2013-12-26 00:46 arielenter has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 2013-12-26 02:15 rz2k has quit [] 2013-12-26 02:26 lilvinz- has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 02:29 lilvinz- has quit [Excess Flood] 2013-12-26 02:29 lilvinz- has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 02:33 wpwrak_ has quit [*.net *.split] 2013-12-26 02:33 newcup has quit [*.net *.split] 2013-12-26 02:33 lilvinz has quit [*.net *.split] 2013-12-26 02:35 dos1 has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 2013-12-26 02:39 wpwrak_ has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 02:41 michael_lee has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 02:43 michael_lee has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 2013-12-26 02:45 michael_lee has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 02:50 pcercuei has quit [Quit: dodo] 2013-12-26 03:38 fire has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 04:37 Mistah_Darcy has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 05:02 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 05:39 Mistah_Darcy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2013-12-26 05:40 Mistah_Darcy has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 05:41 Mistah_Darcy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2013-12-26 05:47 okay, bought the 3020T 2013-12-26 05:47 the problem is that it's slightly above customs limits... I feel like they're going to fuck me plenty 2013-12-26 05:50 make a video and make $$$ on porntube ;-) 2013-12-26 05:53 that would likely be the most long and boring porn movie ever produced 2013-12-26 05:54 well. I hope that my mail forwarder is going to take care of it themselves (and charge me a small fortune, of course) 2013-12-26 05:54 that still beats dealing with customs by myself at any time of day. I've heard several horror stories 2013-12-26 05:54 love that concept of the "mail forwarders" ;-) 2013-12-26 05:55 you don't have them? 2013-12-26 05:56 we have postal mail and courier all the way into the country 2013-12-26 05:57 if customs decide to screw you, they do it on any path you choose 2013-12-26 05:57 except if you have someone smuggle it, of course 2013-12-26 05:57 well, this mail forwarder seems to do it legally, or at least doesn't bribe people too blatantly 2013-12-26 05:58 customs still want to screw *me*, but those guys have an army of lawyers trained for that or something 2013-12-26 05:58 and there is probably some kind of legal loophole which allows them to clear my packages 2013-12-26 05:58 * whitequark shrugs 2013-12-26 06:03 wow. I 2013-12-26 06:03 I'm watching this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fv2mEQS7awE 2013-12-26 06:03 it has voice in german, yet google can show readable subtitles in english 2013-12-26 06:03 it truly evolved into skynet 2013-12-26 06:05 ah, they're written manually. nevermind :) 2013-12-26 06:07 well, automatic captions have been there since 2009 2013-12-26 06:07 and it works pretty well in some cases 2013-12-26 06:08 especially when a speaker's articulation is good 2013-12-26 06:08 i use it sometimes (via plugin in chrome) to automate subtitle creation 2013-12-26 06:17 his reflow setup is quite ingenious: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=KU3grl6Nu2U#t=165 2013-12-26 06:50 panda|x201 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 2013-12-26 07:14 panda|w530 has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 08:18 kyak: the prolem is it has a talent to create reasonably sounding subtitles that are total bullshit 2013-12-26 08:49 michael_lee has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2013-12-26 09:03 michael_lee has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 09:04 whitequark: http://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation_id=annotation_158083&feature=iv&src_vid=b9FC9fAlfQE&v=jSZbkR9vNzI&noredirect=1 should give you some more ideas for your 3020 2013-12-26 09:19 Guest62213 has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2013-12-26 09:22 DocScrutinizer05: that's really interesting 2013-12-26 09:22 thought it might interest you :) 2013-12-26 09:23 I was going to try milling stencils instead (the raw material, brass lists, is really cheap) 2013-12-26 09:23 but I'm not sure if that would work actually 2013-12-26 09:24 Coyo has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 09:24 a set of two electromagnetic valves and a pressure regulator for pressurized air should do to push out a constant amount of paste per time from a syringe 2013-12-26 09:24 Coyo is now known as Guest45400 2013-12-26 09:24 forget about creating stencils with a mill, won't pan out 2013-12-26 09:25 you need laser cutting or etching to do stencils 2013-12-26 09:25 suspected it 2013-12-26 09:25 etching... could probably try that 2013-12-26 09:26 DocScrutinizer05: random idea: exposing the resist with a powerful UV led and an optic fiber with a CNC machine 2013-12-26 09:26 I'm not sure what could it give you though 2013-12-26 09:27 panda|w530 has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 2013-12-26 09:27 panda|w530 has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 09:28 existing technique 2013-12-26 09:30 what's it used for? 2013-12-26 09:31 well, I can't recall details but I've seen exactly this moving light source technique getting used somewhere 2013-12-26 09:32 probably in pre-laser times, maybe somewhere related to offset printing or sth 2013-12-26 09:33 I see 2013-12-26 09:33 or really in professional PCB production 2013-12-26 09:34 also, his magnetic clamps are awesome 2013-12-26 09:34 even though duct tape would work too :p 2013-12-26 09:36 guess why I said the word "magnet" at least 50 times during last 4 weeks in this channel ;-) 2013-12-26 09:37 $ curl -s http://irclog.whitequark.org/qi-hardware/2013-12.txt | grep DocScrutinizer | grep magnet -c 2013-12-26 09:37 21 2013-12-26 09:37 hehe 2013-12-26 09:37 but that's pretty close 2013-12-26 09:40 I actually suggested to wpwrak_ to fix his acrylic case with magnets. I thought of exactly the scenario in this video when doing so 2013-12-26 09:40 the USB2LPT guy made a makeshift scaffold for that purpose using scrap PCBs and superglue 2013-12-26 09:41 well, similar purpose 2013-12-26 09:41 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 09:47 for the ultimate smartass DIY reflow soldering I ponder to get some fluid to cook on my stove ;-) 2013-12-26 09:47 fluid? 2013-12-26 09:47 you basically can't do anything wrong when using vapor phase reflow 2013-12-26 09:48 oooooh that's really interesting 2013-12-26 09:49 use a 5L pot, pour in some 100ccm of 255°C reflow fluid, cook, throw in PCBA for 30s 2013-12-26 09:50 pot? a pressure cooker maybe? 2013-12-26 09:50 no 2013-12-26 09:50 I guess you'd need it to be airtight 2013-12-26 09:50 a simple pot 2013-12-26 09:50 won't the fluid escape? 2013-12-26 09:50 oh, right, that's the goal 2013-12-26 09:50 if it doesn't escape it doesn't regulate t° 2013-12-26 09:50 well, when you cook it too violently it will evaporate and escape the pot, yeah 2013-12-26 09:51 but usually it shall condensate on the lid you put on the pot 2013-12-26 09:51 apelete_ is now known as apelete 2013-12-26 09:51 pretty much like usual water does 2013-12-26 09:51 or you could take a fluid with a slightly higher boiling t° (but still within AMR of the components) so you can't overheat it 2013-12-26 09:51 but the fluid doesn't escape 2013-12-26 09:51 it is just "water that boils at 250°" 2013-12-26 09:53 maybe use a steel bowl with water in it as lid for the pot 2013-12-26 09:55 DocScrutinizer05: http://www.dow.com/heattrans/products/synthetic/dowtherm.htm ? 2013-12-26 09:55 it's even developed for exact that purpose, heat transfer 2013-12-26 09:55 http://www.smta.org/chapters/files/Arizona-Sonora_IBL_SMTA_AZ_Expo_2012Dec4.pdf 2013-12-26 09:55 yes yes, reading that pdf 2013-12-26 09:56 HS235 2013-12-26 09:57 Perfluorpolyether 2013-12-26 09:57 the show "Galden" brand 2013-12-26 09:57 they* 2013-12-26 09:58 http://www.daitokutech.com/products/galden/data/Saftydatasheet Galden HS235.pdf 2013-12-26 09:59 http://www.solvayplastics.com/sites/solvayplastics/EN/specialty_polymers/Fluorinated_Fluids/Pages/Galden_PFPE.aspx 2013-12-26 10:01 you think you can source it? 2013-12-26 10:02 dunno 2013-12-26 10:02 I bet I can get 1L from wuerth, via Nikolaus 2013-12-26 10:02 when he next time visits them 2013-12-26 10:03 or was it global components? 2013-12-26 10:03 our PCB soldering fab has quite a few cans of that stuff, I bet 2013-12-26 10:04 ok, HS235 seems not modern anymore, so use HS240 2013-12-26 10:04 http://hackaday.com/2010/10/15/vapor-phase-reflow-soldering/ 2013-12-26 10:05 http://www.ibrtses.com/projects/vapourphasesoldering.html 2013-12-26 10:05 HAH! 2013-12-26 10:05 yeah he uses HT230 2013-12-26 10:08 * whitequark shudders while looking at a stainless steel tray in close proximity to two live uninsulated wires 2013-12-26 10:08 lekernel has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 10:14 yeah, a weird guy, and particularly I'd have used a simple waterheater 2013-12-26 10:14 there are even some that come with glass 2013-12-26 10:14 though usually they are stainless steel 2013-12-26 10:14 go lower budget: just use an electric kettle 2013-12-26 10:14 ~15 bucks at the store of your choice 2013-12-26 10:15 or did you mean just that? https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQkjgw2lx2SKxgwaAQumIrFBRVhUu-YUifHeYvBKoUoMJlKn4Opgg 2013-12-26 10:15 kinda, yes 2013-12-26 10:15 you need to rework those a little, since they have a thermofuse that cuts out at 130°C 2013-12-26 10:16 place a 200°C switch at *top* of the whole thing, it cuts out when vapor rwches the level of the switch 2013-12-26 10:16 reaches* 2013-12-26 10:17 wolfspraul has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 10:17 when you wanna go fancy, you get a dimmer for the heating and slowly turn it down while thermoswitch at top of pot is engaged and turn it up when switch is too cold 2013-12-26 10:18 I've a spare PID controller lying here 2013-12-26 10:18 then place some sort of heatsing on the pot for vapor to condensate there 2013-12-26 10:18 PID, *great* :-D 2013-12-26 10:18 heatsink* 2013-12-26 10:19 TIL: "tombstoning" and "popcorning" :D :D 2013-12-26 10:19 TIL? 2013-12-26 10:19 "The customer had severe problems with tombstoning" 2013-12-26 10:19 today I learned 2013-12-26 10:19 hehe 2013-12-26 10:20 hm, this actually looks kinda simpler than an oven for reflow, which I wanted to make once 2013-12-26 10:20 btw you could use silicon isolation for the wires, I'm rather sure it has no problems with either temperature nor the liquid 2013-12-26 10:21 and for sure this is more reliable 2013-12-26 10:21 (simpler) and WAAAAY better results I bet 2013-12-26 10:21 unfortunately there's basically no way for me to get the liquid 2013-12-26 10:22 it's classified as ozone depleting substance and prohibited from mailing 2013-12-26 10:22 convection reflow oven is a bitch to build and to operate 2013-12-26 10:22 DAMN! 2013-12-26 10:22 honestly I doubt customs here will give a fuck, they're much more interested in iphones than of 1L of some obscure goo 2013-12-26 10:23 but in the country of origin that might happen 2013-12-26 10:23 I bet# 2013-12-26 10:23 I'll probably ask you to send me some quantity of it when the rest of the toys arrive here 2013-12-26 10:23 hmm, depends where that country of origin is. When it's china, then no problems anticipated 2013-12-26 10:24 china would also be a way, yes 2013-12-26 10:24 Oh, I don't have any 2013-12-26 10:24 well, you said you can get some :p 2013-12-26 10:24 I said I guess I could get some 2013-12-26 10:24 eventually 2013-12-26 10:24 sure 2013-12-26 10:24 when prodding Nikolaus 2013-12-26 10:24 I'm in no hurry 2013-12-26 10:25 but actually that is maybe something I should do 2013-12-26 10:25 just to boost the fame of Golden Delicious and myself ;-P 2013-12-26 10:25 hehe 2013-12-26 10:25 and it actually might come in handy 2013-12-26 10:27 well, 200 bucks for 500ml 2013-12-26 10:27 I thik it might be worth it 2013-12-26 10:27 worth a try 2013-12-26 10:27 where'd you get that price from? 2013-12-26 10:28 err 100 2013-12-26 10:28 from http://www.ibrtses.com.nyud.net/projects/vapourphasesoldering.html 2013-12-26 10:29 >>Here I use Galden HT 230 with a boiling point of 230 degrees Celsius. For comparison, leaded solder melts at 188 degrees and leadfree solder melts at 220 degrees. This stuff is rather pricey, in the order of 100$ US per kilogram, which is about half a liter. << 2013-12-26 10:29 common mishap I do: apply normalization twice 2013-12-26 10:30 so 100bucks/L become 200bucks/500mL 2013-12-26 10:30 err 2013-12-26 10:30 so 100bucks/kg become 200bucks/500mL 2013-12-26 10:30 see what I meant? 2013-12-26 10:31 yeah 2013-12-26 10:31 these guys sell it in single bottles: http://www.pchemlabs.com/product.asp?pid=5081 2013-12-26 10:32 $1200/7kg, uh... yeah, pricey. 2013-12-26 10:32 hah, thought I might be right with the 200 anyway ;-P 2013-12-26 10:33 ooh, that's a different product 2013-12-26 10:33 HT-230 not HS-230, yes 2013-12-26 10:33 but it seems to have similar properties 2013-12-26 10:33 >>Galden HT-230 sold here by the 7 kg (15.4 lbs) containers is used for applications with component immersion, wafer etching, ion implantation, radar equipment, transformers, power supplies, UF6 production, chillers, cooling towers, and freeze dryers. 2013-12-26 10:33 >radar equipment... UF6 production... 2013-12-26 10:33 you'd probably end up on some list buying that 2013-12-26 10:36 http://forum.mikrokopter.de/topic-post324253.html#post324253 2013-12-26 10:38 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 10:44 http://www.eevblog.com/forum/altium/altering-the-paste-mask-for-correct-paste-coverage-on-large-pads/msg191308/?PHPSESSID=9f509da40ca29ca40cb033585f42a163#msg191308 2013-12-26 10:44 > 2013-12-26 10:44 A vapor phase machine is basically a turkey fryer with a cooling ring around the top. 2013-12-26 10:44 hehe 2013-12-26 10:47 http://www.mgchemicals.com/products/cleaners/3m-fluids/ 2013-12-26 10:47 DocScrutinizer05: alternative fluids: http://www.smtnet.com/Forums/index.cfm?fuseaction=view_thread&CFApp=1&Thread_ID=14752&#Message61730 2013-12-26 10:47 oh you just found it too 2013-12-26 10:51 http://www.mgchemicals.com/products/cleaners/3m-fluids/engineered-liquids/fluorinert-fc-70/ 2013-12-26 10:51 215°C 2013-12-26 10:52 >> 2013-12-26 10:52 The saturated vapor generated from boiling Fluorinert liquid FC-70 is very dense and easily contained. The fluid is typically used with solders like 63 Sn/37 Pb, 60 Sn/40 Pb, or 62 Sn/36 Pb/2 Ag. FC-70 liquid can be used in a variety of vapor phase reflow soldering applications, including: 2013-12-26 10:52 BGA attach 2013-12-26 10:53 yeah, 215 would be for leaded, not lead-free 2013-12-26 10:53 though I say fuck lead-free anyway 2013-12-26 10:53 yep 2013-12-26 10:53 too much hassle for prototypes 2013-12-26 10:53 the problem is you can't mix lead free with leaded, really 2013-12-26 10:53 though I forgot why 2013-12-26 10:54 read it a week or two ago, somewhere 2013-12-26 10:54 that vapour-phase soldering pdf you posted, had a bullet point that you could mix leaded and lead-free with VPS 2013-12-26 10:54 while reading about VP 2013-12-26 10:54 hmm, I also think it might be worth a try ;-D 2013-12-26 10:56 yeah, actually 235 was the compromise temp for mixed leadfree and lead production, not requiring to swap liquid of your VP reflow machine 2013-12-26 10:58 fluorinert seems to be equally hard to obtain... 2013-12-26 10:58 same substance 2013-12-26 10:58 this seems to have 3/4 gal bottles with MOQ=1 http://www.amsmaterials.com/products/Fluorinert-FC%252d70.html 2013-12-26 10:58 but "call to order" 2013-12-26 10:59 hm, interesting, it's not actually described as ozone depleting anywhere 2013-12-26 11:00 so perhaps it's possible to send it via mail after all... it's really inert (duh!) otherwise 2013-12-26 11:00 >http://hamptonresearch.com/product_detail.aspx?sid=185&pid=32 2013-12-26 11:00 $108/100ml, wow 2013-12-26 11:01 also from there: "Ozone depletion potential: 0 " so that's encouraging 2013-12-26 11:02 yeah, I gathered it's ozone neutral 2013-12-26 11:02 otherwise we couldn't use it the way it's used in German reflow fabs 2013-12-26 11:03 hm, this http://www.mgchemicals.com/products/cleaners/3m-fluids/engineered-liquids/ sends directly to canadian customers 2013-12-26 11:03 if by customer they mean private person then I know a guy who could probably resend the parcel wherever it's needed 2013-12-26 11:06 it's always a question where to look for a substance. As a random example I found a barrel with ~30kg natrium cyanide in a galvanic lab that been closed. Try to get 1g of that substance! ;-P 2013-12-26 11:06 uh oh 2013-12-26 11:08 same with stuff like KMnO4 2013-12-26 11:09 I found a barrel with a convenient remnant of maybe 500g alu powder at a printing company's junkjard 2013-12-26 11:10 prolly used as pigment for a special printing color 2013-12-26 11:11 I been mainly interested in the steel barrels and had an unpleasant "incident" when opening them at home 2013-12-26 11:11 this alu powder stuff is impossible to clean, once it got out of the flask err barrel 2013-12-26 11:11 I hope you didn't drop the barrel... imagine if it made a spark :p 2013-12-26 11:12 we just called it the silver pest 2013-12-26 11:12 had another barrel with gold pigments, prolly brass 2013-12-26 11:13 we called that the gold pest which been even worse 2013-12-26 11:14 my flatmates cursed me 2013-12-26 11:14 I had to promise to never again open any of those barrels ;-P 2013-12-26 11:15 but with a cloth over it, it made a nice little table 2013-12-26 11:15 hah 2013-12-26 11:16 alas I never had a chance to do some of my weird destructive chemical experiments with the substances in those 2013-12-26 11:18 I however guess the alu must have been passivated on its surface, otherwise it should detonate the barrel when you shake it 2013-12-26 11:18 wouldn't defeat adding it to some blackpower 2013-12-26 11:18 alu would be always passivated in air 2013-12-26 11:19 well, yeah, and during that it tends to catch fire 2013-12-26 11:19 ;-) 2013-12-26 11:19 only if the surface area/volume rate is high enough 2013-12-26 11:19 when fine enough 2013-12-26 11:19 which this stuff *definitely* was 2013-12-26 11:19 thus i think it must have been passivated 2013-12-26 11:20 otherwise it would've been too dangerous 2013-12-26 11:20 but any passivation is moot when next dust particle is an oxidizer ;-) 2013-12-26 11:22 blackpower alike mixtures containing metal dust are the strongest composite explosives afaik. Definitely they are forbidden for crackers in germany, since those crackers would be too strong 2013-12-26 11:23 you could also disperse it in air and ignite 2013-12-26 11:23 well, except mixture of liquid oxigen with a hydrocarbon liquid 2013-12-26 11:23 if you manage to get it in air evenly in a room, you could manage to collapse the building 2013-12-26 11:23 or replace liquid oxygen by tetranitromethane 2013-12-26 11:24 instantaneous reduction of volume by 20% tends to do that 2013-12-26 11:24 you can do same with flour ;-) 2013-12-26 11:24 was going to say that 2013-12-26 11:24 well known ,ill explosions 2013-12-26 11:24 mill* 2013-12-26 11:25 or coal, in mines 2013-12-26 11:25 see also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GBU-43/B_Massive_Ordnance_Air_Blast 2013-12-26 11:25 45% hexogen, 30% TNT, 20% Al powder 2013-12-26 11:25 I prefer mixtures of oxygen and acetylene ;-) 2013-12-26 11:26 over flour 2013-12-26 11:26 what gives? 2013-12-26 11:26 easily obtainable from welding device, easily filled into bags or balloons 2013-12-26 11:27 gives quite a BOOM 2013-12-26 11:27 toldya my experiments are often a tad weird ;-D 2013-12-26 11:28 who doesn't like exploding stuff? 2013-12-26 11:28 except OSHA 2013-12-26 11:28 but those guys are who's weird 2013-12-26 11:30 most annoying problem always been grinding the substances. KMnO4 is incredibly hard 2013-12-26 11:31 even ruined a coffee mill 2013-12-26 11:31 maybe you could dissolve and reprecipitate it 2013-12-26 11:31 with the right parameters you could get a fine powder as the output 2013-12-26 11:31 just pondered about it 2013-12-26 11:34 panda|x201 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 2013-12-26 11:35 on the alu powder: it been fluffy like power sugar and when you tolted the barrel it started to flow almost like a liquid 2013-12-26 11:35 tilted* 2013-12-26 11:36 lekernel has quit [Quit: Leaving] 2013-12-26 11:36 pretty weird stuff 2013-12-26 11:37 oh yeah, and iirc there actually been some warning signs on the barrel 2013-12-26 11:37 (this been like 30 years ago) 2013-12-26 11:38 didn't that ring any bells? :p 2013-12-26 11:38 sure, that's why I took those barrels with me :-) 2013-12-26 11:38 well, and because the barrels themselves were kinda cool 2013-12-26 11:39 and were sitting next to the litter container 2013-12-26 11:41 really that stuff been terribly sticky 2013-12-26 11:41 dandon_ has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 11:42 no matter what you put in to the power, you pulled it out completely covered by silver 2013-12-26 11:42 which been impossible to remove completely 2013-12-26 11:44 dandon has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2013-12-26 11:44 dandon_ is now known as dandon 2013-12-26 11:45 http://xkcd.com/242/ 2013-12-26 11:49 LOL http://homescience.wordpress.com/2010/01/10/how-to-make-aluminum-powder/ 2013-12-26 11:51 yeah @ xkcd 2013-12-26 11:52 my friend calls me "Mr Feynman" 2013-12-26 11:53 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surely_You're_Joking,_Mr._Feynman! 2013-12-26 11:59 aah, better procedure to grind alu: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaF0i0qLyuI&noredirect=1 2013-12-26 12:20 Ornotermes has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2013-12-26 12:22 Ornotermes has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 12:22 (magnet) i don't like them so much. also because they can mess up things in their vicinity. e.g., credit cards. 2013-12-26 12:23 if you still use magnetic stripe cards in 2013, you deserve that 2013-12-26 12:24 dos1 has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 12:29 huh, 3020T is shipped already. quick. 2013-12-26 12:52 WOW 2013-12-26 12:53 btw I found some awesome "electronics for bloody noobs, creating stuff that really works": http://www.coilgun.info/levitation/schematic.htm 2013-12-26 12:54 the design is a tad... simplistic (e.g. has no true PID you'd expect to find in a proper design), but it really explains stuff 2013-12-26 12:54 look at this: http://www.coilgun.info/levitation/infraredemitter.htm 2013-12-26 12:59 though it seems to miss some drawings or info boxes. The question "How do you calculate the resistor in advance?" seems is never answered? 2013-12-26 13:01 LOL @ ""First, a little disclaimer, and a plea for help. I don't know why, but adding this circuit made my levitator stable."" http://www.coilgun.info/levitation/phaselead.htm 2013-12-26 13:02 you're adding the differential part of the mandatory PID regulator, fool! ;-) 2013-12-26 13:02 thus compensating for the inertia of your levitating object 2013-12-26 13:12 DocScrutinizer05: LOL the schematic is faaaaaar too complex 2013-12-26 13:12 I've did exactly that thing with literally: 1 hall effect sensor, 1 operating amplifier used in comparator mode, 1 power transistor, 1 electromagnet 2013-12-26 13:12 a few resistors also 2013-12-26 13:12 that's all. 2013-12-26 13:12 talking about their levitator 2013-12-26 13:13 well, you get a bouncy ball this way 2013-12-26 13:13 bouncy ball? 2013-12-26 13:13 but it may work 2013-12-26 13:13 object oscillating up and down 2013-12-26 13:14 naw it doesn't noticeably oscillate 2013-12-26 13:14 then I wonder how it works at all 2013-12-26 13:14 rz2k has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 13:14 key word "noticeably". you could feel the vibration if you keep it by hand, but not visually 2013-12-26 13:14 aaah, that's pretty good then 2013-12-26 13:15 you're basically combining PWM with a very tight digital feedback loop 2013-12-26 13:15 I think it was an active Hall effect sensor... you'd supply it with 5V and in steady state it would output precisely 2.5 2013-12-26 13:16 then you'd compare its output pin with a tap on a 1:1 resistor divider. it's that simple. 2013-12-26 13:16 yeah, in such design even noise might introduce benefits to the design 2013-12-26 13:16 the system is catastrophically unstable outside of a local optimum though 2013-12-26 13:17 actually doing a random dithering of the digital output 2013-12-26 13:17 yep, that's the problem with such design, it has extremely narrow operation point 2013-12-26 13:17 window rather 2013-12-26 13:17 and no way to recover 2013-12-26 13:18 the simplicity is impressive though 2013-12-26 13:18 yep :-D 2013-12-26 13:18 you can do same with a laser for the light barrier 2013-12-26 13:19 hall sensors are way easier to operate. just superglue it to the electromagnet 2013-12-26 13:19 it's pretty difficult to start up such a system though 2013-12-26 13:19 ugh WHAT? a hall sensor??? 2013-12-26 13:19 hall effect sensor yeah 2013-12-26 13:20 or how do you call it in english? 2013-12-26 13:20 how the heck is it detecting the position of your levitating object? 2013-12-26 13:20 the object has a neodymum magnet attached at the top 2013-12-26 13:20 I wasn't attentive reading what you wrote 2013-12-26 13:21 yeah, but the heck the hall sensor will get massive interference of the own electromagnet 2013-12-26 13:21 now TAHT is a pretty weird design 2013-12-26 13:21 apparently it doesn't prevent it from working :p 2013-12-26 13:22 nah, it just increases complexity of the design by factor 100 2013-12-26 13:22 hard to tell what actually happens 2013-12-26 13:22 hm, someone just emailed me about Galden 2013-12-26 13:23 depends on exact position of hall sensor wrt to e-magnet, polarity of hall sensor, polarity of e-magnet 2013-12-26 13:23 did you ask anyone or something? 2013-12-26 13:23 basically you built an oscillator that doesn't need any moving object to oscillate 2013-12-26 13:24 me? nope 2013-12-26 13:24 me neither 2013-12-26 13:24 somebody lurking in here 2013-12-26 13:24 I guess so 2013-12-26 13:25 or you are already googleized 100% 2013-12-26 13:25 so the webshops don't even need to ask for your email addr anymore and simply send a mail when you visit the website 2013-12-26 13:26 ;-P 2013-12-26 13:26 I thought we had another 5..10 years until our world transformed into this nightmare 2013-12-26 13:26 google "real-time bidding" 2013-12-26 13:27 no I won't, unless I get TOR installed 2013-12-26 13:27 ;-P 2013-12-26 13:27 no seriously, that makes 1984 look mild in comparison 2013-12-26 13:27 and even that doesn't help 2013-12-26 13:27 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real-time_bidding 2013-12-26 13:28 "Let's explain with a simple real time example: a user heads to a page on a website (the "publisher"), causing it to start loading. In the same instant the website ("publisher") sends out a “bid request” to thousands of potential advertisers saying, “We’ve got this user who is 30, Indian, male and based in New Jersey, US, and recently searched for return air tickets to Delhi, opening a page on our site. How much are you willing to bi 2013-12-26 13:28 they're literally selling you on auction, several dozen times a second 2013-12-26 13:34 OMG 2013-12-26 13:35 but yeah, seems to depend on cookies (so far) 2013-12-26 13:35 I have cookie policy set to "always ask" 2013-12-26 13:35 that is bloody annoying though 2013-12-26 13:35 and I honestly hate sites that try to place 3532 cookies 2013-12-26 13:36 yes, it actually is bloody friggin annoying 2013-12-26 13:37 I'd appreciate a small icon in webbrowser telling me "this site tried to place 3433 cookies which I all rejected" and I could click on this icon to see what been the cookies and deliberately accept one or some or all of them, for this time or permanently. On which occasion the browser automatically should reload the page with the updated cookie policy 2013-12-26 13:38 I probably should patent this concept 2013-12-26 13:38 like for popups, yeah 2013-12-26 13:38 someone probably made this already as a firefox addon 2013-12-26 13:51 rz2k has quit [] 2013-12-26 14:07 xiangfu has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 2013-12-26 14:13 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 14:13 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 14:19 panda|x201 has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2013-12-26 14:27 rz2k has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 14:51 mth has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 14:59 grr, java 2013-12-26 15:01 what is the value of having a memory-safe language if you need a native library to access a goddamn serial port 2013-12-26 15:02 and the very second I load this native library it segfaults... 2013-12-26 15:44 grr, lead-free solder: when it's easier to tear the socket from PCB than to disconnect the plug from it 2013-12-26 15:46 actually, no, this is just some Molex contraption which is seemingly designed to be one use only 2013-12-26 16:04 pcercuei has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 16:17 zear has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 2013-12-26 16:19 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 16:23 arielenter has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2013-12-26 16:26 zear has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 16:36 whitequark: DocScrutinizer05 will be so envious ;-) 2013-12-26 16:37 hm? 2013-12-26 16:37 because you have a molex connector that resists all attempt to remove it from the board :) 2013-12-26 16:38 yeah 2013-12-26 16:38 well, I could it make come off, but only at the expense of destroying the PCB 2013-12-26 16:40 "will it blend" ? ;-) 2013-12-26 16:41 well, that shady component sourcer turned out to seem pretty promising 2013-12-26 16:41 so just *maybe* our molex headache soon will vanish 2013-12-26 16:41 arielenter has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 16:42 unless we want to build more than 130k devices 2013-12-26 16:43 and I dare to say: 130k? screw that Nokia N900 display 2013-12-26 16:45 netcomponents.com that is 2013-12-26 16:45 wpwrak_: nonono, I meant that literally 2013-12-26 16:45 I tore it off the PCB 2013-12-26 16:45 even after that (!) I couldn't figure out how does one disconnect it without completely destroying the plastic 2013-12-26 16:45 as expected it lists suppliers that have no own online shop/catalog at all 2013-12-26 16:46 whitequark: sometimes it's tricky to open those critters 2013-12-26 16:46 sometimes actually impossible 2013-12-26 16:47 but usually just hard to find the way to 2break" it without rendering it dysfunctional 2013-12-26 16:48 often it needs drilling holes or cutting slizes or breaking off parts of one of the components to allow separation 2013-12-26 16:49 even more frequently it just needs brute force inserting a sharp screwdriver at the right point to open up the latches 2013-12-26 16:50 of course also semi-destructive process 2013-12-26 16:51 I hardly even seen a design where function critical parts are involved in a lock that can't get opened without breaking those parts - like contact springs that latch up or sth 2013-12-26 16:52 usually it's just the usual triangular plastic latches hidden inside the receptacle 2013-12-26 16:52 they also managed to place it in close proximity to two other easily damaged plastic components 2013-12-26 16:52 four actually, two other sockets, a buzzer and a jumper 2013-12-26 16:52 so soldering it back was one hell of a job 2013-12-26 16:52 sounds like a pretty crappy design 2013-12-26 16:52 rzk has joined #qi-hardware 2013-12-26 16:52 osPID 2013-12-26 16:52 http://ospid.com/ 2013-12-26 16:53 it's supposedly hackable. yeah. 2013-12-26 16:53 the controlling software is also horrible, in the best traditions of vendor-supplied sw 2013-12-26 16:53 some shit written in arduino-like java-based environment (processing) which is hardly possible to get up without it segfaulting 2013-12-26 16:54 it works after all though 2013-12-26 16:55 what is that laser? http://www.ospid.com/blog/ospid-used-in-the-toorcamp-laser/ 2013-12-26 16:56 no clue 2013-12-26 16:56 rz2k has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 2013-12-26 16:56 friggin awesome blue lazor 2013-12-26 17:00 >> It’s built with twenty-four 1 Watt lasers taken from a Casio DLP projector.<< 2013-12-26 17:00 so about 800 bucks 2013-12-26 17:02 http://hackaday.com/2012/08/16/toorcamp-hackerbot-labs-giant-faa-approved-laser/ 2013-12-26 17:09 excellent unrelated comment: >>3) Redundancy theater is easy, while real redundancy is extremely hard. It turns out to be exceptionally easy to build a ‘redundant’ system that just creates a new and different single point failure. Now, that can be an appropriate solution, if and only if the new single point failure is one that you are aware of and is much, much more reliable than where you moved it from. But it’s much easier 2013-12-26 17:09 to just delude yourself into thinking you’ve built a redundant system, and self-delusion is the mother of all engineering failures.<< 2013-12-26 17:13 noticed it too 2013-12-26 17:13 ROTFL @ We controlled a 12kW laser using a PIC16F886…. --- quite the british comment I think serves best to original rant 2013-12-26 17:14 tbh I don't see any problem with that. PIC fails, laser burns a hole through whatever it's pointing to (you should prepare for that anyway) and/or explodes (same) 2013-12-26 17:16 there's about 1000 factors which could lead to either result even if the uC is intact 2013-12-26 17:24 yes 2013-12-26 17:24 that's why I enjoyed that comment 2013-12-26 17:25 fire has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.1] 2013-12-26 17:25