2014-05-25 00:46 <DocScrutinizer05> top ten famous misconceptions?
2014-05-25 00:47 <DocScrutinizer05> like "who ever needs more than 640kB RAM in his computer"?
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2014-05-25 01:24 <DocScrutinizer05> wpwrak: also aiui the recent devicetree crap in kernel makes it almost impossible to NOT boot on different systems, resp to build a device specific kernel space at all
2014-05-25 01:25 <DocScrutinizer05> seems absolutely everything in kernel space is universal now and just configures itself according to devicetree, during boot. No?
2014-05-25 01:26 <DocScrutinizer05> anything that doesn't has no chance at all to go upstream
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2014-05-25 02:47 <wpwrak> i just wonder if there's any significant number of people who'd actually use a gta04 and a neo900 in parallel
2014-05-25 02:47 <wpwrak> also, subtract these who are more than capable of helping themselves, if anything goes wrong
2014-05-25 02:48 <wpwrak> and the world is full of binaries that can probably do much worse things to the neo900. we don't worry about these either, do we ? :)
2014-05-25 02:55 <DocScrutinizer05> I don't see where you're aiming at. We need a proper hw latform ID on Neo900, sth that's more than "rev 7 of GTA04" encoded into 3 bits
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2014-05-25 11:34 <wpwrak> DocScrutinizer05: i just mean the whole concept of putting a kernel/system on the wrong platform. it's simply not a common occurrence in real life. but yes, you need that ID, though for other reasons.
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2014-05-25 12:35 <whitequark> wpwrak: any idea for a victim material other than wood?
2014-05-25 12:36 <whitequark> ooh, hm, say some soft plastic (NOT acrylic). MDPE?
2014-05-25 12:36 <whitequark> I wonder where can I get a thick sheet of MDPE
2014-05-25 12:41 <whitequark> wow, it is *expensive*. 12mm sheet 1500x3000 is over $250
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2014-05-25 13:04 <wpwrak> 12 mm - why so thick ? 1-2 mm would be plenty
2014-05-25 13:04 <wpwrak> pertinax is also good. not sure how well it resists water, though, being modified paper
2014-05-25 13:06 <wpwrak> soft plastic sounds like a good idea. i guess even acrylic wouldn't be all bad, given that you'd have coolant all around it
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2014-05-25 13:08 <whitequark> wpwrak: I eventually selected a 3mm sheet from amazon; RU vendors don't send it in lesss than 2000x1000 sizes, and I already have enough crap lying around
2014-05-25 13:08 <whitequark> (acrylic not bad) but what if I want to cut up a PCB or wood, where there's no coolant?
2014-05-25 13:09 <whitequark> it'll cost me even more broken endmills
2014-05-25 13:09 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: http://www.amazon.com/Magnesium-Shipping-65ft-75ft-GalliumSource-LLC/dp/B0051HBSI0
2014-05-25 13:09 <whitequark> read the reviews and Q&A, they're priceless
2014-05-25 13:09 <whitequark> 5 stars "Don't light indoors. Don't light indoors with it cut up and mixed with potassium nitrate."
2014-05-25 13:09 <whitequark> 6 of 6 people found the following review helpful
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2014-05-25 13:15 <whitequark> by the way, if the coolant keeps being thrown around like that, I'll verify DocScrutinizer05's suggestion about immersing PC underwater
2014-05-25 13:15 <whitequark> I would have already cut up a box to enclose the CNC machine in, but I need a bigger CNC machine to make that box
2014-05-25 13:16 <whitequark> ad inifinitum
2014-05-25 13:16 <DocScrutinizer05> suggestion????
2014-05-25 13:16 <DocScrutinizer05> I *asked* if you *did* it. Never _suggested_ it
2014-05-25 13:18 <DocScrutinizer05> for your "box" I anyway *suggest* using a 5mm steel wire to bend a rectangle shape and stick plastic foil sheets to it to make a nice curtain around your CNC
2014-05-25 13:19 <whitequark> ooooh, that's actually a very great idea
2014-05-25 13:19 <whitequark> thanks
2014-05-25 13:19 <DocScrutinizer05> much more convenient than a *box*
2014-05-25 13:19 <whitequark> exactly!
2014-05-25 13:19 <DocScrutinizer05> and cheaper
2014-05-25 13:21 <DocScrutinizer05> once your CNC station is finalized, I probably should get a poster to stick to my wall above my desk
2014-05-25 13:22 <DocScrutinizer05> I'll use a transparent marker pen of my fav color then, to mark all the details I would've done exactly same way ;-)
2014-05-25 13:22 <whitequark> :D
2014-05-25 13:23 <whitequark> sure, you'll have plenty of images of it
2014-05-25 13:23 <DocScrutinizer05> actually I guess I will use up two markers ;-P
2014-05-25 13:24 <DocScrutinizer05> of course depends on how far those last, and on size of poster
2014-05-25 13:24 * whitequark is cutting up some more acrylic
2014-05-25 13:25 <whitequark> and for I think the first time, I do it during the daytime
2014-05-25 13:25 <DocScrutinizer05> friggin EU elections, have to leave my flat for that, stop the hell spawn TTIP
2014-05-25 13:25 <whitequark> ttip?
2014-05-25 13:25 <whitequark> oh
2014-05-25 13:25 <whitequark> oh crap
2014-05-25 13:25 <DocScrutinizer05> EU-US free trade shit
2014-05-25 13:26 <whitequark> "free trade" aka "we get to control you even more than now", right?
2014-05-25 13:26 <DocScrutinizer05> US assraping whole EU
2014-05-25 13:26 <DocScrutinizer05> us companies (!!) can sue EU states(!!) for billions of compensation when they are not happy with EU laws
2014-05-25 13:27 <DocScrutinizer05> court is a commission of "experts" meeting behind closed doors
2014-05-25 13:27 <DocScrutinizer05> ROTFL
2014-05-25 13:33 <DocScrutinizer05> is bisphenol-A forbidden for food packaging plastic in US now, or not?
2014-05-25 13:34 <whitequark> http://www.fda.gov/newsevents/publichealthfocus/ucm064437.htm
2014-05-25 13:34 <DocScrutinizer05> and BEER!! what they sell as "beer" is US is ridiculous
2014-05-25 13:35 <whitequark> tl;dr: no. The National Toxicology Program does not make regulatory recommendations. With respect to neurological and developmental outcomes of BPA, the Program stated that “additional research is needed to more fully assess the functional, long-term impacts of exposures to bisphenol A on the developing brain and behavior.”[
2014-05-25 13:35 <whitequark> (as of 2013 at least)
2014-05-25 13:36 <DocScrutinizer05> supporting the industry’s actions   facilitating the development   supporting efforts   FDA is seeking   FDA is not recommending
2014-05-25 13:36 <DocScrutinizer05> thought as much
2014-05-25 13:38 <DocScrutinizer05> EU forbids production of vacuum cleaner with more than dunno 1000W, starting RSN. Wonder what US manufacturers will think about it
2014-05-25 13:39 <wpwrak> it's silly restriction anyway
2014-05-25 13:39 <whitequark> the hell EU has against vacuum cleaners?
2014-05-25 13:39 <DocScrutinizer05> well, actually I think the EU is plain wrong here, but it nevertheless would be a first quite obvious case for US companies sue EU states for not allowing the US products on their market
2014-05-25 13:40 <wpwrak> but yes, free trade = subjugation
2014-05-25 13:41 <DocScrutinizer05> EU wants to ban inefficient products and improve the overall energy efficiency. They are idiots to start with stuff like incandescent lamps and vacuum cleaners
2014-05-25 13:41 <DocScrutinizer05> and they are absolute indiotic jackasses to *forbid* that stuff nstead of simply charging it with taxes to make it inattractive
2014-05-25 13:42 <whitequark> contraband vacuum cleaners!
2014-05-25 13:43 <whitequark> welcome to 21st century
2014-05-25 13:44 <wpwrak> seems that they took some hints from exemplary countries like venezuela and argentina
2014-05-25 13:44 <wpwrak> anyway, gotta get ready for the feast
2014-05-25 13:49 <DocScrutinizer05> first think EU should forbid are single-block aircons - the ones that have a tube out the open(!) window for blowing out the hot air from heat pump. Of course for each cunic meter of hot air the monoblock blows out the window, somewhere new hot air from outside enters the room
2014-05-25 13:49 <DocScrutinizer05> cubic*
2014-05-25 13:49 <DocScrutinizer05> thing* - damn!
2014-05-25 13:50 <DocScrutinizer05> those are really about the most stupic technical devices I ever seen
2014-05-25 13:51 <DocScrutinizer05> if at least they had TWO tubes, one for blowing out the heated air, and another one for getting fresh not-so-hot air from outside, for cooling the condenser... but noooo, they take the air for cooling the condenser from the room air
2014-05-25 13:52 <DocScrutinizer05> the same air they just cooled down on evaporator side, and then they heat it up again and blow it out the window
2014-05-25 13:52 <DocScrutinizer05> it's actually surprising that those critters are able to lower room temperature at all
2014-05-25 13:53 <DocScrutinizer05> EU does some good regulations as well, e.g. for fridges
2014-05-25 13:54 <DocScrutinizer05> at least I guess they do
2014-05-25 13:55 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway with TTIP we had to eat all their toxic waste, since we couldn't even tell where there's none of it in any of our food
2014-05-25 13:58 <DocScrutinizer05> and of course we couldn't even sue the US microwave ofen manufacturer for not telling EU citizens to "not use oven to dry cat!"
2014-05-25 13:59 <DocScrutinizer05> So basically US companies can sell in EU the crap they can't sell in US
2014-05-25 13:59 <DocScrutinizer05> as long as they were _allowed_ to sell it, just would break their neck since US customers would sue them
2014-05-25 14:01 <DocScrutinizer05> in EU no risk of getting sued, so... "Oh damn! stop shipping to US, direct all shipments to EU!"
2014-05-25 14:02 <DocScrutinizer05> whitequark: I already seriously pondered to contraband incandescent lamps
2014-05-25 14:04 <DocScrutinizer05> for my bathroom I planned electric heater not made of two heater blowers or silly ugly stuff like http://www.heizstrahler-direkt.de/infrarot-heizstrahler/bad-sanitar.html but rather have a 300 dimmed 40W incandescent lamps all over the wall
2014-05-25 14:05 <DocScrutinizer05> but noooooo, incandescent lamps are *forbidden*, even for heating purposes
2014-05-25 14:08 <DocScrutinizer05> well, I still could get halogen incandescent, but they cost "more than gold"
2014-05-25 14:11 <DocScrutinizer05> meh! http://www.gluehbirne.de/?ref=a1
2014-05-25 14:13 <DocScrutinizer05> http://www.gluehbirne.de/10-x-OSRAM-Halogen-Eco-Gluehbirne-30W-40W-230V-E27-Classic-A-PRO-64542_1  -  for classic non-halogen this would be like 30ct per unit, not 1EUR50
2014-05-25 14:15 <DocScrutinizer05> while now they are of course 3 times as expensive, but I'm amazed that awesome shop still offers them:  http://www.gluehbirne.de/100-x-PHILIPS-Gluehbirne-40W-E27-MATT-Gluehlampe-Gluehbirnen-Gluehlampen-40-Watt_1
2014-05-25 14:20 <whitequark> idiotic, right
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2014-05-25 14:34 <DocScrutinizer05> osram: dimming a 100W incandescent to level of a 60W increases livespan by factor 10
2014-05-25 14:35 <DocScrutinizer05> i.e. 10,000h
2014-05-25 14:36 <DocScrutinizer05> "level" means lumen, the 100W eats a 78W to create the same lumen like a genuine 60W at 100%
2014-05-25 14:37 <DocScrutinizer05> since I want to use them for heating, I actually _want_ that reduction in "efficiency", that's the primary reason why I dim them.
2014-05-25 14:37 <DocScrutinizer05> that's great I found this shop
2014-05-25 14:38 <DocScrutinizer05> I still can realize my bathroom heater project
2014-05-25 15:00 <DocScrutinizer05> actually this article (sorry, german) is quite instructive: http://www.osram.de/osram_de/nachhaltigkeit/nachhaltige-produkte/nachhaltigkeitskriterien/primaere-leistungsmerkmale/lebensdauer/index.jsp
2014-05-25 15:18 <DocScrutinizer05> o/
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2014-05-25 16:02 <kyak> i can easily find 250 W infrared lamps in Russia (made specially for heating) -dunno if it's the case for Germany
2014-05-25 16:09 <DocScrutinizer51> well yeah, you can find all sorts of lamps, just the very common and cheap E27 60W or 100W are outlawed
2014-05-25 16:11 <DocScrutinizer51> halogen still allowed but only clear, no matte. Attention, Idiots Ahead!
2014-05-25 16:13 <kyak> yeah, i think 100W E27 are becoming rare here as well..
2014-05-25 16:13 <kyak> 60W are still widely available
2014-05-25 16:13 <DocScrutinizer51> once they were 4 a buck, at every supermarket
2014-05-25 16:40 <whitequark> http://www.amazon.com/Ground-Yellow-Brimstone-Approved-Feedstock/dp/B003OJDEEI
2014-05-25 16:40 <whitequark> do people... *eat* sulfur? O_o
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2014-05-25 18:31 <larsc> I wonder if that just isn't a bought comment
2014-05-25 18:39 <DocScrutinizer05> huh?
2014-05-25 18:39 <DocScrutinizer05> SO2 treatment is an age old pretty common - for some food and beverage - conservation method
2014-05-25 18:40 <DocScrutinizer05> https://www.google.com/search?q=geschwefel
2014-05-25 18:41 <DocScrutinizer05> https://www.google.com/search?q=geschwefelt    dang
2014-05-25 18:42 * DocScrutinizer05 ponders about occasions where use of term "conservation of conversation" was appropriate/possible
2014-05-25 18:58 <whitequark> fascinating
2014-05-25 18:59 * whitequark is trying to make a lens with his CNC, just for fun
2014-05-25 18:59 <whitequark> a simple parabolic one
2014-05-25 18:59 <whitequark> plano-convex
2014-05-25 19:02 <DocScrutinizer51> hmmmm thats prolly a quite demanding task
2014-05-25 19:20 <whitequark> yeah
2014-05-25 19:21 <whitequark> the machine has .05mm repeat positioning accuracy, but apparently a single step is somewhere between 10-20 micron
2014-05-25 19:21 <whitequark> so if I don't need repeat positioning with that precision, but just want to make a helix, it could work out pretty well (or not)
2014-05-25 19:22 <whitequark> and then I'd just polish it by hand, no big deal
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2014-05-25 20:52 <whitequark> http://fehu.whitequark.org/files/camglitch.gif
2014-05-25 21:01 <DocScrutinizer05> wut?
2014-05-25 21:02 <DocScrutinizer05> no idea what I'm looking at
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2014-05-25 21:25 <DocScrutinizer05> whitequark: how long will russian people tolerate or even ignore or not notice/question the lies they are told by Putin-controlled russian media about Ukraine?
2014-05-25 21:28 <DocScrutinizer05> how long will they applaud the obvious and even admitted lies Putin himself is telled all day long?
2014-05-25 21:28 <DocScrutinizer05> is telling*
2014-05-25 21:30 <DocScrutinizer05> He admitted in a life show in Russian TV that regular Russian army been in Crimea al the time from very beginning, something he outright denied just a week before
2014-05-25 21:30 <DocScrutinizer05> live*
2014-05-25 21:33 <DocScrutinizer05> Is there a mentality in Russia similar to that in some muslim countries that considers lying to the enemy a honorable thing, and an enemy that doesn't shoot the liar right away is a chicken and an idiot?
2014-05-25 21:35 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: (gif) it's some aliasing glitch in the OpenSCAM renderer
2014-05-25 21:35 <whitequark> it's funny
2014-05-25 21:36 <whitequark> (putin) why are you asking me? I'm hardly representative for all russian people
2014-05-25 21:36 <whitequark> but if you want a guess...
2014-05-25 21:39 <whitequark> actually, no guesses. I don't have any insight whatsoever into a typical football (or is it hockey today?) fan screaming something under my window after consuming a sixpack of beer
2014-05-25 21:39 <whitequark> I doubt logic or reflection ever crosses that mind
2014-05-25 21:59 <wpwrak> it also seems that DocScrutinizer05 is exposed to large doses of western propaganda. as far as i can tell, putin isn't doing anything half as bad as the US had done without the west even getting concerned.
2014-05-25 22:08 <whitequark> could also be that muslims are "those non-people" and eastern europeans evoke at least some feeling of kinship
2014-05-25 22:09 <whitequark> (not as much directed to DocScrutinizer05 but to west in general.)
2014-05-25 22:13 <wpwrak> yes, that's quite possible. of course, "muslims" would then also have to include a number of other people, asians, latinos, etc.
2014-05-25 22:19 <DocScrutinizer05> wpwrak: again, since you seem to have forgotten about last time I tild you: I', not listening to any propaganda, and asling about putin's lies is hardly related to any such propaganda even when I would do
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2014-05-25 22:21 <DocScrutinizer05> please reread your own statement one before last and try to see how little sense it makes
2014-05-25 22:23 <DocScrutinizer05> whitequark: thanks! I see, it's hard for anybody with a sane mind to guess about what the plebs will do
2014-05-25 22:27 <DocScrutinizer05> wpwrak: when you honestly think that you need to ignore what Russia does to destabilize Ukraine, just so you demonstrate that you're not suffering from influence of western propaganda, then I guess you're already hopelessly brainwashed by eastern propaganda, since that#s exactly what Russia basically tries to transport with all the lies they spread
2014-05-25 22:29 <DocScrutinizer05> when you think a past crime done by A justifies a crime now B is doing, then I wonder what's your concept of humanity
2014-05-25 23:01 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: http://i.imgur.com/QSO4jWs.jpg
2014-05-25 23:01 <whitequark> in 100µm layers
2014-05-25 23:01 <whitequark> it's really smooth to touch
2014-05-25 23:03 <whitequark> I didn't use acrylic because constantly hauling water for 40+ minutes is not something I'm looking forward to
2014-05-25 23:14 <DocScrutinizer05> why don't you place the pump under the table into the bucket where the water gathers?
2014-05-25 23:16 <whitequark> well, let's start with the fact that I want to phase out the table-and-bucket thing completely
2014-05-25 23:16 <whitequark> because water slowly kills the table, inexplicably oozing through some not-enough-sealed edges and making the MDF expand
2014-05-25 23:16 <whitequark> granted, I bought this table specifically as a worktable, and I'll leave it in RU most likely, but it's still not nice
2014-05-25 23:17 <DocScrutinizer05> :nod:
2014-05-25 23:17 <whitequark> then continue to the fact that there is a LOT of pulp that results from milling acrylic
2014-05-25 23:18 <whitequark> like, I recently milled several parts with total edge length somewhere under 1m, and there's several cubic cm of acrylic chips
2014-05-25 23:18 <whitequark> I'm not sure I want to recirculate that
2014-05-25 23:18 <DocScrutinizer05> yeah
2014-05-25 23:19 <whitequark> the pump *probably* wouldn't give a fuck, the nozzle has some likelihood of clogging, and the endmill for sure doesn't want to recut chips
2014-05-25 23:19 <DocScrutinizer05> that's the whole point of using water ;-)
2014-05-25 23:19 <whitequark> exactly
2014-05-25 23:19 <DocScrutinizer05> avoid recut
2014-05-25 23:19 <whitequark> well, and cooling
2014-05-25 23:20 <DocScrutinizer05> well, and cooling
2014-05-25 23:20 <whitequark> ahem :)
2014-05-25 23:20 <whitequark> with my new system, it's really great. before I made it truly flood, the chips still stayed there, they just didn't get too much in the way of endmill
2014-05-25 23:21 <whitequark> with the Enhanced Flow™, there is absolutely no chips in the work area
2014-05-25 23:26 <DocScrutinizer05> how about using tap water for source, and the pump to move the gathered waste water to the sewer?
2014-05-25 23:29 <DocScrutinizer05> for extra credits on leeteness, use a electromagnetic valve from an old washing machine to automatically start tap water via CNC controller (e.g. a relais in parallel to spindle motor, or whatever)
2014-05-25 23:30 <whitequark> no need for weird setups, the box has an output specially for that (I'd still need the relay though)
2014-05-25 23:30 <roh> whitequark: what are you milling that you cant cool with oil-mist and or air?
2014-05-25 23:30 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: tap water... this would involve almost 10m of tubing. not too good
2014-05-25 23:31 <whitequark> roh: acrylic
2014-05-25 23:31 <whitequark> if I don't use water, it destroys my endmills pretty much immediately and/or has really shitty finish, basically just melted bumpy crap
2014-05-25 23:32 <whitequark> oil-mist? like hell I'm going to have everything covered in oil. everything covered is water is bad enough already (remember I'm not american and don't have a dedicated garage, just a tiny apartment.)
2014-05-25 23:32 <DocScrutinizer05> :nod:  in line with common knowledge as of the intarwebs
2014-05-25 23:33 <DocScrutinizer05> for milling acrylic, lots of water are strongly recommended
2014-05-25 23:33 <DocScrutinizer05> well, water anyway
2014-05-25 23:34 <DocScrutinizer05> given the chips make a nice slurry with the water, I think _lots_ of water are OK
2014-05-25 23:34 <roh> whitequark: maybe just mill slower.. not only less feed, also less rpm
2014-05-25 23:34 <DocScrutinizer05> NOPE
2014-05-25 23:34 <whitequark> roh: under 7000rpm it begins to lose power rapidly
2014-05-25 23:34 <DocScrutinizer05> exactly wrong
2014-05-25 23:35 <whitequark> and I tried to go as slow as it's sane... say 10mm/min (ten). same result
2014-05-25 23:35 <roh> whitequark: i see.
2014-05-25 23:35 <DocScrutinizer05> the slower you cut acrylic, the more it heats up
2014-05-25 23:35 <roh> DocScrutinizer05: only if you keep the rpm up
2014-05-25 23:35 <DocScrutinizer05> right
2014-05-25 23:35 <whitequark> yeah, that was my conclusion as well. very rapid feeds compared to slow ones, on same rpm, seem to somewhat lessen the damage, but it's bad for other reasons
2014-05-25 23:35 <roh> whitequark: sounds like a case to cool with water and alcohol 50/50 floodstyle
2014-05-25 23:36 <DocScrutinizer05> reducing RPM even more prone to clog mill with chips
2014-05-25 23:36 <whitequark> roh: well, I just use water right now
2014-05-25 23:36 <whitequark> floodstyle exactly, about 1L/5min
2014-05-25 23:36 <roh> maybe use metal (aluminium) clamping tools
2014-05-25 23:36 <whitequark> wait, are you basically suggesting I cool it down with vodka? :D
2014-05-25 23:36 <roh> well.. yes... and no.
2014-05-25 23:36 <whitequark> rofl
2014-05-25 23:37 <roh> you drink the vodka and give the undrinkable industrial shit to your mill
2014-05-25 23:37 <DocScrutinizer05> alcohol actually might improve results
2014-05-25 23:37 <whitequark> (clamping tools) I have a wooden board with a set of embedded nuts, as a victim material slash fixture, but it really tends to expand and mess things up
2014-05-25 23:37 <DocScrutinizer05> 50/50 sounds OK
2014-05-25 23:38 <DocScrutinizer05> maybe rather use 30/70 alc/H2O
2014-05-25 23:38 <whitequark> the table is Al and it's fine with water all over it. some screws are apparently Fe though and give off rust stains :( damn greedy communist
2014-05-25 23:38 <roh> yep. i used mdf and later multiplex as well.. but that sucks when you got more than one piece to make since it looses precision fast
2014-05-25 23:38 <whitequark> exactly
2014-05-25 23:38 <whitequark> roh: have you thought of using mdpe?
2014-05-25 23:38 <DocScrutinizer05> non-flammable
2014-05-25 23:38 <roh> mdpe?
2014-05-25 23:39 <whitequark> or hdpe. polyethylene, the harder kind
2014-05-25 23:39 <whitequark> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IK055WK/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
2014-05-25 23:39 <whitequark> like that, I bought two sheets for a test
2014-05-25 23:39 <roh> sounds like very wobbly and not really temperature proof
2014-05-25 23:39 <whitequark> it doesn't expand, is a good victim (won't break endmills), easy to process
2014-05-25 23:39 <whitequark> wobbly... but I screw this down hard to the table anyway
2014-05-25 23:40 <roh> i was actually thinkink of  building a clamping table with pneumatics
2014-05-25 23:40 <DocScrutinizer05> wobbly is no problem since support from table. Temperature shouldn't be an issue either
2014-05-25 23:40 <whitequark> temperature proof... if your victim material is that hot you've got a problem
2014-05-25 23:40 <roh> we recently got a *load of pneumatic actuators and stuff for air-pressure..
2014-05-25 23:40 <whitequark> roh: (pneumatics) sounds really fragile (1 chip and it's done), and you can't really mill all the way down
2014-05-25 23:40 <whitequark> so you have to break out the part, then sand down edges. ew
2014-05-25 23:40 <roh> thus i was thinking of building a universal clamping tool for rectangular flat stuff
2014-05-25 23:41 <roh> whitequark: its industrial stuff, cylinders etc in completely encapsuled, linear actuators, even some rotational ones.
2014-05-25 23:41 <roh> some linear bearing rails and gliders and various bosch-profile parts and mechanics
2014-05-25 23:42 <DocScrutinizer05> nice stuff
2014-05-25 23:42 <DocScrutinizer05> just air actuators have a well defined force but no defined position
2014-05-25 23:42 <whitequark> interesting
2014-05-25 23:43 <DocScrutinizer05> they are usually "elastic"
2014-05-25 23:43 <roh> http://img.directindustry.com/images_di/photo-g/double-rod-double-acting-pneumatic-cylinders-20363-4015376.jpg such and similar ones
2014-05-25 23:43 <roh> DocScrutinizer05: thats fine. i want something to clamp with defineable force.. i can do that with a pressure-regulator then. pressure = force
2014-05-25 23:44 <DocScrutinizer05> thus you usually only use them "binary" - I.E. move to either end of actuator way
2014-05-25 23:44 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, for that they are ideal
2014-05-25 23:45 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: you could have a ratio of pressures on both sides
2014-05-25 23:46 <whitequark> buuut you need some kind of closed loop to keep that ratio constant in face of external force
2014-05-25 23:46 <whitequark> and it's probably just not worth it
2014-05-25 23:46 <DocScrutinizer05> a friend of mine did apprentice at MAN, where the chief of the hall had an own in-hall office with windows that opened and closed with such pneumatic actuators. One day they adjusted the pressure regulator for that contraption from 0.2 to 8bar X-P
2014-05-25 23:47 <whitequark> haha. not even one window survived?
2014-05-25 23:47 <DocScrutinizer05> exactly
2014-05-25 23:48 <whitequark> bet he was pissed off
2014-05-25 23:48 <DocScrutinizer05> I guess that's true
2014-05-25 23:48 <DocScrutinizer05> but of course nobody confessed the prank
2014-05-25 23:49 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: btw, why would cooling it with vodka be better than just water?
2014-05-25 23:49 <whitequark> alcohol has lower heat capacity
2014-05-25 23:50 <DocScrutinizer05> I think a) alcohol has some ointment properties, and b) it's obviously reducing the boiling temperature
2014-05-25 23:50 <DocScrutinizer05> a drop or two of detergent would also be wort a test, I guess
2014-05-25 23:51 * whitequark imagines a combination of all of the above. drunk whitequark babysitting a CNC mill soaked in vodka and constantly producing soap bubbles
2014-05-25 23:52 <DocScrutinizer05> yeah XD
2014-05-25 23:52 <DocScrutinizer05> I don't think combination of detergent and alcohol is a good idea
2014-05-25 23:53 <whitequark> frankly I consider the smell of ethanol disgusting enough to not want to try this
2014-05-25 23:53 <DocScrutinizer05> the both may react with each other in quite surprising ways
2014-05-25 23:53 <whitequark> also if someone visits my apartment, they'll be really worried
2014-05-25 23:53 <whitequark> "it's... uhh... for cooling the CNC mill. yeah!"
2014-05-25 23:54 <whitequark> "it has ointment properties! *hiccup*"
2014-05-25 23:54 * whitequark coughs
2014-05-25 23:54 <DocScrutinizer05> others just clean windows with it
2014-05-25 23:54 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: (combination of detergent and ethanol) that sounds like a weird claim
2014-05-25 23:55 <DocScrutinizer05> not really, see soap immobilized hydrocarbon
2014-05-25 23:55 <whitequark> detergent is usually a glycerol complex ether of fatty acids
2014-05-25 23:55 <whitequark> or some variation thereof
2014-05-25 23:55 <whitequark> nothing to react with -OH
2014-05-25 23:55 <DocScrutinizer05> aka soap spirit, aka e.g. Esbit
2014-05-25 23:59 <DocScrutinizer05> ok, esbit is not exactly with soap, it seems
2014-05-25 23:59 <DocScrutinizer05> and I dunno if soap actually reacts with alcohol, or only with non water mixable hydrocarbon liquids