to tell without any code
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<yorickpeterse> bnagy: if they're argueing about it I recommend them to learn how to write a benchmark
<[k-> bnagy, throw them an article
<yorickpeterse> and learn something about statistics too
<lugub> It keeps looping with no option to input
<yorickpeterse> but yeah, the bikeshed occurs in lots of languages
<bnagy> I think they just haven't done serious ruby for years
<bnagy> haxors etc
<yorickpeterse> lugub: change "elsif" to "else"
<[k-> doesnt options parsing use ARGF
<ljarvis> lugub: gets includes the newline
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<yorickpeterse> and that ^
<[k-> or ARGV
<yorickpeterse> bnagy: I remember the same arguments from PHP
<lugub> OH. wow I totally missed that. thanks
<[k-> what's the diff between ARGF and V
<ljarvis> [k-: look at the documentation
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* [k- slogs to the docs
<bnagy> argf is for reading from pipes
<Ox0dea> ARGF is for reading everything.
<bnagy> if your command is pipelined
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<ljarvis> yes ARGF is for reading any stdin
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<[k-> ARGF reads files
<Ox0dea> ARGF reads stdin and anything in ARGV that it can determine is a file.
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<apeiros> I think it actually treats everything in ARGV as a file
<apeiros> and will raise if it doesn't happen to be one
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<Ox0dea> You're right.
<apeiros> and Kernel#gets being ARGF.gets, and not $stdin.gets causes quite some trouble because of that
<ljarvis> yep
<Ox0dea> apeiros: ARGF isn't greedy, though.
<apeiros> greedy?
<ljarvis> ~% ruby -e 'p gets' -- foo
<ljarvis> -e:1:in `gets': No such file or directory @ rb_sysopen - foo (Errno::ENOENT)
<[k-> > If ARGV is empty, ARGFacts as if it contained STDIN, i.e. the data piped to your script. 
<ljarvis> WHAT BUG
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<Ox0dea> It won't immediately attempt to read every argument as a file.
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<[k-> I think my autocorrect jumped in
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<Ox0dea> ARGF.read will raise if there are non-file arguments, but ARGF.readline won't, as an example.
<apeiros> Ox0dea: correct. like all IOs too, it'll only read when you actually tell it to :)
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<apeiros> um, readline will read, yes
<lugub> yorickpeterse: how come the second time around getc doesn't allow for input? do I need to clear a buffer or something?
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<apeiros> and it will also raise
<ljarvis> readline will raise too
<apeiros> $ ruby -e 'ARGF.readline' -- foo
<apeiros> -e:1:in `readline': No such file or directory @ rb_sysopen - foo (Errno::ENOENT)
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<[k-> Error no entry :D
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<Ox0dea> Right, but if you had supplied two arguments, only the first of which was a file, it wouldn't have raised until a second call to readline.
<apeiros> anything which causes an actual read will raise
<Ox0dea> Yes.
<Ox0dea> Or, rather, it will raise if it can't rea.d
<apeiros> well, until the first file is completely read
<Ox0dea> *read.
<[k-> foo is a legit file in my computer
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<yorickpeterse> lugub: https://eval.in/386752
<lugub> yorickpeterse: thanks
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* apeiros prefers $stdin/$stdout over STDIN/STDOUT
<apeiros> allows me to keep the constants as backup when I reassign the globals
<apeiros> also apart from gets using ARGF, Kernel methods use the globals too (e.g. puts uses $stdout, not STDOUT)
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<[k-> foo = nil; loop { foo = STDIN.gets; break if valid(foo) }; logic here
<ljarvis> wat
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<Ox0dea> How did I end up in ##c?
<adaedra> took a wrong turn
<yorickpeterse> a rather sharp turn
<yorickpeterse> oh wait, that would've been c#
<yorickpeterse> shit
<ljarvis> ##c#
<adaedra> yorickpeterse: heh
<[k-> you want to learn ##c to improve Ruby? :D
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<Ox0dea> I know enough C to be dangerous, and I would like to use that knowledge to pluck at some of the lower-hanging fruit in MRI.
<yorickpeterse> heh
<yorickpeterse> lower hanging fruit
<yorickpeterse> MRI
<yorickpeterse> heh
<Ox0dea> Heh.
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<Ox0dea> The code is occasionally remarkably intertwined.
<Ox0dea> I'm pretty sure I understand how the RB_BLOCK_CALL_FUNC_ARGLIST macro works now, and it's one of the trickier parts.
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<Ox0dea> MRI does a lot of what could rightly be called metaprogramming.
<Ox0dea> In C.
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<hanmac1> Ox0dea: so do you like macros? if yes, check this one out: https://github.com/Hanmac/rwx/blob/master/ext/wxWindow.cpp#L113 ... the macro is defined https://github.com/Hanmac/rwx/blob/master/ext/main.hpp#L490
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<yorickpeterse> Ox0dea: parse.y is a fine example of MRI
<Ox0dea> yorickpeterse: We oughtn't judge a thing at its worst.
<zenspider> I don't want keyword _args_ I want keyword _methods_... like smalltalks
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<Ox0dea> hanmac1: Token pasting is pretty nifty.
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<Ox0dea> You might've taken it just past sane, though. :)
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<hanmac1> Ox0dea: hm where do i do "Token pasting"? my macro_attr is method generating
<Ox0dea> hanmac1: ## is token pasting.
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<lugub> how come this is an invalid retry? retry if answer.downcase.eql?("y")
<hanmac1> ah that is what you mean ... its for turning Attr into _getAttr and _setAttr methods
<Ox0dea> lugub: Where do you expect the retry to retry from?
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<Ox0dea> hanmac1: Yes, I know; "Attr" is the token in that case.
<[k-> retry has to be in a begin block right
<zenspider> just call ping again instead of retry
<hanmac1> shevy: did you see that? Ox0dea did validate i am " just past sane" ;P
<zenspider> also: 2 spaces per indent
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<lugub> zenspider: thanks yeah gist auto changed it
<[k-> don't use eql?
<lugub> how come the retry doesn't work?
<zenspider> don't. use. tabs. EVER.
<lugub> yeah I know gist did it
<zenspider> ew. yeah. don't use eql?
<lugub> why not?
<zenspider> no, you did it.
<Ox0dea> lugub: redo and retry can only be called from within rescue clauses.
<zenspider> it converted it to 8 spaces per tab. you made tabs.
<lugub> 0x0dea: thanks
* hanmac1 uses tabs but only for its C++ code
<lugub> oh you're right zenspider my bad
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<zenspider> ping uri if answer.downcase == "y"
<[k-> sub classes usually don't override eql?
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<[k-> don't you ever override equal?
<Ox0dea> lugub: They're intended to handle *exceptional* behavior, not just when some value doesn't meet some constraint.
<zenspider> Unlike ==, the equal? method should never be overridden by subclasses as it is
<zenspider> used to determine object identity (that is, a.equal?(b) if and only if a is
<zenspider> the same object as b):
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<lugub> right
<[k-> it's in BasicObject
<lugub> I still have the original problem where I can't reget input if it loops again
<lugub> zenspider: right, I understand
<lugub> thanks :)
<[k-> if you type something and press enter, it will work
<Ox0dea> lugub: I suspect you're wanting the user to not have to press Enter to have their input processed, yes?
<lugub> 0x0dea: nope! just if they press y to ping again
<[k-> that wouldn't be easy to do
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<[k-> press y and enter
<lugub> and then if it fails ping again if they say y
<Ox0dea> lugub: There is a crucial difference between just pressing Y, or pressing Y and then Enter.
<[k-> you must press the enter key!
<hanmac1> [k-: eql? != equal?
<hanmac1> >> ["y".eql? "y", "y".equal? "y"]
<ruboto> hanmac1 # => /tmp/execpad-62b7aed93872/source-62b7aed93872:2: syntax error, unexpected tSTRING_BEG, expecting ']' ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386787)
<lugub> $:ruby healthcheck.rb
<lugub> Server http://localhost:12080/pages/index1.html responded with Not Found.
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<lugub> Continue? (y/n)
<hanmac1> >> ["y".eql?("y"), "y".equal?("y")]
<lugub> y
<ruboto> hanmac1 # => [true, false] (https://eval.in/386788)
<lugub> Server http://localhost:12080/pages/index1.html responded with Not Found.
<[k-> hanmac, I never said they are the same
<lugub> Continue? (y/n)
<lugub> oh really?
<lugub> I press y and enter
<Ox0dea> Then your Enter is being picked up by STDIN.getc.
<lugub> ahhh
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<Ox0dea> Pressing Enter puts a newline into the input stream.
<[k-> I know they are different, but I never said they were the same
<lugub> so do I clear STDIN on each iteration?
<zenspider> either use gets or don't hit enter
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<Ox0dea> Or require 'io/console' and use STDIN.getch.
<zenspider> or deal with bad input better
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<Ox0dea> lugub: Easiest would be to use STDIN.gets instead of STDIN.getc, and then just String#chomp off the newline before comparing the input with "y".
<lugub> right, I sorted. gets and answer.chomp!
<lugub> zenspider: its just a script, I don't need to worry about bad input
<lugub> thanks guys :D took a while
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<lugub> there would be no memory worry because I'm calling ping on itself again right? is it good practice?
<bnagy> fwiw I write those a "Hit [enter] to continue, or ^C to abort"
<Ox0dea> lugub: You're using unbounded recursion, so your stack would overflow given enough invalid input.
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<bnagy> y/n is for when you have a choice of "do this or not" but you're going to continue anyway
<lugub> 0x0dea: what would be the best practice?
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<zenspider> that's a LOT of invalid input. doesn't matter here since "it's just a script"
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<Ox0dea> Right, you would need *a lot* of invalid input before it became a problem.
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<lugub> yeah I thought so
<[k-> 3000+?
<Ox0dea> lugub: It's a really little thing, but not having to press Enter is a nice user experience.
<[k-> I prefer if you shift the user input out of ping
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<[k-> did he leave before my suggestion? ;-;
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<lugub> right I get you
<lugub> no I'm still here :)
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<[k-> :3
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<yh> Should a Ruby Gem specify in its Gemfile the exact version of dependencies it uses?
<jhass> yh: rubygems doesn't read Gemfile's
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<jhass> only .gemspec's
<yh> jhass: my bad, I did mean gemspec actually
<jhass> well, for determining a gem's dependencies that is these days
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<yh> Otherwise, it's leaving the decision to the consuming application's Gemfile.lock, which seems to open it to fault if it was programmed to a version that had a bug patched, say
<jhass> and no, I'd say be as permissive as possible
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<yh> oh i see, ~> I'm guessing
<yh> oh, no
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<yorickpeterse> question that will get me frowns: is there something like Builder but for generating Ruby source code?
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<yorickpeterse> (as a String that is)
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<white_bear> i guess there is no way to comment array items when using %w[] syntax, right?
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<yorickpeterse> I know there's unparser, but that is a bit too heavy for my taste
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<yorickpeterse> (too many deps and what not, also depends on "parser" which I don't want)
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<[k-> white_bear: try it
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<white_bear> [k-: i ask because it doesn't work :p
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<apeiros> white_bear: no comments within %w
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<white_bear> right, that's what i thought. will stick with [ 'foo' 'bar' ] then
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<white_bear> can't use symbols because of "-" characters
<apeiros> can
<apeiros> >> :"foo-bar"
<ruboto> apeiros # => :"foo-bar" (https://eval.in/386849)
<apeiros> any valid utf-8 string can be used as a symbol
<white_bear> i meant without quotes :p
<adaedra> >> :"
<ruboto> adaedra # => :
<adaedra> interesting
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<white_bear> the purpose of %w is not using quotes, so... :D
<apeiros> it is also a string array
<apeiros> %I/%i is for symbol arrays
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<adaedra> >> %i[hello-world
<ruboto> adaedra # => [:"hello-world", :
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<[k-> ^
<ringarin> do I simply run `gem update bundler` to address : http://blog.rubygems.org/2015/05/14/CVE-2015-3900.html
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<white_bear> what's the difference between %I and %i (double-quotes vs single?)
<[k-> there is no diff between double and single quotes
<[k-> >> ''
<ruboto> [k- # => "" (https://eval.in/386859)
<ljarvis> white_bear yes one supports interpolation
<[k-> '' will be converted to ""
<adaedra> [k-: there's a diff
<[k-> '' is called the literal string iirc
<ljarvis> [k-: white_bear is clearly asking about %I vs %i
<white_bear> that explains why adaedra's example outputs "" while using %i
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<[k-> :/
<ljarvis> and there's a difference in that %I supports interpolation (thus, making it like " and not like ')
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<adaedra> >> a = 'h'; [ %i[a#{h}], %I[a#{h}] ]
<ruboto> adaedra # => undefined local variable or method `h' for main:Object (NameError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/386861)
<adaedra> >> h = 'h'; [ %i[a#{h}], %I[a#{h}] ]
<ruboto> adaedra # => [[:"a\#{h}"], [:ah]] (https://eval.in/386862)
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<[k-> >> %&lalalalalala&
<ruboto> [k- # => "lalalalalala" (https://eval.in/386864)
<adaedra> %I is to %i what %Q is to %q
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<ringarin> do I simply run `gem update bundler` to address : http://blog.rubygems.org/2015/05/14/CVE-2015-3900.html
<jhass> ringarin: that's an issue in Rubygems, not Bundler
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<jhass> gem update --system
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<yorickpeterse> hrmpf, distributed synchronization using AWS autoscaling tags is an interesting problem
* yorickpeterse checks if he didn't put drugs in his tea this morning
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<yorickpeterse> this would be nicer if AWS had some sort of CAS operation for their API
<yorickpeterse> but alas
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<shevy> hanmac, yeah; if there is one guy that is even crazier than you are, it is Ox0dea
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<shevy> I'd wish ruby would somehow be simpler to use extensively
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<shevy> Something opinionated that is streamlined.
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<shevy> for instance, i find myself to use this here a lot:
<shevy> RbConfig::CONFIG['sitelibdir']+'/foobar/'
<shevy> for a gem project called foobar
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<shevy> any better way to obtain the base directory for a project?
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<[k-> sitelibdir?
<ljarvis> shevy: that isn't accurate..
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<ljarvis> just use File.expand_path('..', __FILE__)
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<yorickpeterse> that isn't much more accurate either
<ljarvis> at least it'll point to the file and not *anything*
<ljarvis> i don't even know what "base directory for a project" means though
<adaedra> just use __dur__ ?
<adaedra> __dir__*
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<shevy> lemme test
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<[k-> it's funny we have __LINE__ __FILE__ but dir is __dir__
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<adaedra> iirc, it's because __LINE__ and __FILE__ are keywords, not __dir__
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<ljarvis> yeah __dir__ is a method
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<[k-> guess it doesn't make sense for dir to be a keyword
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<shevy> your two solutions do not work
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<shevy> they refer to the specific file in question rather than the base directory for a project
<ljarvis> shevy: what are you actually trying to do?
<shevy> RbConfig::CONFIG['sitelibdir']+'/foobar/' <-- always yields to you the base directory of a given project
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<ljarvis> no
<shevy> your solution does?
<ljarvis> it doesn't
<ljarvis> what is "the base directory of a given project"
<ljarvis> what does that even mean?
<shevy> what is so hard to understand
<shevy> you have a project called "foobar"
<shevy> it'll be installed into the SITE_DIR
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<ljarvis> a project? Ruby has no concept of "project"
<shevy> everything works relative to site dir
<shevy> require 'foobar' # there we go
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<ljarvis> sigh
<shevy> so could you now please provide an alternative?
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<[k-> $LOAD_PATH?
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<shevy> I think that'll just be an Array of all the paths respectively that ruby will search through
<adaedra> Your base dir has to be defined somewhere, as it is not something native to ruby
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<ccooke> shevy: correct. What are you actually doing with this directory once you have calculated it?
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<shevy> ccooke I use it to load all files that belong to said project
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<shevy> adaedra I usually follow a simple scheme, main-name like module Foo, path would be foo/ and there will be a foo.rb respectively
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<shevy> In the past I used Pathname
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<ccooke> shevy: so basically you want to load some ruby code that exists in a directory structure?
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<shevy> ccooke yeah but it is already a gem actually; all my projects are essentially gems, mostly (save for some old code)
<ljarvis> OH
<ljarvis> it's a gem is it?
<ljarvis> thanks for mentioning that
<shevy> all. my. projects. are. gems
<shevy> and I use setup.rb for installation as well
<shevy> all the structures I use are gem-compatible as well
<adaedra> I. feel. anger. in. there.
<shevy> and I can install them with or without gem
* ljarvis walks away
<sevenseacat> lol
<shevy> yeah because ljarvis isn't helping
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<adaedra> yeah, of course.
<ccooke> shevy: that wasn't clear. The use of "Project" instead of "gem" is confusing, especially when people ask what you mean by "project" (Which is not a defined term in Ruby). So, you have a gem that needs to load dependant things automatically.
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<shevy> no, I have a project that can be like a gem
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<shevy> and no, it does not "need" to load anything; everything already works just fine
<sevenseacat> *like* a gem?
<shevy> <shevy> any better way to obtain the base directory for a project?
<adaedra> If it ain't broken, don't fix it
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<shevy> adaedra yeah that is fine, I can retain the current way but I am wondering if there are better ways
<ccooke> shevy: __FILE__ on the root .rb file of the project.
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<ccooke> That is the most accurate way to be sure.
<shevy> ah
<shevy> I see what you mean
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<shevy> I was using it on a file one directory structure down
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<shevy> ok
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<adaedra> File.expand_path is here to help with relativity to a given path...
<ccooke> Set it to a constant in the root .rb, then refer to it from the loaded file?
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<ccooke> that way you have an easy way to load it, at least.
<shevy> ccooke yeah
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<shevy> that way it'll give the correct path
<ccooke> Foo::BASEDIR is - if loading things from a base directory is important - perfectly reasonable.
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<[k-> why not use json!
<ccooke> and it's a *lot* less to type :-)
<[k-> then it's extensible!
<shevy> thanks
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<mikecmpbll> is there a more sensible way to implement a min_by method that returns all the members of the collection that share the same min value than: array.select{ |x| x.foo == array.min_by { |y| y.foo }.foo } ?
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<apeiros> mikecmpbll: for starters, only find the min value once
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<adaedra> yeah, save the min in a variable and just select on x.foo == min
<apeiros> instead of on every iteration
<mikecmpbll> this is true.
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<mikecmpbll> thanks :)
<[k-> array.lazy.map(&:foo).select { |x| x == min }
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<adaedra> don't really need this .lazy
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<adaedra> and this only returns you a table of the min value
<adaedra> s/table/array/
<mikecmpbll> yeah, that's a problem.
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<mikecmpbll> i'll go with what i had but with the optimisation.
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<adaedra> it's not a bad way, just don't calculate the min at each time.
<mikecmpbll> indeed.
<apeiros> if it proves to be too slow, there's 2 alternatives. but I would only try those routes if min_by followed by select is indeed too slow.
<mikecmpbll> nah, not slow just aiming for readability and general making sense-ness.
<apeiros> then definitively this solution.
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<mikecmpbll> ok thanks :)
<[k-> aww
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<[k-> .lazy ensures it doesn't loop twice
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<[k-> I wish Ruby had currying sometimes
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<apeiros> [k-: it'll probably still be slower, though
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<adaedra> anyway, it doesn't return any sensible value in your sample
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<[k-> yuh
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<[k-> goodie!
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<mikecmpbll> :D
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<_mh_> yeah, ruby has curry. Discovered a bit ago.
<_mh_> not found myself using it much, as ruby's programming style is somewhat different, but still it's nice to have it at your fingertips
<shevy> _mh_ that's weird isn't it? when a feature in ruby somehow does not seem to fit into other aspects of how one could use or write ruby code
<[k-> what does this mean
<shevy> I am having that a lot with that -> lambda
<jhass> [k-: that you broke ruby
<shevy> [k- is that valid syntax?
<[k-> there is -@
<[k-> so I think it's valid
<jhass> nope
<jhass> those are all special cases
<[k-> nope?
<apeiros> only -@ and +@
<[k-> :(
<shevy> :D
<apeiros> no idea why not for !@ and ~@ too
<apeiros> as those are prefixed as well
<shevy> !!!
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<shevy> [k- now you could file a FEATURE REQUEST at bugs.ruby-lang.org/projects/ruby-trunk
<havenwood> ~ and ! too
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<adaedra> apeiros: because there is no ambiguity with a binary operator
<shevy> hmm
<[k-> alias method -@ hehe
<havenwood> ah, you already said
<havenwood> apeiros: You're too fast with two working arms!
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<shevy> and a working nose
<[k-> I guess so
<[k-> feature request it is
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<apeiros> adaedra: still. I'd be consistent
* [k- adds to to-do
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<apeiros> define prefixed ops with <sigil>@, define all ordinary methods with just the name
<_mh_> shevy: exactly taht.
<shevy> :)
<apeiros> havenwood: yeah! brace yourselves :D
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<apeiros> ;-)
<adaedra> the banhammer is out
<jhass> apeiros: so you're also in the "all self modifying methods should end with !" camp? :P
<[k-> only certain symbols should be allowed
<apeiros> jhass: hm, not really
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<[k-> we shouldn't have "@
<jhass> but it'd be consistent!
<apeiros> but I understand the sentiment
<shevy> [k- hey... class variables have two of them!
<jhass> (I'm not btw ;) )
<apeiros> but personally I'm not a fan of ! and ? for method names in general
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<shevy> I love ?
<shevy> do not take it away from me!
<apeiros> I liked it at the beginning, but changed my mind
<[k-> I like ?
<apeiros> I do still like =, though
<[k-> that's the only thing you can guarantee the type without checking!
<apeiros> you can't
<[k-> convention...
<apeiros> >> def fooled?; "totally!"; end; fooled?
<ruboto> apeiros # => "totally!" (https://eval.in/387002)
<[k-> booooo
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<[k-> you deserve a slap for not following convention
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<apeiros> there's plenty of people who advocate not converting the return value of ? methods to boolean, instead just use the truthiness of whatever you query
<apeiros> (which I find horrible - it's a potential leak)
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<[k-> :/
<apeiros> [k-: oh, I do. my ? methods strictly return true/false.
* apeiros is right back
<apeiros> would that be `/me irb`?
<[k-> we should have <@> while we are at it
<[k-> html!
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<ytti> i don't see added value of adding
<apeiros> that'd be quite confusing to say in a ruby channel, huh? :D
<ytti> if last_line
<havenwood> >> 42.nonzero?
<ruboto> havenwood # => 42 (https://eval.in/387008)
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<[k-> whyyyyyyy
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<jhass> haha
<apeiros> File.size? is another example
<[k-> >> 0.non_zero?
<ruboto> [k- # => undefined method `non_zero?' for 0:Fixnum (NoMethodError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/387009)
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<[k-> 0.nonzero?
<[k-> bleh
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<[k-> why do they not follow conventions
<jhass> [k-: ssh, I gave you a place to experiment
<havenwood> [k-: The convention is a truthy value. 42 is truthy.
<ytti> how does
<[k-> we should shove them out of the window when Ruby 3 comes
<ytti> 42 ? true : false
<ytti> avoid leak
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<ytti> what is the leak? information leak?
<apeiros> ytti: in the case of an immediate, there's no leak
<ytti> or object which may get mutated?
<apeiros> x = foo.query?
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<[k-> >> !!0.nonzero?
<ruboto> [k- # => false (https://eval.in/387011)
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<[k-> :)
<apeiros> if x is any non trivial datastructure, you've just added a reference and prevent GC
<ddv> my convention might be different than yours
<[k-> we should !! all methods? now
<havenwood> [k-: 0.nonzero? is already: #=> false
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<havenwood> nil
<havenwood> rather
<havenwood> falsey
<[k-> UGH WHY
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<apeiros> anyway, brb!
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<havenwood> >> 0.nonzero?
<ruboto> havenwood # => nil (https://eval.in/387018)
<[k-> we should really throw these away
<havenwood> [k-: Because the method ends with a `?` do the return value is truthy or falsey.
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<[k-> we should have a method blacklist
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<havenwood> [k-: So `nil` or `false` are one option, and the other option is anything else.
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<[k-> but then if we want a Boolean we have to !!
<havenwood> [k-: What's wrong with how it is?
<havenwood> [k-: Why do you want true instead of truthiness?
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<[k-> case things; when true
<[k-> does 42===true
<[k-> I think not
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<havenwood> >> :no_problem if 42
<ruboto> havenwood # => :no_problem (https://eval.in/387024)
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<havenwood> [k-: It's how Ruby works. It may be unintuitive for you at first but it's not surprising when you're accustomed.
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<[k-> ;-;
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<[k-> that's why I prefer staticly typed
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<[k-> staticallg
<[k-> derp
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<apeiros> stalactite typing?
<jhass> crystal is doing that a lot more for ? methods, it even has Hash#[]? ;D
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<apeiros> pondered having appended ? as a generic boolean conversion in my toy lang
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<apeiros> sooo, what did I want to work on?
<adaedra> ruby
<havenwood> [k-: I say it's not surprising once you're accustomed but a few years ago Rails had a kerfuffle where some folk argued for `true` and `false`. They were rebuffed but it comes up.
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<jhass> chronos for crystal
<apeiros> adaedra: that'd be "with", not "on" :)
<adaedra> nuclear weapons
<adaedra> HELLO NSA
<apeiros> nucular
<[k-> kerfuffle?
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<apeiros> I think I'll work on my valaptor lib. need that for quite a couple of things :)
<[k-> crystal's type system isn't doing enough imo
<shevy> velociraptor
<[k-> we need return types of methods!
<jhass> [k-: it's there
<[k-> :o
<[k-> I only ever seen def a (b: type)
<apeiros> jhass: that'd probably be fun. I hate how limiting time is :(
<[k-> that's a bit ugly
<[k-> but ohwells
<ddv> [k- always wants stuff that is already available
<[k-> yes that's why I'm into Haskell
<[k-> it's not like language cannot be improved
<havenwood> [k-: It seems all the features you want do exist though. You just don't know about them!
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<[k-> well there are Contracts for ruby
<[k-> those gems that you plug in
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<havenwood> Not DRY.
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<havenwood> But potentially useful nonetheless.
<apeiros> [k-: contracts? as in DBC?
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<[k-> dbc?
<apeiros> design by contract
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<apeiros> pre-, postconditions and invariants
<havenwood> [k-: See Mirah or Crystal if you're yearning for types. Or upcoming versions of Rubinius and Ruby may have some variant of optional/gradual/soft typing.
<[k-> dbc on github? no
<[k-> I've seen where you type Contract on top of defs
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<[k-> like decorators
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<[k-> yessss
<apeiros> jhass: oh, that'd probably be something which would totally get me into crystal - if they added DBC + command/query separation
<apeiros> (the latter is a necessity for the former as far as I can see it)
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<jhass> apeiros: mmh, they seek to stabilize the language, work's more going into stdlib and fixing compiler bugs these days
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<ddv> elixir <3
<havenwood> ddv: \o/
<apeiros> I wonder whether I'll revisit eiffel one day
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<apeiros> from what I remember it was pretty nice
<[k-> crystal looks like scalla
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<[k-> Scala*
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<jhass> wat
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<[k-> a little
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<ddv> [k-: why?
<[k-> var:Type
<adaedra> typescript has that too
<adaedra> rust also, iirc
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<[k-> i myself prefer haskell's way of doing it
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<[k-> the ::
<jhass> foo :: Type is a definition in crystal
<havenwood> Speaking of Elixir, Erlang/OTP 18 released today.
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<yorickpeterse> dat error message
<[k-> is it only for variables?
<jhass> where else would it make sense?
<adaedra> for half-radioactive vietnamese turtles
<[k-> I thought I was convinced to learn crystal
<[k-> but meh
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<havenwood> [k-: Because?
<adaedra> because haskell is better, duh
<ddv> [k-: why are you even in this channel?
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<[k-> because I also Ruby?
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<[k-> your accusation was hurtful tho.
<ddv> what accusation?
<[k-> 'why are you even in this channel'
<[k-> maybe accusation is the wrong word
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<[k-> but hurtful nonetheless
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<ddv> did I hurt your feelings?
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<volty> what's going on here, a love story ? :)
<[k-> somewhat
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<ddv> lol
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<apeiros> what do you folks think about emoji for passwords?
<havenwood> apeiros: :)
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<havenwood> uh... for it!
<apeiros> serious question
<adaedra> undoable
<txdv> how do jo write them out
<ddv> apeiros: easy to brute force
<apeiros> txdv: on apple devices - nothing easier than that
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<apeiros> txdv: cmd-ctrl-space brings up the emoji palette
<adaedra> apeiros: not everywhere
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<havenwood> apeiros: Rename the computers and any network devices to Emoji names too.
<ddv>
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<apeiros> havenwood: not talking about that ;-)
<adaedra>
<havenwood> I have whether git is dirty change the emoji in my prompt. I like that.
<havenwood> Emoji ALL THE PLACES \o/
<ddv> I didn't even know there was a emoij palette
<apeiros> I think using emojis for passwords is ingenious
<ddv> lol
<adaedra>
<adaedra> noes*
<apeiros> entropy goes high up, and it's easy to remember
<txdv> apeiros: once you are not on an apple computer you will have trouble writing them
<apeiros> that'd be the pro's
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<[k-> don't broadcast ssid and use emojis
<apeiros> contras: hard to tell somebody else your password when needed (might actually be a pro :-p)
<[k-> no one will ever guess!
<adaedra> until you invert
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<apeiros> txdv: good point. contra: potential difficult entry if you're on a foreign device
<volty> I think better go with chinese logosyllabic — much more choice, much more fantasy
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<ClassyCritic> Hey guys, I'm getting this error when I'm trying to scrape NCAA soccer teams: https://gist.github.com/AthleteInvictus/e27798233e78fd38dd6e
<apeiros> volty: that's actually in the same area of thought. increase entropy by using characters beyond the ascii range
<havenwood> ClassyCritic: Forbidden! 403 Forbidden (OpenURI::HTTPError)
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<apeiros> I do wonder though - a cracker could consider the max entropy to still be 256, by treating it as binary. even a bit less, by treating it as "anything valid utf-8". no?
<ClassyCritic> havenwood: yes, that's the problem I'm receiving
<ClassyCritic> havenwood: I'm new to Ruby, and I'm not quite sure how to fix it
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<[k-> China will crack your password no problem
<volty> that's true — total length of n bytes can still be reduced to cracking just that bytes
<volty> s/can still/ is/
<adaedra> This is an HTTP error ClassyCritic, your distant service don't want you to access what you're trying to access
<ClassyCritic> adaedra: so no way around?
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<adaedra> not ruby-side, I'd say - except if you have a problem in your request building
<adaedra> try to access it with curl -v (url)
<jhass> ClassyCritic: there's always a way around. Though if they make it hard consider if it's legal
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<ClassyCritic> jhass: Just trying to draw some mens soccer statistics from the NCAA website
<volty> I remember the first time I was trying to crypto something, shifting, rolling, moving, and at the end in the binary I had the same password shown over the space chars :)
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<volty> (or zeroes, can't remember)
<havenwood> ClassyCritic: For example if they forbid certain user agent strings, you could change yours to something they don't forbid. As already mentioned, examine the legality before you bypass being forbidden.
<Tai15> that's an interesting thought. i use passphrases already and speak Chinese. It never occured to me to use a Chinese passphrase.
<havenwood> Tai15: :)
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<adaedra> makes sense, if you're sure you can type it anywhere you may need
<Tai15> and I use traditional characters. those commies would be completely fooled!
<adaedra> “commies”
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<Tai15> sorry, a bad joke adaedra, HK and Taiwan use different characters than communist china
* jhass makes his next password out of box drawing characters
<adaedra> Tai15: ah ok
<apeiros> jhass: tetronomicon password :D
<volty> maybe drawing chinese ideograms on a bitmap. but as apeiros pointed out, for a cracker it's just a sequence of bytes / chars / whatevers
<jhass> mmh, or all these lovely different spaces
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<jhass> narrow non-breaking space zero width space wide space
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<apeiros> oh, fez calls it "tetronimo"
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<apeiros> jhass: yeah, there's at least 8 of them
<apeiros> (spaces)
<adaedra> all those spaces
<pontiki> ooooo, one for every day of the week plus a spare!
<jhass> RTL mark could be a fun addition too
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<adaedra> poor RTL
<jhass> my password is all spaces, but from right to left!
<apeiros> haha
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<Tai15> brilliant jhass
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<shevy> unicode spaces?
<adaedra> meh, I keep hunter2, at least it's easy to type.
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<shevy> no
<shevy> you are french
<shevy> it would be:
<shevy> unter2
<Tai15> adaedra, that just showed up as ******* for me
<dudedudeman> oonter2*
<jhass> reminds me I should try to learn neo2 again, which has all kind of nice symbols accessible
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<adaedra> shevy: …
<shevy> lol Tai15
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<adaedra> Tai15: of course it did, IRC protect my password
<adaedra> *+s
* Tai15 nods
<apeiros> I use a single space as password everywhere.
<apeiros> nobody ever tries that :o)
<jhass> I wonder how many sites you can trip with trailing space
<shevy> I think some require more minimal characters
<jhass> like stripping it during input but not during validation or vice versa
<shevy> I had to change my gmail password to 9 characters... I hated that
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<jhass> shevy: just use a sentence, you're easily beyond 20
<apeiros> shevy: I would hate it too if I had to reduce the length of my password
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<shevy> jhass but then I'd type even more!!!
<Tai15> i use a password manager that's a 20 character mix of random upper,lower, and numbers
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<apeiros> shevy: you type your passwords?!? o0
<Tai15> i'm amazed at how many sites i have to manually chop off 4 characters for it
<shevy> apeiros yeah
<apeiros> well…
<apeiros> Tai15: yeah
<Tai15> and then they yell at me that I need a special character
<adaedra> I type my passwords too
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<Tai15> >:-(
<adaedra> I trust no password manager
<apeiros> it's annoying how many sites think they have to add an upper limit to pw length
<apeiros> I mean, 255 I'd understand
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<apeiros> but anything below it just doesn't make sense.
<pontiki> the stored field is likely 255 anyway :>
<shevy> do you want to use shakespeare as password?
<adaedra> It's hashed anyway
<[k-> they have databases types to fulfill
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<apeiros> storage can't be the reason either if they're doing it correctly.
<[k-> they also have space restrictions
<Tai15> idk, my password manager is only for online stuff so I figure it's not the weakest link
<apeiros> the hash will be the same length, no matter how long the pw
<Tai15> my local encryption is all diceware passwords
<shevy> Tai15 YOU are the weakest link :)
<adaedra> all passwords have the same length in DB...
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<[k-> oh
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<jhass> adaedra: or so you hope ;D
* Tai15 stares at the wrench in the corner
<[k-> huehuehue
<Tai15> yup
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<apeiros> hrm
<apeiros> trying to find a good way to define allowed characters in a password validator…
<adaedra> /./
<yorickpeterse> why would you disallow anything in the first place?
<apeiros> pondering to just use e.g. `characters: %w[L M N]`, where the values are anything which is valid in \p{} regex
<yorickpeterse> unless you store things in plain text it shouldn
<yorickpeterse> * shouldn't matter
<Aria> Yeah. Passwords = bytes.
<apeiros> yorickpeterse: *I* wouldn't
<apeiros> plenty of orgs seem to, though
<Aria> So as long as you're consistent with encoding -- and you should be -- I say don't restrict.
<apeiros> e.g. because they can't handle it on all systems
<apeiros> (our company e.g. fails at anything non-ascii somewhere in the ldap auth :-S)
<yorickpeterse> wtf
<adaedra> wtff
<ddv> wtf
<apeiros> nah, this is for a validator, i.e. not a specific case.
<Aria> Fun.
<apeiros> like this: `password_validator = Valaptor.validate(:password).using minimum: 8, dictionaries: %[top10k english]`
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<volty> the character set should be limited at the expense of the length
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<apeiros> the default for characters would probably be \p{Any}
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<volty> n * (set) === 2 * n * (set / 2)
<apeiros> and encoding: 'utf-8'
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<dudedudeman> how the eff does one test for datetime in minitest
<motivated> how to learn the oops concept?
<apeiros> motivated: practice
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<shevy> motivated thing of ants
<shevy> erm, *think
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<volty> naaa, not ants
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<volty> absolutely
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<shevy> class Ant
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<shevy> ant_452356 = Ant.new
<shevy> ant_452357 = Ant.new
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<volty> the best example for learning oop is geometry — position (coordinates), point, shape, etc etc
<motivated> where i can practice?
<volty> nothing better than that
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<volty> motivated: on your desk?
<Tai15> hey, while i'm hanging out with you guys, does anyone have any experience with any of the tools like RUBYMOTION that allow you to write cross-platform apps in Ruby
<apeiros> Tai15: #rubymotion has plenty I'd guess ;-)
<Tai15> or just experience with writing apps in ruby at all
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<jhass> ?anyone ;)
<ruboto> ;), Just ask your question, if anyone has or can, they will respond.
<shevy> it should not be too difficult to have it work on linux and windows at the same time
<jhass> ups
<Tai15> oh, there's a whole channel? sweet, thank you, kind sir/ma'am
<shevy> yeah ma'am
<shevy> the lady apieros
<[k> but anyone is referring to everybody!
<shevy> nobody is referring to anyone
<[k> its much better then zeroing to one person
<shevy> they could zero in on one person :)
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<Tai15> i didn't really have a question about it specifically, just wondered if anyone had any opinions about which ones worked well. i'm thinking about trying my hand at some app development for a speciality market, and ruby is my strongest language
<Tai15> ...and I just realized I responded to a bot
<shevy> ?anyone jhass would now tell you about anyone
<ruboto> jhass, Just ask your question, if anyone has or can, they will respond.
<Tai15> ._.
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<shevy> damn, that bot truncates
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<shevy> Tai15 happened to someone else too, about yesterday or so
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<shevy> ruboto just looks so clever and innocent
<Tai15> hehe, thanks shevy :-)
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<volty> shevy: have you done something with ruboto ?
<volty> or somebody else, here ?
<shevy> volty I haven't
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<apeiros> shevy: it doesn't truncate. the command is simply `?<factoid> <target nickname>`
<_blizzy_> hmm, RestClient or Faraday
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<motivated> i wanted to do
<jhass> I think http is the new hip thing
<[k> we have a just http?
<[k> level 10 succinctness!
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<jhass> I like faraday because I can just swap out the adapter as needed
<volty> motivated: maybe better you state what already you know.
<jhass> though some people had issues with it I heard
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<mikecmpbll> i find that chaining syntax really crappy.
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<l0oky> Hello :)
<[k> hello
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<[k> (some people dont like it if you complain about ruby here)
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<l0oky> Will this " unless params[:group] " check If not params[:group] is defined? or do I have to say it to ruby diffrently?
<l0oky> [k: you talking to me ? :D
<apeiros> grmpf, somehow my construct seems too verbose :-|
<l0oky> I like ruby :)
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<[k> l0oky: no
<apeiros> l0oky: yes
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<l0oky> hahah
<l0oky> yes no yes... no?
<apeiros> l0oky: `unless expression` is (almost) identical to `if !(expression)`
<[k> params will check if :group is defined
<[k> but not the unless
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<[k> and it'll throw an error
<l0oky> apeiros: I am not talking about a unless keyword
<apeiros> though, it will not check "definedness"
<[k> you should use .key?
<apeiros> l0oky: well, params[:group] will simply look up the key
<l0oky> if It's not defined?
<apeiros> no
<[k> throw an error
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<apeiros> l0oky: actually - what *is* params? a hash?
<l0oky> It wouldn't do like false
<apeiros> or are we talking about rails? then it'd be a HashWithIndifferentAccess
<l0oky> if you ever used rails its a string parameter passed at the url
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<[k> i don't recommend you using if/unless params[:group]
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<l0oky> yeah that..
<apeiros> ok, so rails. and no, params is not a string ;-)
<l0oky> :P
<apeiros> ok, params HWIA has normal []. it looks up a key and returns the value
<apeiros> if the key is not in the hash, it returns nil
<apeiros> and nil is falsy
<l0oky> .nil?
<[k> oh it doesnt throw an error? i confused it with fetch
<apeiros> >> if nil then 1 else 2 end
<ruboto> apeiros # => 2 (https://eval.in/387070)
<[k> (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
<apeiros> l0oky: ^ nil is falsy, as said
<apeiros> [k: you can make it raise an error if you want :)
<l0oky> ty :)
<apeiros> params = Hash.new { |_h, k| raise KeyError, "Key not found: #{k.inspect}" }
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<l0oky> Hash is very much like json
<l0oky> is js
<apeiros> l0oky: very much not.
<l0oky> in*
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<apeiros> JSON is serialized data.
<apeiros> a hash is not serialized.
<l0oky> Does that mean JSON is better? ?
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<l0oky> :D
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<apeiros> oh dear
<apeiros> no, it doesn't mean that.
<l0oky> JK
<pontiki> flee!! FLEEEEE!!!!
<l0oky> HAHHA
<Tai15> hehe
<havenwood> Ruby Object Notation (RON) is different than JavaScript Object Notation (JSON).
<adaedra> !quote l0oky
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<l0oky> Well both serve the same purpose and they're different in nature i guess
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<havenwood> l0oky: Are you familiar with YAML, Marshal, etc?
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<l0oky> havenwood: not really.. :D
<startupality> what requirements is gmail using for threading, does it decide only on subject and senders, or it includes in-reply-to, references header to decide which email should be in the same thread with which?
<l0oky> YAML actually a template engine?
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<l0oky> I think I've used it in node.js express
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<Sou|cutter> startupality: mostly seems like subject to me.
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<havenwood> l0oky: Check the docs for them and you'll see they're actually the serialization business.
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<startupality> Sou|cutter: excelt t
<startupality> except that it is not
<l0oky> ty
<startupality> there is something more and it doesnt seem that participants is enough either
<startupality> i am finding contrasting info online about this
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<havenwood> l0oky: Another serialization option that's a gem instead of in the stdlib would be MessagePack, for example: http://msgpack.org/
<[k> there is also PStore
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<[k> which is in the stdlib
<havenwood> [k: That's transactional Marshal.
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<havenwood> [k: That's not a different serialization.
<havenwood> [k: Its equivalent for YAML is YAML::Store.
<[k> :/
<havenwood> [k: Marshal is to PStore as YAML is to YAML::Store.
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<havenwood> *transactional storage to a file
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<l0oky> What would the `||=` operator mean here: `@current_user ||= User.find(session[:user_id]) if session[:user_id]` ? Thanks :P
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<havenwood> Transactional YAML to DB too: http://ruby-doc.org/stdlib/libdoc/yaml/rdoc/YAML/DBM.html
<havenwood> YAML::DBM
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<[k> l0oky: it means @current_user = (@current_user || User.find(session[:user_id]) if session[:user_id]
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<[k> i forgot a ) there
<havenwood> l0oky: @current_user || @current_user = ...
<[k> oh
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<[k> i stand corrected then
<[k> i thought it always assigns
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<[k> A common misconception is that a ||= b is equivalent to a = a || b, but it behaves like a || a = b
<[k> i thought it was the second in the first place
<[k> but i got corrected by an article before
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<[k> so i switched to the first
<[k> @.@
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<[k> i'll just remember it as short-curcuiting again
<apeiros> [k: well, generally `a <op>= b` indeed expands to `a = a <op> b`
<apeiros> but &&= and ||= are the two exceptions
<[k> pls no
<[k> i alrdy know this
<l0oky> havenwood: So rails doesn't query the second time cool
<[k> they always correct me!
<l0oky> ty
<[k> and my brain gets it wrong!
<apeiros> :)
<apeiros> it's all about eliminating a potential foo= method call.
<[k> i have long known that ruby can short curcuit
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<apeiros> other than that, the two are equivalent
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<apeiros> with variables (no foo= assignment method) it makes no difference
<[k> luckily, ifs are not a method call, or else they would be expensive
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<[k> wait, how does that stack up in rubinius?
<[k> are ifs in rubinius a method call?
<[k> are they expensive?
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<muhammadn> Hi
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<muhammadn> I have a ruby code (not rails!) that benchmarks mongodb but i can't seem to have the data persisted..
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<adaedra> “(not rails!)” :)
<[k> mongodb and data persistance...
<muhammadn> adaedra: take a look at my gist. :)
<adaedra> Already did
<adaedra> Don't see anything wrong, but I'm no mongodb expert :)
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<[k> i recommend 2000.times do |i|
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<[k> for loops are discouraged
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<dx7> adaedra: where is the mongoid.yml?
<muhammadn> ok
<adaedra> why do you ask me, dx7
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<muhammadn> dx7, you have to created in a directory config/mongoid.yml
<apeiros> does this look sensible? https://gist.github.com/apeiros/f78b5e30d3486b258957
<[k> you also have a ridiculously long method arguments
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<muhammadn> dx7: i have included in the gist - https://gist.github.com/muhammadn/b16a6b5d8396a3ee8283
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<muhammadn> [k: yeah.
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<[k> what you should do is to split it into multiple lines if you have no choice
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<apeiros> alternatively pondering to allow `process_port = validate_input | adapt_port | validate_port` (use | like a pipe, instead of the .then)
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<dx7> muhammadn: are you setting the environment to "staging"?
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<muhammadn> dx7: yeah. export RACK_ENV="staging"
<muhammadn> dx7: actually it can be anything depending on mongoid.yml
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<dx7> muhammadn: I ran it here and everything works fine
<dx7> $ RACK_ENV=staging ruby test.rb
<dx7> Time elapsed: 2.727871 seconds.
<dx7> PageView created:
<dx7> 2000
<muhammadn> dx7: what does mongotest collection show you?
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<muhammadn> dx7: use mongotest db.mongotest.find()
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<muhammadn> dx7: do you see any documents directly inside mongodb?
<muhammadn> dx7: i mean mongo shell
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<dx7> muhammadn: 1 min
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<apeiros> hm, nobody got an opinion on https://gist.github.com/apeiros/f78b5e30d3486b258957 ? :(
<dangerousdave> hello
<apeiros> hi dangerousdave
<jhass> apeiros: that means it's good, nothing to profi.. er criticize ;)
<dangerousdave> apeiros: how are you?
<apeiros> dangerousdave: fine, fine. and you?
<apeiros> jhass: hrm, I guess that's one way to see it
<dangerousdave> not bad at all
<dx7> muhammadn: 2000 documents
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<muhammadn> dx7: all created on your end?
<dangerousdave> hoping things will be better once I can get some help with what I am sure is a silly mistake https://gist.github.com/deathwishdave/17fbc7aceac1ad0667f3
<muhammadn> dx7: hmm.. mine is not appearing
<dx7> muhammadn: you need to do: "use mongotest" to use the database
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<dangerousdave> why is key undefined?
<muhammadn> dx7: i did in the mongodb shell
<dx7> muhammadn: after that you need to verify the collection, not the database again
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<dx7> muhammadn: then to this: "db.page_views.count();"
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<dx7> or as you want: db.page_views.find();
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<apeiros> dangerousdave: well, I don't see any definition for "key" in your SharedFile class
<apeiros> dangerousdave: did you forget to add `attr_reader :key`?
<muhammadn> dx7: how stupid of me. i did db.mongotest.find() instead of db.page_view.find()
<muhammadn> dx7: how stupid of me. i did db.mongotest.find() instead of db.page_views.find()
<[k> much derp dangerousdave
<apeiros> dangerousdave: also IMO if the class is File*, the file_ in file_name and _size is redundant ;-)
<apeiros> [k: that was uncalled for
<[k> you do not need to do self.key too, key will suffice, although you could use key() to make it more explicit
<dx7> muhammadn: hehehe it's not stupid... just a little detail
<dangerousdave> apeiros: thanks! i new it would be a silly mistake, just couldn't see the wood for the trees
<dangerousdave> working now
<[k> oh there is an @key
<apeiros> dangerousdave: yw
<[k> you should use @key instead of self.key
<[k> that is the problem
<apeiros> won't help with other.key, though ;-)
<[k> but the error is with self.key!
* apeiros prefers @key over self.key/key too, though
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* apeiros should use the word "though" less often, though
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<[k> dangerousdave: also, use alias_method :eql?, :== as it is more expressive :D
<muhammadn> dx7: yeah. i had not used mongodb in a very long time.
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<[k> dangerousdave: (non-issue) use results.each { |result| ... } if the body is one-liner (according to the style guide)
<[k> but that's a non-issue
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<[k> dangerousdave: attr_reader also accepts multiple arguments, so you can collapse them into 1 method call
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<[k> eg attr_reader :file_name, :file_size
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<dfockler> oh whoa I think I used self.attribute when I switched over from java
<[k> (it is also recommended not to use MD5 now a days)
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<[k> does anyone leave out brackets when defining methods like me?
<[k> i usually just def == other
<[k> looks cleaner imo
<apeiros> [k: my style guide says "use do/end for side effect"
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<[k> after many many ridiculous times of using if() in java
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<[k> i was like i hate brackets!
<dangerousdave> [k: thanks
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<dfockler> brackets?
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<[k> parentheses
<dfockler> parentheses, ahh ok
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<dangerousdave> [k: whats wrong with md5?
<[k> apeiros: link pls :3
<dfockler> I only leave them off when I'm using a dsl
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<[k> dangerousdave: it is found that collisions are much more frequent in md5 than other hashing algorithms
<apeiros> sadly the link to the late Jim's 2004 article about it is 500 server error :(
<[k> (i follow the github one to a certain extent)
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<dfockler> that multiline braces one gives me javascript jitters
<[k> seems like a good convention to follow
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<[k> yeah, thats why i avoided it
<jhass> apeiros: it's in the wayback machine
<dfockler> and just eyeballing it, it looks like you are building a nested hash
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<apeiros> even with the convention of using {} for return value, you'll usually not have multiline {} blocks
<apeiros> simply because that collides with other elements of good style :)
<apeiros> jhass: thanks
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<jhass> np, that's totally in my bookmarks :D
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<muhammadn> dx7: thanks man for helping me out here
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<dx7> muhammadn: no problem
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<slash_nick> Does anyone have any info on the performance of a method with implicit block vs method with explicit block... that is, is `def foo; yield; end` somehow more performant than `def foo(&block); yield; end` ???
<apeiros> slash_nick: &block is faster for passing the block on. for everything else, yield is faster.
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<apeiros> e.g. `def my_each(&block); @my.each(&block); end` is better than `def my_each; @my.each do |*args| yield(*args); end; end`
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<apeiros> but `def my_yielder; yield 1, 2, 3; end` is better than `def my_yielder(&block); block.call(1, 2, 3); end`
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<slash_nick> apeiros: This is a perfect example of the situation I'm asking about: https://github.com/elastic/elasticsearch-ruby/blob/master/elasticsearch-api/lib/elasticsearch/api/utils.rb#L190-L201
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<slash_nick> eh, my highlight picked up a few lines at the end by mistake... I'm talking about that `def __rescue...` method
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<[k> explict < implicit
<sebbers> Has anyone here had experiencing parsing out the day and times from a string like the following:
<sebbers> “I’m available on Tuesday and Thursday from 4:15pm to 7:15pm.
<sebbers> Then also from 3 to 5 on Wed. and Fri.
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<sebbers> Wed 10:00-2“
<[k> explicit is slower
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<[k> sebbers, there are libraries out there for ruby to pick out info like this
<[k> i forgot what they are
<[k> i think i bookmarked some gem aggregation sites
<[k> hold on
<apeiros> [k: not correct.
<apeiros> [k: as I said, it depends on the context.
<sebbers> thank you [k
<sebbers> really appreciate it
<apeiros> slash_nick: that's a case for yield. and then you don't define the &block in the args either.
<apeiros> __methods? srsly? o0
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<sebbers> thank you!
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<[k> yw
<[k> apeiros: ;-;
<havenwood> sebbers: You might also look at ChronicDuration: https://github.com/hpoydar/chronic_duration#readme
<[k> its the truth for the most case
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<sebbers> oh alright. thank you!
<havenwood> sebbers: It can't handle the Tues/Thurs from your example but it gets the times: #=> 14835
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<[k> chronic can parse "mon"
<[k> it looks like chronic duration was meant more for durations
<[k> heh
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<slash_nick> apeiros: thanks, you're the best... don't tell shevy
<[k> you already pinged him
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<apeiros> [k: I wouldn't actually make any bets on whether I have &block or yield more often in my code
<apeiros> gut feeling is that I have more &block
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<avdi> apeiros: thanks
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<apeiros> avdi: yw :D
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<shevy> slash_nick lol
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<shevy> I think that was the funniest comment I read on #ruby today
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<shevy> I don't get to do much ruby anymore, somehow everything is shifting away to other things :(
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<wmoxam> shevy: what are you doing instead?
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<Senjai> shevy: Should submit to bash.org
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<greensoup> what's the difference between the `bundle` and `bundler` command?
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<apeiros> greensoup: there is no bundler command?
<apeiros> bundle is the command provided by the bundler gem
<Darkwater> there is for me
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<shevy> wmoxam currently I am reading up on organic chemistry and biochemistry; biochemistry is ok, I don't like organic chemistry too much... to reach compound D, starting from A, over B and C... hard to know what rules to apply when, how and where...
<apeiros> maybe they've added it because too many were confused that bundler's executable was called bundle…
<greensoup> apeiros: both seem to appear in my path when I install the bundler gem.
<shevy> bundler should provide a bin/bundle file greensoup
<apeiros> greensoup: anyway, just inspect it?
<Darkwater> maybe it's for people who expect bundler's binary to be called bundler
<Darkwater> ie. same as package name
<apeiros> …
<shevy> no sorry my mistake
<apeiros> that's what I meant
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<shevy> I just realized that bundler provides bin/bundle and also bin/bundler
<Darkwater> oh read straight over that, sorry
<wmoxam> shevy: ah, I assumed you were using a different language
<greensoup> they are identical looking script files. I was wondering if there was something deeper that looked at the args and acted differently
<shevy> wmoxam ah, nah... I still want to learn something new... C is on my immediate list... but if I look at university lectures and exams, it's a lot of C++ and Java...
<[k> you can use a diff checker
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<shevy> strangely enough, bundle and bundler differ
<shevy> in one line:
<greensoup> someone in #travis said one worked locally for him when the other didn't. which surprised me.
<shevy> if path =~ %r'/bundler-0\.(\d+)' && $1.to_i < 9
<shevy> if path =~ %r'/bundler-0.(\d+)' && $1.to_i < 9
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<shevy> greensoup well almost identical :-)
<shevy> but I may not have the most recent bundler... 1.9.4 or so
<[k> could be a bug
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<greensoup> shevy: weird. mine are completely identical to each other. but programs can always act differently based on the values of argv or something like that.
<greensoup> but I doubt that's the case here
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<shevy> I just realized... my favourite ruby philosophy is not the TIMTOWTDO or DRY or anything else but this quote from matz:
<shevy> "Instead of emphasizing the what, I want to emphasize the how part: how we feel while programming."
<shevy> greensoup well perhaps it was fixed in later versions
<shevy> I find it confusing that two almost same-names are provided though
<shevy> perhaps because people were wondering why "bundle" worked for a project called "bundler" hehehe
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<Virtual_> I'm having some trouble with Ruby gems on Arch Linux is this the right to place to seek help
<shevy> yeah Virtual_
<shevy> jhass is using arch btw
<shevy> so he can answer!
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<Outlastsheep> Virtual_: I use Arch, though I'm not a super-guru.
<Outlastsheep> I can keep bashing my head into the wall until either one of the two breaks, or jhass comes in.
<Senjai> ?use Virtual_
<ruboto> Virtual_, Don't ask "does anyone use <thing>?". It's better to just state your problem and if anyone has used <thing> they will most likely answer.
<Outlastsheep> What seems to be the problem?
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<Virtual_> well i'm trying to install the gem 'gosu' with 'gem install gosu' I get no problems from that until I try to require gosu in irb and it tells me it can't find gosu
<Virtual_> or any other gem im trying for that matter
<wmoxam> shevy: Java is pretty boring ;)
<wmoxam> shevy: it's good to know some C though
<Outlastsheep> Hmm.
<apeiros> Virtual_: sounds like your irb and your gem command don't use the same ruby
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<jhass> Virtual_: did you change anything opposed to the defaults? gist your gem env output
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<shevy> wmoxam yeah
<apeiros> Virtual_: what does `command -v ruby` show? and what does `gem env` list as "RUBY EXECUTABLE"?
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<shevy> Virtual_ do you have more than one ruby? also, study the output of "gem env" or ideally upload that information to gist or somewhere
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<shevy> if we all repeat it once, it will stick :)
<[k> you all charge at him at onc
<[k> i bet he feels overloaded
<apeiros> that's virtually impossible
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<[k> heh
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<shevy> [k he is an arch user, they are smarter than the average ubuntu user!
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<Virtual_> 'command -v ruby' just prints /usr/bin/ruby
<jhass> Virtual_: works fine here, are you sure the gem install gosu was successful?
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<jhass> does gem list have it?
<shevy> Virtual_ gosu must be compiled, it did not error out?
<apeiros> jhass: they say irb can't find any gem
<Virtual_> jhass: I am it reported no errors anyway
<shevy> for me I just tried and failed
<apeiros> I doubt it's a problem with gosu
<shevy> In file included from Input-TextInput.cpp:1:0:
<shevy> ../../src/Input/TextInput.cpp:4:22: fatal error: SDL2/SDL.h: No such file or directory
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<apeiros> Virtual_: and `command -v irb`?
<Virtual_> gem list doesn't have it nor does it have any of the others
<[k> ;p;
<[k> ;-;*
<Virtual_> apeiros: '/usr/bin/irb'
<jhass> Virtual_: run gem install gosu again and gist the entire output including invocation
<apeiros> odd
<shevy> Virtual_ you have SDL2?
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<shevy> I am compiling SDL2 right now
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<Virtual_> I think I may have realised the problem but I will let you know when it's finished building the gem
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<Virtual_> I do have all the dependencies gosu put on the official website, they have an Arch one which is neat I don't have to search for em
<Virtual_> Yeah problem was a minor one but a habit I picked up from Python, install gems as sudo
<Virtual_> instead of just gem install gosu
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<[k> oh
<[k> ok
<Virtual_> irb(main):001:0> require 'gosu'
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<Virtual_> => true
<Virtual_> works now
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<[k> I bring you this public service announcement to update your rubygems
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<[k> === 2.4.8 / 2015-06-08
<[k> Bug fixes:
<[k> * Tightened API endpoint checks for CVE-2015-3900
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<shevy> huh
<shevy> we have a new bot here
<shevy> a security bot
<[k> where?
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<[k> that was like ~12days ago?
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<[k> 17*
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<jhass> mh yeah, I wanted to ping anatolik about it
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<ljarvis> compact_map needs to exist
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<[k> it doesnt?
<baweaver> >> module Enumerable; def compact_map(&block) map(&block).compact end end; [nil, 1, 2].compact_map(&:itself)
<ruboto> baweaver # => [1, 2] (https://eval.in/387137)
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<[k> that looks simple enough
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<cubicool> Hey guys... I'm having a hard time figuring this out. I am developing some Ruby code I want to EVENTUALLY Gem-ify, so I'm keeping the directory struct and code laid out properly. However...
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<cubicool> I'm having trouble USING this code (locally) without going through the rigamole of 'gem build; gem install' every time I make a small change. Is there any alternative?
<miah> load your code in irb/pry.
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<cubicool> I don't follow...
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<cubicool> Is there no way to simply symlink to my module.rb/module directories in the project that USES the Gem?
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<miah> you can use require_relative, or modify the ruby load path, or write tests so that you can test your code in isolation without the external gem
<miah> s/external gem/external project
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<cubicool> Ruby load path, that sounds promising. I'll google. :)
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<dfockler> do environment variables ever clash?
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<centrx> They just overwrite right?
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<miah> there can be only one
<shevy> aha
<[k> i think they do
<shevy> miah the highlander girl
<miah> =)
<[k> since ENV is a hash
<shevy> ENV appears like a hash
<[k> it subclasses it doesnt it
<dfockler> it just seems like a weird way to have your program operate, by looking at variables set inside the os
<[k> >> ENV.ancestors
<ruboto> [k # => undefined method `ancestors' for #<Object:0x41421ff8> (NoMethodError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/387138)
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<shevy> >> ENV.is_a? Hash
<ruboto> shevy # => false (https://eval.in/387139)
<shevy> >> Hash.new.is_a? Hash
<ruboto> shevy # => true (https://eval.in/387141)
<[k> buttttt
<miah> the environment variable 'FOO' can only have one value
<miah> you can change it any time though
<shevy> I learned this from the old pickaxe [k
<[k> >> ENV.ancestor
<ruboto> [k # => undefined method `ancestor' for #<Object:0x40f29ff0> (NoMethodError) ...check link for more (https://eval.in/387142)
<[k> why doesnt this work :(
<shevy> today is [k fail day
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<miah> im thrown off by the missing ]
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<shevy> yeah
<miah> i have a minecraft pickaxe made out of pearler beads on my desk.
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<Darkwater> i have minecraft
<miah> thats cool
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<centrx> I like balloons
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<miah> i like turtles
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<[k> k
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<shevy> miah as long as you have a cat next to the pickaxe it's ok
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<andywojo> Anyone know of a good way / gem to tackle running sudo on a remote system via SSH? I've lately just been doing system calls %x[ssh #{host} "sudo -S cmd"]
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<andywojo> It stinks though for handling return codes / issues
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<andywojo> all of the gems to do SSH natively without resorting to system calls stinks
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<miah> dunno how that'd work though either =)
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<miah> net-ssh being somewhat... deprecated.
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<markalanevans> Hey folks, what do you call these : http://pastie.org/10256989
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<markalanevans> i want to understand how blocks like that are initalized
<markalanevans> is it a conditional block ?
<markalanevans> or something
<markalanevans> for ex: environment :test do …. end
<miah> just a block
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<markalanevans> so just for clarificaiton
<markalanevans> there is a function somehwere defined as environment
<miah> yes
<markalanevans> and it it there is some sort of test
<markalanevans> to see if :test
<markalanevans> or if :production
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<markalanevans> how is the block aware of the :test or :production
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<nofxx> markalanevans, def environment(args, &:block)
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<nofxx> markalanevans, args would be :development , in the case
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<markalanevans> ok.
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<markalanevans> so in the block, i just compare args == some_function_that_returns_actual_env()
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<markalanevans> and then if true it executes
<nofxx> markalanevans, more like it storing that block for somewhere else call it, with the env
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<markalanevans> ok.
<markalanevans> So i have a ruby file that just have the block statements
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<nofxx> markalanevans, or yes, its just a return unless ENV == args
<markalanevans> Does that meant that there is some global function environment
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<nofxx> markalanevans, env vars usually
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<nofxx> FOO=bar ./program inside program: ENV['FOO']
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<markalanevans> ok
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<markalanevans> thanks nofxx & miah
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<apeiros> I really wish ruby/gems had a canonical way to handle optional dependencies.
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<jhass> like "recommends" in distro package managers?
<Senjai> apeiros: If they're optional, they aren't dependencies. But yes, I agree, but thats their argument and it also makes sense
<Senjai> I would like a Gemfile.local or something
<Senjai> to also load the gems for that, that wouldn't be committed and things
<apeiros> Senjai: I'd disagree
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<apeiros> they are a dependency under a given condition
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<apeiros> "if you want to use feature X, Y is a dependency"
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<apeiros> but please, tell me a better term
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<Senjai> Feature X should therefore be its own gem then.
<apeiros> eager to learn :)
<Senjai> Again, another argument they have made
<Senjai> :P
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<jhass> Senjai: well, bundler has 1.10 has optional groups now, so you could spam your gemfile with developer tools and not install them by accident
<Aria> Conditional dependency makes sense. But I think we'd do well to avoid them.
<apeiros> Senjai: seriously not :-)
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<piet_> how bad is performance when using method_missing
<Aria> piet_: performance of what?
<centrx> This bad <----->
<Senjai> jhass: lol nice. But I still would want a Gemfile.local
<apeiros> Senjai: example: email address validation, optionally resolving the domain
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<apeiros> Senjai: you don't seriously tell me you'd split the latter part into its own gem? that makes about zero sense to me…
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<apeiros> (the dependency is simpleidn btw - because resolve can't handle IDNs)
<jhass> Senjai: also install_if so you could do install_if: -> { `whoami` == "Senjai" } xD
<Senjai> I'm not saying that. Its just an argument I've seen made
<Senjai> install_if is terrible
<jhass> but maybe don#t
<apeiros> and I think the argument is flawed :)
<Senjai> apeiros: Right, but you have to be able to convince THEM of that :)
<apeiros> there *may* be cases where that's a way to work around it
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<apeiros> Senjai: atm, YOU are THEM :-p
<apeiros> as you're arguing on THEIR behalf :D
<Senjai> Oh, I see, but I cant argue a point I already disagree with
<Senjai> I'm simply saying that this conversation has gone on forever in github issues
<apeiros> piet_: benchmark it
<Senjai> and this is the stuff they come up with
<piet_> just wondering how heavily i should rely on alias_method_missing type behavior in a rails app
<Senjai> You could theoretically wrap a bunch of crap in if defined? blocks, too, but thats lamesauce
<apeiros> well, my current way to deal with it: add the dependency in the gemspec. document in the readme that it's only needed for given feature. use a custom require with a descriptive info in case of failure.
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<Senjai> apeiros: I would just go the if defined? route. And tell people if x gem is included, behavior will differ
<Senjai> or make it a configuration option
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<Senjai> allowing them to plug in a class
<Senjai> Similiarly with how you can switch rails' default json parser to Oj
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<diegoviola> HAL: This mission is too important for me to allow you to jeopardize it.
<Senjai> aspiers: Honestly, everything at this moment can be solved with clean composition
<Senjai> For email address validation, you could have a base adapter, and a GemSpecializedAdapter, and have them set to use the GemSpecializedAdapter if they want it.
<Senjai> as a configuration option
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<Senjai> That way it can be declared as a development dependency, and is optional to the user
<Senjai> The only downside of it being that its not obviously optional from the gemspec
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<apeiros> Senjai: I don't like that approach.
<apeiros> it makes it harder for the user.
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<apeiros> I see, you suggested two approaches. but I also see that I'd say the same about the second approach :D
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<Senjai> It adds a configuration step, which I agree adds oweness to the user, but I wouldnt say it'd make it harder
<Senjai> if a user cant figure out how to MyGem.configure {|c| c.email_parser = ThingClass }
<Senjai> they have larger issues
<Senjai> and if its well documented, and in the readme, its literally just a copy and paste
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<Senjai> and that's -only- if you dont want the change in behavior automatic
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<Senjai> if you want it automatic, you could use if defined? craziness to determine what adapter to use
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<Senjai> apeiros: Just to reiterate, I agree with you that optional deps would be cool. I'm more talking about how it could be solved with composition now. So I'm not disagreeing with you.. just being clear :)
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<apeiros> Senjai: oh, yes, I got that
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<apeiros> and thanks for your suggestions
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<apeiros> sorry, I scold others for not being thankful when they get support which they don't/can't use. so I should do better myself :D
<apeiros> s/being/expressing/
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<Senjai> Oh all good, never thought that way. Just wanted to make sure that errone knew what I was talkin bout
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<Senjai> Ugh
<Senjai> I have a terrible question
<Senjai> I want to expect that any number of instances will receive 2 calls of a method total
<Senjai> across all instances
<Senjai> It is TERRIBLE, I understand
<apeiros> Senjai: in a test? mocking?
<Senjai> apeiros: Yes
<Senjai> specifically, active record
<Senjai> in a non rails project
<apeiros> I guess the test double framework would matter as information ;-)
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* apeiros won't be able to help, though
<Senjai> rspec
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<apeiros> huh? what's AR.delay_touching?
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<Senjai> The worst thing ever, that you should never use
<Senjai> It's a monkey patch that consolidates touches
<Senjai> so if a record gets touched several times, it only happens once instead
* apeiros blinks
<Senjai> when it hits the db
<Senjai> Because rails developers like to do things on after_touch that are expensive as hell apparently.
<Senjai> (we didn't write this codebase)
<apeiros> what constitutes as a touch? update queries? deletes? other things?
<Senjai> my_record.touch.
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<Senjai> which simply updates the updated_at
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<Senjai> for busting caches
<Senjai> But you can define after_touch callbacks, and thats where the "we cant afford to touch things multiple times" thing comes in
<apeiros> oy
<apeiros> I see
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<powersurge> how can I convert 'true' to a boolean?
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<Aria> parse it as json?
<Aria> or yaml?
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<powersurge> surely there's a simpler way to just get it from a string?
<apeiros> powersurge: 'true' == 'true'
<apeiros> not kidding
<powersurge> I expected 'true'.to_bool to be there and was surprised when it wasn't
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<powersurge> how very strange
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<havenwood> powersurge: There' s no Bool class.
<apeiros> powersurge: a "to_bool" method for just two possible string values? that sounds unreasonable.
<apeiros> powersurge: additionally, expectations might very well differ.
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<apeiros> should "0" be false? should "no" be false? should "FALSE" be false? etc.
<c-c> yeag
<powersurge> yea, I agree that it's ambiguous to assume
<apeiros> and really, `val == "true"` is simple enough.
<powersurge> but I expected there to be something with documentation to explain away any ambiguity
<c-c> that has made javascripts 'clever' boolean equality mess a lot of things up
<havenwood> powersurge: You can use apeiros' literal_parser gem: https://github.com/apeiros/literal_parser#readme
<apeiros> havenwood: hah!
<powersurge> heh
<apeiros> great use
<havenwood> LiteralParser.parse 'true' #=> true
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<havenwood> >> eval 'true'
<ruboto> havenwood # => true (https://eval.in/387189)
<Senjai> sadness that that needs to exist though
<Senjai> :P
<Senjai> Things should just pass in proper things in a perfect world
<apeiros> Senjai: tbh, I don't even remember why I wrote that in the first place :(
<Senjai> apeiros: That project contains css?
<Senjai> wat
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<powersurge> in a perfect world, a computer would just understand what I want to happen ahead of time and just do it :>
<apeiros> Senjai: css?
<apeiros> in the docs probably…
<Senjai> Ah
<Senjai> Yeah, the project is like 42% css
<c-c> >> a_value = false; another_value = true; [TRUE == a_value, another_value == TRUE]
<ruboto> c-c # => [false, true] (https://eval.in/387191)
<c-c> >> 'true' == TRUE
<ruboto> c-c # => false (https://eval.in/387192)
<apeiros> funny how TRUE is a *typical" true value, while FALSE is false itself
<c-c> yay!
<c-c> >> 1 == TRUE
<ruboto> c-c # => false (https://eval.in/387193)
<c-c> another yay!
<c-c> >> true == TRUE
<ruboto> c-c # => true (https://eval.in/387194)
<c-c> umm...
<apeiros> >> TRUE
<ruboto> apeiros # => true (https://eval.in/387195)
<apeiros> TRUE is true
<Senjai> apeiros: Your sorting gem looks legit
<apeiros> ?experiment c-c
<ruboto> c-c, Please use your local irb or pry (see ?pry) to experiment, ruboto's eval functionality is for demonstration purposes only.
<c-c> B)
<apeiros> Senjai: ooooh, don't remind me. I still have natural sort in a branch I want to release for *ages*
<Senjai> just doet
<Senjai> I would prefer returning a specialized object instead of an array though :P
<apeiros> can't. there was something I had/wanted to resort first. and I forgot what.
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<apeiros> Senjai: where?
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<hoelzro> I /win3
<hoelzro> ww =(
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<apeiros> s/resort/sort out/
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<apeiros> Senjai: if you mean in the sort_by block - that's just how you commonly sort by multiple values with sort_by.
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<apeiros> Senjai: but I'm interested in ways to improve the usability and/or readability :)
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<apeiros> hm, you might actually have given me an idea. not sure I can turn it into something I like, though.
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<apeiros> Senjai: something like this? https://gist.github.com/apeiros/148ad8d6c53a57daa6f4
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<hanmac> apeiros: ;P that looks funky ;P
<dfockler> could you do Sorting.asc instead
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<apeiros> dfockler: I don't follow
<dfockler> Sorting.asc person.first_name
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<apeiros> dfockler: you can do that already
<Senjai> apeiros: yeah
<dfockler> would there be another sorting method than Sorting.comparable
<Senjai> I would prefer to save my sorting strategies somewhere
<apeiros> asc/desc exist already to be used with Enumerable#sort_by
<dfockler> ah ok cool
<apeiros> Sorting.comparable would just be a way to generate a custom comparable object instead of using a plain array
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<dfockler> so you have to use an array because you can't chain the methods together?
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<dfockler> can you yield a new Sorting class that contains the state of your list as you sort it with each call
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<apeiros> dfockler: hm? you use an array because that's how you commonly sort by multiple values with sort_by
<dfockler> ah ok
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<apeiros> e.g., `people.sort_by { |person| [person.first_name, person.last_name, person.age] }` works without sorting gem too
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<hal_9000> hmm. it would be *possible* to write an “invert” function for a string, to sort oppositely :)
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<apeiros> what sorting gem adds is asc(value)/desc(value) to sort the individual values ascending/descending
<apeiros> and it allows you to deal with nil values
<hal_9000> just like sorting by -x for numeric
<apeiros> hal_9000: that's precisely what desc does
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<apeiros> just in a generic way
<apeiros> not just for strings
<hal_9000> it doesn’t just reverse the comparison?
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<hal_9000> that would be the way i would “really” do it
<apeiros> I thought that's what you mean
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<apeiros> it creates an invertedly sorting value by having its <=> inverted
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<hal_9000> oh - i meant you could create a function for strings analogous to - for numbers — but in real life, that would be umb
<hal_9000> *dumb
<apeiros> not sure that'd be possible
<apeiros> but even if - it'd be more expensive anyway
<apeiros> both memory and cpu
<hal_9000> yes, mostly just kidding
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<hal_9000> i think i recognize your nick, but “get info” does not work for me in colloquy now
<Senjai> apeiros: I believe that kind of construct would benefit from returning an object instead of an unnamed data structure thats all :P
<Obfuscate> hal_9000, apeiros: If you have a sequence in ascending order, then you already have it sorted in descending order as well: you merely need to iterate over the sequence from right to left rather than left to right.
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<hal_9000> Obfuscate: true enough, but that does not help in formulating a block for sorting, right?
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<catcher> How can I assign the results of a block to a var?
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<hal_9000> catcher: var = meth { block }
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<hal_9000> assuming meth returns tha block value
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<hal_9000> or var = block.call or var - yield
<Obfuscate> hal_9000: True multi-indexed containers can have the same property, since each index is a constraint on the retrieval order.
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<catcher> hal_9000, does meth already exist in your example?
<hal_9000> catcher: well, i was assuming that was some method name - but it may not apply in your situation
<Obfuscate> hal_9000: The problem is that sorting in most languages (rather than actual databases) is adhoc.
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<catcher> in pseudocode, I'm trying to do this: foo = { ...do some things, return a string... }
<catcher> like an anonymous function
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<hal_9000> catcher: you could always do: foo = proc { blah }.call
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<apeiros> Obfuscate: try to apply that with multiple values.
<spygame> hey guys, i have some conditions stored in the database like field_name operator value and i wanna build if else out of this. how is this possible using ruby
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<Senjai> ?code spygame
<ruboto> spygame, We can't help you without your code, please post it to https://gist.github.com
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<catcher> hal_9000, that works, thanks. Is that a relatively normal way to do it?
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<blahwoop> is there a better way to write this find_min method? min = array[0]; array.each { |num| min = num if num < min };min
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<havenwood> blahwoop: array.min
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<blahwoop> trying to write my own for practice
<jhass> array.sort.first
<jhass> j/k
<hal_9000> catcher: offhand i can’t think of a more natural way
<Obfuscate> apeiros: It works for composite keys with an arbitrary number of indexes. See boolean query optimization in real databases.
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<blahwoop> jhass: lol
<jhass> but no, you pretty much found the way to do it
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<blahwoop> ok thanks
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<blahwoop> i was wondering if it was possible to get it into one line
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<Senjai> spygame: ruboto is a bot
<spygame> lol
<scpike> blahwoop: you could use inject, but don't use this in the real world: array.inject() { |min, x| (min && min < x) ? min : x }
<bougyman> ◀▬▬ is not a bot
<Senjai> spygame: You can do that, you just shouldn't
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<Senjai> Why do you have to do that
<Senjai> Specifying an operator is... no
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<Senjai> You can maybe store a class name, and have a instance of that class be responsible for calculation
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<Senjai> but even then.. theres usually a better way to do whatever it is you're trying to do
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<blahwoop> scpike: o boy. ur right lol
<spygame> Senjai: i don't think i get it completely. so you are saying have everything store in a separate class but again how do i do the calculation ?
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<Senjai> spygame: I dont have enough context about the problem you're trying to solve
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<jhass> mmh, do we have ?context already
<jhass> ?context
<ruboto> Please add more context to your question, what are you doing, why are you doing it, which libraries are involved. Post some code to gist if it clarifies your question.
<jhass> \o/
<scpike> blahwoop: actually without a first arg to `inject` it passest in the first element of the collection, so you can just do `.inject { |min, x| min < x ? min : x }`
<scpike> neat
<apeiros> Obfuscate: it does not work when you have different orientations
<spygame> Senjai: so i have a form where you can build certain conditions. like selecting the field_name and operator and what should be the desired value. so its a bunch of conditions like if this and that or that then do this
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<jhass> and what problem does that form solve?
<Senjai> ^
<spygame> and i'm storing each condition as a row in the db
<Senjai> spygame: We're just going to ask "Why?" until you tell us what the actual problem is :P
<spygame> it acts like a filter for user submitted values
<Senjai> Get us to a point where we cant ask why anymore
<jhass> are you implementing a DSL by treating data as logic?
<Senjai> spygame: Why?
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<sweeper> so like, lisp?
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<jhass> heh
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<diegoviola> I like writing Ruby code
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<jhass> spygame: how many operators are there, how are the actions defined and is there a defined set of those
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<Senjai> jhass: The actual question should be "Why do you have to dynamically filter user input"
<jhass> I bet on "because management"
<scpike> is there a piece of syntax sugar like %w(cat dog) but for integers? I don't think there is, but kind of hard to be sure via google.
<jhass> nope
<spygame> jhass: https://gist.github.com/mfa213/f1b7d260c23b0fa23671 i have updated the gist
<Senjai> scpike: its not hard to [1, 2, 3]
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<slash_nick> apeiros: https://www.omniref.com/ruby/2.2.0/symbols/Proc/yield?#annotation=4087638&line=711
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<Senjai> scpike: %w is just a developer conveniance
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<spygame> jhass: 3 operators == && ||
<Senjai> can't make it much simpler for that with integers
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<scpike> Senjai: I know, but it's 3 extra characters!
<spygame> actions are predefined as well
<scpike> they gave us %i(a b c)
<Senjai> scpike: And adds 3x as much complexit ;)
<baweaver> Senjai: (1..3) ?
<apeiros> slash_nick: seems to be missing the "pass block on" case.
<Senjai> spygame: So this is an action rule system?
<apeiros> slash_nick: but yeah, supports what I said about the case of not passing the block on. use yield in that case.
<scpike> Senjai: yea I don't really think it should exist, but if it did I wanted to make sure I was using it
<Senjai> Perform actions if all the rules match?
<Senjai> scpike: I usually discourage %w unless its like a longgg list of strings
<Senjai> and even then
<Senjai> %i is the only one I regularly use
<diegoviola> where does return come from in ruby?
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<Senjai> what, return is a thing in almost every language
<diegoviola> I know
<diegoviola> but every object in ruby belongs to a class
<Senjai> diegoviola: ^
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<jhass> spygame: I still don't get it, you only did the "add code" part of ?context. I'd suggest you answer Senjai's questions
<apeiros> diegoviola: return is not an object
* slash_nick thinks diegoviola found something in ruby that's not an object: `return`
<diegoviola> is return a keyword or an object?
<_blizzy_> ok well this is getting stupid. please excuse the messy code. can anyone help me figure out why my @pkmn_team array keeps resetting? https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/4dae9559d0ffebeb2b24
<diegoviola> oh
<diegoviola> it's like def then?
<apeiros> diegoviola: despite what people say, not everything is an object.
<apeiros> it's a keyword, yes. like def. yes.
<diegoviola> ok thanks
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<diegoviola> people should stop saying that everything is an object
<Senjai> E.g, you do not return.new(myreturnvalue)
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<Senjai> diegoviola: Every "thing" is an object
<Senjai> return is not a "thing"
<Senjai> you cannot pass it around
<slash_nick> Senjai: so... is a keyword an object?
<Senjai> def is not a thing
<scpike> Senjai: %r can be nice in small doses
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<Senjai> a keyword in the form of a symbol :keyword is
<Senjai> If that's what you emant
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<diegoviola> thanks
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<jhass> spygame: I still don't get it, you only did the "add code" part of ?context. I'd suggest you answer Senjai's questions (in case you didn't get it)
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<apeiros> symbols aren't keywords, though
<Senjai> apeiros: I know, but I think he was trying to get me on calling a symbol a keyword.
<Senjai> because of kwargs
<Senjai> just defending myself :P
<apeiros> Senjai: think of the children! you might confuse them!
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<slash_nick> Senjai: I'm mostly being silly... was having fun with one of these moments: http://i.computer-bild.de/imgs/4/3/7/8/4/2/9/Conspiracy-Keanu-745x559-5176787edc95968f.jpg
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<spygame> jhass: i'm sorry, i was searching in log to find Senjai's question :) . So i'm not sure how to explain this. Its a rules based system where you define certain rules which basically is if/else condition(s) and if the statement is true you perform a certain action. why am i doing this? i guess i'm replicating a system and that's the business requirement if that's serves as an explanation
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<_blizzy_> please excuse the messy code. can anyone help me figure out why @team keeps resetting to []? https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/d6b057df27ab03837f67
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<jhass> Senjai: ^ see I win, because management
<_blizzy_> I've been working on this for about 2 hours, can't find the bug. ._.
<slash_nick> spygame: be wild and use elasticsearch percolators to solve the problem
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: It's odd you initialize @team as `Array.new` then a few lines later replace that with `false`.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Use `[]` and `{}` instead of `Array.new` and `Hash.new`.
<_blizzy_> havenwood, I love you so much right now.
<_blizzy_> thank you.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: you're welcome
<_blizzy_> and I thought Hash.new was faster?
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Nope, use the literal.
<_blizzy_> havenwood, ok then.
<jhass> spygame: anyway, it seems like you have a defined set of possible statements, use a case when and access fields with the hash brackets
<slash_nick> _blizzy_: pkmn only gets populated conditionally... are all those conditions met?
<slash_nick> pkmn_team*
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<_blizzy_> slash_nick, yes.
<_blizzy_> but I'll double check them.
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: Here's a benchmark-ips with Ruby 2.2: https://gist.github.com/havenwood/8f4e4ee03aa79549caf0
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, thxs.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: There the literal is a bit more than 6x as fast.
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<_blizzy_> ok then. I'll use literal.
<Ontolog> Gemfile question. Suppose I have a couple of gems I personally want to use for development and debugging (e.g., "awesome_print"), but I don't want to make changes to the Gemfile for everyone else, is there a way to do that?
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<jhass> Ontolog: no sane one
<Senjai> jhass: Not really
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<Senjai> jhass: I guessed the system type
<Senjai> spygame: How often do the rules need to change?
<Senjai> jhass: <3
<jhass> Ontolog: note there are optional groups with bundler 1.10
<Senjai> jhass: besides, you cheated, everything eventually boils down to because management
<jhass> Senjai: I saw no rules defined yet, so...
<spygame> Senjai: once defined i doubt they will change for that particular landing point
<Senjai> spygame: Okay, there is a better way of doing this.
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<_blizzy_> also, havenwood, seems like that wasn't it
<diegoviola> why can't I return() from the ruby main scope?
<_blizzy_> I put a print statement to find out if all the conditions were being met, and they are
<diegoviola> I get some stupid error
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<_blizzy_> however, the array still resets for some reason.
<diegoviola> LocalJumpError
<diegoviola> sigh
<shevy> DanceCrazyError
<apeiros> diegoviola: you can't think of a reason why you can't?
<spygame> Senjai: which is ?
<Senjai> spygame: If you have things that very rarely change, even arithmetic operations, you could do something like: https://gist.github.com/Senjai/92ceb0abd26281310ff3
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<diegoviola> apeiros: I don't get your question
<Senjai> spygame: Speccifically, give an action, and a ruleset, and if it passes the ruleset, do the action
<shevy> apeiros also does not know the answer
<Senjai> this is basic fraud checking, but it can apply to your case too
<diegoviola> apeiros: because it's in main()?
<_blizzy_> havenwood, pkmn_team is the one with the items
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<apeiros> diegoviola: you notice you can't return from main. and you can't figure out why?
<Senjai> spygame: I would also store the rules in json somewhere too
<_blizzy_> so wouldn't that also make @team have the items
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<apeiros> diegoviola: that's just restating a fact.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Each time the #run method is called, `pkmn_team` is cleared here: https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/d6b057df27ab03837f67#file-a-rb-L55
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<diegoviola> apeiros: yeah sorry I wasn't thinking about what I was asking
<_blizzy_> havenwood, oh ok.
<apeiros> diegoviola: so what should happen when you return from main?
<_blizzy_> let's try this then.
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<Senjai> spygame: This approach, unaltered, would allow admins to check box a list of rulesets that they want for that action, but oyou would define the rulset in code.
<shevy> exit!
<Senjai> You could also have each ruleset take an argument
<diegoviola> apeiros: I don't know, you tell me
<Senjai> and only store those arguments in a serialized column on the database
<shevy> exit!
<Senjai> TLDR, thousands of ways to solve your problem :P
<apeiros> shevy: you need help exiting the channel? :-p
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<shevy> I think a return would exit from main
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<apeiros> Senjai: lol
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<shevy> lol
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<shevy> what an ugly girl
<shevy> I mean bird! bird!!!
<shevy> does such a bird exist for real?
<apeiros> shevy: that'd be a somewhat decent action. what do you do when somebody does `return Foo.new("hello")`?
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<shevy> I discard it!
<shevy> apeiros by the way, is your programming language still called halsbe?
<apeiros> shevy: it will forever be called that way :)
<shevy> ah ok
<_blizzy_> havenwood, thanks, but it's still resetting. let me paste my new code. :/
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<_blizzy_> https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/15da6fdfaa67df87c0ce sorry that I keep asking for help, havenwood
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: This code is being run multiple times but not appending to @team?
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, the code is being ran, and it's appending to @team, it just keeps resetting somewhere.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: When you initialize a new Battle?
<_blizzy_> havenwood, no, I only initialize a new battle once
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<_blizzy_> I then use that same battle to run the run method
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Show the code you run it wiht?
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: It seems the other place you modify the contents of @team is here: https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/15da6fdfaa67df87c0ce#file-a-rb-L270
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, yeah, but that is never reached for a while
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: Don't create global variables.
<_blizzy_> havenwood, oh, ok.
<_blizzy_> c:
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Looks like the first few globals you use should be constants.
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: Do you have any unit tests?
<_blizzy_> havenwood, not atm.
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: Just glancing at the #run method I don't follow what it's doing. It's doing a lot.
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, it's connecting to a websocket, so I pass the message to the method. based on the data in the message, it does something different.
<_blizzy_> thus the switch case /case when.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Try to make methods shorter than hundreds of lines. ;)
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, ok. :)
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: You might try putting a few `p "this place: #{@team}"`s in there in different places to sanity check that it's doing what you think it's doing. Once you hone in, maybe a`require 'pry'` and a `binding.pry` or two to explore.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Breaking methods down into smaller units that you test might help you gain confidence in your code.
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, thanks for the advice.
<_blizzy_> I just wish I could find this bug.
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<postmodern> is there any documentation on using database-backed sessions with warden?
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<_blizzy_> idk if I should upgrade to ruby 2.2 or stick with ruby 2.1.0
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<sanjivupadhyaya> hello
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<sanjivupadhyaya> hello
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<_blizzy_> hello, sanjivupadhyaya
<sanjivupadhyaya> i am just testing.. sorry for that ;)
<slash_nick> hello, hello, sanjivupadhyaya :)
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<sanjivupadhyaya> hello , hello
<sanjivupadhyaya> :)
<sanjivupadhyaya> can you guys tell me why we specify rails version while creating a new app
<sanjivupadhyaya> eg : rails __versionNumber__ new exampleApp ?
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<Senjai> __noob__: Dont neeed __ in your name yo
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<__noob__> haha
<__noob__> i like to keep my name a secret since I am asking silly questions ;)
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<__noob__> I will flash my name after i become a CEO of some fancy startup ;)
<slash_nick> __noob__: if you register a nickname, you can join us in #rubyonrails to get some help with that... And no one here will fault you for asking silly questions.
<__noob__> okay slash.. i will try that now
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* Senjai googles sanjivupadhyaya
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<__noob__> well I googled it but could not find it..
<Senjai> __noob__: I'm bugging you, I was more pointing to the fact typing _ to adress you is annoying
<Senjai> :P
<Senjai> address*
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<__noob__> now this shoudl be fine
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<noob> sould be fine now ;)
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<grex25> Hi, I am trying to install a gem (gem install jekyll), but theres only a blinking cursor and no output, but I got installed everything
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<grex25> Am I doing something wrong?
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<Senjai> grex25: I usually strace the task there, for those scenarios
<Senjai> and see what system call its getting held up on
<Senjai> grex25: strace gem install jekyll, if it looks like anything related to http, its probably some sort of timeout
<Senjai> or not using https
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<drbrain> or you could use the verbose flag
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<drbrain> gem install jekyll -V
<Senjai> Psht, I didn't know about the verbose flag
<Senjai> drbrain: You need to strace harder sir
<Senjai> :P
<Senjai> I debug ruby with gdb *sunglasses*
<_blizzy_> can anyone help me figure out why @team is resetting the 'when' ends on line 91? https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/837716920ff8a7a68da5
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<drbrain> strace isn't going to tell you if you're seeing normal behavior or not if your only experience is broken behavior
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<_blizzy_> I'm using byebug, and after it hits line 91, it resets.
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<Senjai> drbrain: That's fair, but when looking for hangs, which can often be caused by IO, it's still helpful, just may not be the most helpful :P
<Senjai> _blizzy_: Step 1, lock byebug down to an earlier version
<Senjai> recent versions cause issues
<Senjai> Step 2, that is the most complex code I've ever seend
<Senjai> seen*
<Senjai> not really, but I'm making a point
<_blizzy_> Senjai, I mean @team, the array resets
<_blizzy_> not byebug itself
<Senjai> Do you modify it in byebug?
<_blizzy_> no
<Senjai> Idk
<Senjai> byebug is terrible
<_blizzy_> after I step past line 91, the array resets back to nil
<Senjai> I dont use it
<slash_nick> _blizzy_: are you absolutely sure you're not entering the 'else' block? https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/837716920ff8a7a68da5#file-a-rb-L79-L83
<Senjai> I use pry
<_blizzy_> slash_nick, I'm sure because I can put in a print statement, and it prints
<_blizzy_> plus at line 91 with byebug, the array has the correct values
<slash_nick> oh.
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<Senjai> _blizzy_: Get rid of byebug, try pry, see if same problem.
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<_blizzy_> Senjai, I just tried pry. how do I 'step forward' in pry?
<Senjai> _blizzy_: You dont.
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<Senjai> _blizzy_: If you have to use byebug, only earlier versions are okay. You shouldnt have to do step driven development
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<Senjai> Instead you could clean up your code so you dont have to use step to figure out how it works
<_blizzy_> I tried pry before byebug, and I got the same values.
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<slash_nick> _blizzy_: what... your case statement ends on line 87... what's this "when" stuff? https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/837716920ff8a7a68da5#file-a-rb-L93-L95
<Senjai> slash_nick: case m[1]
<Senjai> whatever m[1] is
<_blizzy_> it's an AI for a Pokemon simulator.
<Senjai> _blizzy_: I would suggest splitting up so as to eliminate all switch statements. and long if chains
<slash_nick> Senjai: does it not end on line 87?
<Senjai> slash_nick: ... no
<slash_nick> case;when;end;when; is what i'm reading
<Senjai> It ends the if
<Senjai> i believe
<slash_nick> ah, my bad i guess...
<slash_nick> i think the gist pane was doing some scrolling on me
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<_blizzy_> well, IDK what the heck the bug is.
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<_blizzy_> :>
<Senjai> _blizzy_: Nobody could ever tell you. I would not be suprised if that code can break in any way
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<_blizzy_> Senjai, it's an AI, so it's not going to be the 'cleanest' code
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<Senjai> _blizzy_: Uhm, ai's can have clean code
<_blizzy_> plus it's not finished in the first place :/
<Senjai> _blizzy_: Right, but you're already in pain because of poor coding practices
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<_blizzy_> how is this poor?
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<_blizzy_> a switch case is the best way to handle this imo.
<dfockler> try rich coding instead
<Senjai> How is it not?
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<void> hello *
<_blizzy_> you're not giving any reasons why it is?
<Senjai> Point out anything in specific and I'll tell you how
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<_blizzy_> you're the one who called me out in the first place.
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<Senjai> I'm not going to write a 2000 word essay, pick out anything you think is a good decision
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<_blizzy_> ok, then I'll keep writing my code. c:
<Senjai> lol, k
<_blizzy_> k.
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<slash_nick> _blizzy_: he's not picking on you... just encouraging you to step it up a little
<Senjai> ^
<Senjai> We've all been new.
<Senjai> It's about caring about your craft.
<_blizzy_> slash_nick, I know it's not the best code atm. I'm trying to get it to 'work', then I'll refactor
<slash_nick> we're all glad you're here.. glad you're asking questions... glad to help.
<slash_nick> 
<Senjai> _blizzy_: This is already complex to the point where making it work is going to be incredibly harder than refactoring it
<_blizzy_> sorry if I was sounding dickish, Senjai
<_blizzy_> Senjai, but how is complex bad?
<Senjai> Like, if you dont care about getting better, there is nothing we can do.
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<Senjai> _blizzy_: The job description of any developer is essentially: "Manage complexity"
<Senjai> Also, occams razor
<_blizzy_> I'm reading a websocket, and there are multiple messages.
<_blizzy_> so I'd rather have a switch case than 20 elsif statements.
<Senjai> Right, so there should be a class that handles the websocket.
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<_blizzy_> there is
<Senjai> That class should then determine what part of the application should handle that request/push
<_blizzy_> it's just not in the file.
<Senjai> like a controller
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<_blizzy_> it's in another file.
<Senjai> Each of those classes should only handle its behavior, formulate a response, and return it to the class responsible for responding
<Senjai> each of these cases, should be a seperate class.
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<_blizzy_> oh, ok.
<_blizzy_> I still don't understand how complex == bad, but ok.
<Senjai> You can take a routing approach, defining "Message handlers" for each code you get from the socket
<_blizzy_> isn't that what I'm doing?
<Senjai> _blizzy_: If you had no knowledge of this code, and were asked to add a feature, you couldn't
<_blizzy_> Senjai, I probably could. :/
<Senjai> I cannot read any piece of this code, without understanding the entire codebase
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<Senjai> m[3].include? 'fnt' <<
<Senjai> m means nothing to me
<Senjai> How am I supposed to know what 3 stands for
<Senjai> or what'
<_blizzy_> I could probably go in a repo
<Senjai> or what's supposed to be at that index
<_blizzy_> grab a random line
<Senjai> 'fnt' also means nothing to me
<_blizzy_> and I wouldn't know what it means.
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<Senjai> if fnt_list.include? CERTAIN_FNT_TYPE
<Senjai> bam
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<Senjai> i just dont know what fnt stand for
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<Senjai> I could make it more readable if I did
<_blizzy_> oh.
<Senjai> opponent_immunities = Array.new and resistances, etc
<Senjai> Opponent = Struct.new(:resistances, :weaknesses, :immunities)
<Senjai> There should be the concept of an "Opponent" because it is a "thing"
<Senjai> as I said, I can go on forever
<_blizzy_> ok.
<Senjai> but I suggest you get a good book on programming
<_blizzy_> I know how to program.
<_blizzy_> I'm just trying to get it to 'work' atm. I'll refactor later.
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<Senjai> You don't, you have to admit that. This is brute force programming. It's not something someone who understand how to solve programs with code would even try
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<Senjai> https://pragprog.com/book/ruby4/programming-ruby-1-9-2-0 Is what I'd recommend as a start
<Senjai> Also the refacotoring book by martin fowler
<_blizzy_> how can you say I don't know how to program
<_blizzy_> when I obviously do.
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<slash_nick> _blizzy_: you know a programming language
<_blizzy_> slash_nick, I know that. I also know how to 'program'. I know the difference
<Senjai> _blizzy_: Just because you can copy paste code, and it does something, is not knowing "how to use a computer to solve problems effectively"
<_blizzy_> Senjai, I'm not c/p code.
<Senjai> It's a saying
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<_blizzy_> atm, I want to code to work, then, like I said earlier, I will refactor.
<_blizzy_> since everything has a rough draft.
<Senjai> Sure thing, go for it. I'm going to just drop this as I can't convince you of any of this.
<_blizzy_> this is not even 'beta'
<_blizzy_> ok.
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<slash_nick> _blizzy_: how about this... I'll paste your class into my console... do you have any code to reproduce the problem? something like `b = Battle.new(plz_give_me_this, plz_give_me_this); b.run; b.team == []`
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<umgrosscol> _blizzy_: You'd have to break that code up in to more manageable pieces for people to easily reason about it.
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<umgrosscol> _blizzy_: does @team end up being nil or an empty array?
<_blizzy_> umgrosscol, nil
<_blizzy_> slash_nick, um, give me a few minutes. I think I found something.
<umgrosscol> puts @team returns a value though?
<umgrosscol> Err... displays a value.
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<slash_nick> _blizzy_: I will say that I got something strange when I pasted your class definition into my console...class definitions normally return nil. Yours returned :effectiveness .... there is something very wrong in there :) but as everyone is telling you, you'll need to refactor to move forward
<_blizzy_> using byebug, after it reaches a certain line, it becomes nil
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<umgrosscol> _blizzy_: I see. Which line does it become nil? you might have gotten out of scope.
<_blizzy_> slash_nick, ok, thank you. sorry if I was acting defensive or 'dickish' to anyone. sorry also, Senjai c:
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<_blizzy_> after line 91
<umgrosscol> although I don't see how as this is all supposed to be one monolithic class.
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<_blizzy_> it's a Pokemon AI. It's connecting using a web socket, so I have to parse each line the web socket sends.
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<_blizzy_> then I use a switch case based on the line the web socket sends.
<Senjai> umgrosscol: We went through all of that already. Depending on when you joined the channel
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<umgrosscol> Senjai: I see.
<umgrosscol> Yeah... too much complexity in one place for me to easily reason about.
<_blizzy_> well, ok, I'll start to refactor.
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<umgrosscol> Variables like t, p1, m, data[] reminds me of looking at C.
<umgrosscol> I thought one of the implicit language rules of ruby was cute naming of things.
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<umgrosscol> _blizzy_: You might want to write a few simple tests where you're passing in some recorded websocket response. That way you can edit your logic and make sure it's returning the expected results for the input.
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<_blizzy_> umgrosscol, ok. I still don't understand how this is mind blowingly complex, but ok. ._.
<_blizzy_> I'll add comments
<umgrosscol> _blizzy_: Not mind blowingly complex. You have a lot of nesting and large blocks of code. That generally makes it difficult to reason about at a glance, and more difficult to test generally.
<_blizzy_> umgrosscol, oh.
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<umgrosscol> _blizzy_: Some people don't have any problem with that style. I just find it easier to deal with things that are chunked smaller.
<_blizzy_> umgrosscol, oh ok. :)
<Senjai> umgrosscol: You're a much nicer person than I am <3
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<Senjai> Maybe I'm just bitter
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<_blizzy_> sorry again, Senjai. I was just defensive.
<Senjai> _blizzy_: Yeah, my point is that you shouldn't be. This whole industry is all about other people telling you your code sucks. And telling other people the same.
<Senjai> Criticism makes everything better.
<_blizzy_> Senjai, oh.
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<Senjai> and learning from other peoples mistakes
<Senjai> I often think my code last month is terrible
<_blizzy_> atm I'm splitting up my code
<_blizzy_> into different files
<_blizzy_> like a helper file where some of my methods will be at
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<Senjai> _blizzy_: I would start by extracting into classes in the same file so its easier, and then you can move them elsewhere if you want
<_blizzy_> Senjai, ok. :)
<Senjai> _blizzy_: A good thing to ask yourself when refactoring: Does this method only do one thing? If not, should it be refactored so it only does one thing?
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Have you played around with Minitest yet? It ships with Ruby.
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<Senjai> Same with classes, each class should be responsible for a certain set of data
<_blizzy_> havenwood, I was going to try rspec
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<Senjai> _blizzy_: That, and adding meaningful names to your methods and variables
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<Senjai> You can never have too many methods, if it adds legibility and follows SRP
<Senjai> well you can, but your not likely to
<Senjai> And either rspec or minitest is fine.
<havenwood> _blizzy_: RSpec is popular indeed. Minitest is simpler and ships with Ruby.
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, ok then.
<_blizzy_> thxs.
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: Here's a comment on one of your Gists. Try pasting this after loading your code in irb/pry: https://gist.github.com/NotBlizzard/d6b057df27ab03837f67
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: You can get a long way with just `assert` and `refute`.
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<Senjai> Yep
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Then once you have something working and the tests pass, you're free to refactor and the tests can confirm if things are still green of if they've gone red.
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<Senjai> havenwood: I still think that would be a bit much to ask at this particular point :P
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, ok then. thanks again for your comment.
<havenwood> Senjai: Hem, I'm not sure. You think Minitest asserts are too much cognitive overhead early on?
<volty> of course, he has to refactor that ugly code first :)
<havenwood> _blizzy_: if you changed that `refute` to `assert` the test will fail
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<_blizzy_> havenwood, ok.
<volty> (and wrong, e.g. ws = ws
<Senjai> volty: be nice
<havenwood> volty: easier to refactor with tests ;)
<volty> Senjai: I am nice
<Senjai> havenwood: Yeah, the problem being that getting test coverage for all that, even though its all going to change is going to be difficult
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<zenspider> did someone say minitest? :P
<havenwood> zenspider: \o/
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<zenspider> huh. I don't have that as a keyword
<volty> havenwood: I do not believe so. I think you just can't test a nightmare :)
<zenspider> someone catch me up?
<Senjai> I'm with volty
<volty> _blizzy_: I'm joking.
<havenwood> volty: You could just add a test or two at a zoomed out level. Then extract method refactor and test the units.
<zenspider> bacon is a primary ingredient in my diet
<_blizzy_> volty, oh. c:
<Senjai> zenspider: TLDR convincing _blizzy_ to refactor his code to avoid bugs. Debating on if suggesting test coverage for the existing code before refactor or not
<havenwood> _blizzy_: Have a link to your latest code? (You can update gists by the way, intead of creating new gists.)
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<Senjai> Psht, I never update gists. gist gem ftw
<_blizzy_> havenwood, well, I'll still refactoring.
<zenspider> always refactor against tests
<Senjai> zenspider: Look at his code first
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<zenspider> damn
<zenspider> 1134.1: flog total 189.0: flog/method average
<zenspider> 785.2: Battle#run a.rb:24
<zenspider> 270.1: Battle#decide a.rb:189
<zenspider> 59.6: Battle#effectiveness a.rb:288
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<zenspider> that's... untestable
<Senjai> See what I mean? :P
<Senjai> in this case I would refactor first, test second
<Senjai> as currently its not fleshed out or fully working as is
<pontiki> i hate to ask, but.. no, wait, i don't want to see
<volty> logic can be tested only after right semantics. — you have to know what your code does, and how it does. But that's just my humble opinion. I don't mind (and don't like) tests.
<_blizzy_> I feel bad now c:
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: Don't feel bad!
<Senjai> _blizzy_: Don't be, just take it constructively
<zenspider> ok. so, "basic" refactorings, split run into actions and replace the case with send
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<Senjai> _blizzy_: We've all written terrible code, nobody just writes good code right away
<zenspider> that'll make each action its own thing, and each one should be (relatively) testable from there on
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<Senjai> zenspider: More like seperate objects etc. but yeah. Dont need to reference specific actions
<Senjai> zenspider: We did go over that too
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<zenspider> I wouldn't bother with separate objects at this point. he's not doing the command pattern, just dispatching
<Senjai> zenspider: The logic in each "dispatch" can be a seperate object
<zenspider> action_faint(m)
<zenspider> send "action_#{m[0]}"
<zenspider> err
<Senjai> Or Command if you want to be explicit on the pattern
<zenspider> send "action_#{m[0]}", *m[1..-1]
<Senjai> I'm anti send
<Senjai> zenspider: We're just going to confuse him, lets let him try, and see what he comes up with
<zenspider> I'm anti-gc-for-no-good-reason
<volty> imho the only test possible test at this stage is to see if the prog is running, even if wrong :) // then rewrite from scratch (looking at the old code). but that is a question of style
<Senjai> expect{program}.to_not raise_error
<Senjai> #fixed_forever
<zenspider> ugh
<grex25> Senjai, drbrain: Yeah was a timeout, but works now. Thanks for help!
<Senjai> grex25: <3
<zenspider> worst testing pattern that ever got popular
<Senjai> zenspider: You know I'm joking right
<zenspider> well, at this point, that pretty much IS the only test you can write
<Senjai> Aye haha
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<Senjai> grex25: FYI, 99% of the time, with no output, it usually is
<zenspider> _blizzy_: those numbers I pasted above are from a tool called "flog". The higher the number, the more complex a method is. (non-rails) Industry average is 10/method.
<grex25> Senjai: Was just wondering why there is no output, just like "trying to load gem XYZ.. connecting to 1.2.3.4 "
<zenspider> you should break your code down and in so doing, your flog score goes down and your testability goes up
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<Senjai> grex25: If you use the verbose flag, there should be according to drbrain
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<Senjai> grex25: Otherwise, probably just not implimented
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<zenspider> there's verbose and debug if you really want to go overboard
<zenspider> the latter really is just noise
<volty> verbose for/at whom?
<grex25> Nono, but I just think just getting confronted with a blinkin cursor and zero output before is bad ;)
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<grex25> Senjai: Yeah, thanks for testing it ;D
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<havenwood> _blizzy_: This stuff is hard and you're taking really good stabs at it and adapting quickly to advice. Go in the direction and simpler methods with tests and you're on a good track.
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<havenwood> direction of*
<volty> people, stop pls torturing _blizzy_ :)
<volty> he has too many errors in that code
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<volty> I think he does not have enough experience. And so I suggest him to implement a simple tic-tac-toe before battling with initializiers
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<volty> e.g. @team = Array.new; @team = false
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<_blizzy_> volty, I have experience
<Senjai> Nono, what hes doing is fine.
<_blizzy_> c:
<zenspider> this is far from torture. :P
<havenwood> Small and simple is really important.
<Senjai> We just need to stop suggesting things, and see what his refactoring turns out like
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<zenspider> agreed
<havenwood> Senjai: :)
<Senjai> This convo has gone on for over an hour now :P
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<havenwood> Senjai: I've been away so full of vigor!
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<havenwood> Senjai: The evening shift is arriving.
<zenspider> dudedudeman: "how the eff does one test for datetime in minitest" ? what does that mean? (real q)
<Senjai> havenwood: Please, you have the same shift as I do
<volty> _blizzy_: then (if experienced) you must be very very tired. Get a rest.
<Senjai> Or at least a superset of it
<havenwood> Senjai: Yeah, we do overlap.
<Senjai> volty: Chill :P
<_blizzy_> volty, I'm not tired. c:
<volty> then by experience you must mean «experience of "particular coding"» :)
<zenspider> volty: "your code sucks. you must be very very tired." ... kinda rude, no?
<volty> at
<Senjai> ^
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<Senjai> volty: That's not constructive, and doesnt help anyone
<_blizzy_> volty, no, I have experience in programming in general.
<volty> absolutely.I'm sure. and good
<volty> and I am not rude at all. And _blizzy_ must know that if he has general experience in programming
<Senjai> havenwood: I think the only reason I'm not on after work si because I run windows at home for the videogames and things. And I refuse to use putty to IRC :P
<Senjai> Also irc drains a lot of time
<Senjai> Best procrastination system
* zenspider looks around shiftily... goes back to coding like he should be
<Senjai> ^
<grex25> this channel is quite funny today *grabs popcorn*
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* dfockler is just over here writing python
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<_blizzy_> so it's wrong for methods to be big?
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<volty> it isn't wrong, it's just easier to grasp if you decompose your logic & flow in smaller units. A genius can write all the program in a single method. And even without a method :)
<Senjai> _blizzy_: It's wrong for a method to have more than one responsibility
<Senjai> There are exceptions, but thats a good rule to live by
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<_blizzy_> I'm getting confused now with refactoring.
<_blizzy_> :/
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<Senjai> Take a brief gander at those
<volty> refactoring = rewriting // you write a novel, then you seen it's a mess, then you rewrite it correcting and polishing
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<Senjai> Not always man.
<Senjai> Refactoring in theory should not include a change in any logic
<Senjai> rewriting != refactoring
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<Senjai> he's kind of doing a mix of both
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<volty> sorry Senjai. But that about logic isn't true.
<Senjai> volty: Sorry dude, yes it is. A pure refactoring has no change in logic.
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<Senjai> Refactoring. …is a disciplined technique for restructuring an existing body of code, altering its internal structure without changing its external behavior
<volty> for sure you wanted to say «behavior» (external)
<Senjai> Sure
<Senjai> semantics
<volty> yes, you can change the internal logic as much as you please.
<volty> changing the internal structure is about changing the logic of solving / calculating
<Senjai> Yes, again, it was a semantics error
<volty> sorry
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<jhass> changing the logic would change the behavior, no? if we're fighting about semantics I'd say changing the way the logic is expressed
<Senjai> jhass: That's more correct, the logic surrounding the component as a whole is static. Given the same inputs, you get the same outputs. How that's handled can be changed in any which way
<volty> changing the logic does not necessarily change the behavior
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<Senjai> Yes, nobody disagrees with you :p
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<Senjai> I googled "how to tell people they're right on the internet" but it didn't help
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<volty> behaviour of the whole prog, of course (while internal units, of the chain, could change their external behaviour)
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<volty> ahah
<volty> let's conclude with «Internal Logic»
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