<wpwrak>
the autodetect doesn't seem to support dual-head. it usually finds one screen, though.
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<DocScrutinizer05>
I generally despise the basic concept of "autodetect" without interactive override/supervision
<DocScrutinizer05>
it's what makes M$ products such unbearable crap
<DocScrutinizer05>
any such autodetect aka "smart wizard" always works for 99% of usual cases at best, while failing in a way far beyond what's called 'epic', for the remaining 1+%
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<DocScrutinizer05>
actually it seems those 1% fringe cases never are tested in any of such wizards, and the result when confronting the system with a fringe case are completely unpredictable
<wpwrak>
oh, you have those overrides, in the form of xorg.conf. something i learned to day, though, is that it now ignores instructions in xorg.conf it doesn't like. that's a feature i hadn't noticed before.
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah, poor documentation of any such "override" path is basicaly concept immanent
<DocScrutinizer05>
as is missing QA for the same features
<wpwrak>
documentation wouldn't help - there's far too much stuff in xorg.conf :)
<DocScrutinizer05>
it's the wrong approach on a very very basic level
<wpwrak>
a visual configurator would be nice. show the cards, show what's connected, try to display something.
<DocScrutinizer05>
even the devels think "it's not worth looking into that annoying stuff meant to deal with only <1% of usecases"
<DocScrutinizer05>
and that's a immanent result from the "auto wizard" approach
<wpwrak>
the data can be patched together from the x server log, xrandr, and such, but it's messy and very easy to get wrong
<DocScrutinizer05>
yep
<wpwrak>
in any case, it just surprised me that two screens was so hard. i'm used to triple-head being an epic uphill battle, but dual-head ought to be less painful.
<DocScrutinizer05>
KDE knows to handle dual-head in a very seamless manner, when I plug a new moni to my PC. However I dunno where's the limit at which it again fails completely
<DocScrutinizer05>
NB I never configured the system to work dual-headed
<DocScrutinizer05>
I just connected a 21:9 moni to a HDI/DP jack I found on backside of this PC
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<DocScrutinizer05>
and it instantly switched to dual-headed
<DocScrutinizer05>
the screenshot above shows single-moni state though
<DocScrutinizer05>
the icons at bottom of a screen symbol are (from left to right): "rotate display 90° counterclockwise", "toggle primary output" and "Show list of available display resolutions"
<DocScrutinizer05>
obviously you can rearrange displays by dragging them to where they belong to, and you can enable/disable then with the checkbox. No idea where to switch between multi-desktop and tiled desktop
<wpwrak>
yeah, i don't have fancy "desktop" utilities to rearrange the server configuration. my workflow is more linear: x server finds and sets up the displays, then fvwm uses them. not even sure what fvwm would do if a new screen suddenly appeared.
<DocScrutinizer05>
my comment was more about "this dang KDE obviously does something, and maybe it does it correctly most of them time. Alas no idea WHAT it does, but... it's FOSS so the sourcecode should tell, in an ideal world"
<wpwrak>
yes, sometimes that haystack can be rather big :)
<DocScrutinizer05>
maybe that helps to reduce the haystack
<wpwrak>
looks like a big haystack :) also, the fun bits are probably in some middleware
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah, probably
<DocScrutinizer05>
the shitty thin g doesn't even have a cmdline option to open the right subsection for display management
<DocScrutinizer05>
would a strace of hitting "Apply" button help you?
<wpwrak>
naw, this works at a completely different level than where i am. i don't want to reconfigure a running x server. i need it to start correctly, given a static configuration.
<wpwrak>
in any case, what i have seems to work. the missing :0 will probably upset some thing, but there shouldn't be a lot of them.
<DocScrutinizer05>
prolly worthless without /proc/fd/* listing
<wpwrak>
yeah, a lot of binary messages being exchanged with something else. you'd really have to analyze the whole chain of critters to even know what it does. and then that still wouldn't help, since i'm at a completely different interface.
<wpwrak>
xrandr was useful, though, to provide an overview of what i should be looking for in the server log :)
<DocScrutinizer05>
anyway checking dbus isn't feasible, way too much noise there
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<wpwrak>
killing runaway tabs is really easy in chromium: since each has its own process, you just kill anything that burns 100%
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<wpwrak>
btw, my new monitor has an external power supply. in the 1st generation, the backlights failed first. so i went to LED in the 2nd generation. there, the power supply area failed (always caps, but also accompanied by other bits). let's see where they put the bug in the 3rd generation.
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<whitequark>
lol
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<DocScrutinizer05>
wpwrak: the problem being that this didn't really show up as runaway process in/of browser, the CPU load is mainly with dbus etc I guess
<DocScrutinizer05>
(external PSU) same here with this LG 21:9 monitor
<DocScrutinizer05>
I'm still undecided if I appreciate or dislike this design
<DocScrutinizer05>
on the bright side: it makes simple "UPS" setups pretty easy
* DocScrutinizer05
checks the voltage of that PSU)
<whitequark>
dbus?
<whitequark>
chromium doesn't use dbus
<DocScrutinizer05>
19V@2.1A
<whitequark>
chromium uses SysV IPC for everything and also shared memory
<DocScrutinizer05>
sure
<DocScrutinizer05>
but *I* don't use *chromium* ;-D
<DocScrutinizer05>
still with konqueror
<whitequark>
ah, idk about konqueror
<DocScrutinizer05>
and konqueror, as a true KDE app, uses dbus for literally everything
<DocScrutinizer05>
particularly to connect to kcookiejar
<whitequark>
okay that's a very stupid design
<DocScrutinizer05>
possibly
<whitequark>
btw
<whitequark>
SMD reflow with a blowtorch
<whitequark>
it works quite well
<DocScrutinizer05>
then otoh it separates functional blocks, so you could integrate the rendering part incl cookies and all into arbitrary other apps
<DocScrutinizer05>
o.O
<DocScrutinizer05>
blowtorch? EEEW
<DocScrutinizer05>
I bet soldering works quite well, I just wonder how well the silicon chips will work after such torture
<whitequark>
didn't have a hot air gun or even a skillet yesterday, so did it by using a ts8000 map/pro (propylene) bernzomatic torch as a "hot air gun"
<whitequark>
note i didn't put anything into the flame, i just used the hot exhaust
<DocScrutinizer05>
hmm
<whitequark>
what surprised me was how sedate it is, it actually took quite long to get the board to reflow temp
<whitequark>
I literally had an easier time ruining a board with a proper SMD rework station
<whitequark>
SMD rework station: localized heat, relatively low power, annoying to use--prone to inattentively overheating the PCB and delaminating
<DocScrutinizer05>
I'd probably consider pizza carton plus my beloved ATTEN 858D
<whitequark>
blowtorch: moves MASSIVE amounts of air, 1-2kW of power (iirc), heats up the entire board relatively evenly
<whitequark>
and you need 1-1.5 minutes to get it to 220 (measured with IR thermometer)
<whitequark>
my main concern is the water vapor in the exhaust
<whitequark>
I have an ERL device and it has a RJ45 connector
<whitequark>
except it's actually serial
<DocScrutinizer05>
yep, "Console"
<DocScrutinizer05>
I still wonder where to get a cable for that BS
<whitequark>
just make it
<whitequark>
don't you have an RJ45 crimper?
<DocScrutinizer05>
btw I inverted/rotated the fans mechanically so they do sane high airpressure case mode instead of the brainfucked vacuum vleaner mode :-)
<whitequark>
not sure if there's a difference
<DocScrutinizer05>
hmm, I have a db9 jack ;-)
<whitequark>
for example I did a 1kW chiller, was a bit surprised to discover that the evap has a fan that pulls air through it
<DocScrutinizer05>
anyway two similar fans are causing really annoying interference, my ears suffer
<DocScrutinizer05>
a rack is mandatory to operate this thing
<DocScrutinizer05>
closed type, with door
<DocScrutinizer05>
will benefit my PC and UPS as well
<DocScrutinizer05>
(fan push/pull) it's mainly a matter of placing filters before where you know air *enters* the case. You can't do that in vacuum cleaner mode (the usual PC mode)
<DocScrutinizer05>
the ERpro has ventilation slots *everywhere*
<DocScrutinizer05>
now air comes out there, keeping all dust outside
<DocScrutinizer05>
in factory config air entered everywhere and came out at the tiny fan apertures
<DocScrutinizer05>
I know how devices look inside after doing this a 6 months in my home
<DocScrutinizer05>
particularly annoying for laptops which you have a 'lot of fun' cleaning the heatsinks
<DocScrutinizer05>
killed 3 laptops with this
<DocScrutinizer05>
but *finally* with this nice router my LAN feels sort of secure, with each device having its own eth* IF with its own firewall rules and all
<DocScrutinizer05>
learning about ARP-poisoning drove me nuts
<DocScrutinizer05>
good luck with ARP poisoning my LAN now ;-P
<whitequark>
haha yes I pwned the entire Windows domain in high school with ARP poison
<whitequark>
wouldn't get domain admin had they not use LM hashes though
<DocScrutinizer05>
LM?
<whitequark>
lanman hash
<DocScrutinizer05>
never heard of
<DocScrutinizer05>
would googling for lanman help?
<whitequark>
it's a hash algorithm that first changes the password to uppercase then splits it in two 7-character hash
<whitequark>
passwords over 14 characters or non-ASCII are prohibited
<DocScrutinizer05>
ROTFL
<whitequark>
exactly
<whitequark>
you don't even need rainbow tables, you can probably crack it with an abacus
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah
<whitequark>
I did use rainbow tables though, I got ~40% of all passwords in the domain
<whitequark>
within... two minutes
<DocScrutinizer05>
but with proper ARP cache poisoning you can snoop all traffic in your LAN anyway, so...
<whitequark>
the rest used NTLM which took more work
<whitequark>
yes, that's how I got the domain admin hash
<whitequark>
and the rest I pulled from the domain controller using l0pht
<whitequark>
good fun
<DocScrutinizer05>
hehe
<whitequark>
I reported that to the admin so I haven't even been reprimanded, another guy RATted the domain though and got expelled
<whitequark>
and/or because he was an asshole, the latter part may have had more weight tbh
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<DocScrutinizer05>
my LAN no ARP query or reply can reach any device except the one device which knows there are no ARP replies expected regarding gateway
<DocScrutinizer05>
expected to come from anybody but the router itself
<DocScrutinizer05>
so any ARP poisoning will rather result in an immediate ban of the offender instead of succeeding
<DocScrutinizer05>
one school director said "how can we expect our pupils to develop a sense for security when we forbid any hacking in our school network?"
<DocScrutinizer05>
this guy had rewarded you
<DocScrutinizer05>
thanked you publicly and appointed you for admin
<whitequark>
yeah, some sanity still remains in this world
<whitequark>
in the US they'd probably put you in jail
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah
<DocScrutinizer05>
nice little report ^^^ :-)
<DocScrutinizer05>
did you try brute force VPS?
<DocScrutinizer05>
I guess any arbitrary cooking pot with lid, any arbitrary stove, and a 5cl of Galden, plus some wire bent to keep the PCB a 2cm above the pot's bottom, should do
<whitequark>
no, still not... I've had enough meatspace troubles that I didn't do any PCB in many months, not one since I received galden
<whitequark>
next one, I think
<DocScrutinizer05>
to gain perfection you may have to tune the amount of Galden in relation to pot size, and the power and duration of heat applied via stove
<whitequark>
I think I can even cool down forcibly the top of the vessel
<whitequark>
since I now have the chiller
<DocScrutinizer05>
great! :-)
<whitequark>
ohhhhh I just realized, galden vapor phase soldering is basically the same as a diffusion pump
<whitequark>
mechanically
<DocScrutinizer05>
I heard of folks using a steel bowl with ice and water inside, for lid of pot
<whitequark>
the advantage of my position in HK is I can afford to design nice things rapidly because of taobao
<whitequark>
have you seen my chiller?
<DocScrutinizer05>
I had an extremely weird idea: using Galden instead of water in a steam pistol, and then really 'spray' the PCB with Galden vapor
<whitequark>
steam pistol?
<whitequark>
whats that
<DocScrutinizer05>
well, Dampfstrahler
<DocScrutinizer05>
come in different sizes
<DocScrutinizer05>
just a pot to boil water and a nozze where vapor escapes
<DocScrutinizer05>
nozzle even
<whitequark>
ohhhhhhh
<whitequark>
steam cleaner
<DocScrutinizer05>
those things come in handheld for e.g. cleaning windows
<whitequark>
yeah I know
<whitequark>
just never heard as 'pistol'
<DocScrutinizer05>
well, I ,ade that up
<whitequark>
I think that's not unreasonable but you have two problems
<DocScrutinizer05>
galden mess everywhere being first
<whitequark>
well, no, sorry, one
<whitequark>
which is galden escaping
<whitequark>
yes
<whitequark>
exactly
<whitequark>
2nd was me misunderstanding thermodynamics for a moment :)
<DocScrutinizer05>
that's fixing itself :-)
<DocScrutinizer05>
for the mess issue, maybe a huge basin with a glas lid and two holes for your arms would do
<whitequark>
whats the benefit?
<whitequark>
you can prolly do that but i don't see why would i want to
<DocScrutinizer05>
err, more punctual heating, compared to a complete vapor bath which might be a) not feasible for large board, and b) not even intended, so ther components don't get unsoldered
<DocScrutinizer05>
it's the mega hot air
<DocScrutinizer05>
way better heat transfer, no overheating
<DocScrutinizer05>
the latter obviously thanks to precisely defined vapor temperature
<whitequark>
thats true that the process is much more versatile
<DocScrutinizer05>
think of it like the no-touch soldering iron ;-)
<whitequark>
but i find it hard to imagine where the versatility would justify the drawbacks
<DocScrutinizer05>
rework
<whitequark>
hmmm
<whitequark>
I like your idea now
* DocScrutinizer05
wonders if there's already a patent on that
<DocScrutinizer05>
;-)
<DocScrutinizer05>
some contraption designed faintly similar like an e-cig comes to mind
<DocScrutinizer05>
extremely fast ramp-up
<DocScrutinizer05>
control amount of Galden vapor directly via the electrical heating element power
<whitequark>
feeding it seems complicated
<DocScrutinizer05>
feeding liquid?
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah, that's what e-cigs are great in
<DocScrutinizer05>
I think it works like a petrol lamp, with a wick of sorts
<DocScrutinizer05>
DAMN YOU, ERproFANS! they create a 5Hz interference
<whitequark>
yes it has a wick
<whitequark>
but that holds very little vapor
<whitequark>
if it's ok to manually refill it once in a while then that works
<whitequark>
I'm not sure how much heat (in J) is needed to eg desolder one SMD
<DocScrutinizer05>
yep, of course. You have a 20cl tank with a wick, to hold the Galden. Then at top the wick goes around a .. 50W resistor
<whitequark>
Galden's heat of vaporization is 63J/g
<DocScrutinizer05>
in a tube that ends in a nozzle
<whitequark>
so with a 50W resistor you can deliver ~1g/s of galden
<whitequark>
and so 50W of heat
<whitequark>
hm
<DocScrutinizer05>
make that 200W then ;-)
<whitequark>
then you need 4g/s
<whitequark>
gthats a lot of galden
<DocScrutinizer05>
yep
<DocScrutinizer05>
let's just test it :-D
<DocScrutinizer05>
I mean, the Galden shouldn't get lost
<DocScrutinizer05>
of course you want to catch it and 'recycle' it
<whitequark>
one issue is having too little flow of galden, which makes it decompose to HF and COF2
<DocScrutinizer05>
right
<DocScrutinizer05>
you don't want that :-/
<whitequark>
even if you're in respirator
<whitequark>
HF will destroy your board real well
<DocScrutinizer05>
yeah sure
<DocScrutinizer05>
Galden is nasty like hell when overheated
<whitequark>
you can control the temp to make sure it never exceeds 300°C even locally, perhaps
<DocScrutinizer05>
:nod:
<DocScrutinizer05>
there are those really great PTC heater elements in hot glue pistols
<DocScrutinizer05>
dunno if those also exist for 250°C
<whitequark>
probably
<DocScrutinizer05>
I never even checked the temperature of the hotglue
<DocScrutinizer05>
doesn't feel like >200° on my fingers ;-D
<whitequark>
it should be around 150 for polyolefins, I think
<DocScrutinizer05>
sounds about right, yes
<whitequark>
over 200 is for polyimides and such
<whitequark>
exotic
<DocScrutinizer05>
NFC what material that hotglue sticks are
<DocScrutinizer05>
btw where are you located now, after your 8000km move? (I asked that before, but forgot)
<whitequark>
HK
<DocScrutinizer05>
aaah
<whitequark>
hotglue sticks are polyethylene usually
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<roh>
.s0
<roh>
muh
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<eintopf>
muuuh
<DocScrutinizer05>
~mooo
<DocScrutinizer05>
~moo
<infobot>
mooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I'm a cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass. I'm a cow, you are too; join us all! type apt-get moo.