<dsamarin>
ellio: i try to lift regularly to make sure I build muscle. Also I dislike having a programmers tan so for the summer I try to go outside more
<dsamarin>
ellio: exercising is a natural antidepressant lol
<purr>
lol
<dsamarin>
purr: ikr
<dsamarin>
stop being depressed, it's only chemicals
<dsamarin>
white goo dreeping down your strema
<dsamarin>
you are familiar with chemicals
<Nuck>
dsamarin: So instead of a programmer's tan, you do a brogrammer's tan?
<dsamarin>
haha yeah
<dsamarin>
i suppose
<devyn>
ellio: I drink shittons of coffee and soda but I get outside a lot and am vegetarian (and not for moral reasons)
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<sanitypassing>
Coffee is overrated! REAL MEN DRINK TEA.
<joelteon>
butthole
<joelteon>
does anybody use vagrant here
<devyn>
sanitypassing: tea is unpatriotic
<joelteon>
murica
<devyn>
for you, anyway :)
<joelteon>
so you guys HAVEN'T used vagrant then
<devyn>
what's that again?
<joelteon>
an automatic vm building system
<devyn>
now why would you do that
<devyn>
make a base vm, make images
<joelteon>
because it's pretty useful
<joelteon>
and it's a lot faster to distribute a single file than a VM image
<devyn>
well not really because then your target has to download all of the setup files
<devyn>
and if you have lots of targets
<devyn>
that's useless
<joelteon>
well
<joelteon>
ok
<devyn>
compress a discard'd virtual hard disk and you'll be fine
<devyn>
if net bandwidth is an issue (i.e. deploying from home) then just deploy to one and then have that one deploy to the rest
<joelteon>
you can't impress developers
<devyn>
no, I'm just too used to people thinking their idea is hot shit and marketing it really well when really it's probably slower than how most people would do it :p
<devyn>
rails dev scarred me
<joelteon>
rails? really
<devyn>
all of these people coming out with “teh omg this fucking rocks because I'm a rockstar programmer and everything I make is great”
<devyn>
joelteon: this was back when Rails was the Big Thing™ and had a lot of influence, admittedly, on frameworks of the future
<devyn>
when Node became the Big Thing™ we saw the same attiudes (and basically the same people) there
<joelteon>
is haskell not like that?
<joelteon>
although i can see how it would be faster to distribute an image
<joelteon>
vagrant is just a "make them install it themselves" tool
<joelteon>
so...yeah
<joelteon>
maybe I'll just set up my build slave again
<devyn>
joelteon: the worst haskell gets is the endless shitty blog posts on monads
<devyn>
you don't see anywhere near the kind of marketing powerhousing for libs there :p
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<joelteon>
yeah
<joelteon>
cycle "blog posts about " ++ "monads"
<devyn>
basically
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<devyn>
“ohh I finally get monads, I should make a blog post explaining them using an analogy that worked for me!”
<devyn>
but that analogy is shitty because while you might get what monads are, you don't get why monads are, and a lot of the rest of the category theory that exists in Haskell
<devyn>
and that other knowledge is absolutely necessary before you have any authority to write a monad blog post whatsoever
<devyn>
and by that point you should have more interesting things to write about than monads :p
<joelteon>
yep
<joelteon>
i still don't really get monads
<joelteon>
but I know what typechecks
<joelteon>
so
<joelteon>
i mean there's nothing to "get" really
<joelteon>
it's just a typeclass
<devyn>
(>>=) :: m a -> (a -> m b) -> m b, return :: a -> m a, and the fact that what happens to combine m with m' is implementation specific is really all you need to know for Haskell
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<joelteon>
i don't have a specific mental model of what's going on when monadic actions happen, usually
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<purr>
<prophile> back in my day we would use a couple of wires and tap rhythmically on pins of the cpu to do our work
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<ellio>
hi
<purr>
ellio: hi!
<vil>
mornin'
<ellio>
sup
<vil>
my app does things now
<alexgordon>
sup ellio
<alexgordon>
INSTALLING MAVERICKS
<vil>
WANT
<whitequark>
hey ellio
<ellio>
hi guys
<whitequark>
how do i get bitcoins in exchange of something sane? paypal, visa, etc
<whitequark>
(yes I know why is it hard)
<ellio>
uh, you can't do so
<ellio>
which is a bitch is a bitch
<whitequark>
so you don't know a way either
<ellio>
in the U.S., you've got Coinbase, for bank accounts
<whitequark>
fuck U.S.
<ellio>
EU, bank transfer to mtGOX
<ellio>
but you're never going to be able to do it for reversible money supply, like credit or paypal
<whitequark>
hm
<whitequark>
in fact I just found a way
<whitequark>
a russian service which uses another russian service as an one-way proxy
<whitequark>
they take 6% though
<ellio>
jesus
<ellio>
fuckin' russians
<ellio>
ruining everything with their one-way-ness and proxy-ness and six-percent-ness
<alexgordon>
lol
<purr>
lol
<whitequark>
i fucking hate banks
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<whitequark>
so I changed my phone number, can I change that over the phone? FUCK NO, GO TO THE OFFICE YOU FUCKER
<whitequark>
so they have an app which allows you to confirm transactions without SMS. can I use that th confirm 3D-secure? FUCK NO, GOTTA HAVE A FUCKING MOBILE PHONE
<whitequark>
mind you this is a good bank. others are much worse
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<purr>
<judofyr> TIL alexgordon learns through his anus
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<ellio>
lol whitequark
<purr>
lol
<whitequark>
not funny :(
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
[6~[6~ghihi
<ELLIOTTCABLE>
fucking Mavericks download is making irc unusable
<joelteon>
hey I made a program in haskell that does that
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* ellio
waves to dastels
<dastels>
Hey
<joelteon>
pick 10 /usr/share/dict/words
<ellio>
I'm probably gonna try to hook up with the vagina'd-having-one for lunch, but then I'm free for the rest of the afternoon
<joelteon>
it uses a
<joelteon>
i think it uses a hashmap
<joelteon>
no, it's like
<joelteon>
oh what is it called
<ellio>
Can't dive into new toys today, though; the *fucking terrible* internet at her penthouse is glacially slow
<joelteon>
yeah, it uses a heap
<joelteon>
duh, how couldn't i think of that
<ellio>
I don't have Xcode5 yet, though I've got iOS7-iPhone5
<joelteon>
I STILL don't have my developer account
* ellio
joelteon: do you just want to use mine? >,<
<joelteon>
yeah just give me the download link
<joelteon>
I already paid for it
<joelteon>
fucking christ
<ellio>
doesn't work that way
<ellio>
have to add your phone to the system
<joelteon>
TOO BAD
<joelteon>
oh
<ellio>
BEST NON-ONION HEADLINE
<ellio>
“Eight-month erection leads to malpractice lawsuit by truck driver”
<ellio>
o7 jdhartley
<joelteon>
IS PENDING AND MAY TAKE UP TO 24 HOURS TO PROCESS
<ellio>
dastels: +1 (919) 636-4204, iMessage me; I'mma hop in the shower. I'll Blue-Line up thattaway this afternoon sometime. Even if jdhartley is busy, I need to pop in and at least say *hi* before I jet out of town again
<alexgordon>
wat
<dastels>
ellio: I'm in San Francisco all week... next week sometime?
<ellio>
dastels: I'm leaving Friday; but you definitely need to hook up with the StageBloc guys. They're great fun, even if they *are* mostly PHP devs. ;)
<ellio>
dastels: personally, I'll be back in town sometime within the next two months. Headed to the west-coast to traipse around a little.
<dastels>
ellio: traipsing around the west-coast is not to be missed.
<jdhartley>
(ps, i am not really a php dev that much really)
<ellio>
dastels: I spend a lot of time travellijg
<ellio>
have friends all over
<ellio>
this time, planning to hit up Seattle and Portland peeps
<ellio>
and maybe a trip to SF, though I don't ever seem to manage to hook up with any of the unfortunately-large number of people I know in the Bay Area
<purr>
<alexgordon> python's GC, singlehandedly, proves that capitalism is necessary for society
<whitequark>
joelteon: plot twist: you don't have any?
<gkatsev>
um... they'll probably do the rest of book 3 and start on book 4 in the next season
<joelteon>
whitequark: i don't hahve any
<joelteon>
have
<joelteon>
what's wrong with my keyboard?
<joelteon>
genuinely curious
<gkatsev>
it's haunted
<joelteon>
hauhnted
<whitequark>
gkatsev: you read the books?
<whitequark>
I didn't (yet? not sure, never read that much fiction in english before)
<gkatsev>
I did
<whitequark>
I wonder if GRRM will finish the books
<whitequark>
before the TV series
<gkatsev>
yes
<whitequark>
looking at his schedule... no?
<gkatsev>
he will finish the books before the TV show gets to the part of his books
<gkatsev>
the question is whether the TV show will span all the books
<gkatsev>
or whether they will create a movie for the conclusion or what exactly
<purr>
<gqbrielle> not really, you just poker face a couple times and there you are. gaga, gaga everywhere.
<gkatsev>
purr: shut up
<whitequark>
~five years per book. last in 2011. so, next in 2016. TV show currently finished 3rd.
<whitequark>
about one season per year
<whitequark>
so, it depends on how much seasons per book they do.
<joelteon>
i wonder if i should start reading ASOIAF
<joelteon>
it sounds pretty good
<whitequark>
>Martin is confident he will have published at least The Winds of Winter before the TV series overtakes him.[
<gkatsev>
whitequark: nah, it isn't going to be exactly that.
<whitequark>
do american shows have anime-style filler episodes?
<micahjohnston>
hey guys want to discuss language design?
<joelteon>
what's that?
<micahjohnston>
whitequark: like monster-of-the-week ones or like everyone is in costume and acting out something weird and next episode it goes back to normal
<micahjohnston>
what exactly do you mean
<vil>
and yes on both counts, depending on the show
<whitequark>
micahjohnston: just a season of something vaguely related to the theme but not on the main plot
<whitequark>
usually with abundance of tits but it's not like GoT has a shortage of them
<micahjohnston>
joelteon: it makes me sad to read a lot
<micahjohnston>
like
<micahjohnston>
grrm does not allow nice things to happen
<micahjohnston>
:p
<micahjohnston>
but it is very very hardcore
<whitequark>
micahjohnston: you spoiled child
<micahjohnston>
one of the most fully realized, best written things i've read
<whitequark>
spoiled by the unrealistic fantasy, of course.
<gkatsev>
whitequark: american shows areentirely anime-style filler episodes :P
<vil>
haha
<whitequark>
micahjohnston: how is it dystopia?
<whitequark>
like
<whitequark>
what we have around us IS dystopia
<whitequark>
something something nsa
<micahjohnston>
lol
<purr>
lol
<whitequark>
grrm's books are not that far from the actual middle ages, if you forgive some artistic license
<micahjohnston>
yeah i get it, hence the wink/tongue face lol
<micahjohnston>
but ye4ah
<whitequark>
i wonder
<micahjohnston>
i am typing like a fool today
<whitequark>
well whatever
<joelteon>
ok
<joelteon>
micahjohnston: i'll read it then
<micahjohnston>
you may also enjoy books by brandon sanderson
<micahjohnston>
like mistborn and the way of kings
<micahjohnston>
if you like grrm
<gkatsev>
brandon sanderson writes so much
<whitequark>
more than zelazny?
<joelteon>
ooh
<joelteon>
I have some zelazny
<whitequark>
my dad has quite a bit
<gkatsev>
whitequark: um... idk if more or not
<whitequark>
i think the books numbered up to 110's
<gkatsev>
whitequark: but sanderson still has been writing a lot
<whitequark>
a bookcase full of zelazny
<gkatsev>
I've recently read The Amber Chronicles. Great series
<whitequark>
kinda
<joelteon>
yeah those are pretty good
<whitequark>
I like it
<joelteon>
I didn't get through the last book
<gkatsev>
last book being 10 or 5?
<whitequark>
it goes full-on insane
<gkatsev>
the merlyn cycle is definitely weirder than the corwin cycle.
* whitequark
only read The Amber Chronicles and Lord of Light
<micahjohnston>
gkatsev: yeah he pumps out like 500k words a month
<whitequark>
didn't get the latter
<joelteon>
oh, wait
<gkatsev>
Also, I can't believe that they got someone to write The Oberon cycle >.<
<joelteon>
never mind
<joelteon>
i only got to book 4 of the corwin cycle
<micahjohnston>
also the way of kings is 1000 pages and it's got a 10 book series planned
<joelteon>
I really didn't follow it very well
<micahjohnston>
and mistborn has two more trilogies planned
<micahjohnston>
:P
<whitequark>
"Guard us from the wolf and she-wolf, and guard us from the thief, oh Night, and so will be good for us to pass"
<whitequark>
all that remains
<gkatsev>
(especially since it is known that zelazy did *not* want anyone else mucking around in his universe)
<whitequark>
that quote is like burned in my brain
<gkatsev>
sanderson has had like 2-3 books come out every year since 2007 and had a book each in 05 and 06
<whitequark>
also; discworld
<whitequark>
he writes a LOT, yet the quality doesn't suffer
<whitequark>
how does he manage to do that
<micahjohnston>
to design a language or write something
<micahjohnston>
i am now indecisive
<whitequark>
micahjohnston: don't be so dependent on activities, wishes and opinion of others
<gkatsev>
whitequark: yeah, though, unlikely we'll see any more discworld from him. His daughter is going to take over, though, it seems to make a tv series or something rather than really continue the novels
<vil>
I started writing a document describing a time-manipulation device that could serve as backstory for a sci-fi thing
<whitequark>
gkatsev: why not? alzheimer?
<gkatsev>
yeah
<whitequark>
I think he didn't stop writing?
<gkatsev>
whitequark: also, it's probably because some of the discworld books make sub-series in their own right that it hasn't really suffered
<gkatsev>
in fact, it has probably improved since the first discworld book
<whitequark>
gkatsev: absolutely
<whitequark>
i'd say he got serious from 10th onwards
<gkatsev>
I dont think he will ever stop writing until he is incapable of doing it. But I'm not sure he'll be necessarily writing discworld.
<vil>
micahjohnston: I changed style half-way through and haven't fixed the top yet, so it's a bit rough
<vil>
not done, either
<micahjohnston>
probably my favorite brandon sanderson book is the standalone mistborn book hundreds of years after the trilogy
<vil>
but I like the concept
<micahjohnston>
the alloy of law
<micahjohnston>
vil: you reminded me of it
<vil>
?
<whitequark>
duh
<micahjohnston>
because there was some ability to like
<micahjohnston>
make bubbles in which time is slowed/sped up
<whitequark>
was about to recommend some nice fiction but it was likely not translated to english
<vil>
ah
<whitequark>
:/
<vil>
crap
<gkatsev>
whitequark: what's your native language?
<vil>
I just realized that I forgot to `fossil add` some files two commits ago
<vil>
how to fix
<whitequark>
gkatsev: russian
<purr>
<eboy> Ill rue the day nuck sends me a photo of his genitals
<gkatsev>
ah, cool
<whitequark>
well, it's first
* gkatsev
knows some russian
<whitequark>
I'm not sure which is my native, now
<micahjohnston>
there was really cool stuff about interacting with the bubbles' boundaries
<gkatsev>
whitequark: heh
<whitequark>
half of my thoughts are in english for some weird reason
<micahjohnston>
for instance bullets would veer off wildly kind of like refraction
<whitequark>
and I definitely read/write more of it for years already
<micahjohnston>
when the front half is outside the bubble
<gkatsev>
yeah, i've forgotten a lot of hebrew and russian since moving to the US
<vil>
micahjohnston: interesting. I haven't quite worked out what happens with mine yet
<vil>
currently considering a straight-on pass through, haven't even considered a shearing effect
<micahjohnston>
it'd cause extreme refraction of light etc. i just realized
<vil>
yeah, because as the light passes through, it to gets slowed or sped up
<micahjohnston>
depending on how "sharp" the boundary is i guess
<micahjohnston>
and that's exactly what causes refraction
<micahjohnston>
passing from a medium to a different one with a different propagation speed
<vil>
oh good point
<vil>
neat
<vil>
I need to write more as soon as I get this commit un-mungled
<gkatsev>
whitequark: I have Roadside Picnic queued up to read. Or rather, listen. I'll try and see if I can understand the russian audiobook
<whitequark>
gkatsev: oh, Strugatsky
<gkatsev>
yeah
<whitequark>
"Monday begins at the saturday" is lovely
<gkatsev>
since last year, they released a new english translation
<gkatsev>
one that doesn't suck
<whitequark>
(idk if they translated it this way)
<gkatsev>
but since I can understand russian, i'll try the russian audiobook first
<vil>
micahjohnston: does the explanation for being unable to encase itself in a bubble make sense? or did I miss anything there?
<micahjohnston>
vil: hm it seemed handwavy
<micahjohnston>
idk though
<vil>
that's what I was worried about
<vil>
I want to go more in-depth
<micahjohnston>
i think it would have like circular effects in a way but first of all, you need to determine like
<vil>
also on HOW exactly the effect is acheived
<micahjohnston>
is it possible to affect itself?
<micahjohnston>
yeah
<whitequark>
gkatsev: and Tale of the Troika
<micahjohnston>
and if it is then figure out what kind of feedback would occur
<whitequark>
though in different sense
<whitequark>
the latter can compete with Kafka's The Castle
<vil>
I figured it would keep accelerating the change, because the machine is measuring the change in speed relative to its own position in space
<vil>
hence eventually nearing infinity
<vil>
but the explanation of the slowing of molecules worries me the most, that needs to have the most solid explanation
<vil>
and I'm not sure it's correct
<micahjohnston>
well for instancfe
<micahjohnston>
if it's slowing itself down
<micahjohnston>
then maybe when it gets slowed down its effect lessens
<whitequark>
let's talk about PLT
<vil>
micahjohnston: how come?
<whitequark>
what was a neat PL idea you've seen last?
<vil>
if its OTPM is always one, wouldn't it just keep trying to adjust it? from its point of view, it would be failing to change anything, and thus it would continue
<micahjohnston>
well
<micahjohnston>
idk you can basically choose what you want
<micahjohnston>
because it's not an actual working machine :p
<vil>
I know, but I really enjoy the discussion around it :D
<micahjohnston>
yeah i'm just saying maybe it'd have negative feedback
<micahjohnston>
when slowing down itself
<micahjohnston>
and maybe positive when speeding up
<micahjohnston>
although consider power usage
<micahjohnston>
maybe when speeding up it is positive feedback, but it uses gallons of power and burns out once it can't anymore
<vil>
mmm, god point
<vil>
*good
<vil>
hadn't considered power source yet
<vil>
so it would basically instantly burn itself out
<vil>
going either way
<vil>
I kind of like that better, actually, from a logical stance
<vil>
was hoping to use a machine trapped by itself as a plot point, though. I'll have to find another way of creating a feedback loop
<vil>
speaking of sci-fi, Ra just updated again. I think some of you guys would really enjoy it: http://qntm.org/ra
<micahjohnston>
vil: well no slowing down i think it would just like turn off, or stick at the same level
<micahjohnston>
I would say
<micahjohnston>
idk though
<micahjohnston>
so slowing down could trap it actually
<vil>
hmmm, yeah, since it would ostensibly be burning fuel even more slowly
<vil>
but at the same time using more to sustain it
<vil>
that's an interesting paradox there
<micahjohnston>
oh wow hm
<vil>
so even if it ran out "instantly" inside the bubble, it would take so long to catch up to outside again, that it's trapped?
<vil>
hmmm
<vil>
because by the time it instantly runs out of fuel, it's already slowed time to somewhere near -infinity
<vil>
er, zero, I guess
<vil>
dunno how I'm measuring that for sure yet
<vil>
god, this bends my brain
<micahjohnston>
whitequark: i am unsure what to do with tempus
<vil>
from inside the bubble, you're walking to the edge to escape, and it takes a few seconds. from outside, you can never escape
<joelteon>
wait
<micahjohnston>
everything outside would be a blur
<vil>
yep
<joelteon>
are you guys talkinga bout time bubbles
<joelteon>
talking about
<vil>
probably infinitely bright, actually
<joelteon>
<vil>
since the light would build up on the barrier
<gkatsev>
I killed skype and everything is the same except no skype and the OS runs much better
<ellio>
vil, fail
<ellio>
remove the timestamps >,<
<vil>
ellio: already did, realized as soon as I hit the button
<ellio>
already fixed
<ellio>
hi
<purr>
ellio: hi!
<eligrey>
i want my programs to use as much ram as possible
<ellio>
hi
<purr>
ellio: hi!
<eligrey>
i hate when theyre only using like 500MB ram and 10GB cache
<eligrey>
instead of 11GB of ram
<ellio>
pff eligrey's code wouldn't make a dent in Stephanie
<gkatsev>
eligrey: but why is skype using up so much ram and so much CPU while just sitting there?
<eligrey>
its not like i bought 32GB of ram for my programs to piss on
<ellio>
what should I name my next Mac Pro? :)
<eligrey>
gkatsev: idk i dont use skype
<eligrey>
its so insecure
<eligrey>
just use that new thing based off mumble that i'm going to make with gothalice
<gkatsev>
and you use irc?
<eligrey>
that thing that doesnt exist yet
<eligrey>
gkatsev: until it exists just use secure irc + mumble
<eligrey>
both support client certs
<eligrey>
and forced encryption
<ellio>
<3 Mumble
<purr>
Let it be known that ellio hearts Mumble.
<eligrey>
diffie huffman and elliptic curves are used in mumble
<eligrey>
-mumble
<purr>
eligrey: We don't use Mumble for voice-chat! Talk to us: mumble://ell.io/ (Download the client for Mac, Linux, or PC at http://mumble.sourceforge.net/)
<gkatsev>
don't? what?
<eligrey>
don't what?
<eligrey>
ellio: your mumble server is down
<ellio>
*You* think it is.
<ellio>
;)
<ellio>
I know you're all secretly the NSA. ;)
<gkatsev>
eligrey: "we don't use mumble for voice-chat"
<eligrey>
i know it's down as i cant even get a ping measurement from it
<eligrey>
anyways unlike ellio i care about having a persistant mumble server up 24/7
<eligrey>
x.oftn.org
<eligrey>
dsamarin: we need to change it to labs.oftn.org soon
<gkatsev>
labx? :P
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<alexgordon>
sup
<ellio>
hi alexgordon
<alexgordon>
I'm on mavericks
<alexgordon>
well not on here
<alexgordon>
but on my MBP
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<alexgordon>
it's cool
<dskuza>
HAY BITCHES
<joelteon>
hey bitch
<dskuza>
hey that wasn't cool
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