2014-04-01 00:00 sorry. I'm a irritating English man :| 2014-04-01 00:01 please help me by saying/pointing out when I'm not clear enough 2014-04-01 00:01 ok 2014-04-01 00:02 sometimes I opt for the easy option for my brain regarding my wording when trying to write 2014-04-01 00:03 viric has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 2014-04-01 00:03 FSF would be well-advised to define their domain of competence as "any code that gets *executed* on the same CPU or in same RAM like the OS core under scrutiny" 2014-04-01 00:04 maybe even augment that: 2014-04-01 00:05 ever enough English is my native language. I've spent the last few years trying to use different words but it can and does get messy :D 2014-04-01 00:05 "any code that gets *executed* on the same CPU or in same RAM like the OS core under scrutiny, or on a system that can access said CPU or RAM without said CPU controlling every aspect of such access" 2014-04-01 00:06 hmm 2014-04-01 00:06 (english) sorry my english skill got trained by reading american Byte magazine 2014-04-01 00:06 hehe 2014-04-01 00:06 I hardly can understand a restaurant menu 2014-04-01 00:06 dare i say why not post to the fsf and the fsfe mailing list? 2014-04-01 00:07 becuase there's a lot of fanatics that I don't see any benefit in engaging into battles with them 2014-04-01 00:08 viric has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 00:08 I can try to help by being a middle man. I would have thought that you would be able to have a conversation like we have been having 2014-04-01 00:09 when you've read my above linked tmo posts, you know that Stallman didn't answer even a week after my last mail suggesting my better approach of close monitoring of peripherals. Well, guess what! He still didn't 2014-04-01 00:10 but then, privacy is not the primary goal of FSF. FS is 2014-04-01 00:10 I can't complain about reply times. I'm terrible my self is one reason. 2014-04-01 00:10 privacy isn't because you get privacy via FS 2014-04-01 00:11 FSF's "RYF" campain is a move to force hw and chip makers to open up their closed specs and docs 2014-04-01 00:11 good thing too 2014-04-01 00:11 viric has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 2014-04-01 00:11 alas we're the completely wrong target 2014-04-01 00:11 and tbh I consider that hubris 2014-04-01 00:11 tbh? 2014-04-01 00:12 FSF will - or already has failed on that 2014-04-01 00:12 to be honest 2014-04-01 00:12 arr 2014-04-01 00:13 moving on.... 2014-04-01 00:13 so with the OP 2014-04-01 00:13 chip manufs will NOT disclose their intelectual property in WLAN firmware and/or GPU driver stuff, since that's killing their business by handing out their best asset to their competitors 2014-04-01 00:14 going back then to firware..... 2014-04-01 00:14 there been that move in linux at large to force hw manufs to not provide linux drivers that are not completely FOSS. The result been that hw manufs didn't care and worst case simply didn't provide *any* linux drivers and/or support 2014-04-01 00:15 buzzword GPL-v3 2014-04-01 00:16 wpwrak can elaborate on the details, I guess 2014-04-01 00:20 how is "software to interface with the bloody hardware" bad for showing how there hardware works in important ways. I don't want cop X to have yet another evil monoly. I don't want there so called need above mine. if we all insist on free drivers and firmware then that means for any of them to pertisetat in the markect they have to free the sofrware up or they don't get markect. and so we end up with a fair market cus 2014-04-01 00:20 they all do it. like with having the same price to post a parcel to someone who lives in the country side as someone who lives in a city 2014-04-01 00:20 viric has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 00:21 participate/sell to the market 2014-04-01 00:22 arielenter1 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 2014-04-01 00:23 Web-aptosid876_: I have a question for you: I have a laptop that is all fine and in line with RYF, except for the plugged in GSM module. Now I unplug that module and send the laptop to FSF for RYF cert. When I got the cert I advertise the laptop with that RYF badge but I offer customers to have the GSM modem card plugged in before I send the product to them. What we got here? Cheating? FSF cert rendered misleading? Or simply freedom 2014-04-01 00:23 of customer to decide whether or not he wants that modem card in his certified product? 2014-04-01 00:23 .com's that then don't provide support are trying to twist our arm. lets not put up with company's like that. makes it easy. don't buy there things 2014-04-01 00:23 acceptable cheating 2014-04-01 00:24 acceptable "cheating" 2014-04-01 00:24 sorry, I don't understand "cop X2 and "monoly" 2014-04-01 00:25 "pertisetat"? 2014-04-01 00:25 participate 2014-04-01 00:26 cop=company X= 2014-04-01 00:26 >>if we all insist<< is the pint where your utopy dies 2014-04-01 00:26 point* 2014-04-01 00:26 I regetted that worded when I reread it after pressing enter 2014-04-01 00:26 wording 2014-04-01 00:27 re-read 2014-04-01 00:27 with a good amount of us insisting 2014-04-01 00:28 but we can get a lot more instst indirectly via projects like QiMod's rhombus-tech and the EOMA spec 2014-04-01 00:29 insisting 2014-04-01 00:29 s/instst/insisting/ 2014-04-01 00:29 the whole linux sector is already so small that most hw manufs don't care. The percentage of linux users willing to insist in FOSS firmware stacks in peripherals like modem, WLAN, whatever is microscopically small 2014-04-01 00:30 exactly hence I'm so keen about qimod and EOMA 2014-04-01 00:31 and I have to say, I'm damn happy about not every script kiddie in my neighborjood can flash the newest leetest "make all phonecalls go down and all phones start ringing" hacked firmware to their average cheap android phone GSM chipset 2014-04-01 00:31 to put qimod and eoma and makeplaylive.com simply: a non-evil innovation apple 2014-04-01 00:32 so what?, stuff the script kiddie 2014-04-01 00:33 "so what?" nothing, it's fine the way it is 2014-04-01 00:33 lol 2014-04-01 00:33 in that regard 2014-04-01 00:35 there are savvy people like Harald Welte (also associated to Openmoko) and Dieter Spaar (too) and others, who actually can do proper RE of a GSM stack and use the GTA03 et al calypso modem chipset to investigate on properties and flaws of a GSM cell/network in a non-intrusive way. 2014-04-01 00:36 and that's absolutely enough of freedom in that regard, for my taste 2014-04-01 00:36 s/GTA03/GTA02/ dang! 2014-04-01 00:38 viric has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 2014-04-01 00:38 I'd like to see monitormode in GSM modems being mandatory as of 3GPP AT specs, and offering a rich set of info. But that's it with my hopes for changes in the modem "freedom" situation 2014-04-01 00:39 sounds like the real issue is the gsm system needs a over-hall 2014-04-01 00:41 just becuase freedom can by used by twats doesn't make it a bad thing. and no I don't advocate gangsters -"free men"- gangsters take the freedom to fuck others and deny others there freedom. evil beeps **** 2014-04-01 00:42 anyway FSF approach of "when *we* can't write and flash a new GSM radio stack firmware to the modem, then *nobody* may do it" is not really any sane concept. It only serves for avoiding conflicts with FSF self-image 2014-04-01 00:42 hmm 2014-04-01 00:43 viric has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 00:44 hum hum 2014-04-01 00:45 whatever, I decided that Neo900 isn't interested in FSF and what they do 2014-04-01 00:45 ok 2014-04-01 00:45 big waste of time 2014-04-01 00:45 we know we do better for *our* customers than what FSF tries to establish 2014-04-01 00:46 I guess you didn't write the free software related text on the website ? :p 2014-04-01 00:47 hmm? which text? which website? 2014-04-01 00:47 neo900 2014-04-01 00:47 the same text that got me intersted 2014-04-01 00:47 all text on neo900 websitze is approved by me 2014-04-01 00:48 covered my interested 2014-04-01 00:48 s 2014-04-01 00:48 :) 2014-04-01 00:49 we don't have uch software-related text there, though 2014-04-01 00:49 mich* 2014-04-01 00:49 damn, MUCH 2014-04-01 00:49 o/ 2014-04-01 00:49 n8 2014-04-01 00:50 a lot more then other projects 2014-04-01 00:50 :) 2014-04-01 00:54 it's good what there is when I look. though I had times of lack of confidence reguarding non-free blobs but then there was something I read that settled me. 2014-04-01 00:54 looked 2014-04-01 00:54 the text was good when I looked. 2014-04-01 00:55 right bed time really for me 2014-04-01 01:00 so with the open pandora: hopefully gpu 3d acel isn't needed. wifi blob is mac address and not any important security related bits basicly I need not worry and why the flip does the joystick need non-free blobs according to pcercuei. so now to find out if the non-free junk (like user apps umm like games) is easy to separate in the package manager/repos and uninstall 2014-04-01 01:04 looks like this might anwser most of my questions http://boards.openpandora.org/topic/7085-how-free-is-the-openpandora/ 2014-04-01 01:18 dos1 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 2014-04-01 01:37 Jay7 has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 2014-04-01 01:43 lol http://novamobileappsworld.blogspot.de/2014/03/xciting-affordable-smartphones.html - a 4 weeks old by still maybe news to some of you. Nokia goes android 2014-04-01 01:52 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 02:00 atommann has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 02:01 arielenter has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 2014-04-01 02:02 openpandora does look like it is the best anwser for my needs, I just hope I don't regret it. cus gwc-zero sounds like it will be a fully free sytem in the future but the pandea has keyboard,2 sd, line-in even, bigger screen. when I look at http://pandorawiki.org/USB_compatibility_list i'm a little conerand about wether i might have wifi doom and I assume it comes with the usb audio interface class driver 2014-04-01 02:03 thanks for you help and I leave my irc on and for now I'll get some sleep 2014-04-01 02:04 so post any replys and i'll read them in a few hours time 2014-04-01 02:05 found this sudo su 2014-04-01 02:05 opkg remove libgles-omap3 2014-04-01 02:05 rm /lib/firmware/wl1251-fw.bin 2014-04-01 02:06 the guy also says to remove pandora-pndstore it get a free system, whys that? non-free pkgs listed in the package manager gui? 2014-04-01 02:06 it=to 2014-04-01 02:07 oh and I assume I can play full res video on the cpu. I don't see why not 2014-04-01 02:12 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 02:12 arielenter has quit [Client Quit] 2014-04-01 02:13 opkg remove pandora-firmware 2014-04-01 02:13 i wonder if that includes the nubs? kind-a hoping note 2014-04-01 02:14 not 2014-04-01 02:18 then again theres so many twats on the OP forums I think I might go mad :( arrg 2014-04-01 02:27 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 02:30 then again the gcw-zero has a vibrator moter and the OP doesn't it seams. a vibrator would help a lot with alarms. oh I don't know anymore 2014-04-01 02:30 right bed 2014-04-01 03:19 nicksydney has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2014-04-01 03:41 DocScrutinizer05 has quit [Disconnected by services] 2014-04-01 03:41 DocScrutinizer05 has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 04:43 xiangfu has quit [Quit: leaving] 2014-04-01 05:22 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 05:25 michael_lee has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 05:27 michael_lee has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 2014-04-01 05:34 valhalla has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2014-04-01 05:44 michael_lee has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 05:46 valhalla has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 05:52 michael_lee has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 2014-04-01 05:54 michael_lee has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 05:55 vt has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 06:02 vt has quit [Quit: Leaving] 2014-04-01 06:08 xiangfu has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 2014-04-01 06:09 jekhor has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 06:32 atommann has quit [Quit: Leaving] 2014-04-01 06:32 atommann has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 06:36 nicksydney has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 07:08 zcrc has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 08:55 jekhor has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 2014-04-01 10:20 FDCX has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2014-04-01 10:20 atommann has quit [Quit: Leaving] 2014-04-01 10:31 rz2k has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 10:57 FDCX has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 11:02 zcrc_ has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 11:05 zcrc has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 2014-04-01 11:18 dos1 has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 11:25 DocScrutinizer05 has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 2014-04-01 11:36 DocScrutinizer05 has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 11:48 rz2k has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 2014-04-01 11:54 rz2k has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 11:57 freenode+ accounts, yeay! 2014-04-01 11:57 atommann has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 11:58 DocScrutinizer51 will be happy 2014-04-01 12:04 wej has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 2014-04-01 12:09 wej has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 12:10 I alreeady sent a "thank you2 to the blog! 2014-04-01 12:17 ? 2014-04-01 12:18 wej has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 2014-04-01 12:29 wej has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 12:30 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 12:47 wej has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 2014-04-01 12:54 wej has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 13:02 wej has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 2014-04-01 13:07 DocScrutinizer05 has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 2014-04-01 13:08 DocScrutinizer05 has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 13:16 is any one developing/supporting a OS for the Wiz? I couldn't find anything a while ago, just wondering 2014-04-01 13:23 no 2014-04-01 13:24 thanks 2014-04-01 13:27 zcrc_ is now known as pcercuei 2014-04-01 13:37 jekhor has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 13:50 DocScrutinizer05 has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 2014-04-01 13:52 DocScrutinizer05 has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 14:36 xiangfu has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 2014-04-01 14:38 rz2k has quit [] 2014-04-01 15:13 FDCX has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 2014-04-01 15:25 DocScrutinizer05: i wonder if this helps you to make sense of rms's email http://pandoralive.info/?p=1586 just dumping it out there so I can close the tab in my web browser :) 2014-04-01 15:25 wej has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 15:27 FDCX has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 15:29 wej has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2014-04-01 15:32 wej has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 15:53 pcercuei has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 2014-04-01 15:58 porchao has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 15:59 porchaso0 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 2014-04-01 16:05 rz2k has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 16:07 atommann has quit [Quit: Leaving] 2014-04-01 16:15 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 16:27 pcercuei has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 16:29 unclouded has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 2014-04-01 16:31 unclouded has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 16:34 rz2k has quit [] 2014-04-01 17:10 arielenter has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2014-04-01 17:13 jekhor has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 2014-04-01 17:20 wej has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2014-04-01 17:20 wej has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 17:23 mth has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 2014-04-01 17:24 mth has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 17:29 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 17:29 arielenter has quit [Client Quit] 2014-04-01 17:40 michael_lee has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 2014-04-01 17:46 michael_lee has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 17:51 mth has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 2014-04-01 18:03 DocScrutinizer51: you may like this: http://pics.nase-bohren.de/russia-wants-war.jpg 2014-04-01 18:03 not really. I got real problems right now 2014-04-01 18:06 founding of UG caused personal bankrupt, so I'm about to ponder my options 2014-04-01 18:07 maybe you can have your new company give free lunch to employees 2014-04-01 18:07 mth has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 18:07 hahaha 2014-04-01 18:08 UG? 2014-04-01 18:09 german limited 2014-04-01 18:09 kind of 2014-04-01 18:10 "LLC"? 2014-04-01 18:10 yes 2014-04-01 18:12 do you know GmbH? 2014-04-01 18:13 mm, heard of it 2014-04-01 18:14 of course not the gnarly legal details. for that matter I don't even know how ООО works 2014-04-01 18:15 DocScrutinizer05: that sounds serious :( could you perhaps bill nikolaus for some work, to maintain liquidity 2014-04-01 18:15 UG is the same, excpet that you need less money 2014-04-01 18:15 larsc: I see 2014-04-01 18:20 wpwrak: I'm going to do exactly that now 2014-04-01 18:21 DocScrutinizer05: great. let's hope it work ... and his tax advisors don't find yet another problem. they don't seem to be much better at - belatedly - finding problems than at coming up with solutions :-( 2014-04-01 18:22 yes 2014-04-01 18:23 isn't it amazing how with every entity, on every topic, always the blocking actions happen at speed of light, while the enabling actions take weeks or months to complete? 2014-04-01 18:26 well, in your case it seems that both take a lot of time. 1) you make a plan. 2) they shoot it down. 3) you come up with something else. 4) they shoot it down again. 5) you develop a plan together with them. 6) you start implementing it. 7) once you're committed, they shoot it down again. 2014-04-01 18:33 kinda 2014-04-01 18:35 but then otoh my rent for my flat doesn't get paid this month, while the idea how to pay it otherwise hasn't finished birth process yet 2014-04-01 18:36 well, you said you have a nice landlady ... 2014-04-01 18:36 sure 2014-04-01 18:36 but my energy provider is less forgiving 2014-04-01 18:37 yeah, i'd worry more about these. well, they'll probably send you a warning letter after a few days and such. so you have a bit of time. 2014-04-01 18:37 only a bit 2014-04-01 18:38 well, i hope nikolaus won't make you wait for weeks ... 2014-04-01 18:41 jekhor has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 18:44 I think in Germany they have to continue to provide you with electricity for at least 3 months 2014-04-01 19:05 viric has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2014-04-01 19:25 Jay7 has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 20:25 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 20:47 arielenter has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 2014-04-01 21:05 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 21:47 arielenter1 has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 21:48 arielenter has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2014-04-01 21:52 arielenter1 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 2014-04-01 21:53 valhalla_ has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 21:53 panda| has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 21:54 panda|z has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 2014-04-01 21:54 valhalla has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 2014-04-01 22:34 pcercuei has quit [Quit: dodo] 2014-04-01 22:39 newcup has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 2014-04-01 23:35 wolfspra1l has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 23:39 wolfspraul has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 2014-04-01 23:44 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2014-04-01 23:50 wej has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 2014-04-01 23:53 jekhor has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 2014-04-01 23:55 DocScrutinizer05: hope it works out for you. 2014-04-01 23:58 arielenter has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]