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<hno>
slapin_n1, I lurk around, but haven't had my eyes on IRD tonight. Maybe tomorrow.
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<el>
when I'm trying to sync cubie_android_ics, I'm getting error : "fatal: Authentication failed"
<el>
can anyone help me?
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<oliv3r>
lkcl: ideally wait until we have a blob that works for sun[4567]i before geting onto their case. also leaves us room to examine that one
<oliv3r>
lkcl: worst things come, they get pissy, and don't release any libcedar anymore; unlikly but could happen :)
<oliv3r>
lkcl: also i'd think git://github.com/linux-sunxi/cedarx-libs.git is the most recent one
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<FunkyPenguin>
has anyone been able to build a kernel for A20?
<FunkyPenguin>
i dont see a defconfig in the git tree
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<oliv3r>
FunkyPenguin: nobody has hadware yet
<oliv3r>
FunkyPenguin: This is a lie actually, hipboi has some A20 chips now that he got on a cubieboard. He has gotten our current BSP working I think, or atleast tested that the old kernel works on the new hardware
<oliv3r>
but that's all very experimental
<oliv3r>
ssvb: ping
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<oliv3r>
Turl: am I a manual spammer?! :p
<oliv3r>
i think so, but I bet that's the wrong answer ;)
<lkcl>
oliv3r: ta
<FunkyPenguin>
oliv3r: i've got an A20 box (actually got 4 of them)
<FunkyPenguin>
would it be possible to get the config from /proc on android?
<oliv3r>
lkcl: i'm documenting some findings on the wiki, i'll let you know when i'm done for the day
<oliv3r>
lkcl: note, that this is me dabbling with things i have little understanding, so forgive me on that :p
<oliv3r>
FunkyPenguin: if the stock kernel is compiled a such
<oliv3r>
FunkyPenguin: chances are, your A10 kernel wil run just fine, or near fine.
<oliv3r>
FunkyPenguin: WHERE DID YOU GET THOSE! :p we want some too :)
<oliv3r>
FunkyPenguin: linux-sunxi master is where the fun should be eventually, but we might have to port a few things first. It is assumed for now though, that sun4i works quite well on sun6i
<oliv3r>
sun7i* (sun6i = a31)
<FunkyPenguin>
ok let's see what i can get
<FunkyPenguin>
oliv3r: thanks
<mripard_>
oliv3r: the sun6i and sun7i use a different interrupt controller
<mripard_>
so I'm not sure you can just put a sun4i kernel on sun7i and expect it to work
<oliv3r>
mripard_: now we are mixing 3 things up :p
<oliv3r>
mripard_: i Made the mistake of calling sun7i, sun6i. I hopefully corrected myself
<oliv3r>
mripard_: you then said sun6i and sun7i use different interrupt controllers
<mripard_>
yes
<mripard_>
different from sun4i
<mripard_>
but sun6i and sun7i share the same one
<oliv3r>
so sun7i uses sun6i interrupt controller?
<oliv3r>
but otherwise sun7i is more closly related to sun4i
<oliv3r>
interesting
<oliv3r>
mripard_: can we use dt to 'load' the interrupt controller?
<mripard_>
well, both sun6i and sun7i no longer use the Allwinner custom interrupt controller, but the ARM one, so it's pretty standard
<mripard_>
and yes, you can get that from the DT
<mripard_>
I'm not saying it's hard
<mripard_>
I'm just saying it won't just work
<oliv3r>
mripard_: ah, okay, i thought it was a 'new' custom aw IC
<oliv3r>
mripard_: but that does mean some porting for stage 3.0 and stage 3.4 will be required for FunkyPenguin and he can't run our code just yet
<jelly-home>
oliv3r: sure, you could replace it with just the base name without the directories
<jelly-home>
oliv3r: as dlopen(3) says, If filename contains a slash ("/"), then it is interpreted as a (relative or absolute) pathname. Otherwise, the dynamic linker searches for the library as follows [...]
<mnemoc>
oliv3r:
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<oliv3r>
mnemoc: what IS the latest cedarX code, it's in our github right? empat0 forked it from our github and possibly submitted his changes (if there are any)
<ssvb>
oliv3r: hi, but I'm leaving in a few minutes, will be back in a few hours
<oliv3r>
ssvb: lol okay, i'll have my Q's ready in a few hours :p
<ssvb>
but using android libs is not going to be easy, if even possible (via lowlevel libve api)
<oliv3r>
ssvb: oh no, i was gonna ask real low level noob questions :)
<oliv3r>
ssvb: but go, don't let me hold you up :)
<mnemoc>
oliv3r: afaik linux-sunxi/cedarx-libs has the latest
<rellla>
oliv3r: do you know, why gimli, empat0 and willswang did their own cedarx implementations? would it be worth to bundle it in a way? what's the cleanest way to base on?
<oliv3r>
rellla: that's what i was gonna go ask next :p but from what I saw:
<oliv3r>
rellla: they only use libvecodec.so and didn't use all the files that come with it
<oliv3r>
rellla: empat0 i think did use ours and probably has the closest implementation of it
<oliv3r>
rellla: willis used libvecodec.so and baked some stuff around to integrate it with vlc
<oliv3r>
gimili just did some magic voodoo :p around it, but is for xbmc decoder only
<oliv3r>
so to summarize, empat0 did his changes upstream (linux-sunxi) and integrated it with xbmc; gimili uses libvecodec.so and did the integration to xbmc in secret , hence the duplication; willis integrated libvecdoec.so to vlc
<rellla>
sure? for me it looks like empat0 bases directly on the original libvecore.so and (only) uses the "orig" api and modules (vbv, fbm ...)
<rellla>
while gimli and wills did a kind of wrapper libcedarx.so for the libvecore.so and build their own api to use in xbmc and vlc.
<rellla>
also gimli did a rewrite of fbm and vbv
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<oliv3r>
rellla: exactly
<oliv3r>
emapt0 used 'ours' and pushed changes into our github
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<rellla>
wills bundled vbv_ ve_ and fbm_ modules in his libcedarx.c
<oliv3r>
rellla: I didn't do very close inspection :p
<oliv3r>
I was checking out our git and did update our wiki so far on the android lib
<oliv3r>
still working on it ;)
<rellla>
oliv3r: don't do closer inspections. just RE it ;P
<oliv3r>
rellla: lol, not technical enough Im affraid :p but i'll will put more info as I find it on the wiki
<oliv3r>
step 1 in RE is tearing it appart and documenting things anytway :p
<rellla>
pinging iainb could be useful, to ask why he was stopping his work
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<oliv3r>
rellla: yeah, ask him
<oliv3r>
no update for 9 months :(
<oliv3r>
rellla: hmm, i do notice that ianb's RE of libcedarx (open_cdxalloc) is mostly android stuff
<oliv3r>
I see adapter/avheap/ where alloc is for android, so it's quite possible that's not even needed any longer for regular linux
<rellla>
oliv3r: yes, iirc alloc isn't needed for linux anymore.
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<lunra>
Has anyone got the iptables LED interface thingy to work? I think it's pretty cool, but I can't make it work properly, led-delay keeps getting set to zero, even though I'm telling it to be 1000ms. The command I'm using is {iptables -A INPUT -p tcp -j LED --led-delay 1000 --led-trigger-id blinky} and iptables -L gives {LED tcp -- anywhere anywhere led-trigger-id:"blinky" led-delay:0ms
<lunra>
}
<lunra>
The consequence is that it's very hard to see when a packet arrives because the LED is on for the time it takes for the system to set the pin and then unset it
<lunra>
I'm on a cubieboard, but this is a software problem from what I can tell.
<oliv3r>
iptables led interface?
<lunra>
yep, iptables can set an LED whenever a packet is matched
<oliv3r>
never seen that :) I bet openwrt implements that too, you could see how they do it
<lunra>
Thanks for the pointer
<oliv3r>
otherwise, might be a bug in the led driver of course
<lunra>
Hm, I'm doing it correctly
<lunra>
Yeah. Looks like a bug in iptables or the LED driver (more likely the former). That's the problem with niche features, they break often because noone really cares.
<oliv3r>
or knows about
<oliv3r>
:p
<lunra>
true
<oliv3r>
mnemoc: was it you that mentioned that cedar access registers directly? I'm pretty sure you're right. MACC_REGS_BASE is in libcedar objects, which is the 'media ACCelerator.
<lunra>
I'll leave it running anyway, and if I somehow get a SYN flood on my external SSH port, well then I'll know because my room will suddenly be green (cubieboard LEDs are really bright!)
<lunra>
UGH
<lunra>
still can't get SL going
<lunra>
I can create a user for you on the opensim server if you want to play with that, else I'll just pack it up
<lunra>
ah wrong channel
<lunra>
(sorry folks)
<ssvb>
oliv3r: I'm back :)
<ssvb>
about the libvecore library, one of the challenges is that the ABI seems to be unstable
<libv>
i really should also mask out libve in my highlight...
<ssvb>
libv: what kind of highlight?
<libv>
libvecore triggers my libv highlight
<ssvb>
:)
<oliv3r>
ssvb: right now, i'm only documenting little things I find
<oliv3r>
ssvb: what my simple noob question was about
<oliv3r>
we currently have libvecore.a and libvecore.so
<oliv3r>
using ar we can extract libvecore.a, and get a list of object files, which where built using C files, nothing ispecial here
<oliv3r>
we can use readelf to find out what C files libvecore.so was built from and atleast compare that (did that, see wiki) :p
<oliv3r>
we can also use readelf -s to find function names etc among other thigns
<oliv3r>
with libvecore.a, or rather, the seperated modules, we know exactly which functions/objects etc belong to which objectfile and thus which C file
<oliv3r>
Now I can do readelf on libvecore.so but that just returns a messy bit.
<oliv3r>
I get all functions etc naturally, but besdies prefixes, makes it hard to compare
<oliv3r>
libv: nah, we like when you lurk/respond :)
<oliv3r>
is there a quick and easy way to remove dupes?
<oliv3r>
rellla: but that does explain why the list was twice as long :p
<oliv3r>
rellla: gonna try running that through calc then :p
<oliv3r>
rellla: btw, I diffed a grep FILE :)
<oliv3r>
there, removed dupes :)
<oliv3r>
libre calc ftw
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<oliv3r>
ssvb: which bits did you find that could be frome ffmpeg; i have looked at a few things, but found nothing yet. That said, I find it extremly hard to imagine they'd written all this themselves
<CountryGeek>
oliv3r: sorry to be so late to the game, but ... sort | uniq will remove the dups
<oliv3r>
uniq! duh, well i used calc, but i'll use that next time!
<ssvb>
oliv3r: for example 'ff_mpeg4_DCtab_chrom'
<oliv3r>
ssvb: ah yes, the ff_ prefixes you mentioned
<oliv3r>
i was dabbling around, but hadn't found that specific one
<oliv3r>
ssvb: how much do you know of gcc? What is crtstuff.c for in gcc?
<ssvb>
oliv3r: that's not code, but an array of constants, though it is very suspicious they decided to name it exactly in the same way as in ffmpeg if it is just a coincidence
<oliv3r>
ssvb: interestting, I used 'arm-pc-linux-gnueabi-readelf -W -s libvecore.so | grep FUNC | awk '{ print $8 }' | sort | uniq | grep ff_' and didn't find that one
<oliv3r>
ssvb: ahh, yeah i only focused on function names for now
<oliv3r>
well if the use a table, which is factual data? is that still a violation of the GPL?
<oliv3r>
ssvb: I do think they may have renamed functions, just in case, to obfuscate things?
<ssvb>
imho it's enough to be a circumstantial evidence, somebody might do a thorough investigation if he wants to
<oliv3r>
ssvb: well was digging through some random function names, jpeg, mjpeg etc etc
<oliv3r>
i then did some of those functions against google/git grep ffmpeg.git
<oliv3r>
ssvb: but so far found not a signle funciton name dupe
<oliv3r>
that doesn't mean anything of course
<ssvb>
what about 'ff_huff_build_tree'?
<bfree>
CountryGeek: I'm later to the game ;) sort -u
<oliv3r>
also, ff_mpeg4_DC* appears to be 'some' function? in the objdump, but is a const table in the ffmpeg source
* CountryGeek
nods
<oliv3r>
bfree: double ouch; if only I knew :p
<ssvb>
oliv3r: it's not a function, objdump is just a bit dumb, look at the byte values representing these "instructions"
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<oliv3r>
ssvb: i'm no asm guru :p
<oliv3r>
ssvb: I a readelf on the android objects, 136: 00000000 636 FUNC GLOBAL DEFAULT 52 ff_huff_build_tree
<oliv3r>
136: 00000000 636 FUNC GLOBAL DEFAULT 52 ff_huff_build_tree
<oliv3r>
ssvb: so IF they renamed everything, they may have forgotten that one, or copy pasted that one
<ssvb>
oliv3r: in any case, I'm not in favour of any GPL enforcement actions
<ssvb>
that's a way to mutually assured destruction
<ssvb>
the community still depends on the documentation, kernel sources and a bit of support from allwinner whatever insignificant it is at this point
<ssvb>
I'm not going to provide any more comments on this matter :)
<oliv3r>
ssvb: haha, i'm not gonna do anything either, but lkcl might pursuide them to release the cedarX sources :)
<oliv3r>
ssvb: heck I even mentioned to lkcl above in the log, that he best wait until some new blobs are released at the very least ;)
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<oliv3r>
ssvb: anyhow, if they have in fact use ffmpeg (huffman.c has atleast some bits) it could ease RE-ing a lot imo
<ssvb>
that's for sure
<oliv3r>
that's all I was looking at actually O: )
<oliv3r>
was seeing how hard it was to do the jpeg decoder (and encoder) via cedar
<ssvb>
oliv3r: FYI, libjpeg-turbo should already do a pretty good job
<ssvb>
enough for realtime mjpeg encoding/decoding
<oliv3r>
ssvb: but that's besides the exersize isn't it :p
<oliv3r>
jpeg is very simple compared to all the other audio and video codecs
<ssvb>
true
<oliv3r>
jpeg, mjpeg, mp3 (even if possible) then video i'd reccon
<oliv3r>
god so much to do, so little time and I get distracted by so many things that I'd want to do
<oliv3r>
I wonder how openMAX IL and DL work together. I bet you don't put entire codecs into the DL, just some generic functions you can accelerate i'd hope (dct for example) which can be used by a pletora of codecs
<oliv3r>
if only we had docs and register info for the Media Accelerator
<oliv3r>
ssvb: jpeg_dec is done with libjpeg (maybe even turbe)
<oliv3r>
turbo* allthough I serisouly doubt that
<oliv3r>
ssvb: 100% certain they're using libjpeg for it; they took the functions they needed, copy pasted them into a single file and added their own 'hal'; (libjpeg is public domain afaik so no license violation)
<oliv3r>
though I do think you have to add something to the README or some such
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<BJFreeman>
the repository is to big to download with git clone, is there another way to get a image of the respository
<mnemoc>
the not __git version might be more useful for him
<mnemoc>
even if sightly larger
<oliv3r>
the non-git version has .git removed?
<mnemoc>
it has both, .git and files
<oliv3r>
ah and __git is only the .git bit? :) e.g. 'bare' iirc
<mnemoc>
yes, and that can confuse newbies
<oliv3r>
ah
<oliv3r>
BJFreeman: yes, you may want dl the other linux-sunxi archive from the dump ;)
<oliv3r>
using
<oliv3r>
the OpenMAX logos and trademarks under a royalty-free license. The
<oliv3r>
10.000 $ for Khronos members, and 2.500 $
<oliv3r>
procedure requires a fee, that is
<oliv3r>
for non-members
<BJFreeman>
ok I have the uboot
<oliv3r>
so why would I want to be a member again?
<BJFreeman>
but only have 512 mem
<mnemoc>
oliv3r: royalty-free for those who pay the license :p
<oliv3r>
i ment more, that it's cheaper for non-members to get a sticker :p
<mnemoc>
*g*
<oliv3r>
:(
<mnemoc>
first read 10k vs 25k
<oliv3r>
but it's 10k vs 2.5k :(
<oliv3r>
sotp confusing me!
<oliv3r>
stop*
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<hno>
oliv3r, isn't that 10K unlimited license, or 2.5K per product?
<hno>
BJFreeman, which u-boot? If you are staring at the output fron the u-boot Allwinner ships in NAND then don't worry. If you are staring at output from an SD card u-boot SPL boot then you have the wrong SPL.
<ssvb>
the functions are called via these thunks, and they provide calling conventions conversion
<mnemoc>
:)
<ssvb>
that said, cedarx/libvecore even does not use any floating point arguments, so it should be a non-issue
<mnemoc>
can we use libhybris to use "system" ffmpeg instead of the gpl violating copy bundled in the .so?
<ssvb>
I don't think so
<mnemoc>
I mean, hacking that into the same glue. of LD_PRELOAD is better?
<mnemoc>
ok
<ssvb>
cedarx is likely using a heavily modified ffmpeg (with significant parts of decoding pipleine offloaded to hardware)
<mnemoc>
good point
<ssvb>
libhybris is a framework which creates an environment for transparently loading and using android libraries
<mnemoc>
it's an awesome idea
<ssvb>
so it would look like having android /system directory with some android blobs and a libvecore.so in /usr/lib, which is essentially a wrapper emulating native libvecore.so
<ssvb>
but using libhybris and android blobs under the hood
<ssvb>
mnemoc: it's not my idea, all the credit belongs to vgrade and Stskeeps :)
<mnemoc>
i mean, libhybris itself. like wine
<mnemoc>
accepting the crapness of the world instead of fighting against it
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<mnemoc>
and for us it's a decent way of using newer/better mali/cedarx libs
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<mnemoc>
is there anything in the kernel capable of "faking" the register area so we can watch what the libs do when accessing "raw" memory?
<ssvb>
I would say, there is a chance that Allwinner A10 might have another dedicated ARM core which is executing codecs code from SRAM
<libv>
ssvb: the description there sounds sane to me
<ssvb>
it is a good start for sure
<techn_>
ssvb: Imho they have ripped quite a lot from those reference decoders
<ssvb>
techn_: I don't want to know all these details
<techn_>
:)
<techn_>
but seems that blob is combination of many licenses
<oliv3r>
mnemoc: should be quite easy in kernel mode. though I don't have any real knowledge, what the IOCTL does, is a function that calls readl/writel, so you can do plenty with those arguments passed to the ioctl, before handing it over to readl and writel
<oliv3r>
mnemoc: also the raw access wasn't there in sun4i_cedar.c; i only see it in sun7i
<ssvb>
oliv3r: the memory area with cedarx hardware registers is mapped as uncached and banged from the userland
<oliv3r>
mnemoc: what reference of ffmpeg do you speak of btw? All I noticed so far, was functions probably copy pasted/renamed; i don't think it's the full ffmpeg
<ssvb>
oliv3r: if sun7i has special ioctls for this, then it is now a bit easier to trace
<ssvb>
oliv3r: if it was just a full unmodified ffmpeg, then we would have no need for this blob in the first place ;)
<techn_>
as I said earlier it contains atleast parts of ffmpeg, reference h264 encoder, reference vc1 decoder, ..
<ssvb>
oliv3r: mmap returns you a nice pointer to the memory buffer with the mapped hardware registers, and then this address is provided to the blob via "ve_get_reg_base_addr()" function
<rm>
hmmm last I heard the A10S still had issues even booting up
<rm>
with u-boot
<rm>
not via android-then-reboot
<oliv3r>
on the ML is saw its nearly solved
<oliv3r>
ssvb: yeah, but it'll mean 2 blobs to rule half :)
<ssvb>
oliv3r: as I mentioned earlier, the libve ABI seems to be unstable and has already been changing from release to release, so it might be in fact more than 2 blobs :)
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<techn_>
rm: pretty expencive nand :p
<oliv3r>
ssvb: i know, i'm just curious how they will handle that
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<ssvb>
yay! libhybris cedarx libvecore seems to work fine :)
<ssvb>
and android libs are indeed not affected by weighted P-frame prediction bug
<jelly-home>
yo dawg, lemme make a wrapper for your wrapper so you can wrap libcalls while you wrap libcalls
* ssvb
needs to clean up the code and provide some instructions
<drachensun>
lol
<drachensun>
in all seriousness though, pretty exciting stuff, I am trying to copy vgrade example work right now
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<oliv3r>
atleast that will lower the dependancy on AW to supply timly real linux decoders
<oliv3r>
other hand, it'll do the same what wine does, AW won't see reason to release normal linux decoers
<oliv3r>
libvecore*
<ssvb>
now we have a clear confirmation that the linux blob is buggy
<ssvb>
libhybris is likely to have an extra memory footprint (I have not measured this yet), this could be a good justification to ask for an updated linux blob
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<fra79Wii>
Does someone using the touchscreen experience weird behaviour at low battery?
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<fra79Wii>
It was really bad with the stock firmware (3.0.8) now it's quite fine, but I have to turn brightness to the minim an sf clock back the cpu to 1GHz to have it almost usable
<fra79Wii>
After the 15-10% of battery left
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<Undertasker>
bad voltage converter design
<Undertasker>
Additional capacitors will maybe solve this
<ssvb>
Turl: what license applies when redistributing compiled android binaries?
<ssvb>
I would like to provide a tarball with libc.so libcorkscrew.so libcutils.so libdl.so libdsyscalls.so libgccdemangle.so liblog.so libm.so libstdc++.so libutils.so libz.so Android binaries
<ssvb>
building the whole Android themselves is not for the faint hearted end users :)
<oliv3r>
ssvb: I suppose if your intentions are clea[rn] it should be fine, make sure you have a README with a link to your site that has full building instructions?
<oliv3r>
if you add git hashes it should be better
<ssvb>
I don't know much about android, but this beast took half a day to download and several hours to build
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<ssvb>
rellla: great :)
<rellla>
so in our cedar source, it is already included.
<rellla>
thats what i meant, with "there are too many different versions or implementations on the way"
<rellla>
don't know whats the newest or more complete or which one belongs to which blob...
<Turl>
ssvb: they're under apache2 iirc, so that's it
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<drachensun>
vgrade or any one else familiar with mer, should I just use xorg-launch-helper to launch X under mer?
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<Turl>
ssvb: I'd worry more about redistributing cedar tbh :)
<ssvb>
Turl: thanks
<ssvb>
Turl: I'm not going to redistribute cedar :)
<rellla>
ssvb: iirc willswang first was using the armel blob for his libcedarx, and in armel-libve.h they aren't included.
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<rellla>
so he probably missed updating his files
<ssvb>
rellla: I spotted 3 types of ABI for cedar blobs, but fortunately the blobs from jellybean have the same ABI as the buggy armhf linux library currently in use
<rellla>
good for us
<fra79Wii>
Damn android irc has lost the connection and the log while interesting topics are on plate...
<fra79Wii>
Since you were talking about it I've seen the libvecore.a and libcedarx for android...
<fra79Wii>
For what purpose would be use that lib in android... I'm struggling to port cedarX to 4.2...I have to know all the possible use of cedarx..
<fra79Wii>
Available code...
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<oliv3r>
fra79Wii: all you can do is pray
<fra79Wii>
Yes..that allwinner release the damn sdk...
<fra79Wii>
I manage to make camera almost work with older blob
<fra79Wii>
But it's an awfull hack
<oliv3r>
fra79Wii: offer them lots of money for cedarX sources ;)
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<drachensun>
you would be surprised how hard it is to get them to take your money sometimes
<rellla>
oliv3r: there is only one guy, that knows that they may have sources at least. so first find him :p
<fra79Wii>
I was thinking to use that lib-cedarx for android into the android ffmpeg..somehow...
<fra79Wii>
I was so glad one year ago when I saw beginning of rev-engineering..
<CyberPK>
vinifm: No it isnt't!
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<CyberPK>
my device is a generic csr 0a12:0001
<oliv3r>
rellla: yeah, 1 dev, who probably doesnt care anymore :)
<fra79Wii>
rella: who is the guy??
<rellla>
*PROBLEM*
<vinifm>
CyberPK, it is in black_list :(
<CyberPK>
why???? :(
<CyberPK>
what it mean that is in blacklist? :(
<rellla>
i'll check my mail tomorrow, maybe allwinner answered \o/ <- joke
<rellla>
fra79wii: don't know. mnemoc said (was it mnemoc?) they had/have exactly 1 guy who has access to cedarx sources. and that one wasn't the best friend of tom ;)
<fra79Wii>
I mean cedarX is present in all allwinner chip. They have only to win on rekesing the sources...
<rellla>
they probably don't want to let other people dig into the sources ... btw. what i a license?
<fra79Wii>
A10 is almost compleyely open...if you compare to raspberry pi it's better, it would be even better with an open vpu
<rellla>
fullack
<rellla>
tell it allwinner!
<Undertasker>
They don't care, becasue their main business are cheap android devices, not linux
<fra79Wii>
...waiting for lima to be ready... The vpu would be the only thing remaing close...
<oliv3r>
A10 is still miles better then Rpi
<fra79Wii>
Undertasker: but even in Android the openess is a good thing.
<oliv3r>
you can boot and use A10 an A10 fully (except for GPU and VPU) and with limare/lima even WITH gpu
<oliv3r>
rpi you cant even boot gpl
<oliv3r>
vpu will be RE-able easly
<oliv3r>
just requires a lot of knowledge and work
<Undertasker>
Allwinners customers also don't care, because they only want a working Android, so why should Allwinner invest any time?
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<oliv3r>
well working android still requires a linux GPL kernel :)
<Undertasker>
As if they would care about this in China
<oliv3r>
AW actually is reasonably GPL compliant
<oliv3r>
they even leaked their entire git tree + history
<fra79Wii>
Sllwinner tabs are not so cheep anymore though... All the hw have gone cheap now
<oliv3r>
A20 will be nice
<fra79Wii>
Allwinner..sorry...the complete openess would attract more people to trust and buy...
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<Undertasker>
Always the same game. When all the information is leaked or reverse engineered, that hardware is obsolete
<fra79Wii>
oliv3r: yes I hope would be possible to swap the SoC. I'm looking forward for A20 for months
<Undertasker>
cubieboards should be available soon
<oliv3r>
fra79Wii: FunkyPenguin actually has 4 A20 based boards :)
<oliv3r>
Undertasker: yes, but in this case, the A20 is very similar to the A10
<oliv3r>
and the code has been leaked for those aswell
<oliv3r>
so once we have hardware, we'll have the same level of support for A20, that we have for A10 now
<oliv3r>
and A20 isn't even easly avialable
<oliv3r>
A40 will hopefully be also quite similar *pray*
<fra79Wii>
Wow..would be quad A7 with mali?
<oliv3r>
fra79Wii: we are hoping :p, praying even
<oliv3r>
we guess it may be single or dual A7, quad A16
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<oliv3r>
hmm, interesting, looks like all libs put their data directly in the sram for processing
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<fra79Wii>
But A7 is more performing than A8?
<fra79Wii>
More power efficient for sure...but st same clock are almost the same?
<fra79Wii>
I thought for some reason that cortex A7X2 was slightly better/if not the same than cortex A8