2012-04-14 00:35 RTC Milkymist: @qihardware @xiangfu To be fair... this is still quite experimental and buggy in the current software release. ( 190962598609563648@milkymistvj - 54s ago via web ) 2012-04-14 00:48 rikard has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 01:00 xwalk has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 01:15 dvdk has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 01:46 wej has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 01:47 antgreen has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 02:08 Ivy-E has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 02:52 Ivy-E has quit ["Saliendo"] 2012-04-14 03:51 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 04:14 xwalk has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 04:23 xwalk has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 04:51 zrafa has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 05:32 kyak has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 05:38 rejon has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 06:32 jekhor__ has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 07:01 DocScrutinizer has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 07:37 Martix has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 07:37 rejon has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 08:52 yoss has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 08:52 does anybody know how to calculate PER out of SNR values? 2012-04-14 08:53 ? 2012-04-14 09:01 kilae has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 09:18 anybody heard sth of mickeyl? it's over 2 months now that he last showed up 2012-04-14 09:22 ~seen mickeyl 2012-04-14 09:22 mickeyl <~mickey@openmoko/coreteam/mickey> was last seen on IRC in channel #openmoko-cdevel, 72d 11h 23m 56s ago, saying: 'gnight'. 2012-04-14 10:29 have you tried sending him am mail ? 2012-04-14 10:29 s/am/a 2012-04-14 10:29 wpwrak meant: "have you tried sending him a mail ?" 2012-04-14 11:00 Ayla has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 11:07 wpwrak: sent him a SMS 2012-04-14 11:08 not sure about the right number though 2012-04-14 11:09 well, the number once must've been the right one, and the SMS got delivered 2012-04-14 11:13 http://www.vanille-media.de/site/index.php/blog/ 2012-04-14 11:19 dptech has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 11:32 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 11:55 Martix has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 12:21 I think he wrote it on his blog, no? 2012-04-14 12:21 he is busy with his ios development firm and taking care of family 2012-04-14 12:21 you should try to contact his company about wanting to develop a new ios app, or applying for a dev job (he hired his 3rd developer recently, according to blog) 2012-04-14 12:22 I don't know more than the blog, but the blog is pretty clear to me... 2012-04-14 12:33 wolfspraul: 05-04-2012 12:26:12 < mickey_office!~mickey@e182221015.adsl.alicedsl.de: we're finishing a bunch of apps this month, so i hope things will slow down soon 2012-04-14 12:33 so everything fine" 2012-04-14 12:34 just not very nice to scare people like me with not showing up on IRC at all for >2 months 2012-04-14 12:34 well 2012-04-14 12:34 somehow it seems I understood the situation quite well :-) 2012-04-14 12:35 1. family is priority #1 2012-04-14 12:35 2. making money, in his case with ios apps, is priority #2 2012-04-14 12:35 no priority #1 could stop me from cranking up IRC at least once or twice a week, if only to idle 2012-04-14 12:35 if open harwdare fails, I try my luck with a dev job at mickey's :-) 2012-04-14 12:36 ok but you are special 2012-04-14 12:36 no, mickey is special - he's #openmoko GC 2012-04-14 12:37 exactly :-) 2012-04-14 12:37 openmoko... 2012-04-14 12:37 well, if he doesn't care at all anymore, then he should nominate a co-GC 2012-04-14 12:38 maybe he can join qi in a few years 2012-04-14 12:38 when the kids are in school 2012-04-14 12:38 or pass the job to somebody else completely 2012-04-14 12:38 any takers? maybe he would be happy if someone takes over... 2012-04-14 12:38 I don't know 2012-04-14 12:38 I don't mind 2012-04-14 12:39 how many active gta01 and gta02 users are still around? 2012-04-14 12:39 err, #openmoko != gta0* 2012-04-14 12:41 or - to put it simple and generic - openmoko.org >> openmoko.com 2012-04-14 12:43 and for IRC all this doesn't matter 2012-04-14 12:43 user counts is all that matters 2012-04-14 12:43 for all the #openmoko* channels 2012-04-14 12:44 the GC owns all of them 2012-04-14 12:44 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 12:53 anyway, scratch that all - all caused by mickey's annoying habit to change nickname 2012-04-14 12:58 and then not even registering to use his common cloak 2012-04-14 13:09 iOS firm ? so DocScrutinizer's fears that something horrible and tragic may have happened to him were justified 2012-04-14 13:10 XP 2012-04-14 13:18 rejon has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 13:48 Ayla has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 13:49 wow, linux.com. congratulations wpwrak ! 2012-04-14 13:49 thanks ! :) nice article indeed 2012-04-14 13:49 some of these days, i should finish my work on the atusb driver :) 2012-04-14 13:50 haha 2012-04-14 13:51 i mean it works. just not very well. 2012-04-14 13:55 GNUtoo-desktop has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 13:59 LunaVorax_ has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 14:00 :) 2012-04-14 14:00 wpwrak: can't you get kernel programmers to do this? 2012-04-14 14:02 sure, someone else could do that too. it's both ends that need to change, though - atusb firmware and kernel 2012-04-14 14:02 hmm 2012-04-14 14:02 xwalk has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 14:03 ah 2012-04-14 14:03 the fw is the 8051 code? 2012-04-14 14:03 i have some almost-finished code. just need to find the time for a context switch. 2012-04-14 14:03 it's AVR 2012-04-14 14:03 ah 2012-04-14 14:03 not that you'd notice much of a difference. since it's written in C anyway 2012-04-14 14:04 hehe 2012-04-14 14:06 real men code in FORTRAN. If it can't get done in FORTRAN, do it in assembler. If it can't get done in assembler, it's not worth being done at all 2012-04-14 14:07 GNUtoo-desktop has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 14:07 otoh the real programmer can write FORTRAN code in any programming language, even C ;) 2012-04-14 14:09 on a more serious comment: have you checked how good assembler from C is for AVR? 2012-04-14 14:09 s/assembler/machine code/ 2012-04-14 14:09 DocScrutinizer meant: "on a more serious comment: have you checked how good machine code from C is for AVR?" 2012-04-14 14:12 Lullabysse has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 14:12 wpwrak: ^^ 2012-04-14 14:13 xwalk has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 14:14 DocScrutinizer: you are asking how good avr-gcc is? 2012-04-14 14:14 kinda, yes 2012-04-14 14:15 Ierth has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 14:15 DocScrutinizer: i optimized C to assembler on some occasions on AVR. i could usually get efficient code. but it needs a bit of effort. picking the right register sizes, ordering code the right way, etc. 2012-04-14 14:15 at least in the past it did not have separate address space support yet, I think this was changed recently 2012-04-14 14:16 other issue was that it created quite a lot of extra overhead for interrupt handlers easily 2012-04-14 14:16 there is that c compiler that can do both 8051 and avr, no? 2012-04-14 14:16 sccs or something like this... 2012-04-14 14:17 sdcc 2012-04-14 14:17 http://sdcc.sourceforge.net/ 2012-04-14 14:17 ah, no more AVR, they say. 2012-04-14 14:17 Hi, sorry for my bad english. I'm a quite new user of nanonote and I can't reflash it because I can't install xburst-tools : a dependance don't want to be compiled. Can you help me please ? 2012-04-14 14:18 post the error 2012-04-14 14:19 gtype-desc.c:9164:31: erreur: subscripted value is neither array nor pointer nor vector 2012-04-14 14:19 where did you get xburst-tools from? 2012-04-14 14:19 (to check that exact file) 2012-04-14 14:19 I frequently get baffled when running Lauterbach against ARM code generated from C with RCT (RVT?) compiler. 2012-04-14 14:20 Sorry, the dependance is cross-mipsel-linux-gnu-gcc. I'm on Archlinux, sow i get it and xburst-tools from AUR. 2012-04-14 14:20 sometimes it's next to impossible to understand which line of c code the current instruction belongs to 2012-04-14 14:21 gcc, gdb and systemtap at least understand line numbers 2012-04-14 14:22 sure, but what to do when your line 800 gets interleaved partially between lines 830, 850, and 910? 2012-04-14 14:22 DocScrutinizer: you make smaller functions :) 2012-04-14 14:22 haha 2012-04-14 14:23 so the compiler can inline them later on? 2012-04-14 14:23 which it does a lot 2012-04-14 14:24 Ierth: ah, that file is in the mipsel gcc, or in xburst-tools? 2012-04-14 14:25 Ierth: maybe you should contact the maintainer of that AUR thing. All I can do is to help you install the nix package manager, and have xburst-tools from nix. 2012-04-14 14:26 because I use every oportunity to make people use nix 2012-04-14 14:27 Hum... I think it's just a file which need xburst-tools. Yaourt say me (in french) : ==> D 2012-04-14 14:27 But I don't know nix, what is it ? 2012-04-14 14:28 a package manager 2012-04-14 14:29 hm don't you understand what fails? 2012-04-14 14:29 I mean... I thought Arch users were aware of compilation troubles, building packages, ... :) 2012-04-14 14:30 Hmm, sometime i understand, but not now. u_u 2012-04-14 14:30 do you know C? 2012-04-14 14:31 I'll ask on archlinux's channel. I know C, but not enought to understand the error line I pasted you. 2012-04-14 14:31 lindi-: in fact the compiler does the equivalent to code, of transformation (a+b)^2 -> a^2 + 2ab + b^2 2012-04-14 14:32 the error line is not enough 2012-04-14 14:32 we'd have to see the contents of that file, and maybe of other files too. 2012-04-14 14:32 then on the 2nd form it does weird optimizations and spreads it all across the code 2012-04-14 14:33 amazing optimizer 2012-04-14 14:35 Urf. I'm not used to go so far when some installation falls. I generally search the package somewhere else or search a solution on Internet. 2012-04-14 14:36 hm ok 2012-04-14 14:36 DocScrutinizer: that's exactly what compilers should do :) gcc with SSA should also do things that are pretty non-obvious. SSA = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Static_single_assignment_form 2012-04-14 14:37 Sorry. 2012-04-14 14:37 :) 2012-04-14 14:38 Ierth: well, it's hard to help without detailed information about your system and what is it doing at installation time (versions involved, etc.) 2012-04-14 14:38 llvm also does quite many interesting optimizations 2012-04-14 14:38 Ierth: maybe you should find some good willing person that uses Arch linux, reproduces your problem and fixes it. 2012-04-14 14:41 wpwrak: :-D 2012-04-14 14:41 *burp* 2012-04-14 14:42 Hmm, maybe. Do you want a pastebin about the installation (maybe you will see what file crash the installation) ? 2012-04-14 14:42 I probably should get used to using -O0 or whatever when debugging code at work 2012-04-14 14:43 Ierth: but I'd need the exact version too 2012-04-14 14:43 Ierth: if that's included, fine 2012-04-14 14:43 but the fix will involve changing the AUR recipes, sure 2012-04-14 14:43 And I've no idea about how to do that 2012-04-14 14:49 Ok, the compilation is very big, I'll post just the 5-6 lines before the error. Programm with version : cross-mipsel-linux-gnu-gcc 4.6.0-2 2012-04-14 14:52 the compilation of what? 2012-04-14 14:52 I'll try to contact the person who made this package to tell him the error. 2012-04-14 14:52 no, make the full paste if possible 2012-04-14 14:52 ah, that's better 2012-04-14 14:52 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 14:54 have you heard about electricity counters 'Pachelbel'? 2012-04-14 14:55 Very big compilation, my terminal can't contain all. So, wait a little please, I will do again it. 2012-04-14 14:56 *"I will do it again" I guess. 2012-04-14 15:07 panda|x201 has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 15:13 viric: tada http://pastebin.archlinux.fr/pastebin.php?dl=438874 2012-04-14 15:15 Ierth: there is no error there 2012-04-14 15:15 Ierth: I think it cut the file. 2012-04-14 15:19 viric: Heck ! You're right, it's cut, the file is too big. So : http://www.toofiles.com/fr/oip/documents/log/cross-mipsel-linux-gnu-gcc.html 2012-04-14 15:21 ah, it's an error in the recipe for gcc... 2012-04-14 15:21 That's really a job for the Arch linux people. 2012-04-14 15:22 unrelated to xburst-tools 2012-04-14 15:24 Okay. 2012-04-14 15:25 Unrelated to cross-mipsel-linux-gnu-gcc too ? 2012-04-14 15:25 no. it's an error in that pkgbuild 2012-04-14 15:25 no = yes, it is related 2012-04-14 15:32 Thanks very much. And I saw a broken link in the wiki. Here : http://en.qi-hardware.com/wiki/Xburst-tools. The link must be http://aur.archlinux.org/packages/xburst-tools/PKGBUILD instead of http://aur.archlinux.org/packages/xburst-tools/xburst-tools/PKGBUILD. 2012-04-14 15:36 Ierth: you can update it 2012-04-14 15:36 Or anyone with login could. :) 2012-04-14 15:36 Oh. 2012-04-14 15:37 I'll create an account so. :) 2012-04-14 15:37 thank you! 2012-04-14 15:38 It's nothing. 2012-04-14 15:40 wpwrak: you have the judgment of Videla... 2012-04-14 15:41 wpwrak: here the stupid right wing government is menacing Argentina due to the Repsol YPF nationalisation 2012-04-14 16:03 viric: of course, what they're doing with YPF isn't particularly bright either ... 2012-04-14 16:13 hi guys 2012-04-14 16:13 is it possible to flash u-boot from the Nanonote itself? 2012-04-14 16:14 provided I have access to the MTD device on the kernel 2012-04-14 16:19 since the first few blocks need a special layout it doesn't work i think 2012-04-14 16:21 wpwrak: who are they' 2012-04-14 16:21 ? 2012-04-14 16:22 wpwrak: Repsol is the big shame of the country. But our fascist government things it's of great value. 2012-04-14 16:23 larsc: booboo made that: http://code.google.com/p/dingoo-linux/source/browse/trunk/nandfix/nandfix.c 2012-04-14 16:24 that was supposed to create a working image to be flashed with usbboot, I think 2012-04-14 16:26 viric: "they" = the argentine national government 2012-04-14 16:27 emeb has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 16:27 wpwrak: I don't know the details. 2012-04-14 16:27 wpwrak: but that made the Spanish gov say "Any attack against Repsol is an attack against the Kingdom of Spain!" 2012-04-14 16:28 Shameful, because most company owners aren't event from Spain 2012-04-14 16:28 even 2012-04-14 16:28 And of course has nothing to do with the citizens of Spain. 2012-04-14 16:28 But here we have very easy paths between the companies linked to Energy, and the Government 2012-04-14 16:29 When someone in the government finishes his charge, goes working in an Energy company as 'adviser'. 2012-04-14 16:29 magically. 2012-04-14 16:30 yeah, that's pretty common everywhere :) 2012-04-14 16:30 no matter the ministry. Education, Health, ... :) 2012-04-14 16:31 but what else but make threats can they do if the argentine government is basically trying to confiscate YPF ? 2012-04-14 16:32 they justify it with YPF not investing enough. of course, with government-controlled prices, government-imposed restrictions on currency export, and so on, it's not surprise that investment would be slow 2012-04-14 16:33 also, none of this bothered them during the last 9 years. why suddenly now ? 2012-04-14 16:33 I don't doubt there have been very doubtful movements in the acquisition of YPF by Repsol 2012-04-14 16:33 Here this happens regularly... when the right wing comes to power, they start up selling public owned assets. 2012-04-14 16:34 Which "of course" then they are unrecoverable (unless they bankrupt and have a big debt hole the goverment has to pay) 2012-04-14 16:35 well, YPF and repsol went through several iteration. and the "sell all assets" policy ended well over a decade ago. 2012-04-14 16:35 well, I'm deciding more on prejudice of other movements I've read from Repsol, than on the concrete study of this case. 2012-04-14 16:36 Fabricatorz: Milkymist One Gets Rowdy and Jazzy In Warsaw. Live video synthesis and open hardware http://t.co/lcHl1RoN | @milkymistvj @qihardware #VJ ( 191204886195605504@fabricatorz - 10s ago via Ping.fm ) 2012-04-14 16:42 antgreen` has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 16:43 RTC Milkymist: RT @qihardware: RT @fabricatorz: Milkymist One Gets Rowdy and Jazzy In Warsaw Live video synthesis, open hardware http://t.co/iJjjSZWh #VJ ( 191206609731600385@milkymistvj - 19s ago via HootSuite ) 2012-04-14 16:47 viric: nothing in argentina's current economical policy is deserving of your sympathy. after the elections, they went from dubious and awkward to stark raving mad 2012-04-14 16:50 ok 2012-04-14 16:56 viric: e.g., one recent stunt was to institute a de facto ban on the import of books and other printed material 2012-04-14 16:57 viric: of course, they didn't cal it a ban. instead, they came up with the idea that the lead content of the ink would have to be checked before books, journals, etc., can enter the country 2012-04-14 17:01 Ayla: afaik the issue is that the Dingoo has 4K flash pages while the JZ boot code can handle 512-byte or 2K pages 2012-04-14 17:02 viric: even better, if these things were sent by courier, there would be only one customs checkpoint where they all are held - the international airport of buenos aires. so if you, say, live in mendoza, you'd have to travel some 1000 km to buenos aires to do the customs procedure to get your books 2012-04-14 17:02 to work around that, the first half of the 4K page contains 2K of data and the second half contain the OOB area 2012-04-14 17:02 (so most of the second half is unused) 2012-04-14 17:03 viric: following the angry reaction of the literate class, the government eventually decided to drop that thing. although they didn't exclude bringing it back later 2012-04-14 17:05 mth: nandwrite can write a "raw" image without adding OOB data, so maybe we could prepare an image with a custom OOB layout 2012-04-14 17:05 it's no problem if the OOB data for the 4K page is written as usual 2012-04-14 17:06 it's just that you have to package a 2K page + its OOB and put that inside the data area of a 4K page 2012-04-14 17:06 I don't know what OOB format the boot code expects, but booboo must have figured that out 2012-04-14 17:11 it's on the page I linked earlier 2012-04-14 17:11 http://code.google.com/p/dingoo-linux/source/browse/trunk/nandfix/nandfix.c 2012-04-14 17:12 wpwrak: I have one friend that bought by postal mail a Geiger counter... and imagine, it even has a 'calibration body' :) 2012-04-14 17:12 ;-))) 2012-04-14 17:12 (2nd hand) 2012-04-14 17:13 so you have a thing boxed in lead, that can be opened to calibrate the counter 2012-04-14 17:14 wpwrak: well, democracy is about some actions and reactions, and you can't expect it to be most efficent making everyone happy 2012-04-14 17:14 as we use to say here: "we all know that dictatorship is more efficient" 2012-04-14 17:15 I'm amazed that your goverment gave a peny on the reaction of 'the literate class' 2012-04-14 17:15 viric: (boxed in lead) ah, thought it would be a bag of Pu-238 powder ;-) 2012-04-14 17:16 (literate class) yeah, it's not usually their style to back down from mistakes 2012-04-14 17:26 here they would laugh at any reaction :) 2012-04-14 17:27 having won the elections, here means "the democracy gives us full power for four years, not asking any opinion until the next elections" 2012-04-14 17:28 oh sure. here too. they don't like public protests they didn't organize themselves, though. 2012-04-14 17:40 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEHKXgilX6k&feature=related 2012-04-14 17:41 but what exactly would "kill" the motherboard here? 2012-04-14 17:41 spurious currents? electrolysis byproducts? and what'll be if I would just wash them off? 2012-04-14 18:16 antgreen has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 18:24 hey there 2012-04-14 18:25 .oO(wasnt argentinia bankrupt? and spain... well they are soon too.) 2012-04-14 18:26 in bankrupcy things do not need to make sense neccessarily.. check out berlin. capital of germany and still bankrupt for over a decade 2012-04-14 18:54 wpwrak: here the police is getting stronger weapons against "attempts to destroy the established public order". This week they changed the laws so "pacific resistance to police orders" is considered "attack to an authority". 2012-04-14 18:55 wpwrak: and "organizing massive public meetings for possibly violent acts" changed into "belonging to a criminal organization". 2012-04-14 18:55 They say they would make "vandalic acts" to be treated as "terrorism". 2012-04-14 18:56 And I think Spain has such shameful laws, like "torture" being allowed if it is "against terrorism". 2012-04-14 18:56 (vandalict act = burying a dust bin on the street) 2012-04-14 18:58 whitequark: maybe it has to do with the materials of some capacitors/resistors, or having some electrolytic having inverse polarity, ... 2012-04-14 18:59 bah, it's my blind guess. who knows. :) 2012-04-14 19:00 Of course, if any electronic gets wet, the first thing to do is to remove any power supply, be it cable or battery 2012-04-14 19:00 electronics. 2012-04-14 19:00 :) 2012-04-14 19:01 whitequark: хотя это не одна капля 2012-04-14 19:27 heh 2012-04-14 19:57 urandom__ has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 20:20 paroneayea has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 20:22 GNUtoo-desktop has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 20:51 kilae has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 21:15 whitequark: electrolysis creating ions which are radicals (H+, OH- iirc), both quite aggressive 2012-04-14 21:16 if you wash dirt (oxidized metal) off before anything got rotten fubar, then dry it, usually all shall still work 2012-04-14 21:17 I do that frequently 2012-04-14 21:18 antgreen` has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 21:19 the "trick" is to remove any power before permanent severe damage happens, then thoroughly wash off all dirt with water and other solvent liquids, then the most "tricky" part: dry it all thoroughly. washing with 99% alcohol as last rinse helps a lot on that, as 99% alc is rather hygroscopic 2012-04-14 21:20 of course you may encounter damaged electronic parts due to changed "circuit" caused by "shorts" from water 2012-04-14 21:20 96% alcohol is not good enough? 2012-04-14 21:20 then no washing will help :-D 2012-04-14 21:20 hmm, dunno 2012-04-14 21:20 the higher percentage the better 2012-04-14 21:21 I had a spray at home that was very good at removing oxid from boards... 2012-04-14 21:21 I had totally ruined boards that were left new 2012-04-14 21:21 after all you want to evaporate the liquid, and when there's 4% water in it that's worse than 1% 2012-04-14 21:21 aha 2012-04-14 21:22 well, usually I dry some days. 2012-04-14 21:22 weeks rather than days 2012-04-14 21:22 :) 2012-04-14 21:22 water can be very persistent when in a sub-millimeter gap under a chip 2012-04-14 21:23 yes... 2012-04-14 21:23 there are always chances :) 2012-04-14 21:23 that's why alc 2012-04-14 21:23 presurized air also nice 2012-04-14 21:23 some 5 to 10 bar 2012-04-14 21:24 should be waterfree though ;-D 2012-04-14 21:24 pressurized air can hold amazing amounts of water 2012-04-14 21:24 how alcohol helps removing water in small gaps? 2012-04-14 21:25 I'm quite bad at chemistry 2012-04-14 21:25 (yes, I remember quite well the water in pressurized air from a compressor) 2012-04-14 21:25 it mixes extremely well with water, dilluting and replacing it 2012-04-14 21:25 ah ok 2012-04-14 21:26 hm fire alcohol is 98% iirc... but has that ink. 2012-04-14 21:26 and alcohol is less conductive than water 2012-04-14 21:27 so water, air, alc, air, heat&time. Yielded good results 2012-04-14 21:28 all of that plenty of it 2012-04-14 21:28 except heat which shouldn't exceed 80°C 2012-04-14 21:29 ha, I used alcohol to cool down things ;) 2012-04-14 21:29 80°C? hm so little? 2012-04-14 21:29 hmmm 2012-04-14 21:30 alcohol in boiling water would fire? grr 2012-04-14 21:36 DocScrutinizer: ethanol has an ignition temperature of 425°C 2012-04-14 21:36 (for that 96% thing I have) 2012-04-14 21:50 (I took that temperature from a search result of a search engine :) 2012-04-14 22:13 doesn't matter, your hardware won't cope with high temperatures for long times, some might even fail in minutes at >100° 2012-04-14 22:23 is it possible to change the console font at runtime? 2012-04-14 22:49 DocScrutinizer: yeah, I thought so 2012-04-14 22:49 thanks for confirmation 2012-04-14 22:51 whitequark: YW 2012-04-14 22:51 dvdk has joined #qi-hardware 2012-04-14 22:52 whitequark: btw if voltage is under electrolytic limit of water, probably way less will happen. Alas I can't recall if electrolytic threshold of water was 1.2V or 1.8 or even >2 2012-04-14 22:53 you can design circuits that will work perfectly for months under water, without any isolation or sealing case 2012-04-14 22:53 oh, now that's something entierly new for me 2012-04-14 22:53 none of my chemistry classes mentioned that 2012-04-14 22:54 no sarcasm please 2012-04-14 22:54 font change at runtime is possible: I saw that happen during the boot sequence on earlier SUSE releases 2012-04-14 22:54 I just thought it's worth mentioning it as usually people tend to forget 2012-04-14 22:55 although that was with an actual text mode, not fb console 2012-04-14 22:55 DocScrutinizer: no sarcasm 2012-04-14 22:55 I really didn't know about that 2012-04-14 22:55 and none of them really did mention it 2012-04-14 22:57 and so I was extremely surprised, because, when I still was at university, not only they were kind of important for my specialization, but I also enjoyed them and still remember every interesting fact 2012-04-14 22:57 same for high school 2012-04-14 22:57 weird 2012-04-14 22:58 I shoulda ask my friends. maybe it's just my memory 2012-04-14 23:01 >>In turn, the minimum electrolytic potential for electrolysis of water or 1.23 V. Thus, any current (I) at applied voltage (V) greater than 1.23 V is an overvoltage and results in waste heat 2012-04-14 23:01 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolysis_of_water 2012-04-14 23:02 ah, THAT. just did not recognize the concept when it was named in English. 2012-04-14 23:02 of course I did seen that. 2012-04-14 23:02 even was on my exam 2012-04-14 23:03 at less than 1.23V deionized water doesn't conduct at all 2012-04-14 23:03 it's just called "RedOx potential" here, not "electrolytic limit" 2012-04-14 23:03 and thus will not cause any harm on electronic circuits that have <1.23V at/between any two points 2012-04-14 23:04 well, no clue 2012-04-14 23:04 ;-) 2012-04-14 23:04 yeah 2012-04-14 23:04 anyway, I did not seen that applied to electronic circuits 2012-04-14 23:04 probably redox potential is the absolutely correct term 2012-04-14 23:05 I'll take that into account. iirc STM32LV can work at 0.8V... 2012-04-14 23:05 this also means that LVDS links aren't affected by water. interesting. 2012-04-14 23:05 I've seen circuits built exactly with this purpose and then shown off at conventions 2012-04-14 23:06 some field busses might use the principle 2012-04-14 23:06 lvds links I've seen were strictly indoor, probably due to high losses in wires 2012-04-14 23:21 infobot has joined #qi-hardware