Topic for #ruby is now Ruby programming language || ruby-lang.org || RUBY SUMMER OF CODE! rubysoc.org/ || Paste >3 lines of text in http://pastie.org || Para a nossa audiencia em portugues http://ruby-br.org/
<swarley>
sorry, typing with the keyboard at a 45 degree angle is awkward
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<swarley>
and i know
<apeiros_>
(you can have the latter too, see scriptfile on github - I should wrap that thing up as a gem…)
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<apeiros_>
swarley: I try not to imagine what you're doing…
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<swarley>
Lol, just sitting with my knee up >.>
<RubyPanther>
__DATA__ is Perl
<swarley>
my favorite thing from C that ive done has been ERROR(__LINE__, __FILE__)
<swarley>
Error on line 43 in lol.c!
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<seanstickle>
I think we've established that my use of italics was poorly chosen.
<Whizzy>
Hello. May I ask what the language ruby was designed to be used for?
<swarley>
Whizzy, general use, object orientation
<banisterfiend>
apeiros_: can u ban RubyPanther for life from #ruby
<apeiros_>
swarley: did something similar, but used printf and added a message
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<seanstickle>
Whizzy: for programmer delight.
<apeiros_>
banisterfiend: I can. but so far he didn't give enough reason. he's close, tho
<seanstickle>
Whizzy: what kind of answer are you expecting?
<swarley>
apeiros_, i was making a kernel with my friend, when i got printf, and sprintf to work as they should in the stdlib, i near died of excitement
<apeiros_>
manhunter: yes, and C is interpreted with Cint
<apeiros_>
as said, a property of the tools, not the language.
<swarley>
any language can be either. depends on the implementation
<Whizzy>
lol thank you swarley... Let me put this another way...
<manhunter>
apeiros_: is it optional to use compiler or interpreter?
<apeiros_>
manhunter: you may want to fire up a browser, point it to wikipedia and start reading first.
<apeiros_>
or you could go to a CS course…
<swarley>
for example haskell has ghc as well as runhaskell (i think is interpreted, but i may be wrong)
<manhunter>
is ruby functional programming language?
<seanstickle>
Or you could just say, yes, Ruby is typically interpreted, but there are compilers for it.
<hron84>
manhunter: programming languages are not compiled. Source files are compiled. For programming languages you can write interpreter and compiler too. For example, for ruby, there is an interpreter, and a compuliler (jrubyc, rubinius/rbx) too. So it is highly depends on what do you want to do.
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<apeiros_>
manhunter: srsly, did you try doing some research on your own for like 5 minutes before asking here?
<RubyPanther>
MRI is written in C, you could say that Ruby "is" just a C library/DSL
<hron84>
RubyPanther: python too :-)
<seanstickle>
Suddenly everyone is a denotational semantics professor.
<manhunter>
apeiros_: i read the wikipedia page for ruby
<apeiros_>
I think I better get off irc… either people today are incredibly annoying or I'm just easy to be pissed off atm…
<Whizzy>
I was challenged by a friend that I could not write a full blown (zork style) text adventure within a year. Now I need to shut his mouth, and prove him wrong. (Taking his money is just the icing on the cake)
<seanstickle>
apeiros_: a bit from column A, a bit from column B
<Whizzy>
Now... Let me ask
<RubyPanther>
rb_funcall(rb_mKernel,rb_intern("puts"), 1, rb_str_new2("Compiled or interpreted???"));
<Whizzy>
What language is best suited for games, such as text adventures.
<RubyPanther>
take two chill pills and call somebody in the morning
<apeiros_>
seanstickle: prolly
<apeiros_>
Whizzy: ruby is certainly a good choice for that
<manhunter>
apeiros_: yes, source code is writen in any programming language
<hron84>
manhunter: pay more five minutes to research about it. for example, take look http://www.ruby-lang.org/en/
<apeiros_>
Whizzy: depending on your prior level of knowledge you can pick up ruby in anything between a day and a couple of weeks
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<seanstickle>
Whizzy: IFMML
<seanstickle>
IFML, sorry
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<Whizzy>
apeiros... No disrespect. I mean no ill manners towards you... But I'm in IRC asking whay the language was developed. Do you really think I have a level of knowledge? lol
<seanstickle>
Whizzy: most questions or origin do not have simple answers
<apeiros_>
Whizzy: then obviously it'd be more in the "couple of weeks" region…
<RubyPanther>
Whizzy: Ruby exists to make programmers happier
<seanstickle>
or -> of
<Whizzy>
Sorry Sean... IFMML ?
<seanstickle>
Whizzy: Interactive Fiction Markup Language
<apeiros_>
Whizzy: also, you can have a background other than programming which is still helpful for picking up ruby quickly.
<Whizzy>
Really?
<RubyPanther>
Most languages exist to make the math geeks happier, to make the linguists happier, or to make the CPU happier.
<Whizzy>
Didn't think of that... Well, I am a professional fund raiser... So nothing i do would help me there
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<seanstickle>
I was a professional nuclear reactor operator.
<seanstickle>
It takes all kinds.
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<sroy2>
Whizzy: just for future knowledge… I've found wikipedia is a great place to look up answers to questions like that...
<Whizzy>
Nuclear reactor operator? Why? Why would you do that?
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<seanstickle>
Whizzy: they paid me.
<RubyPanther>
That was before the accident. It caused a mutation. Now he zaps software bugs with xray beams from his eyes. It is his mutant power.
<Whizzy>
>Sroy Yeah, but when you want to know whats going on, I find that talking to the people that do it, day in and day out works best.
<burgestrand>
See, your background is helping you already.
<seanstickle>
Now you can write a fundraising system in Ruby
<Whizzy>
seanstickle Could never pay me enough to do that.
<banisterfiend>
seanstickle: kinda like homer simpson? :P
<Whizzy>
I don't need a fund raising system in ruby.
<Whizzy>
lol
<seanstickle>
Most of the fundraising systems I've worked with suck
<seanstickle>
Raiser's Edge, yuck.
<Whizzy>
That's becuase the fund raisers suck
<banisterfiend>
burgestrand: sup burg dogg
<burgestrand>
banisterfiend: \o,
<seanstickle>
Whizzy: perhaps you should stop doing it.
<seanstickle>
Whizzy: doesn't sound like you are very happy with that line of work.
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<banisterfiend>
fowl: what's up dogg
<Whizzy>
Are you kidding? I work three months out of the year, and spend the other 9 with my baby blowing money...
<seanstickle>
You get a percent of the spend?
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<Whizzy>
I get $3.00 an item. Now, I have 12 schools in my city, with a total of 20000 salesmen, er... I mean students...
<Whizzy>
Each of them sale (on average 15 items each)
<apeiros_>
get yourself a private ruby teacher then
<Whizzy>
Nah... I can teach myself, or I don't deserve to win the bet.
<apeiros_>
isn't using irc cheating then?
<fowl>
whats this a dick measuring contest? i own hundreds of women and much land in south america. i own a yacht with a swimming pool in it, fuck with me.
<apeiros_>
I mean, where's the line?
<fowl>
i'm ballin out the chain
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<Whizzy>
Not to research the languages, and see which I want to use... Why would that be cheating?
<apeiros_>
*shrug*, your and your friend's rules. it's not as if I cared.
<seanstickle>
They used thalidomide in hospitals too.
<Whizzy>
Thanks all for the chat. Good day..
<fowl>
yeah yeah
<apeiros_>
seanstickle: why :( ?
<fowl>
go get your attention somewhere else, LOL
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<burgestrand>
This’ll probably only be fun for a few minutes, unlike kittens
<apeiros_>
burgestrand: yeah, superhydrophobics are awesome. seen that very vid a while ago
<burgestrand>
hehe
<burgestrand>
Would be awfully annoying on clothing though, sure enough it keeps liquid out, but I’d assume it also keeps it in, and we aren’t the most dry creatures, to say the least
* burgestrand
shrugs
<burgestrand>
Also, DNA-sequencers on USB sticks that can sequence your whole genome in 2 hours, also kind of cool
<fowl>
burgestrand enjoy it while it's optional
<burgestrand>
fowl: what makes you think it is?
<burgestrand>
;)
<apeiros_>
burgestrand: so… you use that on all your dates or sth? :)
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<seanstickle>
I remember an old sci-fi story about applying superhydrophobic material to the front of a boat.
<burgestrand>
Oh, wow, that’d be an awkard moment
<seanstickle>
Pulls the boat through the water, making cheap transportation.
<burgestrand>
seanstickle: !
<burgestrand>
seanstickle: awesome!
<burgestrand>
Also, put it on a wakeboard.
<apeiros_>
I'd assume that pressure changes some properties of superhydrophobics
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<burgestrand>
Yeah, probably, it would still be kind of cool with a hoverboard for water.
<seanstickle>
Reactionless drives are the future anyways.
<apeiros_>
I'd also assume that challenges like americas cup - where the boats use quite high-tech stuff - would experiment with such things
<swarley>
randomly takes words in messages and changes them to butt
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<swarley>
expanding the amount of u s as needed to fill the length of the word
<jsvana>
Given a hash with element :foo, how would I check if :foo is in an array, e.g., foo: [1, 2, 3, 4]
<jsvana>
?
<swarley>
if hash[:foo].class == Array
<fowl>
somehash.keys.include? :foo
<swarley>
oh
<swarley>
is in an array
* apeiros_
smacks fowl
<fowl>
oh
<swarley>
i dont think there is a way to tell if an object is nested
<apeiros_>
.keys.include? is so insanely stupid…
<fowl>
haha
<swarley>
apeiros_, what would you do instead in a situation that would use .keys.include?
<fowl>
apeiros_ papyrus is regressing my mind
<apeiros_>
swarley: .keys.include? is a very expensive way to say .has_key?
<jsvana>
swarley: so, no way to do it?
<swarley>
oh, i need to read more rdocs
<swarley>
jsvana, i dont believe so. but as you just saw, im not 100% sure of everything ;)
<apeiros_>
swarley: .has_key? is O(1), which means that no matter how large your hash is, the time needed by it is (almost) constant
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<swarley>
i see
<fowl>
jsvana so you have this hash like { :foo => something } and you want to see if :foo is in any array?
<bonhoffer>
any idea how to test a full match with regex -- i want to make sure the whole string matches
<fowl>
or some_array
<apeiros_>
swarley: .keys.include? however is a) O(n), which means the larger the hash, the more time is needed, and b) has also a higher constant cost as it needs to create an array first.
<jsvana>
fowl: yep. { :foo => [1, 2, 3, 4] }
<fowl>
some_array.include?(:foo), since you know what you're looking for?
<jsvana>
well, no
<bonhoffer>
"1111a".match(/\d/) => false
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<jsvana>
foo just needs to match a number from that.
<apeiros_>
bonhoffer: see anchors
<apeiros_>
bonhoffer: you want /\A\d\z/
<swarley>
jsvana, can we see a code snippit?
<bonhoffer>
of course
<fowl>
:foo is never going to match a number
<bonhoffer>
or ^ $ in ruby too, right?
<apeiros_>
notice however that that will only match a string containing a single digit. probably you want \d+ too
<fowl>
>_>
<apeiros_>
bonhoffer: no
<bonhoffer>
oh, good to know, thanks
<apeiros_>
bonhoffer: ^$ are start/end of *line*, \A\z are start/end of *string*
<apeiros_>
"123\nfoobar" =~ /^\d+$/ # matches
<swarley>
/^\d+\w$/ would match it
<bonhoffer>
i see
<swarley>
i believe
<swarley>
but \w is just the a
<apeiros_>
"123\nfoobar" =~ /\A\d+\z/ # does not match
<bonhoffer>
in particular, i'm trying to match 10/10/12 but not 10//10/12 or any characters 10/a/10
<swarley>
oh
<apeiros_>
just anchor your expression then.
<bonhoffer>
this has to run without error score.split("/").collect { |a| a.to_f }.sum
<swarley>
/^\d+\/\d+\/d+$/ is what i would do. but maybe i dont understand what youre doing
<apeiros_>
.inject(:+) { |s,a| s+a.to_f }
<bonhoffer>
i will anchor the expression
<apeiros_>
also, to_f doesn't raise with non-numerics.
<jsvana>
bonhoffer: /^\d{2}\/\d{2}\/\d{2}$/
<bonhoffer>
apeiros_, nice . . .
<apeiros_>
jsvana: you just failed anchoring
<jsvana>
apeiros_: oh?
<apeiros_>
jsvana: see what I wrote above about ^$ vs. \A\z
<fowl>
/..!..(0_o
<bonhoffer>
sorry i want any size: 10/10/28/28/281/128
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<bonhoffer>
but _not_ 10//10 -- testing in rubular -- it is tough
<apeiros_>
bonhoffer: also, why to_f if you only have ints?
<bonhoffer>
apeiros_, i really want to read up on your inject
<jsvana>
/\A(\d+\/)+\z/
<swarley>
bonhoffer, /\A(\d+ | \d+\/)+\z/
<swarley>
- ' '
* apeiros_
is nice today… /\A\d+(?:\/\d+)*\z/
<bonhoffer>
wow
<bonhoffer>
both -- swarley i understand yours
<apeiros_>
unless an empty string is valid too… my expression requires at least one value
<bonhoffer>
apeiros_, perfect -- it is ?: that is new to me
<apeiros_>
bonhoffer: it means "don't capture"
<apeiros_>
otherwise it's normal grouping
<apeiros_>
captures are the things that end up in $1-$9
<swarley>
/^(.+?)$/; $1
<swarley>
i wish ruby had sub and translate built into the regex like s/// and tr///
<swarley>
not really needed, but i liked it
<apeiros_>
swarley: String#gsub and String#tr
<swarley>
Yes i know
<fowl>
thats just extra gobbledeegook
<swarley>
I just like using it in the way i do with perl
<fowl>
you'll grow to appreciate it not muddying things up
<apeiros_>
swarley: actually I don't
<apeiros_>
and I did perl quite a bit
<swarley>
I would understand why you wouldnt
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<apeiros_>
it's IMO pretty clean the way ruby does it
<swarley>
it is more verbose (appearance wise) to use String#sub
<fowl>
ruby hates sandwiches. no subs. only def people.
<DylanJ>
i have a string "R\xC1T\xCDA\xCE-\x10MS\x11" which "apparently" is the equivlent of "RATMAN-[MS]" How on earth can i display the first string like the second?
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<kenneth>
i barely remember my high school calculus class, much less how to solve it procedurally :p i know d/dx represents the slope of the tangent (rate of change) of my function (lambda) at point x
<fowl>
kenneth in ruby remember to use parentheses with your math
<fowl>
overdo it
<kenneth>
right d/(dx)
<kenneth>
etc
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<kenneth>
ugh it's coming back to me
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<kenneth>
so if i recall correctly i need to evaluate limit[h:0, (my_lambda(h+a)-my_lambda(a))/h]
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<kenneth>
so basically, my question is how to evaluate a limit in ruby?
<fowl>
sorry kenneth your question crosses into the realm of reasons i didnt take calculus. math is an art best left to those Collegiate Wizards
<kenneth>
haha
<kenneth>
well this is the part where i regret skipping CS :p
<startling>
kenneth: there's a #calculus, funnily enough.
<kenneth>
yeah seanstickle i found this article, and his solution doesn't find the limit, just an infinitely close value
<seanstickle>
kenneth: actually, not even infinitely close
<seanstickle>
kenneth: you could always implement a ruby gem that does nonstandard analysis
<seanstickle>
kenneth: that would avoid the need for limits
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<Arkaniad>
Anyone here able to help me with some Capistrano issues?
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<spligak>
Is there any sort of style preference in the ruby community for do; end blocks or {} blocks? Is it usually to use {}'s for one-liners where possible?
<fowl>
and i'm not saying you should just because I do, but keep in mind that around here I'm considered a pretty cool dude.
<manhunter>
can anyone answer my question? is ruby a procedural language?
<banisterfiend>
manhunter: NO it's not
<manhunter>
banisterfiend: why not?
<manhunter>
banisterfiend: give one reason
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<fowl>
yeah banisterfiend prove it liar
<banisterfiend>
manhunter: because you can program in almost every paradigm in most programmign languages, you can even program OOP in C. Yet no one calls C an object oriented language. The point is what is the emphasis of the language, what style does the programming language want you to program in? what is idiomatic for that language, what was that lanauge designed for?
<banisterfiend>
manhunter: and ruby was not designed to be a procedural language, it was designed to be an object oriented language
<banisterfiend>
so to ask if it IS a procedural programming language the answer is no - because that's not what it was designed for
<banisterfiend>
however if you ask instead 'can you program a procedural style in ruby?' teh answer is yes
<banisterfiend>
just as you can program an OOP style in C, or even a functional style in C (if u try hard enough)
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<manhunter>
banisterfiend: ok, thank you
<startling>
functional in C would be pretty hard, yeah.
<manhunter>
can anyone answer my question? is ruby a functional language?
<fowl>
hory shit
<startling>
btw, this guy is banned in all the #python-* channels. we can't tell if he's a troll or not.
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<fowl>
startling: nice try Snake-Friend, but you just gave yourself up. we don't abide Guido's kin in this channel
<startling>
heh.
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<manhunter>
procedural langauge means it executes code step by step or line by line, right?
<fowl>
manhunter nope
<td123>
manhunter: ruby has some functional elements, but you can't classify it as a functional language
<kenneth>
the longest i've ever spent working on a 60 line script
<kenneth>
:p
<banisterfiend>
kenneth: dr kenneth noisewater?
<kenneth>
critique my code please!
<kenneth>
banisterfiend: hmm? what is that
<td123>
kenneth: now write an algorithm that will learn the xor function :)
<fowl>
kenneth can i just edit it from gist
<kenneth>
fowl: yea
<fowl>
oh wait im not sure you can do that anymore i dont see the edit button
<kenneth>
you should be able to
<kenneth>
hmm
<fowl>
oh nvm found it
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<manhunter>
td123: what is functional language then?
<banisterfiend>
kenneth: I know what you're asking yourself and the answer is yes. I have a nick name for my penis. Its called the Octagon, but I also nick named my testes - my left one is James Westfall and my right one is Dr. Kenneth Noisewater. You ladies play your cards right you just might get to meet the whole gang."
<kenneth>
looool
<manhunter>
fuck l0000l
<td123>
troll alert
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<td123>
lol..
<kenneth>
i might have to rewrite this in lisp anyway
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<kenneth>
because say i want to move something like this to production, i will probably have to pre-generate the solution lambdas and store them somewhere, for scalability
<kenneth>
because running this super simple script takes 50ms on my laptop
<td123>
kenneth: or you can use already existing libs ;)
<fowl>
kenneth i just changed your while true block into until good
<fowl>
good = false; until good that is
<kenneth>
i wish ruby would let you treat code as data
<kenneth>
i have a bunch of use cases where serializing a lambda would be oh-so-awesome
<kenneth>
td123: got any to name-drop?
<kenneth>
fowl: sweet, didn't know about until
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<td123>
I don't do any math related work on ruby so dunno, but any machine learning library will surely have something
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<fowl>
you can also use it postfix too, if you can find a use for it
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<vikingly>
Hi! I have a group of Ruby classes that conceptually belongs together. Is it recommended to create a module for these classes?
<seanstickle>
Yes.
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<vikingly>
Is there a best practice for naming modules? The main concept is defined in one class, e.g Event, and the others classes are used by that class. Should the Module also be called Event?
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<DylanJ>
how can i make "\xFF" spit out 255?
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<DylanJ>
"\xFF".magic => 255
<banisterfiend>
vikingly: what module, you mean the enclosing module for your project?
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<vikingly>
banisterfiend: Not for the whole project. I'd like to group models in rails that conceptually belong together into modules.
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<banisterfiend>
vikingly: ask on a rails channel, i think they have their own idioms
<vikingly>
banisterfiend: is there a ruby best practice? The rails convention is that a class SomeClass in SomeModule is defined in 'app/models/some_module/some_class.rb'.
<banisterfiend>
vikingly: i guess that's what i do in pure ruby too
<banisterfiend>
without being consciously aware of it
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<vikingly>
banisterfield: Thanks.
<banisterfiend>
no problem
<vikingly>
One of the classes is always the main concept in my case. I want to name the module MainModuleName=MainClass+postfix. Any suggestion to what the postfix should be?
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<DylanJ>
how can i make "\xFF" spit out 255? "\xFF" => 255 ?
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<DylanJ>
"\xFF
<DylanJ>
"\xFF".bytes.to_a <--
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<spligak>
How would I go about writing a function which yields a character in a continuous rotation? Given "aeiou" the first time I'd call func() it would yield "a" then the second time, "e" and so on. Once we got to the end, it would repeat.
<spligak>
I'm fiddling with str.split(//).rotate - but I think there's an easier way
<TheMystic>
banisterfiend: but even so, rspec contains its monkeypatching in its own execution context. it doesn't globally monkeypatch everything to add #should
<swarley>
well you would need to do math to make sure you are supplying enough letters as you are taking
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<rippa>
you can just use #cyce without arguments
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<rippa>
that gives you endless numbers
<TheMystic>
banisterfiend: yes, but only in your test suite, because you `require 'rspec'`
<TheMystic>
and even that is pretty horrible, because then all code running within your test suite is different from that running in your dev environment.
<TheMystic>
rippa: just don't call #to_a on it :)
<banisterfiend>
TheMystic: that was what i said, if the monkeypatch is confined to development or debugging context it's not so bad.
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<TheMystic>
it's still pretty bad. especially for a test harness, where you really really want your code to behave the same as in production.
<rippa>
I want some way to monkeypatch stuff because it makes it easy to use, but contain it so it doesn't fuck things up
<rippa>
like some kind of tag
<TheMystic>
rippa: ISTR matz working on something for that
<rippa>
=MONKEYS
<rippa>
good to hear
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<swarley>
sometimes i think
<spligak>
So I guess here's where the application of our string rotation comes into play.
<swarley>
i want to filter ruby like you can filter perl
<swarley>
and then i get mad at myself
<swarley>
and tell myself i need to die in a hole
<swarley>
because thats a dumb idea
<spligak>
I'm looking to substitute vowels in a string - say, "school" would become "schaal" and "schael" etc, through all permutations.
<spligak>
The vowel positions are known, and are currently stored in an array - this case I guess would be [3,4] right?
<spligak>
So assuming we can easily rotate over a string of vowels, trying to determine how to use that to generate all these iterations.
<spligak>
haven't quite figured out a way to use that here.
<TheMystic>
well, here's conceptually what you're doing: generating all the permutations of length n of the five vowels (presuming only English text), where n is the number of vowels in the string.
<TheMystic>
once you've done that, you can substitute the vowels into the string in the right places.
<rippa>
%w<a e o i u>.permutation(2)
<spligak>
Gah! It completely slipped my mind permutation takes a number like that.
<swarley>
but using it or not depends on your method anyway
<swarley>
use it or dont, im just killing time ;)
<TheMystic>
huh, i didn't know there was a #permutation method :)
<spligak>
TheMystic: it's pretty awesome. used it earlier for reducing duplicates in every possible way.
<spligak>
where n-chords would need to stay intact, right? so "ssschoolll" you'd want to reduce in such a way to where you do get "oo" in a version without having to have a predefined set of chords.
<TheMystic>
...but #permutation is permutations without repetition.
<TheMystic>
which is not what you want here.
<swarley>
holy jesus
<swarley>
i didnt know
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<swarley>
{a: "foo"} # => {:a=>"foo"}
<swarley>
how was i unaware
<swarley>
that i dont need a json lib
<TheMystic>
swarley: oh but you still do. don't you dare go around #eval'ing JSON.
<swarley>
xD
<spligak>
swarley: I'll second that. /stare
<TheMystic>
that kind of coding will earn you one free kick to the harblz.
<swarley>
i would have just had an external file and done load 'conf/conf.json'
<swarley>
lol
<swarley>
i wouldnt eval an entire json file
<TheMystic>
besides, you can just suck in JSON with psych (or syck), right?
<swarley>
i didnt know that
<swarley>
i thought it only handled YAML
<TheMystic>
(because JSON is a strict subset of YAML)
<swarley>
btw
<spligak>
TheMystic: you are correct, sir. Any idea as to how I could get .permutations to include dupes like "[a, a]" ?
<swarley>
why do yaml files begin with ---
<TheMystic>
spligak: was looking for that -- not sure
<TheMystic>
swarley: because that's what delimits a yaml 'document', and you can have multiple documents per file
<swarley>
ah
<spligak>
by including each vowel twice, looks like. eek.
* TheMystic
<-- way more versed in the vagaries of yaml than necessary
<spligak>
%w<a a e i o u>.permutation(2).each
<spligak>
that seems horrific, though.
<spligak>
easy, but just not clean.
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<spligak>
actually, that's going to produce too much useless stuff, anyway -- dupes of a whole bunch of pairs, obviously.
<TheMystic>
.sort.uniq
<swarley>
^
<TheMystic>
but i don't think it actually works
<spligak>
worth the cost for simplicity, you think?
<spligak>
well, it returns an enumerable
<swarley>
what
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<spligak>
permutation does, right?
<swarley>
oh
<spligak>
so you'd have to consume that and then .uniq
<swarley>
i wasnt paying attention to know whats going on with that
<TheMystic>
well, you have to include n copies of each vowel for #permutation(n)
<TheMystic>
spligak: oh, that's just to indicate that you can take #product of an array with itself as many times as you need.
<swarley>
That would kill my computer
<TheMystic>
the number of times you do it == the number of chars in the resulting arrays.
<spligak>
so how would you call that with a variable, say?
<TheMystic>
a = str.split(//); a.product(a, a) # where r = 2
<TheMystic>
a = "aeiou".split(//); a.product(*(a * r))
<TheMystic>
more generally, for any r
<TheMystic>
in your case, where r == the number of vowels in the string
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<spligak>
right - now usage makes sense. just uncomfortable with the splat syntax
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<spligak>
TheMystic: when using your latest version, I'm getting "can't convert String into Array" for some reason?
<spligak>
On this bit: a.product(*(a * r))
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<TheMystic>
oh, i see why.
<TheMystic>
a = "aeiou".split(//); a.product(*([a] * r))
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<TheMystic>
to get r copies of the array instead of an array with r repetitions of the *elements* in a
<TheMystic>
oh, actually, it should be:
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<TheMystic>
a = "aeiou".split(//); a.product(*([a] * (r - 1)))
<spligak>
That's so much faster it's laughable.
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<TheMystic>
it still doesn't take much to break malloc() with that though
<TheMystic>
anyway, bedtime.
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<juanojeda>
hi guys, i have a bit of a novice question
<juanojeda>
i'm trying to set up guard-livereload and it requires devkit, but whenever i try to install the gem it spits out a bunch of errors and won't install
<Divinite>
Anyone know where I can learn about how to use EventMachine for a telnet server?
<seanstickle>
Build an icapd server instead.
<Divinite>
Sorry, I don't know what that is. What is it?
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<Divinite>
seanstickle: What's an icapd server?
<seanstickle>
Sorry, that was just me hoping for one.
<seanstickle>
It's a sort of calendar server.
<Divinite>
Oh, well that's not my aim lol. But do you know where I can learn to use it? I've been using gserver for prototyping.
<fighella>
can anyone help out with a quick pry question… (how do i save changes to a record… simple i thought)
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<banisterfiend>
fighella: what is meant be record
<banisterfiend>
by*
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<banisterfiend>
fighella: ?
<fighella>
err sorry (bit of a noob) but basically Class is Book, the first "book" in my database i am calling the record… so i change the title of the Book.first using pry… and then want to save my change….
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<Divinite>
banisterfiend: fighella is calling you.
<fighella>
banisterfiend: err sorry (bit of a noob) but basically Class is Book, the first "book" in my database i am calling the record… so i change the title of the Book.first using pry… and then want to save my change….
<banisterfiend>
fighella: save it to where?
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<fighella>
banisterfiend: it's already in my database… i want to save the change… or update the record
<banisterfiend>
fighella: well there must be a method on the object that lets you do that
<banisterfiend>
it's not a pry issue afaik
<banisterfiend>
fighella: maybe ask in #rails
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<fighella>
banisterfiend: haha i did, they sent me here! :) thanks for your help tho… i will find the method… (i think it must just differentiate a bit to the way i do it in regular rails console) thank you tho! much appreciated
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<_ramo>
hi
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<Divinite>
banisterfiend: What should I use to make a telnet server? I'm hosting a Hackathon @ my school soon.
<banisterfiend>
fighella: how do you do it in the regular rails console?
<_ramo>
I'm trying to install http://capifony.org/ on my server... somehow, gem install capifony runs without error, but when i try to do a "capifony ." the console says: capifony: command not found . does anyone know what's going wrong here?
<banisterfiend>
fighella: btw u dont have to 'cd' in pry if u dont want to, u could type exzctly what u typed in rails console and it will work in pry too
<banisterfiend>
fighella: 'cd' is just a convenience, u dont *have* to use it:)
<Divinite>
Is anyone else here??
<banisterfiend>
fighella: i tihnk your issue though is that when you simply go 'name = 'new name'' you are just deifning a local
<apeiros_>
no
<rabbitear>
Divinite: you mean besides bots?
<fighella>
banisterfiend: aaahh that'd be ittt
<fighella>
durrgggh
<fighella>
thanksS! :)
<banisterfiend>
fighella: np
<banisterfiend>
fighella: works now?
<fighella>
let me have a look (feed a screaming baby) and get back to you
<fighella>
thanksss
<Divinite>
Well, rabbitear and apeiros_ hello there
<banisterfiend>
oh o
<banisterfiend>
ok
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<apeiros_>
Divinite: I'm not here
<rabbitear>
hello there too
<Divinite>
Can you guys help me?
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<rabbitear>
you've fallen and we should call the cops?
<apeiros_>
Divinite: with?
<Divinite>
I'm wondering what to use for a telnet server. I was thinking EventMachine.
<apeiros_>
Divinite: new to ruby?
<Divinite>
What's your opinion.
<Divinite>
Yes
<apeiros_>
start with a simpler way then. see TCPServer
<rabbitear>
telnet server in linux?
<Divinite>
Like 3-4 day
<canton7>
eventmachine works great for that sort of thing... Though there might be something beter
<banisterfiend>
Divinite: eventmachine may be overkill
<rabbitear>
one second, brb
<Divinite>
Alright.
<fighella>
banisterfiend: screaming averted… hah.. lets try this
<apeiros_>
Divinite: it's like a 10 liner with TCPServer (require 'socket' to get TCPServer, it's part of stdlib and hence comes with ruby)
<Divinite>
Does it have an "input" handler?
<apeiros_>
well, 10 liner for a somewhat working telnet-server :)
<canton7>
hwo easy is it to do multiple simultaneous connections with TCPServer?
<canton7>
s/hwo/how
<apeiros_>
canton7: as easy as any concurrent programming
<apeiros_>
you can use either threads or Kernel#select + non-blocking
<Divinite>
I was using gserver.
<apeiros_>
hm, I never really got the appeal of gserver.
<apeiros_>
then again, I never really tried.
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<Divinite>
But everyone doesnt like it. I find it really easy.
<Divinite>
But I'm a noob so yeah.
<Divinite>
*at Ruby.
<fighella>
banisterfiend: that was right… thanks a million
<Divinite>
I need to make an input and reply to it.
<banisterfiend>
fighella: np
<Divinite>
apeiros_: So how would it grab input?
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<apeiros_>
Divinite: server = TCPServer.new(host, port); client = server.accept
<apeiros_>
client is a TCPSocket, you can perform normal IO operations on it, like IO#gets etc.
<apeiros_>
note, you probably want "0.0.0.0" as host. that's the instruction to bind to all interfaces.
<Divinite>
Ok. Well I half understand that.
<Divinite>
apeiros_: It's going to be on a vps.
<canton7>
Divinite, just out of interest, I wrote you an echo server using eventmachine: http://pastie.org/3413568
<Divinite>
apeiros_: It only has one ip, should I bind to it?
<Divinite>
canton7: I'm going to check that out, thanks!
<apeiros_>
that's your choice. I never bind to specific addresses.
<Divinite>
apeiros_: Why?
<apeiros_>
because I don't see an advantage, only the disadvantage of less comfort.
<Divinite>
canton7: Thanks so much :D
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<Divinite>
apeiros_: Well, I suppose.
<Divinite>
canton7: Would that be able to take more than one connection at a time?
<canton7>
Divinite, yeah. You can an instance of the Handler class per connection, and obviously send_data sends data only to that connection, and receive_data receives data only from that connection
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<Divinite>
Ok, so you could also log connecting ip's?
<Divinite>
canton7:
<canton7>
Divinite, sure, I've updated the pastie to show that
<Divinite>
Awesome. Thanks so much! I think I'll say a thank you on www.chattaboxa.info soon! :)
<Divinite>
Alright! I'll add that to my list to read!
<Divinite>
canton7: Any other recommendations?
<canton7>
Divinite, I suspect everything you'll need to follow an eventmachine approach is in those latter two links. The docs are pretty good
<Divinite>
canton7: Thanks so much for your help!
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<canton7>
no worries :)
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<Oog>
using rvm installing ruby 1.9.3 on os x lion with xcode 4.2 i used --with-gcc=clang and it worked but i see the note that this breaks gems with native extensions....
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<Oog>
i need xcode 4.2 for ios development. if i install osx-gcc-installer will it break xcode?
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<Oog>
or can i install osx-gcc-installer with xcode and itll live separately?
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<Oog>
you know i just saw that you can use brew install ruby... that seems to be working
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<Oog>
wow that worked... why doesnt rvm work...
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<banseljaj>
Oog: you installed a system ruby
<Oog>
oh so the rvm installs a special ruby?
<Oog>
i thought it just managed versions so it would compile the same code
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<shevy>
I think RVM installs into a directory in your home dir
<Oog>
it does
<seanstickle>
Unless you install as root
<Oog>
but rvm has a problem compiling ruby when xcode 4.2 is installed
<Oog>
you have to use --with-gcc=clang which supposedly breaks native extensions
<Oog>
so im trying to figure out why system ruby was able to compile
<Oog>
but rvm has the problem
<banseljaj>
I haven
<banseljaj>
I haven't used a mac, but sounds like alibrary conflics
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<Oog>
yeah interesting anyway thanks
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<kjellski>
can anyone tell me how I could load a file into rib and have the variables in the script accessible afterwards? or do I need to change the namespace? and if so, how?
<kjellski>
-rib +irb
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<banisterfiend>
kjellski: hi
<kjellski>
hi
<kjellski>
banisterfiend, hi
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: type this: TOPLEVEL_BINDING.eval File.read(your_file), your_file, 1
<banisterfiend>
no
<banisterfiend>
that wont work in stupid irb
<banisterfiend>
that will work in pry though
<banisterfiend>
irb uses a different binding than TOPLEVEL_BINDING
<kjellski>
banisterfiend, whoot? I've got no idea
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: you could try what i said anyway
<kjellski>
banisterfiend, I thought there would be something nice and clean like use or load-into or so...
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* apeiros_
repeats what he says everytime somebody wants that:
<apeiros_>
local variables are called LOCAL for a reason, damit
<apeiros_>
so stop trying to do something stupid. use constants for data that should be available across requires.
<apeiros_>
kjellski: ye, don't change a thing really.
<apeiros_>
if it's just a small script, making a letter uppercase isn't hard.
<apeiros_>
but hey, go around 500 corners if you prefer.
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: really what you want is to start an irb-like session in the middle of your code, rather than bringing your code (awkwardly) to an irb session
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: apeiros wrote a tool called 'pry' for that, http://pry.github.com
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<apeiros_>
(banisterfiend didn't mean to say that I wrote it)
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<kjellski>
apeiros_, never mind, just made that one uppercase character...
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<banisterfiend>
kjellski: probably the best way, but did u try that long thing i typed out first?
<banisterfiend>
just curious if it worked for u
<shevy>
sex
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, nope, actually I start fiddling around with pry
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: i wish u had tried it
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, I'll try it for you, sec
<kjellski>
banisterfiend, nope, no locals available after TOPLEVEL_BINDING.eval File.read(your_file), your_file, 1
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: ok, did u try the other one?
<apeiros_>
banisterfiend: you can't create new variables in a binding
<kjellski>
never mind, pry beats the shit out of me
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: because stdlib is a fossil anyway, better to keep things as gems if u want them rapidly updated
<apeiros_>
banisterfiend: true, which is why I said it works in irb to some extent
<apeiros_>
banisterfiend: well, if we're lucky, stdlib becomes gemified
<apeiros_>
in 2.0
<kjellski>
apeiros_, I hope so
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: it took u about 20 seconds to install pry
<banisterfiend>
i dont think you'll gain so much having it in stdlib
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, you could avoid typing "irb" which leads you to the "wrong" repl though ;)
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<banisterfiend>
kjellski: irb isn't bad, it's better than the default python repl anyway
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<banisterfiend>
and for some reason irb comes with a bunch of useful stuff turned off
<banisterfiend>
like completion and indentation
<kjellski>
banisterfiend, but pry seems really _way_ better then irb
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: i think you just like the colors:)
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, since you wrote it, you know the places that are really better, I started like 5 minutes ago and already like the completion, the help and, yes, the colors...
<banisterfiend>
my favorite is pry-exception_explorer but it seems to have been completely ignored by almost everyone :)
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, wohoooo, looks like slime ^^ but I'll explore the full capabilities on the run...
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<banisterfiend>
kjellski: yeah that's the idea, smalltalk/slime
<banisterfiend>
we'll get there eventually...
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<kjellski>
anyways, since I've just started ruby, maybe another question
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: a module's class? what's that?
<kjellski>
actually I've just my one script file in my "projects" directory
<banisterfiend>
you mean: module MyModule; class MyClass... ?
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, argh
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<banisterfiend>
kjellski: if XML is just a class, then you can reopen via: class Nokogiri::XML; def to_json...
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: whether it's a good idea is another thing :)
<kjellski>
banisterfiend, that's what I do, but where to put that code? and is there another way? Or a more (magical word following) idiomatic way?
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<banisterfiend>
kjellski: if you're modifying a class that already exists u could probably put it in something like a extensions/xml_extensions.rb file or something
<banisterfiend>
im not sure of any idioms in this area but they probably exist
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: but it's best to store it in a way that makes clear to people it's a monkeypatch
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, yeah, just for my little hack here....
<banisterfiend>
kjellski: if it was me, and this was a library you were writing, i'd put it in lib/my_project/extensions/nokogiri_xml_extensions.rb if u were patchinga lot of stuff on nokogiri though maybe i'd put it in extensions/nokogiri/xml_extensions.rb
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, thats a good hint on how to structure this, it this a generally good ruby code structure approach? http://bit.ly/yUGo07
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<banisterfiend>
kjellski: looksfine
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<kjellski>
banisterfiend, I'm running into a problem that I don't understand. In my project, I've moved the file from . to lib/extensions/nokogiri_json_extension.rb and now the parser is telling me that in some line there is an unexpected tSYMBOL
<kjellski>
Where should I start to look at how to design module structure?
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<shajen>
how to use setTimeout in coffescript?
<apeiros_>
shajen: wrong channel?
<pen>
anyone using rake as a replacement for make? if so how do you handle dependencies? how do you replace autotools?
<shajen>
apeiros_: ok, sory :)
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<banseljaj>
Hi. Help with shoes?
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<andycc>
Hey guys, I have a bit of a problem with a sinatra web app - a (sort of) URL shortener. I wrote it and hosted it on Heroku, and all works well if I use the .herokuapp.com URL. However, I want to have a .tk domain name for it. Thing is, if I try to access the app via the .tk domain name, it just doesn't work. Any pointers on what I should try?
<andycc>
(by "it doesn't work" I mean it shows a blank page)
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<irocksu>
hi
<irocksu>
is there a good latex parser in ruby?
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<hron84>
andycc: how do you determine your domain? Or how do you generate links? Please provide us some code to help you.
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<mitya_>
hi everyone
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<mitya_>
I am trying to get the Rack handler for Thin, when I type Rack::Handler.constants :Thin is one of the entries
<mitya_>
but when I do > Rack::Handler::Thin it says no such file to load
<mitya_>
How can I get the Thin rack handler
<burgestrand>
mitya_: install thin
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<mitya_>
burgestrand: Ah... I had assumed that since Rack had the handler Thin was installed... my mistake
<mitya_>
burgestrand: thanks
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<banseljaj>
Anyone well acquainted with shoes available?
<shevy>
never used shoes, never will
<seanstickle>
shevy: you're more of a vibram man?
<shevy>
seanstickle I am a ruby-gtk man!
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<shevy>
though ruby-qt looks better. but its docu sucks
<seanstickle>
Ah, that too
<seanstickle>
wxruby forevah
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<hkhalid>
hi
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<hkhalid>
friends
<shevy>
hi
<shevy>
foes
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<hkhalid>
shevy are you on osx
<seanstickle>
IFF!
<hkhalid>
or linux
<shevy>
linux of course
<hkhalid>
hmmmm
<hkhalid>
oh fuck
<hkhalid>
I forgot I can vm now
<slippyd>
Howdy all.
<slippyd>
I'm having a weird issue with running Ruby that requires gems from TextMate.
<banseljaj>
:(
<slippyd>
And TextMate pros in the room?
<banseljaj>
All I want is a simple GUI app. And i keep getting dragged into these gui wars. :(
<banseljaj>
Can't anyone help. :\
* hkhalid
busts a gui on banseljaj
<slippyd>
banseljaj: It depends on what you're familiar with and what platform(s) you'd like to target.
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* banseljaj
has all the gui toolkits installed, yet has had no work done. :\
<hkhalid>
use gosu
<hkhalid>
and make games
<hkhalid>
and learn how to use it
<slippyd>
Platform-specific GUI tools are almost always going to be better (simpler, more flexible, more fluid, more docs and examples), but it may not suit your needs (e.g. if you want something simple, but cross-platform)
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<samertm>
hey
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<samertm>
how would one add another variable to an object?
<samertm>
like if I had an array called grid
<samertm>
and I wanted to give it a value 'max'
<tayy>
given a Date object (a future date), how do i subtract two days and set a time to it?
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<banseljaj>
slippyd: Hmm. I'm on ;linux, and i intend to go cross platform. But for now, I'd stick with simpler.
<tayy>
i found d << n, which returns n months bef self. but i need it to be in days?
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<banseljaj>
hello?
<banseljaj>
hkhalid: you just named a gui toolkit i've never heard of before. ;-; Which is what has been happening to me all the time
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<banseljaj>
slippyd: I am on linux. Want to do cross platform
<slippyd>
banseljaj: Hmm
<slippyd>
You'll have to ask someone else her n.
<slippyd>
^here then
<slippyd>
I'm a Mac guy.
* hkhalid
slaps slippyd around a bit with a large trout
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<banseljaj>
Well, the ruby is the same, no?
<banseljaj>
hkhalid: Am i to assume that you are muslim by your name?
<hkhalid>
no
<hkhalid>
are you mooslimg
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<atmosx>
my ebox cannot handle usb devices anymore
<atmosx>
either the non-original power adapter is the cause, or I somehow manage to burn the ports
<banseljaj>
I was.
<atmosx>
hmmm hope it's the former the real reason
<atmosx>
banseljaj: you changed religion? that's strange
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<atmosx>
not more weird than java programming whatsoever
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<banseljaj>
I left religion. I'm an atheist
<banseljaj>
Nayways. Anyone able to guide me through shoes? :(
<atmosx>
Where are you from Ali?
<hkhalid>
if you were shia
<hkhalid>
I can understand if you saw people beating themselves up like tards
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<atmosx>
banseljaj: I don't like GUI programming
<banseljaj>
Not Sgia.
<banseljaj>
Shia
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<hkhalid>
or your parents are morons
<hkhalid>
when it comes to religion
<atmosx>
hkhalid: ?
<atmosx>
hkhalid: wtf are you talking about?
<banseljaj>
Actually, my da's an atheist. :P
<hkhalid>
muslims
<tayy>
what's the alternative for adding 8.hours to a DateTime obj in plain ruby?
<atmosx>
hkhalid: You consider muslims 'tards?
<atmosx>
hkhalid: and I assume the Christians are the smart ones?
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<shevy>
religions are a disease of the mind
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<atmosx>
shevy: it might be, if you are a fanatic. But judging someone from it's reliigion is as stupid as judging him by the color of his skin. Or by his skills in a programming language (to mention something closer to our reality)
<hkhalid>
people do that all the time
<hkhalid>
its the reason ruby isnt picked up as much
<hkhalid>
as people view the japanese part and get racist
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<hkhalid>
its not antiquated histroy in US that they locked up japaense people
<atmosx>
hkhalid: I hardly believe so
<hkhalid>
and tortured them here in USA
<shevy>
atmosx: eh. I do not go around and tell anyone that there are people who wrote a holy book, that an entity like "god" would exist, and other hallucinations.
<atmosx>
I didn't even knew that Matz was Japanese when I first grab ruby.
<hkhalid>
atmosx that becuase you dont care about ruby
<hkhalid>
you should have a pic of him on your wall
<atmosx>
shevy: I totally understand you I won't argue with you on that. I'll argue if you insult them on a false basis that you *know the truth* and they don't. You can't prove that God exists more than you can prove that it doesn't.
<atmosx>
even the very definition of God is a point of debate in many cultures
<shevy>
But I don't run around claiming god exists, whereas the religions do.
<atmosx>
hkhalid: care about ruby in what sense? I don't care about my computer either, in a way.
<atmosx>
hkhalid: I don't live out of it… if that's what you mean.
<atmosx>
shevy: Because they believe so. Does that bother you in any way? :-)
<hkhalid>
you should read about Matz
<hkhalid>
and worship him
<shevy>
No, it's not at all. It is a claim made by humans. It came mostly because people of the past did not want to understand that after death comes nothing, so they had to come up with mysticism. It's the same reason why people in the past believed that there exists "starmetal" (iron in meteorites falling down from the sky). Those mental diseases will become less and less the more people know.
<atmosx>
hkhalid: haha okay.
<hkhalid>
im jk
<shevy>
atmosx, yup it does. Because the church is tax exempt for instance here.
<hkhalid>
im muslim, but not muslim like the tards I see today. I believe life is a simulation and god is the ultimate programmer, I cant prove it but life seems like that to me, and if it walks like a duck ..etcetc...
<shevy>
atmosx, but I am equally unfair to all religions ;)
<atmosx>
shevy: in Greece too. I agree with you it should be heavily taxed
<hkhalid>
I can exaplin life in code
<shevy>
yeah hkhalid
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<hkhalid>
most muslims would think im psycho
<atmosx>
shevy: I agree on that, not taxing the church it's stupid and contradicts the very existence of it. It's mission if you get me
<shevy>
people in the past did not know about genes and DNA
<hkhalid>
i dont talk about it, but they are all just about money and status
<hkhalid>
nothing to do with islam i think
<shevy>
today you have synthetic biology
<banseljaj>
hkhalid: o.O
<atmosx>
hkhalid: are you muslim?
<hkhalid>
uh yes
<banseljaj>
fanatics are the ones diseased. and they make the majority look bad.
<hkhalid>
I just said I am
<hkhalid>
but I dont think in terms of good and bad and perosn in clouds
<hkhalid>
i think more of dimensions and energy and code
<atmosx>
shevy: there are people who think that the harmony and complexity of a cell is a proof of a god-like thing uppon thee
<seanstickle>
dimensions and energy huh?
<seanstickle>
Sounds New Agey
<hkhalid>
i write short blurbs everyday to explain how life is code
<seanstickle>
Like totally about the vibrations man
<hkhalid>
nah f new wage
<shevy>
atmosx yup but that does not "explain" anything. they put up a claim and stop there without wanting to explain it. for the church it is tactical, because it did not fit into their world view. just remember how galileo was made their enemy for claiming that the earth ain't the center of the world
<hkhalid>
new age is for white yuppies
<atmosx>
shevy: how can you explain something you don't understand?
<hkhalid>
atmosx is is following a religion.....athiesm
<seanstickle>
hkhalid: sounds like what you're on about
<hkhalid>
seanstickle you need to turn off the tv dude
<hkhalid>
and radio
<hkhalid>
and reddit
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<seanstickle>
People listen to the radio still?
<seanstickle>
Are you IRCing from 1988?
* banseljaj
hides, before others beat him up for opening the pandora's box
<shevy>
atmosx, what exactly isn't understood? "harmony" isn't a scientific term and "complexity" can be brought down to the individual levels. You can bring in DNA into different organisms and cause cells to express them. you will be able to eventually design a minimalistic cell and bootstrap its genome to do more and more things which aren't quite as possible today (as said, systems biology and synthetic biology)
<hkhalid>
wtf
<hkhalid>
shevy you are cool
<shevy>
when you say god did x or y, you don't explain anything
<hkhalid>
me or atom?
<shevy>
anyone who says that, noone in particular :)
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<shevy>
or like the guys who state that life originated outside the earth
<hkhalid>
you are athiest too
<shevy>
I would never define myself as something
* hkhalid
sense wisdom in shevy
<shevy>
it is pointless to state I would be an atheist because there is no god
<seanstickle>
hkhalid: you're probably sensing his aura
<seanstickle>
hkhalid: part of your crystal powers
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<shevy>
in the end
<shevy>
robots will win anyway
<hkhalid>
seanstickle is the type of guy his mom hates she gave birth to
<seanstickle>
Or mutant squirrels
<seanstickle>
hkhalid: I think you just violated your New Age oath
<shevy>
lol
<atmosx>
shevy: let's make the assumption that God exists. Are you sure you will be able to understand him?
<shevy>
that's a silly assumption
<atmosx>
no, it's not :-)
* hkhalid
does voodoo on seanstickle
<seanstickle>
hkhalid: islamic voodoo? is that a thing?
<shevy>
I would not understand such an entity of course, as I would not have the required data to analyse
<atmosx>
Can you understand the details of the string theory?
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<shevy>
of course not
<seanstickle>
Nobody understands string theory. They just know how to move the symbols around.
<atmosx>
shevy: neither do I :-P
<shevy>
but I see high maths as a way to obscure simplicity
<seanstickle>
We're all mathematical nominalists now
<shevy>
you build up a concept that is so complicated only 3 people in the world understand it
<shevy>
then you challenge everyone else to explain it
<kjellski>
any ideas how to get a pry console into eclipse console window?
<shevy>
however, there is the real world, and then there are theories that try to explain phenomens of it
* banseljaj
raises his hand
<banseljaj>
I can ask question?
* seanstickle
calls on banseljaj
<shevy>
just as the people of the past thought that starmetal fell down from the sky as a gift by the god(s), that theory is outdated nowadays
<banseljaj>
Okay, I am creating a class to read a file and split it into sentences.
<tayy>
how do i set specifically just the %H of a DateTime object to 08:00:00?
<banseljaj>
So far, I have the initialize methof, which takes a file name, and opens it
<shevy>
good, you are halfway there then
<epitron>
"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality." -- Albert Einstein
<banseljaj>
And another method that splits it into lines
<epitron>
i think that's where string theory has problems
<banseljaj>
I just have a problem.
<epitron>
"applying to reality" :)
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<seanstickle>
epitron: why?
<shevy>
what problem do you have
<epitron>
untestability
<seanstickle>
epitron: it's not untestable. it's just very hard to test.
<banseljaj>
I want split it around ".i" + a space, and not just on "."
<banseljaj>
regex?
<shevy>
what is "i"?
<epitron>
seanstickle: so you're a string theory enthusiast? :)
<seanstickle>
epitron: I am an enthusiast of many things.
<shevy>
if it were ". " you could use .split(". "), if it gets more complicated, .split also accepts a Regex.... not sure how it would look... .split(/\. /) ... I dont get the "i" there at all
<seanstickle>
:)
<banseljaj>
And in lojban, a conlang, the sentences split at .i
<shevy>
lojban? is that slowensk?
<banseljaj>
It's aa conlang
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<banseljaj>
shevy: no
<epitron>
shevy: upper case punctuation is important
<seanstickle>
Lojban, once upon a time called Loglan
<shevy>
well if "i" is a character, then .split(".i ") would just work anyway or?
<seanstickle>
A language I quite enjoy
<banseljaj>
seanstickle: inded
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<epitron>
oops, i thought you meant //i :)
<banseljaj>
seanstickle: You do? .ua
<shevy>
I understand only half what's going on here right now :(
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<tayy>
hello. anyone plss?
<seanstickle>
banseljaj: go'i
<tayy>
i need to set a DateTime obj's time to 08:00 (leaving date untouched)
<banseljaj>
seanstickle: .uisai
<shevy>
tayy no real idea ... I dont know how to set the hour slot of date time objects alone
<banseljaj>
shevy: thanks
<seanstickle>
banseljaj: but we should refrain from speaking the True Language here
<shevy>
my_date_object.hour = '08:00' # that's what I would do in Ruby! it surely wont work with Datetime
<seanstickle>
banseljaj: it will confuse the mundanes.
<aliSahli>
how i can deploy tow rails applications
<aliSahli>
one use rails 2.3
<aliSahli>
and other use rails 3.0
<banseljaj>
aliSahli: Where are you deploying?
<aliSahli>
ubuntu server
<banseljaj>
local deployment?
<atmosx>
ubuntu!
<banseljaj>
ask around.
<aliSahli>
no server deployment
<aliSahli>
with capistrani
<aliSahli>
with capistrano
<banseljaj>
Ubuntu: The OS of gods. :D
<atmosx>
aliSahli: under gentoo there is a concept of slot
<atmosx>
s
<atmosx>
although ruby implemention 1.9 sucks big time
<atmosx>
banseljaj: blah
* banseljaj
works with EnYa and heroku so can't help much. :\
<atmosx>
what's enya?
* atmosx
really needs to learn how to program in rails (someday)
<banseljaj>
Engine Yard
<aliSahli>
no i have my server and i want to configure it my self
<fayimora>
atmosx: u should
<banseljaj>
Rails was fun
<banseljaj>
is
<atmosx>
fayimora: hmm I still need to grasp ruby, I'm really amateur yet.
<atmosx>
fayimora: and I managed to write an app using sinatra + haml in no time
<atmosx>
so I don't miss rails all that much
<aliSahli>
don't change subject please :)
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<atmosx>
aliSahli: you like better vim or emacs?
<atmosx>
lol
<fayimora>
atmosx: I was poor in ruby when i started learning rails.. I learnt ruby with rails
<aliSahli>
lol
<atmosx>
fayimora: Oh ic.
<aliSahli>
banseljaj: you know rvm ?
<atmosx>
aliSahli: I know rvm
<atmosx>
aliSahli: I know MVC also :-P
<banseljaj>
aliSahli: A bit, yes.
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<banseljaj>
atmosx: you know ABC?
<banseljaj>
:P
<aliSahli>
you think is the best solution ?
<atmosx>
banseljaj: kinda :-P not all of it
<atmosx>
rvm can handle multiple gems without root permissions
<aliSahli>
atmosx: good my son
<banseljaj>
aliSahli: In my experience, yes.
<atmosx>
that said though, some gems require system-wide installations (like sqlite3) otherwise is a huge pain in the ass redefining LD_LIBRARY_PATH to a $HOME/opt directory (or similar)
<aliSahli>
have you an article expalin this experience ? or somthing ?
<banseljaj>
For local management, with an individual ".rvmrc" file, it works seamlessly
<atmosx>
aliSahli: what do you wanna do with rvm again?
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<aliSahli>
i need to deploy tow rails applications
<banseljaj>
rvm.beginrescueend.com?
<aliSahli>
one use rails 2.3
<aliSahli>
and other use 3.0
<aliSahli>
yes banseljaj
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<banseljaj>
I have no article. Mostly did my experiments.
<banseljaj>
haven't deployed an app though. :\
<aliSahli>
okey
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<tayy>
sorry guys. another quick question!
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<tayy>
how do i get the script to do smth when Time = smth?
<iamjarvo>
what exactly is a directory stream
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<RubyPanther>
iamjarvo: that is the io you read a directory through
<iamjarvo>
RubyPanther: so in simple terms its a rirectory reader
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<RubyPanther>
iamjarvo: yes. In C it is the higher level interface, usually implemented with a file descriptor
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<banseljaj>
aliSahli: try #rails. Maybe they'll have better luck
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<aliSahli>
means ?
<iamjarvo>
RubyPanther: thanks
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<banseljaj>
Hmm. need help with a loop
<banseljaj>
I have an array of sentences now.
<banseljaj>
what i want is to pass each sentence and ask the user to type it from memory
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<banseljaj>
If both are equal, the loop continues, otherwise, it should ask to type the same sentence again.
<banseljaj>
Any ideas :(
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<banseljaj>
guys?
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<canton7>
banseljaj, iterate through your sentences (a nice little sentences.each will do), then have another loop that keeps looping until they get it right
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<banseljaj>
canton7: in the inner loop, just a sentence==input would do, right?
<canton7>
banseljaj, or tbh, you can use a "redo" inside the internal loop
<canton7>
banseljaj, with multiple files, e.g. Dir['lib/**/*.rb'].each{ |f| ..... }
<banseljaj>
burgestrand and canton7 do you have shoes experience?
<canton7>
nope
<burgestrand>
banseljaj: only the kind I put on my feet, sorry
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<Divinite>
I wear them a lot
<banseljaj>
:(
<banseljaj>
Nobody knows shoes indeed. :(
<apeiros_>
canton7: Dir[].each { -> Dir.glob {
<apeiros_>
nicer
<apeiros_>
([] can't take a block, glob can)
<canton7>
that's true, good point
<apeiros_>
I think I better don't even start commenting on the require part… I'll just get upset.
<banseljaj>
I think i'll just put everyhting in the same file. :\
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<banseljaj>
it belongs there, really
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<syskk>
quick noob question: i've never had to use a message queue before, what is it used for? the wikipedia article doesn't really help… any practical use case?
<burgestrand>
syskk: for one thing, a to-do list for worker processes
<syskk>
ok.. but why not simply invoke the worker process as we need it?
<syskk>
or you mean many todos for a single worker process?
<burgestrand>
syskk: lots of reasons, but mostly because you don’t need to know how the process gets done or who does it
<syskk>
ok
<syskk>
so what would a message look like? can you give an example?
<burgestrand>
syskk: for example you could have a bunch of really powerful machines that do nothing but heavy number crunching with complicated logic, you could have hundreds of these and just have them take work off the message queue, for example
<syskk>
ok i see
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<burgestrand>
syskk: any kind of format you like, depends on what kind of message queue you use; some use JSON because it’s easy to structure, some just put a string of numbers in there (like an ID)
<syskk>
so messages are simply strings?
<syskk>
ok cool
<burgestrand>
Yeah, most of the time it’s some kind of string-based format I’d say
<syskk>
can it be seen as a RPC mechanism?
<syskk>
i guess it depends on what your workers do with the messages right?
<burgestrand>
RPC, it’s all it is
<burgestrand>
or, no, sorry
<burgestrand>
But yeah, in a sense, you don’t wait for an answer though, but in a sense it’s a kind of RPC
<burgestrand>
(you could wait for an answer, of course, but often you don’t because that’s why you put the thing in a message queue in the first place)
<syskk>
ok cool
<syskk>
would it be correct to see it as a socket where you don't know when and who is going to get your message?
<burgestrand>
ilteris: { thingy: otherthingy } is a short way to declare a dictionary, where thingy: is the key and otherthingy is the value, this syntax is unique to ruby 1.9, you can also use { :thingy => otherthingy }, which also works and is the only thing that works for keys that are not symbols
<burgestrand>
ilteris: finally, :thingies are symbols :)
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<ilteris>
ah lol now it starts to make sense
<burgestrand>
ilteris: symbols are a kind of literal, like numbers or "string", that look like strings
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<ilteris>
when is an appropriate to use a symbol? never heard of symbol before in other languages.
<ilteris>
so a form data should be a symbol?
<Tasser>
ilteris, do you know of enums?
<ilteris>
enumerators, little bit.
<Tasser>
nope, enums
<ilteris>
no I don't :)
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<burgestrand>
ilteris: which other languages do you know?
<mklappstuhl>
can anyone tell me which s3 library to use? rightscale's seems outdated aws-s3's is wierd at some places
<burgestrand>
ilteris: trying to come up with a new way of explaining what a symbol is :)
<shevy>
the first thing to know about symbols is
<shevy>
they are BORING
<ilteris>
lol
<shevy>
enums are a lot more interesting
<burgestrand>
ilteris: but, think of it like this, you have a dictionary, and in this dictionary you want to look things up
<burgestrand>
ilteris: the keys themselves don’t matter much, you only care that they’re easy to distinguish and that they’re efficient
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<shevy>
I like to think of symbols as totally boring, lame ass crippled string-like entities
<burgestrand>
ilteris: in ObjC, you might to do this: #define KEY_ONETHING 0, #define KEY_OTHERTHING 2
<ilteris>
yup
<shevy>
they may be fast, but they make up for this by being so boring, that every word further spent explaining them is a wasted time of BORINGNESS
* shevy
really just tries to help burgestrand!
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<burgestrand>
ilteris: you could then use KEY_ONETHING and KEY_OTHERTHING in place of 0 and 2, and it’d be easy to read the code while the actual things are represented some other way, it’s also nice that you can check if something == KEY_ONETHING efficiently and it does not use up much memory either
<Tasser>
how to convert a struct to a hash?
<ilteris>
yup
<burgestrand>
ilteris: ruby symbols are pretty much for the same thing
<ilteris>
oh
<ilteris>
that's it?
<burgestrand>
ilteris: yup, the difference is that they’re literals
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<ilteris>
how can I get the "value" of a symbol then?
<burgestrand>
ilteris: :symbol == :symbol, superfast comparison (represented as a number internally), and makes sense when you look at it
<burgestrand>
ilteris: the value of a symbol is the symbol :)
<burgestrand>
ilteris: like the value of 5 is 5
<ilteris>
heh oke
<ilteris>
so here: content_type :text
<ilteris>
:text is an identifier
<shevy>
Tasser hmm. not sure this is possible
<burgestrand>
ilteris: it could just as well have been content_type "text"
<burgestrand>
ilteris: but yes, :text is an identifier in this case
<burgestrand>
ilteris: and, well, any other case, it’s what they’re used for
<burgestrand>
:p
<ilteris>
okay, makes more sense now. thanks burgestrand :)
<burgestrand>
ilteris: one thing about symbols though, is that they’re never garbage collected
<burgestrand>
ilteris: it would be a bad idea to generate hundreds of them
<shevy>
boring as they are
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<ilteris>
hehe oke
<burgestrand>
ilteris: so, don’t do this: 1_000_000.times.map { |index| index.to_s.to_sym }
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<ilteris>
why would the person uses symbols here as opposed to regular strings? http://pastie.org/3416528
<ilteris>
are they faster to compare than strings?
<burgestrand>
ilteris: yup
<ilteris>
so we could alternatively use strings in this snippet
<ilteris>
little rellief :)
<ilteris>
thanks for the patience burgestrand
<burgestrand>
ilteris: every symbol has a unique number internally, as well as any object, but for any given symbol this number is *always* the same if it’s the same symbol
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<burgestrand>
ilteris: :symbol.object_id == :symbol.object_id, while "string".object_id != "string".object_id
<burgestrand>
ilteris: but yeah, you probably could
<Dunas>
I can't find a way to use Shoes in standalone programs, help?
<ilteris>
good tip though, thanks
<burgestrand>
ilteris: symbols are mostly just an optimization, and I’d dare say most of the times it makes little difference
<burgestrand>
but using a symbol communicates that this thing is an identifier, which is useful information to the programmer
<ilteris>
so faster comparison vs. garbage not collected tradeoff
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<burgestrand>
Yeah
<ilteris>
burgestrand: how is it being an identifier useful information to the programmer? do you mind giving an example?
<burgestrand>
ilteris: was thinking it communicates intent
<ilteris>
rather than just data
<burgestrand>
Yeah, rather than just a random string
<ilteris>
gotcha
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<burgestrand>
My highly personal opinion, I might add ;)
<ilteris>
no, it's a good one. I appreciate it
<RubyPanther>
if it is used internally in the program and not displayed to the user, then it is a program identifier, and if you display it to the user, then it is data.
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<burgestrand>
and as soon as you add context to it it’s information
<ilteris>
okay thanks gentlemen. going back reading. be back later with my questions :D
<atmosx>
Google does not help, so I think there's none
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<virunga>
atmosx, i don't know... Does it need you for pattern matching on text?
<atmosx>
virunga: yes. I wanna do some simple text fingerpriting using it.. because on wikipedia says it's way faster than sha1/md5/etc
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<virunga>
atmosx, how long is the pattern? Like a common english word for example?
<atmosx>
virunga: yeah max
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<atmosx>
8 chars
<virunga>
there's a lot of algorithms you could use instead of that one. A perfect one for your purpose would be the Shift-And algorithm
<virunga>
invented from the author of yahoo
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<atmosx>
virunga: oh thanks :-) I had no idea.
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<virunga>
atmosx, in theory has a worse time of MC with fingerprint but in practice is really fast
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<atmosx>
virunga: I'll give it a try although… I need to study this part: The algorithm tells whether a given text contains a substring which is "approximately equal" to a given pattern, where approximate equality is defined in terms of Levenshtein distance — if the substring and pattern are within a given distance k of each other, then the algorithm considers them equal.
<virunga>
maybe has the same time... i dont remember now
<atmosx>
don't worry I'll run some tests asap
<atmosx>
thanks for the pointers
<virunga>
atmosx, i don't know the Levenshtein distance but i think you can use a modified version of the agrep algorithm
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<virunga>
the book algorithms on strings, trees and sequences is good for you
<virunga>
it conteins all this kind of algo
<virunga>
it's perfect for that
<virunga>
if i'm not wrong tha MC with fingerprint is build on agrep so....
<virunga>
now i'm leaving
<virunga>
good luck
<atmosx>
I have a book on algo's. It's in introduction. Unfrotunatelly I won't have time to read it before summer :-/
<atmosx>
but thanks :-)
<atmosx>
goto night
<atmosx>
good night heh
<virunga>
'nite
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<jasonlfunk>
I am a web developer who primarily uses PHP at the moment. I'm looking to switch away to a different language; not because PHP is bad but because I know there are other languages that are cleaner, more polished, more consistent, etc. Currently, I'm narrowed down to Python or Ruby. Any thoughts on the matter?
<atmosx>
jasonlfunk: well, you're in ruby.
<jasonlfunk>
I know
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<jasonlfunk>
I wanted to hear the arguments straight from the horse's mouth
<jasonlfunk>
And I didn't know a better channel to ask in.
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<atmosx>
jasonlfunk: look here http://bit.ly/wog6S6 it's a detailed thread on the ruby-ml
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<atmosx>
jasonlfunk: you'll find plenty of answers from sophisticated people and you can make up a mind of your own.
<jasonlfunk>
Perfect. Just what I was looking for. Thanks.
<jasonlfunk>
Would it be considered a sin to use ruby for webdev w/o using Rails? I typically don't like using MVC frameworks. I like ground-up things.
<jasonlfunk>
The Sanatra package looked intriguing to me.
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<apeiros_>
jasonlfunk: no, it's perfectly fine, not to use rails.
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<jasonlfunk>
#python is certainly a more animated channel than ruby. :)