azonenberg changed the topic of #homecmos to: Homebrew CMOS and MEMS foundry design | Wiki: http://homecmos.drawersteak.com/wiki/Main_Page | Repository: http://code.google.com/p/homecmos/ | Logs: http://en.qi-hardware.com/homecmos-logs/
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<pie__> <Noxz> and still in highschool, right?
<pie__> wait you're shitting me?
* pie__ goes to bathe in salt xD
<pie__> not really though, but damnit
<pie__> xD
<Noxz> yeah dude, just a kid
<Noxz> schedule sent to college regarding the bench test for the watchmaking program interview process
<Noxz> hype hype
<pie__> cool \o/
<pie__> i wanted to do scientific glasblowing but there isnt anythin around :(
<pie__> glass
<pie__> probably better to buy off aliexpress anyway lol...
<Noxz> I'd actually kinda like to learn that
<Noxz> but I dont like fire
<Noxz> my mother is a stained glass artist so I've been around glas smy entire life
<Noxz> we had a kiln
<Noxz> but she wasnt a glass blower
<Noxz> so, no exp in that department
<Noxz> there's a few guys on youtube that make awesome stuff that I would just reach out to for really custom stuff
<Noxz> I actually commisioned custom stuff before
<Noxz> 24/40 ground glass jointed long "Test tubes"
<Noxz> more of long reaction tubes
<Noxz> to stick into a "furnace" I amde with nichrome and kiln bricks
<Noxz> 760 C no problem
<Noxz> w/ a cheapo chinese DC PSU
<Noxz> the cords for it eventualy got hot, but yeah, intersting initial test
<Noxz> the first idea was for crackign ethanol to ethylene
<Noxz> w/ Aluminum Oxide granuals - then powder
<Noxz> never really realized well enough though
<Noxz> anywho, I got some "Test tubes" that were ~ 300mm in length
<Noxz> the glass blower I reached out to made smoking stuff, but had exp w/ borosilicate.. so yeah.. he had to order all of the ground glass joints and I had to wait
<Noxz> so long as it worked, and it did
<pie__> cool
<pie__> man i need to start doing not nothing :D
<Noxz> do you at least have a wishlist of what you wanna do?
<Noxz> I actually have an idea of making an aluminum oxide coated mesh for use with steamed vapors to crack/dehydrate
<Noxz> which stemed from a magnesium oxide electron multiplier design
<pie__> well i want to start with one of those DIY SEMs (its either a sem or a TEM or something like that, i keep mixing it up)
<Noxz> yeah, SEM is my first aim
<pie__> im not really set up for any sort of chemistry and im not sure i can set up for it :/
<Noxz> I'm going about it way differently than Ben though
<Noxz> I mean, if you ever seen one of Ben Krasnow's chem setups - it's usually a simple distillation or similar
<Noxz> he doesnt exactly have a fumehood
<Noxz> I, however, do
<pie__> diy sem probably isnt really useful for anything but it seems at least a doable thing for starters
<Noxz> I want to use it for e-bram lithography for electroforming small watch parts
<Noxz> more or less
<Noxz> e-beam*
<pie__> this is what i was thinking of https://dberard.com/home-built-stm/
<pie__> i keep saying SEM because they are both S*M :|
<Noxz> you linked me to that before - very neat
<Noxz> I like the idea of using piezo
<pie__> i think they use piezo normally, its just a LOT fancier
<Noxz> especially since I have piezo stages and ultrasonic homogenizers
<pie__> right now im just trying to focus enough on studying to not fail the semester horribly
<pie__> i might have ADHD, but its gonna be a while till the doc appointment
<pie__> (or im just trash at studying :P)
<Noxz> team meeting - daily standup, bbiab
<pie__> a'ight
<Noxz> heh, depends on subject for me
<gruetzkopf> i've built a fairly terrible STM before
<pie__> what do you do anyway?
<Noxz> IT
<Noxz> as a general term
<Noxz> site triage I think is a more proper thing of the new group
<pie__> gruetzkopf, oh?
<gruetzkopf> for uni
<Noxz> oh, meeting canclled, bossman is in training
<Noxz> k, time to slack and chat :P
<pie__> haha
<Noxz> gruetzkopf, I'd like to know more about your end product as well
<Noxz> yay, email back: bench test one week out, next tuesday!
<sync> nowadays I feel like it is more productive to just buy a surplus sem/tem
<Noxz> you mean second hand on fleabay?
<Noxz> and pray it works
<pie__> everything that involves things like making your own silicon out of sand are probably going to be less productive... which i ams sadly starting to internalize :P
<pie__> thats just a made up example
<pie__> wafers are relatively cheap
<sync> there is not much to be broken, if the e gun works
<pie__> what part of a sem is even the hard part? optics? metrology instruments?
<pie__> (basically everything important)
<sync> it depends, the hard parts are the electron optics and the controls for them
<sync> if you want it to work well
<Noxz> Ben's implementation didnt seem too bad
<Noxz> not too hard
<sync> yeah but also no real use
<sync> tbh, I want to use the em not make it
<Noxz> did it not work? he got a professionally made second hand one later
<sync> and even using a commercial one is a lot of fiddling
<sync> yes, the second one is good
<pie__> i wonder how hard it is to simulate electron optics
<pie__> open source electron microscope design anyone? (pff who needs to be able to manufacture things anyway)
<pie__> i love how any competent person would just make a business out of any of these ideas if they actually did them
<pie__> i mean, this is all srs bzns, so you might as well
<Noxz> can a living room fabricated SEM compete against a commercial one?
<Noxz> competition, cost, reproducability, etc
<Noxz> time
<pie__> i meant the design side
<Noxz> but is there a market for that?
<Noxz> who will gain what from it
<pie__> for living room designed sem? probably not, but if you're trying to seriously design a sem (in your living room) i guess you might as well go into engineering proper
<Noxz> ea component is likely fairly custom to any real degree that publishing any info of it is very specific to what was chosen
* pie__ doesnt really know anything about anything, just frustrated about opportunities probably
<Noxz> jack of all trades?
<pie__> i guess
<sync> there is electron optic simulation software
<sync> even making the parts is not hard
<sync> the devil is in the details tho
<pie__> Noxz, well, that would be if i actually learned the stuff properly enough :P at the moment, just pining to be a jack of all trades :P
<pie__> sync, yeah i figured as much
<Noxz> such as the cooling of the magnets for consistent precise results
<pie__> sync, the basic theory is not hard, but you arent gettng an undistorted image at 1um
<Noxz> it's nearly just a CRT
<pie__> yeah when i found out about the original method of syncing (heh) the beam scanning to crt scanning i thought that was pretty neat
<Noxz> .. what is the method?
<Noxz> I dont recall much of it
<Noxz> and syncing = ?
<Noxz> it is slightly early for me
<pie__> something something what they originally did was modulate the microscope beam scanning and the crt beam scanning with the same signal (well, scaled appropriately)
<pie__> at least, thats what i was told
<Noxz> to reuse some of the electronics?
<sync> no, so that you can see the image
<Noxz> oh
<sync> actually not uncommon way back when
* pie__ goes back to linear algebra
<pie__> sync, does microscope software usually give you an api to script stuff?
<sync> no?
<pie__> thats dumb :P
<pie__> then again, i guess it will usually have stuff for scanning a large area at high res anyway
<sync> well, yes
<sync> but almost nobody would write a script anyway
<pie__> annoying to draw dicks on an ungrounded sample by hand
<gruetzkopf> let me see if still have the stuff from that lab
<gruetzkopf> i still have the boards, but sadly not the X/Y/Z piezo stage
<pie__> gruetzkopf, what are you studying btw
<gruetzkopf> EE
<pie__> makes sense
<Noxz> my Langmuir film book finally arrived
<pie__> yay
<pie__> what are those
<pie__> ah /me googles
<Noxz> I want to do a contiuous roll of graphene
<Noxz> for super capacitors for my electric car
<Noxz> $200 book that took a month to get to me from middle of nowhere kentucky.. I should have paid the $5 extra (if available) for expediated shipping
<Noxz> it has some underlinings in the first chapter, but beyond that, decent condition
<pie__> sounds like you need to scan it and put it on the internet
<pie__> unless you got it because you just wanted a physical copy
<Noxz> it was not on libgen
<Noxz> I had to buy a physical one
<pie__> yeah, hint hint wink wink nudge nudge
<pie__> Our Benevolent Library
<Noxz> I like how scihub will link to there if you put in something that is actually a book (even if it has a DOI)
<Noxz> I also like the slight UI change scihub did, moving the stuff to the left
<Noxz> from the top
<pie__> oh wow
<pie__> wtf.
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