#lisp on 2018-09-15 — irc logs at freenode.irclog.whitequark.org

2018-03-25 12:29 jackdaniel changed the topic of #lisp to: Common Lisp, the #1=(programmable . #1#) programming language<http://cliki.net/> logs:<https://irclog.whitequark.org/lisp,http://ccl.clozure.com/irc-logs/lisp/> | SBCL 1.4.5, CMUCL 21b, ECL 16.1.3, CCL 1.11.5, ABCL 1.5.0

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00:43 <wilfredh> hi folks

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00:43 <wilfredh> I'm a CL newbie and trying to write an HTTP hello world

00:44 <wilfredh> in terms of libraries, I was looking at hutchentoot, but (ql:system-apropos "hutchentoot") doesn't show anything

00:44 <wilfredh> how do I install it with quicklisp?

00:44 <Bike> it's "hunchentoot"

00:44 <aeth> There are two (afaik) servers, https://github.com/edicl/hunchentoot/ and https://github.com/fukamachi/woo/

00:44 <aeth> Both appear in https://www.quicklisp.org/beta/releases.html

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00:45 <wilfredh> argh, such a simple typo. Thanks.

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00:55 <Xach> wilfredh: https://www.xach.com/tmp/quickstart.html is a little hello-world

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00:57 <wilfredh> Xach: thanks, I will play with that tomorrow :)

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04:00 <beach> Good morning everyone!

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04:03 <Oladon> Morning beach :)

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04:05 <Oladon> And g'night!

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04:13 <LdBeth> Good evening

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04:31 <no-defun-allowed> morning beach

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06:55 <makomo> morning

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06:56 <no-defun-allowed> morning makomo

06:57 <beach> Hello makomo.

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06:57 <beach> makomo: Thanks for questioning my decision of not wanting the compiler in the initial image.

06:57 <beach> makomo: I think I was victim of the effect Kahneman describes.

06:58 <beach> The "fast module" said (it is going to be too slow and take too much memory). The "slow module" (which is also lazy) believed the fast one.

06:58 <makomo> beach: oh, i read part of the discussion in #clasp. i'm glad it helped! :)

06:59 <beach> Yes, as I pointed out, if I can rely on the compiler being present, I can eliminate lots of code.

06:59 <beach> I might have to be a little bit careful during bootstrapping. I don't want to save each byte of the X86 instructions in a 64-bit word. :)

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07:01 <makomo> beach: yeah, that wouldn't be very good :-)

07:02 <beach> Anyway, thanks again. The current hypothesis is that I can include the compiler in my bootstrapping output.

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07:02 <makomo> beach: what is this effect you're referring to? i found at least 3 different ones described by Kahneman

07:02 <beach> It's from the book "thinking, fast and slow". There are roughly two modules, the fast and the slow one.

07:03 <beach> The fast one is lousy with arithmetic ans probability. The fast one can do that, but it is lazy and tends to believe the fast one.

07:04 <beach> So, when we hear something like "if we fixed all dripping faucets in France, we could save 100 million liters of water every year", the fast module goes "oh, let's do that then, because that's a lot of water".

07:04 <makomo> beach: awesome. interested to see how this will affect the bootstrapping. i have yet to understand the effective method computation thingies that are being discussed. i'm not familiar with that part of the mop yet

07:05 <beach> The slow module, if it is not lazy that day, would divide by the population of France, resulting in 1.5 liters per person per year.

07:05 <beach> makomo: It is messy because of the lousy description of make-method and call-method.

07:06 <makomo> beach: ah i see. interesting effect

07:06 <beach> With the compiler, I was definitely a victim of that effect.

07:07 <beach> Once I forced the slow module to do its work, things were looking much better.

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07:08 <beach> Anyway, I am about to go for a bicycle ride, and then shop for food.

07:08 <sixbitslacker> Here is your shopping list: (1) Copious dogboy annoyers; (2) Murderous bags; (3) Generous bum animals; (4) Satanic robber contributions; (5) Gaunt flanges; (6) Erroneous compressors

07:09 <beach> Must be a bot, looking for keywords, such as shop.

07:09 <sixbitslacker> Here is your shopping list: (1) Dubious birds; (2) Satirical anti-shock mice; (3) Hesitant terrific selector units; (4) Anonymous dividers; (5) Chinese Unopened paradoxes; (6) Fantastic livers

07:09 <makomo> beach: have fun!

07:09 <makomo> haha yeah

07:09 <no-defun-allowed> sixbitslacker: i'm gonna go to the shops now

07:09 <makomo> something c++ something

07:09 <makomo> minion: something c++ something

07:09 <minion> hey, keep it polite!

07:09 <makomo> :D

07:10 <no-defun-allowed> ahem. shop.

07:10 <sixbitslacker> Here is your shopping list: (1) Indolent exhibitions; (2) Recurrent wavechord skis; (3) Biochemical rigorous seducers; (4) Magisterial bears

07:10 <LdBeth> GG

07:10 <Shinmera> coll spambot

07:10 <Shinmera> *cool

07:10 <no-defun-allowed> minion: something sixbitslacker knows what i eat something

07:10 <minion> watch out, you'll make krystof angry

07:10 <no-defun-allowed> indeed.

07:11 <no-defun-allowed> shinmera: thanks for lquery btw. very fancy clone of a js thing i'm glad i wasn't old enough to bother learning

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07:11 <Shinmera> thanks. It was the first lisp library I wrote.

07:12 <no-defun-allowed> nice

07:13 <no-defun-allowed> i can't remember where i put my irc markov bot ):

07:14 <Shinmera> Colleen: ramble

07:14 <Colleen> 輪ゴム for instance.

07:14 <no-defun-allowed> this had a nice big file of (useless group) spam and i used it to spam (useless group). very symmetrical.

07:15 <no-defun-allowed> (useless group) is not relevant enough to be mentioned and is slightly controversial. you know how sbcl pprint says # if you go too deep? same thing.

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07:15 <MichaelRaskin> pjb: well, eval is the only standard way to evaluate macroexpand-1 in a lexical environment you can describe but cannot obtain as a lexenv object

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07:15 <no-defun-allowed> hey i found it

07:17 <MichaelRaskin> makomo: well, you might have missed that just having access to the list of names in the environment is enough to reconstruct a good enough approximation.

07:17 <no-defun-allowed> https://gist.github.com/TheEmacsShibe/91b0b547b6ef9bd15453d27c282ebc80

07:17 <no-defun-allowed> it's really fun

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07:19 <Shinmera> Maiden's markov is a bit optimised because the db I have is pretty big now.

07:19 <Shinmera> Colleen: markov stats

07:19 <Colleen> The markov dictionary knows 76'155 words with 2'104'528 possible connections.

07:19 <no-defun-allowed> you're probably better it than i am lol

07:19 <Shinmera> https://github.com/Shirakumo/maiden/tree/master/agents/markov

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07:20 <MichaelRaskin> makomo: agnostic-lizard does support expansion using an over-approimation of an environment now

07:20 <no-defun-allowed> i thought we were talking about "first projects"

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07:54 <_death> Shinmera: seems the transitions have equal probability?

07:55 <Shinmera> The chains get repeated, if I remember correctly

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08:06 <_death> ah, vector-push-extend for each occurrence

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08:09 <Shinmera> Not the most efficient storage-wise, of course.

08:10 <Shinmera> But it makes the rest much easier

08:10 <_death> right, I'd expect a count instead.. then it's also easy to tweak the distribution with a "temperature" to create more/less surprising sentences

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13:44 <beach> I just created the #sicl channel for discussions specific to SICL and Cleavir.

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16:26 <SaganMan> nice beach

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16:27 <beach> Thanks.

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23:08 <fouric> http://phoe.tymoon.eu/clus/doku.php?id=cl:macros:prog1 appears broken for me, anyone else? phoe?

23:08 <fouric> (compare to e.g. http://phoe.tymoon.eu/clus/doku.php?id=cl:special_operators:progn)

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23:12 <Siorai> fouric I'd be inclined to agree.

23:12 <Siorai> It's missing the side bar.

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23:20 <Siorai> Yeah it's missing a bunch of the formatting.

23:21 <Siorai> everything looks good until you hit like line 116 in the source for the prog1 one.

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