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2014-03-16 00:41 <DocScrutinizer05> hmmm
2014-03-16 00:42 <wpwrak> mmh ?
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2014-03-16 13:19 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: (before KT-impact) hahaha
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2014-03-16 13:50 * whitequark sighs
2014-03-16 13:50 <whitequark> so I bought a power supply by LIHUA
2014-03-16 13:50 <whitequark> which apparently doesn't make power supplies
2014-03-16 13:50 <whitequark> it makes... copper anodes and CCA wire? wtf
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2014-03-16 15:46 <whitequark> hmmm
2014-03-16 15:47 <DocScrutinizer05> whitequark: seems you survived yesterday's demo?
2014-03-16 15:48 <whitequark> demo?
2014-03-16 15:49 <DocScrutinizer05> oops, today?
2014-03-16 15:49 <DocScrutinizer05> nope
2014-03-16 15:49 <DocScrutinizer05> [2014-03-15 02:15:13] <whitequa1k> I'm pondering going there but not quite sure. people were beaten and imprisoned for months before...
2014-03-16 15:49 <whitequark> ah
2014-03-16 15:49 <whitequark> slept right through it
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2014-03-16 15:50 <whitequark> I was nearly dropping dead from exhaustion yesterday :)
2014-03-16 15:50 <DocScrutinizer05> right, the only mammals surviving KT-impact were those that selpt it away
2014-03-16 15:50 <DocScrutinizer05> ;-)
2014-03-16 15:50 <whitequark> anyway I just fiddled with my CNC and added those two power supplies that have arrived
2014-03-16 15:51 <whitequark> so I'm back to full warp drive^W^W spindle power
2014-03-16 15:51 <DocScrutinizer05> back to full 555-frying capacity
2014-03-16 15:51 <whitequark> hehe
2014-03-16 15:52 <whitequark> http://i.imgur.com/F0yMkL3.jpg
2014-03-16 15:52 <whitequark> they won't fit inside, so I fit them outside
2014-03-16 15:57 <whitequark> works pretty great. voltage is remarkably stable for cheap chinese supplies.
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2014-03-16 16:22 <DocScrutinizer05> whitequark: nasty boy! black is L, not N ;-P
2014-03-16 16:23 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: ouch
2014-03-16 16:23 <whitequark> well, it's not like it matters anyway. the plug can be plugged in any way around
2014-03-16 16:24 <whitequark> the mains plug that is.
2014-03-16 16:25 <DocScrutinizer05> :nod: sure
2014-03-16 16:27 <whitequark> grmbl. the Al bed has grooves too big for M4 bolts I bought for this purpose
2014-03-16 16:27 <whitequark> and I thought I measured everything properly...
2014-03-16 16:32 <DocScrutinizer05> hm?
2014-03-16 16:34 <whitequark> well, I'm trying to fix victim plywood to the aluminium bed of my cnc
2014-03-16 16:34 <whitequark> and bolts *almost* fall through the T-slots
2014-03-16 16:34 <whitequark> clearly not wide enough to securely and properly fix
2014-03-16 16:37 <DocScrutinizer05> use washers
2014-03-16 16:37 <whitequark> hm
2014-03-16 16:48 <whitequark> yep that works
2014-03-16 16:53 * whitequark is actually quite surprised he got that power supply mount right the first time
2014-03-16 16:54 <whitequark> this is first time in my life I use: wire clamps, bolt cutter, drill on something metallic, drafting of this kind, ...
2014-03-16 16:54 <whitequark> and I only misplaced one hole by about 0.5mm
2014-03-16 16:57 <wpwrak> hint: for complicated manual drilling / cutting patterns, print the design on transparent film and use that as a guide / for marking
2014-03-16 16:58 <whitequark> exactly what I did
2014-03-16 16:58 <whitequark> well, I rather printed it on paper and duct-taped that to the case
2014-03-16 16:59 <whitequark> then drilled right through it
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2014-03-16 17:12 <DocScrutinizer51> PE film works great for avoisding scratches and marking the points for holes, and to somewhat keep drill from running away from point of hole
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2014-03-16 17:14 <DocScrutinizer51> when you got no PE film, a paper sticky tape does
2014-03-16 17:14 <DocScrutinizer51> PE film works great for avoisding scratches and marking the points for holes, and to somewhat keep drill from running away from point of hole
2014-03-16 17:15 <DocScrutinizer51> and always use X shaped marks so you still see where the center of hole shall be even when you started drilling
2014-03-16 17:31 <wpwrak> yeah. film -> manual holes (with an awl) -> remove film -> drill is best. that way, the film doesn't crumple
2014-03-16 17:32 <wpwrak> you can also do it with paper, but it's harder to realign
2014-03-16 17:35 <whitequark> why even remove paper?
2014-03-16 17:38 <wpwrak> because you don't want to damage it when working on the wood ?
2014-03-16 17:39 <wpwrak> e.g., if you pass with a saw, the paper will be ripped apart
2014-03-16 17:40 <wpwrak> if all you do is drill small holes, you can probably leave it there, if firmly attached, but most other tools will shred it
2014-03-16 17:52 <DocScrutinizer05> nah, attach (protective) PE-film with marks. Drill. Remove film
2014-03-16 17:53 <DocScrutinizer05> the thicker the film, the better
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2014-03-16 17:53 <DocScrutinizer05> sticky film of course
2014-03-16 17:54 <DocScrutinizer05> preferably (semi)transparent, though that's not mandatory
2014-03-16 17:55 <DocScrutinizer05> http://wuxi-qd.en.made-in-china.com/offer/reqEGURKFfYx/Sell-PE-Protective-Film-for-Acrylic-Panel.html
2014-03-16 17:56 <DocScrutinizer05> http://livingstingy.blogspot.de/2012/06/peel-off-plastic-protective-shipping.html
2014-03-16 17:59 <DocScrutinizer05> >>It is kind of sad, really, that people are so technically illiterate in a technological world.  We live in a Cargo Cult society, really, where a bunch of primitive apes run around examining the technological relics handed down to them by the Gods.<<
2014-03-16 18:00 <DocScrutinizer05> couldn't put it any better ;-P
2014-03-16 18:04 <DocScrutinizer05> alternative to PE: this paper sticky tape, made to get off easily after to painted your walls: http://www.bonum-werkzeuge.de/shop/tesa-krepp-4306-groesse-30-mmx50m-p-3224.html
2014-03-16 18:04 <DocScrutinizer05> s/ to pai/you pai/
2014-03-16 18:04 <qi-bot> DocScrutinizer05 meant: "alternative to PE: this paper sticky tape, made to get off easily afteryou painted your walls: http://www.bonum-werkzeuge.de/shop/tesa-krepp-4306-groesse-30-mmx50m-p-3224.html"
2014-03-16 18:06 <DocScrutinizer05> http://www.tesa.de/consumer/renovieren_reparieren/malerbaender/tesa_malerkrepp_premium_classic,c.html
2014-03-16 18:09 <DocScrutinizer05> for cutting stuff with pad saw (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41b5-8M+vyL._SL110_.jpg) it's mandatory to protect your surface with either of both protective materials
2014-03-16 18:10 <DocScrutinizer05> unless your surface is irrelevant to begin with
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2014-03-16 18:26 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: ooh yes, masking tape. I have a roll
2014-03-16 18:31 <DocScrutinizer05> then you write proper cross-shaped marks on that paper. At least 20mm length for each line, so you *easily* can see if your drill is properly centered
2014-03-16 18:31 <DocScrutinizer05> even during drilling
2014-03-16 18:31 <whitequark> well the idea was to print the blueprint on paper
2014-03-16 18:31 <whitequark> I don't think I can print on masking tape
2014-03-16 18:32 <whitequark> I can print on self-adhesive paper but it's $$$ and then you have to get it off somehow
2014-03-16 18:32 <DocScrutinizer05> then use blueprint paper and transfer the marks from your template paper to the mask tape
2014-03-16 18:33 <DocScrutinizer05> s/blueprint/carbon copy/
2014-03-16 18:33 <qi-bot> DocScrutinizer05 meant: "then use carbon copy paper and transfer the marks from your template paper to the mask tape"
2014-03-16 18:33 <whitequark> well... why not just fix the blueprint on workpiece?
2014-03-16 18:33 <whitequark> drilling won't tear it off
2014-03-16 18:33 <whitequark> I mean, it did not
2014-03-16 18:33 <DocScrutinizer05> because it's not sticky
2014-03-16 18:33 <whitequark> so?
2014-03-16 18:33 <whitequark> tpe it over the edges
2014-03-16 18:33 <whitequark> *tape
2014-03-16 18:33 <DocScrutinizer05> doesn't work. Never did for me
2014-03-16 18:34 <whitequark> hmm, worked well for me. I missed that hole because I did not think it through and didn't make crosses like you suggest
2014-03-16 18:34 <whitequark> rather I printed a hole as well
2014-03-16 18:34 <whitequark> ofcourse that made positioning very hard
2014-03-16 18:34 <DocScrutinizer05> the idea is that the tape is sticky to your object to drill at the point where drilling, so it guides your drill and holds it in place
2014-03-16 18:35 <whitequark> lolwat? a 50 micron tape will hold my 1.5kg hand drill in place at 1000rpm or something?
2014-03-16 18:35 <whitequark> a hole made with an awl, sure. tape? can't believe that
2014-03-16 18:35 <DocScrutinizer05> while a simple paper not only doesn't hold the drill in place but also gets destroyed when drill runs away
2014-03-16 18:36 <DocScrutinizer05> well, all I can say is: it works
2014-03-16 18:36 <whitequark> hrm
2014-03-16 18:36 <DocScrutinizer05> the harder the surface you wanna drill (steel, glass) the more noticeable the difference
2014-03-16 18:36 <whitequark> well, I can try that surely
2014-03-16 18:37 <DocScrutinizer05> of course thick PE works better than thin mask paper tape
2014-03-16 18:37 <whitequark> define thick?
2014-03-16 18:37 <DocScrutinizer05> 0.5mm
2014-03-16 18:38 <DocScrutinizer05> 1mm
2014-03-16 18:39 <DocScrutinizer05> and yes, for sure you should pre-pinch with an ale
2014-03-16 18:39 <DocScrutinizer05> or a hardened steel nail and hammer
2014-03-16 18:41 <DocScrutinizer05> and even _that_ is much easier to accomplish when you got some "soft" sticky protective material on top of your steel surface
2014-03-16 18:43 <DocScrutinizer05> actually humans are not made for dealing with surfaces as hard as steel
2014-03-16 18:43 <DocScrutinizer05> only CNC (usually) doesn't mind
2014-03-16 18:43 <whitequark> hehe
2014-03-16 18:45 <DocScrutinizer05> try it and you'll get it what I'm talking about
2014-03-16 18:46 <DocScrutinizer05> drilling stuff like http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Badezimmer.jpg you will *love* your masking tape
2014-03-16 18:48 <DocScrutinizer05> and don't ask me how many steel surfaces I ruined when drill ran away while drilling
2014-03-16 18:48 <DocScrutinizer05> won't happen when you "mask"
2014-03-16 18:48 <DocScrutinizer05> even when drill runs away, it's not damaging the surface
2014-03-16 18:51 <DocScrutinizer05> (1000rpm) you should start slowly, young padawan ;-)
2014-03-16 18:52 <DocScrutinizer05> muuuch slower than 1000RPM
2014-03-16 18:52 <DocScrutinizer05> ...until you *fell* the drill found its place
2014-03-16 18:53 <DocScrutinizer05> don't tel me your drilling machine has no variable speed
2014-03-16 18:53 <DocScrutinizer05> stuff like that isn't sold anymore since it's basically unusable
2014-03-16 18:59 <DocScrutinizer05> probably even your CNC has a numeric (aka PC) control for spindle RPM for exactly this purpose to start drilling slowly
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2014-03-16 19:21 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: (1000rpm) I have no idea how fast is my hand drill actually
2014-03-16 19:21 <whitequark> it's also graded in parrots
2014-03-16 19:21 <whitequark> (CNC) it actually did not have PC control for spindle out of the box, I think I told this story here already
2014-03-16 19:22 <whitequark> basically it had PWM output on control board with LPT and PWM in on spindle driver
2014-03-16 19:22 <whitequark> all I had to do is to run two wires
2014-03-16 19:55 <whitequark> hm, so G40 is simultaneously the gcode command for cutter radius compensation and ICD-10 code for epilepsy
2014-03-16 19:55 <whitequark> checks out
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2014-03-16 21:12 <DocScrutinizer05> hehe, G40 sounds about right, yeah
2014-03-16 21:13 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, you told the details about spindle speed control
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2014-03-16 21:35 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: I don't think CNC needs to "feel" anything though
2014-03-16 21:35 <whitequark> everything I seen recommended just plunging into workpiece
2014-03-16 21:41 <DocScrutinizer05> (CNC needs to "feel" )you're mixing up cause end consequence
2014-03-16 21:43 <DocScrutinizer05> when you're supposed to start with slow drill speed until you notice drill "found it's place", this doen't mean CNC does need to notice anything since drill will "find its place" with or without anybody noticing
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2014-03-16 22:01 <whitequark> but doesn't drill need to "find its place" only if you don't have rigid support while drilling?
2014-03-16 22:01 <whitequark> and CNC is supposed to be rather rigid
2014-03-16 22:01 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, but end,ill/drill bit is flexible before it breaks
2014-03-16 22:02 <whitequark> tool deflection, right
2014-03-16 22:02 <whitequark> well, it probably only matters much for tiny drill bits
2014-03-16 22:02 <whitequark> http://imgur.com/gcuGIvH,lW2utIf
2014-03-16 22:02 <whitequark> I made a hole!
2014-03-16 22:02 <DocScrutinizer05> yes
2014-03-16 22:02 <whitequark> https://gist.github.com/whitequark/c18b62ca6af3630aba67
2014-03-16 22:02 <whitequark> was not trivial at all
2014-03-16 22:05 <wpwrak> (find its place) i guess bit flexibility vs. hardness of workpiece. e.g., your wobbly 0.2 mm drills vs. steel should yield interesting but ultimately tragic results
2014-03-16 22:06 <whitequark> hmmm
2014-03-16 22:06 <whitequark> I wonder
2014-03-16 22:07 <wpwrak> relatively thin drills vs. copper (for my vias) work fine without further ado, though
2014-03-16 22:07 <whitequark> yep, first thing I tested that .2mm drill at was copper
2014-03-16 22:07 <whitequark> works just fine
2014-03-16 22:07 <wpwrak> just make sure the workpiece doesn't move. drills really hate that :)
2014-03-16 22:09 <wpwrak> mine (for vias) are 0.35 mm and seem to last forever, as long as i don't make any mistakes
2014-03-16 22:10 <wpwrak> of course, if i do, *snap*, there it goes ...
2014-03-16 22:11 <wpwrak> the 1/8" endmill is great for making mistakes. i think it's stronger than any force my mill could produce :)
2014-03-16 22:11 <whitequark> yep, 3mm is rather thick
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2014-03-16 22:30 <paul_boddie> viric: Just tested gpg on the Ben NanoNote again. 4096-bit key generation works, but there's an excruciating wait for entropy.
2014-03-16 22:30 <viric> Ok
2014-03-16 22:30 <viric> !
2014-03-16 22:30 <viric> it's a rare operation though :)
2014-03-16 22:31 <paul_boddie> If there's any readable documentation about writing entropy generation devices for the kernel, maybe post it here for curiosity/amusement.
2014-03-16 22:32 <paul_boddie> But in case there was any doubt, gpg isn't too demanding on the Ben otherwise.
2014-03-16 22:32 <paul_boddie> And as I noted before, I get complaints about entropy on my desktop system anyway.
2014-03-16 22:34 <viric> aha
2014-03-16 22:34 <viric> very good!
2014-03-16 22:34 <viric> thank you a lot!
2014-03-16 22:34 <whitequark> DocScrutinizer05: well obviously this failed
2014-03-16 22:34 <whitequark> argh, "use washers"
2014-03-16 22:34 <viric> →sleep
2014-03-16 22:35 <whitequark> ofcourse that didn't work, because if nut is too small for the slot, *it wouldn't lock in the slot*
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2014-03-16 23:17 <wpwrak> viric: buy one atben and receive 2 MILLION true random bits per second FOR FREE ! ;-)
2014-03-16 23:18 <wpwrak> (in fact, you'll have a hard time to pull them out of the chip so fast. but you'll still be orders of magnitude faster than even your pc, with all its entropy sources)
2014-03-16 23:21 <whitequark> ARGH
2014-03-16 23:21 <whitequark> CNC seems to have lost its mind
2014-03-16 23:22 <whitequark> if I go higher in X, Y, Z then spindle works
2014-03-16 23:22 <whitequark> if I go lower in -//- then spindle inexplicably loses PWM
2014-03-16 23:22 <whitequark> what
2014-03-16 23:22 <whitequark> how is this even possible
2014-03-16 23:24 <whitequark> moreover when I turn spindle *off*, physically disconnecting its control circuit, it turns full-on for a sec
2014-03-16 23:25 <wpwrak> your CNC mill - the gift that keeps on giving ;-)
2014-03-16 23:25 <whitequark> I have this feeling I need to get rid of 555 in that circuit
2014-03-16 23:27 <wpwrak> yeah, raising that ancient corpse from the dead was probably a bad idea from the start ...
2014-03-16 23:28 <whitequark> it doesn't even do anything now
2014-03-16 23:28 <whitequark> it is basically supposed to act as a wire
2014-03-16 23:28 <whitequark> and I suspect that it utterly fails
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