varjagg has quit [Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 26.1)]
Balooga_ has joined #lisp
it3ration has joined #lisp
pjb has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
it3ration has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
SenasOzys has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
SenasOzys has joined #lisp
SenasOzys has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Essadon has quit [Quit: Qutting]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
smokeink has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
lavaflow has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.2]
SenasOzys has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
dented42 has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
dented42 has joined #lisp
suskeyhose has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
SenasOzys has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
pierpal has joined #lisp
SenasOzys has joined #lisp
SenasOzys has quit [Max SendQ exceeded]
SenasOzys has joined #lisp
SenasOzys has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
fikka has joined #lisp
SenasOzys has joined #lisp
SenasOzys has quit [Max SendQ exceeded]
dented42 has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
SenasOzys has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
SenasOzys has quit [Max SendQ exceeded]
<holycow>
.
SenasOzys has joined #lisp
<AeroNotix>
hmm, I have a macro that is forming defmethod bodies but this creates an issue where the defmethod name will be unknown to user code so things like return-from will be slightly annoying to write. How to solve that
<AeroNotix>
?
pjb has joined #lisp
<Bike>
implicit nil block?
<AeroNotix>
Bike: haha, that's what I was just trying to see if it would work :)
suskeyhose has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
dented42 has joined #lisp
pierpal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
pierpal has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
graphene has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
graphene has joined #lisp
graphene has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Balooga_ has quit [Quit: Balooga_]
rtypo has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
graphene has joined #lisp
pierpal has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
rumbler31 has joined #lisp
dented42 has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
fikka has joined #lisp
pjb has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
kooga has joined #lisp
pierpal has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
pierpal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
jinkies has joined #lisp
dented42 has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
acolarh has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
mejja has joined #lisp
acolarh has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
mejja has left #lisp [#lisp]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
robotoad has quit [Quit: robotoad]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
FreeBirdLjj has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
FreeBirdLjj has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
pierpal has joined #lisp
nullniverse has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
pierpal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
pierpal has joined #lisp
it3ration has joined #lisp
robotoad has joined #lisp
pierpal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
it3ration has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
pierpal has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
wooden_ has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
wooden_ has quit [Client Quit]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
kamog has joined #lisp
anewuser has quit [Quit: anewuser]
pierpal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
graphene has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
graphene has joined #lisp
pierpal has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
holycow has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
fikka has joined #lisp
holycow has joined #lisp
Roy_Fokker has quit [Quit: Leaving]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
Volt_ has quit [Quit: exit();]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
lanu has joined #lisp
lanu has left #lisp [#lisp]
regreg has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
lanu has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
steiner has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
lanu1 has joined #lisp
lanu has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
lanu1 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
lanu has joined #lisp
orivej has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
nullniverse has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
it3ration has joined #lisp
<holycow>
anyone know of any interactive music generator programs done in common lisp? not scheme or the like?
<holycow>
not googling much right now. open music is interesting, still configuring that
fikka has joined #lisp
it3ration has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
smokeink has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
igemnace has quit [Quit: gtg, gl]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
jinkies has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
lemonpepper24 has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
nbunjeva2 has joined #lisp
nbunjevac has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
<holycow>
thank LdBeth
<holycow>
still cannot get over how high quality opusmodus is
<holycow>
especially given that it is a cl app
<holycow>
most apps have some hard edges especially around the interface side of things
earl-ducaine has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<holycow>
this one even has an amazingly polished website
<holycow>
i might have to fire up one of my macs and get it to play with
<LdBeth>
Writing pretty interface it not had with Clozure CL as long as you know some Cocoa
<LdBeth>
And the good news is Clozure CL is free open source
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
lanu has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
lanu has joined #lisp
SenasOzys has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
<beach>
Good morning everyone!
<holycow>
mornin
<LdBeth>
morning
Fare has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
meepdeew has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
<no-defun-allowed>
morning beach
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
vlatkoB has joined #lisp
<no-defun-allowed>
how are you?
rippa has joined #lisp
<beach>
Me? Fine as usual. Yesterday I created the #sicl channel to avoid polluting #clasp with my own stuff.
<beach>
no-defun-allowed: What about you? How are you?
Oladon has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
<no-defun-allowed>
alright i guess. i've been incredibly this lazy this weekend
<beach>
no-defun-allowed: Laziness is a virtue in computer science and software development.
<no-defun-allowed>
lol, i'm "planning" i guess
<beach>
Sure.
<beach>
Many people work way too hard. They think that, when they are tired in the evening, they have had a good day of work. I personally try to let the computer do as much work for me as possible.
<no-defun-allowed>
i got the channel implementation finished in cl-decentralise so i have to write some kind of async handler for it and also some uses for the system.
<beach>
Sounds good. I don't know what it is, but it still sounds good. :)
<no-defun-allowed>
i'll make a looping macro of some kind which reads a block, and runs thunks based on what channels it belongs to
<no-defun-allowed>
it's an abstraction for making consensus and mirroring systems
<beach>
Got it.
<no-defun-allowed>
blockchains are way too costly and federation is really boring and is effectively centralisation but with more servers
fikka has joined #lisp
<holycow>
it does sound intriguing
<no-defun-allowed>
(also matrix.org sucks and i want to make a better solution for running the decentralised web of things)
<holycow>
:)
<holycow>
ohhhh ... you are building one of those
<holycow>
neat
<no-defun-allowed>
thanks
* no-defun-allowed
goes to matrix-client.el cause that way she knows links won't break
dale has joined #lisp
<LdBeth>
Can't see why matrix sux, it's just a protocol.
<no-defun-allowed>
>
<no-defun-allowed>
federation is really boring and is effectively centralisation but with more servers
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
<no-defun-allowed>
back
<no-defun-allowed>
cl-decentralise lives at https://gitlab.com/netfarm.gq/cl-decentralise, it's in an organisation cause there'll be projects built on top and i have friends who like the idea
<no-defun-allowed>
beach: is there a way to teach minion your program exists so you can look like a badass and say "minion, tell foo what cl-bar is" like you do?
<beach>
Sure.
<beach>
minion: help
<minion>
There are multiple help modules. Try ``/msg minion help kind'', where kind is one of: "lookups", "helping others", "adding terms", "aliasing terms", "forgetting", "memos", "avoiding memos", "nicknames", "goodies", "eliza", "advice", "apropos", "acronyms".
<beach>
minion help adding terms
<beach>
minion: help adding terms
<minion>
To add a term, say something like ``minion: add "term" as: the definition''. I will remember the definition.
<no-defun-allowed>
nice!
holycow has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
<no-defun-allowed>
*ahem*
<beach>
minion: Help forgetting
<minion>
To make me forget something, say something like ``minion: forget term''. I'll forget what I know about that term or nickname.
<no-defun-allowed>
minion: add "cl-decentralise" as: cl-decentralise is a consensus building protocol designed for fast prototyping and development.
<minion>
OK, done.
<no-defun-allowed>
that was a mouthful
<no-defun-allowed>
ty
<beach>
ywlcm
<no-defun-allowed>
back when cl-d was a python project and it was much larger and fuzzier, people complained i wasn't going fast enough.
fikka has joined #lisp
<beach>
People complain about lots of things. Don't listen to them.
<no-defun-allowed>
turns that if you rush things to meet quotas ideas aren't fleshed out properly and are incomplete
<beach>
I totally agree.
<no-defun-allowed>
the original project, nettle, tried to manage a tree of objects using parent-child links and children were never verified.
<no-defun-allowed>
this meant that anyone could modify children instead of just the linker. with my demonstration system for cl-d i'll split the object into automatically generated "unsigned" parts and "signed" user parts
<no-defun-allowed>
it's strange how people do web projects honestly. many make the interface and single-server logic without understanding how they will send it to other servers.
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
xrash has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
<no-defun-allowed>
maybe it's cause no one hired back end devs or the interface has to look amazing the first time to hook people in
smokeink has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<beach>
no-defun-allowed: Not my domain, but it sounds like you have good ideas with respect to traditional ways of doing things.
<beach>
no-defun-allowed: What is your dayjob?
<no-defun-allowed>
thankyou.
<no-defun-allowed>
i'm an unemployed 17 year old student.
<beach>
Well, if you are a student, then you kind of have a full-time job.
<no-defun-allowed>
that is true
<beach>
17? So are you in high school (or equivalent)?
<no-defun-allowed>
re "strange order of design": it's like someone took SICP's wishful thinking and applied it to a whole project
<no-defun-allowed>
yes, i'm in high school.
<beach>
I see what you mean about design.
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
<beach>
There is a lot of bad design in software. I am planning to write a book about it.
<no-defun-allowed>
i'd love to read that when it comes out
<beach>
Thanks.
<LdBeth>
interesting
<aeth>
The Unix Hater's Handbook 2?
<no-defun-allowed>
if it's called that i'll actually buy the book
<LdBeth>
The Common Lisp School of Design
<no-defun-allowed>
"problem solving methodology? more like problem starting methology: the book"
fikka has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
<no-defun-allowed>
at school we're taught "analysis, plan, design, evaluate" or words to those meanings
it3ration has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<beach>
I won't tell you the name of the book because it is so witty (in my opinion) that someone might steal it before I get the book out.
<no-defun-allowed>
nice
fikka has joined #lisp
it3ration has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
les` is now known as les
FreeBirdLjj has joined #lisp
les has quit [Quit: ""]
les has joined #lisp
nika has joined #lisp
orivej has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
dented42 has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
fikka has joined #lisp
shka_ has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
dented42 has joined #lisp
robotoad has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
svillemot has quit [Quit: ZNC 1.6.5+deb1+deb9u1 - http://znc.in]
FreeBirdLjj has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
FreeBirdLjj has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<beach>
shka_: Hold on. I'll have a look.
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
nika has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<beach>
shka_: It is not strictly necessary. I have written versions without the parent reference. But in certain applications, you might want to avoid inserting and deleting elements by always starting the search at the root.
<shka_>
do you happen to have version without parent floating around?
<beach>
shka_: For example, let's say you are implementing an editor buffer and you want to keep lines of text in the leaves.
FreeBirdLjj has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
<beach>
... then you can keep a pointer to the current line and when it splits, you can use the parent pointer to accomplish the new insertion.
<beach>
Let me have a look.
<shka_>
beach: i want to make immutable queue
<shka_>
so i always insert at the left-most
<shka_>
and delete at the right-most
<shka_>
but i will have to COW so i will need full path regardless
<beach>
nisstyre: Apparently, #scheme is very quiet. :)
<nisstyre>
beach: yeah
<shka_>
easy, pretend that you are writing scheme in CL! ;-)
<beach>
But then you have those FUNCALLs that give it away.
<nisstyre>
beach: macros can solve that
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
<beach>
I suppose.
<shka_>
jackdaniel has this nifty reader macro that simply turns [foo bar] into (funcall foo bar)
ym has joined #lisp
<heisig>
You can also write a with-functions macro that generates appropriate FLET bindings, such that (with-functions (g) BODY) turns into (flet ((g (&rest args) (apply g args))) BODY).
<shka_>
serapeum fbind does that
random-nick has joined #lisp
SaganMan has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.6]
SaganMan has joined #lisp
<jackdaniel>
the most useful macro I have is the one ripped from cmuutils, namely the collecting macro
fikka has joined #lisp
<jackdaniel>
syntactic sugar causes a parenthesis cancer (or so they say)
<beach>
They do?
<jackdaniel>
at least Alan Perlis did, it is a paraphrase. original was: "Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semi-colons"
<beach>
I know the original, but I had never seen the variation.
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
lanu has quit [Quit: lanu]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
<LdBeth>
I think the orignal one applies to PL/I
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
mindCrime has joined #lisp
mindCrime__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
pjb has joined #lisp
adam4567 has quit [Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 24.5.1)]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
jonux has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
dddddd has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
jonux has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
regreg has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
lumm has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<SaganMan>
lol jackdaniel
lumm has joined #lisp
<shka_>
beach: do you always store the class of node in the container?
<beach>
shka_: I don't understand.
<shka_>
right
<shka_>
(make-instance (leaf-class *tree*))
<shka_>
i seen stuff like this before in your code
<beach>
Oh, no I don't always do that.
<beach>
But it can come in handy.
<beach>
If some client wants leaves with additional information in them.
<shka_>
wouldn't be it even better to have defgeneric make-leaf?
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<shka_>
and dispatch on class of the tree
<beach>
Sure, that's another solution.
<shka_>
ok
<shka_>
thanks, i will remember this trick
<beach>
A third one is to have a generic function LEAF-CLASS that dispatches on the container class. The MOP does things like that.
<shka_>
yeah, that's what i do in cl-ds
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
<shka_>
but i don't need that on internal node, so i do this only on leafs
fikka has joined #lisp
<shka_>
interface passing style
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
orivej has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
orivej has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
atgreen has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
it3ration has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
it3ration has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
C-16 has quit [Quit: lol ok]
v0|d has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
regreg has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
regreg has joined #lisp
cobax has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
atgreen has joined #lisp
robotoad has quit [Quit: robotoad]
cage_ has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
robotoad has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
rozenglass has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
heisig has quit [Quit: Leaving]
orivej has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
<frgo>
Question (off topic): What kind of API authoring tools (Non-REST) and code generation tools are there that you guys are considering good stuff?
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
anewuser has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
scymtym has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
varjagg has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
silver0 has joined #lisp
<Shinmera>
frgo: What do you mean?
<frgo>
Shinmera: Some editor that allows me to create and maintain an API spec for functional APIs during design phase and then generate code from that API spec for a set of languages.
<frgo>
I also need to create beautiful-looking PDFs from that spec.
<Shinmera>
Then I can only say that everything I've seen that advertises to do this is a catastrophe in practise.
<frgo>
No, unfortunately I can't use just some kind of DSL in Lisp for that.
nowhere_man has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
<frgo>
Me too, so far. All the tools that are kind of doing the trick are for REST APIs. I don't need that yet.
<Shinmera>
UML is the historical failure example
fikka has joined #lisp
<frgo>
Yeah, but the one example that almost all SW developers are kind of used to.
<frgo>
At least the Java people.
<Shinmera>
poor souls
orivej has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
<frgo>
And I need to coordinate an API for Salesforce platform with a Non-Lisp company.
<pjb>
frgo: have a look at elephant, the protocol generator.
<frgo>
Oh - that'S a new one. Looking ....
<jackdaniel>
frgo: thrift has language-agnostic protocol definitions
<jackdaniel>
(and it covers wide variety of languages)
<jackdaniel>
((common lisp included))
<frgo>
pjb: Where do I have to look for elephant?
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
<frgo>
jackdaniel: Looking ...
silver0 has left #lisp ["Leaving"]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<jackdaniel>
what is nice such protocol may be used to interoperate between different languages (i.e Go vs CL)
<frgo>
Thrift seems to be like the olden golden DCE IDL / Corba IDL.
svillemot has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
svillemot has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
scymtym has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
joga has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
<pjb>
frgo: sorry, it's named etiquette.
<pjb>
elephant is a OO database.
<pjb>
(hey! I had the first letter right!)
xantoz has joined #lisp
<pjb>
frgo: but actually, any generator can be good, for example, cl-ometa. or just your own custom macros.
<frgo>
pjb: Thx. Still: Do you have a web URL for me? (I seem to be too dumb to ask google=
Kundry_Wag has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
fikka has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
astalla has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
lumm has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
<AeroNotix>
Are there any webrtc libraries available? A quick google doesn't turn up anything
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
vmmenon has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
libre-man has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
cods has joined #lisp
Bike has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
igemnace has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
atgreen has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
libre-man has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
meepdeew has joined #lisp
cl-arthur has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
meepdeew has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
pierpal has quit [Quit: Poof]
pierpal has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
dueyfinster has joined #lisp
pierpal has quit [Client Quit]
pierpal has joined #lisp
Roy_Fokker has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
fikka has joined #lisp
regreg has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
it3ration has joined #lisp
it3ration has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
asarch has joined #lisp
zooey has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
fikka has joined #lisp
zooey has joined #lisp
<shka_>
beach: can i copy some parts of 2-3-tree implementation from climacs?
<shka_>
and republish it as MIT
<beach>
From CLIMatis?
<shka_>
from climatis
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<shka_>
names are confusing ;-)
<beach>
I prefer BSD if that's fine with you.
<beach>
The 2-clause BSD.
<shka_>
hm, well actually i can change my license
<beach>
I think the two are compatible.
<beach>
Should not be a problem.
<shka_>
they are
atgreen has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
<shka_>
great, now i should finish that damn queue :]
<beach>
Heh, yes, I see.
<shka_>
i need it because without that writing some generators is kinda awkward
<beach>
I see.
<shka_>
which is annoying because it works just fine if i need a stack and list will do
<shka_>
ok, got to do other stuff
<shka_>
see you later!
<beach>
Have fun.
<loke>
beach: I went back to looking at presentations and copy&paste
<beach>
Good.
<shka_>
cleaning my floor is not fun but thanks :D
<loke>
I have some problems though
<beach>
What are they?
<loke>
Well, remember that the issue I had was to find out a way to extend DEFINE-COMMAND such that it's possible to know the presentation type?
<beach>
I do remember that.
fikka has joined #lisp
<loke>
I haven't figured all of this out, but what I'm testin gis this:
<loke>
I type the command "Copy to clipboard" and it will prompt me for an object to copy. At this point, all objects become clickable (since the command is specialised on T)
<beach>
OK.
<loke>
I click the command, then it records the actual object. Once I press return, it simply calls the COM-COPY-TO-CLIPBOARD function with this object as argument.
<loke>
The issue, I think, is that the knowledge of the presentation type is lost at the point of clicking on the object. Everything after that only deals with the object.
<beach>
Right.
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
* loke
also noted something else...
<loke>
I was wondering why when I clicked on a Maxima equation, the copy-to-clipboard thing decided to copy the Lisp Sexp form... Turns out that since i have multiple presentaton-translators, once of which being the Maxima-expression-to-CLIM:EXPRESSION (so that I can insert maxima equations into the Lisp REPL), it decided to apply that translator when I clicked on the object.
<loke>
I guess that was becasue that's the translator that was defined first.
<loke>
I think this goes to show that having commands that specialise on T is problematic.
<beach>
You do get a menu if you have multiple translators.
<beach>
That way, the user can choose.
<beach>
The menu is ordered alphabetically it seems, at least by default.
<loke>
beach: Indeed. But in the case of the clipboard, you don't want any translation
<beach>
Right.
<loke>
beach: but... now that I'm thinking about it... Would the following stragegy work?
<loke>
What if instead of specialising on T, I let com-copy-to-copy-to-clipboard specialise on some speaicl object, let's call it CLIPBOARD-OBJECT-WRAPPER or something like that. I can then have a single translator that translates any object T into a CLIPBOARD-OBJECT-WRAPPER byt simply instnatiating it like so: (make-instance clipboard-bject-wrapper :object OBJ)
Essadon has joined #lisp
<beach>
How will that solve the problem? It seems to me you still lose the presentation type. No?
<loke>
beach: Hmm...
<loke>
yes. oops.
<beach>
I think you should turn this into a special kind of command.
<loke>
At least the unwanted call to the translator will be avoided. So that's one problem solved.
<beach>
... and not use the standard mechanism for supplying arguments to commands.
<loke>
But what if there is a way (by adding a feature, perhaps) to have the presentation-translator function know what the original presentation type was?
Lycurgus has joined #lisp
<loke>
Then the wrapper object could hold two slots: The object and the presentation type.
<beach>
Sure, if you can find such a way.
<loke>
Looking at the code for define-presentation-translator now...
Fare has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
fikka has joined #lisp
xrash has joined #lisp
dueyfinster has quit [Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
jasmith has joined #lisp
fikka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
<loke>
beach: yay. It should be possible.
<loke>
The translator is called with the actual presentation object as one of its keyword arguments
<beach>
Oh, excellent!
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<loke>
Yes!
<loke>
All I had to do was to add a second argument to the arglist in the translator named PRESENTATION
<beach>
That's great!
<loke>
Neat
<loke>
I'll implement this thing tomorrow
<beach>
At work? :)
<loke>
It is funny that CLIM has so many magic symbol names thta can be user
<loke>
used
<loke>
Now that I know what to look for, it's actually documented in the entry for DEFINE-PRESENTATION-TRANSLATOR
<loke>
"arglist, tester-arglist, and doc-arglist are each an argument list that must "match" the following "canonical" argument list.
<loke>
In order to "match" the canonical argument list, there must be a single positional argument that corresponds to the presentation's object, and several named arguments that must match the canonical names above (using string-equal to do the comparison)."
<loke>
(object &key presentation context-type frame event window x y)
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
<beach>
I see. I'll read it too.
<beach>
Looks good.
<loke>
OK, going to sleep now. I'll play around with this later.
joga has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
<beach>
'night loke.
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
kooga has joined #lisp
graphene has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
graphene has joined #lisp
orivej has joined #lisp
shrdlu68 has joined #lisp
<shrdlu68>
How is sxhash calculated for CLOS objects?
<Bike>
implementation dependent
<Bike>
sxhash has to work ont he level of EQUAL, but two distinct standard-objects are never equal, so
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
<shrdlu68>
I wish to sxhash the subsequence of a sequence without subseq'ing, any idea how I can do this?
<Bike>
what are you using the sxhash for?
<pjb>
shrdlu68: you don't have to read each element of a sequence to sxhash the sequence.
<pjb>
shrdlu68: you can use just the two or three first elements, or the first the middle and the last one, etc.
<oni-on-ion>
ahh. afaik on my tablet (win8.1) i've got ECL going with mingw
nowhere_man has joined #lisp
<k-hos>
I hadn't seen it, but I'm not sure how it applies
graphene has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<k-hos>
standalone program is what I am trying to get, preferably by compiling all files involved and not loading them at run time
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
graphene has joined #lisp
<oni-on-ion>
k-hos: well. bulding programs and choosing a C compiler i think are very related concepts. you did say that you checked the manual and i did not intend to not believe you but i did a google search and thats where i ended up
<oni-on-ion>
i think if it loads C files at runtime that would be still just Compile Time.
graphene has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
graphene has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Oladon has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
impulse has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
impulse has joined #lisp
cl-arthur has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
varjagg has quit [Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 26.1)]
kooga has joined #lisp
laqq3 has joined #lisp
pierpal has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
Oladon has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
mange has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
pjb has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
Jesin has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Jesin has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
rumbler31 has joined #lisp
ober has joined #lisp
rumbler31 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
nowhere_man has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
rtypo has joined #lisp
ealfonso has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
pjb has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has joined #lisp
Kundry_Wag has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
Lycurgus has joined #lisp
orivej has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
actuallybatman has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]