2012-12-18 00:11 jekhor has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 2012-12-18 00:12 pcercuei has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 2012-12-18 00:32 LunaVorax has quit [Quit: Quitte] 2012-12-18 00:39 sivoais is now known as _sivoais 2012-12-18 00:45 urandom__ has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 2012-12-18 01:00 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 01:30 guanucoluis has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 01:38 pcercuei has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 01:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: ioscript/ioscript: allow positions to be redefined (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-blinkenlights/b4530ff 2012-12-18 01:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: swuart/: split general UART functions from application (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-blinkenlights/2e749f9 2012-12-18 01:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: swuart/: merge library part into libubb (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-blinkenlights/1c51cc6 2012-12-18 01:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: swuart/: convert "hammering the peer" demo into a primitive interactive chat (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-blinkenlights/519ebe6 2012-12-18 01:45 [commit] Werner Almesberger: libubb/swuart.c (swuart_open): start TX high, not low (master) http://qi-hw.com/p/ben-blinkenlights/842766b 2012-12-18 02:17 paroneayea has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 2012-12-18 02:20 paroneay` has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 02:48 paroneay` is now known as paroneayea 2012-12-18 02:48 paroneayea has quit [Changing host] 2012-12-18 02:48 paroneayea has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 02:49 guanucoluis has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2012-12-18 02:55 guanucoluis has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 03:04 guanucoluis has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2012-12-18 03:27 pcercuei has quit [Quit: Bye] 2012-12-18 03:36 dvdk has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 2012-12-18 04:04 DocScrutinizer05 has quit [Disconnected by services] 2012-12-18 04:04 DocScrutinizer06 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 04:04 emeb has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 2012-12-18 04:42 wolfspra1l has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 04:45 wolfspraul has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 2012-12-18 04:59 jekhor has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 05:44 jekhor has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 2012-12-18 06:00 wpwrak: are you thinking about a particular use case for the SW UART? 2012-12-18 06:00 is it possible to use it for serial console? 2012-12-18 06:00 i mean, use UBB for serial console then 2012-12-18 07:45 wolfspra1l has quit [Quit: leaving] 2012-12-18 07:59 jluis has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 08:05 kilae has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 08:25 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 09:08 porchao has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 09:58 lekernel has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 09:58 lekernel__ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2012-12-18 10:18 DocScrutinizer06 is now known as DocScrutinizer05 2012-12-18 10:45 kyak: (use case) yes, i want t use it to in-circuit program NXP LPC111x series MCUs. they use a surprisingly text-heavy protocol and it all goes over a UART. 2012-12-18 10:46 it wouldn't work so well for a serial console (either end of it) since you always get small breaks where the receiver is not polling 2012-12-18 10:47 for a driver that doesn't have this problem, things would have to move into the kernel, with an interrupt handler signaling the reception of a start bit 2012-12-18 10:58 wolfspraul has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 11:13 wpwrak: did you have a look at http://www.kosagi.com/w/index.php?title=Novena_Main_Page ? 2012-12-18 11:15 heard of it, yes. dunno. laptops didn't strike me as a big openness problem so far. 2012-12-18 11:16 i.e., all the equipment i have does what it has to do without nasty closed source drivers or messy binary firmware. maybe there is binary firmware somewhere (though i don't think so) but it's handled transparently enough that i don't have to worry about it. 2012-12-18 11:17 plus, a laptop is easily extended via USB, so - without any more specific requirements - there's not really a pressing need for having special built-in hardware features (such as expansion headers, fpgas, etc.) 2012-12-18 11:18 plus, a laptop is a complex system, so this is a lot of work and it's expensive to make. not as bad as a smartphone, but substantial 2012-12-18 11:20 ah, and my laptops have of course all intel graphics. no money wasted on nvidia or ati here. if they want to keep their products a secret, then they can keep their products ;-) 2012-12-18 11:24 GNUtoo-desktop has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 11:27 unclouded has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 2012-12-18 11:29 urandom__ has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 11:38 panda|x201 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 2012-12-18 11:54 wpwrak: how old is your laptop? 2012-12-18 11:55 wpwrak: http://lindi.iki.fi/lindi/firmware/free-firmware.txt has two laptop related entries 2012-12-18 11:58 batteries 2012-12-18 11:58 thats a point need more openess, well you hack the pack but.. 2012-12-18 11:58 kristianpaul: one is some 4-5 years old (a fujitsu u1010), the other maybe 2 (an asus netbook) 2012-12-18 11:59 wpwrak: so you believe the history of restricted boot etc? 2012-12-18 12:00 or drm inside the processors.. 2012-12-18 12:00 i would partially agree that laptops still fair open as the restrictions seems to be imposed somwhere else (tablets. for example) 2012-12-18 12:01 I'd very much like to have a TPM to hold the hdd encryption keys of my laptop but I have a cheap model that doesn't support it 2012-12-18 12:02 now it is quite trivial to bruteforce against my passphrase 2012-12-18 12:02 I do like that for portable harddrives 2012-12-18 12:03 kristianpaul: my systems all predate restricted boot :) 2012-12-18 12:04 I also think that RMS is doing more harm than good inventing these odd alternative terms :) 2012-12-18 12:04 okay lets wait some more years 2012-12-18 12:04 lindi-: he good point :) 2012-12-18 12:05 kristianpaul: and i don't know of any DRM in my cpus either. of course, i stick with intel there. 2012-12-18 12:08 wpwrak: I guess it depends on what you exactly count as DRM. do you include the SENTER instruction in your CPU? 2012-12-18 12:16 hmm, don't even know what it is :) 2012-12-18 12:21 wpwrak: it's a way to build dynamic root of trust: e.g. to make it possible for a userland process to operate on encryption keys even when rest of the system is compromised 2012-12-18 12:22 wpwrak: SENTER instruction is like a normal branch except that it 1) disables other cores and interrupts 2) calculates a hash of the target code (up to 64KB) 3) tells the TPM that "we are now executing code that matches hash X and there is nothing that can interfere" 2012-12-18 12:23 wpwrak: the TPM can then be told things like "please create a new RSA key and let only blocks with hashes X, Y and Z operate using it" 2012-12-18 12:24 wpwrak: when you are done you execute the SEXIT instruction 2012-12-18 12:26 nice. but as far as i know, there's no TPM in my machines. and if there's anything like that, it's dormant. i.e., i had no troubles installing linux. 2012-12-18 12:27 yeah you need several primitives to make anything useful with SENTER 2012-12-18 12:36 wpwrak: if you want to hear more about the positive uses of these technologies I suggest reading about http://qubes-os.org/trac 2012-12-18 12:42 yeah,even the most vile technology can have good uses :) 2012-12-18 12:42 xiangfu has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2012-12-18 12:42 i do wonder whether it's worth the effort to worry about things at such a low level. i mean, apart from academic interest and the tin foil hat faction. 2012-12-18 12:43 wpwrak: well I'm just interested in the technology and want to know what is possible 2012-12-18 12:49 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 13:15 freemor has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 13:23 xiangfu has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 2012-12-18 13:27 freemor has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2012-12-18 13:27 GNUtoo-desktop has quit [Quit: [INFO] fsogsmd : received signal -11, exiting.] 2012-12-18 13:34 freemor has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 13:55 erikkugel has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 14:00 Hoolxi has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 14:00 Hoolxi has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2012-12-18 14:09 GNUtoo has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 14:12 rz2k has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 14:17 freemor2 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 14:18 freemor has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2012-12-18 14:24 freemor2 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 2012-12-18 15:13 freemor has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 15:23 freemor has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 2012-12-18 15:34 emeb has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 15:38 jluis has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 2012-12-18 15:49 freemor has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 15:51 freemor has quit [Client Quit] 2012-12-18 18:11 jekhor has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 18:21 pcercuei has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 18:24 pcercuei has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 2012-12-18 18:25 dandon_ has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 18:26 dandon has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 2012-12-18 18:26 dandon_ is now known as dandon 2012-12-18 18:29 LunaVorax has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 18:32 jekhor has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 2012-12-18 18:59 unclouded has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 19:18 rz2k has quit [] 2012-12-18 19:36 paroneayea has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 2012-12-18 19:52 GNUtoo has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 2012-12-18 20:01 paroneayea has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 20:27 LunaVorax has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2012-12-18 20:30 jekhor has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 20:53 Jurting has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 20:56 GNUtoo has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 21:19 Kikdo has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 21:21 Kikdo has quit [Client Quit] 2012-12-18 21:29 jekhor has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 2012-12-18 21:38 kilae has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 17.0.1/20121128204232]] 2012-12-18 22:09 erikkugel has left #qi-hardware [#qi-hardware] 2012-12-18 22:09 guanucoluis has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 22:16 LunaVorax has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 22:16 Jurting has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 2012-12-18 22:29 Jurting has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 23:07 GNUtoo has quit [Quit: Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.] 2012-12-18 23:21 xiangfu has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 23:31 pcercuei has joined #qi-hardware 2012-12-18 23:46 LunaVorax has quit [Quit: Quitte] 2012-12-18 23:57 pcercuei has quit [Remote host closed the connection]